Patch 2.3 preliminary details

[Dren]

I agree with Xanthippe.  The money is in the lowbie stuff to mid-level stuff.  Easy access to the mats and buyers galore!

I predict this to be even moreso after 2.3 launches.  The number of people holding back for the leveling changes to either finish their alts or start new ones will be huge.  Expect prices on crafted items for the 20-60 lvl toons to jump big time.

[Nebu]

Leveling my rogue I can tell you that there is almost nothing I can buy in the 20 - 40 range.  I'd think that selling to those folks would be bank.  Lots of people are leveling alts and are rolling in gold but not gear. 

[Selby]

One of the mistakes people make in this game is to only try to make and sell high level stuff.  People are still leveling up, and still need lower level stuff.  That's where the money is, simply because no one else is doing it.

I owned the herbalism market on my server because I was the only one selling the stuff beyond the absolute high end materials.  My other alts do pretty well in cash themselves since they harvest materials for their mounts.

[SurfD]

I must be one of those somewhat odd individuals in that I have leveled 3 different characters to level 60 and have probably never spent more then about 20G combined between the 3 of them buying gear for them off the AH.

I honestly have never, EVER seen the point of buying something i know i am going to replace in 3 to 5 levels.  If i was planning on twinking a character and locking them at a fixed level, sure, all bets are off, but if the goal is to hit 70, i just wouldnt bother.

[Ironwood]

I'm with you.  Kinda.

I'd never buy gear;  but I may try to level my professions that little bit quicker.

[Merusk]

I've tried selling low-end engineering stuff. It doesn't move for weeks at a time, but there's at least a semi-frequent demand for higher things. (Adamantite frames, scopes, the odd repair bot now and then.)

The few items that are needed from engineering for the low-end quests I actually expect the demand to bottom-out for after 2.3.  With the faster leveling, you can skip those damned annoying quests like Chasing A-ME-01 and whichever one it is in the Badlands. (Hell I skipped both on my last 2 alts as it is and I can make the stuff.)  I tried selling about 10 gyros over the course of a month, and finally just gave up.  It was costing me more to list a few of them every day than the amount I was selling, and I was undercutting the other 2-3 people selling them.

Demand for low-end mats? Sure, that's there.  Low-end items not so much on my server.  Every server's different.. mine's more raid-focused than others, apparently. Makes sense what with people transferring there to join Risen and Premonition since they can't do pve -> pvp transfers to join other Hardcore raiders.

[Dren]

Yeah, I wasn't really talking about gear.  That really doesn't sell very well at any level.  At least, it never really covers the actual cost.

I was talking about materials for skills and consumables.  The only reason people purchase consumables at low levels anymore is to make leveling that much quicker.  Quicker kills, less deaths, etc. make for fast levelling.

The profession building is just a no-brainer.

[Valmorian]

I must be one of those somewhat odd individuals in that I have leveled 3 different characters to level 60 and have probably never spent more then about 20G combined between the 3 of them buying gear for them off the AH.

I honestly have never, EVER seen the point of buying something i know i am going to replace in 3 to 5 levels.  If i was planning on twinking a character and locking them at a fixed level, sure, all bets are off, but if the goal is to hit 70, i just wouldnt bother.

For me it depends upon the character I'm levelling.  If it's a Mage, Warlock, Priest type then I mostly ignore the AH.  However, it's worth it to always check for the most up to date weapons for a Warrior, Paladin or Rogue.. More damage = quicker levelling..

[Morat20]

For me it depends upon the character I'm levelling.  If it's a Mage, Warlock, Priest type then I mostly ignore the AH.  However, it's worth it to always check for the most up to date weapons for a Warrior, Paladin or Rogue.. More damage = quicker levelling..

Depends on your tradeskills too. My mage is a tailor/enchanter. Other than occasionally looking for cheap recipes/patterns that I might not have, I use the AH solely to sell stuff with.

