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Title: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on September 28, 2012, 02:08:27 PM
Anyone else give this a shot?

Bring Robert Downey Jr's Sherlock Holmes to the present, sprinkle in the site gags from Pshyce, and fill it out with the clueless police force from Monk.

I think this one will live or die by whether one can stomach a really jerky character and whether the world needs yet another Monk/Mentalist/Psyche narcissistic crime solver who steals the limelight while condescending our police forces.

I hear there was a version of this with 3 episodes on Masterpiece which were great. But I don't get that channel. Nor cable.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Trippy on September 28, 2012, 02:25:30 PM
It was...okay. I'm still wondering why Lucy Liu's character, who is Chinese, has the last name of Watson, though.

Edit: to clarify I know why she has the last name of Watson but they don't explain how an apparently unmarried Chinese person with Chinese parents has that last name


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: proudft on September 28, 2012, 02:47:46 PM
挖忖 ?

(wa-tsun)   :grin:


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Merusk on September 28, 2012, 04:24:56 PM
I caught it just because it was on after Person of Interest.  I enjoyed it a hell of a lot more than I thought I would so I'll give it a shot.  Not like there's anything else on Thursdays at 10pm. 


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: DevilsAdvocate25 on September 28, 2012, 04:41:53 PM
I watched it. I liked it. I like that Holmes is not completely in control and smarter-than-thou the whole time. He loses his temper with a woman who is lyig to him and again when he is confronting a suspect that he thinks is maybe going to get away with it. I really liked that he gathered evidence by taking pictures with his smartphone and, like with the BBC Sherlock, he admits to using Google because "not everything can be deduced."

The show was light on action. It felt like watching an episode of Law & Order: Criminal Intent.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Shannow on September 28, 2012, 04:47:33 PM
Not watching the new bbc version of sherlock is one of the greater crimes of the decade.  Get on it!


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Jamiko on September 28, 2012, 09:24:05 PM
I hear there was a version of this with 3 episodes on Masterpiece which were great. But I don't get that channel. Nor cable.

It's called "Sherlock" and there are 2 seasons at this point. And it is way better than "Elementary". And the 2 main guys are in "The Hobbit" as well. Just FYI on that last part...

It is on Netflix if you have that.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Venkman on September 29, 2012, 11:03:55 AM
Oh excellent, I'll check it out on Netflix. Thanks!

"not everything can be deduced."
Good point there, and on some of his other actions. I forgot some of those. I think RBJ pulled it off a bit better, but that they're at least trying here is worth a second episode from me.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Surlyboi on September 29, 2012, 11:58:23 PM
It was...okay. I'm still wondering why Lucy Liu's character, who is Chinese, has the last name of Watson, though.

Edit: to clarify I know why she has the last name of Watson but they don't explain how an apparently unmarried Chinese person with Chinese parents has that last name


Look at the pic of her parents again, her dad is white.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Signe on September 30, 2012, 01:25:58 PM
I have to watch everything on the computer over here and I made a point to watch this and it was okay.  I like Sick Boy!  Still, there's no comparison to the Sherlock series with Benedict Cumberbatch, in spite of his very silly names.  That's been awesome so far.  He's been good in everything I've seen him in but this is his best so far.  Season 3 is supposed to start in January, I think, and I really truly absolutely recommend it to everyone.  And not just because he looks really awesome with dark tousled hair!


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Venkman on October 04, 2012, 10:01:31 PM
We enjoyed the second episode more than the first. They kinda dialed back his asshole-ishness a bit, and his antics seemed to have more of a reason than some parts of the first episode where he seemed to just be a jerk for the sake of it.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Nevermore on October 04, 2012, 11:31:15 PM
I haven't seen the second episode yet but it seemed to me watching the first one that he was trying to channel Gregory House.


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Ubvman on October 05, 2012, 12:02:39 AM
I haven't seen the second episode yet but it seemed to me watching the first one that he was trying to channel Gregory House.

Which is a bad sign.

House was tolerable for the first two seasons (at most) and it descended it complete and utter TV-land trope filled wankery.
You know of course that House and Wilson was supposed to channel Holmes and Watson...


Title: Re: Elementary
Post by: Venkman on October 05, 2012, 01:13:27 PM
Yea that's vibe I got as well. It works ok for me here because I didn't watch much of House. Good show but boring subject for me.

I'm curious if they've already ordered a full season or if they'll wait for the performance of the 3rd and 4th episodes. I imagine they did the typical six episode thing, but with enough production team between 1 and 2 to make some changes (editing or reshoots) to soften his character up a bit and strengthen hers.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on October 05, 2012, 09:21:20 PM
Just watched the first episode of Sherlock. Man you were right, that is a better version. Will watch both weekly just for that Pepsi Challenge feel.

