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f13.net General Forums => World of Warcraft => Topic started by: Morfiend on June 15, 2004, 05:27:01 PM



Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Morfiend on June 15, 2004, 05:27:01 PM
World of Warcraft has just added a huge patch, and if all goes well, phase 3 will start with a new round of beta emails.

Here are the patch notes.

http://www.WorldofWarcraft.com/patchnotes/patch-6-12-04.shtml

Nice changes to the rest system.

Quote
Rest State Changes

The Rest State system has undergone several changes. There are now three tiers of rest states: Rested = 200% experience, Normal = 150% experience and Tired = 100% experience.

The rest timer is much more flexible than before, allowing players to gradually accumulate incremental rest credit for all time spent logged out. Additionally, people who do not log into World of Warcraft for several days will gain bonus rest credit. This will allow those who only play once or twice a week the added bonus of playing as rested (200% experience) for longer periods of time than those who play on a daily basis.

Players also have the ability to rest anywhere in the world. This should help players who forget or choose not to log off at an inn. Resting at an inn is still the preferred method, as rest credit will accumulate four times faster for players logged off inside of an inn.

Lastly, the Rest State modifier is now level-based using a sliding scale to determine how much experience you can gain at each tier instead of the previous flat 20,000 experience per level.

Enter the City to Rest

When visiting one of the six main cities (Darnassus, Ironforge, Orgrimmar, Stormwind, Thunder Bluff and The Undercity), players will no longer need to check into the inn to rest. Players will however still need to seek an innkeeper to receive a hearthstone or to bind themselves to the city.

In this initial implementation, there will be some areas close to the cities that will allow a player to rest without actually being in the city. There are also some areas within each city that are not currently activated for resting. Please be sure to check the character portrait to ensure that the character is resting before logging off. The team is aware of this and will continue to work through these areas.

As before, you will still need to rest at an Inn in smaller towns.


All good stuff IMO, and greatly needed.

PVP is live, and they have added the seconed server for Race Wars. I will be starting a character on this server.
We already have a thread to cover this.

There was a few buffs (thief) (Warrior) and a few nerfs (Warlock) (Priest) and a stealth nerf (Mage) in the form of ADDING a dot effect to their main attack spell, to stop the damage, sleep, damage, sleep, damage, sleep, combo.

Unlike other patches, they are NOT locking characters, only wiping items.

Quote
Items Deleted
With a few exceptions, all items and currency are being deleted for this patch. The following items will not be deleted: Bags, Scarlet Key, all Shaman Totems and the Hearthstone. Each character will be assigned funds based on their level.

Players will be able to redo quests that have already been completed in order to gain back quest items.


As you might expect, there is MUCH gnashing of teeth on the forums about this.

They have finally added resists, also upped the level cap, and added player mounts. Each race has their own mount, but any race can learn any other races mount, it just costs more skill points to learn.

And just for Signe and Haemish...
Quote
Small pets are now in the game. Look for an NPC selling cats, rabbits, parrots and a variety of other ambient creatures.


Wonder how many gerbils named Boo I am going to see?


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 15, 2004, 07:38:31 PM
I'm going to play stupid here and ask this question, which I'm sure has been covered before, but here goes:

Why 200, 150, and 100 percent? If a character logging on (whether for the first time or the next day after a previous play session) is going to be rested, should the numbers not be based off of the "standard" character state? In other words, the rest system is not a bonus, it's just a time based dimishing returns system. Similar to DAoC using diminishing returns on an experience bonus if you "camped" a spawn for too long. At least with DAoC, if someone had previously been camping the hell out of a spawn, the bonus would still be gone, but in WoW, it is individual based. So technically, the percentages are arbitrarily named here solely for marketing and PR purposes and to try to fool the potential players into thinking they are getting "something more". In reality, you are earning 100%, then 75%, then 50% since each time you start, your character is in a rested state. Now I don't have a problem with the system itself. I was just wondering if perhaps I was misunderstanding it. I think they should just be straight with players and say that they are nerfing your experience over time played to slow the rate of advancement and hopefully lower the level deviation between hardcore and casual players. No need to glorify it and say it's a bonus when it is not. Players are not that stupid and min/maxers are going to always be well rested anyhow, no matter how you state it. As a matter of fact, you can bet that playstyle will evolve around that system for almost all players simply because players in a achievement level-based environment are always going to want to maximize the experience per kill. If I'm totally wrong, please explain what I am missing.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: El Gallo on June 15, 2004, 08:01:02 PM
It's PR.  Right now, any time someone says that the rest system sucks, about 37,000 drooling fanbois start screaming ITS NOT AN PENALTY ITS A BONUS YOU DUMBASS ONLY EVERQUEST USES PENALTIES!!!111!


