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f13.net General Forums => News => Topic started by: schild on August 29, 2016, 06:17:16 PM



Title: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 29, 2016, 06:17:16 PM
Making this legible was a nightmare, so fucking read it.

http://f13.net/?p=363


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 29, 2016, 06:17:52 PM
Also, it's like 7500 words. What an asshole.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Khaldun on August 29, 2016, 06:21:39 PM
I love it.

Yes, races as Klingon, Ferengi and Daft Punk. Which is one more kind of disappointing thing about it all.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on August 29, 2016, 07:10:36 PM
i'm not gonna read all that shit jesus christ

is there a tl;dr


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 29, 2016, 07:24:16 PM
yea I put one at the bottom


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 29, 2016, 07:58:29 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/1TEOdUT.png)


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Rendakor on August 29, 2016, 07:59:23 PM
8/10, would read again.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on August 29, 2016, 09:08:43 PM
Accurate. I laughed, I cried, it was not that much better than Cats. But dead on.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Pagz on August 30, 2016, 12:09:50 AM
Was so waiting for this <3


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on August 30, 2016, 12:21:50 AM
I looked at the pictures. They were very good.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Cyrrex on August 30, 2016, 01:08:16 AM
Long read, but I was entertained. 

I forgotten how good Sam was with his drawings.  Seriously man, do you have a collection of comics somewhere you can link to?  They are fucking hilarious.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Gimfain on August 30, 2016, 02:25:11 AM
A good read.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: satael on August 30, 2016, 02:45:57 AM
Best review of NMS I've read so far.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Bhazrak on August 30, 2016, 03:24:32 AM
That's some Grade A absurdity right there, nice read.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Draegan on August 30, 2016, 08:32:53 AM
I read half of it then got bored.

Awesome animaions though.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: taolurker on August 30, 2016, 08:45:31 AM
I read it... and was entertained.

Was about to add links to videos to the other thread, but I guess now I'll add them here..

Honest Trailers review of NMS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wsFhv_Kz38)

Zero Punctuation (Escapist) review link (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/116922-No-Mans-Sky-Review)


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on August 30, 2016, 01:04:17 PM
*adjusts glasses*

There are ocean planets, to make a slight correction to an othewise good piece of writing. My spider sense tells me that the game assigns some sort of general tendency to every player's planet rng at the start of the game, and it takes a certain amount of traveling until it starts changing. For some it seems to be "no ocean planets". Effectively it's an additional limiting factor. Rivers also exist on rare occasions, a bug I suspect.

edit: the ocean biome is just watery plants and animals underwater. Any places of interest are the same as above ground, excluding the ones with npcs I think.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Chimpy on August 31, 2016, 06:59:20 AM
I really enjoy the little x and y coordinates on every object in the animations.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Hutch on August 31, 2016, 09:48:36 AM
The Minecraft pick icon is a nice touch  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on September 01, 2016, 03:32:08 PM
This might be one of those games eventually salvaged by modders: http://www.nexusmods.com/nomanssky/mods/100/?

Speaks to the creative bankruptcy of Hello Games. Something really interesting must've happened during development.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: satael on September 01, 2016, 11:54:17 PM
This might be one of those games eventually salvaged by modders: http://www.nexusmods.com/nomanssky/mods/100/?

Speaks to the creative bankruptcy of Hello Games. Something really interesting must've happened during development.

My guess would be that they just plain ran out of time and didn't dare to postpone the release any further.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on September 02, 2016, 11:06:30 AM
They really wanted to stay a small team but had Sony breathing down their necks. Not surprising. Would've been a much better game without the PS4, but probably would have released in 2018. Or endless Early Access like a lot of things do now.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sir T on September 02, 2016, 08:36:36 PM
They were caught up in a hype tornado. And if they had been in any way honest about stuff the backlash would have meant that all their preorder money would have immediately gotten sucked out of their company and Sony would have murdered them in court. Sony probably told him "just say "yes" to everything."


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sir T on September 02, 2016, 11:18:15 PM
I should add I really enjoyed the read. A game so grindy it made Shild grind at the review.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 06, 2016, 03:00:31 PM
i guess i am a person who used to do pretty fantastic grinds (I'm a Justicar in WoW) but i've turned that into a sort of lazy efficiency. Which is why this article is kind of like a hybrid gamefaqs primer thing.

the only thing it doesn't go into detail on is adjacency bonuses, which are the sort of 'cherry on top' way to break this game into pieces, but are explained nearly nowhere. Basically, the number value of things in the same general category of shit adjacent to something else in that category combine the + number value to create multiplied effects.

