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f13.net General Forums => Gaming => Topic started by: SnakeCharmer on December 12, 2009, 06:52:52 PM



Title: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 12, 2009, 06:52:52 PM
Sold my current rig to a buddy, so time to build a new one.

Budget:
2500.00 USD, including shipping, after MIR's if applicable.  Shipping to 36601 zipcode.
Requirements: 
I'm pushing 1920x1200 resolution, and am a bleeding edge graphics whore.  So everything is usually jacked up as high as it goes.  I want it to be quiet, which may be tough considering the budget/use.  Prefer single card/GPU solution, but not averse to SLI or Crossfire, so in that regard an SLI mobo is probably the way to go for later (just in case), same for the PSU.  Prefer Intel and nVidia, but not married to it.  I'm not scared of overclocking.  I'm tempted to look into watercooling, but someone would have to really try hard to convince me to do it.  Nothing loud about the case at all, from sound/fans to graphics or LEDs (black never goes out of style).
Primary use:
Gaming 99 percent of the time.  Burning movies/audio 1 percent of the time.  If a BR drive/burner(s) can be squeezed in, awesome, but not a requirement.  Mostly play FPSs and MMOs.
Do not need: 
Any peripherals.  Large amounts of storage.  I back the important stuff up to DVD, and have a couple external 1TB HDD's.  250GB to 350GB HDD should be more than enough.  500GB and higher would be overkill.  Do not need to worry about multiple monitors.  My single 24" works just fine.
On The Fence wants/wishes (i.e. if budget allows):
NIC.  Dedicated sound card with digital optical sound out and 5.1 support.  Bluetooth capabilities.  Lots of USB ports (6+ on the back alone).

Is nVidia ever going to come out with their 300 series cards?  Is DX11 worth worrying about for the next couple years (by which time it is, new/better GPUs will be on the market)?  Is it worth it to just game on my laptop until after the 1st of the year and take a look at building then?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 12, 2009, 07:41:09 PM
If you know what you want why can't you spec your own?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 12, 2009, 08:37:26 PM
Because I'm completely behind the times and don't want to handcuff a rig by being cpu or gpu bound, or any other number of factors.  Plus, the obvious, of looking advice from people that know better, especially in terms of quiet components (psu, case, etc).  Some things I'm just going to have to live with as far as noise is concerned, but I'd like to mitigate it was much as possible. 

Knowing what I want out of a rig isn't quite the same as knowing how to achieve it.  Seems to me that simply going through newegg or whatever and automatically clicking the most expensive component by default is a bad idea.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: dusematic on December 12, 2009, 08:39:54 PM
http://arstechnica.com/hardware/guides/2009/10/ars-system-guide-october-2009-edition.ars


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 12, 2009, 10:47:50 PM
If I was looking to build a $2500 rig I think I would try and squeeze a 160gb Intel SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167024) in and live with that as my primary OS Drive.  Probably offload all other storage to NAS.  I think 2010 is definitely going to be the year of the SSD, performance glitches have been overcome and the price/gb is dropping down to mainstream levels.  Just need to clear out all the OEM contracts with the crappy SSD providers and replace them with the guys that are actually delivering the decent products. 

Cold Boot to logged in with Photoshop open in 6 seconds is definitely a performance boost that will be noticed. 

Sounds like we have similar taste in cases, so I'll recommend mine yet again Coolermaster Sileo 500 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119192&Tpk=sileo%20500)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 14, 2009, 12:34:16 AM
My comments:

If you want the option of SLI/Crossfire you should go with LGA 1366 as the companion X58 chipset supports more PCIe lanes than the equivalent LGA 1156/P55 setup. You can do SLI/Crossfire on LGA 1156 but you aren't getting a full 16 lanes on your second card unless the MB maker has hacked in some extra lanes.

If you are willing to overclock I'd recommend the i7-920 as it overclocks really well. Otherwise since your budget is so large go for the i7-950.

For a single GPU video card you'll want the 5870 assuming you don't want to get something cheap(er) now and wait to see what NVIDIA comes out with next year. If you want the dual-GPU 5970 you'll have to drop down to the i7-920 to fit that in (~$650 assuming you can find one).

Here's an example build with no case or accessories that comes out to ~$2200.00 (inc. rebates)


Intel Core i7-950 3.06GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16819115211
$569.99

Noctua NH-U12P SE2 120mm SSO CPU Cooler - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16835608014
$74.99

CORSAIR CMPSU-1000HX 1000W Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16817139007
$239.99

Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit 1-Pack for System Builders
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16832116762
$174.99

MSI Radeon HD 5870 (Cypress XT) R5870-PM2D1G Video Card
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814127449
$429.99

GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16813128362
$268.99

Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Internal Hard Drives -Bare
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16822136284
$99.99
   
CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820145258
$154.99

LG Black 8X Blu-ray Burner SATA Model WH08LS20
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16827136176
$189.99

*Grand Total:*   $2,203.91


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on December 14, 2009, 12:47:05 AM
I really can't see building a PC today costing $2500. This entire concept is flat out insane. Buy a 5870, take your pick of an i7 and mobo, throw in a couple WD Blacks for $100, 8GB of RAM is a trivial amount, put it all in a cardboard box and buy a 500" monitor because I still don't see how you're spending $2500 on a PC in 2009.

Edit: Yes, I see Trippy's post. But spending telling him to spend $569 on a processor is obviously just so he can laugh at him later. And $300 on a power supply? lol


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Bill on December 14, 2009, 04:13:14 AM
What Schild said. I spent around the same amount (GBP so a couple of hundred went on VAT) on my rig and that included two 22" Samsung monitors. Just make sure to get at least 6gb of decent RAM, nice and fast alongside an i7 on a decent board. Personally I can reommend the ASUS P6T range (based on 6 months of it being great and lots of review reading prior to purchase). 5870 certainly looks like the way to if you want "bang for buck"... wow, there's a phrase I never thought I'd type.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on December 14, 2009, 06:53:53 AM
I second the i7-920/LGA-1366/X58 recommendations, that is IMO the cheapest (read "cost-efficient") high-end setup you can buy, and it is pretty future-proof.

WD Caviar Black is pretty much the best "mainstream" HDD you can buy, buy two of those at 1TB so you can RAID 1 them and have permanent backup. The X58 mobos all should come with integrated raid controllers for that.

Get a 5870 if they are available, a solid 6GB tri-channel kit (something that does DDR3-1600 at CL8 is quite okay).

Power Supply, something at 500-600W should suffice for starters, the 1000W Trippy listed is quite a beast and definitely needed if you plan for some big SLI/Crossfire deal later, but you can always upgrade that a later time too.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 14, 2009, 09:46:01 AM
Maybe you all missed the part where SnakeCharmer is a graphics ho. IF he wants the best, he needs expensive motherboard, expensive video card(s) and to protect that asset, an expensive power supply that isn't going to fizzle and wreck his system under load 5 months down the line. Trippy's choices are reasonable for a high graphics performance system.

However, that said, it seems very silly to spend that much on a system and then getting a cheap monitor. I mean, after all, the point is to get very good visuals, and you can't do that without dropping at least 500 more on a monitor. Even that seems penny wise pound foolish, since for the most part, monitors can outlive systems by a generation or two.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on December 14, 2009, 10:07:24 AM
  I think 2010 is definitely going to be the year of the SSD, performance glitches have been overcome and the price/gb is dropping down to mainstream levels.  Just need to clear out all the OEM contracts with the crappy SSD providers and replace them with the guys that are actually delivering the decent products. 

This would not surprise me. SSD for the system and a portable HDD for storage. I can see that as being the norm is a few years.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 14, 2009, 10:41:26 AM
Trippy - Thanks for the info, most appreciated.  That's actually pretty close to what I had pieced together, but was going with the 920 and OC it.  I figure the price difference would be better spent on a better video card (or cards), or more RAM possibly.

Schild - Hush.  Going cheap on a PSU is a quick road to an early death.

Kageh - I figure I'm going to go ahead and buy a 850w or higher PSU.  No point in upgrading to SLI/Crossfire later on and be stuck with an inadequate PSU that I won't need anymore, and end up spending more money in the long run.  I look at it like kind of like woodwork - measure twice, cut once.

Engels - My monitor is fine (Gateway FHD2400).  TN panel, tiny bit of backlight bleedthrough and some color shifting, but overall, I'm happy with it.  Might upgrade down the road; just need to get my kid to sling a toy through the current one to justify a purchase of a new monitor with the wife  :drillf:.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 14, 2009, 10:49:37 AM
Phht, you need this monitor (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9sXhYlIfRY)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on December 14, 2009, 11:08:23 AM
Quote
Schild - Hush.  Going cheap on a PSU is a quick road to an early death.

I don't go cheap on PSUs, in fact I buy the best rated on the market. You don't need to spend $300 to be safe.

You could build a gaming rig for a good deal less than above, and see almost no performance difference and donate $1,000 to f13 (money saved!) for servers.

Point being, you're pissing money away spending $2500 on a PC these days.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: patience on December 14, 2009, 08:55:58 PM
If the results from this (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/balanced-gaming-pc,2477.html) hold up and you get the best graphics card out there (which only comes from AMD at this point) you can cheap out and get the 1156 socket i5 or an X3 Phenom instead of the 1336 socket i7 because AMD cards unlike Nvidia don't rely on a strong CPU to maximize their performance.

I agree with Trippy in that if you want a silent high performance cooler get the Noctua 120mm fan model NH-U12P.

But if you want to take the risk of using a ridiculously large CPU cooler that could be a hassle to fit on your mobo, the newer 140 mm fan version offers better thermal performance while taking a hit on the acoustics performance.

I don't agree with the PSU. The Corsair is overkill if you aren't going for a tri or quad gpu setup. I would recommend the seasonic 750X if you lived in a state with high energy prices like New York but a quick look (http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electricity/epm/table5_6_a.html) at the state you are coming from tells me the savings you would get for the 80 gold wouldn't make up for the upfront cost unlike the Seasonic M12D 750 which is vastly cheaper and is highly rated as a quiet PSU.

2500 Budget is overkill. I barely break that with my wishlist which includes a monitor. Since you want silent performance you have the option of getting a 160 GB Intel X-25M solid state drive even though it is somewhat an excessive expense.

Since you like to overclock you'll want a board with great capacitors and bios to do your tweaking. Since you want to spend the money on a dedicated sound card I think you would want to look at Gigabyte and ASrock boards instead of Asus or EVGA which use high end integrated audio parts which help inflate the price of their high end overclocking boards.

Your biggest source of noise will come from the GPU. You aren't going to be able to get a quiet card through air cooling even though the ATI 5870 is very power efficient unlike some of the past heat hogs. I strongly suggest you consider using a water block. I've never done watercooling myself though so I can't make any recommendations other than you won't get silence unless you are using your GPU to push the limits of Runescape and Peggle.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on December 14, 2009, 08:57:08 PM
The 5870 isn't near as loud as one would think. It's whisper quiet compared to a Nvidia 285/295.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Evil Elvis on December 14, 2009, 09:13:04 PM
If you're spending $1700+, and not getting a SSD, you're doing it wrong.

Get an OCZ or Intel SSD for your OS drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on December 14, 2009, 09:33:17 PM
Wait, OCZ makes products that are not utter shite?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Evil Elvis on December 14, 2009, 10:01:40 PM
I've no idea what OCZ's rep is on other components, but their Vertex SSD's are arguably on par with the Intel drives.

I've got the 30gb Vertex drive, and its great.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 14, 2009, 10:13:11 PM
I've no idea what OCZ's rep is on other components, but their Vertex SSD's are arguably on par with the Intel drives.

I've got the 30gb Vertex drive, and its great.

AFAIK the new Intel SSD g2r5 is the only drive on the market that supports the TRIM command, although the price per gb is slightly better on some of the OCZ stuff it is still in the same ballpark as the Intel SSD.  If you are running w7 (an OS that supports TRIM) then the Intel drive is the one to go with as the price difference isn't really all that different and performance-wise Intel has been and still is leading the pack.  The only big negative with Intel is they have their head up their ass on firmware updates and have bricked a few drives in the process.  Fortunately if you get the latest drive revision with the TRIM support already included there won't be some major reason to flash the firmware ASAP (ie before they dork a few drives and pull it back).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on December 15, 2009, 01:56:25 AM
Hmmm, TRIM has been supported by Indilinx controllers for quite some time AFAIK, it's just that OS-wise it was only supported by Linux until W7 launched.

About PSU Watts needed: Watts and Amperage are two different things. The figure you are actually needing is the maximum current on the 12v rails, not the maximum electrical power. You can run an overclocked i7 with an SLI setup on a good 650W-750W PSU easily, once you get to 50-55+ A on 12V. There are also fantastic PSUs in that range without having to push to 1000W, which will not fry on you and not burn out or damage your system. The 1000W figure sizing is way too conservative. I'm talking $150+ savings there which you can spend on additional stuff.

One more thing you should consider, for that price range, if waiting another few months is an option: First NVidia Fermi benchmarks (leaked from NVidia, yo  :grin:)are starting to show up, and that thing is apparently dominating the ATI5xxx. Conservative estimates put the mainstream launch around march 2010, which isn't that far away.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 15, 2009, 02:28:55 AM
About PSU Watts needed: Watts and Amperage are two different things. The figure you are actually needing is the maximum current on the 12v rails, not the maximum electrical power. You can run an overclocked i7 with an SLI setup on a good 650W-750W PSU easily, once you get to 50-55+ A on 12V. There are also fantastic PSUs in that range without having to push to 1000W, which will not fry on you and not burn out or damage your system. The 1000W figure sizing is way too conservative. I'm talking $150+ savings there which you can spend on additional stuff.
Power supply math is funny, though. Even though a 650W may say it can put out, say, 52A on the +12V line, that's 624W right there meaning it can only output 26W for all the other lines assuming you somehow maxed out the +12V line (and assuming 100% efficiency). In other words the total power output of the power supply is the number you see stated, not the sum of the wattages on all the different lines (it's even more complicated cause +3.3V and +5V typically "share" a max wattage value as well).

More realistically let's say your top-end SLI setup is consuming 40A at +12V (=480W) and you've got a 130W TDP CPU (yes I know the TDP rating isn't the same as the actual power draw but it's a good approximation). Now you are kind of screwed if you only have a 650W power supply, especially once you take efficiency into account. 1000W may be overkill but for what SnakeCharmer may want to do in the future 650W is very likely to be too small. And this doesn't take overclocking/overvoltaging into account.

Edit: also power supplies typically are less efficient at low loads and very high loads and they run hotter at higher loads so it's best to run them around 1/2 to 3/4 load. This is less of an issue than it was in the past as "enthusiast" PS designs are often quite efficient these days (many are in the 80% efficiency range with some in 90% range) but it's still something to consider.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on December 15, 2009, 03:25:56 AM
I agree with the math Trippy, very well put and sound logic.

I'm actually running an overclocked/undervolted i7 (3.6GHz at 1.15 VCore, yay for Xeon) with 2x260 (55nm) SLI on a 650W TT QFan, but it's probably close. I'm just used to be conservative about PSUs, as I'm seeing too much overkill with them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on December 17, 2009, 09:56:19 AM
Well, technically I went $52 over (https://secure.newegg.com/WishList/MySavedWishDetail.aspx?ID=11651085), you could always shave a little money on the HDD.  Should show that, it's a public wishlist.

> 1 SAMSUNG 2494SW Glossy Black 24" 5ms Widescreen LCD Monitor
> Item #: N82E16824001338
> Return Policy: Monitor Replacement Only Return Policy -$60.00 Instant
> $269.99
> $209.99
> 1 ABS Diablo ADV Black Finish + Titanium bezel Steel ATX Full Tower Computer Case
> Item #: N82E16811215013
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy -$50.00 Instant
> $159.99
> $109.99
> 1 G.SKILL Trident 8GB (4 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 2000 (PC3 16000) Desktop Memory Model F3-16000CL9Q-8GBTD
> Item #: N82E16820231332
> Return Policy: Memory Standard Return Policy $259.99
> 1 HITACHI Deskstar HD32000 IDK/7K 2TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Retail
> Item #: N82E16822145276
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy $169.99
> 1 COOLMAX ZP-1000B 1000W ATX 12V V2.3 / EPS 12V V2.92 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply
> Item #: N82E16817159116
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy -$50.00 Instant
> $30.00 Mail-in Rebate
> $179.99
> $129.99
> 1 Thermaltake A2384 Noise Dampening Kit
> Item #: N82E16800999369
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy $8.99
> 2 HIS H489F1GP Radeon HD 4890 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card
> Item #: N82E16814161276
> Return Policy: VGA Standard Return Policy $399.98
> 1 OCZ Colossus OCZSSD2-1CLS120G 3.5" 120GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid state disk (SSD)
> Item #: N82E16820227472
> Return Policy: Limited Replacement Only Return Policy $549.00
> 1 LG Black 8X Blu-ray Burner - Bulk SATA Model WH08LS20K
> Item #: N82E16827136175
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy $149.99
> 1 MSI 790GX-G65 AM3 AMD 790GX HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard
> Item #: N82E16813130224
> Return Policy: Limited Replacement Only Return Policy $119.99
> 1 Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit 1-Pack for System Builders
> Item #: N82E16832116762
> Return Policy: Software Return Policy $174.99
> 1 AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor Model HDZ965FBGMBOX
> Item #: N82E16819103727
> Return Policy: CPU Replacement Only Return Policy $195.00
> 1 ZALMAN CNPS10X Extreme 120mm CPU Cooler with Worlds first PWM Fan Speed Controller
> Item #: N82E16835118051
> Return Policy: Standard Return Policy $75.03
>

EDIT: Just wanted to show what you could get if you stepped entirely away from Intel/NVidia.  For another $80, you can get true x16 on both PCIe slots.

--Dave


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 17, 2009, 10:37:16 AM
I think I would take the 160gb Intel SSD over a 120gb OCZ SSD any day of the week.

edit: Also, I am getting really close to taking this plunge and my new train of thought is I can get 2x80gb Intel SSD's cheaper than I can get 1x160gb Intel SSD.  RAID 0 for even faster performance, nearly the same storage and be out the door for less $$.

edit #2: Also, the Intel is a 2.5" drive compared to the OCZ 3.5 inch.  This adds some longevity, if you upgrade this thing later on you can dump the old one into your laptop.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on December 17, 2009, 05:49:39 PM
I think that if you buy Crossfire currently, you're just punishing yourself. ATI has a long way to go to get microstuttering under control. SLI is way more matured, but still pretty much a luxury and the individual NVidia highend cards (GT200) are currently inferior to their ATI counterparts (5xxx models).

With something like 2x4890 or 2x5850/2x5870 you might brute-force your way around micro-stuttering by simply crunching enough frames to stay ahead of the magical 30FPS barrier, but the higher you crank quality up, the more you're likely to get there.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Goreschach on December 17, 2009, 08:45:06 PM
Crossfire/SLI are both bullshit. A high end 5XXX card will run any game(except maybe Crysis, which sucks) maxed out for the next several years. It's just wasted money for extra e-peen and stability issues.

300 for a power supply is complete snake oil. You can pick up one just fine for around 100, even to power a 5970. I'd recommend a Corsair. They're fairly new to psu's, but they've put out some good ones.

If you're looking mainly for gaming, skip the bloomfields and pick up a lynnfield. The decreased max memory is of no concern, and it has an integrated pci-e controller.

Really, these days the only justifiable purchase to spurge on is an SSD. Either pick up an Intel or a drive with an indilinx controller.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 17, 2009, 09:34:12 PM
Well, technically I went $52 over (https://secure.newegg.com/WishList/MySavedWishDetail.aspx?ID=11651085), you could always shave a little money on the HDD.  Should show that, it's a public wishlist.

EDIT: Just wanted to show what you could get if you stepped entirely away from Intel/NVidia.  For another $80, you can get true x16 on both PCIe slots.

--Dave
Your CPU less powerful than the i5-750 and only slightly cheaper (by $5). Or to put it another way AMD's top-end CPU is not even a match for Intel's lowest end LGA 1156 CPU. If I was going to spend that much on a computer I'd prefer something with more "headroom" for the future, but I'm the type that will upgrade CPUs. I also prefer to spend more on the CPU itself initially as it *is* a pain to upgrade, unlike a video card, so I prefer to upgrade CPUs as infrequently as possible.

Dual 4890s is about the same as a single 5870 (some games 2x4890 is faster, some games the 5870 is faster) so I don't think it's worth putting up with Crossfire (as Goreschach described above) for roughly the same performance/price.

If you wanted to build a lower-end machine AMD is a very good choice as Intel isn't competitive down in that price range but for a $2500 system it seems odd to gimp your CPU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on December 17, 2009, 11:30:15 PM
Yeah, it was mostly a "what if" exercise.  High-end CPU's have tilted towards Intel for several years now, but low-end and mid-range is all AMD.  Personally, I think $2500 is an insane amount to spend on a gaming rig, you can get 90% of the performance for $1000 and still have plenty of upgrade headroom.  I actually just de-SLI'd my rig, putting the pair of 7800GT's the original owner probably spent $800 for into family computers and replacing them with a single 4870 (not much performance boost, but it let me work out a significant upgrade for everyone in the house, including two everything-but-the-HDD rebuilds for 5 year old systems, for $700 total).

--Dave

EDIT As for OCZ vs. Intel SSD; The OCZ has a far higher write speed, and a bigger cache, as well as a 25% higher MTBF rating.  I can see your point, but if I wanted to RAID brute-force the problem, I'd probably work around this little unit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227393), RAID 5 with four or five of those.  I've got 6 SATA ports on my mobo, and it's not hard to find them with 8 or 10.  What else are you going to do with them?  Actually, that's probably exactly what I'll do for my next major upgrade on this rig.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 18, 2009, 12:24:09 AM
EDIT As for OCZ vs. Intel SSD; The OCZ has a far higher write speed, and a bigger cache, as well as a 25% higher MTBF rating. 

That colossus OCZ drive doesn't support TRIM and is pretty expensive per gb even for a SSD.  The performance on it is faster because it is built like 4 SSD's crammed into 1 package with a built in RAID controller.  On the flip side I just read somewhere that if you RAID the Intel SSD's they do not support TRIM either, so I am back to looking at a single 160gb Intel drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: OcellotJenkins on December 18, 2009, 10:59:59 AM
I have a question about SSDs.  If you have your OS installed on one of these, and your games/apps on say a Caviar Black drive, will you still see a significant performance improvement?  I mean it stands to reason the machine will boot quicker, but will game/app performance improve enough to warrant the upgrade cost?  


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 18, 2009, 01:24:52 PM
I have a question about SSDs.  If you have your OS installed on one of these, and your games/apps on say a Caviar Black drive, will you still see a significant performance improvement?  I mean it stands to reason the machine will boot quicker, but will game/app performance improve enough to warrant the upgrade cost?  

I would load key apps (photoshop/office) on the SSD, yes you will see overall improvement as the OS will be on the SSD, but no a game loaded on a 2nd non SSD drive will not open noticeably faster.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on December 18, 2009, 03:59:31 PM
MMO's show some of the biggest performance gains from an SSD, because they were the worst for randomly wanting to load bits of texture.  But games in general get a big performance gain from the SSD.  Order of magnitude improvements in cold boot and game startup/level loading times are typical, it also vastly improves pagefile performance (meaning app switching is no longer as big a deal).  RAID 0 or RAID 5 arrays of 5+ good drives can approach the theoretical limits of SATA 1 throughput.

But it means you have to pick and choose which games you really want to play, unless you're prepared to pay a really large amount to get enough capacity.

--Dave


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on December 18, 2009, 04:26:49 PM
I have a question about SSDs.  If you have your OS installed on one of these, and your games/apps on say a Caviar Black drive, will you still see a significant performance improvement?  I mean it stands to reason the machine will boot quicker, but will game/app performance improve enough to warrant the upgrade cost?  

I own an Indilinx-controller 64 GB SSD, a JMicron 32GB SSD (POS, bought before I realized what that means), 2 WD Black Drives in Raid 0. I tried lots of possible combinations with that.

Regardless of what people say and the theoretical benchmarks, aside from the extremely fast random access time, for gaming the SSD offers little perceivable advantage over a RAID 0 array, which in turn offers little perceivable difference over a single WD Black for me.

After trying various options, I settled to:

  • Indilinx-SSD as boot/OS/app drive (64 GB is plenty for everything, including Office/Photoshop and so on. I think I'm at 33 GB usage or so with all that I could think of installed)
  • Raid 0 array as my gaming drive and hosting the page file. It doesn't make a hell of a difference, but hey, I can do it, so why not. If one drive fails, all my game installs are fubared, I don't care much.
  • Raid 1 array as my "data" drive, symlinked for the user home directory under Windows 7. So all my documents, music, videos etc. are redundant, I never worry about backups.
  • JMicron crap as portable "USB HDD", as it actually has a mini-USB connector and I couldn't figure another use for it.

The raid 0/raid 1 stuff is actually a matrix raid on an ICH10R controller, meaning it uses partitions from two physical drives for two different types of raids, which is cool. I wouldn't know what to do with 2TB of storage otherwise.

Page file on raid 0, mainly to not hog the SSD down and saves me space on the SSD. I even ran with page file disabled for quite some time without any troubles, except for when I decided to 5-box WoW and the damn Firefox memory leak crashed me. Then I enabled page file back on and switched to Chrome!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: OcellotJenkins on December 18, 2009, 05:28:29 PM
Thanks for the information guys, that is certainly helpful.  I think I'll probably wait until about this time next year to take the SSD plunge.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 04, 2010, 12:44:20 AM
Arise! Now that it's tax time and I'm looking at a nice refund, I'm looking to build a new system in the $1000-1500 range. I mostly play WoW but I'd like to be able to run other things and have them look pretty. Doesn't need to be top of the line, as I'm not a huge FPS person, but I want something new. Here's what I'm looking at so far:

Processor:
Intel Core i7-920 2.66GHz LGA 1366 Quad-Core Processor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115202

Mobo:
GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD3R X58 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128375

RAM:
Kingston HyperX 8GB (4 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104167

Graphics Card:
SAPPHIRE 100284L Radeon HD 5750 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102859

Are these all pretty decent choices? I've used some of the suggestions in this thread and some stuff I've read online. Anywhere I can get better performance for the same price, substantial upgrade for a small amount more, or big savings with only a small downgrade?

I'd also like to pick up an SSD to install WoW and Win7 on; is this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167013) one any good? It doesn't need to be too big, just big enough for WoW and the OS.

Thanks in advance.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 04, 2010, 01:19:03 AM
Have you looked at a LGA 1156 setup instead? Might save you a few bucks.

If future storage options is important I'd also suggest looking for a MB that supports USB 3.0/SATA 6.0 Gbps. You have to read the fine print on those boards, though, to make sure those ports are supported by at least PCI-e x4 (some only use PCI-e x1 which isn't enough bandwidth).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 04, 2010, 06:04:15 AM
Not sure I would buy into Sata 3/USB 3 mainboard at this point, as most of it is very first gen, but other than that Trippy makes a valid point.

If you stick with LGA1366/Bloomfield i7, buy a triple-channel kit (3x2GB) instead, as the Bloomfield supports that unlike LGA1156.

Your SSD is good! Like in "very high-end good", the link you posted is to the enterprise-class, premium-priced SLC X25-E. You might want to get the X25-M 80GB gen2 model, which is usually more than enough for mainstream computer use (even though it uses MLC, shouldn't bother you) and costs a fraction of the comparable X25-E.

I do think the graphics card is not a good choice though. 5750 is basically very mid-range. Unless you really need DX11, you could spend a bit more and either get a 4870/4890 or a 5850 (for even more) as those are a way better investment for gaming PCs than an SSD.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on February 04, 2010, 09:27:46 AM
Might be worth it to hold off until the new nVidia GPU's hit the market this March (I think?).  That's what I decided to do.  Been doing most of my gaming on my PS3 or 360 lately anyway.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 04, 2010, 12:18:52 PM
Have you looked at a LGA 1156 setup instead? Might save you a few bucks.

If future storage options is important I'd also suggest looking for a MB that supports USB 3.0/SATA 6.0 Gbps. You have to read the fine print on those boards, though, to make sure those ports are supported by at least PCI-e x4 (some only use PCI-e x1 which isn't enough bandwidth).
Good call, looking at switching to this processor Trippy:
Intel Core i5-750 Lynnfield 2.66GHz 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115215

Thanks for the heads up about the SSD Kageh; don't really know much about the tech so I just browsed the lower capacity ones assuming they'd be cheaper. I'll pick up the X25-M; going to look into the graphics cards you suggested when I get home.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 04, 2010, 12:55:15 PM
The i5s don't support HyperThreading. If that bothers you you can move up to the i7-860 (assuming you want to switch to LGA 1156) which is basically the same price point as the i7-920 but it has a higher base clock speed and has a better "Turbo Boost" mode. The i7-920 is still better at multi-processing/multi-threading, though, even though the 860 and 920 both have HyperThreading.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 04, 2010, 03:10:07 PM
I can live without the HT, so I'll stick with the i5. Switching to this graphics card per Kageh's suggestion:

SAPPHIRE 100279-1GL Radeon HD 4870 1GB 256-bit GDDR5
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102849

Also adding this SSD:

Intel X25-M Mainstream SSDSA2M080G2R5 2.5" 80GB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167023

That puts me at about $1100 just from newegg, without shopping around for prices (Are they still generally the cheapest around? Haven't bought components in a year or so) and I still need to add a PSU, heatsink, case, and DVD drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 04, 2010, 04:14:13 PM
For help with the graphics card decision, here's a decent benchmark round-up:

http://www.tweakpc.de/hardware/tests/grafikkarten/xfx_ati_radeon_hd_5750/s08.php?benchmark=l4d&lang=eng

Select the game engine/resolution that interests you the most you'll see how the cards do against each other.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on February 04, 2010, 05:45:14 PM
Are you using an existing psu and case?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 04, 2010, 06:15:55 PM
Nope, I'm gonna need a new case and PSU.

Thanks for the benchmark roundup, although I really wish they had WoW on there as that's mostly what I'm going to be playing with it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 04, 2010, 06:52:39 PM
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,689378/WoW-Wrath-of-the-Lich-King-Benchmarks-with-Ati-and-Nvidia-graphics-cards/Practice/?page=2

Note that those tests are run with maxed/nearly maxed AA/AF settings.

WoW will run on a GeForce 2 class GPU with the resolution/settings set low enough (on my GeForce 4 Go laptop) and I've run it at 1920 x 1080 on an 9400M integrated GPU so really anything other than an Intel integrated GPU *pos* GMA950 *pos* would be fine if you are willing to turn down some settings.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 04, 2010, 09:30:47 PM
So I'm planning a rig, too. $1000ish is my budget.

(http://lh3.ggpht.com/_mtmggj7FaRo/S2tzD9dMNBI/AAAAAAAAAIg/OvvAf0emU_w/wootcomputer4.png)

Any comments? Suggestions? I want to play 1080p on my HDTV, do some Maya work, and home entertainment etc.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 04, 2010, 11:01:21 PM
I'd go with a more "normal" motherboard.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 05, 2010, 12:59:19 AM
Speaking of motherboards, I had forgot to find a new one since changing to the i5 processor; probably going to go with this one:

Intel BOXDP55WB LGA 1156 Intel P55 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121388

How big of a PSU will I need for this system? Will a 650W suffice, if I don't ever intend to SLI or overclock? Something like this:

DYNAPOWER USA EJ-650A80 650W ATX12V v2.2 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817255049

I'm still debating which case to go with. I want something that looks cool, and has a removable side panel/motherboard tray. Maybe one of these two:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811156189
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811156078


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 05, 2010, 01:34:35 AM
For motherboard, unless you really need mATX (for a HTPC case for example), I wouldn't buy mATX form factor. They are quite cramped to work with and have very few expansion possibilities, which might be a pain in the long run even if it doesn't bother you now. My recommendation would be to buy something mainstream from the Asus/Gigabyte/Foxconn P55 line-up. Do you plan to overclock? Cause mainboard might make a huge difference there.

Cases: I'm a big Lancool/Lian Li fan, I think you can't beat those for quality, even though they are a bit pricey. Looks might seem a bit plain though, but IMO still very stylish. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=lancool&x=0&y=0

If you want something more fancy looking, I would recommend Antec 900 (one or two, doesn't matter), Coolermaster HAF 932/922/690 or - for a premium price but well worth every penny - Silverstone Raven 1 (or 2 if you can't get rev. 1).



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on February 05, 2010, 01:54:18 AM
Quote
I think you can't beat those for quality

As I say in every thread where someone mentions a case of any quality, Zalman says hello.

They're the only cases that don't make me wretch in terms of looks and the build quality is best in class. Odds are they make Lian Li look cheap though (cost-wise).

Edit: And yea, they do.

Edit 2: I've had two Silvestones and previously an Antec. Zalman is better than both of them also.

http://zalman.co.kr/ENG/product/Product_Read.asp?idx=367


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 05, 2010, 02:58:41 AM
I'll take your word on that. I wish I'd seen a Zalman so far, sadly Zalman is very under-represented in the Euro zone, I think there's about one or two stores where I live listing the cases. You see plenty of CPU coolers from them, but hardly any cases.

I'm currently using one of the more expensive Lian Li full towers which I managed to snag on ebay for a fraction of the price and I absolutely love it.

The reason I'm currently recommending the Raven from Silverstone is that I've seen amazing things about what the airflow with the inverted mounting can do to your temperatures.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on February 05, 2010, 09:30:56 AM
I'll recommend the Sileo 500 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119192) once again. 

It probably isn't the coolest case in the world (need a Zalman CPU cooler or equivalent) and probably wouldn't want to overclock w/o water but it is pretty damn quiet.  The tool-less design is damn near perfect as well, you only need tools for motherboard or PSU replacement and rolled edges on any part of the chassis you are likely to come near.  My only real complaint is that the plastic tabs holding the pci cards in are a tad on the chintzy side.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 05, 2010, 11:01:04 AM
Those Zalman cases are really nice. It reminds me of an expensive car or a VFSHG.