One thing I noticed in both shows:

Modern real world settings with all the usual contemporary accruetrements and assumed history, and yet nobody even winks at the name "Sherlock Holmes"? How many people like that would be walking around that wouldn't constantly get at least some question about "so, are you a detective with a name like that?". Which makes me wonder even more, being a detective and all.

In shows like this I don't even think it'd break the fourth wall.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on October 06, 2012, 04:19:11 AM
 :ye_gods:

I think you missed the point.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: eldaec on October 06, 2012, 04:41:43 AM
In shows based on books I think you're allowed to assume the book doesn't exist in that world.

Otherwise Miss Marple can simply look up who did the murder in the book. Or the Russians would know to shoot James Bond in the face as soon as they meet him. Sauron could have razed the shire years ago.

Literary world governments would be able to start prosecuting precrime.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on October 06, 2012, 09:32:23 AM
Nah, I gat that (though I appreciate the extended explanation of what I missed :-) ). Modernization of a brand and all that.

The thing is, Flemings and Christie were writing about contemporary characters in a contemporary time frame about contemporary things. Generally the history is very short. Bond is always the same James Bond, just played by different characters for different eras of the franchise, but always talking to the same audience: a person of today about a thing of today. And each movie is a vignette, only referencing prior ones if there's a narrative link or a recurring villain (who by the second occurence does know to shoot Bond in the face).

LoTR stuff is just telling the same story in the same time frame as occured in the books. The Simarillion is just a longer history of that universe. But it happens in a sequence. Melkor would have needed a soothsayer to predict that in a few aeons some race of halflings would undo the work of his contemporary middleman.

If Elementary/Sherlock were set during the late 1800s like the RDJ movies, then I wouldn't have even noticed it. But being set in the 21st century but with all the trappings of the 1800s character, the show world isn't ignoring just a few dozen books. They've written out a whole century's worth of well known pop culture references.

Both shows could just as easily treated it as a quirky genious taking on an affectation, which then compelled others to do the same, and probably not suffer for it.

Not really a big deal (though apparently worth posting about over coffee #1  :wink:)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on December 10, 2012, 07:16:47 PM
Finished episode 6.

When they ran this on air, was it six two hour episodes? Or is that just how they packaged it for Netflix?

Watched episode 6 the same night I watched Dark Knight Rises.


I needed some Phineas & Ferb to detox after :-)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on January 10, 2013, 09:51:15 PM
A wild Moriarty Appears.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: palmer_eldritch on January 11, 2013, 06:25:48 AM
Finished episode 6.

When they ran this on air, was it six two hour episodes? Or is that just how they packaged it for Netflix?

Watched episode 6 the same night I watched Dark Knight Rises.


I needed some Phineas & Ferb to detox after :-)

They've made six episodes in total (three a season over two seasons) but they weren't two hours long, unless Netflix adds adverts or something. I think they were 90 minutes.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 11, 2013, 04:04:36 PM
I think I might have all my Sherlock shoes confused.  There's the Brit one and the one with Sickboy which isn't the Brit one.  Right?   :ye_gods:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Evildrider on January 11, 2013, 04:42:52 PM
Yeah this thread is confuzzling.  Elementary is the one with Zero Cool.

Nice that they just started the Moriarty storyline last episode too.  Really like this show.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: rattran on January 11, 2013, 06:16:16 PM
I think I might have all my Sherlock shoes confused.  There's the Brit one and the one with Sickboy which isn't the Brit one.  Right?   :ye_gods:

(http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/311/0/a/sherlock_shoes_by_alicevalium-d4fgr7f.jpg)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 11, 2013, 06:57:27 PM
Yeah, right.  And the one that isn't the Brit one has Lucy Liu and the Brit one has the guy from The Office.  The Brit one.  Not the one that's not Brit and has Catherine Tate.  I need a nap.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on January 11, 2013, 07:58:36 PM
Sherlock - BBC - Cumberbatch and Arthur Dent

Elementary - CBS - Sickboy and O-Ren Ishii.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rendakor on January 12, 2013, 01:10:51 AM
I really wish we could have two threads for them; this one's very confusing.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 12, 2013, 09:37:42 AM
I know!   :ye_gods:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on January 12, 2013, 11:47:50 AM
Well, back in the day there was only Elementary. But then someone mentioned Sherlock. But there didn't seem to be enough people into either show so I edited the subject. And then the thread went dormant and I was thinking I was the only one watching :-)

I didn't like the new Moriarity at first. Then it turned out to not be him (maybe?), which I did like. The show had a nice twist in that.