I want you to imagine what this multitool does.

(http://i.imgur.com/tm4cqp3.png)


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on September 06, 2016, 03:13:15 PM
i guess i am a person who used to do pretty fantastic grinds (I'm a Justicar in WoW) but i've turned that into a sort of lazy efficiency. Which is why this article is kind of like a hybrid gamefaqs primer thing.

the only thing it doesn't go into detail on is adjacency bonuses, which are the sort of 'cherry on top' way to break this game into pieces, but are explained nearly nowhere. Basically, the number value of things in the same general category of shit adjacent to something else in that category combine the + number value to create multiplied effects.

I want you to imagine what this multitool does.

(http://i.imgur.com/tm4cqp3.png)
Well, it doesn't make No Man's Sky a game, soooooooo


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 06, 2016, 07:59:28 PM
well, sure it is

an Early Access simulator


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on September 06, 2016, 08:00:29 PM
well, sure it is

an Early Access simulator
That sounds like a terrible multitool.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on September 08, 2016, 04:07:12 PM
I want you to imagine what this multitool does.
Sets off mah OCD (much out of orderness)? I don't like charging up the Boltcaster side of it. I just buff the laser and grenades.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 09, 2016, 06:48:13 PM
it's actually fairly close to an optimum ordering. it could be tinkered with a bit but i especially like the damage getting: 5 + 5 + 3 + 2 + 4, 3 + 3 + 3, 2 + 4 + 1, and 1 + 2 + 2 + 5

then two rapidfires with 3 + 3 + 2 + 5 etc etc


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on September 10, 2016, 03:46:47 AM
From promises of cosmic wonder to optimizing your timer for breaking rocks.



Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Hawkbit on September 16, 2016, 09:27:02 AM
Quote
President of Sony Worldwide Studios Shuhei Yoshida has said that while he enjoyed No Man's Sky, he understands why many players felt let down by the game, and puts that down Hello Games' PR strategy.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/09/16/shuhei-yoshida-no-mans-sky-didnt-have-a-great-pr-strategy?abthid=57dbfc52cd5367c51b00000d

Quote
"I am super happy with the game actually, and I'm amazed with the sales the game has gotten, so I'm not the right person to judge if it has 'harmed' the PlayStation brand. I personally don't think so. If anything, I am proud that people can play No Man's Sky on PS4 as well as PC."

It's good for Sony to say this although somewhat surprising. Overall the NMS debacle won't hurt Sony's brand, but it did for me. Sony was hyping this shit like crazy but never reigned them in on the plan.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 16, 2016, 01:14:41 PM
the current 24 hour peak for No Man's Sky on steam is 3,003 players. Beyond the occasional Sporefest of hate about the game, I never hear anything about it. Hello Games remains quiet and still as the ember waters.

The active playerbase collapsed so quickly that Sony may just actively disallow the franchise any sort of significant remedy in the form of expansions/DLC/major upgrades, if Hello Games was even really inclined to bother in the first place. Mods are probably also not really going to take off.

let's move on to the spate of Postmortem articles! I love those!


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on September 16, 2016, 01:15:39 PM
"WHAT WENT WRONG WITH NO MAN'S SKY: WE INTERVIEW AN ASSOCIATE DESIGNER, A QA TESTER, AND AN ARTIST" - Kotaku


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 16, 2016, 01:33:26 PM
We caught up with Sean Murray on his yacht, the Early Retirement, to ask him what went wrong with No Man's Sky.

"Nothing went wrong," he said, sipping on a coconut daiquiri. "Gamers decided what the fair market value of my promises was, and delivered it to me. My game then delivered them the promise of more content beyond the two hour time threshold for Steam returns. The system works."

"But what if they think that's unfair?"

"Then they are at liberty to not listen to any of my promises in the future. I am bored by the pedestrian whinging of gamers. If they did not want this, they would have learned a long time ago not to preorder games. I took their money, because I learned how to make them give me their money. They deserve their disappointment, because they are as disappointing as my game. This is their galaxy. It was made for them. No part of that was an accident."

"Do you ever intend to fix the game?"

"I don't know how to answer that question. Perhaps if you worded the question differently, perhaps if you said 'do you intend to promise to fix the game' then the answer is: only if a sufficient number of gamers believe I sincerely intend to. Now, if you'll excuse me, it's Autumn now, and East Sussex is not the Society Islands."