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Volm on June 15, 2004, 08:15:09 PM
A healthy chunk of the experience your character gains is through questing (Probably somewhere around 70%), so to me the pve experience seems like a bonus in and of itself.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Morfiend on June 15, 2004, 08:19:49 PM
Quote from: Soukyan
Why 200, 150, and 100 percent?


Two reasons.

1) PR like stated above. People feel better getting 100% over 50%.

2) When they implimented the rest system, the exp stayed the same, but they doubled the AMOUNT of exp needed to level, so the monsters where still giving 100% of the exp they used to, and when rested they gave 200% they exp they used to. But since they doubled the exp needed to level 200% is really 100%.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Big Gulp on June 15, 2004, 08:35:41 PM
Quote from: Morphiend

2) When they implimented the rest system, the exp stayed the same, but they doubled the AMOUNT of exp needed to level, so the monsters where still giving 100% of the exp they used to, and when rested they gave 200% they exp they used to. But since they doubled the exp needed to level 200% is really 100%.


Isn't that kind of like being a government employee, having them reduce your pay by 50%, but then saying, "Hey!  We've also lowered your taxes by 50%!"

C'mon, it's straight PR.  Not that I really care one way or another having never played WoW, but to call this anything but a penalty for catassery is pure spin.  Anyone who'd buy the "it's a bonus" rap is a nimrod.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HRose on June 15, 2004, 09:09:20 PM
Consider that they have upped the required experience for every level.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Rasix on June 15, 2004, 09:18:47 PM
Is there an echo in here?

PS. I won't get in. I know it. Non shitty betas hate me.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: geldonyetich on June 15, 2004, 10:33:17 PM
I thought I signed up for World of Warcraft beta, but no sign of email confirmation in my records.  I suspect that the form lagged out and it somehow never got processed.

Ah well, according to the webpage there will be an open beta prior to release.   If we've the bandwidth to download the client, we'll all get our free preview eventually.

Personally, I'm not holding my breath.  I've seen no sign to indicate that Worlds or Warcraft is anything more than just. another. sterotypical. levelquest. MMORPG.

I have hit the bloody treadmill wall (http://www.grimwell.com/index.php?action=fullnews&id=128) in CoH, but it's yet to be topped so far as the fun factor is concerned.   If you can't pull off that initial fun, I won't even get far enough into the game to determine if I find the overall driving purpose behind the game worthwhile or not.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HRose on June 15, 2004, 11:37:41 PM
Quote from: HRose
Consider that they have upped the required experience for every level.


And the bonuses last for a lot less time now (you loose the well rested bonus very fast).

Basically is a sneaky uber boost to the grind.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Morfiend on June 15, 2004, 11:40:49 PM
Quote from: Big Gulp
but to call this anything but a penalty for catassery is pure spin.  Anyone who'd buy the "it's a bonus" rap is a nimrod.


Its a none catass bonus for me. I dont have the time. So...

I like the rest system. Keeps the catass from shooting up like they have been asking for, but keep the leveling speed high for the casual gamer like me.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Morfiend on June 15, 2004, 11:43:15 PM
Quote from: HRose
Quote from: HRose
Consider that they have upped the required experience for every level.


And the bonuses last for a lot less time now (you loose the well rested bonus very fast).

Basically is a sneaky uber boost to the grind.


At lower levels yeah, but my high level friend was hitting rested in about an hour, because of the flat 20,000 exp wall. Basically it makes lower levels frop rest faster, but higher levels drop rest slower.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 16, 2004, 12:31:31 AM
I'd like to see a beta forum where someone makes an official "This game rawks thread." Beta isn't used for that. And every time someone steps out of that thread to say "this game rawks" he should get a 24 hour ban. If only to keep the splattering to a minimal. Or maybe their own "This Game Rawks" forum.

Edit: The above was ONLY for my enjoyment. It'll never happen. It would be considered bad PR.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: daveNYC on June 16, 2004, 06:06:47 AM
The fact that zombies need to rest gives me a chuckle.

Otherwise, the only thing that is interesting is that the developers spent time putting pets in the game.  That would seem to indicate that they feel that the rest of the game is in pretty good shape.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: kaid on June 16, 2004, 06:54:18 AM
Of course zombies sleep. Otherwise how could bad musicians play loud enough to wake the dead if the dead don't sleep.

kaid


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 16, 2004, 06:56:51 AM
Thanks for the clarification everyone.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 16, 2004, 07:23:53 AM
Bunnies!  Woo hoo!  Do they do anything?  Can they be gunbunnies?  I once produced a poster for a band named Gunbunnies.  It was as tall as Harvey and packed awesome gear.  I fell in love with it.  It was NOT a furry... it was a real bunny.  Really.

