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Author Topic: Gripes, complaints and irritations.  (Read 150936 times)
Draegan
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Reply #630 on: July 24, 2011, 09:11:09 PM

Rogue armor is terrible imo.  The T2 Raid armor looks bad too.

I'll bet that only 5-10% of the player pop ever even gets any T2 raid gear.  20 mans aren't for anything but the hardcore. 

Well you're wrong, but we've had this discussion already.
Nebu
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Reply #631 on: July 25, 2011, 12:11:38 AM

Well you're wrong, but we've had this discussion already.

Perhaps you're right.  I will say that when I was researching servers for a move from Dimroot, I was surprised how few guilds had completed RoS and GSB on each server.  Just doing a random scan of level 50's on any server, I see a small percentage that have any raid gear at all.  Most are geared with crafted and 5-man stuff, hence my comment.

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

-  Mark Twain
Draegan
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Reply #632 on: July 25, 2011, 09:53:13 AM

There are a lot of servers folks that haven't finished GSB/ROS, but have 3 or 4 bosses down.

Also 10 man gear is on par with 20 man gear except the relic weapons (most of the time).  You can easily gear up in 10 mans and some of the easy bosses in the 20 mans and eventually get enough marks for the set gear.  This will then bring you to within gear levels for the preliminary HK bosses.  

The only difficult part is using source engines and runes to hit the new hit cap.  Even then you can still be under it.

Edit:
There is also no reliable way to see how many guilds cleared a raid on a specific server other than hoping enough of them posted on a server forum.
Nebu
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Reply #633 on: July 25, 2011, 10:01:54 AM

Edit:
There is also no reliable way to see how many guilds cleared a raid on a specific server other than hoping enough of them posted on a server forum.

Correct.  I happen to think that this number is ~ 5-10% of the subscriber base.  You think it's larger.  I guess perception is everything.

Also 10 man gear is on par with 20 man gear except the relic weapons (most of the time).  You can easily gear up in 10 mans and some of the easy bosses in the 20 mans and eventually get enough marks for the set gear.  This will then bring you to within gear levels for the preliminary HK bosses.  

This doesn't change the fact that you still need 20 raid geared people to do HK.  20 person content isn't very accessible for those of us not in powerguilds... which I assume to be the majority of the playerbase.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2011, 11:52:27 AM by Nebu »

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-  Mark Twain
Sky
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Reply #634 on: July 25, 2011, 10:29:28 AM

Like when I lived in the ghetto and thought our city was nothing but scumbags and my fiancee, who lives in a nice upper middle class area, kept telling me how nice the city is.

Perception.

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Reply #635 on: July 25, 2011, 12:54:39 PM

Or like the time I asked my friend what the weather was doin' outside, and he told me: Perception.

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Sky
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Reply #636 on: July 28, 2011, 08:52:30 AM

Thank god that stupid event is over. I went through Stonefield, Scarlet Gorge and Scarwood shrouded in that damned fog, not being able to actually see the zones.

Wish I had known those treasure maps scale to whatever level you are when you open them, I would've saved a couple more.

Sky
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Reply #637 on: July 31, 2011, 01:21:27 PM

Crafting dailies hit an abrupt end when they suddenly send you to Moonshade. As a defiant, it's a long trek from scarwood lift base. We get a free port there to enable the porticulum, but it happens around level 30 or so, my dedicated crafters are in their teens. So....done doing dailies with them, no vendor recipes past level 30 undecided

Nebu
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Reply #638 on: July 31, 2011, 02:16:48 PM

Crafting dailies hit an abrupt end when they suddenly send you to Moonshade. As a defiant, it's a long trek from scarwood lift base. We get a free port there to enable the porticulum, but it happens around level 30 or so, my dedicated crafters are in their teens. So....done doing dailies with them, no vendor recipes past level 30 undecided

My entire Rift guild is now playing EQ2.  We've done everything you can do in game with 5 people and needed to explore a game with significantly more content.  Also, Rift crafting is terribad.  The gear is worthless once you run a few T2's. 