I redid my list of stuff (w/ a Zalman). Here's the new guy:

(http://lh6.ggpht.com/_mtmggj7FaRo/S2xNYGut2QI/AAAAAAAAAIs/0EocjEywTKI/wootcomputer6.png)

I don't know what a more normal mother board would be, but I pretty much just found the recommended CPU/mobo from another forum, found a deal, and then filled in the rest.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 05, 2010, 11:32:58 AM
The one you had before was a server mobo.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on February 05, 2010, 11:48:29 AM
Nope, I'm gonna need a new case and PSU.
I like my antec p180. You've just got to be sure the power lines reach, because the psu is in a bottom chamber. I also put in a long psu and had to move the fan from the stock position. Other than that it looks nice, it's quiet and has a front door for stealth. I do have mine visible in the living room, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Evil Elvis on February 05, 2010, 04:47:45 PM
Re: CPU cooler

I purchased the same CPU cooler, since it was about the only 1156 compatible cooler that newegg carries: it's a piece of shit.  Crappy plastic mount (which i cracked trying to adjust it) that's a complete pita to attach.

The stock cooler is more than fine if you don't plan on OC'ing, and it's not too noisy.  Scythe makes some nice 1156 compat coolers, and I think you can order directly from the manufacturer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 05, 2010, 04:59:03 PM
I use this one on my LGA 1156 board:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608014&cm_re=noctua-_-35-608-014-_-Product

It's a "screw-in" so there's no attachment issues (no "pins" or pressure clips) and the backplate use its own set of screws to attach so removing the cooler means the backplate won't get out of alignment which is nice if you can't easily get at bottom of the motherboard.

Note that attaching the fan on the side closer to the front of the case may restrict the height of the memory that will fit in the slots closest to the CPU, depending on the layout of the MB.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 05, 2010, 05:00:17 PM
The one you had before was a server mobo.
It was part of a bundle deal which is why I suggested he find a normal desktop motherboard.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lucas on February 06, 2010, 07:10:44 AM
Hey folks,

Time for me to to buy a new rig, yes yes. Budget around (hopefully) 1800-2000 Euros

So, I was thinking about (only talking about the main components):

Case:
Coolermaster ATCS 840 Silver Full Tower
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/12670-cooler-master-atcs-840-full-tower-case-review.html

Motherboard:

Asus P6T Deluxe? Or anyways something that supports the I7 family. I'm not really interested in overclocking.
http://www.techspot.com/review/129-asus-p6t-deluxe/

Processor:

Intel i7-960
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=37151&processor=i7-960&spec-codes=SLBEU

OS:

Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit

RAM:

I'm a hardcore gamer, but even though FPS are not really my cup of tea, I want to invest in a good quantity of RAM. Aren't 8GB a bit excessive, anyways? I was thinking about 4 or 6 max (DDR 3).

GFX:

Move the Nvidia 8800GTS 640MB I have on my present rig to the new one, and wait for the new Nvidia generation. Yeah, I'll live with the "bottleneck" for a bit but who cares

Soundcard:

Move my Asus D2/PM to the new rig
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/multimedia/display/asus-xonar.html



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 06, 2010, 01:20:05 PM
i7-960 is really bad price/performance ration imo. It is a good processor, but i7-920s can go that high with a very mild and nearly 100% safe overclock (no voltage increase, I'd even say you can probably undervolt a 920 and get 3.2-3.4 Ghz easily).

Do you really need Hyperthreading? Otherwise, like many people said in this thread, you could always get a LGA1156/i5-750 combo which has lower power consumption, generates less heat and has a better turbo implementation for those times where it would activate. If you're gaming, for many current games HT can still be a problem. If you're rather doing lots of audio/video/image processing, the HT advantage shows.

For LGA1366, Asus P6T is a solid choice, and there are variants that are cheaper than the Deluxe too. Gigabyte and Foxconn make decent i7 mainboards, even the one from Intel isn't really bad.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on February 07, 2010, 11:02:31 PM
Quick question - for Win7 I7 gaming system with a single video card... finding single-slot mobo without built-in video card is next to impossible. Should I just by SLI/Crossfire mobo to use with single card?



Soundcard:

Move my Asus D2/PM to the new rig


Any issues disabling built-in sound? I have decent sound system dedicated to PC and always felt built-in sound cards were weak point. What would be good sound card to pair with Onkyo TX-DS595 receiver I have?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 07, 2010, 11:31:39 PM
Quick question - for Win7 I7 gaming system with a single video card... finding single-slot mobo without built-in video card is next to impossible. Should I just by SLI/Crossfire mobo to use with single card?
Yes and if you get a chipset/MB that supports dual x16 bandwidth (not just dual x16 slots) you'll have the option of putting the video card in the "lower" slot which may keep things a bit cooler (the video card won't be jammed up against the CPU).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 08, 2010, 12:52:23 PM
(http://lh6.ggpht.com/_mtmggj7FaRo/S3BUyecwW9I/AAAAAAAAAI0/HaWToEHuOQw/wootcomputer7.png)

This setup work better?

Also, do any of you guys know anything about the Windows 7 Pro deal here (http://www.microsoft.com/student/discounts/theultimatesteal-us/default.aspx) on MS's website?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lt.Dan on February 08, 2010, 05:55:26 PM
You may be able to save a few bucks by using 1033 memory over 1600.  The performance gains from faster memory are small, like 1-2%. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on February 08, 2010, 07:43:02 PM
I really recommend going with one of the name brand cards that offer lifetime or even better double lifetime warranty (means you can void the warranty once and still return it if it dies).  I always have gone with XFX recently but there were several to choose from last time I researched it.

I also think Corsair memory is worth the relatively small price jump because I've never known anyone irl to have a bad experience with it and I hear bout bad sticks all the time on the webs.

Everything else has looked pretty good.

I have an Asus P6T board and I would recommend it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 08, 2010, 07:50:08 PM
This setup work better?
That Gigabyte MB is some sort of weird "legacy support" board (a parallel port? really?). It's okay for a no-frills board if you don't care that the legacy stuff is taking up space that could've been used for other ports/connectors.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 09, 2010, 08:43:00 AM
Do you guys have any monitor recommendations and/or where to buy them? I hear Newegg's not the best, so I left out my monitor from that order. I'm going to use my HDTV for a bit, but I'd like to move my PC to my room afterwards. Something that can roTATE would be rad. Also <$300ish but preferably ~$200.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on February 09, 2010, 09:22:23 AM
This setup work better?
That Gigabyte MB is some sort of weird "legacy support" board (a parallel port? really?). It's okay for a no-frills board if you don't care that the legacy stuff is taking up space that could've been used for other ports/connectors.


How else can you continue to use your cassette reader?  :why_so_serious:

I use to get excited about building a bad ass machine... now its more about cheapest middle-of-the-road builds now. Which means I'll be building this same style pc in 3 years. I need to sit down soon and start thinking about what and how I want my next case to be since I'll probably fabricate it myself...I am thinking milk cartons, maybe old-style erector sets. Time to crach the flea markets for ideas.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 09, 2010, 01:48:13 PM
Hardwood.  Plumb it with a liquid cooling system done in copper.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 09, 2010, 03:12:20 PM
Wish you guys said something before I pulled the trigger on my build. Do I need anything to build my PC besides what comes in the boxes and a couple screwdrivers?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 09, 2010, 03:18:26 PM
If your case comes with an assortment of screws you should be fine.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on February 09, 2010, 06:43:08 PM
Is this a good place to talk about Windows PC performance metrics and the logging of them?  New thread?  Simple, complex?

I'm looking at upgrading my wife's computer in some fashion but it is too new to just throw money in its direction.  Need a help in Win7 performance metrics.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 09, 2010, 06:49:16 PM
New thread.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on February 09, 2010, 07:09:16 PM
Wish you guys said something before I pulled the trigger on my build. Do I need anything to build my PC besides what comes in the boxes and a couple screwdrivers?

Get yourself a small philips-head screwdriver with a long shaft. It helps tremendously in tight spots and also serves as a spike to plunge into your leg when the frustration gets too unbearable (if something doesn't work). In addition, try and pick up a pair of long nose tweezers just in case something drops or you lose a screw.

Your mobo should come with a ton of screws and spacers. Its a pretty plug-n-play process since jumpers went the way of the dodo. Most importantly, take it slow.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Le0 on February 10, 2010, 03:22:39 AM
My turn,
I wanna upgrade and this is what I came up with.
This PC is mainly for gaming and otherwise it is for internet/video.

I'm still wondering if I should get an i7 instead since I'll be spending so much money, i7 would be easier to upgrade later on?

(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj70/euphorik99/Computer%20Specs/i5_2.jpg)

Also added an SSD in this build
(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj70/euphorik99/Computer%20Specs/i7_SSD.jpg)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 10, 2010, 05:12:20 AM
1. The ram is triple channel, the board is dual channel.
2. Socket LGA1156 is not the most future proof.
3. You won't actually feel the need upgrade the processor until after Intel has moved onto the next socket type and you need to replace the mobo.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 10, 2010, 05:15:25 AM
Components look solid, SSD too. Careful, you have an LGA1366 CPU but LGA1156 mainboard. CPU cooler is kind of meh, IMO. If you have the money, I'd buy a Megahalem or D-14/U12P from Noctua. If you want best price/performance ratio, probably Scythe Mugen 2 or Scythe Grand Kama Cross (which is "top blow" design instead of tower and a great cooler for the money). If you don't plan to OC at all, boxed might even be enough (if a bit noisy when getting hot).

i7/LGA1366 vs. LGA1156 is a very good question. Is your PC mainly for gaming? Currently i5-750 outperforms or is at least on par with i7-920 for games, runs cooler and needs less power. Triple channel and dual PCIx16 lanes is one of the advantages of the LGA1366/X58 design if you need any of those, but the memory advantage doesn't really show in games and the PCI stuff only matters with SLI.

LGA1366 has some powerful stuff coming, like Gulftown/i9 (6-cores). But we're probably looking at least another 1-2 years before it becomes mainstream, and the advantage for gaming is still questionable since it would require a massive shift in programming paradigms towards parallelization.

D0 i7-920 is great to overclock. Don't know about i5, but it looks good on paper.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 10, 2010, 05:19:13 AM
Everything I've read about the i5-750 says it thrashes the shit out of everything else in existence except for tasks that make good use of threading.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 10, 2010, 05:57:19 AM
That is probably a bit of an exaggeration though. For raw number crunching, the i7 is similar in computing power but is usually hampered for games by HT, given how HT can lead to threads from the same application starving each other on the same physical core. You can turn HT off with an i7 and have similar results in games.

Here's a comprehensive game comparison at 19200x1200 average fps on i5 vs i7 with a GTX275 (full forum thread - sadly in german - here (http://www.computerbase.de/forum/showthread.php?t=641369)):
(http://www.entrox.at/octacore/images/i5vsi7/19201200avg.png)

As you can see, there isn't really that much difference, sometimes i5 is better, sometimes i7 is better, both can be OC'ed, both vary in results.

For an interesting example of a modern game which actually uses HT - of which there aren't really that many out, but who knows what is to come - i7 can outperform i5s: (Anno1404 (http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,691811/Lynnfield-tested-Intel-Core-i5-750-and-Core-i7-860-benchmarked-in-Anno-1404-Dawn-of-Discovery/Reviews/))

The appeal of the i5 IMO comes from the reduced costs for CPU+MB+dual channel kit vs i7+highend X58 MB+triple channel kit. You get similar / slightly better performance for about 60% of the cost.

For a closing thought, here's the power consumption under load:
(http://www.entrox.at/octacore/images/i5vsi7/verbrauchlast_web.png)

At lower voltage but similar clock speed, you see the i7 consuming an intimidating 100W more than the i5, for a grand total of 350W (a huge figure). The i7 was theoretically undervolted (!) for that overclock, as most boards would default to 1.25V or higher. Assuming your computer runs 10hrs/day, thats 1kW saving per day.




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Le0 on February 10, 2010, 07:50:35 AM
Thanks for the answers.

I'm going to go for a Alpenföhn Nordwand I think, the others seems to be a bit expensive. http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HS-008-AL&groupid=701&catid=57&subcat=1395

I decided to go for the i5 setup, I can't really justify the cost of an i7 setup for only a little bit of performance boost, also since I mainly do gaming I won't benefit from the HT stuff.

Oops, I did not notice the RAM was a triple channel, I'll change that, thanks.

edit: typo



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on February 10, 2010, 10:03:08 AM
More of an indulgence for me, but I really like the modular PSUs. My current PC I built, I went out of my way to grab one and I can't say enough about the neatness of the inside of my box as well as the airflow with a 120mm in front and back along with an inner core 120mm.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 10, 2010, 11:46:55 AM
Everything I've read about the i5-750 says it thrashes the shit out of everything else in existence except for tasks that make good use of threading.
That's not possible since the i7-860 and i7-870 are Lynnfield chips like the i5-750 that are clocked faster than the i5-750, and those i7s have HyperThreading. You could argue the Lynnfield i7s aren't worth the extra cost but that's not the same as saying the i5-750 trashes both of them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on February 10, 2010, 12:59:17 PM
More of an indulgence for me, but I really like the modular PSUs. My current PC I built, I went out of my way to grab one and I can't say enough about the neatness of the inside of my box as well as the airflow with a 120mm in front and back along with an inner core 120mm.

I was thinking this as well.  Corsair makes some nice modular PSU's but if you've never cared don't start now.

I'd try to find a better case, better cpu cooler and you should be money.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Le0 on February 11, 2010, 04:58:55 AM
Here is my final list of stuff, thanks for your advice guys!

(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj70/euphorik99/Computer%20Specs/i5_SSD_FINAL.jpg)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 11, 2010, 05:29:01 AM
That's not possible since the i7-860 and i7-870 are Lynnfield chips like the i5-750 that are clocked faster than the i5-750, and those i7s have HyperThreading. You could argue the Lynnfield i7s aren't worth the extra cost but that's not the same as saying the i5-750 trashes both of them.

I've seen benchmarking comparisons that suggest otherwise, but, you know, variability.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 11, 2010, 05:33:11 AM
That's not possible since the i7-860 and i7-870 are Lynnfield chips like the i5-750 that are clocked faster than the i5-750, and those i7s have HyperThreading. You could argue the Lynnfield i7s aren't worth the extra cost but that's not the same as saying the i5-750 trashes both of them.

I've seen benchmarking comparisons that suggest otherwise, but, you know, variability.
There are glitches with Turbo Boost in individual benchmarks but if you look at things overall there's nothing that shows the i5-750 is faster than the i7-870. The i7-860 is more debatable.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 11, 2010, 08:21:22 AM
Here is my final list of stuff, thanks for your advice guys!

(http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj70/euphorik99/Computer%20Specs/i5_SSD_FINAL.jpg)

If you haven't purchased it yet, I would suggest looking around for SSD prices at zipzoomfly or so. Newegg notoriously overprices SSDs. A quick lookup saves you $45 over NE on that drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Fraeg on February 11, 2010, 01:29:06 PM
Hardwood.  Plumb it with a liquid cooling system done in copper.

nah if he really wants to impress he will build it in one of these:


comes with its very own easy to use handle.   Hmm that was meant as a joke... but that would actually be really really cool, guess you would have to make some holes, building ships in bottles might be all that, but the mobo might cause some issues.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: stu on February 11, 2010, 01:41:43 PM
I have a friend who built a Linux system into a milk crate and loved it. Maybe I can get some pics.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on February 11, 2010, 09:16:29 PM
Been thinking about trying to build something around a nano-ITX mobo into a carved wooden box.  Can get some really nice-looking ones from India for chump change in workable sizes (8-10 inches exterior measurements, $20-40).  Hard part is figuring out how to ventilate without ruining the look of the box.

--Dave


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 13, 2010, 10:06:49 AM
If I wanted a new game to put my setup to the test, what should I get? Preferably it'd be something off Steam, but...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 13, 2010, 11:41:35 AM
If you're into FPS, Crysis and Crysis:Warhead have always been good showcase titles.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 13, 2010, 01:09:12 PM
If you're into FPS, Crysis and Crysis:Warhead have always been good showcase titles.

How about RPG? I've been hearing Dragon Age (I've also heard bad things :() and The Witcher.

Edit: Also, the THQ collection is on sale on Steam for $50. Dawn of War 2 sounds like it would be cool at 1080p. Yay/nay?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 13, 2010, 01:45:19 PM
DoW 2 is great and should look sweet, but I don't think it is really that taxing on the system. DO:A is good, yes.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on February 15, 2010, 11:27:39 AM
If I wanted a new game to put my setup to the test, what should I get? Preferably it'd be something off Steam, but...

The Sims 3

:why_so_serious:

EDIT: I don't want to buy ATi cards!  Dammit.  I am going to throw a lot of money on two matched cards to fit on a ASUS P6T Deluxe and I'd rather not get ATi.  Any hope for Nvidia to stop sucking soon?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 15, 2010, 12:25:32 PM
If I wanted a new game to put my setup to the test, what should I get? Preferably it'd be something off Steam, but...

The Sims 3

:why_so_serious:

EDIT: I don't want to buy ATi cards!  Dammit.  I am going to throw a lot of money on two matched cards to fit on a ASUS P6T Deluxe and I'd rather not get ATi.  Any hope for Nvidia to stop sucking soon?
Depends if NVIDIA actually ships the GF100 in March (well, makes the GPU available in sufficient quantities for vendors to make cards with the GPU) and if you can actually find two and have enough power to power them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 15, 2010, 02:25:59 PM
The GF100 prototype should be on display at Cebit, including (finally) some benchmarks, as launch is due sometimes mid-march according to the usual leaks on the web. I'm also quite anxious to see thow they turn out.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on February 18, 2010, 03:44:06 PM
Count me in the fingers-crossed-for-nvidia camp. Jump to 1080p wasn't as bad as I'd thought but I do miss the headroom my 8800gtx had at 720p. GTX 285 looks decent, but I'd really like some mule kicking for that kinda bread.

Mostly interested in nvidia because I want to play with 3d tech.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 23, 2010, 05:16:24 PM
I'm looking at some accessories for my PC. Currently I'm running pretty terrible USB kb/m to my system displayed on an HDTV. This is the monitor I'm looking at:

Acer B243HLbmdrz Black 24" 5ms Widescreen White LED backlight LCD Monitor 250 cd/m2 ACM 8,000,000:1 Built-in Speakers - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009203

*I'm also looking at this HP monitor, but it's pretty pricey :(
http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF06a/382087-382087-64283-72270-444767-3648442.html

I'm also looking into Filco keyboards. Does anyone have experience with mechanical kbs? Especially in relation to laptop kbs (I haven't had a desktop in years). It's wired, and I'd like wireless, but that's ok becaue I hear they're awesome. Also red escape key = sexy. Mice... I have no idea where to start.

*Edit


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on February 23, 2010, 05:37:25 PM
Quote
Does anyone have experience with mechanical kbs?

Search button, your friend.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lt.Dan on February 23, 2010, 06:04:47 PM
Count me in the fingers-crossed-for-nvidia camp. Jump to 1080p wasn't as bad as I'd thought but I do miss the headroom my 8800gtx had at 720p. GTX 285 looks decent, but I'd really like some mule kicking for that kinda bread.

Mostly interested in nvidia because I want to play with 3d tech.
According to some early articles on 3d gaming I think youre going to need more graphics firepower than a GF100 based card.  The big problem is that the card has to render each screen twice - once for each eye.  That's a pretty big kick in the guts for graphics performance, even on leading edge systems and especially at higher resolutions. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on February 24, 2010, 08:58:02 AM
It's not bad but the card is running a bit hot. About 90C, used to hit 80C for most games that aren't Crysis. I've been turning off FSAA, which I used to max at 720p: performance seems about the same.

Problem is, single card nvidia solutions aren't performing much better right now, so there's not much of an upgrade path for me. I don't mind spending $$$ for good performance, but $350 for a 10% increase is dumb, especially as it's not future-proof.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 24, 2010, 09:45:55 AM
Quote
Does anyone have experience with mechanical kbs?

Search button, your friend.

That thread scares me.

As nice as Model-Ms might work for you, look like fuckass. I also don't think the clickyclick of the keyboard will work when I'm typing papers. Anyone here use a Filco board?

Also, I am looking for an IPS monitor for my rig. I've found this NEC for $325

http://www.amazon.com/NEC-EA231WMI-BK-NEC-EA231WMI-BK-23-inch-Ws-LCD-1920X1080-1000-1-VGA-Black-14MS-Monitor/dp/B002LARVYK

I'm concerned mostly because I've never seen IPS monitors for <$500, and there are very few places for reviews on these things. Any help?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 24, 2010, 10:43:23 AM
I've had very good luck with NEC. That said, I have seen some 'budget' NEC monitors that looked like total butt. This is an eIPS (not sure what the e stands for, will google later), so it'll have the usual caveat of slower response times that allegedly will frustrate hardcore gamers. I have an NEC IPS and I play Call of Duty just fine. Sure, I'm not l33t sH0tz McTw1tch, but its never stopped me from having fun. Oh, ya, and this is with a wireless keyboard, which is apparently death to FPS 'purists'.

Summary: If I didn't already have an NEC monitor, I'd buy 3 of these. In fact, I'm considering buying 2 and kicking the GF out of her den so I can set up Eyefinity.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 24, 2010, 11:21:53 AM
Also, I am looking for an IPS monitor for my rig. I've found this NEC for $325

http://www.amazon.com/NEC-EA231WMI-BK-NEC-EA231WMI-BK-23-inch-Ws-LCD-1920X1080-1000-1-VGA-Black-14MS-Monitor/dp/B002LARVYK

I'm concerned mostly because I've never seen IPS monitors for <$500, and there are very few places for reviews on these things. Any help?
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1436160


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 24, 2010, 11:51:08 AM
Good heavens, a 53 page thread on a single monitor. I thought I got excited about monitors...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on February 24, 2010, 04:07:30 PM
I  :heart: me some hardocp.  You think that is crazy try reading some of their psu threads.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on February 24, 2010, 10:48:43 PM
You think that's crazy, go read Superfuture.

Edit: Example - Here's a 233 page thread on a single clothing company located in Shibuya, JP: http://www.superfuture.com/supertalk/showthread.php?t=52677

Fake Edit: I promise I don't read SuFu.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 25, 2010, 05:38:47 AM


Also, I am looking for an IPS monitor for my rig. I've found this NEC for $325

http://www.amazon.com/NEC-EA231WMI-BK-NEC-EA231WMI-BK-23-inch-Ws-LCD-1920X1080-1000-1-VGA-Black-14MS-Monitor/dp/B002LARVYK

I'm concerned mostly because I've never seen IPS monitors for <$500, and there are very few places for reviews on these things. Any help?

That monitor is supposedly very good for the price and well suited for gaming. I looked at it myself, but it sadly lacks HDMI, which was a deal-breaker for me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 25, 2010, 09:18:20 AM
Would this not work? (http://www.amazon.com/Eforcity-HDMI-F-DVI-M-Adaptor-Contacts/dp/B000E8X5Z0/ref=pd_sim_pc_2) Maybe with this  (http://www.amazon.com/Eforcity-Black-Meter-HDMI-Cable/dp/B000E8SY5Q/ref=pd_bxgy_pc_text_b)too?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 25, 2010, 09:57:04 AM
The NEC monitor supports DisplayPort which is like HDMI but free to use, and it isn't regulated as heavily.

And, yeah, as far as I can tell you can use HDMI > DVI converters. It's like stripping away the audio jacks in an RCA connection - you end up with just the video. I'm going to be hooking up my PS3 to this monitor with a DVI cable, and I'm looking to see what are the specific audio inputs on the monitor so I can get the right cables. Either that or get a proper audio system instead of the in-monitor speakers.

This computer shit is getting expensive. And I haven't even bought my keyboard yet.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on February 25, 2010, 01:25:07 PM
What are you trying to do with audio exactly?  It took me some doing to get my ps3 audio to run through my computer's powered monitors.

I have a 24" monitor w/ my ps3 on HDMI and my computer gpu on AVI.  For Audio I have a M-Audio 2496 with my speakers plugged into output and my ps3 plugged into input.  I can only run ps3 or pc audio, not both and in order to switch I need to open up the soundcard's controls and switch one dropdown menu, like 5 clicks total.  Its not the perfect setup but since I didn't want an amp, 2 sets of speakers, a tv etc. it seemed to be the best I could figure out within my budget at the time.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 25, 2010, 01:41:05 PM
Right now both my PS3 and computer are in the living room. My GPU on my PC has 2x DVI, DisplayPort, and an HDMI output. I've been swapping the HDMI (and the ethernet cord :-\ I have one of those building wi-fis with 1 ethernet jack in each room. And no router) between the PS3 and the PC. It's super ghetto and stupid. I cannot wait till this monitor comes in.

The current plan is to put the monitor + PC in my bedroom. The reason why I want to hook up a PS3 to the monitor is for when my friends and I play multiple PS3 at my house.

I'm not exactly sure how I want to handle the audio. The best case scenario would be a surround sound headset for each PS3 that isn't so loud that you can still yell at your body (couch co-op!), but that's probably not going to happen. We have a really sweet 5.1 audio setup for the big Plasma, so the first option would just annoy my friend who comes over to LAN/online-coop it.

Also, I use a PlaystationEye for my mic. In addition to being totally underused as a peripheral, it's also like a WiiSpeak for your PS3. It does a good job on its own getting rid of feedback (there is none). But the last time I tried doing that with 2 audio sources (at my friend's house he has a TV + Monitor setup each with separate speakers) there was really horrible feedback.

So! Headset probably would be best. But maybe I'd move the PS3 in the room for movie watching? I dunno. It's up in the air.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on February 25, 2010, 02:21:33 PM
Here is a challenge.

I have a friend who wants a new computer for gaming but doesn't want to spend any money.  What is a build for the cheapest top-to-bottom replacement (incl monitor and OS) that can still be considered adequate for gaming into the near future?  Easy Mode < $500, Winrar is < $400, hard mode is < $300.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 25, 2010, 02:37:17 PM
Tell your friend to save up more money. The monitor and OS is going to take at least half the budget so you are talking about building the "box" for ~$250 - $300.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Kageh on February 25, 2010, 04:37:29 PM
The NEC monitor supports DisplayPort which is like HDMI but free to use, and it isn't regulated as heavily.

And, yeah, as far as I can tell you can use HDMI > DVI converters.

What Engels linked would work, and there are pretty cheap HDMI > DVI cables available which work too, as long as the DVI input is HDCP capable. Unless you're getting unprotected stuff out of HDMI of course.

Sadly, I need to connect both a PS3 and a computer to it. There are HDMI to DVI cables for consoles available which are cheaper than buing a HDMI one and a HDMI>DVI adapter but DVI>DisplayPort (to connect the computer to a digital input) costs a lot so I'm not buying one of those. There are plenty of adequate TN monitors which are great for gaming at about half the price and without the need to spend additional money on cabling, as my wife is already glowering at me dubiously whenever I talk of purchasing new digital gadgets. Since I'm not doing any picture work that would require 100% Adobe RGB color space or anything the like, I'm still searching for something good. In the end, I was looking at Samsung 2450 or 2494 or a LG 2361.

OTOH, 3D Vision capable displays in 1080p and 24" are getting launched, so I'm back to scheming and planing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: schild on February 25, 2010, 05:10:58 PM
Here is a challenge.

I have a friend who wants a new computer for gaming but doesn't want to spend any money.  What is a build for the cheapest top-to-bottom replacement (incl monitor and OS) that can still be considered adequate for gaming into the near future?  Easy Mode < $500, Winrar is < $400, hard mode is < $300.

A PS3 and a 21" Monitor with HDMI.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Pennilenko on February 26, 2010, 03:51:06 PM
Here is a challenge.

I have a friend who wants a new computer for gaming but doesn't want to spend any money.  What is a build for the cheapest top-to-bottom replacement (incl monitor and OS) that can still be considered adequate for gaming into the near future?  Easy Mode < $500, Winrar is < $400, hard mode is < $300.

A PS3 and a 21" Monitor with HDMI.

Barely even that on his budget.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on February 27, 2010, 03:38:46 PM
$500 isn't that unreasonable for a bargin basement PC.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Goreschach on February 27, 2010, 04:45:17 PM
$500 isn't that unreasonable for a bargin basement PC.

Regardless, at that point a console is the correct answer. Unless he's interested in MMO's, FPS's, RPG's, or RTS's Blizzard or Valve, a console is pretty much the correct answer anyway. These days, we're mostly just getting console ports with higher res textures and shitty gui's.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Torinak on February 27, 2010, 05:02:07 PM
I need to replace a GT 7950 (one of its DVI ports no longer works reliably, and lack of dual monitors induces stabbiness in those accustomed to them).  What's the roughly-equivalent nVidia card these days? GT 240? GTS 250? The system only has a 500W power supply, and we'll be building new systems later this year, so I'm not looking for a major step up in video cards.

We're still very leery of ATI cards due to driver-related nightmares.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 27, 2010, 05:41:43 PM
$500 isn't that unreasonable for a bargin basement PC.
It is if you want to game on it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 28, 2010, 04:13:56 AM
We're still very leery of ATI cards due to driver-related nightmares.

nVidia currently eats shit with a spoon.  I actually really want to try one of their cards someday, but not any time soon I don't think.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 28, 2010, 10:27:48 AM
We're still very leery of ATI cards due to driver-related nightmares.

nVidia currently eats shit with a spoon.  I actually really want to try one of their cards someday, but not any time soon I don't think.

Uhm, based on what, exactly? Sure, Nvidia hasn't come out with real new hardware since the 295, but I wouldn't call it shit when you look at the benchmarks. Sure, its overpriced considering a high end 5000 series card does all the 295 does and has DX11 support, but I wouldn't call it crap.

The sad truth of the matter is that Nvidia has always seemed a better card because developers have always made damned sure their game works on Nvidia drivers, while sometimes leaving ATI in the lurch. This is probably going to change, since the more Nvidia is delayed in launching Fermi (the new card line), the more market share ATI is going to get, forcing developers to really work with ATI as much as Nvidia.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on February 28, 2010, 01:03:05 PM
Uhm, based on what, exactly? Sure, Nvidia hasn't come out with real new hardware since the 295, but I wouldn't call it shit when you look at the benchmarks. Sure, its overpriced considering a high end 5000 series card does all the 295 does and has DX11 support, but I wouldn't call it crap.

Their entire line of cards is underpowered compared to the equivalent dollar value ATi card, forgive the hyperbole.  That, and production shortages messing with prices and availability.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on February 28, 2010, 01:28:53 PM
Since ATI's drivers always suck, it doesn't matter that their hardware is better for the price.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on February 28, 2010, 04:52:32 PM
I switched back to ATI with the 4870, and have had no issues with the drivers. I'm now running a 5870, still no driver issues.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on February 28, 2010, 09:25:22 PM
That NEC monitor I linked above... it's awesome.

Also, portrait mode on 23" 16:9s is absurd.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 28, 2010, 09:59:13 PM
grats!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Aez on June 05, 2010, 05:54:28 PM
I'd like some advise on an upgrade.

I'm wondering if I can get away with a video card and GPU upgrade  or simply buy a new computer.  If an upgrade is possible, any suggestion?

Here's my system  :

AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual
Core Processor 4200+
2.21 Ghz, 3.50 GB of RAM
Nvidia 7900GT/GTO
Mother board : Asus M2N-SLI deluxe
Window xp




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: brellium on June 06, 2010, 02:07:31 AM
I'd like some advise on an upgrade.

I'm wondering if I can get away with a video card and GPU upgrade  or simply buy a new computer.  If an upgrade is possible, any suggestion?

Here's my system  :

AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual
Core Processor 4200+
2.21 Ghz, 3.50 GB of RAM
Nvidia 7900GT/GTO
Mother board : Asus M2N-SLI deluxe
Window xp
You're replacing the system, the processor is weak 90mm 1mb l2 cache

On my system I went Intel for the first time, locked myself out of an upgrade path, but picked up a MB and a yorkfield 9550 for 400$ (a quad core Xeon that I can OC to 4gz  :heart: :heart: :heart:), I would have to gone into a i7 for something significantly better.

The i7's are awesome.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on June 06, 2010, 02:35:56 AM
I'd like some advise on an upgrade.

I'm wondering if I can get away with a video card and GPU upgrade  or simply buy a new computer.  If an upgrade is possible, any suggestion?

Here's my system  :

AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual
Core Processor 4200+
2.21 Ghz, 3.50 GB of RAM
Nvidia 7900GT/GTO
Mother board : Asus M2N-SLI deluxe
Window xp
What's your budget?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Aez on June 06, 2010, 08:40:15 AM
Not much, I was hoping for a 300$ upgrade. If it's not possible, I'll finance a new computer.  It's just bad timing because my GF is on maternity leave.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Pennilenko on June 06, 2010, 10:35:49 AM
I'd like some advise on an upgrade.

I'm wondering if I can get away with a video card and GPU upgrade  or simply buy a new computer.  If an upgrade is possible, any suggestion?

Here's my system  :

AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual
Core Processor 4200+
2.21 Ghz, 3.50 GB of RAM
Nvidia 7900GT/GTO
Mother board : Asus M2N-SLI deluxe
Window xp




Overclock that puppy a little bit and add a nice mid level budget graphics card. That would easily give you a nice performance boost for 300 dollars.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Goreschach on June 06, 2010, 12:42:31 PM
If you want to put off getting a new computer, you could pick up a 4850 for around a hundred bucks, and a tower heatsink(or whatever will fit in your case) of the proper socket mount for around 35. With shipping that would come out to around 150. The 4850 is still perfectly capable of running all games as long as you don't max them out or try running them in some multi monitor setup. You'll lose dx10, however. And the x2 overclocks well, and does alright for feeding gpu's, since it was one of the earlier chips to have an imc.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 06, 2010, 01:02:15 PM
The 4850 is..... You'll lose dx10, however. .

wait, what?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on June 06, 2010, 01:59:49 PM
XP.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 06, 2010, 02:11:51 PM
XP.


Oh. Well. I don't think he had DX10 to lose in the first place :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 06, 2010, 05:03:58 PM
If you want to put off getting a new computer, you could pick up a 4850 for around a hundred bucks, and a tower heatsink(or whatever will fit in your case) of the proper socket mount for around 35. With shipping that would come out to around 150. The 4850 is still perfectly capable of running all games as long as you don't max them out or try running them in some multi monitor setup. You'll lose dx10, however. And the x2 overclocks well, and does alright for feeding gpu's, since it was one of the earlier chips to have an imc.