Anyway... I've always been fond of the idea of resting offline.  In that old Mac game, Clanlord, you could park your butt in the library and slowly level your skills.  Righ has been parked there for 3 years without once logging in.  I rather doubt he'll ever log in again.  He must be very, very uber by now.

If WoW has a penchant for choosing testers that are active in the forums, I, also, stand little chance of getting in.  It's all good.  I'm more than happy to wait for open beta or release rather than regularly logging into that scary place.  I'm not sure that companies really choose testers that way... I think it's a ruse.  It's probably just a lottery.  If it were true, they wouldn't be able to fill a thimble with the amount of intelligent members on that board.  These days I take everything a game company tells me without any salt at all.  They are the masters of empty wibble.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on June 16, 2004, 08:55:09 AM
Quote from: Big Gulp
Anyone who'd buy the "it's a bonus" rap is a nimrod.


We ARE talking about Blizzard fanbois here.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 16, 2004, 09:36:08 AM
Quote
but they doubled the AMOUNT of exp needed to level

Egads, I hate mmogs.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 16, 2004, 09:39:53 AM
Quote from: Sky
Quote
but they doubled the AMOUNT of exp needed to level

Egads, I hate mmogs.


Nice Avatar, Iron Man.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mackey on June 16, 2004, 11:04:11 AM
Like someone mentioned, the rest state system is one of diminishing returns. Whether they label it 200%/150%/100%, or 100%/75%/50% is unimportant, really.

Some things in the game, such as skill points, are based on your base xp earned. So in theory, if I earn a lot of my xp while tired and someone else earns almost all of their xp when well rested, I will have a  lot more skill points at the same level as them, come the end of the day. So it *is* more then just a bonus/penalty, tho one could argue how much more.

What it does seem to do is act as a deterrent to sitting down and grinding at a camp for several hours. As someone else mentioned, quests give a pretty large amount of XP (XP which is not counted in the rest state system), so unless you are killing a lot of mobs while doing your quests, the rest system may not even become an issue.

I haven't checked out the new rest system in beta3 yet, but it doesn't seem true that min/maxers would always be at well rested. From a pure numbers stand-point, you could get to a point in Beta 2 were you would make more xp if you logged off for 8 hours then played for 4 more hours at fully rested then if you tried to grind out xp for 12 straight hours. On the other hand, most of the time grinding through would provide more returns, were one so inclined.

It's certainly an interesting concept of trying to address the whole "xp grind" and push people towards doing the quests (which WoW seems mostly about) instead of just racing to the level cap.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 16, 2004, 11:53:40 AM
Quote from: schild
Quote from: Sky
Quote
but they doubled the AMOUNT of exp needed to level

Egads, I hate mmogs.


Nice Avatar, Iron Man.

And here I was expecting a tee-hee!

It's Man of Iron, btw. Already deleted lest some uptight loser decide that seeing a marvel knockoff destroys the immersiveness of beating up endless hordes of faceless thugs.

CoH and Planetside aren't really mmogs, ask the mmog players! Not enough challenging boredom.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 16, 2004, 12:15:56 PM
Quote
CoH and Planetside aren't really mmogs, ask the mmog players! Not enough challenging boredom.


Tee-Hee!  (there you go)

Imagine how shitty the free open beta for wow will be?  There is no way in HELL it will run for shit unless the launch open beta with twice the number of servers they will be running on the actual launch day.  Open beta is a horrible idea for this game.  It will just give all those who only try open beta a horrible impression of the game as being 'logonquest' and then 'lagquest' once they do get in.  Really high profile games don't have the luxory of doing open beta IMO.  It is a BAD idea.