But compared to the British one, this is more New York than than it is Sherlock Holmes. Standard quirky detective formula.

It's kinda like how I feel about NCIS: LA. That's an LA cop drama thing with cool guys doing cool things in environments that should come off as gritty but are just too bright and shiny. It just happens to draft off the NCIS branding and the timeslot.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 12, 2013, 05:33:57 PM
I don't watch NCIS since that goofy guy with the silly hat left.  Actually, that might be one of the CSIs.  I forget.  I know it's not Law and Order: Something or other.  I used to watch those.  I love the Brit Sherlock show and I like the non Brit one very much, too.  I'm down with Sickboy being typecast as a junkie.  I'm sure I'm not up to date on anything but Dexter at the moment. 


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Der Helm on January 12, 2013, 11:29:48 PM
I don't watch NCIS since that goofy guy with the silly hat left. 

Isn't that Dexter as well ?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Evildrider on January 13, 2013, 12:14:37 AM
I don't watch NCIS since that goofy guy with the silly hat left. 

Isn't that Dexter as well ?

I think she means Grissom from CSI. 


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Der Helm on January 13, 2013, 07:05:06 AM
I don't watch NCIS since that goofy guy with the silly hat left. 

Isn't that Dexter as well ?

I think she means Grissom from CSI. 

That character wears a hat ?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 13, 2013, 11:54:43 AM
That's the one, I think.  I thought he wore a hat, too.  I don't know. 


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Evildrider on January 13, 2013, 02:47:49 PM
I don't watch NCIS since that goofy guy with the silly hat left. 

Isn't that Dexter as well ?

I think she means Grissom from CSI. 

That character wears a hat ?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/Glorfirith/Hat.jpg)

He didn't wear hats all the time but this one popped up in a few episodes.  This is what I thought Signe may have been referring to.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 14, 2013, 10:31:18 AM
Yeah, him.  He had another hat with strings under it so you could make a cute bow, too.  It was floppier.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Arthur_Parker on January 30, 2013, 05:53:44 AM
Sherlock is great.

I think Elementary is pretty good apart from the first two episodes that had really bad/obvious plot lines.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Raph on January 31, 2013, 12:30:21 AM
Half the fun of Sherlock is seeing the ways in which they call back to the original stories.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on February 01, 2013, 10:28:52 PM
There anyone keeping track of those references? I would love to see a list/site. I never got much into the original stories, so I'm probably missing a lot of subtle references.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Raph on February 02, 2013, 12:49:13 AM
A quick Google yielded this page: http://buddy2blogger.blogspot.com/2013/01/canonical-references-in-sherlock-study.html



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on February 06, 2013, 11:31:00 PM
Ah thanks!


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Brogarn on February 20, 2013, 03:03:06 PM
I've yet to watch Sherlock but can say that Elementary is starting to get better. Lucy Liu is starting to become slightly more than the wallflower she has been and they're finally developing a relationship/friendship between the two of them that actually feels like one. I think they made a poor choice with Aidan Quinn as the Captain, though, only because I think he's too good for the small part he's playing.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on February 20, 2013, 08:33:35 PM
I agree. At least he's not the bumbling detective they sometimes put in that role. But they'd have been better with a no name.

And I agree too that the show is getting better. Which is interesting. I'm still eagerly awaiting the next set of Sherlocks though :-)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Hammond on February 22, 2013, 11:33:58 AM
So far I have been enjoying it. there has been a few episodes that were a bit off but overall its getting better. For a first season all in all its pretty good. I think it will stay in my DVR schedule for awhile at least.

edit. I just watched the last episode tonight and there was a scene where Holmes was in a Limo and they were showing the traffic around them. Holmes is sitting with his back to the front windshield and it looks like they are going in reverse. Then they flip the camera around and the direction changed. Whoever did the CGI made a small "oops". I am hoping this is a one off odd stuff like that really distracts from a show.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: March on March 17, 2013, 01:18:03 PM
I really like the updating done in the BBC Sherlock.

But the US Network Elementary is just a quirky detective consultant show a'la Castle, Mentalist, Monk, etc. 

I might like it better if it was called Hemlock rather than Sherlock, but then, what's the point of yet another detective show with a broken detective?  Calling it Sherlock just causes cognitive dissonance from what it decidedly is not, an adaptation of Sherlock Holmes.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on May 16, 2013, 09:53:58 PM
Spectacular season ender. Even if I saw the twist coming.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Evildrider on May 17, 2013, 12:48:15 AM
Yeah, I also enjoyed this.  I'm actually surprised that that it wasn't a cliffhanger, but I guess they didn't bank on getting another season.   :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on June 01, 2013, 02:27:05 PM
Maybe :-) But given they're the arch enemy with vast resources, I doubt some local police force will keep them locked up for long.

