Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

[shiznitz]

I loved Arena, and loved Daggerfall more, but they were both buggy pieces of shit at launch, and Daggerfall at least for months afterward. Didn't stop me playing them, but buggy as all get out.

Morrowind was better, but there were still broken parts, not just the faces. And 'no cliff racers' was the first mod I installed for it.

Daggerfall: where becoming a werewolf was actually full of win!

[Sheepherder]

Morrowind was better, but there were still broken parts, not just the faces. And 'no cliff racers' was the first mod I installed for it.

Oblivion in action is like watching a zombie shuffle along: totally surreal.  Morrowind is watching that same zombie shuffling along then jump with all his might, clear all of half a foot, fall back towards earth, stop short of it, and glide forward while suspended above the ground for three metres before finally landing and continuing his shuffle.  Yet it's still more fondly remembered.  You have to fuck up badly for that kind of result.

[Muffled]

Morrowind was better, but there were still broken parts, not just the faces. And 'no cliff racers' was the first mod I installed for it.

Oblivion in action is like watching a zombie shuffle along: totally surreal.  Morrowind is watching that same zombie shuffling along then jump with all his might, clear all of half a foot, fall back towards earth, stop short of it, and glide forward while suspended above the ground for three metres before finally landing and continuing his shuffle.  Yet it's still more fondly remembered.  You have to fuck up badly for that kind of result.

Hey man, Morrowind blew my little mind the first time I played it.  I would get a House Redoran tattoo if I wasn't such a pansy.

It does look very, very bad now though.

[Sheepherder]

Morrowind blew almost everyone's mind, and it had nothing to do with the game mechanics, because they almost all universally sucked.  It was just a really cool world to fuck around in.  Oblivion isn't, and it strikes you in an uncanny valley way that shit is not as it should be, whereas Morrowind just plain backhands you with the weird and tells to to man up, bitch.

[Paelos]

Morrowind blew almost everyone's mind, and it had nothing to do with the game mechanics, because they almost all universally sucked.  It was just a really cool world to fuck around in.  Oblivion isn't, and it strikes you in an uncanny valley way that shit is not as it should be, whereas Morrowind just plain backhands you with the weird and tells to to man up, bitch.

I found riding around on giant whale-bugs completely hilarious.

[Sky]

Morrowind blew almost everyone's mind

I think it's really age-dependent. Arena blew my mind, Ultima 4 blew my mind, Morrowind was just a prettier Daggerfall with worse gameplay. Never finished it or Oblivion.

[Lantyssa]

I enjoyed them all.  Maybe it's because I'm a massive explorer-type though.  As long as the story doesn't get in my way, I'm happy.

[HaemishM]

I have tried to play Oblivion twice, and both times my interest just totally petered out soon after I escape and start walking around the first city. I think I once went riding out of the city and found a hidden dungeon, got lost in it and never went back to the game.

[Ingmar]

Morrowind blew almost everyone's mind, and it had nothing to do with the game mechanics, because they almost all universally sucked.  It was just a really cool world to fuck around in.  Oblivion isn't, and it strikes you in an uncanny valley way that shit is not as it should be, whereas Morrowind just plain backhands you with the weird and tells to to man up, bitch.

I played it for just long enough to note 3 things:

- leveling system was pants on head retarded
- combat was click mouse swing sword, with no promise of any greater depth later on
- game was the single ugliest rpg I had ever played (for its era)

I logged maybe 4ish hours total. My mind was not even a little blown. I could have gotten past the 2nd two issues, if it weren't for the first one, ugh. I managed to 'finish' Oblivion, since the leveling was a slightly smaller pair of pants on head retarded in that one, and they fixed some of the ugly.

[LK]

I'd be interested in seeing how this game will deviate from the basic formula established by previous Elder Scroll and current Fallout games.