All that said, I will still waste time downloading the client and failing to log in.  That will further solidify my opinion that the game is not worth buying and save me some money.  Then again I might like it.  Damn them if I do.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Johnson101 on June 17, 2004, 10:40:41 AM
um no Open Beta will be awesome and they'll probably add lots of servers


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Rasix on June 17, 2004, 10:47:10 AM
HAHAHAHAH HAHA HAHA HA HAH

Ohh thanks, I needed that. Whew.. side hurts.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Anonymous on June 17, 2004, 11:02:46 AM
Quote from: Johnson101
um no Open Beta will be awesome and they'll probably add lots of servers

Dear god, a bnet reject has found f13.
...
GET READY FOR SOME FUN, BOYS.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 11:03:27 AM
The guy in the cell next to me just yelled, 'NEW FISH.' I wonder what that means.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 17, 2004, 11:29:23 AM
Please tell me that was a gimmick account.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Johnson101 on June 17, 2004, 01:35:47 PM
um blizzard made starcraft diablo and warcraft... and werent all 3 uber gosu? ya thats what i thought


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 01:37:52 PM
Quote from: Johnson101
um blizzard made starcraft diablo and warcraft... and werent all 3 uber gosu? ya thats what i thought


Blizzard North made Diablo and Starcraft - who have since gone on to Arena Net. Blizzard made Warcraft I, II, III, and are in production on Ghost and WoW. I believe Blizzard also made Lost Vikings and some other, older, crappy games.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Rasix on June 17, 2004, 01:37:55 PM
Quote from: Johnson101
um blizzard made starcraft diablo and warcraft... and werent all 3 uber gosu? ya thats what i thought


Someone consult the Rosetta stone..


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Murgos on June 17, 2004, 01:46:58 PM
Um, pardon my non-l33tness but, what does 'gosu' mean?


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 01:48:10 PM
It means something in Japanese. Maybe Ookii will tell us. But I do know the sentence in question made like no sense in any language.

Edit: Actually, it's not that it didn't make any sense - it's that it was wrong in any language.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 17, 2004, 01:50:52 PM
"gosu


Korean gaming term meaning "good manner expert/professional" commonly used in the game Starcraft

keke that guy is gosu lah~"

oh dear.

Edit:  It's hard to describe how incredibly old I feel right now. :(


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: AOFanboi on June 17, 2004, 01:56:41 PM
Quote from: Murgos
Um, pardon my non-l33tness but, what does 'gosu' mean?

Strange words like that is stuff you put into Google so that it can come up with sites like this (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=gosu). Basically it seems to be Korean for "excellent player of Starcraft". Yes, my head hurts, too.

That said, I still think there are about twice too many fantasy MMORPGs than needed at any point in time.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 01:57:05 PM
Quote from: Signe
He's a furry.


Thanks for clearing that up.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 17, 2004, 02:01:14 PM
Quote from: schild
Quote from: Signe
He's a furry.


Thanks for clearing that up.


Bastard.  You made me spill my coffee all over myself.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 02:19:51 PM
Quote from: Signe
Bastard. You made me spill my coffee all over myself.


No, this will.

Quote from: Johnson101
(http://www.yukihime.com/comics/paremix/mail/girlfriend.jpg)


You wrote this, am i rite?

Edit: Damn, I'm bored. I definately blame JoWood for my lack of entertainment today.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Johnson101 on June 17, 2004, 02:25:03 PM
but wow made by blizz how cud be bad?


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 17, 2004, 02:26:04 PM
I rest my case.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Krakrok on June 17, 2004, 10:21:53 PM
Quote
Literally, "High Hand". Fuguratively, very skilled, ghetto, or godly. Generally a collective term that means anything awesome.


Since when was ghetto a synonym of "very skilled", "godly", or "awesome".


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: NiX on June 18, 2004, 03:32:42 AM
We're talking about STARCRAFT. Duck is probably another way to call someone an ass sucking jerkoff.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 18, 2004, 06:36:13 AM
Cuz yo playahs be ghetto when they step all up in yo ass on starcraft!


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 18, 2004, 06:37:16 AM
Quote from: NiX
We're talking about STARCRAFT. Duck is probably another way to call someone an ass sucking jerkoff.


Don't be such a duck.


QUACK


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 18, 2004, 06:45:25 AM
I am still telling myself it is a gimmick account.  I must mainain SOME hope for humanity.  There is sure as hell no way I am going to converse with it.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 18, 2004, 07:24:28 AM
Don't worry, Alluvian, it'll be ok.  You're my friend and I'll help you through this.  I'm here for you.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Murgos on June 18, 2004, 08:37:06 AM
Thanks for the linkage.  I like this one:

Quote
gosu   

    A sub-human who sacrifices his or her social and sex life in exchange for ungodly Starcraft or Warcraft abilities. There have been actual cases where many 'gosu' players had starved to death because of playing Starcraft for too long.

    Gosu: "Hahahaha! I can make 82973 zerglings before you can even send your SCVs to the minerals! I'm the best! I FEAR NOTHING!"
    You: "...except natural light."


Someone was quite angry when they wrote this...