The 5770 is roughly the same speed if he wants to be forward-compatible with DX11.  It's also at a pretty good point price/performance wise, though the 4850 / 4870 are beasts that way.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: K9 on June 06, 2010, 05:31:51 PM
SO I know nothing about computers and my PC seems to have died. It was an old Dell Dimension 8400 and it has had some catastrophic mother board failure that seems to be pretty common (fan going into crazy overdrive, that stopped and now it just beeps sadly)

So I need a new PC and have little clue what to buy. I'd probably prefer something with a warranty, I'm not sure I have the expertise or patience to build my own. I was thinking of going with Dell again, since this last PC has been pretty trouble free for 5-6 years, and where I have had trouble their service has been good. I just have no idea what's good value for money, what are good components vs bad, and so on. I could probably afford £800-900 if it's going to last a while.

With respect to use, I'm not expecting to play a ton of high-end games on it. Probably WoW and SCII for the most part. Having something I can also use for work (cpu-intensive modelling) would be a bonus.

Any advice would be welcome, thanks. Even really basic stuff.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 06, 2010, 06:34:14 PM
From your description, I think this one will do you:

http://configure.euro.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?b=&c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&kc=DRSSX004&l=en&m_30=322642&oc=D00X8104&rbc=D00X8104&s=dhs

High end processor
So-so video card (nothing fancy but can do games). I am confident you can install another one, provided you don't need a super duper one which would tax your Power Supply (if it even has enough power connectors for it)
   

Price      £1,098.00
Total savings*      £269.00

Total      £829.00

   Catalog Number / Description                                                Product Code       Qty       SKU       Id

   Base:
StudioXPS 8100 - Intel Core i7 Processor 860 (2.80GHz, 8MB)       346965       1       [210-30757]       1

   Microsoft Operating System:
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium 64bit- English                        409483       1       [619-25659]       11

   Services and Support:
1 year of coverage included with your PC                                         322642       1       [754-56815]       30

   Monitor:
Display Not Included                                                                       92239       1       [480-10999]       5

   Memory:
6144MB (2x2GB) (2x1GB)1333MHz DDR3 Dual Channel Memory       294395       1       [370-15901]       3

   Hard Drive:
2TB Dual Hard Drive Raid 0 "Stripe" (2x1TB - 7200rpm)                295460       1       [400-18347]       8

   Video Card:
Graphics Card - Single 1GB Nvidia GeForce GTS 240                         351318       1       [490-11904]       6

   Optical Devices:
DVD +/- RW Drive (read/write CD & DVD) with Roxio Easy CD and
DVD Burn software                                                                          420041       1       [429-15320]       16

   Keyboard:
Dell™ USB Entry Keyboard - UK/Irish (QWERTY)                           255298       1       [580-15212]       4

   Mouse:
Dell 2 Button USB Optical Mouse                                                    214237       1       [570-10750]       12

   Thermal Cooling:
95W Processor Heatsink                                                                     346968       1       [412-10037]       412

   Speakers:
No Speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system)          6655       1       [520-10217]       18


   Dell System Media Kit:
Studio XPS 8100 Resource DVD                                                              346957       1       [340-20766]       319


   Sound Cards:
Integrated HDA 7.1 Dolby Digital Audio                                                189326       1       [510-10237]       17

   


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 06, 2010, 08:17:29 PM
I'm firmly in the camp that the i5-750 is the way to go, it's the same core without hyperthreading, some security features which may or may not turn into a massive DRM clusterfuck, and some virtualization features designed to handle DMA in hardware.

Case in point. (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/62)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 06, 2010, 08:30:36 PM
It seems that the i7 8xx does a wee tad better than the i5s with 3D modeling. Of course, it all depends on various factors. IF his programs take advantage of hyperthreading, then he's got an edge with an i7 8xx, I suspect.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 06, 2010, 08:44:47 PM
It's a $90 price difference for almost nothing performance wise even in best case.  Hyperthreading has never impressed me, the TxT security feature makes EA and Sony cackle with glee, and VT-d is superfluous unless you're running demanding modern applications in a virtual environment, where a software layer handling DMA requests just isn't fast enough.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on June 06, 2010, 09:00:10 PM
For rendering 3D models HT probably does matter but K9 will need to dig around to see if there are any benchmarks that can confirm that.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 06, 2010, 09:45:50 PM
Very close. (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/30)

A more general comparison. (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/109?vs=108)

The second comparison reveals that there are a shitton of programs that still attempt to use every available core before checking whether it's a logical or a physical core, which really fucking hurts programs that need fast cache access more than parallelism.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: brellium on June 06, 2010, 11:10:35 PM
Honestly, for just WoW and general office stuff I'd just go for the bottom, one for 400-500£ with a non intel card should run WoW fine.

Dell either goofed up on pricing or wanted to get some old stuff out and I walked away with a 300$ box with a 5 year warranty, it worked fine (not awesomely, but fine).

I could run 25 man raids, do WG and stuff on it fine and this is (now) a 2 year old box.  Granted, my netbook can run WoW, at 2 fps, but it can run WoW.

I seriously wonder what my current machine would do in WoW.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 06, 2010, 11:49:32 PM

The processor is not something you find you need to replace.  Or maybe it is, now that FSB's have fucked off and died.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on June 07, 2010, 08:40:32 AM
I'm considering grabbing one of those very same i5 750 processors.  Suggestions on a good motherboard to go with it?  I wouldn't know a good MB if you beat me over the head with it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on June 07, 2010, 08:41:43 AM
MSI P55-GD65


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nebu on June 07, 2010, 10:28:39 AM
I'm starting to wonder if I'm the only person that has had great luck with Asus MB's.  I'll take a look at the MSI.

I'm really sold on the i5 and am probably going to upgrade to one soon.  The only thing holding me back is the complete lack of an MMO worth spending time on. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on June 07, 2010, 10:40:39 AM
MSI P55-GD65

It's freaking weird that this was exactly the MB I was looking at buying.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 07, 2010, 11:32:59 AM
I haven't actually seen many truly shitty motherboards, even the manufacturers unwilling to put out a manual in anything other than Engrish are putting out some pretty hot shit for cheap (http://www.anandtech.com/show/3572).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: K9 on June 07, 2010, 06:26:27 PM
From your description, I think this one will do you:

http://configure.euro.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?b=&c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&kc=DRSSX004&l=en&m_30=322642&oc=D00X8104&rbc=D00X8104&s=dhs

snip

Thanks a lot for the suggestions. PC hardware is one thing I have a glaring blind spot for, so I usually opt for a bigger number = better approach which I suspect is not the right way to go. I might just go ahead and buy this unless anyone has any other suggestions or improvements. I'll come back in due course for upgrade suggestions I guess.

fakeedit: Are dell monitors good value for money? You omitted a monitor from the build which is fine since my old one works fine. Going to two screens is something I would probably be keen to do in the near future. Would I need a different graphics card for that, and is getting a monitor as part of the bundle good value, or should I buy separately?

For rendering 3D models HT probably does matter but K9 will need to dig around to see if there are any benchmarks that can confirm that.

I honestly wouldn't have a clue what to make of those. The modelling I do is all numerical though, not graphical (science, narf).

Thanks for all the comments!




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 07, 2010, 07:20:01 PM
The GTS 240 can accomodate two monitors:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_geforce_gts_240_us.html

Two via DVI port. If your current monitor uses VGA, you can purchase a DVI-to-VGA adapter. They aren't expensive.

Since the uproar by Sheephearder and his intense animosity towards all things i7  :grin:, I tried to find an i5 system on the UK site, but I'm not seeing it.

The best thing you can do is to see if your modeling software supports hyperthreading. If it does, the i7 is probably going to be better than the i5. If it doesn't, then the i5 might be better, but who knows.

Dell's monitors are for the most part good. The pricing, as bundled with a system, suggest the purchase of the 23" one (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&sku=320-8299&redirect=1). Its a TN monitor, which generally speaking means good for gaming, not great for video (viewing angles and blacks are a bit weak). Trippy or someone else might know a bit more on this subject, since I've been out of the monitor game for a while.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 07, 2010, 08:58:27 PM
1. Combine an Intel i5-750 and the Geforce 260 GTX, IMO.  That way you don't have to go card shopping.
2. Dell monitors are usually pretty good.
3. HT doesn't consistently perform better at anything, even where it should be a clear upgrade like file compression it can be +/- 20%, completely depending on what software you use.

EDIT:

Quote
StudioXPS 8100 - Intel Core i5 Processor 750 (2.66GHz, 8MB)
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium 64bit- English
OS Windows® Recovery Media Not included
Microsoft® Office Starter 2010 (Word Starter, Excel Starter)
1 year of coverage included with your PC
No Security/Anti-Virus Protection - English
No Accidental Damage Support
Display Not Included
6144MB (2x2GB) (2x1GB)1333MHz DDR3 Dual Channel Memory - Might want to go for 4 matched sticks, £40 more.
1.5TB (7,200rpm) Serial ATA Hard Drive
Graphics : Single 1.8GB Nvidia GeForce GTX 260 - The ATi card is £140 less, but it's pretty mediocre.
DVD +/- RW Drive (read/write CD & DVD) with Roxio Easy CD and DVD Burn software

http://configure.euro.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?b=&c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&kc=DRSSX003&l=en&m_30=322642&oc=D00X8103&rbc=D00X8103&s=dhs


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: K9 on June 08, 2010, 05:02:48 AM
The best thing you can do is to see if your modeling software supports hyperthreading. If it does, the i7 is probably going to be better than the i5. If it doesn't, then the i5 might be better, but who knows.

We write it ourselves, so I'm going to guess no  :grin:

Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 08, 2010, 09:29:32 AM
I'd go with Sheepherder's build. For the same amount of money, you get a much more beefy video card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on June 09, 2010, 01:29:28 PM
My ATI 4850 512mb just melted and I'm wondering if there is a bottleneck in my system for a video card upgrade/downgrade.  Similar to Aez:
 
AMD X2 64 5000+ oc'd to 3.0ghz
4GB DDR2 800 ram
Asrock 939Dual-Sata2 mobo cobbled together with its daughter card


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 09, 2010, 02:43:17 PM
90% of GPU failures are due to insufficient or failing power supplies. What are your PSU's stats?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on June 09, 2010, 03:31:50 PM
90% of GPU failures are due to insufficient or failing power supplies. What are your PSU's stats?

Antec earthwatts 500W (ea-5000)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 09, 2010, 03:54:53 PM
That's a decent brand and a decent wattage.

So, ya, I think if you were running a 4000 series card without issue, you can comfortably upgrade to a 5k series and see improvements. Your CPU isn't omgwtfbbq aswome, but its on par with a E6xxx series C2D processor. You may not get the absolute best performance with that CPU, so its probably a bottleneck, but you'd still get an improvement. How much is hard for me to say, other than looking at artificial benchmarks that won't quite match your hardware config.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on June 09, 2010, 05:42:19 PM
After many years, considering a new case.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139001

Undecided.  I want my next case to last at least ten years.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on June 09, 2010, 06:47:17 PM
Decided.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163089


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 09, 2010, 10:49:41 PM
What made you decide for the Silverstone over the Corsair? That Corsair looked pretty sweet to me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on June 09, 2010, 11:39:16 PM
Confirmed a removable mobo plate.  I suppose the user endorsement was what sold me.  I felt we connected.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on June 27, 2010, 05:36:44 AM
I was in the market for a new laptop, but realized I never take the thing anywhere anyway. So I decided to go for a desktop. Here are the parts. I tried this once in the past and it failed miserably, so instead of spending months researching and waiting and pining for tech that isnt out yet, or scrutinizing every detail of my build, I would rather just get it over with as fast as possible (even if that isnt the proper mindset). If someone could give it a quick once over to make sure I'm not missing something major that would be good.

Also, if anyone knows how to shave off a few $ for due to my lack of foresight, that is welcome too.
And is neweggs return policy for monitors still the no less than 5 dead pixels BS that it used to be? I looked and didnt see it anywhere.
Thanks

Case: COOLER MASTER COSMOS 1000 RC-1000-KSN1-GP Black/ Silver Steel ATX Full Tower Computer Case
Model #:RC-1000-KSN1-GP
Item #:N82E16811119138
Return Policy:Standard Return Policy
In Stock
$169.99
      
HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
Model #:WD6401AALS
Item #:N82E16822136319
Return Policy:Standard Return Policy
In Stock
$74.99   
      
Monitor: ASUS VH242H Black 23.6" 5ms HDMI Full 1080P Widescreen LCD Monitor
Model #:VH242H
Item #:N82E16824236052
Return Policy:Monitor Standard Return Policy
In Stock
Mail in Rebate Card
$199.99
      
Memory: G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-4GBRL
Model #:F3-12800CL9D-4GBRL
Item #:N82E16820231277
Return Policy:Memory Standard Return Policy
In Stock
$107.00       
      
Mobo: ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
Model #:P6X58D Premium
Item #:N82E16813131614
Return Policy:Limited Replacement Only Return Policy
In Stock
$299.99
      
CPU: Intel Core i7-920 Bloomfield 2.66GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor BX80601920
Model #:BX80601920
Item #:N82E16819115202
Return Policy:CPU Replacement Only Return Policy
In Stock
$279.99
      
PSU: CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power ...
Model #:CMPSU-750TX
Item #:N82E16817139006
Return Policy:Standard Return Policy
In Stock
Mail in Rebate Card
$109.99
      
GPU: ASUS EAH5870/2DIS/1GD5/V2 Radeon HD 5870 (Cypress XT) 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support ...
Model #:EAH5870/2DIS/1GD5/V2
Item #:N82E16814121374
Return Policy:Standard Return Policy
In Stock
Mail in Rebate Card
$409.99
      
CD/DVD: ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner - Bulk - OEM
Model #:DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS
Item #:N82E16827135204
Return Policy:Standard Return Policy


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 27, 2010, 12:24:28 PM
My only thought is that your motherboard and cpu are set up for triple channel. I don't know if you -have- to use 3 sticks, but I believe that's what your mobo and CPU are ideally set up for.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on June 27, 2010, 05:28:02 PM
nice
replaced the ram with this

CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TR3X6G1600C9
Model #:TR3X6G1600C9
Item #:N82E16820145222


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 27, 2010, 10:22:08 PM
Better brand anyways.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 28, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
If you want to save a few bucks you might look at an i5 750 system, yeah?  (See further on up the thread)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lounge on June 28, 2010, 04:01:09 PM
So I just ordered some parts to upgrade my pc on the cheap to try to play some of these steam games I've purchased recently.  I already had a case/monitor and whatnot but what I'm not sure about (and don't know how to find out really) is if the 380w psu in my current case is enough to power this thing.  Any pointers on figuring that out?

Here's what i ordered:
- GIGABYTE GA-H55M-UD2H LGA 1156 Intel H55 HDMI Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
- GeIL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10660) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model GV34GB1333C9DC
- Intel Core i3-530 Clarkdale 2.93GHz LGA 1156 73W Dual-Core Desktop Processor BX80616I3530
- Western Digital AV-GP WD5000AVDS 500GB SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal AV Hard Drive -Bare Drive
- EVGA 01G-P3-1158-TR GeForce GTS 250 1GB 256-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

Came out to $480 shipped with another $40 in rebates. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 29, 2010, 12:27:46 PM
Also, if anyone knows how to shave off a few $ for due to my lack of foresight, that is welcome too.
And is neweggs return policy for monitors still the no less than 5 dead pixels BS that it used to be? I looked and didnt see it anywhere.
Thanks

The i5-750 is ~$90 cheaper for almost the exact same processor.  The added features of the i7 are negligible for most people.

what I'm not sure about (and don't know how to find out really) is if the 380w psu in my current case is enough to power this thing.  Any pointers on figuring that out?

What's the brand on the PSU?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lounge on June 29, 2010, 12:30:54 PM
What's the brand on the PSU?

Antec ... Came with my Sonata 1 which is many years old at this point.  If its even going to be questionable I'll upgrade it, just would like to know how big and how to figure that out.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on June 29, 2010, 01:08:58 PM
Link (http://www.silentpcreview.com/article61-page1.html)

I'd say no.  18 Amps @ +12V is probably cutting it very close even for a new PSU.  That number should probably be closer to 30.

Seasonic and Silverstone are very good brands.  Corsair rebrands Seasonic PSU's.  A 550 watt from any of these brands will run most SLI systems.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on June 29, 2010, 01:45:50 PM
Link (http://www.silentpcreview.com/article61-page1.html)

I'd say no.  18 Amps @ +12V is probably cutting it very close even for a new PSU.  That number should probably be closer to 30.

Seasonic and Silverstone are very good brands.  Corsair rebrands Seasonic PSU's.  A 550 watt from any of these brands will run most SLI systems.
Not all Corsairs are/were Seasonics. Some are/were CWTs (I haven't checked recently to see who Corsair is using for what models).

The GTS 250 draws 150 W power max. So on the +12V line(s) that works out to 12.5A, just for the GPU. As said Sheepheader that's cutting it pretty close considering all the other devices that will draw +12V from that line.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lounge on June 29, 2010, 01:48:47 PM
Right! Thanks for the info.  I'll grab a 550w from Frys on the way home.

Also... I just found this which helped clear things up for me:
http://educations.newegg.com/tool/psucalc/index.html


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rrazcueta on July 01, 2010, 01:12:34 AM
And is neweggs return policy for monitors still the no less than 5 dead pixels BS that it used to be? I looked and didnt see it anywhere.

I've heard newegg is real shitty about monitor replacements. I bought all my parts for my PC at newegg except the monitor which I got at Buy.com because of their dead pixel policies. Amazon replaced my brothers 42" Samsung HDTV for free, so check them out, too.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 21, 2010, 02:19:29 PM
So, the GF's 4 year old Dell's PSU's fan is giving out, so instead of replacing the PSU, we were thinking of just me building her a system. She plays Dragon Age and will be playing Fallout Vegas till doomsday, so she's gotta have a fairly decent gaming rig. Goal is decent gaming with legs but with an eye on the pocket book.

She already has a GPU, and we have a case and DVD drive. We would have to purchase the rest. How does this look to you guys?

(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/82194/newegg.JPG)

Looking at Dell, it looks like I'd have to spend more, even tho I'd get a new GPU and monitor with the deal. We really really don't need those.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on July 21, 2010, 02:43:19 PM
What's the GPU she has now?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on July 21, 2010, 03:05:48 PM
How does this look to you guys?

What OS? Because the 4GB will not be visible to the OS without a 64bit OS.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 21, 2010, 05:07:26 PM
Trippy, she currently has a Core Duo. Yep, without a 2 in it. One of the first dual cores out there. It does ok, but her Dell PSU (the one with the failing fan) is just barely able to meet the power needs of her 9600GT card, so its in our interest to upgrade her system to have a more powerful PSU for a video card in her not too distant future.

Fuser, we have access to both 64 and 32 bit Windows 7. We will probably go with 64 bit. She doesn't do anything more demanding than gaming, so I figure 4 gig is fine for her. We can always buy more ram later.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on July 21, 2010, 05:09:10 PM
Why not get a new GPU now too then? The 9600GT is pretty gimpy by today's standards. What resolution does she run at?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 06:53:32 PM
Building new PC, since my starving-student friend managed to munch old one off me:

CPU: AMD HDT55TFBRBOX Phenom II 1055T Six Core Processor
Mobo: ??? Strongly prefer ASUS and willing to pay premium for it
Video Card: ASUS Geforce GTX480
Sound: Creative Labs SB0886 PCI Express Sound Blaster
Memory: Corsair or Kingston Triple Channel 12GB
Power Supply: ??? Strongly prefer Antec and willing to pay preminum for it
Caste: Antec-300 or ???

Goals: Gaming on high-resolution monitor, movies and very occasional matlab number crunching.

I need help with motherboard selection. I don't plan on ever going 2x (or 3x) video cards, yet I need something that will be reasonably future-proof.

Any help is appreciated.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 07:00:40 PM
Building new PC, since my starving-student friend managed to munch old one off me:

CPU: AMD HDT55TFBRBOX Phenom II 1055T Six Core Processor
Mobo: ??? Strongly prefer ASUS and willing to pay premium for it
Video Card: ASUS Geforce GTX480
Sound: Creative Labs SB0886 PCI Express Sound Blaster
Memory: Corsair or Kingston Triple Channel 12GB
Power Supply: ??? Strongly prefer Antec and willing to pay preminum for it
Caste: Antec-300 or ???

Goals: Gaming on high-resolution monitor, movies and very occasional matlab number crunching.

I need help with motherboard selection. I don't plan on ever going 2x (or 3x) video cards, yet I need something that will be reasonably future-proof.

Any help is appreciated.

GTX 480?  I think you'd actually get better performance (and spend just a little less money) by running 2 of the new 1GB GTX 460s in SLI, but apparently SLI isn't supported on AMD mobos (sorry - I've been shopping Intel pretty much exclusively).

As for the mobo, might as well go bleeding edge (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131644) if you're willing to drop $500 on the gfx.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 21, 2010, 07:16:03 PM
Why not get a new GPU now too then? The 9600GT is pretty gimpy by today's standards. What resolution does she run at?

She's got an old 4:3 aspect ratio monitor from NEC that's got a very good image quality. She loves it, so I'm not pushing that angle. You're right that she'll need a new vid card soon enough, but right now we're focusing on the core of the system.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 07:27:58 PM
As I alluded to earlier, I'm also putting together a new PC.  Here's what I've got so far - just looking for outside opinions:

CPU:  Intel Core i5-760 ($210)
Motherboard:  MSI P55-GD65 ($160)
PSU:  XFX Black Edition P1 750W ($90)
Video:  Gigabyte GTX-460 1GB OC ($220) (may add a second down the road)
HDD:  WD Caviar Black 1TB ($90)
RAM:  G.SKILL ECO Series 2x2GB (will add a matching set if needed) ($96)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 07:36:43 PM
GTX 480?  I think you'd actually get better performance (and spend just a little less money) by running 2 of the new 1GB GTX 460s in SLI

I doubt it. It has to run at 1920×1080. Also my past experiences with SLI/Crossfire is that it is waste of money for 2/3 of apps/games out there. I don't want to build something that will work 'teh best' for 1-2 games today, I want system that will work well for next 2 years for all games, and something that I will be able to migrate in parts to other computers when I upgrade down the road without having.

As far as graphic card, what would be comparable setup using ATI cards? Did ATI ever fix driver issues?



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Goreschach on July 21, 2010, 07:43:59 PM
GTX 480?  I think you'd actually get better performance (and spend just a little less money) by running 2 of the new 1GB GTX 460s in SLI

I doubt it. It has to run at 1920×1080.

As far as graphic card, what would be comparable setup using ATI cards? Did ATI ever fix driver issues?



(http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z303/Patekki/facepalm.jpg)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 07:46:49 PM
Last ATI card I owned, I ripped out of my rig and threw against the wall. I am not too eager to relive that expirience, so its pretty much Nvidia or GTFO, so in my mind real question is 470, 480 or 2x460 when running at 1920×1080 ( or was it 1920x1200? my laptop chokes trying to power it, so it waiting for new PC)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 07:50:17 PM
GTX 480?  I think you'd actually get better performance (and spend just a little less money) by running 2 of the new 1GB GTX 460s in SLI

I doubt it. It has to run at 1920×1080. Also my past experiences with SLI/Crossfire is that it is waste of money for 2/3 of apps/games out there.

As far as graphic card, what would be comparable setup using ATI cards? Did ATI ever fix driver issues?

I've been using an HD4850 with zero issues for some time.  

The only comparable AMD hardware to the GTX480 is either the HD5970/2x 5970 in CF or something stupid like the Asus Ares (http://www.guru3d.com/article/asus-ares-review/) ($1200 and it weighs 5 fucking pounds).

Anand's tests (http://www.anandtech.com/show/3810/nvidias-geforce-gtx-460-part-2-the-vendor-cards/7) seem to indicate that the revised Fermi architecture is an improvement over the GF100 cards, so it'll be interesting to see what happens when they apply it to the high end versus the midrange users they're targeting with the 460.

That said, you're starting with an AMD CPU, so any SLI discussion is largely irrelevant.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 07:57:39 PM
My last rig was AMD (started with X2 4800 eventually upgraded to Phenom 4x 9850 for $100-ish with bios flash) with Nvidia 280 running on M3A mobo. I was 100% happy with it throughout its life, the best PC I ever built. I want more of it.

I *really* like the fact that AMD doesn't do 'socket dance', so with AMD you have mobo/ram setup that is very upgradable down the road. Intel pretty much un-upgradable, hotter and not nearly as stable.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 08:06:12 PM
As I alluded to earlier, I'm also putting together a new PC.  Here's what I've got so far - just looking for outside opinions:

CPU:  Intel Core i5-760 ($210)
Motherboard:  MSI P55-GD65 ($160)
PSU:  XFX Black Edition P1 750W ($90)
Video:  Gigabyte GTX-460 1GB OC ($220) (may add a second down the road)
HDD:  WD Caviar Black 1TB ($90)
RAM:  G.SKILL ECO Series 2x2GB (will add a matching set if needed) ($96)

I would go with at least 8GB of RAM.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 08:07:05 PM
Aha!

SLI-capable AMD board! (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131636)

Tragically, any of the nForce AMD boards don't seem to also support Crossfire (that I can see) so you'll have to pick a side and stick with it.

As for the 8GB thing, I plan on it since it's cheap.  Just figure since I can get a solid gaming PC with 4GB, I can add that after the initial build.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 21, 2010, 08:14:42 PM
As I alluded to earlier, I'm also putting together a new PC.  Here's what I've got so far - just looking for outside opinions:

CPU:  Intel Core i5-760 ($210)
Motherboard:  MSI P55-GD65 ($160)
PSU:  XFX Black Edition P1 750W ($90)
Video:  Gigabyte GTX-460 1GB OC ($220) (may add a second down the road)
HDD:  WD Caviar Black 1TB ($90)
RAM:  G.SKILL ECO Series 2x2GB (will add a matching set if needed) ($96)

I have that same basic rig, and with the exception of some issues with my mobo (which is being RMA'd next week) that seem to be the exception rather than the rule, you'll LOVE it.  I would pop for the GTX470, though.

MAKE SURE YOU GET RAM THAT HAS BEEN VETTED BY MSI'S QVL.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 08:16:23 PM
Aha!

SLI-capable AMD board! (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131636)

Tragically, any of the nForce AMD boards don't seem to also support Crossfire (that I can see) so you'll have to pick a side and stick with it.

Interesting.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/graphics-card-geforce-radeon,2646-6.html

Tom's hardware suggests Two Radeon HD 5830 in CrossFire Configuration as current the best setup/cost with honorable mentions to 480. What is the difference between 5850 and 5830?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 08:21:04 PM
As for the 8GB thing, I plan on it since it's cheap.  Just figure since I can get a solid gaming PC with 4GB, I can add that after the initial build.

In the past I had issues finding matching dual-channel memory, surprisingly enough, not all dual-channel memory even from the same manufacturer will work well together as dual-channel pairs.

I would also go for more reputable brand - Kingston, OCZ, Corsair. Server guys I work with swear by Kignston, not sure how well that translates to consumer market...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 08:29:43 PM
MAKE SURE YOU GET RAM THAT HAS BEEN VETTED BY MSI'S QVL.

I spent ages searching MSI's site for the QVL list to no avail.  I can't imagine that G.Skill is not on there somewhere.  I just like the low voltages that the ECO series will acceptably run at, which gives lots of headroom for fucking around at more extreme settings.

I also admit that anything with a 1" talll metal comb attached to it was immediately DQ'd for being both retarded and blocking me from using a huge CPU cooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 21, 2010, 08:56:09 PM
Another question:

Western Digital 300 GB VelociRaptor SATA 10,000 RPM (I have nothing but good things to say about WD Raptors, my first one 74G one is still running strong and fast!)

or

Kingston SSDNow V Series 128 GB

?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 21, 2010, 10:07:02 PM
Another question:

Western Digital 300 GB VelociRaptor SATA 10,000 RPM (I have nothing but good things to say about WD Raptors, my first one 74G one is still running strong and fast!)

or

Kingston SSDNow V Series 128 GB

?

If you're on a board that supports SATA6, get the SSD and drop your OS and games on it.  Otherwise I'd just get Caviar Black drives for pretty much everything.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 21, 2010, 11:41:47 PM
I spent ages searching MSI's site for the QVL list to no avail.  I can't imagine that G.Skill is not on there somewhere.  I just like the low voltages that the ECO series will acceptably run at, which gives lots of headroom for fucking around at more extreme settings.

I also admit that anything with a 1" talll metal comb attached to it was immediately DQ'd for being both retarded and blocking me from using a huge CPU cooler.

Here you go (http://www.msi.com/uploads/test_report/TR10_1846.pdf).  It's under the Test Reports (http://www.msi.com/index.php?func=prodtestreport&maincat_no=1&cat2_no=&cat3_no=&prod_no=1846) tab.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 22, 2010, 12:37:18 PM
Intel Core i5 661 3.33 GHz Clarkdale (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115217): dual core with HT. I picked it because it uses 35 nm tech and that's hot, or actually, less hot than the 45nms I'm seeing. At least I think it is. Also like that with the board I picked, it'd have onboard graphics so there's no panic in the streets if the dedicated GPU blows up.

Opinions on that CPU?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 23, 2010, 08:36:05 PM
Feedback please:

CPU: AMD Phenom II X6 - I like AMD sockets since I know it will be reasonably future-proof
Mobo: ASUS Crosshair IV - it has good on-board sound, so I don't need discrete sound card; otherwise it has to have SATA 6GB, DDR3 and USB3
Video: ASUS  HD 5850 x2 - not much price difference between 5830 and 5850, my preference is a single card; but all mobos with features I want come with SLI/Crossfire.
Ram: Kingston HyperX T1 DDR3 - 2133 MHz x4 8G; mobo VQL doesn't explicitly states it supports 4Gig 2000 or 2130 ram... strange still to be using 2G sticks in year 2010
PSU: Corsair CMPSU-750TX 750-Watt  ;i s this enough?
HDD: Kingston SSDNow V Series 128 GB
Case: Cooler Master HAF 932 - something big enough to no need water cooling

Is there a way to get comparable performance cheaper? Ended up more than I wanted to spend.

What happened to Hybrid SLI or Hybrid Crossfire technology? Would something like M4A89GTD PRO/USB3 used with single ATI card force it into 8x mode or slower speeds? Any benefit to using it?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 24, 2010, 11:34:19 AM
Why are you getting crossfire, if you don't mind my asking? Have you had good luck with it in the past? Why not go for a single 5970, for instance? Price is about the same, and you sidestep potential compatibility issues, not to mention the blocked airflow and additional heating issues.

Also, it seems that you want a lot of video firepower. Do you have a huge monitor, or various huge monitors?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 24, 2010, 11:54:38 AM
I have 24 inch 2ms display and I play FPSs competitively, so keeping frame rate up at all times is crucial for aiming.

I have not had luck with crossfire or sli in the past, my latest experiences was 2x 260 Nvidas that I ended returning for 280 that I used ever since. You'd hope things matured over last couple years.

I am getting crossfire because mobo supports it. Maybe I should reconsider.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 24, 2010, 12:05:22 PM
When you say competitively, do you mean you turn down all eyecandy to get maximum performance? I'm no expert, but I think you'd do fine with a 5870. Then I'd go for dual SSDs SATA 6 in Raid 0.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on July 24, 2010, 04:36:06 PM
Ok, finalized my build.

***************************************

Mobo:  ASUS M4A89TD  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131655&Tpk=M4A89TD%20PRO%2fUSB3)

CPU:  AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103849)

RAM:  Kingston HyperX 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104173)

GPU:  MSI R5970-P2D2G Radeon HD 5970  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127467&cm_re=5970-_-14-127-467-_-Product)

Sound:  Creative Labs PCI Express Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829102019)

HDD:  WD SiliconEdge Blue  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820250002)

PSU:  XFX Black Edition XPS-850W  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207001)

CASE:  COOLER MASTER HAF 922  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119197)

$2,152.91 from egg.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: JWIV on July 30, 2010, 09:42:56 AM
Here's the case mod you need -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcpHV318gxo
 :drill: :drill: :drill: :drill: :drill: :drill: :drill:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on August 02, 2010, 01:41:34 AM

GPU:  MSI R5970-P2D2G Radeon HD 5970  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127467&cm_re=5970-_-14-127-467-_-Product)


What a beast.  

Based on Engels' advice I picked up a 5770 to replace my 4850.  That quickly turned into an excuse to replace my motherboard since one of its PCI slots died.  Nevermind I had another slot available.

I picked up a Gigabyte MA785GM-US2H (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128394&cm_re=gigabyte_motherboard-_-13-128-394-_-Product) because I wanted to reuse my AMD Athlon 64 X2 processor and DDR2 RAM but I wanted the AM3 upgrade option.  Which was a mistake for my wallet because now I realize I can get $40 off a processor with this motherboard which compels me to look at an AMD Phenom II X2 555 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103846&cm_re=amd_555-_-19-103-846-_-Product).

Update:  this Gigabyte motherboard is pretty great and I would recommend it to anyone looking for an upgrade path with older system parts.  Micro ATX, 4 DDR2 slots, AM2 / AM2+ / AM3 compatible, and all the drivers loaded in Windows 7 automagically.  Coming from an old AsRock board this is fancy town.

This board got my Athlon to 3.2ghz stable and I'm going for 3.4ghz next.  This setup will do just fine until I find out if Diablo 3 will noticeably benefit from a quad-core.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 28, 2010, 11:04:26 AM
Starting to consider an upgrade now that my system is nearing four years old. Main reason is really the upgrade from 720p to 1080p; looks great but it's starting to stress my system. Here's my idears, pretending I have money to actually do this. Upgraded parts would be C2D e6600, 4GB DDR2 800, ASUS P5WDH Deluxe, EVGA 8800GTX 756MB.

i5 750
4GB Crucial DDR3 1600
ASUS P7P55D-E Pro
ASUS 480 GTX 1.5GB

Carrying over my old case (Antec P180), sound card (fatality x-fi), psu (PP&C 610W 12V@49A), hdds and opticals etc. Going nvidia because I like 3d Vision, going ASUS mobo because that's what I always use. Cash register says about 950 bones.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 28, 2010, 12:05:33 PM
Looks good to me. I have a similar older system and this looks just about what I'd upgrade to, with the probable difference is that I'd go for a i7, but that's somewhat academic for gamers.

