f13.net

Now that the season's finally underway it appears that it is going to be a good one.  The offseason trades have made things interesting, and a lot of the younger teams are finally coming into their own.

Several teams are very good and were expected to be very good:
1.  Chicago
2.  Orlando
3.  Miami

I think Miami will eventually pull through in the Southeast and win the title.  Lebron is playing lights out and I really like the fact that he's stepped up his inside game.  And grown a beard.  Oddly, they may be better without Wade playing.....Orlando will go as far as Howard takes them.  I'm never confident in a center leading a team to the title, however, and don't expect big things of this team.  Chicago has an intriguing mix.  I'm not sure they have enough off of Rose, particularly at the 2/3 position to win it. 

A couple of younger teams have finally hit their stride and look to be contenders at least for their divisions:
1.  Oklahoma City
2.  Indiana
3.  Atlanta
4.  Clippers
5.  Denver
6.  Philadelphia

I don't really expect any of these teams to contend for the title other than Oklahoma City.  They have a very good team, but the Northwest division is tougher than it might look on paper.  Indiana is an enigma.  I just can't figure out why they're playing well, and I certainly don't expect this to last the year.  Atlanta probably won't make the playoffs but do have that capability.  They're just stuck in a tough division.  The Clippers should win the Pacific, but you just can't discount the Lakers and Kobe.  Denver being good doesn't make any sense to me.  I don't think they'll have the staying power.  Same with Philadelphia.  They have a very mediocre looking roster, on paper.  Maybe they have some great teamwork, but I don't expect it to continue long term. 

A few teams have gotten so old that I've written them off, even if they may contend for their division title:
1.  San Antonio
2.  Lakers
3.  Phoenix
4.  Boston

I really, really don't like this Boston team (and they're MY team).  Rondo is a beast, but he can't be the go to scorer.  It's tough when you have a guy like him that is capable of a triple double on any night and you have trouble winning.  That means he needs a new surrounding cast.  The Lakers will probably come in second in their division and will almost certainly make the playoffs, but I'll be very surprised if they make a run in the playoffs.  I suspect that Bynum may be traded before the year is out, possibly for Howard.  That would be the only trade that would make sense for Bynum, and I'm not sure why they aren't using him as their number 2 option at this point.  He's got a lot of talent too.  Phoenix is over, Nash is getting close to retirement necessity.  The Spurs are the same as the Suns.  They may actually win their division too, but it's a weak division and I don't see them putting together a playoff run.

Then there are the duds:
1.  New York Knickerbockers
2.  Portland
3.  Dallas

It really, really makes me happy that Amare Stoudemire and Carmelo Anthony suck.  It shouldn't surprise anyone because that duo won't guard a stop sign.  They could, but they just won't.  I hope they lose every game as those are two of my least favorite players.  Portland should be better than they're showing.  They have a lot of young talent that is very good.  Maybe Brandon Roy being MIA has hurt them more than I expected.  Dallas should be better than this as well. It's shocking to see them in such a pitiful state.  I like Nowitzki, but this may be it for them as well. 

Here's a couple of teams that may make a move as the season progresses:
1.  Milwaukee
2.  Minnesota
3.  Sacramento

Milwaukee has a great little nucleus with Bogut, Jennings, etc. but I'm just not sold on Jennings.  He's a little too unpredictable and reminds me of OJ Mayo- not a guy to build your team around.  I AM a big fan of Minnesota, however.  I love Kevin Love  :awesome_for_real:, and Ricky Rubio could be the real deal if he could just hit a few shots.  They've shown the ability to beat tough teams, and with a little gelling this may be a team that sneaks into the playoffs.  Sacramento is even more talented, on paper, that the Wolves.  Tyreke Evans may not be a true PG, but he does well enough and Demarcus Cousins has a ton of talent, if he can keep his head screwed on straight.  I think the problem there was Paul Westhead, who I just can't understand how he gets hired.  He's a complete clusterfuck and the Kings seem to be doing much better since he left. 

So my prediction to win the title is Miami.  I think this is Lebron's year, and everyone else seems so unsettled.  They have the team to take down Chicago and I don't see any other real competition for them in the Eastern Conference.  The Western Conference should be won by either the Clippers or the Thunder.  I'm going to go out on a limb and take the Thunder (It's not too big of a limb as the Western Conference seems particularly weak this year).

I don't think Orlando belongs up there in the top three sure contenders category, Oklahoma does though.  And it's not because of the embarrassing loss we took yesterday, we are just not that good a team.

Yeah, Oklahoma City is definitely on the verge of being in the contenders.  I was hesitant to put them up there just yet due to the youth factor, but should probably go ahead and do it.  Orlando won't be up there at the end of the year, not because they aren't good but because Howard won't be there.  I can almost guarantee he will be traded, probably to the Lakers.

I liked Atlanta a lot before the Horford injury. However, if they can continue what they are doing AND get him back for the playoffs, I think they can make a run.

Now they just need to keep Josh Smith from jacking up 18 footers at the worst possible times.

Atlanta has a very good chance to win a couple of series in the playoffs, and even make it to the final four.  I don't see them winning the whole thing, however.  I think this is Lebron's year.  I personally think they should think about trading Wade for Howard.  I don't know if the numbers would work, but wouldn't that be a blockbuster?

Well they are leading their division without their top center, so I think Atlanta is playing above their heads atm.

Of those wins, 3 are against New Jersey, 2 against Charlotte and 1 against the Wizards, Cleveland and Minnesota.   :oh_i_see:

They did split with the Heat, however, and played them very tough (OT) in the game they lost, so maybe they're better than I'm giving them credit for.  That is the toughest division this year, by far.  They are getting ready to hit a road stretch and then a much tougher part of the schedule.  That will be where we really see what they are about.

My guess is New Jersey blinks first because they have a lot more to lose.  Brooks Lopez, Marshon Brooks, a lottery pick and houstons mid teens pick would actually not be a bad haul for howard.

I'm not sold on Howard.  Of course, I'm not sold on any center bringing home a title unless it's Shaq, and even then he had to have some pretty damned talented help with Koby. 

Howard is not going to bring you a title by himself, what he does is turn a team with players like Jameer Nelson and Hedo Turkoglu into a defensive powerhouse.  That team has never had another good defender on it and yet it is always near the top in team defense.  He also simply does not get tired ever and does not miss games.  You still need a go to scorer of all star caliber to go with him.  Simply surrounding him with three point shooters like Orlando has tried to do for so long is not reliable enough to win it all, they can shoot themselves to the finals or shoot themselves out of the first round.

Fucking crazy ass Jeremy Lin (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/4299/jeremy-lin) dropped 38 on the Lakers tonight to bring his four game average up to 28.5 ppg.  Before that he barely had gotten into any games.  In January he averaged about 9 minutes and 5.5 ppg.  Funny to think he was a Harvard grad, so didn't even get a scholarship to play in college.

Hawks took the Magic to the wire and then won in OT, despite some very very bad officiating in favor of Dwight. I honestly blame their coaching a lot for why they panic down the stretch.

People keep comparing Lin to Tebow because they are both devout christians forgetting the fact that Lin is winning because he is kicking fucking ass, not sucking and winning anyways.

He's also not proselytizing by means of his sport, either.  At least as far as I know. 

He's also non-denominational rather than a near-snake handlers, so there's that.

I consider them all bugfuck crazy. 

Best quote so far:

"Only in the NBA would the success of an Asian with economics degree from Harvard be a surprise."

This Lin thing is a pretty fantastic story.  Apparently, nobody has ever scored more points in his first three starts?  That's insane.  And then he drops 38 on Kobe and the Lakers?

Of course, the media will probably beat us to death with him. 

I think that explains everything  :awesome_for_real:

Kobe made it clear before that game that he wasn't impressed by the upstart and was going to deal with him.  He didn't exactly lay down the gauntlet (though he has now), but still.  He doesn't like leaving MSG of all places in that fashion.  So I leave my comment as it was.

I didn't watch the game so I don't know what actually happened and who was guarding who, etc.

I was just making a comment on the odd number of point guards who play like All-stars against the Lakers.

I was loving the compressed scheduled when the season began but the quality of basketball has really suffered and there are way too many injuries.

I think we can probably blame the fact that most of these guys were snorting coke off of hookers' asses in the offseason this year instead of training.  Plus there was no pre-season to get detoxed.

Flop so hard (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eOmJF7CmZ4&feature=player_embedded)

With all that flopping you'd think that Duke players would be better in the NBA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0upQDkY-pg). 

I stopped paying attention to the NBA once LeBron left Cleveland but Jeremy Lin has me watching again. I don't care about the Knicks at all but I'll root for that guy.

How could you not pull for the guy?  It's an amazing story.

And he did it again, apparently.  Sinks a game winning 3 with half a second remaining.  They've won six in a row now.  What the hell do they need with Carmelo Anthony anyway?

I hate the Knicks, but I can't help but root for this guy.

I personally think they would be better off without Anthony.  He has never been a guy that really elevates his team. 

Offer Melo and Chandler for Howard, win championships.

Players at the 2-3 position typically are your championship cogs, not centers.  Howard isn't Shaquille Oneal, and I doubt he would put this team over the top.  Melo could be that guy if he wasn't a fat, lazy piece of shit that won't play defense. 

I have to wonder if the turnovers in Lin's game are a deficiency or just a product of being asked to a lot in very little time.  Still, great story and something to make the NBA season for me worth following.

The high turnover rate could also be influence by the fact that the team around him is absolutely terrible, for the most part.


Also, you changed your name to Metta World Peace (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/7576926/los-angeles-lakers-mike-brown-metta-world-peace-meet-clear-air) and you really expect anyone to give a shit about you? 

Wait, what? Ron Artest changed his name to... METTA WORLD PEACE? SERIOUSLY?

This was even better watching the Lakers/Knicks game last week. "An elbow to the head from World Peace"  :why_so_serious:

Delicious, isn't it?  The guy that started a raging brawl in Indianapolis and got suspended for a year because of it named himself World Peace.

Greg Oden = Sam Bowie = done at a young age (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7595246/surgery-greg-oden-portland-trail-blazers-turned-third-microfracture). 

This guy just can't catch a break.  I think he could have gone down as one of the all time defensive/rebounding greats if his legs would have held up.  I guess that his acromegaly just wouldn't let him function correctly.  It's a pretty sad story, really. 

His career was over in 2007. People tried to say he could come back, but the reality is that one the knees become an issue for anybody that early who is 7ft? Game over.

That being said, it was still a stupid pick by Portland from the standpoint that even if he does work out, centers are getting marginalized in the NBA. The game is about power forwards and guards now, and has been for the last 5 years. Paul Pierce, Dirk Nowitzki, Kobe Bryant, Dwayne Wade, and Tony Parker are what you need to win championships.

None of those are power forwards.  Dirk may be listed as one, but he plays as a small forward. 

The game has been about shooting guards and small forwards since showtime and the Bird Era Celtics.  Shaq, Duncan and Olajuwan were the only centers to be really showcased in taking their teams to the finals, and Clyde Drexler and Koby were key components of those teams.  In the case of Shaq/Koby I would argue that Koby was the reason they won the last two titles when they were together.  I would also argue that if you don't have a super competitive, dead eye two guard you're stretching to win a title (even if it's just a guy that gets hot for the series, as Jason Terry showed us  last year).  Tim Duncan is really the only center that has willed his team to wins almost by himself, and I'm not even sure he's a true center.  The true center is a dead position.