I seriously, seriously doubt it will. Skyrim's announcement, to me, is like a new season of a favorite television series being announced. It'll look better, have slightly refined techniques, but will be the same formula and mechanics that have made the series what it is, with all new content to consume. This is where I see video games as an industry right now.

If they start getting creative, then they'll be doing what Squaresoft has been doing with Final Fantasy: experimenting with a specific configuration of a genre rather than refining it. *This introduces failure into a sure thing,* and why we get what we get.

[Paelos]

I don't want them to get creative with this one. I want them to make it bigger. The games are getting smaller and smaller from Daggerfall > Morrowind > Oblivion. I'd like to see them reverse that trend with this title and give me a huge world to wander around in for a long period of time, exploring new crap.

[WayAbvPar]

I don't want them to get creative with this one. I want them to make it bigger. The games are getting smaller and smaller from Daggerfall > Morrowind > Oblivion. I'd like to see them reverse that trend with this title and give me a huge world to wander around in for a long period of time, exploring new crap.

That would work for me. Fix the character leveling (and the related "encounters level with the player" crap), give me a giant world to explore, and let me loose. Here's my $60.

[Sheepherder]

Screw what they did in Oblivion.  Drop me off the prison boat in Skyrim and drop the hint to talk to some guy about Draugr leaping out of the sea and eating fucking faces and I'm happy.  Because unstoppable gluttonous sea zombies that eat those who were their kin in life are fucking awesome, and dragons are fucking lame.

[LK]

Existing in a world like you want would be great if the content was being continually generated. The flaw to your play style is that, eventually, you run out of areas to explore / content to experience.

[Tebonas]

Then you buy the next game. If the world was large enough, you got enough entertainment out of it for your money.

[Lantyssa]

Considering I got two solid months out of any of the Bethesda games, along with numerous later flirtations, I'd say I do get my money's worth.  Especially compared to other play styles that burn through them in under a week then never touch it again.

[Sky]

I don't want them to get creative with this one. I want them to make it bigger. The games are getting smaller and smaller from Daggerfall > Morrowind > Oblivion. I'd like to see them reverse that trend with this title and give me a huge world to wander around in for a long period of time, exploring new crap.

This really bit Gothic in the ass, ended up with Piranha Bytes losing the franchise. To be fair, Gothic started out as a smaller, more hand-crafted world, so returning to their specialty with Risen really worked. So I guess by extending that logic to Bethsoft, going to a more randomized giant world would be a good move for them.

Of course...they do have to contend with being a console game, now 

[Paelos]

To be fair, what bit Gothic in the ass was that their games would not function, and combat was infuriating on a level not seen since 1996.

[Sky]

To be fair, what bit Gothic in the ass was that their games would not function, and combat was infuriating on a level not seen since 1996.

I'd disagree, and so would enough fans to keep the franchise going through 5 full releases :p They know they're niche and many developers could take a lesson from them about knowing your audience and not over-reaching your grasp.

[Paelos]

I'd love to hear you explain to me how Gothic 3 was functional and not combat ass, but that's not for this thread.

I will say that the strength of the Elder Scrolls franchise has always been exploration, so I hope they don't strive for something else.

[LK]

Yes, the Elder Scrolls definitely satisfies the "To Explore" need of gamers. It barely addresses the other three.

[brellium]

Judging from Oblivion speech mini game...if they're going for SPECIAL once more, at least it'll be replaced with a Speech check.
But looking back at Oblivion 'Be the guildmaster of all guilds' typical design, expect more shallow experience in a big world with wasted potential. Bethesda is just not that creative in the writing dept.

Even Fallout 3 with its fun gameplay had nothing to offer in terms of main quest writing except for killing giant orcs with slo-mo attacks.

Oblivion? My name is Patrick Stewart, you're the chosen one, I've seen you in my dreams, even though you're in the jail for a crime I cannot even recall,  I trust you, here's a really special necklace, save the kingdom from satan, please.

The difference being between the two being:  I actually finished fallout 3 and new vegas, but couldn't be arsed with oblivion after hitting my 3rd oblivion gate.