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

-  Mark Twain
Sky
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Reply #639 on: July 31, 2011, 03:33:38 PM

It's hardly worth it before then. They've bumped up the rift rewards (token system) to the point where a couple events will tide you over for ten levels with blues and purples. The crafted stuff is barely better than quest gear, I think my mage is wearing a couple crafted rings and even those it was a toss-up on which stats I wanted since they were about even otherwise. Pretty let down, since crafting was decent in the tests.

There is some decent vendor/daily token stuff...but as I said, I just hit a wall with doing dailies, and they tend to require ingredients I either don't have or are much rarer than rift event tokens, especially once you get to Scarwood and the ancient wardstone dailies.

Just...meh. I'm not sure where they're trying to go with this game, but I think I'm about done. Really wish EQ2 had that expansion out to tide me over to TOR.

March
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Reply #640 on: July 31, 2011, 07:48:16 PM

I took my time leveling, and just hit 50 with my rogue (and my Cleric).

Serious question: is there solo content at 50, or does Trion simply assume I am now fodder for the Dungeon/Raid mill?  I went back to Ice-whatever to do those dailies, and there are the horrible Stillmoor dailies... where else should I look?

I really appreciate the Class/Combat system... just getting that sinking feeling that I've peeked behind the curtain and seen WoW pulling the levers of the great and powerful end-game of Oz.
Sky
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Reply #641 on: July 31, 2011, 08:31:00 PM

Shimmersand, the dragon guys past the hot springs should have some dailies, too. But that's about it. Dailies ad nauseum. Either you raid and pvp or you're done. Maybe roll an alt on the other faction to see the linear quests on that side.

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Reply #642 on: August 05, 2011, 05:29:29 PM

I've been trying to get into RIFT for like a month now after quitting WoW and it's just not scratching my itch. The world is the biggest generic "who gives a shit" fantasy world ever even compared to WoW which stole from every fantasy book written before it. I don't read quest text because I can't be arsed to care about any of the characters or story.

Meanwhile, I love how Rifts and invasions give you pretty rewarding stuff to do, and the soul thing is pretty cool even if it looks like it's possible to make a completely gimp-ass character. Looking at guides I chose poorly when making my tank character, but I was able to fairly easily do a 5-man just playing like I used to play my Warrior tank in WoW. Also even if the regular game-world is boring to look at the starter dungeon I did was actually pretty cool looking, especially at the end with the great white-out snow effects.

"The world is populated in the main by people who should not exist." - George Bernard Shaw
Draegan
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Reply #643 on: August 05, 2011, 11:47:15 PM

Shimmersand, the dragon guys past the hot springs should have some dailies, too. But that's about it. Dailies ad nauseum. Either you raid and pvp or you're done. Maybe roll an alt on the other faction to see the linear quests on that side.

Hopefully we'll see some new 5 mans, 2 mans, and some solo instances that we've been promised in the next patch.

Edit:
Actually you can grind 5 mans for T1 raid badges now.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2011, 11:51:41 PM by Draegan »
Nebu
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Reply #644 on: August 06, 2011, 09:34:36 AM

Edit:
Actually you can grind 5 mans for T1 raid badges now.

1 per day.  In 80 days you can buy one piece of marginally better gear.  yay!  swamp poop

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

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Sky
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Reply #645 on: August 06, 2011, 01:25:57 PM

If you punch your timeclock every day.