A great example of what you need is Westbrook/Durant.  I think those guys have got it going on and will win some titles soon.  I like their chances almost as much as Lebron/Wade.

99-00 playoffs:

Shaq 30.7ppg 15.4rpg 3.1apg 56.6% eFG 30.5PER  0.224 win shares / 48
Kobe 21.1ppg 4.5rpg 4.5apg 47% eFG 19.3PER 0.116 win shares / 48

Between Nowitzk (and Chandler's defensive aptitude), Gasol, Garnett, the Wallaces, Duncan and Shaq I don't see how this is a small man's game. Things have changed but teams are still needing the best big men to win. Howard should really be included on that list, the Magic have had some really crap squads.

Nowitzki is still a PF, he's the 4th player, guards an opposing PF/C and spends a lot of his time in the post (esp. the high post). He just represents an evolution of the position where a big man who can shoot and drive will take advantage of a mismatch.

Posting up does not make one a power forward.  Michael Jordan was one of the best post up players to ever play the game.  Same for Kobe Bryant.  Neither does who you guard make you a power forward.  Nowitzki handles the ball a lot for that team. 

So what does make a modern power forward then? Nowitzki is not the only 4 who possesses these skills; Odom, Garnett, Love, Gasol and others do as well. His flexibility and ability to stretch the floor shows off his versatility and the changes in the PF position.

I would call Garnett and Odom more tall small forwards.  Love and Gasol are almost purely paint players and don't handle the ball a lot.  They are more of the traditional, yet highly skilled, power forward model. 

And Nowitski, Garnett and Odom aren't the "point forwards" of the past.  They don't distribute the ball.

Probably the most interesting name to me out right now is Lebron.  He's become much more of a paint player this year. 

The 2-4 positions have become so blurred due to the insane athleticism that some of these guys have.  The 2 and 3 positions are almost interchangeable.  The 3 and 4 positions not so much, but for guys like Nowitski, Garnett and Odom the overall play isn't that much different, they just take good advantage of their height.  Overall it makes for a very exciting brand of basketball.

My point is that the distinction is blurring, and that modern power forwards possess many of the skills that used to mainly be the domain of the outside players. This doesn't mean that those players are small forwards, it means that the power forward position itself has changed.

Yes, but you're still lumping them into a category primarily because of their size, not because of how they play.  Dirk is less of an outside player than he was during the first five years of his career, but his overall play matches that of many small forwards. 

How about this?  How about we call him a "forward" like the NBA page does, instead of lumping him into one distinction or another?   :awesome_for_real:

It looks like Rajon Rondo is officially on the trading block (http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/7631850/sources-boston-celtics-aggressively-trying-trade-guard-rajon-rondo). 

I can't help but believe that this guy will really, really help a quality team.  He's a regular with triple doubles.  But he seems like a real head case.  He butted heads with his college coach and now he's having trouble with Rivers.  If you put him on the Lakers you've got a contender again, in my opinion.  He might be a decent choice for the Spurs as well.  Popavich seems to do well with head cases. 

The Celtics want to trade their youngest good player?  :uhrr:

That is what I see as well, Ingmar.  There has to be a reason for it.  First, I don't think Rondo is quite the player to build a team around.  He's not going to carry a team like Durant or Lebron.  Second, he's had a reputation for being quite the head case.  That deal throwing the ball at the referee has been blown a bit out of proportion, but it shows a hot headed nature that I'm sure exists more in the locker room than we see here.  I have some first hand accounts of his behavior at Kentucky and, while he wasn't a complete idiot, he didn't take well to coaching there either. 

Interestingly, he's apparently an avid roller skater. 

The Celtics are getting ready to blow this thing up, imo. They are old as hell, and they don't like their young players (see Rondo). They want to dump salary, get some trade value and work through the draft to get some better picks.

Honestly they should dump everyone but KG.  He's a great player as a veteran, and I think would be a nice role model for a younger player that wanted to come in and work. 

Mike D'Antoni has "lost" the Knicks' locer room. (http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7684157/mike-dantoni-lost-new-york-knicks-locker-room-according-sources)  

Now really, who didn't see this coming once Carmelo Anthony came back from his injury.  The Knicks need to get rid of Anthony quickly, if they can.  Or just bench his ass and let him ride out the rest of his contract.  D'Antoni's system will work, when the players actually run it.  Anthony has ridden his national title to a well paid, yet lazily enacted, career.  


I wonder who that "one person" close to the situation is?  


And now apparently Dantoni has resigned (http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7686638/new-york-knicks-coach-mike-dantoni-resigns).  I can't believe that, in a Dantoni versus Melo drama, Anthony isn't the one being shown the door. 

Oy, Knicks.  :facepalm:

To go from Linsanity to this in such a short time is lulzworthy. Talk about blowing a huge opportunity because you have one guy on the team that's a total shithead.

I don't know what to think about the Warriors trade. I'm kind of inclined to think we somehow managed to not get value back for one of the most overrated players in the game.

Bogut is a decent inside presence when healthy.  He can get you 14 and 10 on a given night which is much better than the deadweight Kwame Brown.  But then again, he's not healthy.  I'm not, and never have been, a big Ellis fan.  I'm also not, and never have been, a huge Stephen Jackson fan.  He can score in droves but he's a locker room cancer and doesn't play defense unless he's super happy.  

I call it a lateral move, at best.  

Actually, I do see a positive-  this frees up a lot of time for Klay Thompson, who I really, really like.  He's a good player, plays defense, has good size and can shoot the ball.  He was the player of the future at that position anyway, really. 

I don't even follow basketball, especially the NBA, and I KNEW this shit would happen. Lin's point totals go down because he's dishing the rock more and Melo gets pissy because he suddenly isn't the focus of the offense anymore. Boo fucking hoo. You'd think he'd be happy that someone on the team can actually register an assist.

Anthony has ridden the success of that 2003 NCAA tournament his entire career.  The guy is a locker room cancer, a prima dona, and doesn't play a lick of defense.  The Knicks get everything they deserve for signing this slug and would do well to trade him ASAP.  I would also advise trading Lin while the goods are still hot.  I don't think he'll be able to swing it in most offenses.  He was made to play for Dantoni.

In other NBA news, it looks as if Howard has finally pissed the Magic ownership off enough to move him (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7686147/sources-orlando-magic-dwight-howard-opt-end-season). 



I think they should unload him soon.  There's no way that he sticks there after this year.  The Orlando Magic-  where young Centers go to die. 

And now it looks like he might opt in for the final year of this contract.  Fuck, stop playing with my emotions Dwight!  We beat Chicago Indiana and Miami this week, we play San Antonio tonight and the team is on a roll.

I wish he would stay in Orlando, too.  It could be a nice team if they would pony up for a decent PG and small forward/SG

The owner is very willing to pony up for whatever the front office can get but once you get in the cycle of being a quite not good enough to win it team there is really very little you can do to bring in better talent, you take risks in order to get over that last hunch (vince carter, jason richardson) that come saddled with bad contracts because absorbing those is the only thing you can offer.  If Howard does opt in though they have a ton of cap space for next year so they should be able to get another star and convince both of them to stay.

They should have gone after a better point guard years ago.  It was clear even in the 2009 finals that Jameer Nelson wasn't going to cut it long term.

I dunno, if Jameer doesn't wreck the Heat last night Howard might have been gone already.  He was injured that year and should never have played in the finals, but he got selected to the all star game.

Don't put too much stock in his offensive numbers (which are way down this year anyway), but he has always been a huge defensive liability.  He's way too short to guard anyone, really, and it shows when you play a top level PG.  They should have at least gotten a good defensive minded guard that could spell him at times. 

And now he is leaving again, god damnit i can't wait until tomorrow.

He's gone.  All this stuff now is just showboating and trying to piss off the Magic into trading him this year.

He doesn't wanna be traded at all.  He wants to go on a playoff run with Orlando rather than sit at home a year of his prime, he wants to join a New Jersey team with a lottery pick and lots of trade assets instead of a completely gutted team of just him and Deron.  Best situation for him would be for orlando to try to keep him, the problem with that is that not gutting new jersey just makes it a much more appealing destination.

So were the Knicks just tanking to get rid of D'Antony?

Well, they played well for him when Anthony was injured.  Then Anthony comes back and they stink again.  Then D'Antoni leaves and they're good again.  Maybe it was D'Antoni that was tanking for Carmelo?

Then again, it seems a common theme in sports that when the old coach goes out, the team is suddenly invigorated, wanting to prove something for themselves and their new boss.  At the end of the day, Carmelo Anthony is still a giant douche and therefore the Knicks can fuck themselves.  Lin is the only reason this team is a little interesting, and he has been forced to fade into the background to make room for Carmelo's giant douchiness.

While Jeremy Lin is tearing it up in NYC Stephon Maybury just took his bottom of the barre Chinese basketball team to championship, and after averaging 33 pts and like 6 assist in the finals and scoring 40 in the deciding game he couldn't win the MVP because its for chinese only.  Nice to see him doing good though.

Don't look now, but Rajon Rondo and the Celtics are starting to heat up (http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=320401002). 

This shortened season could play into their hands very well, what with the ancient creaking bones and all.  They've struggled with injuries in prior years and the shorter year could keep them healthy enough to make a deep run in the playoffs.  When healthy they can still be deadly, as seen in this beatdown of the Heat.

The Heat are in a pretty big slump though.

And they never play well in Boston..

They are 15-5 in their last 20 games and now leading their division.  I'm expecting a nice playoff run. 

The only problem with this scenario is fuck the Celtics.

I love the Celtics.   :grin:

Well, Dwight Howard is out for the season (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7834605/orlando-magic-dwight-howard-back-surgery-miss-rest-season). 


This seems a little odd to me.  Anyway, watch the Magic make the finals without his ass.   :awesome_for_real:

So I went to the Spurs/Lakers game last night.  I had someone give me seats that were quite good (it's the only way I would ever be able to get them  :awesome_for_real:) and it was my second time sitting non-nosebleeds. 

A couple of thoughts from the game:

1.  I know Koby just got off of injury, but he's definitely lost a step.  And he's possibly lost the "it" that made him so damned deadly in the early 2000's. 
2.  Andrew Bynum is a complete headcase, but holy fuck he is huge.  His legs are longer than Tony Parker, I think.  Overall I'm not terribly impressed with his game.
3.  Ron Artest, ahem Metta World Peace, is a gigantic dude.  I'm fairly certain he's been on the 'roid train in his life.  He definitely wasn't that big in college, and with his history of temper issues.....
4.  Manu Ginobili is freaky good.  He gets the utter hell beaten out of him every game and isn't terribly athletic, but when his three pointer is falling the guy is ridiculous. 
5.  Tim Duncan still has it a little bit.  Also, we sat about 5 seats away and 3 rows back from his wife, who is super hot and actually doesn't seem very high maintenance. 
6.  NBA arenas are fucking loud.  Not with fans, but with all sorts of extraneous bullshit that is questionable at best when considering whether or not it is "entertainment".
7.  Kawhi Leonard was a great pickup for the Spurs.  The guy rebounds like crazy and plays super defense in addition to stroking the three. 

After seeing this game I think that the Spurs are clicking well on all cylinders.  Kawhi Leonard was the missing piece that they didn't have last year.  I'm actually expecting to see the Spurs in the finals and feel that they'll win it in this shortened season.  Then I expect that Tim Duncan will retire, and wouldn't be surprised to see Ginobili retire as well. 