Same, I did recently get bored and finished morrowind.

This time I just picked up a dedra diakatana and went around raping shit.

[Paelos]

Yes, the Elder Scrolls definitely satisfies the "To Explore" need of gamers. It barely addresses the other three.

It tries to hit on some of the achiever shit with all the guildmaster titles, but that's not the main flow. There's certainly no social or killer.

[LK]

Achiever needs something that matters. XBox Live Achievements are as close as you can get. That's the power of them; their ability on a meta scale to satisfy. In-game achievements are given more meaning when attached to Live Achievements... to an Achiever.

But, yes, not really the point of Elder Scrolls.

[Hawkbit]

Kotaku has a post from Game Informer mag right now.  Sounds like Skyrim is going to use a classless system and you earn skill points by how much you use them in the game.  Level is then tied to skills, so learning a lot of low level skills keeps your overall level low, yet leveling one or two skills very fast raises your overall level fast. 

Mob scaling is more Fallout3 than Oblivion. 

[eldaec]

I have tried to play Oblivion twice, and both times my interest just totally petered out soon after I escape and start walking around the first city. I think I once went riding out of the city and found a hidden dungeon, got lost in it and never went back to the game.

To be fair though, Oblivion is pretty cool until you escape.

[eldaec]

Yes, the Elder Scrolls definitely satisfies the "To Explore" need of gamers. It barely addresses the other three.

Honestly, not really in the case of Oblivion, because the thing about exploring, is that you have to find something.

[Sky]

Playing Risen reminded me how I dislike mob scaling. Creeping into a new dungeon, peeking around corners and seeing some earth-pounding Ashbeast or creepy ghoul and then running before they see you. Or the first encounter, trying to get away or just watching the thing one-shot you in a bloody haze.

[Hawkbit]

The way Oblivion handled mob scaling was the #1 reason I never made it more than 10 hours into the game.  There needs to be insurmountable odds in some instances - things I just can't beat.  Otherwise it just feels like CandyLand.

The #2 reason was how character levels were based around skillups; I found myself trying to game the leveling system too much and that turned me off, too.  I hope they get some of these things fixed.

[Sheepherder]

There are mods for Oblivion correcting both of those problems.

[Sky]

I like the skill ups advancement, but there was something about it that was messed up in Oblivion, where you'd hurt your stats by levelling up, was it monster level scaling by character level, so if you picked too many locks without skilling up combat skills, you'd be facing advanced monsters without the skills to fight them? Iirc, then that was still a scaling issue and not advancement.

Anyway, I like mods like FFH2, that create a fresh new game with the old one's engine. Oblivion you need mods just to fix what the hacks at bethsoft fucked up. LIke, a lot of mods. That's indicative of a bad game.

[Lantyssa]

It was because it didn't matter what skill you leveled, it contributed to mob scaling.  Maybe you wanted to do a little basket weaving, or you happened to be wearing a different category of armor than you normally would... skill raises and then so do mobs.

[Hawkbit]

There are mods for Oblivion correcting both of those problems.

Yep, but for whatever reason every time I attempted to use mods on Oblivion it made the game unplayable.  I spent well more than twice the amount of time playing Oblivion than I did trying to get it to run the way I wanted.  In the end, it was just easier to not play it.

[Sir T]

I have to admit, I found the Shivering isles expansion a far more engaging place to wander around in and play in than oblivion itself. I mean, yeah you wound up trapped there according to the lore but hell you became a Prince, and it was a really well designed place to mess about in.

If I ever reinstal oblivion I'll probably go straight to the shivering isles and toss the keys to the rest of the world into an oblivion gate on the way. 

[Sheepherder]

In the unmodded game leveling too many non-combat skills won't fuck your game unless you get absolutely "I'm level ten and haven't gotten a single skill up that will aid me in combat, or used any of my non-combat abilities to acquire better equipment" retarded about it.