I did really enjoy it. But I still agree with March in a way. As much as I enjoyed the first season, it still feels like they label-slapped "Sherlock Holmes" onto yet another antisocial dysfunctional narcissitic private detective, because when iterations on that theme ran out, they needed to tap into brand awareness.

But this might just be because the BBC show does such a better job at modernizing the Sherlock Holmes (and extended cast) of lore.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on September 28, 2013, 06:35:42 PM
Season 2 began this week for Elementary. Wasn't bad, but kinda slow and largely unresolved. It seemed to reintroduce the core cast again rather than continue anything.

Woulda been less disappointing except it happened the same week BBC announced Sherlock isn't coming back until 2014 (and apparently Freeman's been cast for a TV adaption of Fargo (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-24295792)?!)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: lamaros on October 02, 2013, 01:46:51 AM
The problem with the first season finale (of Elementary) was that the reference was so strong as to be obvious. My GF liked it, but as soon as the name Irene Adler popped up it was episode over for me.

Haven't watched Sherlock. Will have to take a look at that.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on October 02, 2013, 05:03:58 PM
Haven't watched Sherlock. Will have to take a look at that.

Yea definitely worth checking out.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on October 23, 2013, 06:27:32 PM
 Sherlock returns in January. (http://www.deadline.com/2013/10/downton-back-january-5-sherlock-returns-january-19-pbs-finally-makes-official/)

YES!


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 04, 2014, 05:36:44 AM
So, Um, did you chaps get this yet ?

We did.

It was.... as expected.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: satael on January 04, 2014, 06:34:57 AM
I was kind of disappointed with the first Sherlock of season 3 for some reason. It just wasn't anything great storywise in my opinion. The first Elementary episode of the year on the other hand was pretty good (but I don't expect as much from it storywise as I do from Sherlock)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 04, 2014, 08:40:50 AM
I was kind of disappointed with the first Sherlock of season 3 for some reason.

Moffat ? :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Chimpy on January 04, 2014, 09:59:18 AM
So, Um, did you chaps get this yet ?

We did.

It was.... as expected.


We get it on Jan 19th.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on January 04, 2014, 03:25:19 PM
So, Um, did you chaps get this yet ?

We did.

It was.... as expected.


Christ. Has the Moffatry metastasized?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 04, 2014, 04:07:04 PM
It had enough Gattistry to counter most of the effects.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on January 04, 2014, 08:39:12 PM
You guys are using English characters, but I can't figure out what you mean :-)

Downtown Abbey tomorrow, Sherlock in two weeks, it's a good month for US TV viewers.

Oh and Elementary seems to be hitting an interesting point. They're focusing a lot more on character development than they did in season 1. It's adding interesting dimensions, particularly for Watson and Bell.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on January 04, 2014, 10:44:01 PM
For those in the US without cable TV, are there official streaming options available for the new episodes?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: MahrinSkel on January 04, 2014, 10:48:14 PM
For those in the US without cable TV, are there official streaming options available for the new episodes?
Sherlock was on HuluPlus, not sure about Elementary.

--Dave


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Viin on January 04, 2014, 10:51:10 PM
We're watching Sherlock on Netflix this week, to get caught up.

Edit: nvrmnd, just saw the ask was for *new* episodes


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Chimpy on January 04, 2014, 10:54:21 PM
For those in the US without cable TV, are there official streaming options available for the new episodes?

For Sherlock: PBS.org (or the various mobile/Roku apps) not long after they air for streaming. If you are able to get PBS on your tv through non-cable means you can also watch it that way when it does air :P



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Venkman on January 04, 2014, 10:57:14 PM
For those in the US without cable TV, are there official streaming options available for the new episodes?
Sherlock was on HuluPlus, not sure about Elementary.

--Dave

I've used the CBS app to watch Elementary. They usually have only the last 3 episodes. That'll change since they'll soon require you connect the CBS app to an active cable subscriber account (no surprise there).


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 05, 2014, 04:50:18 PM
As you all know, I'm an honest bloke and credit where it's due.

Episode Two of the latest series was fucking fantastic.

So there's that.

Edited to Add :  It's the Blink of Sherlock, to be honest.  It was that good.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on January 06, 2014, 10:44:35 AM
Oh shit, then. I look forward.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 06, 2014, 11:07:05 AM
I'd just skip the whole first episode Hooray, He's Alive bollocks and launch straight into Sign of Three.  Even a day later I still have to grit my teeth and admit that it was damn clever.