There were whispers that he was exaggerating his injury because he refused to play for Van Gundy anymore, but i think having a season ending surgery that might even keep him out of training camp next season pretty much disproves that.

Remember, his name is Metta World Peace (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/4/22/2967353/video-ron-artest-throws-elbow-gets-ejected#storyjump/in/2731470?sct=hp_t2_a6).  

Edit:  Seriously, you should watch this nasty ass elbow he throws at James Harden.   :ye_gods:

He's still claiming it wasn't intentional, i hope they come down hard on him.

One would think that he should be banned permanently.  I mean, for fuck's sake, the guy waded into the fan section at Auburn Hills and started punching people.  He's a menace. 

They won't do that. He'll get a first series suspension at best.

Well of course they won't do it.  They clearly showed that they care fuck all about image when they didn't ban him for life after the Auburn Hills incident. 

It's the NBA. They THRIVE on the thug image.

Bullshit, they've gone to extremes to squash the thug image.

Besides, real thugs play hockey.

Yeah, except for that completely insane dress code or how your next great player has all his tattoos hidden under his jersey.  The NBA really loves the thug imagery.

NBA players get banned for fixing games or drugs. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_players_banned_or_suspended_by_the_NBA)  Artest had the longest suspension ever for the Melee, even longer than Spree trying to kill his own coach.

Didn't say David Stern liked it. I said they THRIVE on it.

A player hasn't been permanently banned from the NBA in two decades. The few that did get banned got back in. They will absolutely ban you for associating with organized crime and gambling, or for being unable to get your shit together over narcotics.

The rest? You'll get suspended, and that's it. Players have gone into the stands a couple times in the last decade, not banned. Bench clearing brawls? Suspended 10 games. Felony gun charge? 7 game suspension. Reckless driving that kills a man? Seven games. Pulling guns on each other in the actual lockerroom? 50 games. Not banned. In fact, he's gone on to play two more seasons subsequent to that.

The NBA can dress it up, or say they are taking control of the situation, but they aren't. The track record under Stern is anything but.

I've seen enough neck tattoos to know that the "thug image" is barely contained underneath all the glitz and glamour.  They've done a decent job at trying to hide it, I suppose, but Stern doesn't want it to go away completely.  It's marketing.

No one bans for that shit either.  MLB has a couple of bans that have stuck for non-drugs/steroids/gambling, NHL suspensions haven't even passed a half-season yet, and NFL personal conduct suspensions are hilariously short given some the events.

And ghost... wow.  Just wow man.

That's because people in baseball aren't dumb enough to go wandering around the clubhouse with guns.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-02-21/sports/27056861_1_gun-problem-weapons-policy-deadly-weapons (http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-02-21/sports/27056861_1_gun-problem-weapons-policy-deadly-weapons)

Nobody fucks with the Goose.

7 game suspension for Artest.  The NBA is a bunch of idiots. 

Color me not shocked.  :awesome_for_real:

Um, yeah.  Billy Hunter may be in some totally deep shit (http://tracking.si.com/2012/04/25/report-billy-hunter-tried-to-invest-nbpas-millions-in-sons-failing-bank/?sct=hp_t2_a11&eref=sihp). 


This is a huge deal.  Embezzling money isn't cool, and it makes sense that Derrick Fisher is getting his shit together now. 

That is massive. What I read said that Fisher was voted out because Hunter turned the players against him.

Wonder why Hunter might do that?   :why_so_serious:

And Rose just tore his ACL at the end of a blowout, fuck.

That really, really sucks.  I like Rose a lot. 

Meanwhile Orlando shockingly steals one on the road.  Check out the Duhon dance in the back:
(http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/full/569350985.gif?key=480270&Expires=1335665057&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA&Signature=xeQVeGLzRuX40lrTHDCBKW-sNAWd1YnZL2gDiOQfYBobFolPowlDh184mD2t2Pb0lldUxvdSIxc43n40gxo1DyuGwb7RPd4PWw4q~1NVyVr4NQkQoFAG-mVzp7T5vYQipFJOWre7~6527OeL-aMVRwg7MIbbme1K-HDKNvK55Oc_)

Wow.  Crazy ass comeback by the Clippers last night.  They were down by as much as 27, and 21 in the fourth quarter.  This team could be good if they played entire games.

Yeah, that was a great comeback.  Too bad it had to be a team like the Clippers against a team like Memphis.

Chris Paul is hard for me to like. 

Since Jay Z is involved with the design and promotion of the Brooklyn Nets (http://www.nba.com/nets/index_main.html), I expect that they will be extremely popular in the very near future. 

(http://www.netsstore.com/images/products/1053_large5.jpg)

Hawks beating the Celtics is really pissing off everyone at ESPN. I'm loving the tears, since they already counted out Atlanta in basically ever projection. What will happen if Atlanta wins, OMGNOBODYWILLWATCHTHEM!

It wouldn't be surprising to see the Hawks Magic and 76'ers in the second round.

There has to be some sort of penalty for taking yourself out of the playoffs by punching glass right? that dumb fucker can't be getting paid.

That was pretty awful.  One has to wonder what had him pissed more, losing or watching Carmelo play shitty defense and shoot 26 shots.  Twelve of 26 isn't bad, but he shot 3 of 15 the previous game.  The guy's a loser. 

New York just earned the record for longest playoff losing streak, ever.  Last time they won a playoff game 9/11 hadn't happened yet.

The whole game was awful. Nobody could score anything and Lebron was on the bench with 4 fouls forever. Then, when he came back in the 4th quarter, it was like the Heat just decided they were tired of playing badly.

Carmelo again gets 20+ points while everyone else plays like shit on the Knicks. Steve Novak is usless. Baron Davis is useless. JR Smith went 5/18 and 0/5 beyond the arc. That's piss-poor in the Missouri Valley Conference, let alone the NBA.

In other news, the Mavs are stuffed, basted, and about 48 minutes from being completely done.

Yeah, Anthony shot 7-23 and played lazy defense.  He played as shitty as the rest of them.

So what you're saying is that he had a pretty good night.

 :drill:

So the Spurs absolutely crushed the Clippers last night.  The Heat look very beatable, the Bulls are out, Boston is old.  OKC looks pretty damned good though. 

Right now I'm picking either the Spurs or OKC to bring home the trophy, most likely OKC but I'm not sure that they'll have a good answer for Tony Parker.  I love the way Westbrook and Durant are playing right now. 

I hope Lebron James realizes that this is as good as it is going to get.  If he doesn't win it in the next couple of years he's going to be washed up trade bait.  It's not like he can trade up to a better team.  Of course it may be that his best bet for winning a title is playing second fiddle to a guy like Kevin Durant.... :uhrr:

Heat are still going to win the series. But losing Bosh is a HUGE deal for them.

Wade was awful in that game, and Battier was beyond awful. That won't happen again.

But even when Wade and Battier weren't awful they still lost.....  :oh_i_see:

They still didn't have Bosh, which makes their interior dreadful. 

Seriously, the James hate has gone from trendy to just tiresome.  Drop it.

You mean the second game? The one where Joel Anthony played 35 minutes at Center with no points? Or the one where Mario Chalmers shot 20% from the field? Or where Mike Miller scored 0 points in 17 minutes?

Rasix-  I like Lebron.  I hope he wins the title this year because he's amazing and doesn't deserve the reputation of Karl Malone.  But he still needs to get in there and own shit like he's capable of.  And I do think he made a mistake leaving Cleveland (not because of how he did it) but because they were right on the cusp of having a great squad.

Paelos-  Yep.  That was the whole point.  


Addendum:  looks like the Heat cancelled their practice today (http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2012/story/_/id/7946016/2012-nba-playoffs-miami-heat-cancel-practice-media-availability-friday).  I realize these guys are professionals and probably don't need to practice at this point, but there is definitely something down with this team.  And I don't think it's just Bosh being out.  The team did very well in a stretch over season where Bosh was out.  I really don't think the Heat will win this series, Paelos.

The Heat are going to win game 4, ghost.

George Hill has been playing out of his mind for 2 games straight. Everytime he's gone for 20+, the next game has been a complete dog.

The key for Miami is to go at the Pacers and get them in foul trouble. Outside of the starting 5 on the Pacers? No threats on that bench, period. Get the Georges into foul issues, or their Center? Miami will crush them.

Should we gamble on it?   :grin:

Uh, no they didn't.  They were 4 - 5 in the regular season without Bosh.  The Heat could survive losing either James or Wade since those two have a similar game, but they can't survive without Bosh since he's the one who their offense runs through, even when he's not the one scoring points.  It seems like if there's ever a time Miami needs to practice, it would be now since they need to make some major adjustments if they want to have a prayer of pulling out this series. 

Sure. The loser publically admits in this thread that they don't know the NBA this season, and acknowledges the sports prowess of the other. You in?

That's fine.  I was thinking something more substantial, like a game on steam (20 bucks or less). 

Pfft, I'll save that for bigger bets than one game in a series. If you want to bet on the NBA champion, I'm game.

Now or when the finals hit?

I think we should wait until the final teams are set.

I'm willing to wait until the final four to pick a bet.

My answer will still be the Thunder.

I'm thinking Spurs but I don't follow the NBA real closely.

You take Thunder, I'll take the Spurs (although I believe that the Thunder will pull it out and win as well).  

Pacers in 6.  They will win game 4.

https://twitter.com/#!/dandakich/status/203513790837428224

Yea I think that sums things up.

I don't want to live in a world where I have to respect Chris Bosh's abilities as a professional basketball player.  As such, I would like the Heat to pull this series out before going up in smoke.

I want them to play the Thunder simply because I can yell out THUNDERHEAT! at my office a lot.

Also, they have the best players. The Pacers are so boring that not even their own fans showed up to watch them in the regular season.

I like Roy Hibbert.  Other than that I could care less about the Pacers.  They've got a pretty good team of no-name guys though.

I don't know if you guys have seen this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=8DnKOc6FISU#!) yet, but it's a Pepsi Max commercial with Kyrie Irving all decked out as an old man schooling some guys in a pickup game.  It's pretty cool. 

That's fucking awesome.  The problem with the Heat is that without Bosh they have the two best players on the court and the Pacers have the next eight.  Both Wade and Lebron have to play like superstars now, and while they are both clearly capable of it an off night by either means a loss.

MMMMMM. Tastes like victory!  :grin:

I thought we had foregone the childish gloating and kowtowing bet over the tangible asset bet on Spurs versus OKC (if they make it past the Lakers).   :awesome_for_real:

That's fine, but you have to acknowledge that I was right on all counts about that game. Miami did go after the bucket and got the Pacers into foul trouble. The starting 5 are all the Pacers can hang their hat on.

I still like OKC going the distance.

I do?  I thought it was self evident that you were.  

Just think, you could have already had your $20 Steam game if you'd have bet on that game.  I think either the Spurs or OKC wins the title.  The East is pretty weak this year.

Addendum-  my understanding is that you've picked OKC and I've picked the Spurs in our bet.  Is that correct? 

Yep. $20 steam bet on OKC, assuming they make it through to the next round, and the Spurs do as well.

In the event that neither OKC or the Spurs win, it's a push. In the event that either team doesn't make the next round, it's a push.