With that, he signaled for his pilot to gun the engines and head southward.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 19, 2016, 04:08:55 PM
the count of players in NMS approaches one eightyith of launch


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on September 19, 2016, 04:11:59 PM
Eightyith sounds like a creature from the Pythagorean deep.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Khaldun on September 19, 2016, 08:32:16 PM
NEWS NEWS NEWS

Sean Murray, innovative lead designer of No Man's Sky, to partner with Peter Molyneux on innovative new game. "It will feature entire cities of richly interactive AI agents, all of which have evolved naturally from single-celled organisms over millions of in-game years," says Molyneux. "They will remember your character's name, generate fully interactive economies, and build procedurally-generated structures while also creating over 4 million unique systems of alien government". Molyneux continued, "The game universe will have over forty different ways to travel faster than light which players can discover, but players will also be able to invent as many as six hundred different styles of ground transport suited for aliens that crawl, run, swim, and roll." Murray enthusiastically noted, "Also there are at least ten different dimensions and over six thousand superpowers that characters can discover, and at least three different schools of magic."

Murray and Molyneux continued describing game systems for the next six hours without interruption. We hope to have a full video of the announcement at some point.

NEWS NEWS NEWS



Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Paelos on September 21, 2016, 02:10:28 PM
I hope that designers fucking gamers with promises over and over would teach them something, but a new generation of gamers has risen up to fill the pockets of more these pyramid preorder schemes.

So basically if you preordered the game, I hope you learned this time. If not you're a dysfunctional lab rat.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Khaldun on September 23, 2016, 10:10:07 PM
I was ok being a lab rat on this one. It is an interesting failure rather than a purely cynical one. It was something that could have been a good deal more fun with some very small and I think plausible changes; and could have been less risible if Sean Murray had kept his fucking trap shut and the suits hadn't pushed it out there. Meaning there are things to be learned from this both in-game and outside of it, and the learning required giving it an honest go and not just relying on reddit frothing. I am still disappointed, mind you, not the least because I can see the things so clearly that could have made it much better that were (are, even) within plausible reach. There's a lot of stuff more cynical and less interesting out there on Steam right now.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 29, 2016, 07:41:10 AM
Hello games is being investigated for deceptive advertising. I don't know what to expect about a UK commission or if it will go anywhere, but it did remind me that hello games is still advertising the game, post release, with completely fictional "in game footage" that has all those things we thought would be in the game, but weren't.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on September 29, 2016, 08:46:03 AM
It's the Advertising Standards Agency, who don't have much power. At worst they can make them stop using specific adverts if they find them to be misleading. It's rare for them to investigate games and AFAIK they've only started this investigation because they've received several complaints.

Would be interesting if they ruled against NMS in as much as it might have some effect on blatant false advertising in the future.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 29, 2016, 09:08:15 AM
Yeah I would not very they will do anything.

But it's very nice of hello games to have video footage of the game we didn't get helpfully right there all over the game's official site


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 29, 2016, 09:17:05 AM
Hell hath no fury like the internet conned

"E3 2015. Sean: "I'm gonna do something really stupid now. I'm gonna choose one of these planets at random, and we can go there"

A couple of days after release. The files are datamined. In them, there is a folder named 'E32015'. In that folder, are three folders named 'Planet1', 'Planet2', and 'Planet3'."


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on September 29, 2016, 09:36:40 AM
Hell hath no fury like the internet conned

"E3 2015. Sean: "I'm gonna do something really stupid now. I'm gonna choose one of these planets at random, and we can go there"

A couple of days after release. The files are datamined. In them, there is a folder named 'E32015'. In that folder, are three folders named 'Planet1', 'Planet2', and 'Planet3'."

Well, he did choose one of those 3 randomly though.  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 06, 2016, 09:14:56 AM
Some news sites have been talking about how the ASA's ability to make a case against NMS for false advertising may be categorically inhibited by the procedurally generated nature of the game as well as Sean's meek-and-meandering soft-claim style. I.E., it was easy to hit Killzone: Shadow Fall because of false promises on technical absolutes (they promised 1080p clearly, game did not have 1080p) but the claims against NMS (much less variance in worlds and animals than visually indicated in game press, much less variance in structures, no 'grand space') can always be hiding on one of those other seventeen hojillion planets. How can you say it isn't if you never checked? Hmm?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 06, 2016, 09:17:31 AM
also there was a dust-up in the "No Man's Sky Gaming World" because the NMS subreddit shut down after the playerbase ended up having nothing to do except complain about the game


