Closing the WoW Chapter

[jpark]

My RL friends and I (4 immediate friends) are departing from WoW.

It's been a good run - been with the game since release - a lot of fun.  Recent changes to the game just don't seem to suit our play styles:

1.  5 man content is really useless and trivial - you either raid - or - raid.
2.  Kara is a lot of fun - BUT - organizing a small raid like that with specific class requirements seemed to be more work than larger raids - it wore us down.
3.  Arena gear seems comparable to Teir 5 gear (more or less) removing a big incentive to raid - which is not necesssarily bad - but I far prefer AV or Arathi to the bland terrain battles of Arena - but the latter is where the real loot is.
4.  Guild identity means less and less these days - too bad AV can't be done as a guild - too bad arena teams are too small to be more inclusive of a guild figthing at once.
5.  I am not a fan of the leveling exp nerf - it seems to emphasize the end game nature more than ever now.

In some ways my fondest memories of this game were getting groups for things like SFK; Scarlet Monastary and Dire Maul.  I used to criticize the younger players looking for candy runs through these instances - but I realized sometime ago there is just no grouping to be had.  As a warrior - getting raid spots is harder than ever with these reduced raid sizes - combine that with casual play - bad mix.  It seemed easier to be a casual tank in BWL and MC during their hey day - than the raid sizes today.

My compliments to the game - maybe it has moved on from my friends and I rather than vice versa.  I might pass the time by heckling the EQ2 forums - but - time to find a new game :)

[Modern Angel]

I'm right there with you, though I still have my sub to log in once in a blue moon and talk to friends. I'll be back with the expansion... I may (big if) get roped back in with 2.3.

For me it was a different problem: I did a lot of theorycrafting and even though my guild never raided at a high level the entire game started looking like a math equation after awhile. Once it starts to look like that the genie's out of the bottle and you can't suddenly turn that switch off. I'm playing some LOTRO with a small group of friends; very casually, a promise to myself of no raiding and no endgame catass shit.

WoW was certainly fun while it lasted and you won't hear me bash it. They made some very crucial mistakes with BC, as good as it is, for a fair handful of their base. Not enough to make much of a dent, mind you, but enough that I've noticed people leaving even before I decided to.

[SurfD]

Can i have your stuff?

Just Kidding.

All that asside, your reasons do seem valid.  Maybe if they had more 10 man raid content?  I dont doubt that for some it can be a pain to gather even a kara group together, but maybe that would be balanced by having more 10 man content?  At them moment there are 6 25 man raid zones (if you count quickies like Gruul and Magtheridan) but only 1 (soon to be 2) 10 man raid instances.  I can definately see how people could get burned out on raiding Kara over and over again with no change of scenery.

i think 5 mans (heroic at any rate) may make a comeback, with the addition of a lot of new badge loot on par or > T4 stuff.

And i totally agree on the arena thing, however you only need to do what, your minimum number of arena matches a week and let the points build? Plus, doesent the old stuff get discounted / eventually moved into the general Honor Pool of gear?

[WindupAtheist]

I used to criticize the younger players looking for candy runs through these instances

I'm with you there.  I played with a guild where I had a lot of friends, and I probably could have spent my entire time in the game following behind a max-level buddy, raking in easy loot.  But I would politely decline a milk run if I was going somewhere that I wasn't already bored with because I wanted to... you know... play the game.

[Dren]

Still hooked myself and only will get worse in 2.3.  I'm a guy looking for a game that allows me to accomplish something in each game session regardless of grouping or not and this has filled that niche for me.  I see that being even more true after 2.3.  Casual-a-go-go.

Kara runs don't get old when you only have enough in your guild to go about once a week on average.  The summer was challenging with everyone being busy.

I can't speak to PvP, because I really haven't had enough time to sink into it to branch out.  I plan to get into it once I feel I've gotten all I can from the rest of the game.

I can see where I'd move on if I had a regular bunch of friends to game with, but I've long ago gotten past this.  If I were to try and stay with the group of firends I have, I'd be back to the glory days of buying a new game 3 times a month.  Everyone is so scattershot.

It's my age I think.  I've come to be a lot more satisfied squeezing everything I can out of a game and shoving it into every free crevice in my busy schedule as I can.  WoW has worked well in that regard.  It is a great lower life priority activity for me anyway.

[ShenMolo]

2.3 comming out inspired me to re-sub. I was bored of raiding with a hunter before and wanted to switch to a warrior alt. There were no spots in my guild for warriors (dps or tank) so I cancelled for a while out of boredom. With 2.3 comming out, I decided to re-sub, xfer my warrior to a casual guild on a new server, and become a 1-2 night a week 10 man raid tank while farming honor for the eventual Arena 1 dps set thats purchaseable in 2.3.

Once 2.3 arrives there will be the new 10 man, as well as EZ mode leveling to level up the druid and lock I've always wanted in time for the expansion.