That said, just read an article on Sandy Bridge, the new 35 nm mid range processor line from Intel that's meant to come out in Q1 2011. It gave me pause because although the performance isn't THAT much better, the chipsets they will have for them, the P67 and the H67, will have 2 native SATA3 ports. Right now Sata3 is somewhat gimped because it relies on a 3rd party onboard controller chip from Marvel.

Naturally, the new Sandy Bridge will take YET ANOTHER socket type.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on August 29, 2010, 10:24:40 PM
Have had this sitting in my cart for about a week. Aside from adding an optical drive, any comments or critiques? Probably won't upgrade for another 5 years again or so.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 29, 2010, 10:42:23 PM
Looks about right to me. Is the plan to store files and install games on the 1T drive, leave the 64GB SSD drive for the OS?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 29, 2010, 10:49:28 PM
Skip the SSD (IMHO), ditch that 300 case.  It's flimsy as hell.  Go with a better PSU.  Pick up an aftermarket CPU cooler (Hyper 212, or whatever is the hot shit these days.  I use a Corsair H50 on a push/pull exhaust combination and love it).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on August 29, 2010, 11:17:28 PM
I am actually not happy with my Radeon HD 5970 - ATI drivers are still garbage, I am getting all kinds of texture glitches in SC2. Researching problem *drummroll* its a DRIVER ISSUE! Tiger never changes its stripes - I should have went with Nvidia.

As to Athlon X6 - I have nothing bad to say about it. Cheap, quiet, stable and stock cooler is 100% adequate, so you don't have to upgrade it unless you OC.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on August 29, 2010, 11:30:10 PM
Skip the SSD (IMHO)

SSD is pure joy, I got slow-ish WD SSD (its not prone to 'used' performance degradation) and it is significantly faster than my old Raptor. If your system can support 6Gig sata, go for it. Loading OS in 10 seconds or completing full virus scan in under 2 minutes is pure joy.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on August 30, 2010, 12:00:35 AM
Looks about right to me. Is the plan to store files and install games on the 1T drive, leave the 64GB SSD drive for the OS?

I figured on the 64gb SSD I would have the OS and whatever game I'm playing. 1tb would be for everything else such as music, movies, etc.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 30, 2010, 09:37:51 AM
I guess if you are in the habit of uninstalling a game as soon as you're interested in another, that's ok. I've found that I am never quite ready to part with one game, even if there's a new shiny that's caught my attention. 64 Gb might leave you little wiggleroom, especially considering how huge game installs are nowadays.

Also, beware sinij's recommendation of 6Gig sata; some intel socket motherboards 'support' sata3, but the chipset doesn't; its being done by an on-board add-on controller by Marvel or someshit, and the performance isn't good. He has an AMD machine, which does have plenty of native SATA3 support.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on August 30, 2010, 10:12:55 AM
I've never been able to play more than one game at a time, my brain just can't do it for some reason. It's the whole reason why I still have a 20gb 360, I only ever have one game installed to the HD. I might move up to a larger SSD, my max budget is around $2000 but to hit that I'd have to go nuts.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 10:58:28 AM
ASUS 480 GTX 1.5GB


Might want to look in to doing SLI with 2x 460s. The performance is just about the same on the benches (leaning in favor of the 460s), and you save $100 to $150.

Anandtech bench comparison (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/158?vs=181)




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: bhodi on August 30, 2010, 11:02:01 AM
I've never been a fan of SLI. Some games don't use it very well, and it just makes twice the noise and puts off twice the heat.

The theory that you can keep current by buying a 2nd card and SLIing them later for cheap doesn't work out either, as the cards become more expensive because they are older and use old ram and such.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 30, 2010, 11:03:44 AM
I head that in general the 460 does very very well for its price point, with the possible exception of having half the tesselation of a 470/480 card. I guess running it in SLI would overcome that limitation.

I personally would like to hear from folks that have either the 460 or the other 400 series cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 11:04:45 AM
Here is a build I put together on newegg a few weeks ago.

Quote
1      EVGA 768-P3-1362-AR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Superclocked 768MB 192-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card
Item #: N82E16814130564
$219.99

1      EVGA X58 FTW3 132-GT-E768-KR LGA 1366 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
Item #: N82E16813188065
$269.99

1      CORSAIR XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model HX3X12G1600C9 G
Item #: N82E16820145235
$299.99

1      CORSAIR CMPSU-850TX 850W ATX12V 2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready Active PFC Power Supply
Item #: N82E16817139009
$129.99

1      Western Digital Caviar Black WD5001AALS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
Item #: N82E16822136320
$69.99

1      Intel Core i7-930 Bloomfield 2.8GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80601930
Item #: N82E16819115225
$289.99

1      Corsair Force CSSD-F60GB2-BRKT 2.5" 60GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
Item #: N82E16820233124
$144.99

1      LITE-ON CD/DVD Burner - Bulk Black SATA Model iHAS124-04
Item #: N82E16827106289
$19.99

1      Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
Item #: N82E16835100007
$9.99

1      LIAN LI PC-B25F Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
Item #: N82E16811112248
$159.99

Total was around $1650


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 11:08:10 AM
I've never been a fan of SLI. Some games don't use it very well, and it just makes twice the noise and puts off twice the heat.

The theory that you can keep current by buying a 2nd card and SLIing them later for cheap doesn't work out either, as the cards become more expensive because they are older and use old ram and such.

I agree with you 100%. But, I have heard that the 460s SLI very very well. Its one of the first cards to make buying current gen SLI a viable option and not just good for the 3dMark junkies.

I head that in general the 460 does very very well for its price point, with the possible exception of having half the tesselation of a 470/480 card. I guess running it in SLI would overcome that limitation.

I personally would like to hear from folks that have either the 460 or the other 400 series cards.

I have a EVGA 460. The card is nice. It runs very quiet and low temp compared to my old 8800GTX (original model). I can run most games at all settings on max, except high shaders. I run 1900x1200 res on a 30 inch monitor. For a mid range $200 card it runs great. I am planning to upgrade my system soonish, and add another one in SLI. My first time ever.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 30, 2010, 11:13:49 AM
I've not been a fan for the same reasons. I have the side of my case off due to the heat my 8800gtx pumps out on my current game of choice. And I;ve always had good luck splurging on the best gpu tech at the time, I've never been unhappy with gpu performace going that route back to the very first generation of 3d accelerators. Back then I did have 2 gpu's though, because there were two different ways of rendering, some games liked one, some like the other, so I'd swap out and boot off disks to configure the machine. Remember boot disks? Whee.

Anyway, yeah. Big bad gpu, slab o memory and fat pipeline, as many shader units as they can stuff on. Good times. The 8800gtx is still a pretty awesome card, it's mostly because I upgraded the monitor that newer games are starting to show some cracks, there's a bunch of stuff coming out that will stress it...and I want to play in THREEE DEEE (meaning doubling the workload).

I'd rather upgrade the memory in a bit (especially if prices can finally deflate a little), and the i5 looks like a good gaming cpu. And of course, saving a bunch of dough on the carry-overs, this would be the first time I haven't built from scratch, but I'm getting quite the collection of old systems and my house is small. I will probably move the C2D system into the old Athlon enclosure just to use my awesome old coolermaster wavemaster case again.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 11:38:19 AM
Just in case.

Guru 3d Review of 460 SLi (http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gtx-460-sli-review/1)

Page 16 or so shows the noise and such.

Quote
With the more GPU stringent resolutions and modern games you can quite easily gain 1.8x ~ 1.9x performance with two of these 200 USD cards. At a grand total of 400 USD that is mighty impressive to observe, in fact in this solution most of the time you will be even much faster than the mighty hot and noisy GeForce GTX 480. Obviously that statement remains relative as the GTX 480 will be much stronger in situations that require more frame buffer and memory bandwidth. Examples here are anything above 8xAA and say a gaming resolution of 2560x1600. But if you are a gamer with a monitor resolution up-to 1920x1200 and you think that 4xAA or 8xAA is fine, then you fall within 99.98% of the people that could be on the lookout for a solution like this. Unfortunately NVIDIA SLI solutions have one negative .. to be able to operate two or more cards in SLI mode you'll need a SLI certified motherboard. Please keep this in mind at all times though, most X58 motherboards are SLI certified, and some P55 motherboards as well. That or an nForce motherboard (which is a dying breed). But carefully make sure and check that out before opting for SLI.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 30, 2010, 11:45:56 AM
Not to mention the higher PSU requirement. I'd not venture into SLI land without an 850 Watt PSU or above.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on August 30, 2010, 12:59:32 PM
1      CORSAIR XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model HX3X12G1600C9 G
Item #: N82E16820145235
$299.99

I've been going back and forth between 6gb and 12gb but I don't know if I want to spend that much on RAM or if it's worth it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 30, 2010, 01:16:17 PM
Skip the SSD (IMHO)

SSD is pure joy, I got slow-ish WD SSD (its not prone to 'used' performance degradation) and it is significantly faster than my old Raptor. If your system can support 6Gig sata, go for it. Loading OS in 10 seconds or completing full virus scan in under 2 minutes is pure joy.

I can see the appeal of it, but until I can use one for all of my storage needs, I'm not going to bother with one.  My PC goes from a power down state to desktop in about 20-25 seconds.  Shaving 10 seconds off that won't do anything for me.   And all my viri scans and whatnot are doing while I'm sleeping.  Personally, I'd rather spend the money elsewhere.  Like the new Corsair 600t case:




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nebu on August 30, 2010, 01:20:05 PM
That case is a sexy beast.  I could see being happy with that for a decade.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 01:32:53 PM
Is that CPU cooler a watercooler or a new type of air cooled?

NM, I found it on newegg. Its a mini stand alone watercooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 30, 2010, 01:34:38 PM
Actually, two of those evga 460s on the egg would only be $20 cheaper than the single asus 480.

I take back what I said about RAM prices deflating, they're pretty good right now. I think 12GB is a bit overkill, 6 would be plenty. I'd like to add 4 more GB to my setup, but that's a pretty easy upgrade unless things go crazy. Prices aren't back to where I got the 4GB kit for $65, but whatchagonnado? I use the current kit in my machine to judge where the market is, admittedly a rough gauge, but it's ok for generalizing. Right now that kit is selling for $93, down from about $120 earlier this year. In 2007 when I built the pc, 2GB was $340  :oh_i_see: Glad that pricing balloon passed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on August 30, 2010, 01:37:44 PM
Have had this sitting in my cart for about a week. Aside from adding an optical drive, any comments or critiques? Probably won't upgrade for another 5 years again or so.


I don't like it when people seem like they are trying to save a few bucks by off branding the PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 01:42:30 PM
Actually, two of those evga 460s on the egg would only be $20 cheaper than the single asus 480.

I take back what I said about RAM prices deflating, they're pretty good right now. I think 12GB is a bit overkill, 6 would be plenty. I'd like to add 4 more GB to my setup, but that's a pretty easy upgrade unless things go crazy. Prices aren't back to where I got the 4GB kit for $65, but whatchagonnado? I use the current kit in my machine to judge where the market is, admittedly a rough gauge, but it's ok for generalizing. Right now that kit is selling for $93, down from about $120 earlier this year. In 2007 when I built the pc, 2GB was $340  :oh_i_see: Glad that pricing balloon passed.

You should be fine with 6gb. That was personal preference for me. My current system has 8gb in it, and I personally wouldn't want less, but there doesnt seem to be a way to optimally get triple channel with 8gb. So 12gb it is for me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 30, 2010, 01:59:24 PM
My system would have 4 in it, upgraded to 8 later. Are you running lots of 64 bit apps?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 30, 2010, 02:09:58 PM
A decent amount.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 30, 2010, 04:34:42 PM
Is that CPU cooler a watercooler or a new type of air cooled?

NM, I found it on newegg. Its a mini stand alone watercooler.

Yup, it's what I'm using at the moment, but I switched to Gentle Typhoons on a push/pull arrangement (fan/rad/fan).   Superduper quiet and keeps my CPU nice and cool, and keeps the case uncluttered and easy to work in.  I honestly can't recommend it enough.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on August 30, 2010, 06:05:56 PM
I don't like it when people seem like they are trying to save a few bucks by off branding the PSU.

I guess I've never really considered Thermaltake as off brand.  :headscratch:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on August 30, 2010, 06:57:32 PM
Yeah, I've used several thermaltakes in the last few years, they make a good psu.

I have one of the Corsair H50 units I picked up stupidly cheap a few months ago, haven't installed it yet though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 30, 2010, 09:31:23 PM
Ya, Thermaltake isn't an off brand.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on August 31, 2010, 08:32:54 AM
That case picture is terribly misleading. All the red/black makes it look sexy, but none of that comes with it.

Boo.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 31, 2010, 11:17:27 AM
Well, ya, the motherboard is gonna be whatever color it is. As is the video card. I don't exactly feel mislead, tho.

This one would do the trick:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131642


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on August 31, 2010, 12:14:11 PM
What I dont understand is why Corsair spent so much time on making the inside of the case look really nice, with all the black texture and color and cable management and then they dont include a window on that case.

Now, I'm not one to demand a windowed case and all the glowing lights and stuff, but it seems an odd choice on corsairs part.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 31, 2010, 01:59:04 PM
Well, they probably just paint or powder the whole box at once, it would cost more to just paint the exterior. And cable management, it's usually more about air flow than teh pretty (only the cpu appears to be water-cooled).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trouble on September 01, 2010, 08:46:09 AM
I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the parts for my new PC which should be arriving today:
Core:
  • CPU - Core i7-930 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115225) - $289.99
  • Motherboard - ASUS P6X58D Premium LGA 1366 Intel X58 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131614) - $294.99
  • RAM - Corsair XMS3 12GB (6 x 2GB) Triple Channel DDR3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145235) - $299.99
  • Video Card - XFX HD-587X-ZNFC Radeon HD 5870 1GB DDR5 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150476) - $389.99
  • Case - Cooler Master Cosmos S (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119150) - $179.99
  • Monitor - Hanns·G 28" LCD Monitor (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824254043) - $299.99
  • System Drive = Crucial RealSSD C300 256GB SATA III SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148349) - $569.99
  • Media Drive - Seagate Barracuda 1.5TB 7200 RPM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148337) - $79.99
  • PSU - XION Supernova 800W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817190016) - $96.49
  • CPU Cooler - Zalman Ultra Quiet Cpu Cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118019) - $45.24
  • Optical Drive - ASUS Internal 24x DVD Rewritable SATA Optical Drive (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827135204) - $23.99
  • Normal Mouse - Logitech Anywhere Mouse MX (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826104320) - $49.99
  • Gaming Mouse - RAZER Mamba - Dual Mode Wired/Wireless Functionality (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826153048) - $129.99
  • Mouse Pad - RAZER Vespula Dual Sided Gaming Mouse Mat (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826999074) - $34.99
  • Headset - Logitech Wireless Gaming Headset G930 with 7.1 Surround Sound (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003VANOFY) - $159.99
  • OS - Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116754) - $99.99

Total: $3,044.60

This is definitely the most expensive computer I've ever built, and especially the highest relative performance. My last computer 4 years ago clocked in around $1400. Splurging on an SSD really didn't help the price. I know if I wait 3 more months I can get a cheaper/higher capacity SSD and god knows what other new shit, but I've been playing that waiting game for a year. 160gb isn't big enough for a system drive for me so I had to either skip the SSD or lay out for an expensive 200gb+ mofo. The SSD I decided on specifically because it's the only SATA3 to hit the market so far and Anandtech gave it a decent endorsement (http://www.anandtech.com/show/3812/the-ssd-diaries-crucials-realssd-c300) - "If you’re running Windows 7, have a 6Gbps controller and want a 256GB drive, go Crucial. If you’re running any other OS, are using RAID or can only afford a 128GB drive, go SandForce."

Some of the stuff I bought is definitely out beyond the price/performance sweet spot, but most of it isn't really. Some of it, especially the mouses and headset, are unnecessary creature comforts, but I wanted to go all out on a new computer for once now that I have a bit of spare money. With my computer using habits, some of the stuff that seems exorbitant probably won't be, like the RAM. I work as a freelance web developer and it is common for me to be mixing business and pleasure and it's faster for me to leave applications open than to open and close and reopen them (on this computer anyway, maybe not with the new rig/SSD). Having Photoshop in the background taking up a few gigs, development environment, three+ web browsers each with a dozen or more tabs, Eve open to check chat/market orders, and then TF2 windowed on top of all that and I expect I can do that 12gigs of RAM justice. I had 6gb before and it was at about the limit of fucking with my productivity, then a stick failed and I've been at 4gb. That has been very annoying, forcing me to close a lot of shit and greatly increasing the time it takes to switch tasks.

I'm really looking forward to trying out the headset. I've been using the Plantronics Audio 995 (http://www.amazon.com/Plantronics-Audio-995-Wireless-Headset/dp/B001SEQN3U) for the last year and a half and I've loved it. Sound/mic quality as good or better than any other $30-60 wired headset I've owned and it's actually lived longer than almost any wired headset I've owned funnily enough. The new Logitech one looks amazing and fixed every issue that I had with the Plantronics one, while providing significantly higher quality audio. You can use it while it charges via USB (Logitech one is not usable while charging, arggg). It has three configurable buttons on it which you can use for stuff like Ventrillo push to talk, so you can be on the shitter or in the kitchen talking on Vent (no I wouldn't actually use it in the bathroom).

As for the mouses, I got really used to using the Logitech VX Nano (http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Cordless-Laser-Mouse-Notebooks/dp/B000TKHBDK/) at my last job and the Anywhere Mouse is the supposed successor to it. I really like the small form factor, light weight, and free spinning mousewheel for general computer usage and web development. It's not really good for gaming though. Enter the Mamba which is one of the first wireless mice to have the dual wireless/wired mode so when I forget to charge it I'm not fucked. The mouse life difference between the two is kind of hilarious, giving you an idea of the difference in power requirements between the lasers. The Anywhere mouse should go for about 100 days on two AA batteries (the VX Nano went up to 150 days on two AAA's, ridiculous) whereas the Mamba will go for maybe 18 hours on a full charge.

I await both the FedEx and UPS delivery trucks, as my order was sourced from 5 separate distribution facilities and was annoyingly shipped using both of them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 01, 2010, 09:45:45 AM
Why don;'t you just have a workstation and game box, control with kvm?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trouble on September 01, 2010, 10:24:59 AM
Why don;'t you just have a workstation and game box, control with kvm?

Well there's a lot of overlap between the two since my work also makes use of a lot of RAM and Photoshop utilizes a GPU. I wouldn't just be able to cut out of most everything for a barebones workstation. I'd still have to load it with 6gb of RAM and a $100+ graphics card. The only thing I'd have chosen to slim down on my gaming box would be the RAM if I wasn't using it for work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 01, 2010, 11:32:21 AM
Have you seen if the SATA III SSD will run well with the 3rd party chipset on your motherboard? I've read somewhere (can't remember where, anand, twit, somewhere) that the 3rd party controllers for SATAIII aren't really all that for speed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on September 01, 2010, 08:42:50 PM
I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the parts for my new PC which should be arriving today:

I find 'one step down from most expensive' is by far better strategy than bleeding edge you went for. Cost per benefit hits really hard diminishing returns near the very top. Paying 3G for PC these days is excessive, and that comes from "money not an issue" dude.

Your system is a good choice, but you severely overpaid on SSD, headset. mouse and mousepad ($35 pad, wtf, does it give out BJs?). Return these  and get 128G WD SSD that doesn't suffer from performance degradation with use for fraction of the cost, get 5$ pad, 99$ professional KOSS wired headphones and 50$ logitech gaming mouse.

Also don't throw good money on no-name screen, it will outlive all your other components so this is the last place you want to save. You want 120Hz for 3D or 2ms for gaming from major brand like Samsung/Vewsonic.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 02, 2010, 12:26:33 PM
I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the parts for my new PC which should be arriving today:

I find 'one step down from most expensive' is by far better strategy than bleeding edge you went for. Cost per benefit hits really hard diminishing returns near the very top. Paying 3G for PC these days is excessive, and that comes from "money not an issue" dude.

Your system is a good choice, but you severely overpaid on SSD, headset. mouse and mousepad ($35 pad, wtf, does it give out BJs?). Return these  and get 128G WD SSD that doesn't suffer from performance degradation with use for fraction of the cost, get 5$ pad, 99$ professional KOSS wired headphones and 50$ logitech gaming mouse.

Also don't throw good money on no-name screen, it will outlive all your other components so this is the last place you want to save. You want 120Hz for 3D or 2ms for gaming from major brand like Samsung/Vewsonic.

I agree with all that except the headphone part. I have heard those headphones are amazing. I am actually considering picking up a pair for myself. One of the main reasons being I have a tiny desk and I am constantly getting tangled in my headphone cord.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trouble on September 02, 2010, 10:13:45 PM
I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the parts for my new PC which should be arriving today:

I find 'one step down from most expensive' is by far better strategy than bleeding edge you went for. Cost per benefit hits really hard diminishing returns near the very top. Paying 3G for PC these days is excessive, and that comes from "money not an issue" dude.

Your system is a good choice, but you severely overpaid on SSD, headset. mouse and mousepad ($35 pad, wtf, does it give out BJs?). Return these  and get 128G WD SSD that doesn't suffer from performance degradation with use for fraction of the cost, get 5$ pad, 99$ professional KOSS wired headphones and 50$ logitech gaming mouse.

Also don't throw good money on no-name screen, it will outlive all your other components so this is the last place you want to save. You want 120Hz for 3D or 2ms for gaming from major brand like Samsung/Vewsonic.

I agree with all that except the headphone part. I have heard those headphones are amazing. I am actually considering picking up a pair for myself. One of the main reasons being I have a tiny desk and I am constantly getting tangled in my headphone cord.

SSD - A couple notes here. I'm not an expert on this stuff, but my understanding of how TRIM works and based on a read of the Anand article is that it won't be an issue for me given that I'm on Windows 7 and based on my usage pattern. The cost per gigabyte seems pretty much in line with the rest of the pack so I don't think it's overpriced on that metric. As for size, my old system drive was an old 160gb HDD and I often enough had to uninstall games and programs that, while I wasn't using them at the time, I knew I would be at some point in in the next couple months just to not fill up the drive. I've held off on getting an SSD system drive up to now because I knew I'd need one over 200gb or I'd just keep hitting the same issue. I know I paid out the ass for it, but I had basically vowed not to get a new computer unless the system drive was an SSD, and that SSD was over 200gb. I waited probably a year longer than I would have just so the prices came down from astronomical to "just" ridiculous. I almost put off the purchase to wait for Intel's third generation drives at the end of the year but I just couldn't take the performance issues anymore.

Headset - I will never go back to a wired headset and the choices for wireless are basically between the one I already had and the G930. It's just a personal bugaboo but I fucking hate the feeling of wires draping down from my head and I rejoiced the day I got the Plantronics Audio 995. I could have just not upgraded but I decided that if I was selling the farm I might as well go the extra mile. Having used it now for a couple days, I am definitely happy with my purchase.

Gaming Mouse - This is one of the lesser justified purchases for sure. It's a really fucking expensive mouse. It has a glowy base station though... In the past I just didn't have a gaming mouse. There are creature comforts that come with it, like having a wide range of laser DPI's to easily switch between, but the cost isn't really justified. Not sure what I'd get in it's place, the Anywhere Mouse really isn't suited to gaming. Probably just a regular wireless mouse in the $50-70 range like you said (dislike wires on mice too, I don't like wires on shit I need to move).

Mouse Pad - I decided to get it after trying out my roommate's older version. I would have thought the same without having tried it, but I really really like the feel of it.

Monitor - I kind of was looking at it as a hold-me-over purchase to move my old 1650x1050 monitor to secondary. Monitors seem to kind of be in flux now with the introduction of 120Hz/3D/etc. and I plan to buy two more monitors in the next 6-12 months once I have a better grasp on what I want to do. At that point this one can be relegated to second or third string.


I definitely went beyond my usual (and yours) bleeding edge minus a step or two. Not quite into crazy ass $1000 processor and dual $700 video card land, but going down that path.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Goreschach on September 02, 2010, 11:28:55 PM

I agree with all that except the headphone part. I have heard those headphones are amazing. I am actually considering picking up a pair for myself. One of the main reasons being I have a tiny desk and I am constantly getting tangled in my headphone cord.

Go Sennheiser or go home.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 03, 2010, 10:49:34 AM

I agree with all that except the headphone part. I have heard those headphones are amazing. I am actually considering picking up a pair for myself. One of the main reasons being I have a tiny desk and I am constantly getting tangled in my headphone cord.

Go Sennheiser or go home.

I just checked their site, I dont see any wireless headsets, only wireless headphones.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trouble on September 03, 2010, 12:25:31 PM
Wireless stereo headsets are a rare breed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Segoris on September 03, 2010, 01:22:08 PM
Mouse Pad - I decided to get it after trying out my roommate's older version. I would have thought the same without having tried it, but I really really like the feel of it.

On this, I have to agree. I believe the older version you're talking about is the Razer Exactmat. I have one of them and it is awesome. I used to just use the basic shitty blue pads thinking anything larger would suck and not really be useful while the material didn't matter at all, I found I was wrong when I randomly bought the exactmat during a sale. I have a hard time gaming on regular mouse pads now, especially at the mouse sensitivity I'm using as a result of a "premium" mousepad.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Miguel on September 03, 2010, 03:57:52 PM
Quote
I know I paid out the ass for it, but I had basically vowed not to get a new computer unless the system drive was an SSD, and that SSD was over 200gb.

$600 for an SSD? 
 
:-o

I salute you sir, for thou art a true gamer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on September 03, 2010, 06:43:07 PM
Yes, brave souls like him is why we can get technology much, much cheaper down the line...

Thank you sir, you are gentlemen and a scholar.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Koyasha on September 03, 2010, 07:24:02 PM
I'm curious as to the Mamba and whether it has a way to change the battery, a detail I have not been able to find on the website which makes me think it cannot be changed at all.  I ask because I currently have a Logitech MX Revolution, which I am quite fond of, but its battery life is growing ever shorter.  Early on I was able to use it for a couple days without recharging and these days it gives me a critical battery warning within a single day.  So when I do replace my mouse, I hope to replace it with one that I can change the battery on.

Of course, at least I could just run the mamba in wired mode permanently if it came to that.  I really don't see the point of a wireless mouse most of the time, and I would have gotten a wireless one of these if the features of the MX Revolution had been available on a wired mouse when I got it.  If I do replace it, I'm going to miss the freespin wheel.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 04, 2010, 01:51:31 AM

So when I do replace my mouse, I hope to replace it with one that I can change the battery on.

Soldering iron.

If it's getting replaced anyways you might as well wreck it beyond repair in the name of science.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on September 04, 2010, 02:28:49 AM
I'm curious as to the Mamba and whether it has a way to change the battery, a detail I have not been able to find on the website which makes me think it cannot be changed at all.  I ask because I currently have a Logitech MX Revolution, which I am quite fond of, but its battery life is growing ever shorter.  Early on I was able to use it for a couple days without recharging and these days it gives me a critical battery warning within a single day.  So when I do replace my mouse, I hope to replace it with one that I can change the battery on.

Of course, at least I could just run the mamba in wired mode permanently if it came to that.  I really don't see the point of a wireless mouse most of the time, and I would have gotten a wireless one of these if the features of the MX Revolution had been available on a wired mouse when I got it.  If I do replace it, I'm going to miss the freespin wheel.

You can easily change the battery on the mamba assuming you can find a replacement. 

IMHO (been using it for about a year) this mouse isn't worth $75 much less $130, then again I don't use the macro features and never go above 1800 DPI.  Occasionally In Photoshop it does come in handy to be able to slow the mouse down with a click of a button, but my new Logitech mouse does that too.  The scroll wheel squeaks like a real mouse (aka a cheap piece of plastic) and it has some serious friction to it so it is cumbersome to scroll large distances.  The glowy charging station was cool but my always on USB ports are on the front of my box and I hate plugging crap in there. I run out of juice regularly and 95% of the time I don't bother switching back to wireless so the glowy base station sits there like a dead hunk of plastic (at least the wire is nice and long and high quality).

On the other hand my performance MX goes for a week or 2 between charges (as opposed to a day or 3), is much more ergonomic, has a great build quality and generally blows the razor away in all aspects except for macros (which I do not use).  It even offers the same emergency usb wired mode and the nano-unifying-dongle with 30 ft range > glowy base station any day of the week.  The DPI is less than the Mamba's 4800 but the 1600 or 2400 DPI (can't remember which) is more than enough for me or anyone else who doesn't have super human dexterity.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Koyasha on September 04, 2010, 03:24:12 AM
Hm, last time I looked Logitech didn't have any mice that could go wired/wireless, and all their good ones were wireless.  But taking a look at some of the newer Logitech mice, I like the Wireless Gaming Mouse G700.  It looks like it's got the optional-cable feature as well, and it has buttons in much more comfortable places than the razer, and the shape looks as though it's similar to the MX Revolution, which has a form that I rather like.  When I do replace mine maybe it'll be with a G700, and I won't lose the freespin that I like, or the form factor I'm pleased with.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on September 04, 2010, 11:51:15 AM
Wireless gaming mouse is an oxymoron.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 04, 2010, 03:18:13 PM
Hm, last time I looked Logitech didn't have any mice that could go wired/wireless
Meet the G700 (http://www.logitech.com/en-us/gaming/mice-keyboard-combos/devices/7244?WT.ac=GSeries|7295|G700Getthedetails). Sexy as hell.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Tarami on September 04, 2010, 03:40:38 PM
Wireless gaming mouse is an oxymoron.
Word, my good man.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 04, 2010, 03:44:51 PM
Wireless gaming mouse is an oxymoron.

As are wired mice that turn themselves off. We have those abominations at work and they drive me nuts.

Corsair has a new gaming headset coming out and it sounds pretty hot. Might want to look into it. I believe it's called HS-1 (go figure) and its price point is supposedly $99.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on September 05, 2010, 11:58:23 AM
I use Logitech G5 (slightly newer model is G500, but I don't like side button design, too easy to mis-click) and MX518. I really like ability to customize weight in G5/G500, but I find MX518 more sensitive/precise. I use G5 for spray-and-pray, I use MX518 for sniping.

I can easily tell noobs that use wireless mice - they are the ones that get headshot in sniper duels.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: birdsguts on September 05, 2010, 03:50:53 PM
Even Razor mice pale compared to the mighty MX518 in my opinion.
Best mouse made. Why spend more?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 05, 2010, 03:57:52 PM
I prefer Razor mice, though I'm still on my original Copperhead I bought back in '05. Haven't seen anything since that's really moved me enough to spend money.

The Naga and/or the MS side button one whose name escapes me are kinda tempting, but I have two Copperheads and neither seems intent on expiring anytime soon, sooo...cheap wins out.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 05, 2010, 04:57:44 PM
Even Razor mice pale compared to the mighty MX518 in my opinion.
Best mouse made. Why spend more?

The old 518 was amazing. I recently replaced mine, and it seems that the construction is much lower quality now. The mouse doesnt have the same solid feel that it used to. Also the buttons do not sit as solid.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 08, 2010, 04:18:44 PM
If it's getting replaced anyways you might as well wreck it beyond repair in the name of science.
This is one of my core philosophies. Great way to learn how to do stuff.

My favorite words to hear "Let's replace it", my mind hears "Let's tear it apart and see if we can fix it with no negative consequences."

Though I did just tear apart an iPod to replace the backplate...I only needed a little bit of superglue :P

I was talking in the RF thread about replacing my cordless logitech mouse, I just got tired of crappy performance. MX518 it is. Miss the heft of the two AAs, it's a bit light. Do like the on-the-fly sensitivity adjustment and it seems to perform well enough. Hate the cord, but meh.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: birdsguts on September 08, 2010, 07:01:45 PM
Even Razor mice pale compared to the mighty MX518 in my opinion.
Best mouse made. Why spend more?

The old 518 was amazing. I recently replaced mine, and it seems that the construction is much lower quality now. The mouse doesnt have the same solid feel that it used to. Also the buttons do not sit as solid.

Oh man that's sad to hear. I should have stocked up on old ones when I bought this one. I've had it for about 6 years at this point. Maybe more.
I have these AKG headphones... k240s... same story. Used to be rock solid, all the smart people bought them up when they were getting scarce.. Construction went to shit. "Say law veee y'all"


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on September 15, 2010, 03:01:45 PM
So hey, I've got a question.

My system drive died last week and I need a replacement. I have two choices, a 1 TB conventional drive (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533) ($90) or a 60 GB Solid State (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227542) ($147).

Normally you'd go with the 1 TB, right? Except the only thing I put on my system drive anymore is the OS. I've had Windows scrag itself (and its drive) too many times to trust any other data to it. I keep all my valuable data (docs, MP3s, videos) on a 1 TB secondary drive. I don't actually need a huge system drive -- the only thing on it will be Vista.

So my main question here is, is it worth spending the extra money for the extra speed, or should I just grab the 1 TB and use it to install crap games?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 15, 2010, 09:42:19 PM
Well, if you're using Vista, it won't have trim support, so although the SSD will be fast as heck initially (even with sloggy Vista), the performance will drop to about half in a few months.

If you were going to get Windows 7, I'd say shoot for the SSD, but otherwise, go for the 1T.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: hal on September 15, 2010, 10:34:36 PM
I gotta say I know its a build your own thread but just saying. Newegg 590.00 shipped.

Processor:
    AMD Athlon II X2 240(2.8GHz)

Processor Main Features:
    64 bit Dual Core Processor

Cache Per Processor:
    2MB L2 Cache

Memory:
    4GB DDR3 1333

Hard Drive:
    500GB SATA II

Optical Drive 1:
    24X DL DVD+/-RW Drive

Graphics:
    NVIDIA GeForce GT240 1GB

It runs lotrol in dx 10 real smooth. It plays Vampire the masquerade better than any computer I've ever had. That is without moniter. Keyboard mouse and tower. I couldn't figure out how to build cheaper.
1 x ($559.99) DT IBUYPOWER | GAMER POWER 538D3
$559.99


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on September 16, 2010, 08:36:56 AM
Well, if you're using Vista, it won't have trim support, so although the SSD will be fast as heck initially (even with sloggy Vista), the performance will drop to about half in a few months.