"Actual cases where many gosu players had starved to death" (emphasis mine)  What?  Were a bunch of gosu players sitting in a room falling over thier keyboards one by one in the last agonies of death by starvation while the survivors played on?

Well thats certainly set my mental image of what Gosu means.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 18, 2004, 08:51:34 AM
Ooo!

Gosu Survivor!

6 contestants enter the LAN Party, one exits alive!


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on June 18, 2004, 10:12:49 AM
I'd pay to watch that.

But only if I could control the button that activated the electrodes attached to their testicles. With my hand at the trigger, we'd be assured of sterilization of the gosu species.

Johnson101... that has to be a gimmick account meaning "College Class focused on learning how to be a dick - 101."

He R freshman dick, kekela.

Please tell me he's Korean and such an eloquent grasp of Engrish is owed to it being his fourth language. You know, after Zerg, Retard and Mongoloid.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 18, 2004, 11:21:21 AM
Quote from: Sky
Ooo!

Gosu Survivor!

6 contestants enter the LAN Party, one exits alive!


There was a "sci-fi" novel written by a Japanese author about something similar. Can't remember the name or the author but it was a banned book in Japan for a while. Anyhow, the premise was that a junior high class was taken to a remote island. They were all given guns and left there. The last one surviving wins.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Murgos on June 18, 2004, 01:07:37 PM
Quote from: Soukyan
There was a "sci-fi" novel written by a Japanese author about something similar. Can't remember the name or the author but it was a banned book in Japan for a while. Anyhow, the premise was that a junior high class was taken to a remote island. They were all given guns and left there. The last one surviving wins.


Was it called "Paradise Lost:  Nippon Style"?


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 18, 2004, 02:47:27 PM
Quote from: Murgos
Quote from: Soukyan
There was a "sci-fi" novel written by a Japanese author about something similar. Can't remember the name or the author but it was a banned book in Japan for a while. Anyhow, the premise was that a junior high class was taken to a remote island. They were all given guns and left there. The last one surviving wins.


Was it called "Paradise Lost:  Nippon Style"?


No. I found it. It's called Battle Royale (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=ZYw17ZNDFX&isbn=156931778X&itm=1).


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: AOFanboi on June 19, 2004, 01:33:21 AM
Quote from: Soukyan
No. I found it. It's called Battle Royale (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=ZYw17ZNDFX&isbn=156931778X&itm=1).

Which was also made into an excellent film (http://uk.imdb.com/title/tt0266308/).


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Numtini on June 28, 2004, 06:24:54 PM
I got a code from a friend on friday. Um, does the gameplay change at some point? It's pretty simplistic.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 28, 2004, 08:46:57 PM
WoW beta sign-ups for Europe start 5 July.

http://www.blizzard.co.uk/


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: schild on June 28, 2004, 09:51:23 PM
Quote from: Numtini
I got a code from a friend on friday. Um, does the gameplay change at some point? It's pretty simplistic.


It's Blizzard. Wtf do you expect? Complication like Civ? Patriarch?


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Numtini on June 29, 2004, 03:16:26 AM
Quote
It's Blizzard. Wtf do you expect? Complication like Civ? Patriarch?


No just something as complicated and entertaining as Shadowbane PVE...


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 29, 2004, 04:42:28 AM
Quote from: Numtini
Quote
It's Blizzard. Wtf do you expect? Complication like Civ? Patriarch?


No just something as complicated and entertaining as Shadowbane PVE...


Is it really more simplistic than that? Please, share info.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Numtini on June 29, 2004, 06:05:25 AM
Gameplay so far is more or less EQ dumbed down to the point where you can solo anything. I haven't really had to use tactics, other than obvious things like use ranged attacks if I'm a caster, heal myself if I'm a healer, send in the pet first if I have one. It's really really hard to die, I've only died twice bringing several characters up to 8th and 9th, once when I went afk because I needed to stir dinner.

And you don't to group, other than to zerg bosses in the once every 5 or so level boss mobs. And grouping is pure zerging, the sum of the parts is not greater than the parts together. No class synergy. Really it's not even a zerg, just need a partner.