(Though not surprising.  Don't go into it thinking you won't figure some of it out before the characters do.  Bear in mind that it's a rewrite of shit you've read countless times...)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Threash on January 06, 2014, 11:35:46 AM
We don't have enough episodes to be skipping shit! hell you know you are going to watch them all at least ten times in the two years it takes them to make another season.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: satael on January 06, 2014, 12:23:18 PM
I'd just skip the whole first episode Hooray, He's Alive bollocks and launch straight into Sign of Three.  Even a day later I still have to grit my teeth and admit that it was damn clever.

(Though not surprising.  Don't go into it thinking you won't figure some of it out before the characters do.  Bear in mind that it's a rewrite of shit you've read countless times...)


Sign of Three turned out to be enjoyable though this manic and goofy Sherlock isn't really my favorite type of Sherlock Holmes by far (especially the bit before the opening credits reminded me more of Dr. Who la Matt Smith which is fine... just not in Sherlock Holmes so much)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: NowhereMan on January 08, 2014, 12:52:19 AM
Sign of Three was a bit of a relief, the first episode was just utterly lacking in plot so it was good to see that it's not going to turn into some character driven show that puts the mystery solving on auto-pilot. That said it's still a little overly character focused to my eye, something I hope will fade back into balance as they get over the whole 'things are happening to the characters, look they're 3 dimensional and everything!'. I'm still liking Mycroft whenever he appears, if Sherlock becomes a bit less sociopathic I hope they keep him on hand for assholish put downs.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 08, 2014, 03:16:59 AM
Aye, I'll agree with that.  I just liked that we actually had an episode that was constructed well and knew how to build, even if what it was building to was obvious in the first five minutes.

Also, Hilarious.  Sherlocks Drunk Cam made me piss myself.  Especially 'Cardigan'.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: apocrypha on January 08, 2014, 03:17:08 AM
Yeah, enjoyed Sign of Three, although the "how he did it" bit was nonsense.

Feels to me like Gatiss is writing the character interactions and dialogue, which are good, and Moffat is writing the plots, which aren't that great.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on January 08, 2014, 08:50:43 AM
I loved Jeremy Brett as Sherlock Holmes.  Michael Caine and Robert Downey Jr. were awesome as funny Sherlocks.  I used to watch the old old films with Rasil Bathbone, too, and enjoyed them.  But Jeremy Brett will ALWAYS be Sherlock Holmes for me.  He was brilliant.  I miss him!  :(


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 08, 2014, 09:11:59 AM
Michael Caine didn't really play Sherlock though.  He played someone pretending to be Sherlock.

That film had Ghandi in it too.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: satael on January 08, 2014, 10:57:39 AM
I loved Jeremy Brett as Sherlock Holmes.  Michael Caine and Robert Downey Jr. were awesome as funny Sherlocks.  I used to watch the old old films with Rasil Bathbone, too, and enjoyed them.  But Jeremy Brett will ALWAYS be Sherlock Holmes for me.  He was brilliant.  I miss him!  :(

I have to agree. Brett is the definite Sherlock Holmes for me too (and always will be)  :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: satael on January 13, 2014, 08:37:00 AM
The third (and last) episode of season 3 of Sherlock was entertaining but not really memorable. Still I'm really glad that a 4th season is in the works  :grin:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 13, 2014, 05:31:25 PM
I apologise in advance for anyone who took my words of encouragement on the 2nd Ep and then watched the 3rd.

Forgive me.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on January 13, 2014, 11:20:27 PM
Heh. Rasil Bathbone.

On the third ep, yeah the Moffatry has returned full force.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on January 27, 2014, 09:27:36 AM
Sign of Three was fantastic, and hilarious.

and...
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/68652d5defa9e692543cb874540fa402/tumblr_myzl68nL5o1rlltdro1_500.gif)


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: TheWalrus on April 04, 2014, 03:20:22 PM
Blatant shoutout to Anonymous on the show last night. Making Holmes do funny shit in exchange for work was great.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on April 04, 2014, 03:24:28 PM
What ?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Soulflame on April 04, 2014, 03:41:00 PM
Presumably a reference to Elementary, the US version of Sherlock that's running on... some broadcast channel.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Surlyboi on April 04, 2014, 03:46:16 PM
It is indeed in reference to elementary. Running on CBS.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rendakor on April 04, 2014, 03:58:23 PM
Why are both of these shows in the same thread again?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: TheWalrus on April 04, 2014, 03:58:44 PM
Not everything is about you blokes across the water.  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Trippy on April 04, 2014, 03:59:48 PM
Why are both of these shows in the same thread again?
No idea.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rendakor on April 04, 2014, 04:00:41 PM
I'm actually surprised schild allowed it. He gets upset when we try to talk about multiple movies in the same thread over in that subforum.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Merusk on April 04, 2014, 05:55:53 PM
Blatant shoutout to Anonymous on the show last night. Making Holmes do funny shit in exchange for work was great.