Soln
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Reply #646 on: August 07, 2011, 01:14:54 AM

I wish people would run the lower level (anything less than 50) dungeons.  Makes me yearn for LotRO solo skirmishes after awhile.
Kirth
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Reply #647 on: August 08, 2011, 07:51:21 AM

After two attempts to get into this I just find it bland. Its everything WoW/EQ2 has been doing with public quests added in. Typical play session was slogging thru quests that I didn't care enough to read because the map told me where to go and what to kill, until something more interesting happened like a rift or zone wide invasion. My last stint in WoW really burned me so after hearing how the endgame of rift was just the same gear grinding I was done.
Sky
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Reply #648 on: August 08, 2011, 09:19:50 AM

Edit:
Actually you can grind 5 mans for T1 raid badges now.

1 per day.  In 80 days you can buy one piece of marginally better gear.  yay!  swamp poop
I tried explaining this concept to my fiancee. Her response "....and this is fun?"  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?

It is fun, up until the point where the curtain slips a bit and you see the grind wizard sitting behind it. It's really not a game for casuals, no matter how much they try to backpedal now (not to mention the 'solo' instance is gated by group content, but that's not a huge sticking point imo). I would only recommend Rift if you like to raid. I'd say pvp, but since gear matters, you'd probably want to be a raider to have access to that gear to keep the playing field as even as possible.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2011, 09:23:51 AM by Sky »

Nebu
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Reply #649 on: August 08, 2011, 10:35:04 AM

If you can't run Hammerknell, you will never be as competitive as possible in pvp.  That's one of the biggest problems with the game.  The raid gear ramps up so quickly, that it really creates a huge gear discrepancy between those with a strong 20 man contingent and those that do not.  

Now, I do think that Rift is a very well crafted game.  After going back to EQ2 for a month, this is blatantly obvious.  Rift is very streamline, has very enjoyable 5-man content, and an interesting ability progression process with the different souls.  I think that the lack of content for small groups and solos will be the ultimate undoing of the game.  It takes about a month to get burned out on the available content with a solid group of 5 people.  While that's well worth the box cost, it isn't a very good value for a game garnering a monthly subscription fee.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2011, 10:56:56 AM by Nebu »

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Sobelius
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Reply #650 on: August 08, 2011, 02:46:23 PM

If you can't run Hammerknell, you will never be as competitive as possible in pvp.  That's one of the biggest problems with the game.  The raid gear ramps up so quickly, that it really creates a huge gear discrepancy between those with a strong 20 man contingent and those that do not.

Random thought of the day: A RIFT forum poster said they were in a dungeon PUG and someone in the group used an automated gear "scanning" program to determine whether they were "up to" the dungeon. I wonder if the warfront system could take gear into account with a similar "scan" and assign people based on a range of personal+gear stats (and lock you into that gear once you accept the port into the warfront). No help for open world PvP but could be a way to normalize warfronts. Warfronts/battlegrounds seem to be the most enjoyable when everyone on both sides is relatively evenly matched, with objects/objectives within the scenario giving brief buffs.


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Draegan
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Reply #651 on: August 08, 2011, 11:22:09 PM

If you can't run Hammerknell, you will never be as competitive as possible in pvp.  That's one of the biggest problems with the game.  The raid gear ramps up so quickly, that it really creates a huge gear discrepancy between those with a strong 20 man contingent and those that do not.  

Now, I do think that Rift is a very well crafted game.  After going back to EQ2 for a month, this is blatantly obvious.  Rift is very streamline, has very enjoyable 5-man content, and an interesting ability progression process with the different souls.  I think that the lack of content for small groups and solos will be the ultimate undoing of the game.  It takes about a month to get burned out on the available content with a solid group of 5 people.  While that's well worth the box cost, it isn't a very good value for a game garnering a monthly subscription fee.

Only if you don't get attacked.  Top rank gear compared to top raid gear is that you die in raid gear very quickly.  If you're PVPing, you're going to be wearing valor stuff.  The only difference right now is relic weapons.  That's not happening for a long time now,

Currently top rank PVP gear is much better than what anybody is getting right now in HK.  HK has only 3 bosses down right now.  Those relics aren't coming any time soon.  So PVP gear and player will have a huge advantage over raiders for at least the next month or so unless a huge nerf bat hits HK.