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on October 06, 2016, 10:14:59 AM
What other function could a NMS subreddit have now anyway? Post pretty pictures of interesting planets or fauna?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 10, 2016, 08:17:50 AM
that's the saddest part though is that people still do, and when they do, the pictures they post are functionally identical to pictures already posted in the first few hours of the game being out. when i browsed through the subreddit, the occasional sincerely-excited-to-share post was there, of a planet or a creature someone discovered, which looks pretty much identical to multiple places i saw myself in my short window of playing.

there's nothing else really to share. If I wanted to update my game guide to include anything new to talk about since the short time i played it, I might be able to add two sentences. I would be able to mention that the occasional proto-stream has been located by gamers. I'd mention the sean murray 'amazing, there's so many of you' copypasta. And that the entire studio has been a ghost since launch. There's nothing else to really go through. Outside of one post where a person details the exact mechanics of Adjacency Bonuses for ships and multitools, I have covered essentially everything and there's nothing else there to discuss.

NMS is no longer a game, it's a drama reactor that slagged and is now slowly cooling down at the bottom of a cooling tank.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on October 10, 2016, 09:06:37 AM
This is a saddening read: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-10-07-building-a-space-sim-in-a-post-no-mans-sky-world

Other people trying to make a space sim game but suddenly finding they can't raise the funding because people feel burned by NMS.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Kail on October 10, 2016, 04:18:57 PM
This is a saddening read: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-10-07-building-a-space-sim-in-a-post-no-mans-sky-world

Other people trying to make a space sim game but suddenly finding they can't raise the funding because people feel burned by NMS.

I dunno... I'm sure it sucks for the devs (though probably not too bad since this got funded anyway), but people wising up about crowdfunding is a good thing, in my book.

Honestly, there's a lot of very worrying stuff in that article:
Quote
"'We don't have content, predefined things," explains Baillie. "People will be able to build whatever they want"
Quote
So, with all that out the way, let's ask that all-important question. What is you actually do in Dual Universe? Plenty, of course. It's a continuous single shard universe that blah blah game backstory blah blah nothing about what you actually do in Dual Universe blah blah PvP zone blah blah etc.
Quote
someone might need a large space station ... Perhaps you'll also need to employ people ... pirates that might be touring ... might become part of a guild ... maybe you ... possibly ... might ... maybe ... There are countless possibilities ...
All this tied up in a single shard, open world MMO with a monthly subscription fee that they're developing in two years for $500k?  I mean, good luck and all, but I'd argue that people would be RIGHT to be a bit skeptical of a developer pulling this off as his first title.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on October 10, 2016, 04:25:40 PM
I'd have ventured a guess that this sounded a lot like Dmart, but not enough narcissism.  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on October 10, 2016, 09:38:31 PM
people wising up about crowdfunding is a good thing, in my book.
Definitely. I do a fair bit of crowdfunding, but I also do my homework. When I'm just tossing my money at a long shot, I don't expect much.

All this tied up in a single shard, open world MMO with a monthly subscription fee that they're developing in two years for $500k?  I mean, good luck and all, but I'd argue that people would be RIGHT to be a bit skeptical of a developer pulling this off as his first title.
It's like shitty traditional businesses blaming their failure on 'the economy' 8 years later. NMS is going to take a lot of heat for otherwise shitty games having problems.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on October 11, 2016, 01:20:58 AM
Yeah fair points, but I suppose my point was that the comments they received had changed dramatically since NMS launched. Game development doesn't happen in a bubble and people like Sean Murray and Chris Roberts piss in the cornflakes for everyone in the long run.

Now if only the dickheads who keep throwing money at Roberts every time he doodles a new imaginary ship on the back of a napkin would start to wise up too....


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Merusk on October 11, 2016, 09:49:39 AM
You can't reason with cultists, which are exactly what Roberts legions are.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2016, 01:12:05 AM
Well, I'm on record for enjoying NMS for the chill experience it was, and if Star Citizen can be a better game than that, I'm ok with it. I give zero shits about drama, I just like fun games (my definition may vary from the Internet's).