"Everyone" was introduced last season and did the same thing.  They had it to silly levels of controlling the power to his house and turning off and on appliances.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: TheWalrus on April 04, 2014, 06:44:24 PM
Ah hell, I missed that one. Wife doesn't like the show, so I only get to watch it every now and again.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Soulflame on April 04, 2014, 07:36:23 PM
Last night's Elementary was reasonably decent.  We casually try to catch Elementary, although we're not really dedicated to any shows right now.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: KallDrexx on April 13, 2014, 10:16:23 PM
Saw the first episode of Sherlock, and thought it was very good.

Looking at the episode listing on Netflix, is it normal to only have 3 episodes per season?


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: disKret on April 14, 2014, 04:52:29 AM
Looking at the episode listing on Netflix, is it normal to only have 3 episodes per season?

Yeap. Every episode is 1,5h.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: KallDrexx on April 14, 2014, 08:27:20 AM
Is that a British thing? 

Just seems odd since US shows are usually 13 or 26 episodes per season, some of which being an hour long each.  Not that i'm complaining, I'd rather a show be tighter and better written with less filler.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on April 14, 2014, 08:58:30 AM
No, it's a Sherlock thing.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rishathra on June 11, 2014, 08:23:28 AM
Is it a Sherlock thing to get trounced by the bad guy at the end of every season?  I enjoy this show but the third season in particular had almost no actual mystery solving, and also had the bad guy run circles around Sherlock the whole way through.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on June 11, 2014, 08:28:30 AM
Edit :  Yes.





Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on June 30, 2014, 07:17:17 PM
It's been out long enough I'm not going to be spoiling for anyone but Sherlock DID know(or at least heavily presumed) once the glasses were taken off.  Sherlock taking the laptop was simply him coming up with a bad plan which he was hoping might work if there was an actual vault.  He specifically had Watson bring a gun to Christmas ahead of time knowing the course of action he would most likely be forced to take to protect those he loved.  The scene in the closet was not a shot of Sherlock thinking "oh my god I've been foiled"  it was him resigning himself to what his next action would have to be now that he had confirmation.  He even asked again, out loud with the helicopter "are you really, super sure about this?"(paraphrasing)

The bad guy in this episode wasn't really all that smart, he just had a great memory and leverage.  In that way I don't think he was a great villain because it was never really a game of wit, it was brute force from the beginning. Still enjoyed it though.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rishathra on July 01, 2014, 08:32:23 AM
I understand your points, but shouldn't a show about Sherlock Holmes have him capable of coming up with GOOD plans?  And your comment about the brute force villain just makes it worse.

Look, I'm no Holmes purist or anything.  Really, I have little actual knowledge of the character and have never read any of the books or seen anything other than this and the first RDJ movie.  But even I know that he's famous for being a smart guy who is good at solving mysteries/crimes.  That's like his core competency.  I feel the writers could try to come up with something more interesting than "let the bad guy run circles around me until it gets to the point that I'm cornered and have to come up with some crazy hail mary move that doesn't actually make me win, only not lose so badly."  This has happened twice, now.  I accepted it with Moriarty because the "I lost deliberately so I could go off the grid and dismantle his network" actually made some sense.  But for them to do it again the very next season seems weak.

Sorry about all the bitching.  I really do like this show.  I think I feel the same way Ironwood does about Dr. Who: a good character marred by bad writers making him do nonsensical things to further a weak plot.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on July 01, 2014, 09:08:44 AM
I agree and disagree. 

First off I'll agree that creating a villain that is more a brute force type is somewhat boring, they shouldn't have tried making another big bad villain in the first place.  If you do make another Moriarty type you will inevitably have to compare the two and since you can't make someone smarter than Moriarty you have to make the villain powerful in some other way which doesn't work as well in a Sherlock Holmes story.

Now to disagree.  While I don't like the brute force villain as the season finale I do like that the writers wanted to expand on the character and not just do the same old criminal mastermind of the week.  Glasses guy could have made a compelling episode two villain but then again that's the problem with three episode seasons, there's only room for so much.  Again I don't think bad guy was running circles around Sherlock but the episode did a really piss poor job of actually showing Sherlock's side of things.