*$20 and/or the term dollars or cash does not actually represent actually currency or value if anybody from the state gaming commission or IRS happens to be watching said forum. Details of any and all natures related to the winner of the bet will be worked out via Steam and/or F13 PMs.

Oh, so you're bailing if your team doesn't make it to the next round?

Yep, because at that point they will have blown a 3-1 lead, which is statistically unlikely, and on top of that I'm not even sure the Spurs are actually good given who they played.

Our bet is on. I'm still waiting to hear more from the Heat/Lebron haters after the last two games on both TV or radio. It's gone eeeeeeeeeerily quiet.

Facebook is silent.  My ragey brother-in-law hasn't made a baby Bron-bron comment in days.

Remember that last year Lebron was playing out of this world until the finals. They'll come back.

Ohh yah.  I don't think Miami can win it. It's only a matter of time.  Fatigue will set in with the amount of minutes Lebron and Wade have to play.

It's hard to bash a guy that throws down 40 points, 18 boards and 9 assists.  But that's been the issue with James for his entire career-  he can't seem to replicate this stat line on a regular basis.  Everyone knows that he has the talent to dominate every game that he plays in, but for whatever reason he doesn't.  He seems like a good guy, doesn't get into trouble and is a spectacular talent.  It's tough to dislike him, in my opinion, even with the disaster that was "the decision".  That doesn't change the fact that time is creeping up on him as far as being the central guy in an offensive set like Miami's.  If he doesn't win the title in the next 2-3 years it probably isn't going to happen with him being "the guy".  

I want Miami in the finals simply because it'll be great for the sport. Also, I absolutely cannot stand Boston.

Unless you live or are from Cleveland and have that city loyalty thing going. Granted, Modell is the pinnacle of loathing in that town, but LeBron is second... a distant second, but still.

Boston was my team growing up and I really like Rondo.  He's a hell of a talent too.  I don't really care who comes out of the East as long as it remains somewhat competitive.  Either the Spurs or OKC will be a hard matchup, so we've got a pretty good finals coming our way.  

Stern has his fingers crossed for an OKC v. Heat matchup.

Having all his young big named superpowers in one finals would be a huge draw.

It really would be Stern's wet dream.  The Spurs are on a mission though.  They know that this is their last real chance.  I suspect that Tim and possibly Manu will retire after the season if they win the title, so they're going to leave it all on the court. 

I don't think this is the Spurs last real chance, those guys simply reload and come back with a contender every couple years.  This might be Duncans last shot, at least as a big piece of the team.

OKC made it closer on the road against the Spurs than I thought they would. They might be able to steal game 2 if they can keep the intensity through the 4th quarter.

This seems like one that will go 7 games.

Will probably be a better series than the finals  :awesome_for_real:

I don't think so.  These are 4 really good teams.

The Eastern side of things has been abysmal to watch. Even the ESPN talking heads can't get behind it.

It's certainly not the return of Show Time versus Bird, et. al.

Ever since Rose went down its been "Alright, so let's wait for the Heat to get to the finals."  Even the 2 day panic during which they tried to hype up the pacers didn't make it actually interesting...  I listen to way too much ESPN radio..

These drives of Paul Pierce are causing me physical pain.  Celtics are just so goddamn old.  It would be interesting to see them play OKC just for the comedy factor.

I would love to see Rondo play for the Heat or the Lakers.

Nation Mesmerized By Spurs' Dazzling Pass-Screen-Pass-Shoot Brand Of Offense (http://www.theonion.com/articles/nation-mesmerized-by-spurs-dazzling-passscreenpass,28331/)

 :awesome_for_real:

Also i think the Magic with Howard would have put up a much better fight against a Boshless Miami than the Pacers did.

The game between Boston and Miami last night was another unwatchable clunker.

The Celtics continue to suck shooting the ball, as they only hit 39.5%, and 52.4% of their free throws.

Miami shot 50% from the floor and still only put up 93 points? Ugh. The Vegas over/under before the game started was a paltry 179. It still went under. Compared to the back and forth awesomeness of the Thunder/Spurs series, this is a joke so far.

52% of free throws is goddamn criminal.

The Celtics are currently putting a beatdown on Miami just at half.  I'm sure that the Heat will come back and make it close (if not win), but it's pretty much all Rondo right now.

Addendum:  Heat making a big push-  turning into a hell of a game.

This is what I've wanted to see out of the East all playoffs and haven't gotten. Great game with a great finish.

Second overtime playoff game of the night. :drill:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Lsob3td-dA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Lsob3td-dA)

THUNDERSTRUCK!  :drill:

Next video can we get more highlights and fewer self-congratulations?

Thanks!

OKC played with greater intensity in the second half of all of their wins.  I was impressed by their hunger and intensity for such a young team. 

Well, they clearly have a lot more talent than the Spurs, who, aside from Tony Parker, should be out on the court with canes and walkers. 

I disagree.  I think that Ginobili and Duncan still have a lot of game left in them.  OKC just showed that NBA basketball is a 4 quarter game and you need to have spring and quickness all 4 quarters if you want to be competitive.  San Antonio did well all season by making better decisions to offset their age.  They just didn't capitalize on it as well this year in the playoffs. 

Interestingly, Boston is doing what San Antonio couldn't.  They are using their ball movement to offset their lack of youth.  Having a young PG in Rondo certainly helps though. 

Westbrook, Harden and Durant have way more athleticism and overall game than Parker, Duncan and Ginobili have, and I love the Spurs.  Ginobili is my favorite player, but he just doesn't have the athletic ability to keep up with some of the younger stars. 

Got real quiet around the league now that Lebron went off.

Twice.

Guess the haters are just stewing.

Lebron has been doing this for years.  Expect him to wilt in the finals. 

The better he plays the more it makes him look like a bitch for going to the Heat actually.

Wow.

So if he wins, will yall finally stop? Can he literally DO anything to change the opinions of the haters?

I think there's a section of people who, if he wins a championship, will revise their opinion on him, but there's an equally large (or larger) section of people who will change their line from 'he can't win a title' to 'he can't win a title without other superstars/he can't win it more than once' ..the guy is held up to an 'MJ or bust' level that is kind of ridiculous.

Anybody that continues to spout hate at Lebron IF he wins the title this season has gone off the deep end.

The "hate" comes from him wanting to build a superteam and win easy championships rather than trying to be the player someone of his talent level should be.  Someone with the talent of Lebron should look at players like Wade and Bosh and think "those guys are great, i want to beat them", not "those guys are great, i bet we could win seven championships without any effort if we teamed up".  If Bird, Magic and Dr J had done the same in 80s Lebron would be flipping burgers.  So, no winning isn't going to make him look any less like a bitch.  And damn freaking right he is held up to an "MJ or bust" level, that is the kind of player he IS.

I don't agree, there's a lot of talented players in the NBA and no such thing as an easy championship, and wanting to play with the best players possible isn't being a bitch, it's common sense.

Actually, yes.  I'm sure this will surprise you, but the best way for Lebron to shut up his detractors is to play like a fucking beast and own OKC. 

Lebron has more talent in his pinky toe than 99% of the NBA.  At what point is it "hating" to say that the guy is choke city?  I actually like Lebron, but I'm not going to bet the keys to my house on his play (maybe just a copy of Torchlight 2  :awesome_for_real:).  I also hate when superstars like Karl Malone and Charles Barcley, who were fucking amazing, never could get it done.  I really don't want Lebron to be in that boat.  The dude could be fucking Magic Johnson and Michael Jordan combined if he'd just be the guy.  Look what he did in game 4 of the Indiana series-  40 points, 18 boards and 9 assists.  That is godlike.  If you look at the numbers on his games, when he hits 12 baskets or more they almost always win.  I mean seriously, the guy fucking owned the last two games of the Celtics series. 

But he always chokes.  Always.   :grin:

I wouldn't see losing to OKC as a choke, Durant and Westbrook are clearly not as talented as Lebron and Wade but their supporting cast is far better.  Last year though was a total choke job almost entirely on Lebrons shoulders.

Lebron's been to the finals three times, counting this one.  He should win it.  He's better than Durant, overall, Wade is better than Westbrook and I'd call Bosh/Harden a wash. 

Really you should call it the "big 4" for each team, because Mario Chalmers and Serge Ibaka are both very good and have played well for their teams.  Both are averaging double figures and both are pretty lame at their secondary duty (i.e. rebounding for Ibaka and assists for Chalmers). 

When you look at the top 4 players for both teams it really is pretty damned similar, although I'd take Wade's experience with the NBA finals over Westbrook and LBJ's versatility over Durant. 

Looking at the other guys, I like OKC's guys much, much better.  Sefalosha and Perkins are both pretty good, and it's tough not to appreciate Derek Fischer.  The dude's been on a ton of really good teams.  Looking at the Heat, it's surprising that they can't find better scrubs than what they have.  Haslem is tough, when he's healthy.  Miller sucks.  James Jones?  Really?  Joel Anthony sucks.  I like Turiaf when he's healthy. 

So summary-  top 5 favors Miamuh but the bench of OKC is, I would say, marginally better, not necessarily good enough to get them over the top. 

I can see getting on Miami because at times they just don't seem to give a fuck early in the series. Game 5 is a great example. It's like, wow guys did you really just lose on your home court because you didn't want to play tonight? Because that's what it looked like.

As for the rest of Lebron and the decision, I could care less at this point. I'm not going to waste time defending Cleveland. It's undefendable. Anybody that gets sent there professionally or through the draft should do everything in their power to get out of the misery factory.

To me a guy like Dwight Howard is much more offensive. He's in a good city with a good program, and he's still a complete shithead.

And even he's no Andrew Bynum.

Orlando isn't a good program, in a few years they've turned a championship contender into a first round team with their horrible front office moves.  They've gotten steadily worse year after year and have neither assets nor cap space to improve.  With or without Dwight that team needs a few rebuilding seasons.

It sounds like the Spurs may be trying to go after Garnett.  That would be a nice place for him to end his career. 

To me a good program doesn't just include recent history. They were in the finals in 2009. Regardless of the decisions from the last 3 years, the Magic are one of the few programs that have filled up their arena every season since 2006. The fans want it.

If they would have stopped dicking around and got themselves a real point guard they would have been fine.

But from the perspective of a player planning where to spend his career future prospects matter more than past history.  Dwight is looking at a team with zero assets, zero cap space, a very inept front office and the prospect of having to face a super team every year in the playoffs for the foreseeable future.

Okay, what's your playoff prediction?  I'm going Heat in 6. 

OKC in 6.

Yeah, this.

OKC in 7.

We got ourselves a ballgame folks!

I have to go with OKC in 6. 5 if Westbrook remembers that there are 4 other guys on the court with him. The young guns of the Thunder have shown time and again that they can outlast the older guys on opposing teams. Admittedly, I am biased, since I live in OKC, but I stand by what I said.

This is fucking awesome.  Rome asks Stern if he fixed the draft draw for the Hornets (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8048426/nba-commissioner-david-stern-radio-host-jim-rome-get-lottery).  Hilarity ensues.



 :awesome_for_real:

I am probably one of the two or three people on earth that actually like David Stern.  He's a hardass and a smartass.  I think that the chances of this draft being fixed are really, really fucking slim.  Conspiracies in the age of cellphone cameras, leaks and whistleblowers just don't really happen as often as we'd like to think. 