And it's a fair point that NMS's huge hype and fall (deserved or not) definitely plays into any space game featuring exploration.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 12, 2016, 12:02:44 PM
i accidentally came across the least insightful game article ever

http://www.gamenguide.com/articles/54218/20161012/no-mans-sky-latest-news-update-hello-games-title-slowly-falling-sean-murray-busy-with-next-patch.htm


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yegolev on October 12, 2016, 12:38:56 PM
I thought you were linking an article but seems like it's just advertiser spooge.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 13, 2016, 11:16:15 AM
I do think that because of NMS, anyone who really does want a groundbreaking major space sim title anytime in the forseeable future has to pin their hopes on chris roberts. If he fucks up his now unique window to suck inhuman quantities of money from crowdfunding on the promise he will slake the thirst of all us spaceboys, then the grounds will be well and truly razed and salted behind him.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on October 13, 2016, 11:43:31 AM
The unholy triumvirate of E:D, NMS and SC all being failures or disappointments in one way or another will kill space sims forever, definitely.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Typhon on October 13, 2016, 09:18:33 PM
Disagree.  Someone has to look at the ridiculous amount of money that SC has pulled in, without delivering anything and NMS has pulled in by delivering a tech-demo and say, "listen, if we delivery a tech-demo that also has a bit of a game in it, we'll be wearing money hats".

Ideally, Disney pays some independent to delivery X-Wing Versus Tie Fighter 2017...  2018?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on October 13, 2016, 09:24:32 PM
Did Disney make much of anything on Star Wars Battlefront? That game lasted weeks and was completely forgotten about.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sir T on October 14, 2016, 08:28:56 AM
I wouldn't describe E:D as a failure on the level of NMS. People got a product on time and on budget and the game is continuously supported, and it has at least one expansion to its credit, AND the company did not lie about what was in it. You might as well call Eve Online a failure by that standard as the interesting stuff in that was not generated by the game mechanics. Hell, when I was exploring in that game I saw that some bored graphic designer had drawn the eye of Horus on the skybox of one system as nebula, and then found the same Eye of Horus Nebula on 2 other star systems on different sides of the Galaxy.

The real problem of the HOOOOOOGE universe is that a YUUUUGE universe is very hard to fill with interesting stuff to discover, and E:D hits this problem big time. A Planet is a Planet is a ball of rock and gas after all, and the time to CONSUME content is a magnitude less than the time it takes to CREATE content. So once you have seen 50 ring planets its kinda sameo.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on October 14, 2016, 08:52:44 AM
The unholy triumvirate of E:D, NMS and SC all being failures or disappointments in one way or another will kill space sims forever, definitely.

You'll note the bit I highlighted. Words I chose very carefully specifically to apply to E:D. Absolutely E:D wasn't a failure on anything like the scale of NMS, but it was disappointing in many ways.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 14, 2016, 11:42:16 AM
ED is at this point kind of a space-lab for prototype proofs of concept for other space sims. Anything ED does at least proves that you could build some good gameplay and content around it, even if ED won't.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Khaldun on October 24, 2016, 04:00:39 PM
Seriously, ED is essentially a fantastic engine ready for someone to create content. Makes me wish they'd sell it to someone who was willing to stick the money in to make some aliens and some life forms etc.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Cyrrex on October 25, 2016, 05:41:25 AM
I have been playing ED in on my Vive for the past 10 days (having never played it before) and I already want to live the rest of my life in my pretend spaceship.  I can only imagine what it would be like with an actual compelling story line.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 27, 2016, 01:33:26 PM
I can only imagine what it would be like with an actual compelling story line.

(http://i.imgur.com/8pTSVjV.gif)


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on October 28, 2016, 12:01:27 PM
Apparently Hello Games and Sean Murray got hacked. Or maybe a deranged Murray escaped detention and they're just trying to damage control.

http://www.polygon.com/2016/10/28/13453440/no-mans-sky-tweet-game-was-a-mistake

edit: oh and https://twitter.com/rickyberwick/status/792025210816004096


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on October 28, 2016, 03:50:48 PM
they set themselves up for this by just flat-out ghosting, honestly

i mean it's the first tweet in how long? since right after launch?

/e - 18th of august. jesus h christ, the microdrama over this game being a festering abandonturd has provided eight times the entertainment value the game itself could have possibly provided


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yegolev on November 04, 2016, 08:32:17 AM
I guess Sean Murray can be thanked for letting me find out about Ricky Berwick, so there's a silver lining.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: UnSub on November 07, 2016, 08:04:26 AM
Did Disney make much of anything on Star Wars Battlefront? That game lasted weeks and was completely forgotten about.

Fortunately, Star Wars Battlefront 2 will be out next year, because we were running short on multiplayer shooters.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on November 07, 2016, 08:31:26 AM
Did Disney make much of anything on Star Wars Battlefront? That game lasted weeks and was completely forgotten about.

Fortunately, Star Wars Battlefront 2 will be out next year, because we were running short on multiplayer shooters.