Between the gear I make (for skill-ups), the enchants I put on my gear (for same), I don't need anything else. Bags always sell well, although not too profitably, and some stuff (like the black mageweave stuff) tends to sell really well -- and since I had to make a bunch to skillup, I sell that.

Mostly what I do, however, is if I've got a bunch of crap greens from any alt (jewelcrafter, tailor, blacksmith, leatherworker, even engineer) -- I just mail them to my enchanter, melt them, and send the results back. There's always a brisk trade in enchanting materials of all levels, and at least I get something back.

[Xanthippe]

I have a level 16 alt that sells bronze tubes for 1g each.  And Aquadynamic Fish Attractors, 5g/stack.  I sell 2-4 tubes a day, and about 12 stacks of lures a week.  I should probably make those low level scopes and sell them.  I can rarely find scopes on the AH other than the khorium scopes.

Just started a leatherworker who's 29.  Been selling the two blue items, about 1 per day.  I even sell some of the green items, because there's not much on the auction house. 

I can make more per hour going to Outlands and farming, but sometimes I can't or don't want to go farm, and it takes less time to make crap and put it up.

With regard to gear - I buy a lot of it.  Why not - my main's rich, what else will I do with the gold?  Save it for housing?  (Even buying gear, and buying mats to level up new professions, I still have a pile).  It makes levelling that much easier.

People say they can't make money from crafting but they're focused on the wrong things.  High end crafting rarely pays unless it's enchanting or jewelcrafting - the two most expensive to level up.  Alchemy's screwed since TBC for profit anyway.  I think I break even on my potion master making mana pots so that I can discover more recipes.  Plenty of people make pots for free.

[Merusk]

I have a level 16 alt that sells bronze tubes for 1g each.  And Aquadynamic Fish Attractors, 5g/stack.  I sell 2-4 tubes a day, and about 12 stacks of lures a week.  I should probably make those low level scopes and sell them.  I can rarely find scopes on the AH other than the khorium scopes.

The logic behind scopes is probably this:  I'm trashing this soon, do I really need a scope?  Prior to level 40 and the sniper you can only add 2-5 damage to your weapon.  Depending on the speed, is it worth the gold?  Hell, I didn't think it was even worth it to put scopes on the weapons I used after replacing my Rhok' while leveling through BC.

Now I've got to ask. How many bronze tubes to you sell in a day on your server? And gyros?

[Xanthippe]

2-4 bronze tubes per day, and I don't sell Gyros anymore because my engineer isn't big enough to make them, but I used to sell 2 -4 a day on those also.  Also sold Mithril casings, one or two per day.

Before TBC I sold Thorium Bullets for a decent price - marked them up about 40% only, because I sold so many of them. 

Then stupidly I went back to alchemy/herbs because engineering was so bad at TBC launch.  I guess I should go back to engineering on my hunter - alchemy is shitty shitty shitty for a nonraider, and engineering is looking pretty good with these newfangled things in the next patch.

[Fordel]

In what way is alchemy shitty for a non-raider?

[Xanthippe]

Can't buy mats, make potions and sell potions and make money doing it.  Not good money, anyway.

Transmute mastery is a joke; potions mastery allows a person to break even if they're careful and don't make or sell too much at a time; elixir mastery is the only one that can make money.  People are beginning to figure that out, though, which means ... lower prices, less money.

The discovery thing is just bullshit. 

The whole change to Guardian or Battle elixir doomed the business of alchemy.  It's far more lucrative to sell herbs than potions these days.

I'm thinking about dropping herb gathering to pick up engineering so I can make arrows or bullets for my hunter.  I'd drop alchemy but I already have discovered and purchased enough that it's an investment I don't want to turn my back on.

[Kalei]

Also on the PvP front, Random Battleground Daily Quest, yay!