[Simond]

And i totally agree on the arena thing, however you only need to do what, your minimum number of arena matches a week and let the points build? Plus, doesent the old stuff get discounted / eventually moved into the general Honor Pool of gear?

Season one arena gear goes on to the general PvP vendors (buyable with normal honour & BG tokens) when season 3 starts. Season 2 gear will hit the vendors when S4 starts, etc, etc.

[Merusk]

Yep, S1 gear is about 14.5k honor max for the bp, helm and legs right now (according to MMO-Champion).  Fairly easy to obtain one piece with a single AV weekend grind (at least now.. we'll see after 2.3 how that works.)

I understand your leaving sentiment.  The 10-mans do make it a little harder to incorporate everyone.  Kara's just not well-balanced.  They wanted to introduce it as a raid rather than a largeer 5-man, so it's tuned as such.  Big mistake, IMO.  It should have been tuned closer to the old Scholo/ UBRS/ Strath when they were all 10-man runs.  (Oh noes, people would have gotten half-step upgrade purples easier that way!)

On the other hand, I keep finding more to do.  We only raid big stuff on the weekends, with Kara/ Gruul being done on the weekday now if there's enough interest.  After grinding my dailies in an hour or so, I find I still have plenty to keep me occupied between doing stuff for my alts, PvP or dicking around raising this faction or that one.  Lots of folks like to bitch about the faction grinds introduced, but it's kept me occupied nicely.  Probably because while I've got the Achiever mindset, I don't feel the need to get them done RIGHT NOW ZOMG instant gratification!!

[jpark]

Not directly germaine to this topic, but I have had the feeling the game is silently moving away from the faction based tension of Horde vs. Alliance.  I was shocked in arena to find I could end up fighting people of my own faction. 

Not only do I find that non-thematic, it also further reduces the incentive to be horde.  It used to be - if you were horde the reduced player population meant a weaker economy and fewer guilds/groups to choose from - BUT - you knew you could get into AV instantly unlike alliance.  WIth the big loots in arena now - that benefit to horde is removed.  People play horde for many reasons of course - but those reasons just became smaller.

Anyway this is a "feeling" I have - somehow - I have the impression that more content in the future will not be facton based anymore - time will tell.

[AcidCat]

I just resubbed after my third month-long break from the game. Each time I've quit, I thought I was done for good. But then 3-4 weeks go by, somehow that itch just comes up again. In my hiatus this time, I played the LOTRO free trial, the EQII Play the Fae trial, the Warhammer beta, and the Tabula Rasa beta. Firing up WoW again, making a new character and running around Elwynn, was like coming home after being lost in the desert for weeks. I think I just need a break periodically to remind me of how good the game is, and how mediocre everything else out there is in comparison.

[El Gallo]

I always assumed, even back in Beta, that they would largely get rid of factions in the future.  It takes them long enough to make new content even without having to do two versions of most quests.  Coming soon - an expansion where Alliance & Horde band together to fend off [Snakes invading from the Moon]. 

I was never into Warcraft before WoW, so I always thought factions were just some annoying crap they stuck to for lore reasons despite being a shitty game mechanic.  But I can see how a Warcraft fan would feel very differently about it.

[jpark]

I was never into Warcraft before WoW, so I always thought factions were just some annoying crap they stuck to for lore reasons despite being a shitty game mechanic.  But I can see how a Warcraft fan would feel very differently about it.

I hear you - but that is not quite my angle.  I see it as "roleplay" - the tensions between the factions - the inability to communicate between the two sides - creates a tangible recreation of the intended storyline.  It really creates a tangible social fabric - when you hear guys in the home cities talking smack about the other faction for one reason or another.

As an aside, only faggots play alliance  :-D

[murdoc]

As an aside, only faggots play alliance  :-D

FOR THE HORDE.

I may take a beating for this, but I say the best game that I played that included factions was DAoC. I had a lot of fun in the frontiers waging war over keeps. Not everyone had this experience and probably not many remember DAoC fondly, but I had a Hell of a lot of fun in DAoC RvR.

[Merusk]

Not directly germaine to this topic, but I have had the feeling the game is silently moving away from the faction based tension of Horde vs. Alliance.  I was shocked in arena to find I could end up fighting people of my own faction. 

If you're basing that because of the Arena, you missed all the arena discussions when it was still just an idea.  Arenas were made this way 1) to reduce queue time 2) because to do horde vs alliance in them meant you weren't seeing the true "Best of" go against each other in the PvP matches at the end of the season.   Merely the "best" team from that side.  Perhaps the top 10 teams were all horde. Doing horde vs alliance meant only 5 got to compete while 5 less competent allies got in.

Ed:  Not to mention that the cooperation seen vs the Silithid and Illidan and aren't the first time the Horde & Alliance have set-aside differences.   The tensions that were involved at the beginning of WoW only came about after some strife that happens 'behind the scenes' after WC3 (which can apparently also be read about in the P&P RPG.)