For example, my Relic dagger is 37dps.  Top rank PVP Dagger is 44dps.
Sky
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Reply #652 on: August 09, 2011, 09:12:17 AM

What is most effective to wear to GET the valor gear?

Zetor
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Reply #653 on: August 09, 2011, 09:34:49 AM

(gimpmask.jpg)

Seriously though, high-end raid gear is vastly superior to crappy leveling / low-end dungeon gear when starting out. You won't have valor, but you'll have a lot more hp than someone in greens/blues, and (more importantly) your offensive potential will be through the roof. If you play a burst damage spec, you can gank enemies even in valor gear real quick. Of course you'll die a lot, but you'll still live far longer than someone who just hit 50 in greens.

edit: it also takes a LONG time to outfit yourself in a full set of valor gear (rank4? Maybe rank3). Until that point, pve gear in 2/3 of your slots is all you got.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2011, 09:37:33 AM by Zetor »

Nebu
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Reply #654 on: August 09, 2011, 09:43:28 AM

For example, my Relic dagger is 37dps.  Top rank PVP Dagger is 44dps.

Have you seen what 44 dps weapons do in the hands of a rank 6 parachamp or assassin?  It's horribly unbalancing.  Most people in the warfronts are using weapons that are ~ 30 dps.  You really only need about 500 valor to be competitive, meaning that more than half of your gear can come from raids.  PvP in Rift is all about spike damage, and much less survivability.  I routinely see warriors in the warfronts wearing only pve gear.  They seem to top the charts just fine.

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Threash
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Reply #655 on: August 09, 2011, 12:07:27 PM

What is most effective to wear to GET the valor gear?

Do the pvp dailies every day, then farm battlegrounds.  I havent played since they added pvp rifts, no idea how good those are.

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Draegan
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Reply #656 on: August 09, 2011, 10:33:56 PM

For example, my Relic dagger is 37dps.  Top rank PVP Dagger is 44dps.

Have you seen what 44 dps weapons do in the hands of a rank 6 parachamp or assassin?  It's horribly unbalancing.  Most people in the warfronts are using weapons that are ~ 30 dps.  You really only need about 500 valor to be competitive, meaning that more than half of your gear can come from raids.  PvP in Rift is all about spike damage, and much less survivability.  I routinely see warriors in the warfronts wearing only pve gear.  They seem to top the charts just fine.

Yeah but those are warriors.  They're pretty OP in WFs.  They have a shit load of health from their gear and plate.  So that puts them ahead of rogues in leather.  And only needing 500 is silly.  That's a pretty long grind from ground zero to get that.

My point about 44 dps weps is that raiders aren't getting those, pvpers are.  And those PVPers can be solo, casual, duo, small group or raiders.  PVP weps are on par with Raid weps and are easier to get.
Threash
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Reply #657 on: August 10, 2011, 09:20:43 AM

Yeah, this whole "you need to raid in order to pvp" thing is pure bs.  It is actually the other way around, pvp gear is far superior than equal tier gear in pve because of the set bonus.

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Nebu
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Reply #658 on: August 10, 2011, 09:57:07 AM

Yeah, this whole "you need to raid in order to pvp" thing is pure bs.  It is actually the other way around, pvp gear is far superior than equal tier gear in pve because of the set bonus.

The best weapons in the game are from Hammerknell.  Melee dps is determined primarily (in the case of rogues and warriors) by weapon dps.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Having a 44dps weapon gives you a sizeable advantage over those using a 32 dps weapon.  This effect is magnified by dual weilders.

Second, getting 500 valor has been trivialized by pve quests and 4x favor weekends.  

The whole discussion is pointless anyway as Rift pvp is terrible and getting worse with each successive "fix".  

« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 10:03:20 AM by Nebu »

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Threash
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Reply #659 on: August 10, 2011, 10:03:00 AM

There are 44 dps pvp weapons, and they are much much easier to get than anything out of hammerknell.