Starting with a revamp to Alterac Valley here:  http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html;jsessionid=3DD9BF4DBC252B1FA8E1EF40FBE000AE?topicId=2215842565&sid=1

Per the PTR and devs, we won't get the bonus from those quests unless there's a win.  Which brings in the controversial AFK factor that is the bane of BGs.

Much to the AFK-crowd's chagrin, at the 11th hour, we are endowed with this little bit of ammunition:  http://www.curse.com/downloads/details/9811/

"Details CattleProd allows you to add a monitor to automatically report AFK users. This monitor can be configured to automatically start when entering a battleground."

Apparently Blizzard opened up the door that introduced leeway to script writers which allows an API function call to ReportPlayerIsPVPAFK().  So in addition to the manual report placed in the players' hands, we now have an addon that automates that process.  Of course there are addons on the other side of the spectrum that are countering it with alerts to the debuff so it should be interesting to see how this pans out.  It's a war zone within a war zone.

[Venkman]

I must be one of those somewhat odd individuals in that I have leveled 3 different characters to level 60 and have probably never spent more then about 20G combined between the 3 of them buying gear for them off the AH.

I honestly have never, EVER seen the point of buying something i know i am going to replace in 3 to 5 levels.  If i was planning on twinking a character and locking them at a fixed level, sure, all bets are off, but if the goal is to hit 70, i just wouldnt bother.

I'm with you here. And I don't think faster leveling is going to mean a better market. The game is still balanced to let you go 1-70 on quest gear and what you get for drops alone. Doing something faster that you're already going to be doing much faster due to patch doesn't seem to generate a big market opportunity.

 The only money I've ever made has been from Herbs. That was before switching to Engineering. I've invested so much in it now I'm not giving it up without a fight. At least I can use the teleporters, which as a Mage means I'm 5 minutes from anywhere on both worlds. 

[Nebu]

I'm really liking alchemy for leveling, but it's not much of a money maker on my server.  I'll likely respec my tradeskill at 60 or so, but I'm not sure what I'd switch it to.

[Xanthippe]

For a consistent money maker, mining is probably the best one to have.  Mining, skinning, herbs.  The next would likely be the ones that provide stuff that gets used up or replaced a lot - enchanting, alchemy, jewelcrafting.  The downside is that you need to buy or acquire recipes at 100g and up.  There is zero cost to gathering.

My active toons are a 65 priest (tailor/enchanter) who mostly makes bags and DEs stuff for me - not a lot of money there, but it's nice to be able to make bags and cloth (primal mooncloth bags are awesome to have); a 70 hunter (alchemy/engineering now, just switched), a 70 lock (mining/jewelcrafting - trained up and bought all the recipes as soon as I saw them right after TBC launch, so it was very lucrative until recently - not so much now because a lot of people have picked up JC so supply is high).

My alchemist is a potion master on the theory that I can discover more recipes.  I'm not in a raiding guild, and rarely hawk my vocation.  Maybe I can sell potion injectors after 2.3.

I have a 29 shaman who is skinning/leatherwork.  I sell plenty of low level greens daily - can buy leather off the AH and still make a profit.  Timewise, it's more profitable to go hunt in Outlands on one of my 70s, but not as enjoyable for me.

My 19 warrior is mining/blacksmithing.  I have not so far seen much that's impressive for blacksmithing - can't sell what I can make for a profit either, because ores are so expensive (in comparison with leather).  This is an experiment.

[Xanthippe]

Btw, another reason to drop alchemy - you can almost _always_ find an alchemist to make whatever you like, for free or tips.  They will do it just for the chance of discovery.  Plus, depending on what you want them to make, you can find the correct master - potions or elixirs.

Transmute mastery is bogus - poorly thought out.  The proc rate is the same as for the other masteries but you can only transmute once per day.  With potions and elixirs, there is no daily limit to procs, no cooldowns.

Another place Blizz screwed up with alchemy is that the cooldown timer is the same for Azeroth alchemy transmutes and Outlands transmutes.