Yeah, I was warned about that, and I found this article on optimizing Vista for an SSD: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/storage/2009/08/27/ssd-performance-tweaks-for-vista/1

Not enough, you think?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 16, 2010, 12:35:23 PM
Well, they are 'tweaks', not really optimizing. Unless by 'optimizing' means 'slowing down the junking up process'. They essentially just turn scheduled defrag off, and turn off superfetch and indexing. Which will slow the degradation of the drive, for sure, but you're still essentially then just running Windows 7 without trim support. Over time, its just gonna get cloggy, no matter what.

The later 'tweaks', including reimaging after a full erase are going to work too, but its a lot of effort. You'd still need to buy Acronis or another cloning software (I recommend Acronis, btw), so why not just get Windows 7?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on September 16, 2010, 03:25:47 PM
Buy the SSD and Win7 together.

I've stuck with XP on my desktops because all my stuff works so there hasn't been a need to upgrade, but it's been impressing me with how well it's running on a laptop I recently installed for a co-worker.  Better than the old XP that was on it, and Vista would have choked it to death.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 16, 2010, 04:03:14 PM
I grabbed it when they were running all the pre-launch $50 promos. I can't believe everyone didn't grab at least one copy at that price!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on September 16, 2010, 05:23:53 PM
Buy the SSD and Win7 together.

Unfortunately, I can't afford both right now, and I need the drive to get the home PC working again. So I'm going to taken Engels' advice (which was echoed by the office IT guys) and get a conventional drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trouble on September 16, 2010, 09:56:02 PM
http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/wiki/index.php?title=How_to_set_up_Windows_on_a_VERTEX at the bottom under "Drive maintenance".

OCZ has a program called wiper.exe which essentially does a manual TRIM and will work on Vista. The downside is you do have to run it manually. I read somewhere that it'll work with any SSD that supports TRIM but I'm not sure if that's true or not and I forget the source.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 17, 2010, 01:05:38 AM
Actually, that's kinda cool, and if it works, I change my mind   :awesome_for_real:

Looks like although they're talking about vertex, it also works with the agility line.

The more you know...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on September 17, 2010, 09:04:35 AM
Does anyone have experience with or knowledge of ATI's 5870 mobile graphics card?  It should be monstrously powerful for a laptop, but...I've never owned an ATI card, and I am afraid of the drivers.  I always end up with Nvidia cards, and often because the driver issues scare me off.  Do I have reason to be worried?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Numtini on September 17, 2010, 10:00:47 AM
No idea about that particularly card, but I've had my ATIs for about the last two years and have had no problem at all with drivers.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 17, 2010, 10:54:07 AM
I've had a ATI 5870 desktop version and have had no issues for the last 7 months. No point of real comparison tho, one is desktop, the other is a laptop.

Here's a comprehensive review, along with comparison charts:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/ATI-Mobility-Radeon-HD-5870.23073.0.html

Bottom line is it compares in performance to the desktop 5770.

Small editorial: The fear of ATI dates back to the freakin' 90s. ATI hasn't been particularly bad for a long long time. No worse than Nvidia. Some stuff comes out half baked, such as their eyefinity tech, but for basic stuff, its fine. People have loooong memories, is all.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 17, 2010, 11:29:48 AM
Very long memories mostly because the experiences were so horrific. And it was somewhat later than the '90s, too.

Regardless, ATi/AMD/whoever still isn't quite in the same league as nVidia when it comes to drivers. I still see myriad compatiability and performance complaints...much more than with nVidia. On the good side, they're more in neighborhood of quibble issues, but there it is. It's not the horror show it once was, but I personally still stick with nVidia.

On the subjects of notebooks, there's some very hot stuff coming down the pike from both AMD and Intel. If you're in the market but can hold off a bit, I'd wait and see what the Sandybridge and the new AMD goodies bring to the table. Preliminary reports look to be very favorable indeed. VERY favorable.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 17, 2010, 11:59:24 AM
Speaking of historical gpus, I found this list on maybe my twelfth post here:
Quote
Diamond Stealth 3d
Creative 3d Blaster
3dfx Voodoo 1
3dfx Voodoo 3
Nvidia TNT Ultra
Nvidia Geforce 2 Ultra
Nvidia Geforce 4 ti4400
ATI Radeon 9800 Pro
I don't remember what was in my last machine, was there one between the 9800 Pro and the current 8800 GTX? Can't remember. All but the first two were really great cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Tarami on September 19, 2010, 08:36:46 PM
Nice list. Makes me want to share my own:

Matrox Millenium 4MB (ran Quake 1 and Ultima 7 I believe)
Righteous Orchid 3D, Voodoo 1, 6MB (ran Quake 2, burnt up)
Artic Rage, Voodoo 1, 8MB (ran Quake 2 briefly)
Matrox G200, 8MB (ran Quake 2, good Lord that card was slow but looked fantastic.)
Righteous Orchid II, Voodoo 2, 16MB (Quake 2)
?, Riva TNT 2 Pro, 32MB (Quake 2, 3)
Hercules 3D Prophet II, Geforce 2 64MB (Quake 3, vrooooooom!)
Club Radeon 9600 SE (worst purchase of my life. Luckily, the piece of shit burnt up.)
Club Radeon 9800 Pro (ran nothing specific)
BFG GeForce 6800 GTO, factory overclocked, 256 MB (ran WoW until it melted.)
Leadtek GeForce 7800 GTX, 256 MB (ran WoW until I quit, then some LotRO)
Leadtek GeForce 8800 GT, 512 MB (ran LotRO, still in my office computer)
XFX GeForce 280 GTX, 1024 MB (now running)

Looking back... the first Voodoo 1 was still my favourite card because it's so formative for my childhood. After having pushed my greasy nose against the counter glass of a local electronics market for a couple of weeks, my dad finally gave in and bought it for me as an early birthday present. I don't think I will ever get an as profound graphics experience ever again as the first few seconds after I had booted up Quake 2 in OpenGL for the first time. A year later my parents had to install a seperate ISDN connection in the house to be able to receive calls, as I was hogging the phone line for hours every night to play Quake 2 CTF. Going from the USRobotics 33.6K modem to 64K ISDN was pure steroids for the railgun accuracy. Though I'm still not sure how I managed to configure the Cisco adapter at age 14 - but no config meant no Quake, so I guess I was motivated beyond belief to penetrate the obscure Telnet interface.

Quite frankly, my parents were the best and most enabling parents a kid who loved games could have had. They got me computers, Internet connections and video cards and drove me and my friends all over the country for LAN parties. A weekend without fragging people over a LAN was a boring weekend indeed. I guess they thought it better than me being out drinking and they were probably right.

I guess that's my boring gaming history in so many words.

Edit:
Sorry for the derail, but I was in a cool-story-bro'-sharing mode.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on September 20, 2010, 10:57:08 AM
So I decided to take the plunge with that ATI card.  Well, more of a plunge on the whole laptop:

http://www.msimobile.com/level3_productpage.aspx?cid=6&id=255 (http://www.msimobile.com/level3_productpage.aspx?cid=6&id=255)

Should be fast as balls.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 21, 2010, 11:16:47 PM
Very long memories mostly because the experiences were so horrific. And it was somewhat later than the '90s, too.

Regardless, ATi/AMD/whoever still isn't quite in the same league as nVidia when it comes to drivers.

Yes, they haven't damaged or killed a shitton of cards by disabling automatic fan control in the last year.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on September 22, 2010, 06:22:06 AM
I interviewed with a group at ATI/AMD that was in the process of rewriting the entire back-end suite of software used by the driver team (also most of the pre-silicon testing teams) but their time line was ~2 years out for the full change over.  So, they are working on it but it won't be soon.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 22, 2010, 09:35:13 AM
I managed to resist buying it until trying the demo, which is now available if anyone is interested.

Also, I just noticed being able to grab AMD Catalyst video card updates through Steam.  Pretty nice.  Info (http://blogs.amd.com/play/2010/09/14/video-driver-updates-made-easy-amd-and-valve-team-up-to-provide-ati-catalyst-updates-on-steam/).  More info (http://blogs.amd.com/play/2010/09/14/video-driver-updates-made-easy-amd-and-valve-team-up-to-provide-ati-catalyst-updates-on-steam/).

I clicked this, thinking "yay, driver updates made easier!"

two and a half goddamned hours later, my display is fixed.

No, it's not steam's fault, it's that ATI can't write a goddamned installer to save their fucking lives, and the 10.8 and 10.9 also wound up with known issues where the overscan settings (that are wrong by default) reset to defaults every reboot. Oh, and you have a 10% chance of opening the control panel to reset them.

*rant* I love ATI's hardware, but they need to hire a tools programmer.
:why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on September 22, 2010, 10:27:22 PM
One memory of computer gaming that stands out for me was of original sound blaster. Someone hooked up big speakers via amp to it and played original Dune RTS. It was shiny, it went BOOOM!!! ... I couldn't afford such setup until much later, but in all my setups I try not to neglect sound. It makes tons of difference in your gaming experience.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ironwood on September 23, 2010, 05:01:15 AM
So I decided to take the plunge with that ATI card.  Well, more of a plunge on the whole laptop:

http://www.msimobile.com/level3_productpage.aspx?cid=6&id=255 (http://www.msimobile.com/level3_productpage.aspx?cid=6&id=255)

Should be fast as balls.

That looks rather nice.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on September 23, 2010, 09:42:20 AM
I have it now in my possession.  I can confirm that it is balls fast (for a notebook) and can manage Crysis on High settings.  That's with stock drivers, which I'm afraid to touch at this point.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 23, 2010, 06:08:38 PM
So my wife's computer died yesterday, so it's time to try and get it fixed (might need a new mobo) but it's also brought up the time to get a new box from December to now, since my as-built-by-Trippy box is getting past 3 years. I'll get the new one, she'll get the old one. Everyone wins!

We'll be getting it from here, since it's local and actually has very good prices for Australia. Newegg etc won't cut it, I'm afraid.
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/build.php?page=1&systype=intel

Budget is AU$2000, though if it can be cheaper that's a bonus. Monitor seperate. Going not for bleeding edge, but best power-bang-buck. A solid 80% machine that plays games gud.

Wants:
Intel CPU
NVIDIA Video Card
2TB HDD. Or maybe 2 of them.
The cheaper Samsung/Lite-On/LG SATA DVD rewriters are good enough. No need for BRD at this stage.
A good case with tool-less enclosures and good cooling. Maybe a 2nd choice/backup case in case they're out of stock.
LMK if I need to buy additional fans or request a PSU upgrade.
4GB RAM? 6GB RAM? 8GB RAM? I want to have a good solid amount, so I never have to upgrade, but I still can if I need to. And RAM to complement the Mobo as best possible.

Not bothered about sound cards. Onboard sound with stereo is usually good enough, since we often have 2 machines going in here anyway. I don't need 5.1 or anything.

I'm also going to pay them to glue it together for me, since it's just easier for warranty purposes etc. And that way I know it'll work when I get it.
I can get a cheap Win7 upgrade kit - either one of these. So I'll get the cheapest qualifying OEM version they have available.
Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate - Upgrade (media only) - WAH, Student - Campus, School - DVD - 32-bit - English - Microsoft
Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate - Upgrade (media only) - WAH, Student - Campus, School - DVD - 64-bit - English - Microsoft


No speakers/modems/keyboards/mice

Advice on monitors is also welcome, but will be seperate from the box budget. HDMI worthwhile? Will it play all my video files?
I'm partial to Samsungs and since I have a 22" at the moment, I'd like to go bigger. 24" or even 27"


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 23, 2010, 07:14:58 PM
Wants:
Intel CPU - i7 950 (around $300)

EVGA 1366 motherboard that supports SLi for upgradeability. Between $200 and $280.

NVIDIA Video Card - EVGA 460gtx 1gb (easy to add another for big graphics boost) (around $200)

2TB HDD. Or maybe 2 of them. - (Look for a western digital or seagate on sale. Newegg has them for like $100)

The cheaper Samsung/Lite-On/LG SATA DVD rewriters are good enough. No need for BRD at this stage. - Any cheap sata dvd-burner is good.

A good case with tool-less enclosures and good cooling. Maybe a 2nd choice/backup case in case they're out of stock. - Pick one? I like Antec 900-2.

4GB RAM? 6GB RAM? 8GB RAM? Corsair XMS3, ether 3x2gb or 6x2gb sticks. About $150 each 6gb kit.



Added notes above. That place doesnt seem to have any of the midrange EVGA motherboards. Which is a pain. Other than that the rest of the stuff seems to be on that list.

Oh yeah, make sure you get a 64bit OS.

Ultimate is mostly just a pointless prince gouge though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 23, 2010, 07:22:30 PM
The educational upgrade to ultimate will cost me $20, so I'm not too worried about that part.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on September 23, 2010, 08:25:19 PM
I really like my CoolerMaster case. http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=42375 looks like that site has them.

Airflow is really pretty good, it is easy to add fans (I added 2 blue LED ones to the top), all drive bays are tooless and easy to use(HDD bays are great because the back side is accessible as well when the back cover is off for cabling etc.) Also has a ton of power connectors for graphics cards/sata drives/old school numex nicely wrapped in black mesh tube.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 24, 2010, 09:09:06 AM
Why wouldn't you go for the i5 750? Also, if it's for your gaming rig, don't skimp on the gpu. Get the best you can afford. I don't like SLI, though. Here's my wishlist from a couple pages back.

i5 750
4GB Crucial DDR3 1600
ASUS P7P55D-E Pro
ASUS 480 GTX 1.5GB

Since most games are still 32 bit I wouldn't worry too much about the RAM, you can drop another 4GB in down the line if needed. I'm re-using case/drives/sound card/etc, so that's all I have for quick recommends.

That cpu (well, the i5 760 at your site), some 4GB pc1600, 2TB WD Black (I'd go for the 1TB for better cache, but eh), Lite-On cheap optical, the P7P55d-E Pro mobo, the Asus 480 GTX and shop assembly totals about $1450, leaving you $550 for a case and OS.
Quote
Custom Built Computer
- Intel CPU:   Intel Core i5-760 / 2.80GHz / 8MB Cache / LGA1156
- Intel Motherboards:   Asus P7P55D-E-PRO Intel Mainboard - 4x DDR3 / 6x Sata Raid / 1x IDE / Gigabit Lan / LGA 1156
- Desktop Hard Drives:   Western Digital Caviar Black 2TB 7200RPM 32MB SATA 3Gbs
- Optical Drives:   Lite-On Super AllWrite SATA DVD Re-Writer (24x - Black)
- Desktop Memory:   Corsair DDR3 4GB PC-12800/1600 (2x XMS3 2GB) CMX4GX3M2A1600C9 Ram
- Graphics Cards:   Asus NVIDIA ENGTX480-2DI-1536-MD5 GTX480, 1536MB, 384bit, DDR5, 2DVI, mHDMI, FAN, PCIE, ATX
- Assembly:   Built By Centre Com
- Custom Quote Date:   Saturday, 25 September, 2010
Sub-Total: $1,449.40


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 24, 2010, 07:43:59 PM
If you want to get your DDR3 to run triple channel, you need it to be install in sets of 3. Which is why I said get 3x2gb. You could get 3x1gb or 6x1gb, but thats going to be a lot hard to upgrade in the future.

Also, I still think going with 1x460gtx will be fine, and then just add another later if you need more power. 2x460s is pretty much the same as 1x480, but produces less heat in most instances.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/

Go there to see.

Before this generation of cards, I also disliked SLI and not a good deal, but with how these 460s work, it has suddenly become a great way to upgrade or even run a new system.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chinchilla on September 24, 2010, 08:42:00 PM
Didn't want to hijack someone's thread, but appartently this is the one thread for all (I didn't know that).

I'm building this PC for Darkfall.  I really enjoy the game and my laptop isn't cutting it.  What do you guys think?  I'm buying a monitor and other little things from newegg.  The bulk is from IBuyPower because I don't feel like doing my own tech support and such for problems.  They include it for 3 years.

Think this case is good enough?  Price is $1,300.  I can get a dual card setup fro another $230, but I didn't think I needed all that.

Back2School Intel X58 Special Case ( NZXT Tempest EVO Gaming Case - Black )

Case Lighting ( None )

iBUYPOWER Labs - Noise Reduction ( None )

iBUYPOWER Labs - Internal Expansion ( None )

Processor ( Intel® Core™ i7 950 Processor (4x 3.06GHz/8MB L3 Cache) )
iBUYPOWER PowerDrive ( None )

Processor Cooling ( Liquid CPU Cooling System [SOCKET-1366] - [Free Upgrade] Standard 120mm Fan )

Memory ( 6 GB [2 GB X3] DDR3-1600 - A-DATA Gaming Series )

Video Card ( NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 - 1GB - Single Card )

Video Card Brand ( Major Brand Powered by ATI or NVIDIA )

Motherboard ( [SLI] ASUS P6X58D-E )

Motherboard USB / SATA Interface ( Motherboard default USB / SATA Interface )

Power Supply ( 750 Watt -- Corsair CMPSU-750TX )

Primary Hard Drive ( 1 TB HARD DRIVE -- 64M Cache, 7200 RPM, 6.0Gb/s - Single Drive )
Data Hard Drive ( None )

Optical Drive ( 24X Sony Dual Format/Double Layer DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Drive - Black )

2nd Optical Drive ( None )

Flash Media Reader/Writer ( 12-In-1 Internal Flash Media Card Reader/Writer - Black )

Meter Display ( None )

Sound Card ( Creative Labs Sound Blaster Audigy SE )

Network Card ( Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100) )

Operating System ( Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium + Office Starter 2010 (Includes basic versions of Word and Excel) - 64-Bit )

Keyboard ( iBUYPOWER USB Keyboard - Black )

Monitor ( None )

2nd Monitor ( None )

Speaker System ( None )

Power Protection ( None )

Headset ( None )

Video Camera ( None )

Advanced Build Options ( Tuniq TX-2 High Performance Thermal Compound - The best interface between your CPU and the heatsinks )

Warranty ( Standard Warranty Service - Standard 3-Year Limited Warranty + Lifetime Technical Support )

Rush Service ( Rush Service Fee (not shipping fee) - No Rush Service, Estimate Ship Out in 5~10 Business Days )


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 24, 2010, 10:55:15 PM
i5: For people who don't give a fuck for how many seconds faster they can decompress archives as long as their games run faster.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 24, 2010, 11:41:45 PM
i5: For people who don't give a fuck for how many seconds faster they can decompress archives as long as their games run faster.

Care to elaborate on that?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on September 25, 2010, 12:19:38 AM
i5 in tests for gaming have been performing pretty much the same as an i7 since they announced the part. i7 you pay a price premium for.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 25, 2010, 12:37:37 AM
So my wife's computer died yesterday, so it's time to try and get it fixed (might need a new mobo) but it's also brought up the time to get a new box from December to now, since my as-built-by-Trippy box is getting past 3 years. I'll get the new one, she'll get the old one. Everyone wins!

We'll be getting it from here, since it's local and actually has very good prices for Australia. Newegg etc won't cut it, I'm afraid.
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/build.php?page=1&systype=intel

Budget is AU$2000, though if it can be cheaper that's a bonus. Monitor seperate. Going not for bleeding edge, but best power-bang-buck. A solid 80% machine that plays games gud.

Wants:
Intel CPU
NVIDIA Video Card
2TB HDD. Or maybe 2 of them.
The cheaper Samsung/Lite-On/LG SATA DVD rewriters are good enough. No need for BRD at this stage.
A good case with tool-less enclosures and good cooling. Maybe a 2nd choice/backup case in case they're out of stock.
LMK if I need to buy additional fans or request a PSU upgrade.
4GB RAM? 6GB RAM? 8GB RAM? I want to have a good solid amount, so I never have to upgrade, but I still can if I need to. And RAM to complement the Mobo as best possible.

Not bothered about sound cards. Onboard sound with stereo is usually good enough, since we often have 2 machines going in here anyway. I don't need 5.1 or anything.

I'm also going to pay them to glue it together for me, since it's just easier for warranty purposes etc. And that way I know it'll work when I get it.
I can get a cheap Win7 upgrade kit - either one of these. So I'll get the cheapest qualifying OEM version they have available.
Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate - Upgrade (media only) - WAH, Student - Campus, School - DVD - 32-bit - English - Microsoft
Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate - Upgrade (media only) - WAH, Student - Campus, School - DVD - 64-bit - English - Microsoft


No speakers/modems/keyboards/mice

Advice on monitors is also welcome, but will be seperate from the box budget. HDMI worthwhile? Will it play all my video files?
I'm partial to Samsungs and since I have a 22" at the moment, I'd like to go bigger. 24" or even 27"

You have a pretty big budget for just the box so you have lot a flexibility in the configuration.

Some comments on the earlier recommendations. The i5-760 that Sky recommended is still the price/performance king for "enthusiast" gaming rigs. If you wanted to save some money that would be the way to go. However if you wanted to use up your budget you can spend extra on the CPU. I wouldn't recommend the i7-950 cause the max turbo speed (3.33 GHz) is lower than some of the other CPUs in that price range. My pick for CPU for you is the i7-870. It has a slightly slower base clock speed than the i7-950 but higher max turbo speed (3.6 GHz, also faster than i5-760 which is 3.46 GHz). The i7-870 also puts you on the (generally) cheaper 1156 platform.

However if you do want to go SLI you might want to go with 1366 since you'll get easier support for full dual PCIe x 16.

For memory I'd go to either 6 GB if you go with 1366 or 8 GB with 1156 and just forget about 4 GB.

For video card(s) it depends on how much noise and heat you are willing to put up with. The GTX 460 is the sweet spot right now for NVIDIA enthusiast GPUs. You do have the budget for a GTX 480 if you do need that much GPU power, though.

I don't like how the cases have included power supplies so I would order the power supply and case (w/o PS) separately.

Here's what I would recommend. It's a little below your budget so there's room to upgrade the components you care most about:

Intel i7-870   $344.00
Asus P7P55D-E PRO  $204.00
WD Caviar Black 2 TB  $206.00
Corsair DDR3 8 GB PC-10600/1333 (4x 2GB)  $221.00
EVGA NVIDIA GTX460 SC (01G-P2-1373-KR)  $284.90
Corsair ATX-750 750W  $236.50  (rebranded Seasonic)
Case (whatever you like)
DVD burner (whatever you like)

$1496.50




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 25, 2010, 12:42:24 AM
i5: For people who don't give a fuck for how many seconds faster they can decompress archives as long as their games run faster.
Care to elaborate on that?
The i5s don't have Hyper-Threading like the i7s do. HT doesn't help with gaming (yet). If gaming is what you care about i5s are the better value. If you regularly run CPU-intensive multi-threaded apps, though, the i7s may give you better performance overall.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 25, 2010, 01:19:12 AM
Didn't want to hijack someone's thread, but appartently this is the one thread for all (I didn't know that).

I'm building this PC for Darkfall.  I really enjoy the game and my laptop isn't cutting it.  What do you guys think?  I'm buying a monitor and other little things from newegg.  The bulk is from IBuyPower because I don't feel like doing my own tech support and such for problems.  They include it for 3 years.

Think this case is good enough?  Price is $1,300.  I can get a dual card setup fro another $230, but I didn't think I needed all that.
If you don't plan on going to SLI you might be able to save some money switching to the 1156 platform.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 25, 2010, 01:28:43 AM
i5: For people who don't give a fuck for how many seconds faster they can decompress archives as long as their games run faster.
Care to elaborate on that?
The i5s don't have Hyper-Threading like the i7s do. HT doesn't help with gaming (yet). If gaming is what you care about i5s are the better value. If you regularly run CPU-intensive multi-threaded apps, though, the i7s may give you better performance overall.


Most of the current benches have the i7 beating out the i5 at medium and high resolutions. Not by a huge margin but still beating them, also, isnt i5 all 1156? Going 1366 should give you a sligh boost in almost all areas. Also, if you want to overclock, I heard the x58 OCs much better.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 25, 2010, 01:52:51 AM
Yes there are faster CPUs but you pay more for them. The point about the i5-760 is the excellent performance you get at the $200 price point. You can pay 50%, 100%, 400% more for 10%, 20%, 30% frame rate improvement.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 25, 2010, 06:00:51 AM
Thanks guys, I'm more after the "sweet spot" of the moment with the components rather than paying 50% or 100% more for 10-20% performance bump. Won't be overclocking. With the last machine I bought there I got them to pull the included PSU and give me a slight discount on a better (higher voltage) one, so it shouldn't be a problem hopefully. If I can spend $1500 or $1800 rather than 2k I won't be upset. The monitor is probably going top set me back an extra $500 on top of the box, so hey. I ballparked the $2k budget from the last box that I wanted to spend $1200 on but ended up spending $1800 on instead.

Now: the stupid questions:

What is SLI and why do I (not?) want it?
2 Video cards? How does this work? (and if I got 2x of the $2-300-range vid cards, which ones would be the best to get? And would it be better than 1 $600 card (I'm not keen on spending $600 on one vid card for some reason.. probably after my last uber card melted down and cost me $300 to rep it.)
1156/1366? Motherboard type?
Triple channel RAM? um...?



thanks again,


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on September 25, 2010, 10:39:36 AM
SLI is "scan line interlacing", what it does is separate the screen into alternating rows of horizontal pixels and has 1 card draw every other (or every 3rd or 4th in a 3 or 4 board setup).



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 25, 2010, 10:47:27 AM
Quote from: Trippy
For memory I'd go to either 6 GB if you go with 1366 or 8 GB with 1156 and just forget about 4 GB.
I'm curious about this. I get the 6GB for triple channel, but why would you need more than 4GB for a gaming box? The 64 bit games just aren't there yet, and you can slap in another 4GB when they are. Slapping in a ton of memory has always been one of my traditions in building pcs, but I don't really see much reason for it right now.

About the SLI thing, it's my own preference. I always buy the very best video card on the market when I build a computer, I find I need to upgrade gpus less and my computers last a long time. This 8800GTX is still a great card, while most cards of its generation are long dead. I guess you could buy a lower end card and then double it later, but then you're doubling an old card...I'd probably spend $250-300 on a new card entirely at that point, since you'd get about the same performance as the old card in SLI without any hassles of SLI.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 25, 2010, 11:33:29 AM
Yes there are faster CPUs but you pay more for them. The point about the i5-760 is the excellent performance you get at the $200 price point. You can pay 50%, 100%, 400% more for 10%, 20%, 30% frame rate improvement.


The i5 750/760 is probably the best bang-for-your-buck CPU out there for high end gaming. The i7 does seem to scale better with high-end SLI systems, but then we're talking megabuck multi-GPU systems where price really is no object (think 2-3 470 or 480GTXs). Both OC like crazy, even on air.

The new Sandybridge stuff seems like it'll continue this trend with a bullet. AMDs new stuff is looking pretty interesting, too, but nothing concrete yet on how it will perform compared to the Intel offerings.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on September 25, 2010, 02:45:29 PM
I'm curious about this. I get the 6GB for triple channel, but why would you need more than 4GB for a gaming box? The 64 bit games just aren't there yet, and you can slap in another 4GB when they are. Slapping in a ton of memory has always been one of my traditions in building pcs, but I don't really see much reason for it right now.

The game may not be 64bit but the OS is, I am sitting here with only Firefox open (with only a single tab) and according to task manager my machine is using 1.62gb of memory.  While the minimalists out there are probably yukking it up about how bloated windows is, I actually love that Windows 7 sees all these "excess" resources and uses them if they are there. 

On a side note after a brief moment of clarity when Intel introduced the core i series of processors, they have managed to once again quickly muddy the waters for me on what I get for the different series.  At launch it seemed the i3 was the next gen core 2 duo, the i5 was the quad core and the i7 was the quad core with hyper-threading.  After recently taking a deeper look I'm either reading things wrong or they have changed things so that the core i5 is now 2 cores instead of 4 making it more of a high end i3.  Am I the only one who feels like they are playing 3 card monty with their cpu branding?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on September 25, 2010, 03:31:18 PM
Just wait until they start selling parts as i3 that are "upgradeable" to i5 via entering a code from Intel.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 25, 2010, 03:41:10 PM
Yes there are faster CPUs but you pay more for them. The point about the i5-760 is the excellent performance you get at the $200 price point. You can pay 50%, 100%, 400% more for 10%, 20%, 30% frame rate improvement.


The i5 750/760 is probably the best bang-for-your-buck CPU out there for high end gaming. The i7 does seem to scale better with high-end SLI systems, but then we're talking megabuck multi-GPU systems where price really is no object (think 2-3 470 or 480GTXs).

Well, the i7 950 is only $299 right now on newegg. Its only like you said, probably 15% faster, but it pushes your whole system to 1366.

As for SLI check the anandtech bench page, it lists all of the cards and you can compare them. Up to this current gen of cards SLI was really only for people with money to burn for epeen machines, but with the 460 cards, SLI is really a good solution for mid-high systems. You can getaround the same performance from 2x460 cards for around $400 as you can from one 480 card that costs $550 to $600. 

The best advice is to go that anandtech bench site and play around with the different cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 25, 2010, 11:50:03 PM
1156/1366? Motherboard type?
Triple channel RAM? um...?
(LGA) 1156 and (LGA) 1366 are socket types. Among other differences socket LGA 1156 CPUs use a dual-channel memory controller while LGA 1366 CPUs use a triple-channel memory controller. The 1156 "platform" is generally a bit cheaper than the socket 1366 platform since the CPUs tend to be cheaper, the chipsets are typically a bit cheaper so the motherboards are cheaper (plus vendors tend to load up their LGA 1366 motherboads), and a dual channel memory setup is cheaper if you are willing to go with 4 GB while with a triple channel you'll want to go to 6 GB rather than 3 GB.

I don't really consider triple-channel memory a reason to get a 1366 setup since non-synthetic benchmarks for normal apps don't really show any noticeable benefits. However the X58 chipset, which is the only desktop chipset that supports LGA 1366 processors, does support dual PCIe x16 slots with a full 32 lanes (i.e. x16/x16). With LGA 1156 motherboards, typically, you don't get a full 32 lanes with dual PCIe x16 slots -- e.g. you might get x16/x8 instead of x16/x16. So if you wanted to get an SLI setup you should consider the 1366 platform.

Edit: fixed quoting


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 26, 2010, 12:33:41 AM
ok so I'll pretty much just be using it for games and work stuff (word processing, etc). I'd like to run things like BF:BC2 and Crysis on high settings, but, you know. Maybe an occasional bit of video editing. As DRM becomes more fucktarded, I'm buying fewer and fewer PC games in favor of console versions, aside from stuff that uses Steamworks.

So now I need to decide whether to go i5 or i7, and likewise whether to go for single or dual GPUs.

For what I'll be using it for:
Will an i7 make a noticable/significant difference?
Will a dual-GPU setup make a noticable/significant difference?


Back to my wife's box for a moment, looks like the mobo is deaded, so I have to rep it or basically bin the whole machine. Since it's an older Mobo (ASUS A7N 8X-E) I'm not confident that Centrecome will have a workable Slot A replacement. So I figure I can probably rebuild it relatively cheaply to be pretty decently upgraded.
It's currently got an ATI 9600/256mb card, and I believe an Athlon 2000 or 2600 in it.

In the $300-400 total range ($500 at a stretch- but completely happy to spend $300 in total), what would be a decent replacement Mobo, CPU and GPU for it? (again, I prefer Intel/NVIDIA)

I'd like to reuse the RAM, if worthwhile. I have 3x RAmos 512 DDR400, CL2.5 sticks.
Then again, if 2 of either of these 1gb sticks are significantly better, it's doable. Or 3 of the $27 one.
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=19058
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=19050

I'm thinking core2 or i3, decent mobo with onboard everything, and cheap and cheerful gpu that can at least handle shader 2.0 and such, and if it can run (say) Borderlands/TF2/L4D/2 and such decently (doesn't have to be at max). Maybe the above RAM, and I'll do the nuts and bolts myself tomorrow afternoon.

Might have to also buy a cheap SATA optical drive, since the mobos are all listed as only having 1x IDE, and I have 2x IDE optical drives and 2x IDE HDDs in there. (we can live with 1 optical drive in there).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 26, 2010, 11:42:10 AM
Almost hate to do this, but it really does "just depend."

If money is an issue (mainly if you want to keep it around $1200 or less), go for an i5 760. If you absolutely must drive a 30" monitor or something like 3x22" monitors (or more), then I'd get an i7. If you're running a lot of multi-threaded apps, then I'd get an i7. After that decision is made, then worry about vid cards.

Again, if you're on the cheap and not trying to drive some outrageous resolution, I'd go with something like a nVidia 470GTX (beginning to see them around $250 now) or an coughAMD5850cough card. The only reason to go SLI is if you're really pushing pixels--like a multi-monitor surround setup or a 30". Then you're looking at SLI, but I can tell you right now that the 460GTX still isn't enough for this in an SLI setup and they can't be triple SLI'd. Not with games like Crysis on the table. Best thing here is to go check Hardocp or the Anandtech bench to see what will float your boat and not bankrupt you.

Lastly, PCI lanes don't really matter much with the present CPUs available. There are some extensive tests over on Hardocp that cover this. The mobo...x55, I think...with 8xPCI lanes and dual 460GTXs will get most any job done, short of the aforementioned 30" or whathaveyou. Fuck Crossfire. Ahem. SLI scales better. Period. End of story.

Short answer: get the cheapest mobo that supports the i5, get an i5 760, then get a 470GTX if you can find one around $250. If not, get the 460GTX. That's a powerful system (and pretty similar to mine), and relatively inexpensive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 26, 2010, 01:04:12 PM
The only reason to go SLI is if you're really pushing pixels--like a multi-monitor surround setup or a 30". Then you're looking at SLI, but I can tell you right now that the 460GTX still isn't enough for this in an SLI setup

I totally dont buy this. Look at these results.

SLI 460 vs single 480 (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/181?vs=158).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 26, 2010, 01:33:04 PM
Most of the current benches have the i7 beating out the i5 at medium and high resolutions. Not by a huge margin but still beating them, also, isnt i5 all 1156? Going 1366 should give you a sligh boost in almost all areas. Also, if you want to overclock, I heard the x58 OCs much better.