It's probably not fixed. Then again, the fact they do it behind closed doors is beyond ridiculous. When you're already being a unique snowflake in your draft process, so much so that it's rare when the worst team in the league actually gets the first pick, the last thing you should be doing is obscuring the results.

I don't mind Stern, but I don't think he's done the NBA any favors in the last 3 years. In fact, I think he's largely overstepped his bounds. The negotiations, the Chris Paul thing, and the ridiculous lottery "outcomes" have all done more to hurt the NBA than help it.

They had the same issues back when Ewing was drafted and it never amounted to anything.  It's all BS.  And the NBA has never been more popular.  The finals this year are a nice deal for the NBA.

Sports in general have never been more popular with the advent of HDtv becoming commonplace tech. That doesn't mean that the commissioners are affecting that change.

Maybe.  Maybe not.  Stern is still a funny, ruthless son of a bitch.  And I like that.

Bear in mind, I have no problem with him going after Rome. I thought it was downright hilarious when he accuses Rome of pouting after Stern said he made a career out of these cheap thrills. Jim Rome is nothing more than a glorified shockjock who is trying to remain relevant on a network that has horrible sports coverage. ABC, FOX, and CBS all blow NBC out of the water.

Jim Rome is and always has been a complete douchecock.

I wish I could find it. There is a good article written by one of the journalists who was in the room when the lottery was done. The real one, not what they show on TV. If anyone reads that and still thinks its fixed they have bigger problems. Jim Rome has that information and he was asking a dishonest question.

Because he's a douchecock. And Stern was right, he's made a career out of being a douchecock.

The moron put a bounty on Gordie Howe. That alone should warrant him having his head kicked in a few times. I salute Stern on this one.

This. I've never really understood how he manages to have a career. The Jim Everett thing should have put him off the air for good and that was years and years ago.

There's a ton of douchebags that continue to have jobs in sports media.  It's almost a pre-requisite.

Well, the Heat take home court advantage.   :grin:

I don't think the Heat will win three (would be four I guess counting tonight) in a row though. If they want the title they'll probably have to win another in OKC.

OKC ain't going to win shit if they continue to refuse playing in the first quarter.  When did Shane Battier turn into Reggie Miller?

I am appauled that OKC has to send Hardin out there to score ANY points in the first quarter with Westbrook and Durant on the court. Magic was absolutely right to slam Westbrook for his PG play at halftime.

We'll know better once they play a game in Miami. 

If Shane Battier came down to earth and the Thunder play on the first quarter this games wouldn't be very close.  Miami has given up huge leads in both games, if last nights game had gone a minute longer they'd be down 2-0 now.

Battier is a hell of a shooter.  Earlier in his career he was an almost 40% three point shooter.

It's not so much that Miami can't close out games as that they're playing a much better line-up down the stretch.  Perk just needs to not be on the floor when Miami is playing without a proper big, he's not doing much.

Sebastian Pruiti's Grantland piece is a good overview if you're just going to read one of these, (http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/29751/oklahoma-citys-bigs-problem)
Zach Lowe from SI covers the offensive issues leaving Perkins in against Miami's small lineup creates, (http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2012/06/15/thunder-heat-finals-lineups/) and
Rob Mahoney from the NYT explains why Battier is ripping OKC apart at the start. (http://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/06/15/why-the-thunders-starting-lineup-isnt-working/)

He was a 32% shooter this season, this series he's shooting almost 70%.

Well, he's old.  It's not as shocking to see him shooting at a high level as it would be to see, say, Elton Brand suddenly shooting 50 plus percent from three.

It's a statistical anomaly. It just happens as the right time for us to notice.

Him shooting well is a statistical anomaly? 

Yes? Hot streaks like that are basically the same as runs at the craps table or what happens when I play Paelos in Blood Bowl. With a larger sample size he will inevitably regress to his career average.

My point was that he has traditionally been a pretty good shooter, except for the past couple of years.  It's not unheard of for him to go on hot streaks. 

And my point is him going 9-13 beyond the arc is not normal for any shooter, especially since he shoots 38% on his career.

It would not be atypical for a career 40% three point shooter to have streaks of this sort.  He's a good shooter.  It's really not that baffling.

1 game, sure. 2 games in a row? No, you're simply wrong. Battier hasn't done that all season. He's never gone two games in a row this season shooting <50% beyond the arc with more than 5 tries a game.

It is baffling because it's been completely absent. In fact, the last time this came up for Battier was in April of 2009, when he went 8-15 in 3 pointer across back to back games. You're talking about the 3 year gap, and it just happened to surface in the playoffs.

Note Shane Battier hit 2-2 three pointers tonight.   :grin:

Watched the game.  I feel like the foul trouble for Durant was the difference.  The Heat feel iffy to me.  They are great when everything is running on all cylinders, but they all too often get into this mode where they just sort of run down the shot clock and try to take jump shots, and it can get ugly. 

Should be a good series, can still go either way as far as I am concerned.

Watching OKC and Miami makes me realize how pointless every single other team is.  One star teams like Chicago really would have zero chance against either of them.

Chicago is very, very good when Derrick Rose is healthy.  I'd give them a shot against both of these teams.

I haven't watched any NBA for many years now, but watched this game last night at a bar.

I know it was always iffy, but have they just totally stopped calling traveling?  Christ.

If you're driving to the hoop? Yah.  Take 4 steps and a jump.  They don't seem to care.

If you're standing still?  They will call it every time.

Yeah this is why I can't watch the NBA.

They've actually changed the walking rule in the NBA to two steps once you suspend your dribble.  I honestly don't care all that much.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jkn0jOfOMgI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jkn0jOfOMgI)

Ugh.

Yeah, it really makes the games un-watchable for me.  Being able to run to the hoop as much as you want for that sweet dunk destroys the game.  Make the talentless assholes actually play for it!

Oh well, I still have international ball.  I recall watching the refs rip apart our players with constant traveling calls at the last Olympics.  It was quite enjoyable.  This time around should be equally fun.

The crab dribble may not pass Olympic scrutiny.

Michael Jordan, you are an idiot (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8070083/sources-charlotte-bobcats-hire-mike-dunlap-coach).....

How bad do you think they'll fuck up the draft?

I'm not sure that was as much Michael Jordan being an idiot as no one wanting to coach the damn Bobcats.

Dude, there has to be at least someone that has the stones to coach the Bobcats.  Fucking Pat Ewing would have been better.

Addendum-  and by this I mean the actual act of putting a penis into Pat Ewing's ass would have been better than hiring some college assistant from a team with a losing record.

Nobody wants to work for Jordan. That's the issue. He's undoubtedly the worst boss in the NBA.

The only person that could have made anything out of that job would have been Jackson because he would have been able to somewhat control Jordan.  Jordan may actually be a worse administrator than Isaiah Thomas. 

Hold on, Isaiah Thomas is a downright criminal. Jordan is just a hopeless gambler.

But they both have gotten equally shitty results.  I'm not concerned about the methods of their ineptitude, just the end result of their idiocy.

Oh Westbrook. That may be the play that haunts you for the rest of the year.

It's tough to fault Westbrook.  The dude shot over 60% from the floor, had 7 rebounds, 5 assists and a steal.  The rest of the team lost the game, even considering a pivotal play.

I don't fault him. I just said it would haunt him.

The Thunder have no chance at beating the Heat the way they are playing right now. Hardin is absent, Ibaka can't get any points down low, and Durant refuses to rebound. I mean shit, when one of your forwards is getting outrebounded consistently by your point guard?

It would be interesting to see how good Durant would be if he didn't have Westbrook on his team.  Russel Westbrook is very, very good.  Hell, he may end up being better than Durant.  He reminds me a lot of Isaiah Thomas.

John Hollinger has an insider article (http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2012/story/_/page/wizhornetsdeal-120620/new-orleans-hornets-get-better-end-deal-washington-wizards) on ESPN about the recent Okafor/Ariza trade to the Wizards.  It's hilarious and spot on. 


And people wonder why these teams continue to suck.  This was just a miserable trade. 

Dear lord the officials just want this series over. Not that Miami won't win otherwise, but good lord just let them PLAY. They don't need your help, refs.

This championship is OVER. Lebron is going to the hoop finally. Forget it OKC, you got no answers for that.

And he has 11 assists.  They're putting the hammer down now.

Mike Miller is absolutely unconscious. My god.

Yeah, it's pretty bad when you get beaten by Shane Battier, but at least he plays good defense.  Getting beaten by Mike Miller is unconscionable.  

Interestingly, Miller and Battier are shooting a combined 10-15 from three as of now.

It'll be a quiet day from the haters tomorrow.

Then, by next year they'll be back talking about how he couldn't do it alone or some shit.

Yeah, because Jordan didn't have Pippen (or Rodman).  

Internet, especially Facebook, is soooo quiet.  I need to find some obnoxious animated gifs to get them agitated.

Good for the Heat, I honestly didn't think they'd win this series.  I thought the Thunder were just too young, too talented, and too fearless.  I never pick the finals right.

I think the defining moment of the night is when they went up big in the first half and Mario Chalmers started playing to the crowd.  James walked over and just shook his head saying "not yet."  The last 3 playoff series has turned LeBron James into that killer people said he needed to be.  Pure business until the job is done.  The rest of the league has more to fear from him than ever.

Yay! I'm so excited!


That it's over!

Sports radio will finally shut up about it.

Yeah, I've never understood the "can't do it by himself" argument (which had already started from sources).  Magic had Kareem and Worthy, Bird had McHale and Parrish and Johnson, Koby had Shaq and then an assortment of really, really good players, Jordan had Pippin, Duncan had Manu and Parker and Robinson.  Incidentally, I think that Jordan had the weakest cast of supporting players, but some of them (Horry, for example, who has more rings than any of the guys above) appeared to be very average players that went on to win a ton of titles.  The NBA isn't a league in which you can Iverson your way to the top. 

With this win Lebron has firmly entrenched himself in the top 50 of all time because there can never be a "well, he didn't win a title" conversation like you could have with Iverson, Malone and Barcley.  Good for him.  He's lost his choke status.  Now if he wants to cement himself with the legends mentioned above he'll just need to win a couple more titles.  That may be difficult as the Thunder look very, very dangerous and they will learn from this loss.

The 'shortened season' whines are already in full effect.

Ah, so that's where they are going?

If they aren't from Cleveland, those people can go jump off a bridge and do the rest of us a favor.

I doubt anyone, even us Clevelanders and ex-Clevelanders, would question Lebron's talent and physical ability. He got his ring his way. Good for him. He played as we all expected he could play. Still rooted against him and wantedt o see him choke. Didn't happen, so congratz to him. That said, he tarnished his image so that no matter when he comes up in conversation, it will always have that "decision" specter along with it. He can win 7 more rings, he can give to charity, he could come back to Cleveland and win a championship... nothing will eliminate his dickishness to the city of Cleveland.

That's why I said, if you aren't from Cleveland. I don't expect anybody there to ever get over it. You found the best player on the planet and your organization surrounded him with the Washington Generals AllStars.

I don't know if I'd go for that angle.  This season was a grinder.  Back-to-back-to-back games? Yetch.

Eh, fuck Cleveland.  Well, except the Indians.  I hope they win one.  

(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/82533/jumparoundlebron.gif)

edit: Hah, look at Shane Battier start to get into it. 

He was a bit immature when he left, but it's not like he was strangling babies or kicking dogs.  I just don't see the bitterness.  Paelos is right.  He wanted to win and it was never going to happen in Cleveland.  Who can blame the guy for leaving?