Tailors can make mooncloth and primal mooncloth on different timers.  Alchemists have to choose between an arcanite bar, an essence of something to something, or primal might, or primal something to something.  One transmute per day folks! 

[Venkman]

I hear that the Gladiator set (Season 1 Arena gear) is purchaseable with Honor points now in the respective Halls (Champion's Hall for Alliance) on PTR. Can anyone confirm and point to a site that lists their costs?

[Chenghiz]

This site has the old and new arena point and honor point prices for season 1-3 sets.

[Phred]

I'm really liking alchemy for leveling, but it's not much of a money maker on my server.  I'll likely respec my tradeskill at 60 or so, but I'm not sure what I'd switch it to.

On my server you can make 20 g a day just logging in and transmuting earth to water. Earth sells on the ah for avg 5g, water 25. Seems pretty good money to me. Earth to water has to be one of the easiest formulas to get being as it's sporan faction and one repeatable quest gives you 750 faction. Took me 2-3 1/2 hrs on my rogue to go from low honored to revered and get it.

Put in the perspective of daily quests, no trade skill is particularly interesting atm.

[Venkman]

This site has the old and new arena point and honor point prices for season 1-3 sets.

Thanks Chenghiz

[slog]

any word on when 2.3 hits the servers?

[ShenMolo]

any word on when 2.3 hits the servers?

I haven't heard a date, but the patch has been downloading via the background downloader for the last 3-4 days. Perhaps within the next couple of weeks? Just a guess.

[Phred]

any word on when 2.3 hits the servers?

I haven't heard a date, but the patch has been downloading via the background downloader for the last 3-4 days. Perhaps within the next couple of weeks? Just a guess.

I heard they just patched test last week so it still might be a while.

[Jayce]

That's an interesting thought Xanthippe, but then if you make a few extra potions it's a few extra gold, but if you get 3 primal mights, that's (on my server) about 75x2 additional gold.  Then there's the point that Phred brought up - transmute stuff found on the AH to better stuff and maybe make 60g instead of 20.  I've even seen one proc for five primal mights.  That'd be 375g, not bad for a single shot.  To match that with potions or elixirs you'd have to do a lot of brewing.

[Dren]

That's an interesting thought Xanthippe, but then if you make a few extra potions it's a few extra gold, but if you get 3 primal mights, that's (on my server) about 75x2 additional gold.  Then there's the point that Phred brought up - transmute stuff found on the AH to better stuff and maybe make 60g instead of 20.  I've even seen one proc for five primal mights.  That'd be 375g, not bad for a single shot.  To match that with potions or elixirs you'd have to do a lot of brewing.

Guys that is all great, but there is supply and demand.  If transmutes were allowed to be done nonstop, the prices would all drop like a rock.  The reason they are so high now is that their supply is throttled.  I assume Blizz has thoguht through all of this and felt it kept the game balanced in some way to have a slow steady stream of the higher sought after motes and gems being fed to the market.

I'm transmuting Stone to Water myself until I get more faction in other areas and/or get a discovery.  I don't mind it as the value I gain in doing it is nice, but it would be nice to at least limit it to 1 per day per type of transmute.  As it is now, ANY transmute can only be done once per day.  Hell, even tailors get to make one of the 3 specialty fabric types every 4 days. (Doing this with my tailor.)

Make it so you can make one primal transmute, one gem transmute, and one essence transmute.  That seems more fair.

[Xanthippe]

How many primal mights are you going to make that you lose money on?  Ie, that don't proc?  Cost of a primal might on my server right now is:

Primal Earth 3g
Primal Mana 15g
Primal Water 18g
Primal Air 25g
Primal Fire 22g

about 83g

They are up at the AH for 80g/each

Now that's without factoring in deposit (which is lost if you don't sell them) and AH cut.  So you HAVE to proc plus you have to sell enough of them.

So while it sounds good, in theory, you'll proc perhaps what, 10% of the time? and end up with 2 or 3.  You can try once per day.  You might go 20 days without a proc (as I did once).