What? How did it warrant a sequel?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: HaemishM on November 07, 2016, 08:44:19 AM
Star Wars.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Ironwood on November 10, 2016, 02:18:43 PM
Thread and Article worth coming back for.  10/10, would despair again.



Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Lucas on November 27, 2016, 05:38:33 PM
So, most of you are probably already aware of it, but it looks like a big update, called "foundation", came out of the blue today, along with some communication from Hello Games:

http://www.no-mans-sky.com/news/
http://www.no-mans-sky.com/foundation-update/

Ahem, dear Hello Games, was it too difficult to post...I don't know, a couple months ago, something along the lines of "ok, we've just started creating content for this update we're going to call "foundation": our current plan is to give you bi-weekly updates about our progress", instead, you know, of the total silence that we  got. Doesn't seem rocket science to me.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on November 27, 2016, 05:58:44 PM
You know, if their goal had been Minecraft, it probably would've been easier to just do that.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on November 28, 2016, 04:18:53 AM
Yeah... building bases on planets that you can't go back to? WTF?

This is going to sell really well I'm sure. <-- green, obv.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Rendakor on November 28, 2016, 07:21:37 AM
Quote
Waypoints can be placed and colour-coded to allow explorers to return to discoveries
You can go back to them now.

I think this is all too little, too late; I was far too angry at the game when I ragequit so it's going to take a lot to get me to reinstall.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Amarr HM on November 28, 2016, 09:19:15 AM
I loaded it up last night, started building a base with all the shiny stuff. Attached one component and then realised to build a bigger base I needed to mine for more stuff, in order to mine I required a better mining laser, in order to upgrade my mining laser I required a better ship .. that's when I logged off.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: apocrypha on November 28, 2016, 09:30:26 AM
Oh it's a free update, my mistake, I thought it was going to be DLC.

Well, good on them at least for trying to add something to the game, but yeah, it makes no sense that they didn't talk about this to anyone until now. They really have zero clue about PR do they?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on November 28, 2016, 09:39:55 AM
I loaded it up last night, started building a base with all the shiny stuff. Attached one component and then realised to build a bigger base I needed to mine for more stuff, in order to mine I required a better mining laser, in order to upgrade my mining laser I required a better ship .. that's when I logged off.

I don't know why she swallowed the fly...  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on November 28, 2016, 01:28:36 PM
Yeah... building bases on planets that you can't go back to? WTF?

This is going to sell really well I'm sure. <-- green, obv.
Teleporters to get to and from. If you want to move it, you get all materials refunded (though it would've been nice for a structural storage ala AE2).

As far as radio silence from Hello Games, fuck the Internet. It's lost all right to anyone telling them anything, ever. They'll bitch either way, so no loss.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Ginaz on November 28, 2016, 10:20:44 PM
Yeah... building bases on planets that you can't go back to? WTF?

This is going to sell really well I'm sure. <-- green, obv.
Teleporters to get to and from. If you want to move it, you get all materials refunded (though it would've been nice for a structural storage ala AE2).

As far as radio silence from Hello Games, fuck the Internet. It's lost all right to anyone telling them anything, ever. They'll bitch either way, so no loss.

 :facepalm:


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on November 29, 2016, 10:08:08 AM
What I mean is, you're damned if you do or damned if you don't. So don't waste the time, just make the game you want to make and let it speak for itself. The only feedback metric that matters is profit.

Obviously they're doing well enough to continue to develop content for the game, so good for them.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: HaemishM on November 29, 2016, 10:58:37 AM
That is the exact opposite of good marketing and a is a great way for an indie house to never be heard from again.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on November 29, 2016, 11:07:42 AM
I want to give this another chance so I started a survival game. I spawned on an ice planet, over seven minutes away from my ship. I die from exposure in about three minutes.

Let's generate another start:

Even colder, 12 minutes away. So am I supposed to cockstab for hours trying to stockpile minerals to keep me alive to get to the ship, at which point I can cockstab again to fix it?

Reading the internet, this is indeed the case. You have to jump between shelters and caves, so that means reroll a new planet until you get one where survival is possible. Resource drain and rarity is an order of magnitude worse, so all you ever do is mine stuff to do even the smallest thing. Basically survival is an unplayable mode.



Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Wasted on November 29, 2016, 01:04:06 PM
I tried survival mode as well, it pretty much highlights everything that is tedious and annoying about the game.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: 01101010 on November 29, 2016, 01:32:05 PM
I want to give this another chance so I started a survival game. I spawned on an ice planet, over seven minutes away from my ship. I die from exposure in about three minutes.

