Jewelcrafting

[jpark]

I love the concept.  Great idea with socketable items.  My bud is 350 in skill.

This is our recent realization:

Level 70 Green vs. Level 70 blue item with sockets.

Unsocketed, we tend to find the level 70 blue item inferior to the green at the same level.  Significantly (the green can have a single stat - focusing on the attribute you need, whereas blues tend to have multiple stat bonuses - in areas of marginal utility).  Socketed with good gems, the Blue is superior to the green, but only incrementally.

I could post some item examples here - but the real use for jewelcrafting seems to be - imo - for epics.  Gems are expensive, and really only make the blue socketable item marginally better than a green at the same level, based on our experience in the game thus far.

Felsteel Helm (level 70)                                      Green helm (level 68)
1206 Armor                                                             853 Armor
27 Stamina                                                              79 Stamina
blue socket
blue socket
red socket
socket set bonus: +4 to hit
Defense:  + 33

For boss tanking, I prefer the green item, especially if the blue is unsocketed.

[lamaros]

I love the concept.  Great idea with socketable items.  My bud is 350 in skill.

This is our recent realization:

Level 70 Green vs. Level 70 blue item with sockets.

Unsocketed, we tend to find the level 70 blue item inferior to the green at the same level.  Significantly (the green can have a single stat - focusing on the attribute you need, whereas blues tend to have multiple stat bonuses - in areas of marginal utility).  Socketed with good gems, the Blue is superior to the green, but only incrementally.

I could post some item examples here - but the real use for jewelcrafting seems to be - imo - for epics.  Gems are expensive, and really only make the blue socketable item marginally better than a green at the same level, based on our experience in the game thus far.

Felsteel Helm (level 70)                                      Green helm (level 68)
1206 Armor                                                             853 Armor
27 Stamina                                                              79 Stamina
blue socket
blue socket
red socket
socket set bonus: +4 to hit
Defense:  + 33

For boss tanking, I prefer the green item, especially if the blue is unsocketed.

+12 stam gems in that and we have...

353 more armor
16 less stamina
33 more defense.

I'm going to go out on a limb and assume, that for boss tanking, people prefer a warrior other than you.

[Typhon]

For the point in game where the decision is between a tank with those two items it just doesn't matter.  Therefore the person that stuck with the green is the person that will have money to pay for gems when he finally gets that socekted purple that will matter for the new end game... which I believe was the point of jpark's post - intermediate socketed items are "meh" because gems are expensive/end-game-only type of proposition.

Did you even bother to try to understand the point of his post, or do you just see his name, close your eyes, and start swinging?

[MrHat]

Actually, some of the BoP Trinkets in Jewelcrating are crazy.

[Mazakiel]

My only complaint about Jewelcrafting is that as I turn the bend into 225 and up, it looks like a massive pain in the ass to level up.  Otherwise, I love it.  And there are definitely some nice trinkets, and that's just at the lower end of things.  I love my owl trinket. 

I do wish they'd fix the damn hare trinket though.  Either let us cut citrines, or make it use normal citrines instead.  It shouldn't take this long to do something to make it craftable. 

[Morat20]

Actually, some of the BoP Trinkets in Jewelcrating are crazy.

It's nice as shit at the low-end, too. I've been muling grinding rings and necklaces out to low-level alts and guildies. I'm wearing some rather awesome blue ring right now on my 20 shaman,

[lamaros]

For the point in game where the decision is between a tank with those two items it just doesn't matter.  Therefore the person that stuck with the green is the person that will have money to pay for gems when he finally gets that socekted purple that will matter for the new end game... which I believe was the point of jpark's post - intermediate socketed items are "meh" because gems are expensive/end-game-only type of proposition.

Did you even bother to try to understand the point of his post, or do you just see his name, close your eyes, and start swinging?

Bit of both.

Gems aren't that expensive, really.

[Fabricated]

230ish-300 in Jewelcrafting made me want to shoot myself in the face. After that the skill will grind itself out as you cut green and then blue/epic gems.

As for that example...that's awful. That blue helmet owns the shit out of the green with no gems in it at all.

Here's a better example

Talonguard Epaulets of the Champion (Green)
688 Armor
+17 Strength
+26 Stamina
+17 Defense Rating
Level 63

Pauldrons of Brute Force
721 Armor
+16 Strength
+22 Stamina
Yellow Socket
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +3 Dodge Rating
Equip: Increases defense rating by 18.
Level 63

The equal level green is roughly as good as the blue with no gems. Now...with the right gems.