How much money are you losing/gaining really?

If you say, "but I farm all my primals!" then I say that there is still a value assigned to that primal, and you are either losing money or barely breaking even.  You could instead be selling your primals.

Ok, now consider elixir mastery.  Buy or find fel lotus, price 22g each.  Sell flasks.  There is no limit to how many procs per day you can have.  You might proc, you might not, but you eventually will - it's not a one time per day thing.

You can sell some flasks for 45g each (eg, Flask of Pure Death).  You might be breaking even on buying the herbs and lotuses, but you'll profit on procs.

My server may not be like yours - there are a lot of raiders on mine.

(I'm potion mastery though, because I don't use elixirs and I make a lot of mana potions - I don't make much on them, but still focused on discovery).

[Simond]

any word on when 2.3 hits the servers?

According to Drysc: Planned patch date is next Tuesday(/Wednesday/Thursday, depending on where you are), with Arena S3 starting the following week.

[Phred]

about 83g

They are up at the AH for 80g/each

On my server it's not hard to find someone in trade still offerering the transmute for free and paying you if they get a skillup/discovery.
Same with riding crops minus the discovery.

[Jayce]

about 83g

They are up at the AH for 80g/each

On my server it's not hard to find someone in trade still offerering the transmute for free and paying you if they get a skillup/discovery.
Same with riding crops minus the discovery.

Has anyone here ever been ripped off for their primals?  I am always nervous of those transmuting for free, because I figure if they charge they probably aren't scamming.  But it's scary to put 5 primals, representing a night or two of work, into the inventory of a perfect stranger.

[Chimpy]

about 83g

They are up at the AH for 80g/each

On my server it's not hard to find someone in trade still offerering the transmute for free and paying you if they get a skillup/discovery.
Same with riding crops minus the discovery.

Has anyone here ever been ripped off for their primals?  I am always nervous of those transmuting for free, because I figure if they charge they probably aren't scamming.  But it's scary to put 5 primals, representing a night or two of work, into the inventory of a perfect stranger.

I am sure it happens, but I don't know anyone who has had it happen.

I never charge for combines, never ask for tips. Of course, I also don't go around hawking my skills to the world either, if I have my transmute up and someone asks in /2 for a certain trans I can do, and I feel like bothering with it, I will send them a tell.

But as a lot of people have said, even by undercutting the current market value on the primals and selling them, then buying a pre-made might off the AH is usually going to be better for you economically than farming the primals and then transmuting.

[Sogrinaugh]

about 83g

They are up at the AH for 80g/each

On my server it's not hard to find someone in trade still offerering the transmute for free and paying you if they get a skillup/discovery.
Same with riding crops minus the discovery.

Has anyone here ever been ripped off for their primals?  I am always nervous of those transmuting for free, because I figure if they charge they probably aren't scamming.  But it's scary to put 5 primals, representing a night or two of work, into the inventory of a perfect stranger.

Thats a reportable offense, and you will get your stuff back if you contact a GM.  In the very early days of wow (nov/dec 04) their were people playing fresh off D2 addiction, where such scamming was commonplace and expected.  I can remember people getting scammed out of their stuff in a similar fashion, and getting it back after paging a GM.

[Jayce]

Thats a reportable offense, and you will get your stuff back if you contact a GM.  In the very early days of wow (nov/dec 04) their were people playing fresh off D2 addiction, where such scamming was commonplace and expected.  I can remember people getting scammed out of their stuff in a similar fashion, and getting it back after paging a GM.

Interesting.  In the past, in most games they couldn't do this because it would lead to a he said-she said sort of thing (I report player x for scamming even though I gave or sold him the stuff, so I get it back and he has nothing). 

I wonder if they log player transactions and can check on the truth of the claim?  That would be cool but I'd have to think the volume of information would be legendary even if they kept it for a day.