All games start slow, the newbie game in EQ gives no hint of the complexity of the later game (though 1st level in EQ is more challenging than anything I've seen in WOW). I'm just sort of wondering if anyone has played higher and if WOW changes and evolves as you get higher because I'd have expected it to start doing so at the levels I've gotten to.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Murgos on June 29, 2004, 06:35:55 AM
To be fair, first level in EQ for say - a Dark Elf Enchanter with no previous game experience (i.e. a noob) - is probably one of the most frustrating and difficult things you can try to do online.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 29, 2004, 06:36:08 AM
The game is being made for those who loved diablo and warcraft.  I am holding out about zero hope that I will like it or that it will make a fun and engaging mmorpg.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: boley on June 29, 2004, 07:20:27 AM
Quote from: Murgos
To be fair, first level in EQ for say - a Dark Elf Enchanter with no previous game experience (i.e. a noob) - is probably one of the most frustrating and difficult things you can try to do online.


Heck, the challange of finding your trainer at level 1 in EQ was harder than 99% of the content in other mmogs.  Finding some of the the darkelf trainers (and that one human rogue trainer) was just cruel.  

Not that any of that was a good thing mind you.

B


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sable Blaze on June 29, 2004, 07:26:56 AM
You should have played a dark elven shadowknight. The whole Lodge of the Dead was hidden in some backalley past a hole in the wall. Simply finding it took the better part of a whole night.

Spent the rest of the night figuring out how to get OUT of Neriak, just so I could hunt.

Fun fun fun!


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Aslan on June 29, 2004, 07:49:10 AM
Sonofabitch.  I am NEVER going to get into WoW beta.  *sigh*  Just wanted to vent.  Thankeesai.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 29, 2004, 08:16:19 AM
Quote from: Aslan
Sonofabitch.  I am NEVER going to get into WoW beta.  *sigh*  Just wanted to vent.  Thankeesai.


You can wallow in misery with me, then. I've resubscribed to AO to while away the time. Actually having a fun time of it, too, but I'd still like to test WoW on those rainy days.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on June 29, 2004, 08:34:01 AM
Quote from: Alluvian
The game is being made for those who loved diablo and warcraft.  I am holding out about zero hope that I will like it or that it will make a fun and engaging mmorpg.


Does it have the Horizon-style gigantic signs with arrows on them that say helpful things like "Monster" and "Resources?" Although, with Blizzard, there probably needs to be signs for "Exploit" and "ZergKekeLA."


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Numtini on June 29, 2004, 09:04:12 AM
Quote
Does it have the Horizon-style gigantic signs with arrows on them that say helpful things like "Monster" and "Resources?"


No, instead NPCs with giant exclamation points over their head direct you at all times exactly where to go in order to accomplish quests.

So in spirit, the answer to your question is really "yes."


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: WayAbvPar on June 29, 2004, 09:47:58 AM
Quote from: Murgos
To be fair, first level in EQ for say - a Dark Elf Enchanter with no previous game experience (i.e. a noob) - is probably one of the most frustrating and difficult things you can try to do online.


Heh- I had forgotten all about that. The n00b DE experience was miserable, but really made me appreciate how much easier everything else was in comparison. Misty Thicket was a paradise for n00bs to start in, for instance.

Someone tell me an EQ horror story, quick- I am getting nostalgic.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on June 29, 2004, 09:52:51 AM
13-hour plane raid. Nuff said.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mesozoic on June 29, 2004, 10:15:41 AM
For those looking for a more complex n00b experience, Verdantine in AC is up, and the game is downloadable for "free" ($12.95 but the 1st month is free) at the Turbine site. (http://store.turbinegames.com/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ac_dm_en&Category_Code=AC)

Once my eyes got used to the graphics, I started enjoying it.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sable Blaze on June 29, 2004, 10:23:30 AM
Vex Thall. Enough said.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Rasix on June 29, 2004, 11:28:38 AM
Quote from: Sable Blaze
Vex Thall. Enough said.


You're overestimating the catassitude of your audience. I'm not sure many here got that far and thus would be able to emphasize.

But yah, I got to hear some friends bitch about Vex Thall constantly.  One of their more staggering pooch screws.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: kaid on June 29, 2004, 11:33:44 AM
The biggest gripe I hear about Vex Thal is although it is a great place for gearing up for higher planes everybody I know who hunts there complains its boring. These guys are hardened raiders and most raids do not phase them but they all say that Vex just bores them to tears.

Kaid


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 29, 2004, 12:01:49 PM
I heard Verdantine was a clusterfuck of tools, Meso. Please to be giving more info.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: El Gallo on June 29, 2004, 12:24:33 PM
Quote from: Sable Blaze
Vex Thall. Enough said.


EYES

GOGGLES

NOTHING


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 29, 2004, 12:24:35 PM
Quote
You're overestimating the catassitude of your audience. I'm not sure many here got that far and thus would be able to emphasize.  

