Hate Pugs? You'll hate them even more now!

[Merusk]

X-server PUGs via the LFG system, coming soon!  Apparently the fix for the "Additional instances cannot be launched" also allows them to do x-server dungeon queues.  (Bets on it simply being load balancing?) 

 As a feature (and probably the only way to make it work right) you'll also be teleported into the instance once you have a full group.

Additionally, there will now be a way to flag yourself as "Leader" in the LFG system. If you're flagged as leader and your group completes the dungeon, you get a bonus/ reward of some sort.  They didn't explain exactly what it would be.

[Lakov_Sanite]

I don't see how this is bad. a pug is a pug...people are just as willing to be retards on your own server, getting people from others can't make that worse.

[Selby]

Maybe now I'll find enough people to run Oculus with me...

[Merusk]

*I* don't think it's worse, but I've never had a pug problem.  I'm always willing to bail if I realize it's a failure group, so pugs don't bother me.   I know others don't feel the same, though.

[ezrast]

I don't see how this is bad. a pug is a pug...people are just as willing to be retards on your own server, getting people from others can't make that worse.

You can blacklist the retards when you're just dealing with your own server.

[Sheepherder]

Considering that with this you can probably bail, re-queue, and be in another group in seconds I'd say that it's not going to be a problem.

[Hindenburg]

Would be wonderful if coupled with a player rating system. Sadly, the same system would be abused.

Still, an improvement.

[dusematic]

The problem with blacklisting is that the list is too small.  I filled up my entire list during the great "casino" spamfest of 2006.  And during many other similar mass hysterias.  Also, idiocy. 


HAVE A DRINK TO CURE WHAT AILS YA!

[Koyasha]

Problem with this is that it will probably kill server communities entirely.  Battlegroups already hurt server communities massively.  In that case, the benefits probably outweighed the downside, but I feel like the cost on this one is higher than the benefit.

[Merusk]

Server communities were ruined years ago. People server hop without a second thought as to what's going on, then come back a few months/ years later.  I've lost track of how many people I've lost contact with due to transfers.

[Rendakor]

I don't see anyone besides the lone "DK DPS LFG!!!" actually using this shit.

[pxib]

It might light up the lower level instances again. I hear they're all but dead now.

[Sheepherder]

The old instances are, in fact, very dead.

[Lantyssa]

Think of it this way... those hard to reach instances will now be easily reachable.  You may even be able to keep it same server by pre-forming your group, or getting four of you together and grouping the fifth.

[Sheepherder]

The number of people on my server I'd actually go out of my way to group with is surprisingly low.

[sinij]

I don't see how this is bad. a pug is a pug...people are just as willing to be retards on your own server, getting people from others can't make that worse.

Really?

What about Ninjas? What about leeching? What about leader abuses (you cleared trash, but my buddy gets to come in for the final boss kill)?

You simply cannot blacklist all retards accross all servers, at least on your own server you can guess based on guilds they belong to...

[Sheepherder]

What about Ninjas? What about leeching? What about leader abuses (you cleared trash, but my buddy gets to come in for the final boss kill)?

1. Happen on my server, frequently.  Seriously, check your realm forum.
2. This is new.
3. Also new.

Chances are the same people who would fuck you over on purpose are the same ones clearing Naxx on a regular basis for alts and either don't want to put up with your shit, or are just going to ignore you when you demand your iLevel 219 axe that you and 15 of their guys worked so hard to get for their raid leader's alt.  Any time you see five people in the same guild together with one of them having lead somebody's getting fucked, period.

EDIT: I just realized, you could use the LFG tool to start a raid on one server and, presumably, invite specific people from another server.  That's fucking hardcore.  Expect to see a lot of people going cross-server to raid with friends / like-minded poopsockers met through the forums.

EDIT2: I even have a theme song for this phenomenon.

[Lakov_Sanite]

um...people already do that, it's called server transfers.

[Ingmar]

If your server is big you don't need this. If your server sucks, the benefits outweigh the possible badness since hey, at least you got a group at all.

No real downside here.

[Sheepherder]

um...people already do that, it's called server transfers.

Which still doesn't help you if you have friends on several different servers.

I think I'm going to have to try at some point to create a 25 server raid.  Maybe even make it all paladins and kill new Onyxia, for the lulz.

[Tale]

[Bzalthek]

I wonder if they're going to block trades in these cross-server groups.  Otherwise the next step is cross-server Auction Houses.

It's an interesting step, and I think this will be great for getting pugs for those less frequently visited dungeons.  I'm just trying to see where this rabbit hole goes because it seems like a step rather than a stopping point.

[Lantyssa]

One server, with instances.  Play with any of your ten million friends whenever you want.

[kildorn]

What about Ninjas? What about leeching? What about leader abuses (you cleared trash, but my buddy gets to come in for the final boss kill)?