Enduring Deep Peridot
+3 Defense Rating and +4 Stamina

Pauldrons of Brute Force
721 Armor
+16 Strength
+30 Stamina
+3 Dodge Rating
Equip: Increases defense rating by 24.
Level 63

Now it's definitely better. This is with commonly available green gems as well. What sucks though is that blue gems are pretty uncommon (nevermind cutting them requires rather high jewelcrafting AND the dropped plan to cut them).

edit: Blech, it's depressing doing this with the new Dungeon Sets. The Breastplate of the Bold is only barely better overall than a level 70 "Of the Champion" breastplate if you stick blue gems into it, and even then it still has a little less +def than the green.

[Typhon]

Bit of both.

   can't fault you for honesty.

Also, I agree with Fabricated, the example given wasn't good.  Only reason I posted is I'm struggling with the same thing - ok, I have these blue socketed items, which unsocketed aren't as good as greens that I have, and I have a very large sum of money that I need to come up with to buy the epic flying mount.   Am I really going to waste time gemming (sp?) these, or just sell them and wait for lvl 70 blues/purples?

If I could pop gems out of slots, it would be a cleaner win.

[jpark]

As for that example...that's awful. That blue helmet owns the shit out of the green with no gems in it at all.

If your carrying enough defense already - the stamina gain from green helm is attractive.  The difference in armor has a very small effect on damage mitigation.  It depends on the fight but with enough defense on - yes I certainly would prefer (I am still at 69) the green helm over the blue for a boss fight - but not for trash.

[Fabricated]

Bit of both.

   can't fault you for honesty.

Also, I agree with Fabricated, the example given wasn't good.  Only reason I posted is I'm struggling with the same thing - ok, I have these blue socketed items, which unsocketed aren't as good as greens that I have, and I have a very large sum of money that I need to come up with to buy the epic flying mount.   Am I really going to waste time gemming (sp?) these, or just sell them and wait for lvl 70 blues/purples?

If I could pop gems out of slots, it would be a cleaner win.

Green quality gems do the trick and if you pick the ones you want, will definitely make a blue with sockets better than an equal level green. If you just buy them off the AH, they're only 1-2G apiece on my server, and most aspiring Jewelcrafters will cut whatever uncut gems you have for free since it's an awful tradeskill to level.

Now, blue gems...those suck to get right now since not enough people are hitting the level 70 5-mans and Heroics where they drop like candy.

[Merusk]

Now, blue gems...those suck to get right now since not enough people are hitting the level 70 5-mans and Heroics where they drop like candy.

Yeah, let's talk about JC pattern prices.  WTF.   I got a blue pattern as a world drop last night, Auctioneer gives me a LOW price of 536g.  It's not even a uber gem, just +4 hit and +4 agi at ~350 skill. I can't even imagine how much the high-end patterns are going for.

[WayAbvPar]

Auctioneer isn't always accurate though...I moused over some piece of gray vendor trash in my inventory last night and was informed that it was going for 14g+. Either Auctioneer was bugged or some joker put it on the AH and then bought it with another character just to screw with folks.

[Fabricated]

Most of the blue/metagem plans right now are really rare since again, not a lot of people are regularly hitting the level 70 5-mans yet. Expect them to drop quite a bit as the raiders get geared/keyed for Karazhan (and run heroics since the epics out of those are roughly comparable to even stuff from the current 25-man raids). From the looks of it on spoiler sites, gem plans seem to actually be part of the regular loot table for some 70 normal/heroic bosses, just not at the top.

[Ironwood]

Auctioneer isn't always accurate though...I moused over some piece of gray vendor trash in my inventory last night and was informed that it was going for 14g+. Either Auctioneer was bugged or some joker put it on the AH and then bought it with another character just to screw with folks.

Or as a money transfer of some type.  Though it boggles the mind unless you're scanning the neutral AH as well....

[Merusk]

Auctioneer isn't always accurate though...I moused over some piece of gray vendor trash in my inventory last night and was informed that it was going for 14g+. Either Auctioneer was bugged or some joker put it on the AH and then bought it with another character just to screw with folks.

Or as a money transfer of some type.  Though it boggles the mind unless you're scanning the neutral AH as well....