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Nebu
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Reply #660 on: August 10, 2011, 10:04:11 AM

There are 44 dps pvp weapons, and they are much much easier to get than anything out of hammerknell.

If they were added with 1.4, then I was unaware.  I quit playing Rift when I hit rank 6 since there was nothing else for a small guild to do. 

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

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Reply #661 on: August 10, 2011, 04:58:49 PM

I am feeling no desire to log in any more. I made fifty with two characters, raided for a bit, got r4 on one and r5 on another. There is just nothing else really. I feel like this game is really shallow.

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Sobelius
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Reply #662 on: August 10, 2011, 05:03:48 PM

I am feeling no desire to log in any more. I made fifty with two characters, raided for a bit, got r4 on one and r5 on another. There is just nothing else really. I feel like this game is really shallow.

What would it need to have to give it depth? More content? More leveling? Skirmishes and monster play and a storyline a-la LOTRO? The devs of RIFT said up front they wanted to make it easy for people to get to 50 and raid or PvP since that's where the majority of people end up. They keep adding more high level stuff -- and new things like PvP rifts. Is this just not sufficient to keep holding interest?  I'm just asking out of curiosity.

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Threash
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Reply #663 on: August 10, 2011, 05:18:39 PM

A whole lot of people are simply played out on the whole diku thing.  There is nothing wrong with Rift, it is an incredibly well made game.  Honestly i can't think of one thing WoW does better, other than minor things which usually Rift is extremely fast in copying (like being able to trade BOP items for an hour after looting just went in, one of those minor nice to have things WoW came up with).  I just don't want to level up by going from quest hub to quest hub doing the same quests over and over, i don't want to get to max level and farm regular dungeons so i can farm expert dungeons so i can farm regular raids in order to obtain the latest fashion in gigantic shoulder armor, i don't want to farm battle grounds for pvp gear so one day months for now my alt won't get globaled by a R8 warrior.  I hope Rift does well, their devs are a shining example of how MMO development should be like and the work they've put in since launch is breathtaking, i just wish they were working on a different game.

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Nebu
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Reply #664 on: August 10, 2011, 05:38:43 PM

What would it need to have to give it depth?

1) New 5 man content.  The T1 and T2 dungeons are nothing but a rehash of dungeons you had already done leveling.  By the time you have your T2 gear, you're sick of looking at them.

2) More meaningful pvp.  There are 4 small warfronts.  These get old far sooner than it takes to obtain rank 6.

3) More useful soul combinations.  As a mage, the number of viable ways to spec for dps was VERY limited.  

4) More interesting crafting.  They have begun to make it more useful.  How about making the crafting system an interesting minigame?

5) Add some interesting solo/small group content.

6) Make better use of the Rift system.  Having it act as an NPC spawn point gets old very fast.

7) Improve class balance

8) Allow all classes the ability to play all roles (just like clerics can)

9) Balance classes for both pve and pvp.  

10) Minimize gear effects in pvp.

11) Test shit before letting it go live.  Allowing the first time dungeon bonus to persist allowed people to hit level 50 in a day.  PvP rifts are affecting the game the same way and we're seeing people reach rank 8 in a weekend through an exploit that was EASILY noted on test.  

12) More vanity items (pets, wardrobe, mounts).  Reskinning a 2-headed turtle isn't fooling anyone.  Reskinning the pvp gear is equally lame.

13) Make an equal number of melee and range challenges with bosses.  

Etc.

Rift is a VERY well made game.  It just lacks content for anyone that doesn't have 19 people to play with.  Even raiding guilds are getting bored and we're barely 3 months in.  Player advancement should be obtainable through multiple pathways at this point in MMO evolution.  Sticking to a simple gear grind is probably the biggest reason that I find the game shallow. 

« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 05:48:14 PM by Nebu »

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

-  Mark Twain
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