Luckily my guild screwed me on the necro epic (heh, I mean moreso than SOE) by handing off the part I had worked for weeks (after helping the guild leadership get all theirs, of course) to a guy who rarely showed up for any events (I was usually early), but was friends with the 'inner circle'.

Between that and looking at the Plane of Air raid we were supposed to do next, one of those long, multihour catass affairs, I haven't logged into EQ since the day I quit 'for good' a couple years ago. Ended up level 54, only 'big' raids I did were Hate and Fear, and I don't feel like I missed out on anything excepting things I could have been doing other than hate and fear. Hell, on one of those raids, my rl buddy came over with his computer and we played xbox games while everyone sat around yanking their puds.

I'd crush and burn my nuts in a george foreman grill before I'd play EQ again.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 29, 2004, 12:41:32 PM
EQ endgame does not really require raids.  I never really understood the logic that goes "I hate raiding so EQ can fuck themselves".  I can understand less melodramic varients of it, and the melodrama is probably just based on the forum itself.

I am done with EQ.  I have been so for about a year or more.  I forget when exactly.  My character ended up level 58 (ranger) and I think I went on... um... maybe six raids tops.  I did air with a friends guild because I knew they were competent and it would go well.  It was painfully long and not really worth it, even though I did get a haste belt out of it because all other rangers had far better.  So I just chose not to raid much.  We did small things that our guild could do with 6 people.  Nothing earth shattering but when we were getting together we were still having a good time.  Got together with 2 groups of that other guild and did some boss mob in nightmare one night.  That was fun.  I got a decent bow because again the other rangers had better.  In the end I just grew too tired of it to log in anymore.  LDON kept it interesting for awhile with the small groups, but it got boring long before I qualified for any decent rewards.  I guess I was just lucky with a small group of good friends.

I don't get how a game (any game) can make anyone that angry.  Ranting for no apparent reason can be fun though.  I have done it myself, but I never took myself seriously.  I always assumed others were just joking around as well.  I hope that is the case.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mesozoic on June 29, 2004, 12:45:11 PM
Quote from: Soukyan
I heard Verdantine was a clusterfuck of tools, Meso. Please to be giving more info.


I've had one griefer incident.  Basically new characters reach a greeter who tells them to open a nearby chest, remove an application, and hand it to the greeter.  I have no idea why they have this - I suppose its so that brand newbies can waste time trying to figure out how to open a chest.  At any rate, no one can use the chest until the last person to open it closes it.  

So of course Jackass wanders in, opens the chest, and watches the lowbies pile up in the room.  And you can't report the character to GMs because a Harassment Report requires the name of the griefer but - of course, the game database apparently doesn't register the new char's name immediately, so you have to wait.

Shit like that.

And the usual "do u need a patron?" activities.

On the other hand I've had a lot of stuff just outright given to me, once people found out that I was a genuine "new" AC player.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Soukyan on June 29, 2004, 12:52:45 PM
Much obliged. Think I'll give it a whirl.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Signe on June 29, 2004, 03:53:53 PM
I tried the $12.95 AC trial not long ago.  Evidently, I have become ugly intolerant.  I just couldn't stand to look at it and never even made it out of the tutorial.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Big Gulp on June 29, 2004, 04:24:52 PM
Quote from: Signe
I tried the $12.95 AC trial not long ago.  Evidently, I have become ugly intolerant.  I just couldn't stand to look at it and never even made it out of the tutorial.


Never be ashamed about being an eye candy whore.  If I'm going to be staring at a screen for hours and paying a monthly fee to boot, it'd better damned well look decent.  AC's been around for how long now and they haven't given it a facelift yet?  Sorry Charlie, you guys should have gotten off of your asses and done it by now.  Oh, I realize that they thought everyone would migrate over to AC2, but hey, this is what happens when you produce crap.

This is a company that had MS backing, put out one of the first MMOG's and they couldn't get their shit together or see the handwriting on the wall?  No sympathy.  What really gets me is that they have two other decent licenses to work with in the chute that they're also going to butcher.  At this point Cryptic is making all other developers look like rank amateurs, and I'm as giddy as a little school girl about it.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mesozoic on June 29, 2004, 04:33:39 PM
The graphics bugged me when I fired it up.  But after a few hours it was suddenly somewhat transparent to me.  

Same thing that happens with great graphics, really.  A few hours of "hey kewl" followed by 100+ hours of "tree, tree, tree, rock,...here I am, dungeon."

Edit: I should also note that there has been a fair amount of lag on Verdantine as well.  Some rubber banding, but not much.  Mainly lag in moving and picking up / looting items.  ATM the server seems to top out at about 2100 people a night.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 30, 2004, 06:43:36 AM
Quote
 If I'm going to be staring at a screen for hours and paying a monthly fee to boot, it'd better damned well look decent.

