Diablo III Wild Speculation and Rumor Mongering Abounds

[Paelos]

The way the system is still does this though.  You'll have builds that specialize.  You will have people who follow the mob mentality of the best melee/caster build.  Nothing changes.  These games are based on stats, gear and the abilities you use.  Nothing has changed on the surface.

What build? How are they building in this system? What's the example here?

[Draegan]

The way the system is still does this though.  You'll have builds that specialize.  You will have people who follow the mob mentality of the best melee/caster build.  Nothing changes.  These games are based on stats, gear and the abilities you use.  Nothing has changed on the surface.

Well, except for the fact that the game doesn't punish you if you want to play your hilarious giant front lulz build on your own one day, and then the next day switch up to your serious business inferno progression build to play with your friends. 

I guess my whole argument was comparing D3 to current gen games and not to D2 only.  So if the whole discussion is strictly D2 vs. D3 then I agree with all that.

[MrHat]

I'm fairly certain that the free respecing has some limits on it in further difficulties.

[Sjofn]

I'm sure I'll like D3 fine (I liked the little beta well enough), I just won't like it as much as I might've. Ah well.

Just like every other game that gets lots of discussion, D3 just won't be as good as the one in my imagination.

That doesn't always happen to me. Unlike a lot of people here, I am still capable of feeling joy.  

I think we all had the same reaction during the demo of the runes and effects. "So wait, why the fuck would I use anything but the hilariously awesome rune of dropping giant frogs on things and summoning zombie bears?"

And the huge bell thing for the monks, although I think that might've just turned into a regular ability.

[kildorn]

I'm sure I'll like D3 fine (I liked the little beta well enough), I just won't like it as much as I might've. Ah well.

Just like every other game that gets lots of discussion, D3 just won't be as good as the one in my imagination.

That doesn't always happen to me. Unlike a lot of people here, I am still capable of feeling joy. 

[Sjofn]

Fuck you.

[luckton]

 

[Merusk]

I'm fairly certain that the free respecing has some limits on it in further difficulties.

From what they've said the only limits are cooldown on using the skills you respecced.   In Normal they've lowered the CD down to 10-15s after swapping, I imagine in Inferno it will be something like 5-10 mins.   Either way it's only a timer easily taken care of at your TP location so limiting it further would be silly.

The most they could do is make it a gold sink.

[MrHat]

I'm fairly certain that the free respecing has some limits on it in further difficulties.

From what they've said the only limits are cooldown on using the skills you respecced.   In Normal they've lowered the CD down to 10-15s after swapping, I imagine in Inferno it will be something like 5-10 mins.   Either way it's only a timer easily taken care of at your TP location so limiting it further would be silly.

The most they could do is make it a gold sink.

But that does add a bit of tactics required in selecting your favorite kit in Inferno, doesn't it?

[Samprimary]

i mean seriously this lightning effect

[Maledict]

Respeccing does remove the stacking MF buff you gain from killing rates and champions in Inferno difficulty however, so it's not going to be something you will doing at the high end of the game. Your basically locked to one load out once you leave the town.

[amiable]

Respeccing does remove the stacking MF buff you gain from killing rates and champions in Inferno difficulty however, so it's not going to be something you will doing at the high end of the game. Your basically locked to one load out once you leave the town.

I think thats Ok, my question is whether or not they are going to have a ton of "I'm totally immune to this attack" monsters which were everywhere in D2.  That is going to really punish folks with a single damage type (Barbs especailly are going to get hit hard by this, as almost all of their skills only do physical damage).

[Murgos]

Blizzard:  We tried the traditional leveling up and unlocking way of advancement, it was ok but led to a lot of unfun play styles.  Holding onto skill points for later.  Having to respec/restart a character for an early decision, etc...  Then we tried this current method and all the testers liked it much better.  It was much more fun from the beginning and on through the entirety of the game while still providing variety and increasing power and specialization.

Internet Nerd:  No, I am sure I would have liked the old way better.  You and your fancy 'metrics' and 'testing'.  I know when I like a punch in the dick and this was exactly the punch in the dick I was looking for.

[Lantyssa]

No one is against respecs.

Well, no one sane, and no one here.

[Samprimary]

I know way too many who are. It has led to some really ... special reading.

People who have insisted that without theorycrafting builds and being stuck with them is the only thing that can give depth to the game. Without which, it's just for dirty dirty casuals.

[Lakov_Sanite]

There are, literally, hundreds of possible builds per character in this system.  You will be max level in a day or two after completing normal mode once. All the fun runes are still there but with functionality now.   there is some penalty so that you can respec but not constantly so your choices do matter....

I'm just....what else could you possibly want?

[Xanthippe]

I know way too many who are. It has led to some really ... special reading.

People who have insisted that without theorycrafting builds and being stuck with them is the only thing that can give depth to the game. Without which, it's just for dirty dirty casuals.

This amuses me endlessly.

[Merusk]

I've seen some posts like that on the Diablo battle.net site.  The most memorable one was "This game is too easy and just proves that BLizzard has begun chasing dollars instead of gamers.".
 .