All in all it wasn't a terrible episode in my mind, it was an imperfect ending to a case but at least one of the episodes needed a messy, imperfect ending it just shouldn't have been the finale.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: NowhereMan on July 01, 2014, 12:22:49 PM
I'll disagree quite strongly with the thought that it's not a Sherlock Holmes thing, it's certainly not a central part of the character but it was Conan Doyle himself who set that sort of climax up. The original confrontation with Moriarty was exactly that, Holmes thinking through the whole fight with 'If he does X I'll do Y and he'll do Z and...' with Holmes realising he doesn't have any smart option left and throwing himself off the falls with Moriarty. Part of the character (now) is that he's willing to doom himself if he sees that that's the optimal solution. Sometimes he doesn't just logic his way to victory.

Of course this also led to Holmes being the poster boy for the fake death/comeback trope since Conan Doyle needed to make some cash. Interesting point regarding him is that Conan Doyle always viewed the Sherlock stories as total hack writing he only did for the money totally devoid of any literary merit. On the other hand his 'literary masterpiece' (the White Company) is complete drek.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on July 02, 2014, 10:01:19 AM
His follow up 'The Black Company' was just as bad.

And Glenn Cook was a stupid pseudonym.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Evildrider on May 15, 2015, 02:36:29 AM
Don't know if anyone is still watching Elementary, but that was a dark turn for Sherlock in the finale.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Signe on May 15, 2015, 07:36:20 PM
I watch it but I haven't seen that episode left.  I've watched nearly all his stuff since Sick Boy.  I can't let go.

Wait... speaking of Sick Boy... Allegedly, there is a sequel to Trainspotting coming in 2016 or 2017.  It's from Irvine Welsh's book "Porno".  I liked it in spite of the title.  Anyway, Danny Boyle, again allegedly,  has already signed up Sick Boy and Renton even though Renton hates Danny's slimy guts.

I only know this stuff because my cousin is a huge Ewan fan and sent some article about it a few months ago. 


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: angry.bob on October 25, 2015, 11:37:47 AM
Just going to leave this here.  (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nk86jSLufLs)Didn't see it mentioned elsewhere.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Chimpy on January 01, 2016, 07:14:53 PM
"Period" special episode of Sherlock airs tonight on PBS (and I think it may have aired on BBC tonight too?).



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on January 05, 2016, 11:03:26 AM
That New Years Day episode?  :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: jgsugden on January 05, 2016, 11:14:33 AM
That New Years Day episode?  :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr:
A bunch of people called the surprising twist, but I still enjoyed seeing it unfold.  I just wish it wasn't taking so long to get new installments out -  I forget so much of what took place and it takes me too long to recall whether someone we see is someone that has previously appeared or not.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Threash on January 05, 2016, 11:17:21 AM
It's going to take even longer now that Cumberbatch is a big star doing Marvel films.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Chimpy on January 05, 2016, 09:30:44 PM
They are planning on filming the fourth series this spring/summer but it won't air until 2017 according to the last reports I read.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on January 06, 2016, 08:18:51 AM
That New Years Day episode?  :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr: :uhrr:
A bunch of people called the surprising twist, but I still enjoyed seeing it unfold.  I just wish it wasn't taking so long to get new installments out -  I forget so much of what took place and it takes me too long to recall whether someone we see is someone that has previously appeared or not.

It didn't make any sense and wasn't even very good? I guess this is what people have been bitching about with Dr. Who for years. Really the only reason to watch Sherlock is Cumberbatch and Freeman acting together.



Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Chimpy on January 06, 2016, 08:42:31 AM
I thought it was entertaining. It was obviously more of a vehicle for them to have fun than to be "serious drama."


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: NowhereMan on January 06, 2016, 03:09:14 PM
I enjoyed it in this just because, yeah, it's a Christmas special and they were having fun without really engaging the metaplot. If this is the only serious Moffating I'm not too bothered (Dr. Who basically has this repeatedly, every season) although having a single hour special over 2-3 years and finishing on the same cliffhanger makes me a bit  :mob:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 10, 2016, 05:49:01 PM
That was dreadful.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on January 10, 2016, 06:47:53 PM
That was dreadful.


Worse, it was absolutely pointless.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 11, 2016, 08:47:02 AM
Yes.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rendakor on January 11, 2016, 09:10:15 AM
It was alright. I went in after hearing you guys all hate it (SURPRISE SURPRISE) so my expectations were pretty low.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: jgsugden on January 11, 2016, 11:47:05 AM
F13.NET
USELESSLY CYNICAL
COMMENTARY


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on January 11, 2016, 11:56:55 AM
The episode was objectively bad because there was no episode, it was an extended dream sequence with no stakes whatsoever. The whole episode was simply an excuse to use a character they lament killing off.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: jgsugden on January 11, 2016, 03:06:30 PM
It was exactly what was intended: A chance to play in the original sandbox with their 'modern' cast.  It was meant as a fun bonus, not a pivotal component of the ongoing story.  It was fun fluff.