Nope, just the Alliance AH here.  It's people who know how Auctioneer works and are trying to drive the price up on some good, or trying to counter the noobsauces who post legitimate 50g+ items at a 5s starting bid then put no buyout.   I did the same thing with Thorium Ore right at BC's release and it had adjusted the price just to watch it work.  Listed the ore at 30g/ 20 and watched the other auctions creep up in price over the next two days.

It seems like it only works on people who don't regularly scan the AH, or frequenly flush their Auctioneer scan, but my observations indicated there were plenty of them.

For frequently sold things like Netherweave/ Runecloth and common patterns, Auctioneer seems to always be low.  The new 'post auctions' window that has the UI refresh is very nice for a sanity check.  I posted a stack of Netherweave and it told me "cannot match lowest price" with a 2g buyout, but the other listings were all around 3-5g.  Once again, yay for twits posting small quantities at insanely low prices.

[Xanthippe]

I picked up a bunch of jewelcutting recipes the first two weeks for 125 or less - those same recipes are now going for 250 or more.  I was one of the first jewelcutters on my server; now a lot of people seem to be dropping blacksmithing or tailoring or whatever they got to make their uber set/weapon/whatever and have taken up jewelcrafting.

So maybe there's more demand.

More likely, with those prices, someone's dreaming or trying to game auctioneer.

[Koyasha]

Auctioneer isn't always accurate though...I moused over some piece of gray vendor trash in my inventory last night and was informed that it was going for 14g+. Either Auctioneer was bugged or some joker put it on the AH and then bought it with another character just to screw with folks.

No.  Auctioneer can't tell whether an item actually sells at that price, it only sees that the item has been up for sale at that price.  People put items up for sale at excessive prices, and people put up items that do not sell occasionally in order to try and get people to buy them at some ludicrous price.  Auctioneer informing you that a grey item is going for 14g+ means that grey item was probably seen once at auction, because somebody put it up at a high price hoping someone would either misclick and purchase it or be fooled into thinking that if it's on auction, it must be worth something.

Only if you see some seemingly worthless item with a high number of times seen at auction should you actually begin to wonder whether it may actually be worth something.  The line that informs you how many times something has been seen is important.

[Lantyssa]

And if you find an item with a silly price, you can always use /auctioneer clear [shift-click] to remove it from the pricing database.  (I think that is the command.  It's been a while since I've used it.)

[WayAbvPar]

Auctioneer isn't always accurate though...I moused over some piece of gray vendor trash in my inventory last night and was informed that it was going for 14g+. Either Auctioneer was bugged or some joker put it on the AH and then bought it with another character just to screw with folks.

No.  Auctioneer can't tell whether an item actually sells at that price, it only sees that the item has been up for sale at that price.  People put items up for sale at excessive prices, and people put up items that do not sell occasionally in order to try and get people to buy them at some ludicrous price.  Auctioneer informing you that a grey item is going for 14g+ means that grey item was probably seen once at auction, because somebody put it up at a high price hoping someone would either misclick and purchase it or be fooled into thinking that if it's on auction, it must be worth something.

Only if you see some seemingly worthless item with a high number of times seen at auction should you actually begin to wonder whether it may actually be worth something.  The line that informs you how many times something has been seen is important.

It showed it with a buyout of 100% (which I thought meant that all the auctions listed had ended in a buyout).

On a semi-related note- holy SHIT do Star Rubies sell fast. I had 2 b/o at 6g within minutes of posting each auction. I might need to crank the price up a notch and see if they are still biting.

[Jayce]

On a semi-related note- holy SHIT do Star Rubies sell fast. I had 2 b/o at 6g within minutes of posting each auction. I might need to crank the price up a notch and see if they are still biting.

On my server, wool cloth (of all things) was hot for a while.  I saw stacks approach 3g.  I think it must have been the Outland effect or something, but for a while there I thought there must be some new uber recipe that needed wool.

[Ironwood]

O_O


Star Rubies you say ?  I have about 50 of them in my banky.

Hmmmmmm

[SurfD]

wool cloth might have been people with LOTS of money to burn leveling up tailoring alts?

[Righ]

There are regularly people changing trade skills, and with the addition of BOP crafted items to many trades, switching trades has become a major thing. And one hour in some stupid Azeroth zone farming lowbie items is a lot of gold you could have famed in Outland. Better to give somebody leveling their whorde or space demon alt some 'good' cash for the crafting items they don't burn.

[Xanthippe]

On my server, I've noticed old world prices falling a bit - I think they've peaked.  But I keep thinking that, so maybe I'm still wrong.