Ed: I just went to the forum to try and cherry-pick a few good ones.. but I don't have to.  Just go to Gen Disc there's numerous threads from folks QQ about it being too easy and no customization and choices not mattering.  It's amusing.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/3354739/

[Fabricated]

The only reasonable argument for making it more like D2 is to encourage people to make more characters. Make a character with a specific build, play until you get bored or die if you're playing hardcore, make another and try something else. The whole AH thing plays against that principle really. Why the hell make a new character after spending $X on gear for your first/main character?

[FieryBalrog]

I don't understand why people think there is no planning with this system. There isn't the same exact type of planning, no.

But the restriction here is instead of skill point allocation, you have slot allocation. 6 slots to work with, 3 passives, 5 runes per skill of which you have to choose one; and you have a significant penalty at max level for swapping out skills/passives/runes during a play session. There are 25c6 x 18c3 different loadout options for a Wizard, for example, not counting runes. If you think just randomly slapping together skills is going to give you a great loadout... think again. That's why you'll still have to, you know, plan shit out.

Not to mention optimizing your gear for your skill loadout too (or vice versa).

[ezrast]

Ah, see, I didn't realize there was any penalty at all for respeccing mid dungeon. Knowing that the game won't be balanced around swapping primary skills every few minutes makes me feel better.

[Draegan]

I don't understand why people think there is no planning with this system. There isn't the same exact type of planning, no.

But the restriction here is instead of skill point allocation, you have slot allocation. 6 slots to work with, 3 passives, 5 runes per skill of which you have to choose one; and you have a significant penalty at max level for swapping out skills/passives/runes during a play session. There are 25c6 x 18c3 different loadout options for a Wizard, for example, not counting runes. If you think just randomly slapping together skills is going to give you a great loadout... think again. That's why you'll still have to, you know, plan shit out.

Not to mention optimizing your gear for your skill loadout too (or vice versa).

I'm not saying there isn't any planning.  I'm saying the planning is simplified.  I prefer having to unlock abilities or runes or passives via passives and balance everything on points spent rather than just figuring out the right combination of abilities.

Gearing for optimizing your build is the same however.

[Phred]

The only reasonable argument for making it more like D2 is to encourage people to make more characters.

Yes and considering they felt they needed to delete characters after inactivity in D2 it really seems like they want to discourage the huge growth of their database and this is the solution.

[Phred]

I've got to say wtg to blizzard for making quest exp greater than kill exp. Like people really needed more encouragement to race through the maps.

[Ragnoros]

I think thats Ok, my question is whether or not they are going to have a ton of "I'm totally immune to this attack" monsters which were everywhere in D2.  That is going to really punish folks with a single damage type (Barbs especailly are going to get hit hard by this, as almost all of their skills only do physical damage).

No, they have said there will not be monsters immune to specific types of damage like in D2. There will however be monsters that root, fear, stun, slow, and fling crazy amounts of damage all over the place, once you leave normal mode anyway.

[Job601]

I've got to say wtg to blizzard for making quest exp greater than kill exp. Like people really needed more encouragement to race through the maps.

Do we know if this will still be true at higher difficulty levels, or are people just guessing based on the beta?

[Phred]

I've got to say wtg to blizzard for making quest exp greater than kill exp. Like people really needed more encouragement to race through the maps.

Do we know if this will still be true at higher difficulty levels, or are people just guessing based on the beta?

It's hard to call it a guess when the numbers are right there for you. I guess we're guessing that mobs and quests will scale equally but...

[Ragnoros]

ITT: Game rewards you for completing objectives; gamers shocked.

[Phred]

ITT: Game rewards you for completing objectives; gamers shocked.

Poster misses the point. No one is shocked

[Lakov_Sanite]

You will hit max level after completing normal mode. You must compete normal mode to advance to harder difficulties. 

[Ragnoros]

Also for reference you finish Normal right around level 30, Nightmare at 50, and Hell at 60.

[Merusk]

Yeah, that.  Which is what irritates me the most about the whole system.  "Sorry, you're not hardcore enough to play the build you want."

 

[Murgos]

ITT: Game rewards you for completing objectives; gamers shocked.

Poster misses the point. No one is shocked

Really?  You're annoyed the exp per mob kill is low when you will have to kill umpteen billion mobs but only get to do each quest once per difficulty level?

[Maledict]

Yeah, that.  Which is what irritates me the most about the whole system.  "Sorry, you're not hardcore enough to play the build you want."

 

Which is *exactly* the same as Diablo II. You would finish D2 at level 30 if you really pushed it, but my first character to complete the game didn't even get  enough skill points to unlock the end of tree skills. You have always needed to play the higher difficulties to unlock the full range of builds for Diablo.

[Job601]

ITT: Game rewards you for completing objectives; gamers shocked.

Poster misses the point. No one is shocked

Really?  You're annoyed the exp per mob kill is low when you will have to kill umpteen billion mobs but only get to do each quest once per difficulty level?

In the beta, you can complete quests repeatedly for the experience.  In fact, you start a public game by choosing which quest you want to be on, instead of which waypoint you want to go to.