I'd much rather have seen a new episode that continued the story meaningfully, but it is what it is, and for what it is, it is fine.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Rendakor on January 11, 2016, 04:11:18 PM
Once I heard it was set in the 1800s I knew it wasn't going to advance the main story in a meaningful way. I wish they had just done "Sherlock in the 1800s" instead of  but I still enjoyed the experience.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Ironwood on January 12, 2016, 03:39:19 AM
It was exactly what was intended: A chance to play in the original sandbox with their 'modern' cast.  It was meant as a fun bonus, not a pivotal component of the ongoing story.  It was fun fluff.

I'd much rather have seen a new episode that continued the story meaningfully, but it is what it is, and for what it is, it is fine.

The problem with your analysis is that it wasn't fun.  Wife fell asleep and I was supremely irritated once it became clear what he was doing and then once there was actually no payoff to the main 'crime.'


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: NowhereMan on January 12, 2016, 05:24:16 AM
I kind of liked it because silly little jokes and references to moustache growing amuse me. However it would have been infinitely better if they'd made it an actual 1800s case for fun that got solved rather than a reminder that there's a main series with a plot that this is totally connected to without actually accomplishing anything. Like I said if it's a one off I won't lose any sleep but if Moffat starts to feel Sherlock is ripe for injecting a hefty dose more Moffatry into I'll be pissed.

In 2017 if I remember any of this by then any way.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: jgsugden on January 12, 2016, 09:42:36 AM
I'm looking at it as a spectacle, not a story. It was fun to see them in 'original' setting like it is fun to watch some of the ridiculous explosions In a Michael Bay film. I could have obtained the same enjoyment if it was only 30 minutes, but it didn't drag on too too long. Fine. I don't regret watching it.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Slyfeind on January 17, 2016, 05:46:24 PM
I absolutely loved that episode, every second, every scene, every bit, until the very end when the story rendered itself completely pointless. Christ, and I actually like what Moffat does half the time.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Lakov_Sanite on January 19, 2016, 01:00:09 AM
I absolutely loved that episode, every second, every scene, every bit, until the very end when the story rendered itself completely pointless. Christ, and I actually like what Moffat does half the time.



I can't quote this hard enough.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on January 12, 2017, 08:57:22 AM
Season 4 has started. Definitely better than that shitty special one-off episode.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: NowhereMan on January 16, 2017, 07:51:57 AM
Oh God, season 4 is pretty full on Moffatry. He's really pulling into his Dr. Who 'fairytale' bollocks. It sort of, kind of holds together in the sense that it's all, probably, physically possible but god damn does it simply not make sense.


The first 2 episodes are decent (if you ignore Mrs. Hudson tearing through a London suburb in her Aston Martin with police in hot pursuit) but the third is just :uhrr:


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: satael on January 16, 2017, 12:20:42 PM
It didn't really feel like Sherlock Holmes to me. I've always thought Sherlock was about solving an interesting case they happen on based on evidence and reasoning rather than having the main characters' personal lives be the focus and continually ramping up the stakes and action thru the season (I'd probably go as far as saying this season was jumping the shark trying to top Moriarty from the previous season).


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Soln on January 16, 2017, 12:27:46 PM
I barely got through the first episode with MrsWatson.  Really bad cast actress with just rofl writing. Stopped watching after that.  Show is shit.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Father mike on January 16, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
This was the series finale.  So ... Yaaa?

Everyone who writes modern procedurals needs to keep their brains firmly wrapped around the idea of avoiding villain escalation.  When you lead with an antagonist who is every bit as powerful/clever as the protagonist, you have to keep upping the ante.  So now we have the godlike villain whose powers are Moffat at his self-indulgent worst.

I sort of liked the 2nd episode of the 4th season because we had a villain who was powerful outside "the game", but everyone knew Sherlock would outwit him in the end; the focus of the story was Sherlock and Watson rebuilding.  The episode was dragged down by by the having to set up the finale's villain, but still a good watch.  Like NowhereMan said, this was just loony.

The case du jour is just an excuse for us to watch the characters ping off each other.  All the time spent building your villain's omnipotence is just a waste.  A hard to explain, internally inconsistent waste.


Title: Re: Elementary/Sherlock
Post by: Shannow on January 22, 2017, 09:24:36 AM
Watching finale now, it's fucking awful.  The writers never seemed to get the point that Sherlock is at its best when they are being funny and Sherlock and Watson are interacting.  Seriously fucking boring , now when they do the whole tortured bit , fuuuuuuuck off.