Let's generate another start:

Even colder, 12 minutes away. So am I supposed to cockstab for hours trying to stockpile minerals to keep me alive to get to the ship, at which point I can cockstab again to fix it?

Reading the internet, this is indeed the case. You have to jump between shelters and caves, so that means reroll a new planet until you get one where survival is possible. Resource drain and rarity is an order of magnitude worse, so all you ever do is mine stuff to do even the smallest thing. Basically survival is an unplayable mode.



Couldn't you just tunnel over to your ship to stay out of the elements? Or at least tunnel to recharge then dash again? I dunno how it works though as I have not played it for a few months...busy with my black Friday purchases.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: jakonovski on November 29, 2016, 02:52:35 PM
I want to give this another chance so I started a survival game. I spawned on an ice planet, over seven minutes away from my ship. I die from exposure in about three minutes.

Let's generate another start:

Even colder, 12 minutes away. So am I supposed to cockstab for hours trying to stockpile minerals to keep me alive to get to the ship, at which point I can cockstab again to fix it?

Reading the internet, this is indeed the case. You have to jump between shelters and caves, so that means reroll a new planet until you get one where survival is possible. Resource drain and rarity is an order of magnitude worse, so all you ever do is mine stuff to do even the smallest thing. Basically survival is an unplayable mode.



Couldn't you just tunnel over to your ship to stay out of the elements? Or at least tunnel to recharge then dash again? I dunno how it works though as I have not played it for a few months...busy with my black Friday purchases.

I don't think it's possible to tunnel with the basic gear, but I could be wrong. But even like that the shelter regeneration speed is so slow that you'll be spending an hour getting to your ship, most of it waiting.




Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yegolev on December 16, 2016, 03:28:41 PM
I'm just happy that I managed to get to a planet that isn't dissolving my flesh at a rapid pace.  I also have a working ship, but nice planets don't seem to be overrun with plutonium, so I spend a lot of time looking for that just so I can fly around and hope to find a recipe for glass.  I can make antimatter; glass seem trivial by comparison.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Pagz on February 03, 2017, 07:36:12 PM
http://schedule.gdconf.com/session/building-worlds-using-maths

Brave of him.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on February 03, 2017, 09:04:29 PM
Shame it's not at AGDC or I'd crash it.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Amarr HM on February 04, 2017, 03:56:39 PM
If he's doing a gig like that, does that mean he's not a gazillionaire?


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yoru on February 05, 2017, 05:14:08 PM
If he's doing a gig like that, does that mean he's not a gazillionaire?

Nah, speaker passes are free and nonremunerative. The hard part is just getting a talk approved, but being a "big name" helps a lot there.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Torinak on February 05, 2017, 06:19:53 PM
It's free advertising. There'll be a lot of media coverage. Some of it will emphasize how NMS now has some new half-assed features that weren't in at launch so some people will be tricked into buying it.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Father mike on August 12, 2017, 10:29:27 AM
ARISE !!!

After the launch dumpster fire, I had sworn off buying this till it dropped under $10, but since it's a Sony release, that'll never happen.

However ... patch 1.3 is out, and there is a Steam sale dropping the price to $24.  Is anyone still playing? If do, has Hello patched in enough game to make this worth pulling the trigger?

Any way, new features include
Quote
Full patch notes are available here: www.nomanssky.com/atlas-rises-update (http://www.nomanssky.com/atlas-rises-update), but here’s a quick run down of the main features:

  •     30 hours of branching story and deeper lore
  •     Procedurally generated guild missions
  •     Much deeper interstellar trading
  •     Star Systems have varying wealth, conflict and economies
  •     Overhauled Space combat controls, weapons and AI
  •     Portal stargates enable quick travel
  •     Terrain manipulation for more complex bases
  •     New farming and mining interactions bring increased depth
  •     Increased biome variety and Rare exotic biomes
  •     Analysis visor & discovery improvements
  •     Galaxy map and many other UI improvements
  •     New S Class ship designs
  •     Low altitude flight and the ability to crash your ship
  •     Crashed Freighters to salvage on planets
  •     Joint exploration



Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Reg on August 12, 2017, 11:02:12 AM
I bought it at release and just started a new game yesterday. I'm not far enough in to know if it's any fun yet. Maybe one of our more obsessive gamers can weigh in.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Lucas on August 12, 2017, 11:21:41 AM
I'll have to play a bit more, but for now let me say that (at least in "normal mode") the first few hours are definitely more engaging and interesting with the addition of focused tutorial tooltips, story and gameplay features. Graphics have also improved.