As for the talent, it's clear that he's probably the most talented player to ever play the game-  physically.  His mental toughness has been (and rightfully so) challenged in the past but he pretty much nailed that one in the ass this year.  Now it's just a matter of trying to cement his legacy among the all time greats. 

Mark Cuban tears Skip Bayless apart (http://www.businessinsider.com/mark-cuban-first-take-2012-6)

I like Mark Cuban.  He provides good entertainment value.

It's not just that.  Cleveland has a history of getting kicked in the balls by Sports.  Indians, Browns v1.0, Modell fucking-over the city, Browns v2.0.

LeBron is from the city and knows that history and chose to add to it in the most dickish self-centered way humanly imaginable.   If he'd handled leaving with a modicum of class rather than making it the LeBron show it wouldn't have caused as much bitterness.  There's still be some but the majority of folks would be over it by now.

He's immature and coddled.  I don't really blame him that much.  I'm sure "the decision" wasn't an idea that originated with him and it's tough for guys his age to do much with a modicum of class (particularly the rich ones).  It would be very surprising if some media idiot at ESPN didn't push the suggestion to his agent and then you get the awfulness that followed.  It's also not fair to blame Lebron for Cleveland's history.  They had the opportunity to try and keep him, but never really made any moves to bring in a legitimate secondary star to help him out. 

Compare it to KG leaving Minn and you will see where I am coming from. Frankly, the market in Cleveland was not big enough for two stars without one of those stars cutting back on salary (which IMHO they are way more able to do given the huge endorsement deals the main NBA stars get). It is sad, but if he would have just headed out on his free agency option and moved onto Miami, it would have bene a way different story. But all this has been said before.

Kevin Arnovitz on why he wanted the Heat to win (http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/46336/lebron-james-and-the-end-of-all-that)

I guess I could go with that article if the players haven't actively brought that sort of scrutiny into their lives, e.g. Kris Humphries with his Kardashian experiment, multiple rap albums, shittons of money, stupid decisions like "the decision", etc.  Hopefully some of the younger upcoming stars have learned from the nonsense and will do just that-  keep it about the basketball. 

They won't.

I don't know.  Derrick Rose doesn't seem cut from that same cloth.  Many of the younger guys seem to keep their noses out of trouble. 

There's a difference between doing something criminal and doing something stupid.

They will all do something stupid. It's the nature of being young and having asstons of cash. I'm satisfied with most of them not getting into run-ins with the law. That's why the Lebron thing never bothered me. Yeah, he gave a middle finger to Cleveland. It's not like it wasn't warranted. That organization was doing fucking nothing, and surrounding him with leftovers that couldn't win 20 games in the NBA. When it's a bunch of dudes judging other dudes, I don't have a lot of sympathy for the "it's not what he said, it's how he said it" argument. Sack up. This is sports.

Lebron, other than acting a little immature at times, has really been a model citizen.  The NBA always gets a bad rap for having thugs, but the NFL is where all that shit goes down.  I don't think we'll see a repeat of his "decision" from our next major free agent.  I think these guys are learning from Lebron's example about what not to do, and I think he learned from that example as well.  Now if we can just get Tony Parker to quit being a douche and hanging out with Chris Brown....

I flip on Mike and Mike on my way in to work to see what they are talking about now. "Coming up, in a very special interview with Lebron..." Click.

Yep, they are going to pound this until July. Then, they'll do some All Star break stuff for baseball.

And at that point they shift full bore into the NFL speculation. I like the NFL, but there's nothing more I hate than football talk in the offseason while real sports are going on.

Durant seems like a pretty decent fellow also.

Skip Bayless is a truly a complete cockgobbling twatwaddler. I'm surprised he can be understood with Tim Tebow's cock in his mouth.

Bayless was an absolutely awesome sportswriter until he left Dallas. He went from actually investigating things and writing about actual sports to a generalizing talking-head idiot. After 1996 he just became a parody of himself. I remember because he was in Dallas when I was growing up there, and he was pretty well respected for his coverage on the Cowboys.

In essence, he got lazy. He discovered he could make just as much money by being a loud, uninformed shockjock than he could doing actual journalist work. Nobody actually takes him seriously. Nobody takes the dog's ass that is Stephen A Smith seriously either. The difference is that Skip USED to be respected for his work at some point. Smith was never respected for his work. In fact, he's one of the few people on ESPN to actually get demoted at their sports coverage job during their career. In fact, even when he got his own show, it was cancelled on ESPN within a year. He's an idiot.

I mean First Take is a show that's not even on the ESPN regular channel. It's on ESPN2 from 10 to noon. It's in a timeslot that only unemployed would ever watch, on a network that only gets noticed when it's college football season.

You forgot that ESPN2 carries Mike and Mike and soccer, so yes, it does get noticed. Not after 8 am mind you, not by most US sports fans.

Mike and Mike is simulcast on the radio though. I would imagine they get a much broader audience due to that. Also, like you said they take the morning slot. Unless you are on TV or radio in the morning or afternoon drive? You're a hack.

Boring draft.  Don't see a whole lot to be excited about with this bunch.

Yeah, when Dion Waiters is #4 it's pretty weak.  New Orleans made out pretty well.  Even their second round pick is likely to stick for them.  Houston botched yet another draft by taking a bunch of forwards.  They should rename themselves the Houston Forwards.  I personally think the #2 pick, Kidd-Gilchrist, could end up being the best overall player from the draft.  He may not average 40 ppg, but he'l do all the things needed to put your team on the winning side.  Maybe like a non-roided up and less crazy Ron Artest.

I don't hate the Barnes pick for us, I'll say that.

Why not?  You already have Klay Thompson who plays the same position and is a better shooter.  Barnes isn't nearly athletic enough to get into the lane in the NBA and his handle sucks.  He certainly didn't fill a "need" position for the Warriors.  I would have preferred to see them take a swing on Drummond or Myers Leonard. 

He filled our only "need" position, which is a 3. Klay is a 2, Barnes has him by at least an inch and 20+ pounds. Ezeli will be a nice defensive backup for Bogut, that's really all we needed out of the center position in the draft.

Barnes is going to be a major bust.  Sorry to burst your hope bubble.   :oh_i_see:

I do like Ezeli though.  That guy is a badass. 

The Warriors may end of getting value via trade for Barnes though, either during FA or after D/summer/whatever its called league. This draft seemed boring as fuck except the part where Cleveland managed to fuck up again apparently.

Also the #2 pick is going to be ass. Because you can't grow as a player on a team/org like the Bobcats. What a waste of talent for them to get him.

Breaking news: NBA owners are still fucking retarded.  25 million 3 years for Asik, max contract for Hibbert, 4/40 for Gerald Wallace, 3 years 36 mill for the corpse of Nash.  What a waste of a lockout.

It is a little out of control. 

Also, it appears as if Howard may have asked for a trade to the Nets.  That's probably not a bad destination for him. 

It's a great destination for him but the Nets have jack shit to offer.  He's probably going to be a Laker or a Rocket before the season starts.

I'm not sure what the rules are on these sorts of deals, but with a sign and trade the Magic could potentially get rid of some salary to get under the cap and sign a nice free agent.  Too bad there's no one available worth signing, really. 

Dwight is under contract for the upcoming season, no sign and trade is necessary.  And while he is being pretty loud about not wanting to sign for anyone but the Nets in order to scare off potential trade partners for the Magic the fact remains that he won't be able to sign there next year.

Sounds like it's LA or Houston or nothing then. 

Holy shit.  Steve Nash to the Lakers (http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/8130840/sources-steve-nash-headed-los-angeles-lakers-sign-trade-deal).  Didn't see that coming, but I like it. 

Seeing Nash in the Lakers colors...ugh.

That said, as a Jazz fan from youth, I got kind of desensitized to it after seeing Malone in it.  

It only made sense with Malone, what with the LA Gear shoes and all......   :grin:

HAHAHAHAHAHA someone has agreed to take Joe Johnson and Marvin Williams from the Hawks. We've done the impossible!

Danny Ferry is now your GM, and he's a good one.  Look for your team to start looking significantly better in the near future.

Or look to land one star player and surround him with a bunch of third tier players and has-beens.

That's impossible. Atlanta hasn't had a star player since Nique.

They'll make a big move for Chris Paul, I think.  I'm not sure that's the best idea.  I don't particularly like Paul.  And I think they can afford another good "star" quality player. 

Doesn't matter.  The Lakers are the team to beat for at least a few years.

Don't buy into the Laker hype. This is still very much the Miami and OKC show unless something weird happens. Oh and Chicago's pretty good. And the Spurs.

I think the Spurs are dead.  But I've thought that for four years, so they'll probably be decent.   :awesome_for_real:

I'm going to pick the Lakers for the title next year.  I think that Nash will make them that good, because he's that good. 

It was actually a good move for the Nets, it convinced Deron to stay.  Even if they don't land Dwight Deron, JJ, Wallace and Lopez is a pretty strong lineup that would give miami fits.

If the Lakers end up getting Howard they will be a force.  For a year or two at least.

Ray Allen to the Heat.

So yeah. The NBA won't be worth watching in the East next year.

I don't really think it makes much of a difference.  There already was no competition in the east and Jesus is just a spot up 3 pt shooter now, something Miami already has by the buckets.  Overall he is a much better player than say Mike Miller or Shane Battier, but both of those guys stepped up HUGE when it mattered.

Actually, Allen is probably a wash when comparing to Battier.  Allen is a defensive liability as an old man and Battier is quite good on D.  They will provide a nice tandem, however, and I think Miller is probably close to being done with all his health problems.

Allen is there to replace a banged up Miller and a possibly retiring Jones; nothing more.  Tbh, I'd take a healthy Miller (one of the best rebounding guards in the league) or Battier over an aged Allen any day.  Both of those guys (especially Miller, who can even handle the ball) are 20+ pt starters on most other teams.  To take it further, I'd rather cultivate a younger Jones as well (very underrated defender and the 3-pt champ in last yrs all star game).  Jones can also play fwd.

What the sign DOES do though is put the 3-pt game in Miami's offense.   Until the Finals the 3-pt game really wasnt even a notion on the chalkboard.  With Allen there now though they can run plays off of it w/o a 2nd thought, making the lane wide open for everyone else including Chalmers who got pushed to the 3-pt arc all year instead of driving.  Also, the 2nd-team will be more of a threat when the big-3 arent playing together.

It's looking like Miller really wants to stay though and isn't going to retire.  So I dunno...  the Heat will easily be the deepest team in the league.  And they can transform into a deadly jumpshooting team at will if need be.

It's also looking like the Heat will score either Camby or Lewis (yet another big shooter ala Bosh) now also for minimums.  /shrug   It's a smart move for these guys moving to Miami because the reality is they're the best organization in the league (and maybe in all of sports at this point) from the top-down, especially for older players.  Very family-oriented, fun-loving, the team is a real team on/off the field, they have the best medical staff, yr-round weather, etc. 

Their only weakness is inside against big men, but with Bosh playing big and the Heat's scoring depth and pace there's really no reason for the Heat to even worry about that.  Big men cant stay on the floor long enough to be a viable threat (ask garnett and howard about this).  You'd need two Howards/Shaq's to pull it off, which is why the Lakers really should go after Howard if they can and keep either Gasol or Bynum.