 The end of WC3 kind of leads you to believe that Horde-Alliance relations while not stable, are on the mend.  After all, the Horde isn't a throng of bloodthirsty demon-driven killers anymore.  Stability is in both parties long-term interests.

[jpark]

Not directly germaine to this topic, but I have had the feeling the game is silently moving away from the faction based tension of Horde vs. Alliance.  I was shocked in arena to find I could end up fighting people of my own faction. 

If you're basing that because of the Arena, you missed all the arena discussions when it was still just an idea.  Arenas were made this way 1) to reduce queue time 2) because to do horde vs alliance in them meant you weren't seeing the true "Best of" go against each other in the PvP matches at the end of the season.   Merely the "best" team from that side.  Perhaps the top 10 teams were all horde. Doing horde vs alliance meant only 5 got to compete while 5 less competent allies got in.

Ed:  Not to mention that the cooperation seen vs the Silithid and Illidan and aren't the first time the Horde & Alliance have set-aside differences.   The tensions that were involved at the beginning of WoW only came about after some strife that happens 'behind the scenes' after WC3 (which can apparently also be read about in the P&P RPG.)

 The end of WC3 kind of leads you to believe that Horde-Alliance relations while not stable, are on the mend.  After all, the Horde isn't a throng of bloodthirsty demon-driven killers anymore.  Stability is in both parties long-term interests.

Good points.  But if the Horde and alliance are going to climb into bed together - there has to be a "them".  My recollection is that "them" was the burning legion in WC3.  In WoW, if that is the burning legion - it not a "faction" until we see players with the option of playing the Burning Legion vs. Good Players (horde + alliance)

[Xanthippe]

Almost a year since TBC was launched, and I have yet to see the inside of anything bigger than a 5man.  I haven't even seen Kara yet; my hunter's attuned but never gone, my lock still needs to do BM.  My 65 priest will likely hit 70 before I see Kara.

And I just started levelling a shaman and warrior, and going between those.

There are so many different ways to play WoW.  Sometimes I just like to play the crafting/auction game.

And what Murdoc said about DAOC.  Absofuckinglutely right on.  That was some fun - the 3way war.  Too bad ToA came along and removed all my joy.

I arena because I have to for the loot.  I don't particularly enjoy it, although I love my partners and have learned so much from them.  But AV remains my very favorite bg, and I would love to have some sort of WoW war game to play that was more persistent (a la DAOC Frontiers).  If it could be combined with some kind of trading or economic disruptions, ... now I'm off fantasizing.

Oh, and if you get lucky on servers, there is no queue for bgs for alliance.  I haven't seen a queue since battlegroups were put in, other than due to a glitch.

Three years and I'm still rather in lurv with WoW.  Who woulda thunk it?

[jpark]

I booted up my level 30 Templar in EQ2.  I did not realize later that what was standing beside me was a level 70 player until I read his level.  The goddamn gear is so lack lustre in that game you can't tell by looking at people if they are level 15 or 70.  Playing other MMORPGS is like assuming a factory position during the summer so you can appreciate "school" when September hits ;)

[Tannhauser]

True, WoW is many games in one.  As an explorer type, I'm disappointed that I'll probably never see Illidan or other goodies because I'm just not hardcore about this game.  I want to SEE all the content the game has but oh well. 

Not a WoW hater, just a casual player.

[Azazel]

I'm over WoW. Again. Between being too busy with work and the fact that there's simply nothing to do solo (besides the grind of daily quests) has finally made the brick his the wall. My account expires in 5 days, so I'll try and get in 10 arena fights this weekend, and then again after the patch, then that's it again for a couple of months...

I barely have time for dip-in dip-out things like Portal or TF2 right now, so the endless grind of WoWcraft isn't something I can be bothered with atm.

[rk47]

same here i've been off it for half a year already. think i levelled a hunter, pally then finally shaman. the Kz raids was getting dull, and the guild was too small to do anything else. I've done most 5 mans to death and finally decided to quit when the new content patch didn't add much else.

[Tannhauser]

I think WoW will age gracefully.  I can see me coming back in two years to do Westfall quests again just for the sheer nostalga of it.
They shouldn't disturb the old areas too much because of that reason.  You don't mess with the classics, well except for Coke.

[Kalei]

This thread caught my eye tonight because I've been trying to put my finger on exactly what it is about the game I used to love that I don't love about it anymore.  You make good points and all are valid.

I think WoW is like getting to be like a soup with everything but the kitchen sink thrown into it and that's the best way I can describe the faltering feeling.  Everytime I log on, there's too many things on the To-Do list and it's like fishing around the soup trying to identify everything that's gotten into it.  Then picking out the stuff I don't like to eat.  Or swallowing the stuff I have to because it's attached to the stuff I like.

It's times like these where the saying, "Keep it simple, stupid" has its merits.