Promising.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Soln on August 12, 2017, 10:54:02 PM
I fired it up today.  Restarted.  Seems smoother but still jarring to meet aliens just hanging out in abandoned places.  We'll see.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Tale on August 13, 2017, 03:33:52 AM
The game Elite: Dangerous now has a lot of refugees from No Man's Sky, especially on PS4. Their general reaction is "Why did I ever bother with No Man's Sky?". Just letting you know.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Mandella on August 13, 2017, 11:59:27 AM
The game Elite: Dangerous now has a lot of refugees from No Man's Sky, especially on PS4. Their general reaction is "Why did I ever bother with No Man's Sky?". Just letting you know.

I had a friend mention that just yesterday. He picked up No Man's Sky on sale, played it for a while, and then tell me he was seriously thinking about returning it for refund and picking up Elite.

So apparently No Man's Sky is doing a great business in creating demand for Elite: Dangerous.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Reg on August 13, 2017, 01:55:58 PM
Is Elite: Dangerous any good in solo mode? I have zero desire to play another MMOG right now.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Tale on August 13, 2017, 04:16:26 PM
Is Elite: Dangerous any good in solo mode? I have zero desire to play another MMOG right now.

You can switch between Elite's solo, private group, and open (instanced MMO) modes at any time without penalty. It's all played on the same servers even if you choose to have no-one else be able to interact with you. You can relog and be in open again whenever you like. You continue playing the same character with the same progression no matter which mode you're in.

A Reddit survey the other day (young male-skewed site which gave some otherwise weird results) found that 51% mostly play in solo.

The big warning however is that Elite Dangerous has a massive learning curve. At first you struggle to even fly your ship or land it. And you do a lot of googling and reading wikis. People who get past the curve tend to go on to play hundreds or thousands of hours. I'm at 700 hours and having a blast.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Sky on August 13, 2017, 05:54:58 PM
I'm staying away from E:D because I'd end up with a Vive.

NMS is a good game for what it is, just a lot of people think it's something else.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Reg on August 13, 2017, 06:23:27 PM
I played Eve for years. I can't imagine Elite has a worse learning curve. Still, thanks for the warning. I'm not sure I'm ready to put that kind of energy into a new game right now. Maybe I'll pick it up at the Christmas Steam sale.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 13, 2017, 07:29:58 PM
NMS is a good game for what it is, just a lot of people think it's something else.

No. A lot of people were flat out told it was something else.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Rendakor on August 13, 2017, 08:08:20 PM
What schild said. No Mans Sky is False Advertising incarnate.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Mandella on August 13, 2017, 09:14:58 PM
Is Elite: Dangerous any good in solo mode? I have zero desire to play another MMOG right now.


The big warning however is that Elite Dangerous has a massive learning curve. At first you struggle to even fly your ship or land it. And you do a lot of googling and reading wikis.

That's true, but it should be noted that if you have any experience with flight sims and you own a joystick you shouldn't have any real trouble. It's easier than any WWII aviation sim I've ever picked up, for instance.

That said, I own it and haven't played in a while. It is a colossal time sink, and you don't really build anything in it either.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Kitsune on August 21, 2017, 03:15:42 PM
So, just as a curiosity, the initial article that caused the thread is inaccessible.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: schild on August 21, 2017, 03:30:47 PM
yes, correct

we don't have a frontpage


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yegolev on August 28, 2017, 08:49:04 AM
NMS is much improved from before.  For one thing, I can transfer stuff from my current ship directly to a crashed ship.  You can also summon your ship to your location.  There is more gameplay; I restarted and there is at least more gameplay in the early parts.

As usual, I will say that I didn't read anything about this game before I bought it.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 18, 2017, 11:42:53 AM
the best way i could describe the difference between NMS today and NMS at launch is that today's version is an actual game


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Yegolev on September 20, 2017, 10:00:05 PM
You are being generous, but I agree in spirit.


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Samprimary on September 21, 2017, 01:00:08 PM
well I mean I wouldn't say a particularly great game, but .. a game. like, with a release that wouldn't go down like the world's most oversold tech demo


Title: Re: No Man's Sky: A COMPREHENSIVE PRIMER BY SAMPRIMARY.
Post by: Xanthippe on November 24, 2017, 08:36:58 AM
I just bought it on sale. I like it.

I have not read much about it, including the first article in this thread that is inaccessible.