Then of course the Heat could just cultivate the big men they already have.  Curry can be a force now that he's lost weight (he will breakout next year I'm sure). Turiaf just needs more time since he signed late in the year.  Joel could be a top-10 big man if he worked on his layup and hook.

Front office and coaching is just as deep.

More of a juggernaut now than anything else.  :oh_i_see:

They are also talking to Rashard Lewis.

Signed him this morning.   :grin:

(http://ionenewsone.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/miami-heat-trayvon-martin.jpg)

Come to the Dark Side.

We have Titles!

It really doesn't seem like Lewis has been in the league 14 years.  I still remember him crying in the green room when he was taken in the second round. 

I've never been a huge fan of his.  For his size and build he floats too much around the 3 point line and his defense stinks.  Still, that may just be what the Heat need.  They certainly need some more shooting, and it appears as though they are comfortable leaving James at the 4 position. 

I was a big fan of his until he got suspended for using some kind of steroids and then his production massively declined right after.  He was fucking clutch on our finals run though.

Yeah, I forgot about that.  He's a douche.

Looks like the Knicks are going to let Jeremy Lin go (http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8168185/2012-nba-free-agency-new-york-knicks-match-jeremy-lin-houston-rockets-offer-sheet-source-says).  I can't say that I think this is a bad idea.  Lin is a scorer (and a bit of a turnover machine) and they really don't need a scorer in their offensive sets at the PG position.  I still see Lin as a huge risk.  Not only is he relatively unproven still, in my opinion, he also has some apparent issues with injury to deal with.  It will be interesting to see how he does with Houston.  

Houston knows what they are doing.  This is a financial decision rather than a basketball one, 8 mil a year is a pittance for someone who gets you an entire country worth of fans.

Until he flames out because he's not nearly as good as you expected and your team only wins 25 games. 

So the Knicks dump a potential young star that puts asses in the seats, and continue to keep a financial and wins drain in Carmelo.

Yeah. They have no shot. This is a great deal for Houston.

No it's not.  They are WAY overpaying for Lin.  $14 million per year in his last year is simply absurd. 

He's a 23 year old intelligent PG in a guard league. He can work with a Houston team that has no cap issues, and a bunch of unproven young talent. Guys like White and Lamb can work with Lin to make this a young gun team that can contend for a playoff spot.

Look, Lin played 25 games last year and had a surgical issue that effectively ended his season.  He is a streaky shooter, a turnover machine, has no left hand and doesn't (can't, really) play defense.  Lin, by himself, isn't going to be a guy that takes you to the playoffs.  I wish we could have seen him in the playoffs so that we could see what real defense would do to expose his game.  I suspect that his extended end of season absence had more to do with that (and getting the best salary possible) than with the actual injury itself. 

Otherwise, Lamb hasn't played a minute.  I like Terrence Jones but he's got a lot of holes in his game.  The rest of the roster is trash.  They're totally banking on getting Howard, which is okay I suppose but the Josh Harrelson, Courtney Fortson and Chandler Parsons crew is not going to get it done, with or without Lin.

Disagree. You've got a Houston team that was barely on the outside looking in to the playoffs. You've got a league that's shifting towards more youth, with or without the Howard nonsense. You have one or two more years, or in some cases maybe none, for teams that are the traditional powerhouses being able to capitalize on their rosters.

Also you left out Royce White. The 21 year old 6'8" 270 lbs power forward out of Iowa State. The kid is a great player with a great defensive game.

I think Royce White is going to be a disaster.  His anxiety disorder is going to be a huge problem.  There's no doubting that he's super talented though.

As for the rest of it, this is a super shitty roster (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/roster/_/name/hou/houston-rockets).  It's full of forwards, too much youth and no name players.  Lin can't fix that. 

So negative!  :awesome_for_real:

I know, right?  It doesn't matter.  That won't be the final roster.  There will be a trade and/or cuts.  They can't keep 11 forwards on the roster. 

Story coming out yet again that Lin wouldn't have signed with the Knicks anyway. He was sick of Carmelo.

Until the Knicks get their heads out of their asses and dump that team cancer, they are hopeless.

I thought he was a restricted free agent.  

Addendum-  I like Jeremy Lin.  I think he's a breath of fresh air, but I'm not in love with him as a player.  I think he's got some pretty big holes in his game that will be exposed when he's more of a known commodity.  In the end I think he'll be a 15-6 type player (which is what we saw towards the end of his 25 game example last year).  But seeing him basically run from the Knicks organization should let them know what sort of cancer Carmelo Anthony is.  The should have amnestied his ass instead of Chauncey Billups.  That deal needed a do over.  And the second option would have been to drop Stoudemire.  He's not nearly as good as he was in his prime in Phoenix. 

Agree with you on that.

Lin however is not overpaid from a revenue stand point.  He's going to bring a lot of money into the franchise.

Surely he will.  Apparently he increased the value of the Knicks franchise by some $600 million (http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8174968/jeremy-lin-leaving-new-york-knicks-james-dolan-blundered-again). 

And really, Lin should be thanking his lucky fucking stars.  He will be much better off in Houston (or really anywhere) that doesn't have Carmelo Anthony.

I don't even follow basketball that much, and even I know Anthony is a douchenozzle. Sure, he's a great individual player but he seems to be cut from the same mold as Iverson. Great individual player who can't figure out how to utilize his talents to help a team win championships.

It's funny how awful Iverson and Anthony were together, now that you brought that up.   :awesome_for_real:

He doesn't play defense. That's why. He gets his points and then waits for the other team to score so he can get more points.

Meh, at least Iverson carried a shitty team all the way to the finals on skill alone.

True, although they had a great player in Raja Bell, but didn't realize it.

Raja Bell played what, 5 games that year?  Not a factor.  They did have Dikembe Mutombo in his prime, however, which was a big help. 

This piece (http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8177587/jeremy-lin-says-interview-preferred-stay-new-york-knicks) contradicts this a little bit.  I'm sure we won't hear the real story in mainstream press if it has to come from Lin's camp, however.  They seem to have their shit together. 

Oh I believe he preferred New York. Who doesn't prefer living in NY as a pro player over the shithole that is Houston? That doesn't mean he was going to sign with them. You can read between the lines on what he told reporters. There was an obvious culture clash from a guy like Lin who wants to give it everything all the time, and the shitheads on the Knicks right now.

I wanted to have fun playing basketball. ... Now I'm definitely relieved
Every single vet on our team that has been in the league longer than five years pulled me aside and told me that I shouldn't play," Lin said. "And I had arguments with them about why I should."
I love the New York fans to death. That's the biggest reason why I wanted to return to New York.

I think that he's no dummy and sees the possible marketing possibilities for the China/Asia market that were opened up with Yao Ming in Houston.  And I think the Knicks will be fine, as an organization, without him.  As far as living in Houston, once you make $5,000,000k it doesn't matter as much.  He can get a fat pad wherever he wants and get an apartment in H town.  Then when he makes $14,000,000 he's rolling.  He was an econ major at Harvard.  I'm sure he's got it all worked out.

It was ass fucking backwards that the Knicks let him test the market in the first place. Also fat ass Melo is a shithead and the Knicks still wont win a playoff series next year god willing with his fat ass and Felton who looks like he's also a fat ass.

I hope the Bucks, Cavs or Wizards (hell anyone) surprise with a fun good season because otherwise the east is going to be all types of boring (Miami, Boston, Bulls) mixed with overhyped new yawk bullshit next year. Suits me fine because I'd like to see LBJ go back to back just to further shove his foot up the ass of all the haters.

This is probably one of the best things that could happen for Lin and therefore is good for the sport as a whole. I'd really like to see the Rockets get Dwight Howard if I didn't think Dwight Howard is a total fuckhead pansy who I've completely soured on at this point.

The Knicks and the Rangers are owned by the same consortium of clueless dickbags that think hiring one or two high profile shitheels past their prime is better than developing young talent and running with a team full of roleplayers. We lamented that as least as far back as my days in the sports biz back in the mid to late 90s. Plus ca change.

Economically, going to Houston is a no brainer. The cost of living is 53% lower in Houston and there's no state income tax.

The Cavs should have a good season, Kyrie Irving is a bonafide star.  The Nets will be pretty good, not as good as their massive pay roll says they should be but good enough to make some waves.  The Bucks are once again gonna be a borderline playoff team that should be rebuilding.

It's only a balloon payment for the matching team, for Houston it's just the average salary over the life of the contract (~$8m) each year.  And the Knicks could have just stretched the payments/salary cap hits into a few extra years if they thought that at any point they would want to get out of the repeat luxury tax payer penalty.  Which they never will because they have fucktons of money tied up in a not very good roster, insane management, and no amnesty.

I think it's pretty clear that Dolan just didn't want to match the offer.  They could have dealt with it if they really wanted Lin.  And Lin would have, even if he was just mildly successful, a beneficial effect on Dolan's cashflow from increased popularity.

And, in part, I think that the Knicks actually made a choice based on their roster (and Carmelo's pushiness).  It wasn't really a bad choice for them. 

For fuck's sake.  The NBA is just insane.  JaVale McGee is now worth $11 million per year (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8179311/javale-mcgee-denver-nuggets-agree-multiyear-contract)?  The Nuggets deserve to never win another playoff game again.  I can't believe George Karl went for this shit.   :uhrr:

There is something horribly wrong with the nba's current setup. Whoever gets Bynum and D12 have a huge leg up because apparently every single "nba" center is worth 12mil+ per year and at that rate getting one of the two true superstar talents at center at 15mil per year is a fucking steal. What a joke.

There are just too many players making over 10mil a year while probably not being worth half of what the true superstar max contract guys are worth while costing almost as much.

Also is there a league where performance goes up more during contract years?

Javale made huge strides in Denver. It's kind of hard to predict how good he's going to be.

JeVale had 2 great games.  I'm not spending the money, but I bet they could have had him for less (or his equivalent at 10 ppg and 10 rpg)

I think it's more Javale stopped acting like an idiot. He's not going to be worth it next year. Years after that? It's easy to understand why they would pay. High risk, high potential.

It's actually becoming crystal clear (through various media reports) that:

A - Carmelo did not want Lin around next season at all
and B - Dolan felt Lin "owed" the Knicks for his success, and wouldn't give him the deal because Lin dared to contract shop.

Lin better thank his lucky fucking stars that the Knicks didn't match the deal.  He could have ended up in a hellish situation there. 

I talked to one of the Knicks tonight, and he told me that the team as a whole liked Lin a lot more than they liked Melo. I'm not surprised by this at all.

Dwight Howard finally gets traded to the Lakers. (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8252042/sources-dwight-howard-los-angeles-lakers-four-team-deal-complete)  Now I can really dislike him.   :grin:

Lakers get Howard.
Nuggests get Igoudala.
76ers get Andrew Bynum and Jason Richardson
Magic get shit (I mean Aaron Aflalo, Al Harrington, Nikola Vucevic) and a protected first round draft pick from each team (which is pretty good, although not great).

Nash, Bryant, Gasol, Howard. Never imagined seeing those names together. Then again Payton, Bryant, Malone and O'Neal didn't work out so well.

Just when I thought the Heat were gonna be on cruise control for a few yrs.   :facepalm:
Starting to feel like the old NBA.  League contraction is happening on the roster scale evidently.  There will be 4 powerhouses and that's it.

I'm really surprised they didn't trade Gasol.  I think that lineup is easily on par with any other in the league.  