You pay a slight performance overhead for HT, and whether you can capitalize on that depends on the parameters of the test.  See here for a test with fairly good parity - the processors are identical, and the i5 tends to outperform the i7 at games despite the "better" socket type (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/109?vs=47&i=2.3.4.5.6.25.26.27.28.29.30.31.32.33.34.35.36.37.38.39.40.41.42.43.44.45.46.47.48.49.50.53.54.55.56.57.58.59.60.61.62.63.64).

It takes some time to switch a thread, regardless of the processor.  HT does it faster under very particular circumstances - if the thread on a core is currently finished execution and the other thread stored in the L1 cache of that core is ready for execution.  If the HT processor needs to access the L2 cache to complete the swap then the HT processor is no faster at switching.  Due to this a HT processor may be faster or at a task overall, depending upon where threads are allocated, how much processing time each respective thread needs, and which threads are dependent upon the output of others.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 26, 2010, 02:05:57 PM
Most of the current benches have the i7 beating out the i5 at medium and high resolutions. Not by a huge margin but still beating them, also, isnt i5 all 1156? Going 1366 should give you a sligh boost in almost all areas. Also, if you want to overclock, I heard the x58 OCs much better.

You pay a slight performance overhead for HT, and whether you can capitalize on that depends on the parameters of the test.  See here for a test with fairly good parity - the processors are identical, and the i5 tends to outperform the i7 at games despite the "better" socket type (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/109?vs=47&i=2.3.4.5.6.25.26.27.28.29.30.31.32.33.34.35.36.37.38.39.40.41.42.43.44.45.46.47.48.49.50.53.54.55.56.57.58.59.60.61.62.63.64).

I agree that there isnt much difference, but I believe thats a bad comparison. I dont even know if you can get the 920 chip any more, and with the price reduction of the 950, I dont see any reason to get any i7 lower than that. /shrug

I think really it comes down to how much you want to spend. I am going to be building a new system soon and I am going to go with the i7 950 and SLI 460s. I got my whole system at around $1150. Thats a good price point for me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 26, 2010, 02:26:09 PM
The only reason to go SLI is if you're really pushing pixels--like a multi-monitor surround setup or a 30". Then you're looking at SLI, but I can tell you right now that the 460GTX still isn't enough for this in an SLI setup

I totally dont buy this. Look at these results.

SLI 460 vs single 480 (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/181?vs=158).

460s in SLI will beat a single 480 by a fairly significant margin, but neither can drive the pixels necessary for resolutions like 2550x1600 and up with max or near max settings in the kind of games I'd be interested in. And if I weren't pushing that level of fill rate, I'd still take a single 480 over the 460 SLI setup just for simplicities sake...assuming you have the power supply for the 480.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on September 26, 2010, 02:48:46 PM
Do people even use that high of a resolution unless they have a giant monitor? I mean, I think my monitor is 21 or 22 inches with a native resolution of 1680x1050 and I've never gone higher than that. Mainly because my computer is 5 years old but I guess I was under the assumption you get the best image quality at native resolution anyways.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 26, 2010, 02:53:24 PM
You do, but the lastest and greatest 30" monitors are 2550x1600. That's a metric shit ton of pixels to drive. When you start talking Eyefinity or NVsuround (or whatever green calls it), then you're up to 5760x1080--or more. That requires truly brobdinagian vid card setups. It looks glorious, too!  :drill:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on September 26, 2010, 03:01:21 PM
That's nuts. I barely have enough desk space for my 22" monitor and speakers. Going SLI just to push 1680x1050 for me would probably be overkill.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 26, 2010, 11:32:44 PM
I think I'll just be getting this monitor to go with it: (and just running the one)

Samsung 27" P2770HD ROSE-BLACK LCD - 5MS / WUXGA 1920x1080 / DTV-TUNER / D-SUB / DVI / HDMI / AV / SPKS
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=45597


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 27, 2010, 01:29:39 AM
ok so I'll pretty much just be using it for games and work stuff (word processing, etc). I'd like to run things like BF:BC2 and Crysis on high settings, but, you know. Maybe an occasional bit of video editing. As DRM becomes more fucktarded, I'm buying fewer and fewer PC games in favor of console versions, aside from stuff that uses Steamworks.

So now I need to decide whether to go i5 or i7, and likewise whether to go for single or dual GPUs.

For what I'll be using it for:
Will an i7 make a noticable/significant difference?
If your video editing package uses a multi-threaded renderer with support for more than 4 threads you might see a benefit from the i7. These days, though, using a package that supports GPU-accelerated rendering makes much more of a difference than HT-support does.

Quote
Back to my wife's box for a moment, looks like the mobo is deaded, so I have to rep it or basically bin the whole machine. Since it's an older Mobo (ASUS A7N 8X-E) I'm not confident that Centrecome will have a workable Slot A replacement. So I figure I can probably rebuild it relatively cheaply to be pretty decently upgraded.
It's currently got an ATI 9600/256mb card, and I believe an Athlon 2000 or 2600 in it.

In the $300-400 total range ($500 at a stretch- but completely happy to spend $300 in total), what would be a decent replacement Mobo, CPU and GPU for it? (again, I prefer Intel/NVIDIA)

I'd like to reuse the RAM, if worthwhile. I have 3x RAmos 512 DDR400, CL2.5 sticks.
Then again, if 2 of either of these 1gb sticks are significantly better, it's doable. Or 3 of the $27 one.
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=19058
http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?sort=2a&products_id=19050

I'm thinking core2 or i3, decent mobo with onboard everything, and cheap and cheerful gpu that can at least handle shader 2.0 and such, and if it can run (say) Borderlands/TF2/L4D/2 and such decently (doesn't have to be at max). Maybe the above RAM, and I'll do the nuts and bolts myself tomorrow afternoon.

Might have to also buy a cheap SATA optical drive, since the mobos are all listed as only having 1x IDE, and I have 2x IDE optical drives and 2x IDE HDDs in there. (we can live with 1 optical drive in there).
At that budget you are better off going with AMD. If you really want to go Intel I would recommend using some of your box's budget for her machine. E.g. go with 4 GB on your box instead of 8 GB (assuming you will go with LGA 1156) and then use the other 4 GB on her machine. It's easy enough to upgrade to 8 GB later if you find 4 GB is not enough.

So an i3 with a cheaper ASUS LGA 1156 motherboard and say a GT240 would be ~$400 + the 4 GB RAM from your budget.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 27, 2010, 03:22:10 AM
OK, based on the above for her rebuild, I have come up with this - how does it look?

2x
Corsair DDR3 2GB PC-10600/1333 Value Select Ram (VS2GB1333D3)
$51.70ea -> $103.40

Intel Core i3-530 / 2.93GHz / 4MB Cache / LGA1156
$126.00

ASUS LGA 1156
Asus P7H55-M Intel Mainboard - 4x DDR3 / 6x Sata / 1x IDE / Gigabit Lan / Onboard VGA/HDMI / LGA 1156
$109.00


Plus one of the following GT240 cards: - Cheapest available of these, I guess, since I don't know the difference between them and they all look much the same (to me.)

ECS NVIDIA GT240, 1GB, 128bit, DDR2, PCIE2.0, HDTV, VGA, DVI-I, SLI, FAN, HDMI
$101.20

Gigabyte NVIDIA N240D3-1GI GT240, 600Mhz, 1GB, 128bit, DDR3, DVI, HDCP, HDMI, PCIE2.0, ATX
$108.00

EVGA NVIDIA GT240 PCIE 2.0, 1GB, DDR3, 128bit, DVI-I, VGA, HDMI (01G-P3-1236-LR)
$112.20

Asus NVIDIA ENGT240-DI-1GD3 GT240, 1GB, DDR3, PCIE2.0, DVI-I, HDCP, HDMI WIN 7
$115.00

Gigabyte NVIDIA N240OC-1GI GT240, 1GB, 128bit, DDR3, DVI, HDCP, HDMI, PCIE2.0, ATX
$125.40


Total is $440-465, which is within budget. This seems cheaper than Trippy's quote above though.

This machine just needs to run Word, WoW, LOTRO, and in theory a few FPS games like L4D and BFBC2, though not at max settings. Budget is effectively seperate from my new machine since we need to get hers up and running ASAP, and my machine will be post-tax-return in a couple weeks, topped off from our pay at the time if needed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 27, 2010, 09:30:17 AM
Do people even use that high of a resolution unless they have a giant monitor?
The monitors we've been getting at the library for the last year and a half have been 21-24" 1080p monitors. It's pretty much the sweet spot right now, a nice convergence of home theater setup and pc monitors.

In my own case, I also have to factor in 1080p doubled for 3D Vision. Hmm...I wonder how SLI interacts with 3D Vision...having a dedicated card to each eye would be awesome. I'll have to do some reading before I can magically in my imagination afford an upgrade (need new walls in the kitchen & den...).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on September 27, 2010, 11:04:41 AM
On a related note, I came home from work yesterday and my video card I presume is borked. Only a few 4x3 resolutions available, 5 large pink/green bars down the display and says no drivers are installed. It even does the nasty bars during start-up. I've tried reinstalling the card, drivers, using DVI or VGA and it still does the same shit. It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the video lag when scrolling or moving windows around.

This sucks but is awesome at the same time. It will take some of the guilt away from spending money on a new computer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 27, 2010, 11:23:05 AM
My rear 12cm outflow fan is dying, the bearings are making a racket. I'm trying to convince my fiancee that the computer is obviously on its last legs and I need to rebuild it!  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on September 27, 2010, 11:50:40 AM
On a related note, I came home from work yesterday and my video card I presume is borked. Only a few 4x3 resolutions available, 5 large pink/green bars down the display and says no drivers are installed. It even does the nasty bars during start-up. I've tried reinstalling the card, drivers, using DVI or VGA and it still does the same shit. It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the video lag when scrolling or moving windows around.

This sucks but is awesome at the same time. It will take some of the guilt away from spending money on a new computer.

A sure sign of a dead card. Sometimes these can be resurrected by "baking" them (and, yeah, it's like it sounds). Often only a temporary solution, but it will postpone the inevitable. There's a large thread over on HardOCP about this very thing.

Also, once you start getting down in the $125 region, there's the new nVidia 450GTX. I believe this card is supposed to sell for about $125 and it's a good deal more capable than the 240. Hmm, quick check on Newegg shows them about $130 to $160. High end is encroaching on the 460, but Newegg isn't the greatest on price anymore. Still, $130 isn't bad and it is a better card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on September 27, 2010, 02:20:38 PM
My rear 12cm outflow fan is dying, the bearings are making a racket. I'm trying to convince my fiancee that the computer is obviously on its last legs and I need to rebuild it!  :why_so_serious:

You mean you don't have at least 4 other 120 mm fans lying about? What kind of a tech nerd are you?!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 27, 2010, 02:32:22 PM
THE COMPUTER IS DYING. NEEDS NEW PARTS. CPU/RAM/MOBO/GPU.

Clearly you can understand this now that I've explained it.

Also, I'm not really a tech nerd. I own more axes than spare 12cm fans.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 27, 2010, 02:58:24 PM
OBL what's your budget post


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 27, 2010, 03:41:01 PM
I could probably scrape $20 together. Cost of upgrade: just under $900 when I last checked.

Let a man have his fantasies. Unless my computer upgrade can be made out of insulation, drywall, lumber and paint.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on September 27, 2010, 04:34:41 PM
It would make for an interesting case mod.  Insulation might be bad though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on September 27, 2010, 05:23:43 PM
It would make for an interesting case mod.  Insulation might be bad though.
Good for the sound dampening, just need to properly plan the airflow. Definitely want to be grounded when working on a box like that though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on September 28, 2010, 08:12:33 AM
It would make for an interesting case mod.  Insulation might be bad though.
Good for the sound dampening, just need to properly plan the airflow. Definitely want to be grounded when working on a box like that though.

Use steel wool for the insulation.  It will transfer heat outward (which makes it less of an insulation and more of a heat sink, I guess) and also baffle the internal noise without the ionization problems of the fiberglass (because it would be grounded via contact with the case).   :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 28, 2010, 10:08:43 AM
Rigid foam Tuff-R insulation. Masonry house that I haven't gotten around to stud-walling. Anyway. Enough of this nonsense. Sorry for the silliness.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on September 28, 2010, 03:55:53 PM
So from the lack of response, I assume the parts I listed above are okay?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on September 28, 2010, 06:09:37 PM
Rigid foam Tuff-R insulation. Masonry house that I haven't gotten around to stud-walling. Anyway. Enough of this nonsense. Sorry for the silliness.

oh - you could put some old refrigerator coils behind the studs and then have a nice heat-sink setup....


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 29, 2010, 02:15:46 AM
I agree that there isnt much difference, but I believe thats a bad comparison. I dont even know if you can get the 920 chip any more, and with the price reduction of the 950, I dont see any reason to get any i7 lower than that. /shrug

It's almost the exact same processor on a different die, clocked to the same speed, with an identical L2 and L3 cache.  It is not physically possible to get a more accurate comparison of what a processor is like before and after HT without drawing the spec yourself.  Your processor of choice compared to the i5 750 (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/109?vs=100&i=2.3.4.5.6.25.26.27.28.29.30.31.32.33.34.35.36.37.38.39.40.41.42.43.44.45.46.47.48.49.50), clocked 400 MHz faster at a cost of $110 is worth +/- three frames per second, the same amount of money would make a person's 4GB of memory into 8GB or buy 2/3 of another 460GTX to SLI with.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on September 29, 2010, 02:44:11 AM
I agree that there isnt much difference, but I believe thats a bad comparison. I dont even know if you can get the 920 chip any more, and with the price reduction of the 950, I dont see any reason to get any i7 lower than that. /shrug

It's almost the exact same processor on a different die, clocked to the same speed, with an identical L2 and L3 cache.  It is not physically possible to get a more accurate comparison of what a processor is like before and after HT without drawing the spec yourself.  Your processor of choice compared to the i5 750 (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/109?vs=100&i=2.3.4.5.6.25.26.27.28.29.30.31.32.33.34.35.36.37.38.39.40.41.42.43.44.45.46.47.48.49.50), clocked 400 MHz faster at a cost of $110 is worth +/- three frames per second, the same amount of money would make a person's 4GB of memory into 8GB or buy 2/3 of another 460GTX to SLI with.
That's not a fair comparison of HT. You are comparing CPUs on different platforms (LGA 1156 vs. LGA 1366) that have different Max Turbo speeds.

If you want to do a real comparison of HT you need to compare the i5 760 and the i7 860. Same platform, same cache, same base speeds, same Max Turbo speeds.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/191?vs=108





Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 29, 2010, 10:07:56 AM
Ooh, I like that bench tool! Trippy continues to deliver the goods.  :Love_Letters:

(Well, anand technically, but celebrate the messenger!)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on September 29, 2010, 10:27:50 AM
Ooh, I like that bench tool! Trippy continues to deliver the goods.  :Love_Letters:

(Well, anand technically, but celebrate the messenger!)

Hi, I only linked it like 3 times in the past 2 pages.   :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 29, 2010, 10:49:36 AM
Who are you again?


Damn newbies.


 :awesome_for_real:


(also: woops)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on September 29, 2010, 05:37:13 PM
No games benches.  Tom's has some (http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/desktop-cpu-charts-2010/Gaming-Left-4-Dead-2,2433.html), results are +/- 2%.  On the plus side, the Anandtech testing seems to indicate that HT no longer threatens to slag your processor like the Netburst implementation (peak power draw is down).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on October 20, 2010, 08:33:09 AM
Just realized that I posted my question in the wrong thread last night... trying this again. 

Quote
Anyone have good experience with pre-built boxes?  My dad needs a new PC and he's a few hours away... I'd build him one, but if anything went wrong and I'm not there then I'd feel crappy.  And I don't feel like tech support over the phone with him.

He'll use it for photo storage, email/internet and gaming.  He's not bleeding edge graphics guy, but plays WoW and Dragon Age.  His current system has both on the lowest settings and is a really terrible experience. 

System specs seem almost similar as I'm looking at them.  I'll get him Win7 and 4+gig memory, but I'm lost on current CPUs and Video Cards, especially in pre-built.  He's got monitor, kyb, mouse... just needs a new box. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on October 20, 2010, 09:35:37 AM
Budget and location?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: hal on October 20, 2010, 09:38:12 AM
I gotta say I know its a build your own thread but just saying. Newegg 590.00 shipped.

Processor:
    AMD Athlon II X2 240(2.8GHz)

Processor Main Features:
    64 bit Dual Core Processor

Cache Per Processor:
    2MB L2 Cache

Memory:
    4GB DDR3 1333

Hard Drive:
    500GB SATA II

Optical Drive 1:
    24X DL DVD+/-RW Drive

Graphics:
    NVIDIA GeForce GT240 1GB

It runs lotrol in dx 10 real smooth. It plays Vampire the masquerade better than any computer I've ever had. That is without moniter. Keyboard mouse and tower. I couldn't figure out how to build cheaper.
1 x ($559.99) DT IBUYPOWER | GAMER POWER 538D3
$559.99


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on October 20, 2010, 09:41:47 AM
Quote
It plays Vampire the masquerade better than any computer I've ever had. That is without moniter.

*snort*


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2010, 09:54:37 AM
I bet it runs WoW great, too!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on October 20, 2010, 09:58:16 AM
Budget and location?

Likely a sub-$750 purchase in America - I'll buy online.  

Mostly just looking for opinions on branding and what CPU/GPUs are halfway decent in pre-builts.  I'd build myself, but that whole "I'm the lifetime tech support" is something I really want to stay away from.  He just needs a stable box that can play WoW and Dragon Age on fair settings.  Though I'd love if he gets a unit that can play WoW on Ultra.  


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on October 20, 2010, 10:03:09 AM
Home purchases aren't as great as office place ones I understand, but Dell while under on-site warranty has always been good for us.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2010, 10:43:51 AM
Dell does use 3rd party techs, though. I showed the last one how to replace the motherboard on a USFF.  :oh_i_see:

We're looking for a notebook. What a total pain in the ass that is turning out to be. Found a decent-sounding Toshiba, but it's Office Depot only, no stores within 100 miles and no refund if you open the box :| A few Asus and Acers sound good, but seeing mixed reviews. Tried to get some hands-on at Best Buy but almost killed the sales staff there, loud, obnoxious and hovery. Probably end up just giving up and getting a Dell Studio 15.

Any feedback or ideas about notebooks welcome, ideally would like to get something that has some longevity for under 700 bucks. (Well, ideally would get a mac, but $1800 for the 15" is  :ye_gods:)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on October 20, 2010, 12:20:40 PM
Dell does use 3rd party techs, though. I showed the last one how to replace the motherboard on a USFF.  :oh_i_see:

We're looking for a notebook. What a total pain in the ass that is turning out to be. Found a decent-sounding Toshiba, but it's Office Depot only, no stores within 100 miles and no refund if you open the box :| A few Asus and Acers sound good, but seeing mixed reviews. Tried to get some hands-on at Best Buy but almost killed the sales staff there, loud, obnoxious and hovery. Probably end up just giving up and getting a Dell Studio 15.

Any feedback or ideas about notebooks welcome, ideally would like to get something that has some longevity for under 700 bucks. (Well, ideally would get a mac, but $1800 for the 15" is  :ye_gods:)
The Dell Outlet has been bombarding me with 20-25% off coupons since school started up.  Their new redesign for searching outlet inventory sucks but after some poking around I found a Studio XPS 1647 with the following stats:

    * Studio XPS 16 - 1647 Laptop
    * Processor: Intel Core i5-430M Processor (2.26GHz, 4Threads, turbo boost up to   2.53Ghz,3M cache)
    * Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium
    * 500 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200RPM) with Free Fall Sensor
    * 4 GB DDR3 SDRAM 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)
    * 8X DVD +/- RW w/dbl layer write capability
    * 1 GB ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4670

$819 bucks and you can whack 20% off that with this coupon code: G33V36FJ4W63CL (expires on the 22nd).

I have a Studio 17 that I purchased through the outlet and am pretty happy with it (even though the graphics card isn't as good as what is in an XPS).  

I did talk a buddy of mine into pretty much the same laptop listed above and it arrived with some loose parts floating around inside (sounded like a fan had come loose), Dell took it back for a full refund but it it still soured him a bit on the whole outlet thing so he went full retail on his repurchase.  After a month on his new machine (once the new car smell faded a bit) he admitted that if he had to do it over he would have given the outlet another go.

edit: did a refresh and same another XPS 1647 came up with a 5730 card and the bluetooth module for $919.  Took me well over an hour to strip my laptop down and install the bluetooth module so my suggestion is get it preinstalled if you want it.  Anyhoo that is the whole fun of the outlet you get to hit f5 40 times in 2 days to get a feel for the inventory then spend another 2 days hitting f5 to refind the specific model you decided on.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on October 20, 2010, 01:03:06 PM
Budget and location?

Likely a sub-$750 purchase in America - I'll buy online.  

Mostly just looking for opinions on branding and what CPU/GPUs are halfway decent in pre-builts.  I'd build myself, but that whole "I'm the lifetime tech support" is something I really want to stay away from.  He just needs a stable box that can play WoW and Dragon Age on fair settings.  Though I'd love if he gets a unit that can play WoW on Ultra.  

If you are willing to go a bit Off-brand and take that assumed risk, TigerDirect has some options. (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/category/category_slc.asp?Recs=10&Nav=|c:114|lp:500:hp:999.99|&Sort=4)

However, you'll perhaps notice that although the processors are fine for 90% of gaming, the video cards are really budget. Skirting the $650 dollar range they're offering 9500 and 240 cards, which really isn't great even for casual gaming. I'd sooner go for Dell's Studio XPS 7100 Desktop, retailing at ~$700.

Another option is getting a desktop that's not meant for gaming and then buying a video card after the fact. The only problem there is that its liable to come with a power supply that may not give enough juice to a card that needs a dedicated PCI-E power connection. Then you're back into fiddly land with your dad, which is what you're trying to avoid.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2010, 02:16:16 PM
Thanks, Salamok. Used that coupon on a non-xps studio 15 refurb (don't need the xps stuff) with an i5-450 for $650. Might have been able to hunt down a better deal, but she wants a simple 15.6" laptop with backlit keys ASAP. She's happy, so I'm happy :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on October 20, 2010, 03:16:48 PM
Thanks, Salamok. Used that coupon on a non-xps studio 15 refurb (don't need the xps stuff) with an i5-450 for $650. Might have been able to hunt down a better deal, but she wants a simple 15.6" laptop with backlit keys ASAP. She's happy, so I'm happy :)

np, glad someone got to use it.  Every three weeks I get one of these emailed to me and it makes me itch to buy something.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on October 20, 2010, 05:26:02 PM
After searching all day, that's pretty much what I came up with, Engels.  Thanks for your time.  Not sure what to do, but I have a sneaking suspicion that I'm building a system soon. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Abagadro on October 20, 2010, 06:44:04 PM
Just realized that I posted my question in the wrong thread last night... trying this again.  

Quote
Anyone have good experience with pre-built boxes?  My dad needs a new PC and he's a few hours away... I'd build him one, but if anything went wrong and I'm not there then I'd feel crappy.  And I don't feel like tech support over the phone with him.

He'll use it for photo storage, email/internet and gaming.  He's not bleeding edge graphics guy, but plays WoW and Dragon Age.  His current system has both on the lowest settings and is a really terrible experience.  

System specs seem almost similar as I'm looking at them.  I'll get him Win7 and 4+gig memory, but I'm lost on current CPUs and Video Cards, especially in pre-built.  He's got monitor, kyb, mouse... just needs a new box.  

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I just bought an ibuypower box off of amazon (it had it the same price as newegg).  Only had it a week but like it so far. Got the i5/8GB RAM/1 TB/GTX460 version for a grand. Probably paid a few hundred over self-built but had it less than 24 hours after I purchased and its works great (disclaimer: only had it for a week).


EDIT: Just read your later post and this is likely more machine than you need.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 21, 2010, 09:06:44 AM
I just bought an ibuypower box off of amazon (it had it the same price as newegg).
Remember, newegg = no tax. Shipping can be a mixed bag, though it's much faster with newegg (generally next business day).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Abagadro on October 21, 2010, 10:51:10 AM
No tax on amazon either, at least for me there isn't.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 21, 2010, 11:10:19 AM
Interesting. The egg began charging tax in NYS, but the backlash was so severe they stopped. There's some forumla you have to work out on your income tax for internet purchases, but there's also a flat fee you can pay.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Koyasha on October 23, 2010, 01:06:41 PM
So, since I was talking about mice a few pages back I thought I'd mention I finally replaced my MX Revolution with the Logitech Wireless Gaming Mouse G700, and I figured I'd give a few comments incase anyone else was interested in the mouse discussion.

The mouse is pretty nice, shaped like the Revolution so it's quite comfortable to me.  The number of mouse buttons are nice, and the four thumb buttons are easier to get used to than I thought - I very quickly picked up on them.  Technically four thumb buttons is one less than the MX Revolution - the Revolution's thumb-wheel was essentially three buttons, forward, back, and click, along with the standard two thumb buttons.  The G700 makes up for that with the oddly positioned three buttons next to my index finger though, so it has two more buttons total than the Revolution.  Those are, as I expected, somewhat awkward to press.  I may get used to them with more time, but I expect they'll always be a little odd to press.

The only big complaint I have, coming from the MX Revolution, is that my favorite feature of the Revolution is now kind of gimped.  One of the main reasons I chose the G700 was the freespin scroll wheel like the Revolution.  It has this, yes, but switching between freespin and click mode is now manual.  One of the two buttons just below the mouse wheel is a manual locking mechanism that locks and unlocks the scroll wheel.  There is no other way to switch modes, and what hurts the most is that it doesn't switch modes automatically.  For anyone unfamiliar with the MX Revolution, once you spin the wheel more than a few clicks, it automatically releases and goes into freespin mode if it's set that way, then automatically re-locks into click to click mode when the spinning slows down.  For the G700 to require a manual button press to lock and unlock makes it very inconvenient to use this feature.

Overall, thumbs up on the mouse, but big frowny-face at the manual-only wheel mechanism.  Why they would take a step back after giving us the perfect mousewheel with the MX Revolution I don't understand.  I'm definitely going to write to them to express my opinion that the Revolution wheel was better and if they made a version of the G700 with an automatic switching wheel, it might be the last mouse I ever need.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 02, 2010, 09:50:17 AM
How viable is it to buy a new computer in parts over the next 4-5 months and it not be obsolete by the time I get it up and running?

I don't necessarily need a new computer right now, but my current box is starting to make some noises and I'd like to be prepared this time.

Also, suggestions on parts? Budget is ~$800-900 and I'd like SSD.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on November 02, 2010, 10:22:30 AM
Considering my current system is about two years old and plays everything fine, it's viable.

However, you're better off setting aside the money you would spend each month, and not purchasing anything until either there is a great sale on a useful piece, and/or you're ready to buy everything.  That means your warranties are closer to boot date, and prices may have dropped enough to save you a hundred or two given you're anticipating almost half a year of gathering.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 02, 2010, 10:43:42 AM
Listen to Lantyssa, she speaks words of wisdom. Or types them, really.

Another angle to the warranty thing is that if you wait that long, you won't even be plugging some parts in until some warranty (or at least rma) windows have closed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Severian on November 02, 2010, 12:50:14 PM
not purchasing anything until either there is a great sale on a useful piece...

Keep an eye on the upcoming Black Friday.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 03, 2010, 09:51:30 AM
also Intel is expected in the 4th quarter 2010 or 1st quarter 2011 to double the sizes on it's current line of SSD's w/o doubling the prices.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on November 03, 2010, 01:53:17 PM
My speakers have given out.  Rest In Peace: 1998-2010

Recommendations?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 03, 2010, 07:02:33 PM
also Intel is expected in the 4th quarter 2010 or 1st quarter 2011 to double the sizes on it's current line of SSD's w/o doubling the prices.

Yeah, I've been waiting for that  before purchasing one. That's on the top of my list because my current HDD isn't sounding too good.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on November 03, 2010, 07:29:50 PM
My speakers have given out.  Rest In Peace: 1998-2010

Recommendations?

Whatever unused once you can find lying around the office?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on November 03, 2010, 07:57:12 PM
My speakers have given out.  Rest In Peace: 1998-2010

Recommendations?

If you are just looking for stereo speakers that have great sound quality, I am really happy with these:

http://www.alesis.com/m1active320usb

I got them for like 85 bucks at Guitar Center last year.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 04, 2010, 12:24:04 AM
My speakers have given out.  Rest In Peace: 1998-2010

Recommendations?

If you are just looking for stereo speakers that have great sound quality, I am really happy with these:

http://www.alesis.com/m1active320usb

I got them for like 85 bucks at Guitar Center last year.
I use lower-end studio monitors (non-USB) as well and really like them:

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/StudiophileAV40.html

Mine are sitting on speaker stands behind my desk to get them up to the proper height. Positioning of "near-field" speakers is very important -- you basically have to point them straight at your ears to get the best sound. Also if you like booming bass studio monitors are not for you.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on November 04, 2010, 08:52:23 AM
Whatever unused once you can find lying around the office?

I don't seem to work in that sort of place.

The family does not appreciate bass.  I will look around some more.  Thanks for the suggestions.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 04, 2010, 08:52:41 AM
I would not recommend monitors unless you know what you're getting into. Consumer ears are not trained for them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 04, 2010, 12:12:05 PM
I don't seem to work in that sort of place.

The family does not appreciate bass.  I will look around some more.  Thanks for the suggestions.
http://www.trittonusa.com/ (http://www.trittonusa.com/)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: El Gallo on November 05, 2010, 05:14:09 PM
Slightly offtopic, but I'm looking for a laptop that I can play games and watch movies on, in addition to the usual word/excel/surfing shit. Would really rather not go over $1800 or so (I'm an underpaid civil servant now). Of course, I'd be happy to go lower. Anandtech fellated the ASUS G73Jh pretty hard 6 months ago http://www.anandtech.com/show/3795/mobile-buyers-guide-notebooks-dtrs/6 and still seems to like it and its successor, the G73Jw, which seems to be basically the same system with better battery life http://www.anandtech.com/show/3998/asus-g73jw-geforce-gtx-460m/5

Any reason not to get one of those?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 05, 2010, 10:12:56 PM
Do you plan on carrying this thing around? For a movie watching laptop I like that it's 1080p and has Blu-ray but it's pretty heavy.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 06, 2010, 09:43:53 AM
Ya, a version of an addage applies to laptops

-Plays Games
-Light
-Cheap

Pick two.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 06, 2010, 10:22:08 PM
Alienware M17x R2 at you guessed it the Dell Outlet (http://www.dell.com/us/en/dfh/notebooks/xpsnb_gaming/ct.aspx?refid=xpsnb_gaming&s=dfh&cs=22), 20% off coupon:  Z?6517S913?Z2G


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on November 08, 2010, 11:04:33 AM
My speakers have given out.  Rest In Peace: 1998-2010

Recommendations?

Mixamp and headphones. Audiotechnica or Beyer. That's if you don't have a sound card with an amp. The high impedpence Beyers are particularly glorious if you've got a beefy amp. I prefer open cans, so tend to Audiotechnica.

Also, the Corsair HS-1 might be worth a look. Not music cans, but supposedly very good with movies and games. Built-in sounds card (USB headphones).

I"m not much on desktop speakers. I'm still running an ancient gaggle of Logitech 550s. Hardly ever use them. I have a set of Klipsch 2.1s, but they've seen maybe 10 minutes of use in three years on the secondary box.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 15, 2010, 12:30:56 PM
Well, I got the thumbs up for a computer build.  I'm going to do it myself this time since I just about threw my Dell out the window anytime I had to do an upgrade.

Budget I figure is about $1000-1200.  I'd like to keep it to around $1k unless I can get some really good deals for Win 7 and Office Home and Student (run about $220). 

I haven't done this in a while, so it's all a bit overwhelming.

All I'm really set so far on is the i5 760.

The rest I have some questions on.

GPU:  Should I get a 460 or one of the new ATI 6850 cards?  I may SLI/CF down the line later when I need to extend the life of the machine.
RAM:  I'd like to get above 4, but I can be talked out of it.  I know a game will only see 4, but you're running a OS as well.  I guess 3 sticks of 2GB isn't optimal for an i5.  8GB (2x4GB) absolute overkill?
PSU:  How big do I need to go here?  I can always upgrade later if I SLI, but having that option just there wouldn't be bad.
Case: Antec 300 decent enough?

Anyone recommend a motherboard or CPU cooler they're particularly fond of or would be good for this setup? 

Do not need:
HDD - I have a 1TB WD in there. Good enough, right?
Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers

This is all pretty much for gaming.  I want mainly something fast and under budget, hopefully without any sort of possible heat or durability issues.  I don't really plan on overclocking.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 15, 2010, 12:38:09 PM
Well, I got the thumbs up for a computer build.  I'm going to do it myself this time since I just about threw my Dell out the window anytime I had to do an upgrade.

Budget I figure is about $1000-1200.  I'd like to keep it to around $1k unless I can get some really good deals for Win 7 and Office Home and Student (run about $220). 

I haven't done this in a while, so it's all a bit overwhelming.

All I'm really set so far on is the i5 760.

The rest I have some questions on.

GPU:  Should I get a 460 or one of the new ATI 6850 cards?  I may SLI/CF down the line later when I need to extend the life of the machine.
RAM:  I'd like to get above 4, but I can be talked out of it.  I know a game will only see 4, but you're running a OS as well.  I guess 3 sticks of 2GB isn't optimal for an i5.  8GB (2x4GB) absolute overkill?
PSU:  How big do I need to go here?  I can always upgrade later if I SLI, but having that option just there wouldn't be bad.
Case: Antec 300 decent enough?

Anyone recommend a motherboard or CPU cooler they're particularly fond of or would be good for this setup? 

Do not need:
HDD - I have a 1TB WD in there. Good enough, right?
Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse, Speakers

This is all pretty much for gaming.  I want mainly something fast and under budget, hopefully without any sort of possible heat or durability issues.  I don't really plan on overclocking.


The Antec 300 is a good case, though with any of the current gen graphics cards, it does tend to get a bit cramped. I would consider finding a case that's got a bit more space to it (front to back).

I'll leave GPU/RAM to Trippy or someone else more on the up with those performance wise, but I can't see a reason why you shouldn't go for 8GB.