I've been saying that for years, too. It's also why I bitch about people who put technology ahead of style. Style holds up over time, being as stylish as possible with the technology you have. Technology gets old real fast, all the tech that went into the fancy maps on the npcs in Thief:DS didn't stop them from being poorly animated wooden freaks, eminently forgettable. No style imo. Ditto for the 'realistic' movement, any game that boasts photorealism needs a kick in the junk.

Quote
Same thing that happens with great graphics, really.  A few hours of "hey kewl" followed by 100+ hours of "tree, tree, tree, rock,...here I am, dungeon."
All that said with Mesozoic's caveat in mind, naturally. AC had a great huge but relatively sparse and empty landscape. SWG looked a lot nicer, but the landscape features weren't as good, and you still had that effect of a big empty world devoid of any real reason to explore it (I explored both AC and SWG's game worlds, because I dig that kind of thing....when there's lots of cool stuff to find, AC is > SWG in that regard imo).


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 30, 2004, 07:56:30 AM
AC was very fun to explore in it's day.  The expansive landscapes were very new at the time for mmogs.   Sure the textures became a blobby mess in the distance and the terrain was insanely simplified in the distance unless your ram was above the norm at the time, but it actually had some distant vista's.  Very fun to see what is over the next hill.  The shitty gameplay for the melee is what drove me away.  I was an archer, and that was fun, but everyone had to pretty much just do their own thing in combat because the melee served no special role without an ability to block mobs or taunt.  That gameplay drove me away pretty fast.  And I didn't like the very generic spells.  The magic system was pretty neat, the spells the system made sucked.

SWG never had much exploration interest for me.  The hills were too meaningless for me to suspend disbelief and even call what was on the screen terrain.  It was 100% eye candy with no actual purpose.  Now I hear that terrain blocks shots finally.  That is good, but with no jumping and falling damage, exploration just seems lacking for me.  I don't know how to describe it better.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on June 30, 2004, 08:02:47 AM
Ok, since I R LAZY and yet somehow curious, what is the Verdantine server on AC1 and why is it special?

It's not like I'm going to pay Turbine for anything after AC2, especially not now that DAoC has hooked me again.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Alluvian on June 30, 2004, 08:07:08 AM
It is a clean slate fresh start server where the catasses can race to see who gets to level bazillion the first in 3 days.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on June 30, 2004, 08:52:25 AM
Here's what brother bin over at grimwell's site had to say as a...err...review?
Quote
Fight the "commie  PINKOs" on verdantine...
 
 
 or is that fight as the commie pinkos on verdantide..?? its all so confuzing....
 
 pk ... taste great
 
 pk-lite ...less filling,  
 
  ... tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....tastes great...less filling....
 
 JOIN the DarkTide resistance to commie pink-ness.... JOIN the DarkTide ZoneTroopers.... on Verdantine.!!
 make it a slave colony.
 
 

He's one of the guys that reminds me why I hate mmogs :P


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: daveNYC on June 30, 2004, 09:01:33 AM
Quote
JOIN the DarkTide resistance to commie pink-ness.... JOIN the DarkTide ZoneTroopers.... on Verdantine.!!
 make it a slave colony.


And then he complains that no one wants to play with him.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: HaemishM on July 01, 2004, 08:40:13 AM
Is that assmunch trying to get people to play on Darktide, or on Verdantine? Is Verdantine like PK, only with less carbs?

I R CONFUSED.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Sky on July 01, 2004, 09:01:04 AM
I do not know. I never know what the hell he's talking about, but I figured by the topic title it was relevant. If you can decipher it.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mesozoic on July 01, 2004, 09:06:21 AM
Verdantine is not PK.  It is a standard server, just new.  I don't know what that self-parody is talking about.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mi_Tes on July 01, 2004, 09:09:17 AM
I am playing some AC on the Verdantine server and having a good time starting as a n00b again.  I don't PK and it isn't a red server like Darktide, however there are some people who go red or pink on Verdantine.  Maybe they wanted the challenge of who could be the best pk on the white servers?  I couldn't tell the point of the post either and just guessing.


Title: WoW Phase 3
Post by: Mesozoic on July 02, 2004, 05:15:23 AM
Quote from: Mi_Tes
Maybe they wanted the challenge of who could be the best pk on the white servers?  I couldn't tell the point of the post either and just guessing.


I think its just DTers who want in on the new shiny.