I'm also going to predict that Bynum will implode in Philly.  He's close to home and has too much of that "crazy bastard" aura about him.

I like it. The league seems unwilling to get rid of the crap teams, so the players are doing the next best thing.

I would be very surprised to see contraction of a US based team in any sport.  Still, looking at attendance figures from 2011 (http://espn.go.com/nba/attendance) suggests that the usual suspects of the Hornets, Bobcats, Kings, and Grizzlies could all be good deductions from the league.  These four teams have little history and don't really appear to going anywhere.  The Pistons, Pacers, Nets, Cavs, Hawks, Bucks, Timberwolves,and Wizards all have a little history but several of them could stand to go, too.  Primary targets, in my opinion, would be the Bucks, T Wolves and Wizards. 

Personally, if I were Stern I'd get rid of the Grizzlies, Bobcats, Timberwolves and possibly the Wizards or Bucks. 

The Pacers have been in freefall for attendence since 2005. I have no idea why that might be, other than the fact the Colts were really awesome in that period, and Indiana went through a 4 year playoff drought.

Still, they went to the playoffs in 2010, dead last in attendence. They were 3rd in the conference in 2012, 2nd to dead last in attendence. WHAT? Even the Hawks with our shitty Joe Johnson contract and non-existant point guard play drew 1000 more people a game than that.

Sometimes interest for a sport just wanes.

Tampa Bay lightning were that way the second year after the cup -- attendance was just way down.

(As an aside, I find it very strange that I haven't posted in at least two years and decide to post in an NBA thread....hmmm  :drill:)

Welcome back. You'll find this little corner of the forum is much more fun than the others. Just don't talk about cycling.

And don't get into the middle of one of the "I'm right" discussions that Paelos and I get into about once a month.  

Edited to add:  And fuck you, Paelos.   :awesome_for_real:

From what I can remember, Big P was a little tamer than other f13 posters.  :)

From someone who's been an ORL fan for about as long as I can remember (I was 10ish in the days of Penny, Horace, and Shaq), I've never seen someone whine as much as Dwight Howard.  Dwight Howard coudl've been a legend in Orlando a la Evan Longoria for the Rays or Vinny Lecavalier for the Lightning.  Fans in Florida love to have a face of an organization even more than the Colts loved Manning -- think Tebow and UF.

Watching someone cry his way to the firing of one of the truly great basketball coaches and eventual trade drives me crazy.

I'm not a big Dwight Howard fan either.  You see a certain level of whininess, petulance and entitlement expectation in all superstars.  Lebron has it a bit, Koby has it a bit, MJ had it....it's part of the gig.  But all of these guys didn't let the metagame that they were playing intrude into their on the court performance.  In some instances (like Koby) he let the metagame elevate his game.  Dwight doesn't seem to have that.  He wants to blame everyone else but himself for the team's problems.  Koby and Nash and the other Lakers that have been to championships won't put up with that shit.  He won't be there longer than a year if he can't get it together.

Orlando?  What in the fuck?  How in the world do you trade Dwight Howard and not get Bynum back?  What a terrible deal for them.  It's not as if they even get decent picks for a rebuild, because all the teams involved are going to be good. 

I think you're underestimating just how good three first rounders (four if you count the one that was already drafted) are.  In the short term, it sucks.  In the long term, they'll be stronger for this.

I actually think LA is taking a big chance here...if Captain Crybaby hates LA, he signs with Dallas to fashion moneyhats, and LA loses.

Hi Android browser, quit being such a pain in the ass transposing my letters when I post.   :uhrr:

Just when you thought the NBA was starting to get a glimmer of an idea of what the words "competitive balance" mean...

I don't think the fans actually want that.

Late first round draft picks aren't that great.  You have a 1/2 chance of picking someone that will even stick around in the NBA.  The 16-23 range is much better than the 23-30 range, but the L.A. pick is certainly going to be in the later range and of little value.  Denver and Philly both get better from this deal making their picks worse as well.

Yeah, you can't look at the players that Orlando got back in return.  They were just trying to get draft rights.  Those guys won't be around long, I'd imagine. 

From Orlando's perspective, here's what they're working with:

Plan A:  Extremely talented, discontented center plays for one year while wishing he was elsewhere

or

Plan B: Four players with lots of upside and three guaranteed first round picks.

Both plans A and B don't bring home a championship -- I think ORL's GM did very well here and should be pleased.

Analysts apparently do not agree:


John Hollinger:

J.A. Adande:

Simmons:

Maybe this comes from my personal life experience, but sometimes you're so ready to be done with something that you'll take less than you deserve.

Dammit Adande, usually you and I are right on the same page.   :heartbreak:

Anyway, it'll be two or three years before anyone can truly determine who made out best due to drafting and whatnot...I still remember the analysts who said Steven Stamkos was the "worst #1 overall in the last ten years."  Lawl.

Oh no doubt they could be wrong, and you also have to take Simmons with a grain of salt whenever the Lakers are in the conversation.

That said Orlando had the best center in the league for what, like 11 or 12 of the last 20 years? And managed no titles. Write it on their tombstones.

There was no such thing as a "good" trade for Howard. They lost that battle when it became more than public knowledge he was mentally done with Orlando. Who was going to offer fair value to a team that's absolutely desperate to sell? Nobody.

Also, the rich get richer stuff is nonsense. Orlando was second behind the Lakers in team salary, and it's a salary cap league. Come on.

It's rich get richer in a historical sense.

So champs get champier?

I wonder if basketball is evolving to essentially what baseball is now, with a few teams (read:  Heat and Lakers) evolving into NYY as the "place to play."

And I don't mean a place to get paid.  My dad works with a former MLB pitcher's (13-year veteran) mother.  He pitched for the Reds most of his career and toward the tail end was scooped up by the Yankees.  He's a big guy...6'7", iirc.  When he played for other organizations, he'd commonly ask to get moved either into an emergency exit row or business class on flights since he had such long legs.  On his first flight with his new team, he asked the travel coordinator the same thing he'd been asking for years.

The coordinator looked at him with as though he had two heads and replied, "Mr.  XXXX, we only fly first class."

The NBA has always been that, it is actually far worse than baseball. Something like half or more of all the Finals spots ever have been the Lakers or Celtics.

The NBA understands what its fans want, and they deliver it in mass quantities. Call it fixing, call it coddling, call it whatever. They incentivize big named guys on big market teams because that's what sells. NBA finals clenching game with Miami and the Thunder? A national TV rating of an 11. The 2010 finals game 7 with the Celtics and Lakers? That pulled a 15.6 for the highest rated finals game in history.

The worst finals in recent NBA history? The 2003 matchup between San Antonio and the NJ Nets. Not a single game in the entire series got over an 8. At it's lowest, game 2 got a 5 rating. Family Guy repeats on FOX do better than that.

Why did that happen? Because it was the first time in years the Lakers weren't involved in the finals. The next time was 2005 when the Pistons played the Spurs. Guess what happened? Ratings produced the second record low for TV. Funny because in 2004 when the Lakers played the Pistons, Game 5 produced the second most watched game in Finals history. Hmmmm.

You don't need to fix anything.  Orlando is incompetently run, possibly by ownership and not basketball staff, but everyone else got something they wanted.

The Lakers are willing to spend money, are able to offer players a number of intangibles like Los Angeles and a commitment to winning, and are smartly run.  This deal for the Lakers was basically Howard for Bynum, a player they developed from teenager to All-Star and sold high on.  People have been killing the team for years for not dumping Bynum and/or Gasol.  Same with the Odom trade exception last season.  Now, with a bit of luck and a lot of hard work executing another hugely complicated trade for a Top Five player, the Lakers can roll out Howard, Pau, Ron-Ron, Kobe, and Nash.

The Spurs were awful one year and it was the right one and got Duncan.  The Thunder traded a player with a heart problem for Perk, got Durant instead of Oden, and picked up a future All-Star in very late 1st round in Ibaka.  The Celtics were less "lucky" but also got players a lot older and have a title and a lot of injury-related heartbreak to show for it.  Miami got Toronto and Cleveland to agree to trades too remember.

The Knicks could have done it, but picked a volume scorer and a guy with as many knee surgeries as my Dad.  The Nets tried to do it, but got a bit impatient and figured the ECF was good enough to start out with.  The Bulls are cheap.  The Clippers can't do it as long as Sterling is around.  Golden State maybe?

In the NBA the WORST place you can possibly be is middle of the pack.  If you are not a contender you want to bottom out and rebuild, getting stuck in the middle leaves you perennially as not good enough to win and not bad enough to improve.  The Magic team with Bynum would have been at best an eight seed in the east, that is a horrible situation to be in.  The only place where they got screwed in this trade was in the final Iguodala for Afflalo/Harrington trade, they could have done better than that.  Hell Portland got a sixth pick for Gerald Wallace.  Howard Duhon and Clark for Bynum McRoberts and Eyenga + a first round pick from 2017 (a year the Lakers won't have Kobe Nash or Pau anymore) is not a terrible deal.  Bynum and Richardson (another bad contract) for Iguodala and two good young prospects in Harkless and Vucevic + another first rounder is a pretty decent deal.  Iguodala for Afflalo and Harrington on a horrible contract + another pick i guess is pretty shitty.

I've been a Magic fan longer than you and i thought Van Gundy should've been fired on the spot.  You don't throw the organization under the bus like he did and expect to keep your job, it is that simple.  I don't care if Howard is being a baby, you don't air the teams dirty laundry to the press and destroy any chance of keeping a franchise player because your feelings got hurt.  And he might have been a great Xs and Os coach but he was a horrible people person and completely refused to play rookies and develop young talent, which is partly to blame for Orlandos severe lack of trade assets.

Both Van Gundy coaches fail at the most important thing in coaching, leadership.

Any post that starts out like this?   :oh_i_see:

Feel free to disagree, but c'mon man.  And it's the organization's fault that the star player cried a river that Van Gundy eventually drowned in? 

I might give you that he should've had more class than to call out the organization, but here's the thing:  it was true.

Well, you mentioned it so i figured it was important :).  Whether it was true or not it still sunk any chance of keeping Howard right after they had talked him into waving his ETO, coaches are not important enough to survive that kind of offense.

Good god, is Serge Ibaka really worth $12 million per year (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8280001/oklahoma-city-thunder-agree-serge-ibaka-extension-source)? 

NBA league priorities seem definitely fucked up.  (and yes, I understand he led the league in blocks)

But but but...he lead the league in blocks!  BLOCKS!

(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/418653_493267800701749_862284661_n.jpg)

Ibaka is only 23 and already the best in the league at something, that's probably a pretty good argument for getting paid.

I'm not buying it.   :oh_i_see:

Any center with even the bare amount of skill and size is going to get paid.

Yeah, that's less than 2x what Kwame Brown makes after all.  :awesome_for_real:

Al Horford and Joachim Noah make less money than this joker and they're both twice the player.

Not by PER, they're all right around ~19. And those other 2 guys are 3-4 years older; if Ibaka continues to improve as he ages he should outperform them in the long run.

Horfor will get a max contract when his current one runs out, probably so will Noah.

Yeah, well, Chris Anderson and Andersona Varajao have PERs of around 19 too, and I'm not trading Ibaka, Noah or Horford for both of them and a first round pick.  PER doesn't tell the whole story.  There's quite a few guys above 19 that I wouldn't trade for any of the three guys we're talking about.