As for your HDD, you should consider the option of getting one of the new Intel SSDs once they hit the shelves, which I think should be sometime between now and Christmas. Use it just for your OS or OS + Games. The speed difference is noticeable and with the Intels not increasing in price, it's not really a bad idea.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on November 15, 2010, 12:39:34 PM
RAM:  I'd like to get above 4, but I can be talked out of it.  I know a game will only see 4, but you're running a OS as well.  I guess 3 sticks of 2GB isn't optimal for an i5.  8GB (2x4GB) absolute overkill?

I've had 8GB for two years now. RAM is inexpensive. There's no reason not to future-proof by getting as much as you can afford.

Quote
PSU:  How big do I need to go here?

I used this site (http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp) to calculate how much you need to run the parts you select. Then add 100 or so watts to future-proof; PSUs wear down over time.

Quote
Case: Antec 300 decent enough?

I'll always recommend a Lian Li. Beautiful, well-ventilated, and designed for easy access.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on November 15, 2010, 01:57:35 PM
Just remember you need 64 bit Windows with all that RAM.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on November 15, 2010, 02:26:34 PM
I put a Coolermaster V8 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103055&cm_re=v8-_-35-103-055-_-Product) cooler on my I5 760 when I built it last month. It might be a little beefy for your needs but I :heart: it. I've had it on the slowest speed and it's literally whisper quiet. My CPU temp is 27 at idle and 34 under load.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 15, 2010, 03:08:33 PM
Just remember you need 64 bit Windows with all that RAM.

Yep.  I know at least that much.

RAM:  I'd like to get above 4, but I can be talked out of it.  I know a game will only see 4, but you're running a OS as well.  I guess 3 sticks of 2GB isn't optimal for an i5.  8GB (2x4GB) absolute overkill?

I've had 8GB for two years now. RAM is inexpensive. There's no reason not to future-proof by getting as much as you can afford.

Quote
PSU:  How big do I need to go here?

I used this site (http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp) to calculate how much you need to run the parts you select. Then add 100 or so watts to future-proof; PSUs wear down over time.

Quote
Case: Antec 300 decent enough?

I'll always recommend a Lian Li. Beautiful, well-ventilated, and designed for easy access.

Good point on the RAM.  Looking at this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314) for 2x4GB.

Based on that site, a 650 or 750 would be fine for SLIing down the road (giving enough cushion to play it safe).  I do have a 550W Corsair in my box right now, but it's over 3 years old.

Lian Li cases, in the price range I'm looking at, have a lot of mesh.  I have cats.  I'm not sure how well that'd work out.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 15, 2010, 03:47:48 PM
Good point on the RAM.  Looking at this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314) for 2x4GB.

Based on that site, a 650 or 750 would be fine for SLIing down the road (giving enough cushion to play it safe).  I do have a 550W Corsair in my box right now, but it's over 3 years old.

Lian Li cases, in the price range I'm looking at, have a lot of mesh.  I have cats.  I'm not sure how well that'd work out.

Try and find a store showing off the case and see if the mesh is metal or fabric. The Antec 300 has a lot of metal/plastic mesh on it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 15, 2010, 08:15:29 PM
So, this PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341018) pretty decent? 50 bucks off today.  I'm hesitant to stray from Corsair.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 15, 2010, 10:16:45 PM
newegg has full oem versions of w7 home for $95 on today's (11/15) black November deals.  Had this coolermaster case (http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=5843) for about a year now and I still love it (did need to throw a Zalman in to keep the cpu cool enough though). 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 15, 2010, 11:54:41 PM
newegg has full oem versions of w7 home for $95 on today's (11/15) black November deals.  Had this coolermaster case (http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=5843) for about a year now and I still love it (did need to throw a Zalman in to keep the cpu cool enough though). 
lot of duds in the reviews. of course, that's not a scientific assessment, but its still a bit surprising.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 16, 2010, 12:13:52 AM
newegg has full oem versions of w7 home for $95 on today's (11/15) black November deals.  Had this coolermaster case (http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=5843) for about a year now and I still love it (did need to throw a Zalman in to keep the cpu cool enough though). 
lot of duds in the reviews. of course, that's not a scientific assessment, but its still a bit surprising.

That seems to be the case with any item under 5 "egg" feedback. Heh, even for some with.  Only thing that doesn't make me flinch is people bitching about stock heatsinks/fans on the CPU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 12:56:35 AM
So, this PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341018) pretty decent? 50 bucks off today.  I'm hesitant to stray from Corsair.

I like this one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207007) at just $10 more after rebate.  52A on a single 12v rail and 650W total output.

If you haven't already purchased the motherboard or Windows 7, check out this combo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.552603).  Gigabyte GA-P55-USB3 + W7 Home Premium 64-bit for $195.

As for the CPU cooler, I think the Hyper 212 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) is generally the go-to bang for the buck choice still, though I went with the Cooler Master V6 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103088) (with an extra fan) for my most recent build.  The V6 is frickin huge though:



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cigh on November 16, 2010, 09:13:07 AM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.549129
 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.549129)
Thats a good combo and alot more horsepower than you have configured now.  Pick your video card and you have a very nice system.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 16, 2010, 09:39:12 AM
[As for the CPU cooler, I think the Hyper 212 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) is generally the go-to bang for the buck choice still, though I went with the Cooler Master V6 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103088) (with an extra fan) for my most recent build.  The V6 is frickin huge though:


WTF is that thing? It's enormous. How loud is it?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 09:54:52 AM
WTF is that thing? It's enormous. How loud is it?

That's the Cooler Master V6 installed in my PC.  Cools like a champ, but it's a 6.5" cube that weighs something like 2+ pounds and may have clearance issues in a case without 'blown out' sides - it's super overkill for anything but heavy overclocking - probably even moreso than the V8 than MuffinMan recommended.

At 100%, the cooler's fans are somewhat audible, but the fans are running at half speed most of the time, so all you hear is air moving through the case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 16, 2010, 10:11:55 AM
Damn, that's crazy.

Any suggestions for an aftermarket cooler for an ATI 4XXX HD card? The amount of fan speed increase on simple tasks is crazy. Any HD video instantly causes an audible sound increase on the card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 10:19:24 AM
Damn, that's crazy.

Any suggestions for an aftermarket cooler for an ATI 4XXX HD card? The amount of fan speed increase on simple tasks is crazy. Any HD video instantly causes an audible sound increase on the card.

I used the Scythe Musashi (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185081) on the HD4850 installed in my last machine because I didn't realize the stock cooler on the card wasn't speed-controlled and was set at 100% all the time until it was too late.  It's pretty big and a bit spendy but it runs quietly.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 16, 2010, 10:52:35 AM
Intel Core i5-760 Lynnfield 2.8GHz 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80605I5760 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067)

+

MSI P55-GD65 USB3 LGA 1156 Intel P55 USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130272)

for $323 before a $40 mail in (and yes, I do mail them in).

Not a lot of feedback on that MB.  Hrrmmm.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 10:58:17 AM
Intel Core i5-760 Lynnfield 2.8GHz 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80605I5760 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067)

+

MSI P55-GD65 USB3 LGA 1156 Intel P55 USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130272)

for $323 before a $40 mail in (and yes, I do mail them in).

Not a lot of feedback on that MB.  Hrrmmm.

I'm using the older (pre-USB 3) version of that board currently and like it quite a lot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 16, 2010, 11:52:41 AM
I used the Scythe Musashi (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185081) on the HD4850 installed in my last machine because I didn't realize the stock cooler on the card wasn't speed-controlled and was set at 100% all the time until it was too late.  It's pretty big and a bit spendy but it runs quietly.

What brand was yours? I think mine is Built by ATI and the fan is speed-controlled. 4850 too. Did you find the card sped up a lot with the new fan? I'm really trying to find a way around it making lots of sound during small tasks. Don't care so much when it goes nuts during gaming. I expect that running games at 1080.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 12:25:23 PM
What brand was yours? I think mine is Built by ATI and the fan is speed-controlled. 4850 too. Did you find the card sped up a lot with the new fan? I'm really trying to find a way around it making lots of sound during small tasks. Don't care so much when it goes nuts during gaming. I expect that running games at 1080.

The card was an overclocked Gigabyte with a Zalman cooler installed by the manufacturer.  The Musashi has speed controls for both fans mounted on a PCI slot cover, but it was pretty quiet to my ears even running at full blast.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on November 16, 2010, 12:27:22 PM
So, this PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341018) pretty decent? 50 bucks off today.  I'm hesitant to stray from Corsair.

Holy shit! Run from that thing screaming. OCZ isn't worth two hoots in hell for PSUs. They're budget level, rebranded junk. Trust me, I know from personal experience. I had a 600watt OCZ fail and take most of the guts in my old C2D box with it (only the vid card survived).

Stay with Seasonic or Corsair (rebranded Seasonic). Can't go wrong there. The AX series PSUs are pricey, but truly outstanding units.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on November 16, 2010, 12:36:14 PM
The card was an overclocked Gigabyte with a Zalman cooler installed by the manufacturer.  The Musashi has speed controls for both fans mounted on a PCI slot cover, but it was pretty quiet to my ears even running at full blast.

Awesome, thanks! I've been having a hard time finding a cooler in local stores, so this helps a lot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 16, 2010, 01:06:04 PM
Holy shit! Run from that thing screaming. OCZ isn't worth two hoots in hell for PSUs. They're budget level, rebranded junk. Trust me, I know from personal experience. I had a 600watt OCZ fail and take most of the guts in my old C2D box with it (only the vid card survived).

Stay with Seasonic or Corsair (rebranded Seasonic). Can't go wrong there. The AX series PSUs are pricey, but truly outstanding units.

I'm fairly certain that XFX's PSUs are also rebranded Seasonic units as well.

Awesome, thanks! I've been having a hard time finding a cooler in local stores, so this helps a lot.

If you pick the Musashi up, installation is pretty fiddly due to the size of the parts involved.  I had to lay the cooler fan-side down on a table after installing the threaded pins and then place the card on top of it.  It will 'wobble' a bit even if the thumbscrews are threaded to the stops - the backplate has some flex in it - but should still be making good contact on the GPU die.  Also, the reviews aren't kidding about the included VRAM heatsinks being attached with pretty cheesy thermal tape, so clean everything with alcohol and give the glue in the tape time to 'set' before trying to install it or you'll be picking them up off the floor of your case in short order.  SPCR found that you can also just mount the Musashi on top of some of the stock ATI cooling plates, which would let you skip the RAM heatsinks altogether.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 16, 2010, 11:59:28 PM
GPU:  Should I get a 460 or one of the new ATI 6850 cards?  I may SLI/CF down the line later when I need to extend the life of the machine.
The performance seems pretty comparable. Personally I'd go with NVIDIA but that's cause I like the drivers better.

Quote
Anyone recommend a motherboard or CPU cooler they're particularly fond of or would be good for this setup? 
Since you going with an LGA 1156 motherboard and you want to leave the option of SLI/Crossfire open I would suggest you take a look at boards with the NF200 chipset on it. This will give you extra PCI-e lanes so you can get a full x16/x16 in SLI mode/Crossfire mode. The P55 chipset by itself does not support enough PCI-e lanes to do that. However boards with the NF200 are typically designed for quad-SLI/Crossfire and they often give up other features to support that.

E.g. this board without the NF200 has USB 3.0 and SATA 6 Gb/s support but only supports x8/x8 in SLI/Crossfire mode (I own this one):

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131621

This board in contrast doesn't support USB 3.0 or SATA 6 Gb/s but can do x16/x16/x8/x8 thanks to the NF200:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131594


For heat sink I have this one on my LGA 1156 motherboard:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608014&Tpk=Noctua%20NH-U12P

This heatsink screws down (though it's somewhat fiddly) which I strongly prefer over clips that you have to bend or use push pins. One drawback is that the fan closer to the front of the case, if you install it, may block other components. E.g. on my motherboard I can't fit memory with tall "fins" in the memory slots closest to the CPU with that fan installed.


Stay with Seasonic or Corsair (rebranded Seasonic). Can't go wrong there. The AX series PSUs are pricey, but truly outstanding units.
Not all Corsair are made by Seasonic. You need to Google which series are made by whom. The AXs do happen to be made by Seasonic and are based on their X series.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on November 17, 2010, 08:33:41 AM
To emphasize what Trippy said, If you get a tower cooler, make sure you get a bracket or it comes with one.  Push pins suck for normal fans.  They're absolutely terrible for tower coolers and will pop off at some point due to their weight.  Once they start doing that, they'll get worse about it, and you'll end up having to pull your system apart to install the bracket anyways.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 17, 2010, 11:13:05 AM
I just got an evga 460 gtx with an external exhaust. It really keeps the case very cool, but it's loud as fuck. Not sure I'd go that way again, though the card is decent enough. Then again, I really need to look at liquid cooling because in the winter it gets so damned hot in my living room it's like having a hair dryer. The internal fan on my old 8800gtx was also larger and quieter, I think they cheaped on the actual fan part.

Anyway, 2¢. Performance-wise, I'm happy with it as a mid-range card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on November 17, 2010, 11:56:26 AM
Just wanted to throw this out there for anyone thinking about building a new system any time soon.

Microcenter has the i7 950 on sale for $199 right now. Everywhere else its pushing around $295. So this is a fantastic deal. I also found out that Microcenter will price match Newegg.

I picked up the i7 950 and also a Corsair hx850w modular PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on November 17, 2010, 12:13:52 PM
Anandtech just put up a preview of Asus' newest mobos aimed at Intel's new Sandybridge CPU. This stuff looks really hot. Sandybridge isn't expected to drop until Febuary, but if you can wait this stuff is looking really good.

AMD still has a few things in the offing that might be worth postponing a build. The 6900 series vid cards and especially Bulldozer will be very significant players in the computer arms race this next year.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 17, 2010, 01:46:05 PM
Up until 2 years ago I was probably more loyal to the ASUS brand than any other maker of PC components for a period spanning over a decade.  The last 2 ASUS mobos I have purchased have sucked donkey balls, the new gigabyte board I replaced them with was cheaper, easier to manage and more feature ladden for less money and I have had no issues with it whatsoever.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 17, 2010, 04:07:57 PM
I too was am a Gigabyte convert from Asus. Nothing particularly wrong with Asus, but I found Gigabyte simpler and the last 3 boards have been steady.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 18, 2010, 11:36:22 AM
My ASUS board is almost four years old now, so I'm not sure who I'm loyal to :P

I was thinking of a cheap cpu bump for games that are cpu-bound with the 460gtx, why the hell is the Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 $330? It's ancient in cpu terms, ffs, and as Morf points out you can get a galdern i7 for less. For an extra hundred bucks I could get an i5 750, mobo and 4GB of ram, ffs.

I'd really love to get the cpu/mobo/ram upgrade and slap in a second 460. In my dream world where I have money to do so.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on November 18, 2010, 12:24:16 PM
You can put me in the Gigabyte camp as well. My last 3 machines had Asus mobos, but this one has a Gigabyte and I couldn't be more pleased with it.

What goes in my Sandybridge (or possibly Bulldozer) box still remains to be seen, but Gigabyte will definately be a player when I comes time to drop the cash. Not planning on doing anything before mid-summer of '11, but definatly building something around the July/Aug time frame.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 18, 2010, 01:45:17 PM


I was thinking of a cheap cpu bump for games that are cpu-bound with the 460gtx, why the hell is the Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 $330?

Its expensive for precisely the reason you're still considering it; its the end of your socket type upgrade path and they know that consumers would sooner replace a CPU than the whole board. Its always been so, a little less with AMDs.

I would go ahead, bite the bullet and do a full upgrade (recommend a i5 760 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067)); Trippy or someone else can correct me, but with a C2Q on an ole P35(?) chipset, you will not be using the full PCI capacity of your new video card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 18, 2010, 02:22:31 PM
Plus by upgrading the MB you can get SATA III and take advantage of all the buttkicking for goodness ssd tech about to roll down the pipe!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 18, 2010, 03:34:43 PM
If I were going to upgrade, it wouldn't be by dumping money into this old wreck :) I just had a list on newegg and happened to look after Morf posted that bit about cpus.

I did grab the 460 gtx because it would port to a new system and get a speed bump, plus it would rock SLI and for the first time I think I'd prefer SLI.

That said, since there's no money it's just the fantasies of a graphics whore with a four year old jalopy.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on November 18, 2010, 10:57:30 PM
There's a deal floating around--Newegg I think--on 470GTXs for $199. The 470 is the new sweet spot. The only downside is you need a pretty substantial PSU for an SLI setup.

Personally, I still regard SLI as a hassle. It's not always a smooth walk in the park. Single GPU if I can manage it. The only fly in the ointment is 2560x1600 resolutions. Even the 580GTX is only just getting it done at this resolution in DX11. At 1920x1200, though, I'd avoid SLI if at all possible.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 19, 2010, 01:10:04 AM
There's a deal floating around--Newegg I think--on 470GTXs for $199.

This card  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127501)get down to $200 with the combination of the 10% off and mail in rebate.  There's 10% off on a couple of cards and others have around $35 off in mail ins.. but none except this one with both.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on November 20, 2010, 05:04:05 AM
GPU:  Should I get a 460 or one of the new ATI 6850 cards?  I may SLI/CF down the line later when I need to extend the life of the machine.
The performance seems pretty comparable. Personally I'd go with NVIDIA but that's cause I like the drivers better.

...

This heatsink screws down (though it's somewhat fiddly) which I strongly prefer over clips that you have to bend or use push pins. One drawback is that the fan closer to the front of the case, if you install it, may block other components. E.g. on my motherboard I can't fit memory with tall "fins" in the memory slots closest to the CPU with that fan installed.

The 460 is a pretty slick card, upgrading from a X1900 GT. ( :why_so_serious: )

The driver configuration on a NVIDEA card is faster to launch, but they still manage to completely ignore the fact that you have no fucking way to decipher what the fuck 32x vs. 16xq AA is.  I have no clue if modern ATi cards do that, but whoever chairs NVIDEA should be forced to suck off a corpse for that, because it's the most utterly bullshit thing to obfuscate ever.  Very often you're trading one annoyance for another.

Also, whoever designed the Intel push-thing gadgets on heat sinks deserves a bullet in the cerebellum, rendering their state of mental retardation permanent.  If you want an aftermarket heatsink, get something with fucking screws on it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 20, 2010, 11:19:42 AM
GPU:  Should I get a 460 or one of the new ATI 6850 cards?  I may SLI/CF down the line later when I need to extend the life of the machine.
The performance seems pretty comparable. Personally I'd go with NVIDIA but that's cause I like the drivers better.

...

This heatsink screws down (though it's somewhat fiddly) which I strongly prefer over clips that you have to bend or use push pins. One drawback is that the fan closer to the front of the case, if you install it, may block other components. E.g. on my motherboard I can't fit memory with tall "fins" in the memory slots closest to the CPU with that fan installed.

The 460 is a pretty slick card, upgrading from a X1900 GT. ( :why_so_serious: )

The driver configuration on a NVIDEA card is faster to launch, but they still manage to completely ignore the fact that you have no fucking way to decipher what the fuck 32x vs. 16xq AA is.  I have no clue if modern ATi cards do that, but whoever chairs NVIDEA should be forced to suck off a corpse for that, because it's the most utterly bullshit thing to obfuscate ever.  Very often you're trading one annoyance for another.


Do you not know what AA is, or just the specific setting? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spatial_anti-aliasing


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on November 20, 2010, 03:54:39 PM
The specific setting.  I should not have to Google what exactly 16xQ AA is, when there's a tooltip right at the bottom of the screen that could tell me but doesn't.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on November 22, 2010, 05:51:42 PM
Hey guys, I am currently building my new system, and I am kind of stumped on which mobo to get.

Here is what I posted on hardforum about it.

Quote

I was wondering if anyone could give some advice on a mobo for a new build. I was planning on waiting till Cyber Monday, but I picked up a i7 950 at Microcenter and now I really want to do my build.

I already have the i7 950, Corsair hx850w PSU, and an EVGA 460 gtx card. I am planning on grabbing another 460 to SLI.

I am also planning on doing some light overclocking on this build, which I have never done before. OC that is, I have built plenty of systems before.

I am really having problems deciding on a mobo and cpu cooler and case.

Newegg motherboard compare (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Productcompare.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=40000280&IsNodeId=1&Description=evga%20x58&bop=And&CompareItemList=280|13-188-065^13-188-065-TS,13-188-068^13-188-068-TS,13-131-665^13-131-665-TS). These are the 3 boards I have been looking at. The last build I did for a friend used the FTW3, and I liked that board, I am also a big fan of EVGA stuff. I dont really see much difference in the 2 EVGA boards. I asked on the EVGA forums, and was told:



Will the second PCI-e slot running at x8 make that much of a difference?

As for the Sabertooth, it seems like a great board, but I really dont like the camo colors (not that it really matters) and I heard its a decent bit more complicated to OC that the EVGA boards.

Any info would be great.

Also, if someone would like to post in the HOT DEALS forum, you can get the Sabertooth at Frys right now for $159 (after $20 MIR).  Sabertooth at Frys (http://www.frys.com/product/6396141?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG). I cant post it as I dont have 50 posts yet.

So basically, between the 2 EVGA boards, and the Asus. I know I shouldn't but I really like the look of the EVGA. I like the sabertooth look also, but it doesnt match any of the current components. I know its a small thing, but it does matter a little. More to the point is that I do want to OC this build a little and I heard that the EVGA OC software and BIOS are really good for beginners.

Some one posted on Newegg that the EVGA board doesnt have "true" SATA 6 and USB 3, but didnt elaborate and I have no idea what that means.

Also, any case recommendations would be awesome too. I like the Antec 900-2, but I hate its hard drive enclosures and lack of cable management. I had my heart set on the Corsair 600t, it has most of the features I wanted. Bottom air intake for the PSU, filters on the front fan, nice cable management and easy access to hard drive bays. But it turned out to be to wide to fit in the computer holder under my desk.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 22, 2010, 07:04:18 PM
Some one posted on Newegg that the EVGA board doesnt have "true" SATA 6 and USB 3, but didnt elaborate and I have no idea what that means.
Since none of the Intel chipsets have native support for SATA 6 Gb/s or USB 3.0, motherboards that want to add support for these have to add additional controller chips which need to get integrated using the existing I/O channels on the board which for desktop motherboards would be PCIe. A single PCIe 2.0 lane (x1) supports up to 5 Gb/s bandwidth. The highest speed for USB 3.0 is 4 Gb/s (5 Gb/s is the theoretical max but 4 is the actual limit). So to fully support, say, 2 USB 3.0 ports and 2 SATA 6 Gb/s ports you would need at least 20 Gb/s of PCIe bandwidth or 4 lanes of PCIe (x4) dedicated (not shared with other devices) for those controllers. The boards without "true" support dedicate fewer lanes so you won't be able to achieve max bandwidth on some number of multiple simultaneous devices.

BTW the motherboard specs on the EVGA site are almost useless.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 22, 2010, 07:15:04 PM
Will the second PCI-e slot running at x8 make that much of a difference?
If you mean x16/x8 vs. x16/x16, according to HardOCP the answer would be no:

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2010/08/16/sli_cfx_pcie_bandwidth_perf_x16x16_vs_x16x8/2


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on November 22, 2010, 10:03:34 PM
Some one posted on Newegg that the EVGA board doesnt have "true" SATA 6 and USB 3, but didnt elaborate and I have no idea what that means.
Since none of the Intel chipsets have native support for SATA 6 Gb/s or USB 3.0, motherboards that want to add support for these have to add additional controller chips which need to get integrated using the existing I/O channels on the board which for desktop motherboards would be PCIe. A single PCIe 2.0 lane (x1) supports up to 5 Gb/s bandwidth. The highest speed for USB 3.0 is 4 Gb/s (5 Gb/s is the theoretical max but 4 is the actual limit). So to fully support, say, 2 USB 3.0 ports and 2 SATA 6 Gb/s ports you would need at least 20 Gb/s of PCIe bandwidth or 4 lanes of PCIe (x4) dedicated (not shared with other devices) for those controllers. The boards without "true" support dedicate fewer lanes so you won't be able to achieve max bandwidth on some number of multiple simultaneous devices.

BTW the motherboard specs on the EVGA site are almost useless.


Thanks, that makes total sense now with some of the other stuff I have read.

Now, would that mean the Asus does have "true" SATA 6 or are all Intel boards false so to speak?

Also, any recommendations on those boards? Seems like the Asus is clearly the superior tech for less money. I guess I am trying to find a reason why I would buy the EVGA, as I want to like the board. I think probably any of them will be fine and I just need to pick one. But I sort of have writers block on it and cant.  :uhrr:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 22, 2010, 11:26:17 PM
Some one posted on Newegg that the EVGA board doesnt have "true" SATA 6 and USB 3, but didnt elaborate and I have no idea what that means.
Since none of the Intel chipsets have native support for SATA 6 Gb/s or USB 3.0, motherboards that want to add support for these have to add additional controller chips which need to get integrated using the existing I/O channels on the board which for desktop motherboards would be PCIe. A single PCIe 2.0 lane (x1) supports up to 5 Gb/s bandwidth. The highest speed for USB 3.0 is 4 Gb/s (5 Gb/s is the theoretical max but 4 is the actual limit). So to fully support, say, 2 USB 3.0 ports and 2 SATA 6 Gb/s ports you would need at least 20 Gb/s of PCIe bandwidth or 4 lanes of PCIe (x4) dedicated (not shared with other devices) for those controllers. The boards without "true" support dedicate fewer lanes so you won't be able to achieve max bandwidth on some number of multiple simultaneous devices.

BTW the motherboard specs on the EVGA site are almost useless.


Thanks, that makes total sense now with some of the other stuff I have read.

Now, would that mean the Asus does have "true" SATA 6 or are all Intel boards false so to speak?
It claims it does though looking at the specs more closely I'm a bit confused by the "math" that's used. On my motherboard (http://usa.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=T2FxW2fXGZQgSn2V&templete=2) which has "true" USB 3.0 and SATA 6 Gb/s it has this special chip:
Quote
Unique PCIe X4 Chip for Ultra Performance
- True USB 3.0 Support
- True SATA 6Gb/s Support
The matches the math I did above though now I'm wondering if in fact my board is acting more like the Sabertooth described below.

Looking at the Sabertooth board it says it uses the Marvell® 9128 PCIe SATA6Gb/s controller and the NEC® USB 3.0 controller but the specs for those chips say they use a single PCIe 2.0 lane each, not two lanes each. If you count by PCIe lanes reserved for PCIe slots it also implies those controllers are using one lane each. The X58 plus the ICH10R provide 42 lanes of PCIe 2.0 bandwidth (36 from X58, 6 from ICH10R). The board uses 38 lanes for its PCIe slots plus one for the regular PCI slot which, assuming the PCI slot isn't shared with a PCIe slot, means you have 3 lanes left over. That leaves one lane each for the Marvell and NEC controllers plus one lane for the JMicron® JMB362 SATA controller which also needs one lane. So it seems like at least for the SATA 6 Gb/s controller you won't get the full bandwidth if you have 2 drives hooked up and each can do up to the theoretical max. The USB 3.0 controller on a single lane is less of an issue cause in practice ~3 Gb/s is about the max you can hope to achieve on a single device.

The POS EVGA site doesn't list the extra controllers on their boards but looking at the lane counts for the slots the specs are even more confusing. The 131 board uses 35 lanes for its slots which leaves 7 lanes that can be used for extra controllers and stuff. The 132 board either uses 35 lanes or 43 lanes (!) depending on how you want to read its fucked up specs (it's presumably 35 lanes). With 7 lanes free for controllers EVGA could claim "true" USB 3.0 and SATA 6 Gb/s assuming they are using the same or similar controllers as the ASUS board and using dedicated PCIe lanes. It's possible that these boards, for whatever reason, don't use the 6 lanes provided by the ICH10R chip and so all the additional controller functionality not provided by the X58 and ICH10R have to be crammed into the single remaining X58 PCIe lane that's not used by a slot on the motherboard.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on November 23, 2010, 12:51:57 PM
Thanks again Trippy. I think I got it. Although, it doesnt really help me pick one.

I was planning on running a SATA3 Velociraptor (that I already own) and a SATA 6 1tb Western Digital. It does seem that the Sabertooth is the better tech if I am understanding all that.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on November 23, 2010, 06:11:56 PM
Thanks again Trippy. I think I got it. Although, it doesnt really help me pick one.

I was planning on running a SATA3 Velociraptor (that I already own) and a SATA 6 1tb Western Digital. It does seem that the Sabertooth is the better tech if I am understanding all that.
Is there any performance difference between using sata 3 vs. sata 6 on a single mechanical drive? Seems that this extra bandwidth requires a high end ssd like the crucial c300 to get used.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 23, 2010, 08:01:13 PM
The Raptor at 10K RPM maxes out at about 85 MB/s transfer rate. A 15K drive can go higher but still not enough to max out 300 MB/s.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Tebonas on November 26, 2010, 12:13:11 AM
Yay, my first mispost. One shouldn't frequent forums during crunch time. Sorry  :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on November 27, 2010, 09:44:43 PM
OK, graphics card decision time:

This EVGA 470: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130550

Or this MSI 470: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127513

Both will end up costing around the same amount, and I like the reviews of each cards, not to mention they aren't freakishly long (some cards were a full inch longer). I think the 470 is the right priced card for the budget I've maintained; I'm not looking to jump up to a beefier card or an SLI solution.  Plus, I'm just more comfortable with nvidia. I'll be putting it in an Antec 300 Illusion if that makes much of a difference. 

And with this, my build will be done.  Yay. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 27, 2010, 10:02:01 PM
EVGA has the better warranty if you register (lifetime). Personally I'd go with whichever card was quieter.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on November 28, 2010, 01:00:00 PM
I'll second the EVGA. Good warranty, and also the step up program.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Phred on November 28, 2010, 04:29:56 PM

The performance seems pretty comparable. Personally I'd go with NVIDIA but that's cause I like the drivers better.

Quote

Do people who say this use the stock ATI tray tools or the Guru3d ATITray tool? I used NVidia for years, up until my last card which failed prematurely thanks to the solder issue, so I picked up a 5850 and I use the Guru 3d tray tools and I find them way better than either the stock ATI or the NVidia controls.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on December 01, 2010, 12:37:14 AM
Since my wife's repairs ended up being the purchase of a whole new computer, and some nasty bills came in, my new PC got put off for awhile there.

So I'm hoping to go in this week. Tomorrow or the following evening to get it sorted. Does this still look good, or is there new superexciting/much better value things that have taken these components' place? I'm sure the stuff listed is all still decent, but there might be something that's now much better value or has been introduced. Some prices have dropped from the original, so I've changed them to the current prices. A bunch of other stuff seems to be really low on stock, so they may be out of any of those components when I go up...

http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/default.php

Intel i7-870   $313.00    (i7-950 $335?)
Asus P7P55D-E PRO  $195.00
WD Caviar Black 2 TB  $206.00
Corsair DDR3 8 GB PC-10600/1333 (4x 2GB)  $155.10 - "Call for stock" - Get the 2x 4GB sticks instead if they are out of the 4x 2GB ones? Other options?
EVGA NVIDIA GTX460 SC (01G-P2-1373-KR)  $244.20 - "Call for stock" - I have NFI about motherboards.
Corsair ATX-750 750W  $225.50  (rebranded Seasonic) - "Call for stock" - aside from wattages, I can't tell the differences, I've bought Thermaltake in the past...
* Corsair AX-850 ATX? $255.20
* Corsair HX-750 ATX? $199.00
* Corsair TX-850 ATX? $180.40

Case (whatever you like)
DVD burner (whatever you like)


My budget will allow for a bit of flexibility, maybe another $100 or so on the GPU, maybe more ram (4x 4GB sticks?) But I really need advice on those things.




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 01, 2010, 01:25:43 AM
I'd go ahead and get 2x4GB ram. More wiggle room down the line.

The 460 has one version with 768 ram and another with the 1GB ram, if memory serves. I'd angle for the 1 GB, since 768 may bite you in the butt in the future.

If you are running a high rez on your monitor, you may wanna consider the next one down the line, the 470 for ~$100 USD more. (yep, I know you're an Austrialasian)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 03, 2010, 11:32:57 AM
I picked up the final pieces of my build last night, and I am going to build it tonight. If anyone is interested, here is what I ended up going with. I actually ended up picking a lot of this stuff up at local B&M shops, using sales and price matching to get pretty decent prices.

Case: Antec 900 Two. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129058) $95
Processor: i7 950 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115211). $195
Motherboard: Ausu Sabertooth x58 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131665). $199
RAM: Corsair XMS3 12gb Kit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145235). $185
Power Supply: Corsair HX 850w Modular (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139011). $149
CPU Cooler: Corsair H50 - hybrid water and air cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181010). $69

I am also using the hard drive and GPU from my old system.

Main Hard Drive: WD VelociRaptor 150gb (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136296&cm_re=velociraptor_150gb-_-22-136-296-_-Product). I plan on also grabbing one of the SATA6 WD 1tb hard drives from newegg soon for $89.
Graphic Card: EVGA GTX 460 768mb (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130564). I will probably pick up another of these soon to SLI also.

Ill post some pictures of my build while I am doing it if anyone cares.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 03, 2010, 11:55:00 AM
I'll be doing (as much as I get time to) my PC assembly this weekend as well.   Excited and a bit perplexed/overwhelmed.  Haven't built a my own in a LONG time. 



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 03, 2010, 12:31:45 PM
I'll be doing (as much as I get time to) my PC assembly this weekend as well.   Excited and a bit perplexed/overwhelmed.  Haven't built a my own in a LONG time.  



You will be fine. Its much easier these days than it used to be. Round peg round hole etc. This will be my second build in 2 months.

I usually do it in this order.