1. Happen on my server, frequently.  Seriously, check your realm forum.
2. This is new.
3. Also new.

Chances are the same people who would fuck you over on purpose are the same ones clearing Naxx on a regular basis for alts and either don't want to put up with your shit, or are just going to ignore you when you demand your iLevel 219 axe that you and 15 of their guys worked so hard to get for their raid leader's alt.  Any time you see five people in the same guild together with one of them having lead somebody's getting fucked, period.

EDIT: I just realized, you could use the LFG tool to start a raid on one server and, presumably, invite specific people from another server.  That's fucking hardcore.  Expect to see a lot of people going cross-server to raid with friends / like-minded poopsockers met through the forums.

EDIT2: I even have a theme song for this phenomenon.

The statement was 5 mans only right now, and see how it plays out. I don't see an issue with letting the hardest of the hardcore cross server raid, though. I highly doubt it will happen, really. Just because you wouldn't gain guild XP doing so, and that's pretty much the reward for NOT using the LFG tool.

[sinij]

Regardless of how big your server there is only limited number of times you can abuse PUG and get away with it. Eventually your rep catches up to you and you have to transfer out. My guess is that number of times you can abuse and still have people joining your PUGs is in a single digits. If you happen to be in a guild - your entire guild recruitment dies, and even jackass guilds get serious pressure to get rid of bad apples.

The same is not true for cross-server. This system will have more griefers than Crossroads after school is out.

People rolling Need on everything, then later trading items to buddies (thanks to new 1 hour trade rule)? People running heroics up to the last boss then kicking out everyone to bring in buddies? People leaving after getting drop they wanted, not caring to finish instance? People goting AFK/GTG because, who cares its just a PUG?

This system is doomed to fail without some form of "rate your group members" feature.

[Lakov_Sanite]

You can only trade items for one hour with people who were in your group at the time the item dropped. Also, my point earlier is that the hardest of the hardcore already ignore servers, they find guild and then transfer all the time.  It's fairly common practice for hardcore guilds to get server transfers all the time now so even if they did allow cross-server raid groups there would be no point except for pugs and the only thing you can pug raid is naxx atm.

[Rasix]

This system is doomed to fail without some form of "rate your group members" feature.

There is no way anyone would abuse such a system. 

[Selby]

...and the only thing you can pug raid is naxx atm.

Our server has Uld-25 PUGs going on every week or so.  Last weekend we got all the way to Kologarn which was pretty impressive for a bunch of alts and new people.

[Hindenburg]

Eventually your rep catches up to you and you have to transfer out. My guess is that number of times you can abuse and still have people joining your PUGs is in a single digits.

Haha, no, you can easily pull it off several dozens of times, and even when you do get blacklisted, a name change is cheaper than a transfer.

[Rasix]

Eventually your rep catches up to you and you have to transfer out. My guess is that number of times you can abuse and still have people joining your PUGs is in a single digits.

Haha, no, you can easily pull it off several dozens of times, and even when you do get blacklisted, a name change is cheaper than a transfer.

There's a guy on my server that's cleaned out several guild banks with the same character. Servers as a whole can be rather large and /trade + server forum spam only covers so much.

[kildorn]

If our guild actually recruited people, we'd probably get stung by out complete lack of communication with our realm as a whole. I don't think any of us hang out in any global or regional channels to find out who should be blacklisted.

But really, the cross server queues are good for instances it's hard to find groups for/leveling, and has a reward tied to the leaders of it as a bonus, since the changes for guild xp/leveling will make pugs DIE without some system added to encourage them.

[Venkman]

Sorry, can't easily find it, where'd they say this feature is coming?

And for how long have they had freakin' banner ads in their forums? Tells ya how long it's been since I've visited that retched place.

[Koyasha]

You can only trade items for one hour with people who were in your group at the time the item dropped. Also, my point earlier is that the hardest of the hardcore already ignore servers, they find guild and then transfer all the time.  It's fairly common practice for hardcore guilds to get server transfers all the time now so even if they did allow cross-server raid groups there would be no point except for pugs and the only thing you can pug raid is naxx atm.

On the other hand it would allow said guilds to try out applicants much much more easily, and people to apply to them much more easily and show their skills or lack thereof.  So in a way it might make it easier for people to find a guild they belong in.

Was announced during the dungeons and raids panel if I remember right.

[kildorn]

Sorry, can't easily find it, where'd they say this feature is coming?

And for how long have they had freakin' banner ads in their forums? Tells ya how long it's been since I've visited that retched place.

Announced at Blizzcon.

And about a year?

[Gobbeldygook]

Cross-server instances?  This sounds great.  But there must be a catch somewhere...



Oh there it is.  Real screenshot from my servers h-toc queue just now.