- Mount backplate and bracket for CPU cooler on motherboard (if you have a 3rd party cpu heatsink).
- Mount motherboard to case.
- Mount PSU.
- Install RAM.
- Install CPU.
- Install Hard Drive and DVD Drive.
- Install CPU Cooler.
- Cabling.
- Power on system to check for post and drives and such.
- Cable management.
- Install Windows.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on December 03, 2010, 02:39:55 PM
My wife intercepted my computer parts and some of them are now wrapped under the tree.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on December 03, 2010, 02:41:51 PM
bogus!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on December 03, 2010, 02:51:18 PM
Dude, that is so wrong.  Never touch a geek's parts.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 03, 2010, 03:01:43 PM
My wife intercepted my computer parts and some of them are now wrapped under the tree.
:ye_gods:
Never touch a geek's parts.
:sad_panda:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 03, 2010, 03:22:34 PM
CPU Cooler: Corsair H50 - hybrid water and air cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181010). $69

Pick up a couple matching 120mm fans (Antec 3 speeds from Best Buy are fine - put them on medium), mount it in a push/pull configuration with it exhausting OUT of the case.  It's worth about a 10c drop in CPU temp.  The instructions call for the fan that comes in to be mounted as an intake fan that blows air through the radiator and into your case (blowing hot air into your case).  I use Gentle Typhoons on my i5-750 @ 3.8 ghz and I idle in the low 30's and load temp at about 65c.  Totally silent.  Love love love it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 03, 2010, 03:29:21 PM
CPU Cooler: Corsair H50 - hybrid water and air cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181010). $69

Pick up a couple matching 120mm fans (Antec 3 speeds from Best Buy are fine - put them on medium), mount it in a push/pull configuration with it exhausting OUT of the case.  The instructions call for the fan that comes in to be mounted as an intake fan that blows air through the radiator and into your case.  It's worth about a 10c drop in CPU temp.  I use Gentle Typhoons on my i5-750 @ 3.8 ghz and I idle in the low 30's and load temp at about 65c

I'm actually considering doing THIS (http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=390688&mpage=1). I will be getting a set of fans to do push/pull on the H50, I just havent decided on which fans yet. I can't find very many reviews on 120 case fans.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 03, 2010, 03:41:17 PM
On overclock.net (http://www.overclock.net/water-cooling/612436-official-corsair-h50-h70-club.html), there's a post in there that has the static pressure, RPM, cfm, and db ratings of a couple dozens fans.  I'm running GTX 470 in SLI, so my ambient case heat is a little bit more than what is normal for the push pull config.  I also keep the front fans on juuuust about their lowest setting and the top fan at its lowest setting.

That's a weird set up that guy is running, but if it works more power to him (and I guess you!).  I use the 900 2 as well.  Cable management is 'ok', not great, but it's a decent enough case.  I really want the Corsair 600T, but can't really justify it right now.  I ended up splicing/soldering all the case fans into one molex plug to keep down the plug/plug/plug/plug nonsense.  I also got an 8pin extension to run the smaller mobo power supply cable behind the mobo.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 03, 2010, 03:56:17 PM
I also wanted that Corsair case, but a few things stopped me. The plastic on the front part of the case made it look and feel a little cheap. The case is really wide. Its about 3 inches wider at the bottom and about 5 or 6 wider in the middle than the Antec 900 / 902, and due to that it wouldnt fit in the carriage I have under my desk to hold the case.  It has no window, and while I am not super in to all the flashy stuff, it does look nice, and some times I do like to have a look inside there.

Oh yeah and it cost around $65 more than the Antec 902.

I am considering replacing all my Antec case fans with very quiet fans, any recommendations?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 03, 2010, 04:04:00 PM
I am considering replacing all my Antec case fans with very quiet fans, any recommendations?
Nexus is the benchmark. I use the Noctua fans.

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article63-page2.html


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 03, 2010, 04:24:52 PM
Newegg's out of the Noctua fans in the review linked. They do have another type, the NF-P12-1300 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608004). I suspect they are just as good, but I thought I'd ask here, since I too am considering replacing two of my 120mm.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 03, 2010, 04:32:18 PM
Newegg's out of the Noctua fans in the review linked. They do have another type, the NF-P12-1300 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608004). I suspect they are just as good, but I thought I'd ask here, since I too am considering replacing two of my 120mm.
I use the 1300s but I'm not sure exactly how they compare with the 1200s.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 03, 2010, 05:07:38 PM
Did some research since my last post.

I have heard Noctua are good, but the color puts me off.

The Scythe GentileTyphoon are very high rated, and also the Noiseblocker Multiframes. Seems like all those are out of stock on Newegg.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 03, 2010, 10:43:02 PM
You have to keep an eye out on the GTs.  They seem to sell out quick.  I'm happy with them.  As I said, when using them with the H50 in the push/pull, with an ambient of about 23-24c, they keep me at about 31-33c on idle and 55-65c using Prime95.  I'm veeeery tempted to run a duct from the top front case fan direct to the p/p to bypass the ambient heat from the mobo/GPUs - just to see what kind of difference, if any, it would make.  I mounted my DVD at the very bottom and shifted the front case fans all the way up so it's basically a straight line of air from the top front 120mm to the H50 fans/reservoir.

I'm tempted to yank the DVD out completely and just use an external DVD drive when I need it.  I never use it, and it's two less cables to run/hide.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on December 03, 2010, 11:18:09 PM
I use the scythe s-flex fans, and have been quite happy with them for years.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 04, 2010, 04:14:35 PM
I did my new build last night and I was wondering if my CPU temps are a bit high, and if so what should I do.

My apartment is pretty much always 22c (72f).

Current system:

Case Antec 902
i7 950
Asus Sabertooth x58
H50
12bg Corsair XMS3
EVGA GTX 460 768mb
Corsair HX 850

I currently have the 2 front fans intaking, my bit top fan exhausting.

I have the H50 set up intaking from the back in a push setup.

My CPU is idling at 39-40c and while running Prime95 its 65-66c. That seems a bit high for only stock speeds. I wanted to OC, but I dont feel like with the current temps that would be a great idea.

The pump is running at 1300rpm and the Corsair fan is running at 1600rpm.

Other system temps:
Motherboard 34c
Northbridge: 56c

Any advice?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 04, 2010, 04:54:55 PM
That seems high, but the paste that comes stock with the H50 takes a good week or more to 'cure'.  If you're overly concerned, switch the H50 fan to exhaust and see what happens.  The Corsair way of doing it makes me think there's a buffeting effect that doesnt allow the good clean air to get away from the reservoir.  My best results have always been setting the reservoir fan to exhaust, regardless if I use two fans in a push/pull or if I use one fan as exhaust.  There's tons of people posting the same results (better as exhaust).

With the H50 as an intake and the two fronts as intake, you're pushing alot of air against each other, regardless of the top fan exhausting the air out.  In my head, I see a swirling, buffeting effect that the top fan can't keep up with.  I tried my two front fans as exhaust (and I even think the H50 recommends switching the front(s) to exhaust), but didn't like the idea of hot air being pushed into the case and moving about the rest of the components.

e:  In messing about with different configurations (and a ton of research), I found that with the 900 2, the best way to set it up was push/pull, moving the DVD to the very bottom mount and moving the fans all the way up.  It makes the DVD a little tougher to get to, but on the other hand consider how often you actually use it.  When you DO use it putting it on the bottom moves the drive noise away from you (when it's spun up, anyway).  However, it gives you a perfect straight line path of good clean cool air from the top front intake fan perfectly straight to your H50 fan(s) and reservoir.  It also puts your bottom fan in a good line with your graphics card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 04, 2010, 06:33:05 PM
Think I should reseat the contact with Arctic Silver?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 04, 2010, 07:44:57 PM
I wouldn't think so, unless you had a fair amount of contacted twisting and movement when you got it lined up with the retainer and wrenched it down.  The stuff they use on the H50 has some premium stuff on it (Shin Etsu).  Give it a week, or even a month, before deciding unless your temps get out of control.

e:  I just thought of something...When in your bios, the fans are showing 100% speed, yeah?  IIRC, when in bios or on startup/POST, your fans automatically spool up to their max speed, but when you get to desktop, they slow down.  Make sure your default fan speed in bios is max/100%.  If it's not, your fan and pump may be operating slower than they should.  And because your system doesn't recognize it as being too hot, they're only doing what they need to be doing.  The H50 needs your fan and your pump operating at a constant 100 percent speed, regardless if it's idle or underload.  And that MIGHT be why your idle temp is so high (but doesn't really explain why your load temp is pretty much the same as mine).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 04, 2010, 10:36:20 PM
I looked all over my BIOS, and didnt see any options for adjusting the fan speed.

When I first installed the pump over the CPU, I didnt quite get it to lock in the ring clamp thing. So I had to loosen it, and twist it slightly left and right. Do you think this could mess up the thermal paste?

Also, I dont think if I change the fan direction its going to make much of a difference. If I remove the side on my case, it doesnt help the temp. I am going to try and change to exhaust, but im not sure if I have the right screws with me right now.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 04, 2010, 10:51:48 PM
Which BIOS is it?  If it's American Megatrends, it's located under H/W Monitor.  Alternatively, download speedfan and see what RPM your fans are spinning at.

I don't think you messed up the paste, but it's possible.  Give it a week and see what happens.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 04, 2010, 11:40:33 PM
So I tried to change the setup to exhaust, and realized the radiator is just a tad to big to fit flush up against the case. The next thing I tried was totally moving the rad and fan outside the case, temps stayed exactly the same, so I dont think with the single fan using intake or exhaust is going to make a difference.

The BIOS is a custom one for the Asus Sabertooth. I did find fan options in under hardware monitor, but it was to show the current speed or ignore it. I do have a fan monitor, and it is showing the fan running at 1600 to 1650rpm. The stats on the fan say it should run at 1700rpm.

Image below of my fan speeds and temp, and cpu-z under full load with Prime95.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 04, 2010, 11:52:50 PM
I'm really pleased with my build so far. I still think I could do a bit better on the cable management and fan speeds (Antec 300 M Illusions manual fan switches are kinda assy for setting to medium speeds).   

It's really nice to load a game and just play at the highest settings.  Granted, I haven't really tried pushing it yet.  Only loaded up Fallout: NV and WoW so far.  The required Oblivion testing (which was once Morrowind testing) will come soon enough.

Builded ended up being.

i5 760
MSI P55-GD65
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus 58
CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply66137443
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-8GBRL66079257 (N82E16820231314)
MSI N470GTX Twin Frozr II GeForce GTX 470 (Fermi) 1280MB 320-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card66825035
Antec Three Hundred Illusion Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case66417858
1 TB WD Caviar Black from my old PC

Only component I'm not really happy with at the moment is the MB, and that's because it's not detecting the speed of my RAM correctly right now.  I think 1600 is only supported as an "OC" setting, but I haven't quite deciphered the BIOS yet on how to do that.

Assembly only took about 3 hours, mainly due to not being really sure on some aspects.   Windows 7 installation was painless.  Yay.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 04, 2010, 11:57:10 PM
Image below of my fan speeds and temp, and cpu-z under full load with Prime95.


Weird, man.  I guess it's possible you got a bad H50 because your temps shouldn't be anywhere near that high (even taking the TIM curing into consideration - at most you're looking at 5c difference).  Here's my i5-750 at full load with P95.


Put the stock cooler on it and see what happens?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 05, 2010, 12:25:15 PM
Only component I'm not really happy with at the moment is the MB, and that's because it's not detecting the speed of my RAM correctly right now.  I think 1600 is only supported as an "OC" setting, but I haven't quite deciphered the BIOS yet on how to do that.

Assembly only took about 3 hours, mainly due to not being really sure on some aspects.   Windows 7 installation was painless.  Yay.

Ras, to get any of the new motherboards to see your RAM any higher than 1066 you need to enable XMP in the BIOS. Its like a semi-OC setting. But really its more like one switch you flip.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 05, 2010, 12:27:15 PM
Image below of my fan speeds and temp, and cpu-z under full load with Prime95.


Weird, man.  I guess it's possible you got a bad H50 because your temps shouldn't be anywhere near that high (even taking the TIM curing into consideration - at most you're looking at 5c difference).  Here's my i5-750 at full load with P95.


Put the stock cooler on it and see what happens?


Just puttering around Windows with a few small things running I am noticing my temps are about 44 - 53. Some times those temps at the same time on different cores. Is a 9 degree difference on different cores at the same time normal?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on December 05, 2010, 12:32:12 PM
It's possible it's just the different BIOSes giving the different temperatures.  On the same motherboard mine went from a solid 34 C to averaging 39 C with only a BIOS update.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on December 05, 2010, 01:57:53 PM
Hoh boy, my computer decided to not post once today. After retrying once the computer turned on fine. Between this and the random crash dump screen I got yesterday, I think it's time to start looking at making a new i5 system... Or am I being paranoid?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 05, 2010, 03:19:45 PM
I'm actually considering doing THIS (http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=390688&mpage=1).
Is it me or is there a big dead space under the gpu? Shouldn't there be a fan in there, too? I'd think an ideal push/pull would have three tiers (on an Antec case): top for cpu zone, mid for gpu zone and the bottom channel where the psu sits.

The evga external exhaust design is annoyingly loud (I'm sure they cheaped on the fan), but one great thing is that it defeats that thermal hot spot in most cases. Case temps (and gpu) are way down compared to my more standardly-cooled old 8800gtx.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 05, 2010, 04:09:27 PM
Hoh boy, my computer decided to not post once today. After retrying once the computer turned on fine. Between this and the random crash dump screen I got yesterday, I think it's time to start looking at making a new i5 system... Or am I being paranoid?

Got a copy of the crash dump?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 05, 2010, 04:10:12 PM
Hoh boy, my computer decided to not post once today. After retrying once the computer turned on fine. Between this and the random crash dump screen I got yesterday, I think it's time to start looking at making a new i5 system... Or am I being paranoid?

That could be any number of things that don't require a whole new system.

Make sure everything looks seated correctly. Ram, video card, sound card (if you have one), etc.

Might be the ram. Run a Memtest86 test off the UBCD (http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/).

Might be the vid card (this one's unlikely) since unless they are seriously horked, they do let you get past POST.

Might be the power supply. Is your PSU a hold over from another system? Do you have another PSU you can use to check it out? Most folks don't, but some of us nerds have 2 spare lying about from prior builds laying in a closet somewhere.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on December 05, 2010, 04:19:42 PM
Quote
Make sure everything looks seated correctly. Ram, video card, sound card (if you have one), etc.

I don't tinker inside my system at all; so everything is seated fine.

Quote
Might be the ram. Run a Memtest86 test off the UBCD (http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/).

Good idea, actually.

Quote
Might be the power supply. Is your PSU a hold over from another system? Do you have another PSU you can use to check it out? Most folks don't, but some of us nerds have 2 spare lying about from prior builds laying in a closet somewhere.

It's a newer PSU; originally the system had a hold over; but a new graphics card forced me to get a new PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 05, 2010, 07:17:48 PM
I don't tinker inside my system at all; so everything is seated fine.

Negative.  Heat and electrical current cause oxidization and galvanic action, reseating failing cards and memory modules may scrape off any metal oxides.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 06, 2010, 10:21:55 AM
Only component I'm not really happy with at the moment is the MB, and that's because it's not detecting the speed of my RAM correctly right now.  I think 1600 is only supported as an "OC" setting, but I haven't quite deciphered the BIOS yet on how to do that.

Assembly only took about 3 hours, mainly due to not being really sure on some aspects.   Windows 7 installation was painless.  Yay.

Ras, to get any of the new motherboards to see your RAM any higher than 1066 you need to enable XMP in the BIOS. Its like a semi-OC setting. But really its more like one switch you flip.

Thanks! That did the trick.

Interesting fact:  the automatic fan control on my card didn't work until I actually hit "user define" in the MSI afterburner software and just saved the defaults.   :awesome_for_real:



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 11:44:17 AM
So, I returned my H50, as I noticed I could hear a lot of water noise in the pipes which people said is not good. I picked up another one. I cleaned the CPU top really well, and seated the new H50. I also added another fan to it, so its now in a push/pull setup exhausting.

I have just about identical temps as I did with my first unit. Idle at 40c, load at 66c. I am getting very frustrated with this thing. I know my temps should be much lower than this.


It doesnt seem to matter what fan setup I have, or what speed they are on. Still pushing pretty much the exact same temps. Anyone else have any ideas?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 06, 2010, 11:51:01 AM
I have no idea what to say other than to put your stock cooler on it and see what happens.  If after swapping out the h50 and putting the stock cooler on it, and you still have too high of temps?  Something else is wrong.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 06, 2010, 12:38:01 PM
Did you use a thermal compound when mounting the cooler to the CPU?

Edit- NM posting from phone, didn't scroll up enough to see your arctic silver comment.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on December 06, 2010, 01:15:51 PM
I don't tinker inside my system at all; so everything is seated fine.

Negative.  Heat and electrical current cause oxidization and galvanic action, reseating failing cards and memory modules may scrape off any metal oxides.

...Magic, got it.

Thanks, that's actually really good to know. The computer hasnt acted up since, but I'll take a look inside just in case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 01:23:01 PM
I'm beginning to wonder if my CPU just runs really hot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 02:15:55 PM
SnakeCharmer, any tips on which version I should buy of the GentileTyphoon?

Scythe Link (http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/acc/051/d1225c12b1ap_detail.html#) - There seems to be 5 models that go at different speeds. I was thinking maybe the 14.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 06, 2010, 02:56:39 PM
I use these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185058), but I hear the Noctuas (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608009) are a little better due to the higher static pressure.  They're also 3 times the price of the GTs.

Have you tried your stock CPU cooler?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 03:32:00 PM
I use these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185058), but I hear the Noctuas (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608009) are a little better due to the higher static pressure.  They're also 3 times the price of the GTs.

Have you tried your stock CPU cooler?

Not yet, I'm going to try that when I get home tonight.

I was thinking of getting 4 of the GentileTyphoons, 2 for my case and 2 for the H50.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 06, 2010, 03:46:37 PM
Did a little bit of reading...There's this (http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2035564), this (http://forums.pureoverclock.com/showthread.php?t=6471), this (http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/294947-28-temps-coolermaster-load-high).

Temps sound completely normal.  It's just a hot chip.  You might could try putting the vcore to whatever it should be rather than auto and seeing what happens.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 03:54:16 PM
Funny. I had already read all those. I realize its a pretty hot chip, and its going to run hotter than yours, but most of the stuff I read said that with the H50, I should be seeing idle temps in the high 20s to low 30s, and loads of mid 40s. Where as I am idling around 41c. Almost 20c hotter than ambient. I have a bunch of AS5 at home, so I am going to experiment when I get off work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 06, 2010, 04:00:29 PM
It's good, but I don't think it's quite THAT good.  I love it mostly from an aesthetic point of view; it makes a clean case and it's quiet.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 06, 2010, 04:03:34 PM
Morfiend,

Did a quick google of i7 950 temperatures and there seems to be a lot of chatter about concerns their processor's temp is too high. However, I am starting to think your temps may be normal.

Some random post on the internets had this to say:

Quote
3.6 GHz at Vcore 1.200v 67-70 C on prime95
3.8 GHz at Vcore 1.225v 72-76 C on prime95

1.325v Vcore seems to be the lowest voltage I can set to keep my system stable for 4.0 GHz. I haven't run prime95 too long (maybe around 20 minutes max) because of the temperature issue

So, it looks like you're running at a Vcore of 1.208 and getting a temp of 66 C at 3.0 GHz. Compare it to the guy above at 3.6 at Vcore 1.200 and 67-70 C it seems plausible.

Edit: Ah, looks like you got it covered.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 09:20:15 PM
So, I don't think I will be able to install the stock cooler. I will have to remove my motherboard to access the H50 backplate, and its a HUGE pain in the ass.

I did reseat the H50 with Arctic Silver 5, and now I am running way hotter even. After 5 minutes of Prime 95, I'm now running at 75c.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 06, 2010, 10:19:31 PM
Reseated a 4th time and now im back to 39-40c idles and 65c load temps. I still feel this is to high, but I dont know what to do next.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 06, 2010, 11:24:39 PM
65 C at load still gives you, what 30ish to TJ Max? That's way within safety limits. Honestly bro, I think that's just how they're designed.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 07, 2010, 01:16:18 AM
I brought my processor up to 3.7 and it was idling at 56-58c, and as soon as I started Prime95 it jumped to 85c and then climbed up to 91c in the next 30 seconds.

Does that seem right?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Minvaren on December 07, 2010, 08:15:09 AM
Not sure about Intel, but my last few AMDs (95W 2.8/3.0 Ghz) idled at 35-40c and peaked at 60-65c under full load, so your original temps don't seem too far out of bounds by comparison.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on December 07, 2010, 08:32:31 AM
How much thermal paste are you using?  One thing to keep in mind is that you want an extremely thin coat.  The idea is to seal any gaps between the two plates.  Too much paste and it acts as an insulator.

Running hotter than ever would seem to indicate too much.  Get it to a decent temp (and I honestly think 39 C idle / 65 C under load is a decent temp), and give it a week.  Even then, it'll take time for the paste to settle due to pressure once you have the proper thickness.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on December 07, 2010, 08:51:47 AM
Do you have any secondary cooling around the cpu area for mosfets, nb and such? Water cooling does great for what it's on, but nothing for surrounding stuff.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 07, 2010, 09:10:42 AM
Are you still getting water flow noises?  Are you certain you've purged all air from the loop?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on December 07, 2010, 09:44:58 AM
H50 is a sealed system cooler, there should be no water noise at all. I have one on my desk I haven't installed yet.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 08, 2010, 02:32:16 PM
So is this the thread for "I am a hardware idiot?". I'm looking at building a box sometime after Christmas. My current PC is...elderly (2002-ish?).

I've gotten someone to agree to help put the thing together (he's done it lots of times, and I've never done it, so...prefer to have someone stand over my shoulder and say 'Don't be a moron' before I do something dumb).

Trying to keep it in the 500 to 700 dollar range. Don't need a monitor. Cost for the OS is seperate from the hardware costs (I want to set it up to dual boot Ubuntu and Windows 7, I think). My hard drives are elderly enough that even if the hardware fits, they're at the end of their lifespan.

So what I should I be looking at? Case, video card, CPU, power supply, RAM, and drives?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 08, 2010, 05:12:28 PM
Depends on your needs. If you aren't a gamer/video fiddler, then yes, its very doable. If you are interested in gaming its still doable, but a bit constrained at $700.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 08, 2010, 05:26:56 PM
210   chip (i5 760)
120   mb (might be able to get cheaper if in a combo)
150   GPU (a 460 can be got for this price)
100   RAM (4 gigs)
100   HD  (perhaps can get cheaper)
50   case (cheap)
20   dvd (standard)
75     PSU (could get for less)

There's a quick, lazy response that gets you (albeit with stock cooling) a decent gaming machine at $825 for the hardware.  You could shave $10-20 dollars off here or there and perhaps some more with combo deals and mail in rebates.  Very possible to get that under $700. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on December 08, 2010, 06:54:48 PM
Don't forget a static strap.  No matter what your buddy tells you, use a static strap AND GROUND IT. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 08, 2010, 07:42:37 PM
AMD CPU/Mobo is an option if you start looking at i3's instead of i5's.

Don't go cheap on the PSU.  Get something 450-600 watt from Seasonic.  Yes, a 450 watt will run an i5 and GTX 460 if it's not a piece of shit.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Thrawn on December 09, 2010, 09:53:40 AM
Don't go cheap on the PSU.

Seconding this, I have a bunch of dead cheap off brand PSUs in my basement from computers I've fixed for people.  Buy a decent brand and you usually want to buy bigger than what you need.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 09, 2010, 10:26:08 AM
210   chip (i5 760)
120   mb (might be able to get cheaper if in a combo)
150   GPU (a 460 can be got for this price)
100   RAM (4 gigs)
100   HD  (perhaps can get cheaper)
50   case (cheap)
20   dvd (standard)
75     PSU (could get for less)

There's a quick, lazy response that gets you (albeit with stock cooling) a decent gaming machine at $825 for the hardware.  You could shave $10-20 dollars off here or there and perhaps some more with combo deals and mail in rebates.  Very possible to get that under $700. 
That seems workable. While technically this will be a gaming machine, in actuality -- I'm years behind. I'll be satisified with something that'll run SC2 and Diablo 3, when it comes out. Runs, not "runs awesomely with 3 million FPS with all the bells and whistles on".


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 09, 2010, 11:00:28 AM
210   chip (i5 760)
120   mb (might be able to get cheaper if in a combo)
150   GPU (a 460 can be got for this price)
100   RAM (4 gigs)
100   HD  (perhaps can get cheaper)
50   case (cheap)
20   dvd (standard)
75     PSU (could get for less)

There's a quick, lazy response that gets you (albeit with stock cooling) a decent gaming machine at $825 for the hardware.  You could shave $10-20 dollars off here or there and perhaps some more with combo deals and mail in rebates.  Very possible to get that under $700. 
That seems workable. While technically this will be a gaming machine, in actuality -- I'm years behind. I'll be satisified with something that'll run SC2 and Diablo 3, when it comes out. Runs, not "runs awesomely with 3 million FPS with all the bells and whistles on".

For those prices you can get a pretty damn well performing PC. Also, at a later date you can add a second 460 graphics card, but a large performance increase. Just make sure you get a motherboard that supports SLI and a PSU that can handle the load of both cards.

I would recommend at least a 750w PSU. Also, you can probably get 6gb of ram for that price, 3x2gb, so you can run in triple channel. You should be able to find a hard drive for more like $50 if you watch newegg for sales. Currently they have a SATA 6 1tb drive for $89.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 09, 2010, 11:05:08 AM
That seems workable. While technically this will be a gaming machine, in actuality -- I'm years behind. I'll be satisified with something that'll run SC2 and Diablo 3, when it comes out. Runs, not "runs awesomely with 3 million FPS with all the bells and whistles on".

I just bought something similar, but with 8 gigs RAM, a 470 GTX, a CPU cooler, and a 750W PSU. It handles Blizzard games at "ultra" graphics settings with a constant 60 FPS.

I would recommend at least a 750w PSU. Also, you can probably get 6gb of ram for that price, 3x2gb, so you can run in triple channel. You should be able to find a hard drive for more like $50 if you watch newegg for sales. Currently they have a SATA 6 1tb drive for $89.

Can't run triple channel unless he goes an i7 that supports LGA 1366.  Depending on how lucky he gets with deals (like the $200 i7950 that was floating around a while ago), that could bump the price up more or keep it relatively the same.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 09, 2010, 11:53:55 AM
Basically the exact setup you originally listed will do Blizzard games at 60 fps on Ultra.

More PSU is better, but higher efficiency trumps more wattage.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on December 09, 2010, 11:57:48 AM
Wouldn't his monitor/resolution play a large part in determining is CPU/GPU/RAM needs to run X game at ultra (or whatever) settings?  A setup the runs 1280x1024 (or whatever it is) at ultra would chug at 1920x1200.  I've always recommended to friends to determine what resolution they play/want to play at then build accordingly.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 09, 2010, 12:11:02 PM
Wouldn't his monitor/resolution play a large part in determining is CPU/GPU/RAM needs to run X game at ultra (or whatever) settings?  A setup the runs 1280x1024 (or whatever it is) at ultra would chug at 1920x1200.  I've always recommended to friends to determine what resolution they play/want to play at then build accordingly.
1280x1024 is the monitor I have, and I don't plan to replace it. I'm trying to do this on the cheap. Especially since I have to scare up a copy of Windows 7 somewhere.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 09, 2010, 12:50:43 PM
Wouldn't his monitor/resolution play a large part in determining is CPU/GPU/RAM needs to run X game at ultra (or whatever) settings?  A setup the runs 1280x1024 (or whatever it is) at ultra would chug at 1920x1200.  I've always recommended to friends to determine what resolution they play/want to play at then build accordingly.

I play on a 23" LCD (1920x1080).  So, he'd be just fine now, and fine if he ends up upgrading his monitor in a year or two.  I'd rather have more than enough than just barely.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 09, 2010, 04:50:15 PM
So basically I take the list and start watching NewEgg? (I'll probably spring for 8 gigs of ram. 2 4gig sticks). I keep expecting I'll end up with a motherboard that for some reason won't fit in the damn case -- too many Dell PC's with their weird-ass motherboards cut to fit their cases.

Dammit, I ended up with 1k for the bits and pieces. I may have overdone it on the PSU and video card (420 together) and 340 for the MB+CPU combo.

Hmm. I may just have to surf sales. Post-Christmas general has some good stuff.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on December 09, 2010, 05:16:53 PM
Yeah.

Decide on a processor type, then use the sort functions to find the mobo/processors that fit your criteria. Just make sure your case and your mobo are both the same type (ATX or MicroATX) and the fit problem should not exist.

If you are looking for getting a good all-around PC for less, you could look at AMD processors. I have been very happy with my Phenom I built 2 years ago.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 09, 2010, 05:30:28 PM
Eh, I could get a pretty similar build through Dell for 1200, which would include Office Home and Student and 7 Ultimate, for 1200 bucks. Admittedly, that includes a 500 dollar discount I get through my workplace.

PSU wouldn't be quite as good, nor the card as easily upgradeable, but price-wise it's a wash. Damn, I was hoping for a larger, more obvious savings.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on December 09, 2010, 05:35:03 PM
I like Dell, but you end up paying for it in the long run.  My last one, even being an XPS, was a complete pain in the ass to upgrade.  It also ran uncomfortably hot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morat20 on December 09, 2010, 05:41:20 PM
I like Dell, but you end up paying for it in the long run.  My last one, even being an XPS, was a complete pain in the ass to upgrade.  It also ran uncomfortably hot.
Yeah, I have that problem now. Of course, where I keep my tower isn't the best ventilated now. I'm sorta mulling the "Same price, but with software and a better warranty" up against "Not Being Dell".


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on December 09, 2010, 06:05:14 PM
I don't find Dell cases hard to work in at all, YMMV.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 09, 2010, 06:49:16 PM
Dammit, I ended up with 1k for the bits and pieces. I may have overdone it on the PSU and video card (420 together) and 340 for the MB+CPU combo.
EVGA 460 at newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130591)= $160
Corsair 850w PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009&cm_re=corsair_850w-_-17-139-009-_-Product) = $125


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on December 09, 2010, 07:31:21 PM
I don't find Dell cases hard to work in at all, YMMV.
Depends if you get a tower or one of their smaller form factors.  I never have trouble with their towers either, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 09, 2010, 08:05:54 PM
EVGA reccomends 24A @ 12v for a single card system (meaning double that is SLI capable with headroom).  CWT made the linked Corsair, and may or may not be a good brand / OEM currently.

$75 Seagate 620w (48A @ 12v) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151096)

Seagate's other shit. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007657%2050001697&IsNodeId=1&name=SeaSonic%20USA)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ashamanchill on December 09, 2010, 09:54:53 PM
Hey guys, just a quick question. My brother works in a computer warehouse and he got me a good deal on a quad core. He also got me a hard drive, and a (illegitimate) copy of windows 7. The thing is, I more or less want to use my old hard drive, with all my things on it, and it being arranged how I like it and what not. I asked him if I could just move my hard drive over and use it on the new computer, and he basically said no.

Is what I am asking to do feasible? If so, how? Or is he right?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on December 09, 2010, 10:01:20 PM
Hey guys, just a quick question. My brother works in a computer warehouse and he got me a good deal on a quad core. He also got me a hard drive, and a (illegitimate) copy of windows 7. The thing is, I more or less want to use my old hard drive, with all my things on it, and it being arranged how I like it and what not. I asked him if I could just move my hard drive over and use it on the new computer, and he basically said no.

Is what I am asking to do feasible? If so, how? Or is he right?

If you're going to be using a new motherboard, I would say no.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 09, 2010, 10:12:33 PM
Hey guys, just a quick question. My brother works in a computer warehouse and he got me a good deal on a quad core. He also got me a hard drive, and a (illegitimate) copy of windows 7. The thing is, I more or less want to use my old hard drive, with all my things on it, and it being arranged how I like it and what not. I asked him if I could just move my hard drive over and use it on the new computer, and he basically said no.

Is what I am asking to do feasible? If so, how? Or is he right?
The two issues you'll have is Windows activation and whether or not you'll even be able to boot off the drive into Windows given the lack of drivers for the new motherboard. If you can get it to boot and it's a legit non-OEM copy of Windows and you still have the key you should be able to get whoever you talk to to give you the activation code to let you activate it on your new hardware.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on December 10, 2010, 09:48:03 AM
You can use it as storage, but making it a boot drive without reinstalling has been a pain since the days of XP due to MS OS's not wanting to load if the motherboard changes.  And simply for stability and performance, I'd recommend a fresh install anyways.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Morfiend on December 10, 2010, 11:44:39 AM
And even if you do get it to boot and past activation, you then have to deal with tons of old drivers for hardware that doesnt exist. Really, its a bad idea all around.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: birdsguts on December 10, 2010, 04:55:52 PM
Whenever I have that issue I just install to a fresh drive and slave up the old one as a "storage" drive and archive of sorts.
Best of both worlds really. You can always rebuild shortcuts on the new drive to all your old stuff and it'll feel mostly the same with minimal effort.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ashamanchill on December 12, 2010, 04:48:40 AM
Thanks for the response everyone. I have basically taken all your advice. I bought a new copy of Windows 7 for (relatively) cheap and installed it on the new hard drive. I read what y'all have said, and decided 'aw fuck it, if they think it's  pain, it will be nightmare for me' and just installed WoW on my new computer.  The only thing I really needed to back up on the old comp was my creative writing folders anyway.







And porno.  :drill:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: veredus on December 27, 2010, 09:06:42 PM
OK, so I received $100.00 in gift cards from Newegg for Christmas and I'm looking to finally upgrade from my cheap GT240. I wanna keep it under $200.00 after shipping (cheaper the better too) and mainly interested in an NVIDIA card. If it matters I am running:

I5 750
6 gigs DDR3
Gigabyte GA-P55M-UD2 Motherboard
Case is big so card size not an issue

This is the primary one I am looking at http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130567 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130567)
Good deal or any other suggestions? 

It's $189.99 on sale right now with a $20.00 rebate card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on December 27, 2010, 10:54:29 PM
460GTX 1gig card. Pretty much the only choice under $200, unless you run into a smokin' 470 deal.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 27, 2010, 11:43:00 PM
Check the warranty stuff.  EVGA does lifetime warranties on some cards if you register it shortly after purchase, as I recall the AR suffix indicates this.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 29, 2010, 10:55:18 AM
My 460gtx 1GB EE has a lifetime warranty on it. Nice kick for my almost 4yr old C2D e6600 with 4GB of DDR2.

If I did it again, I'd skip the external exhaust, though. It's wicked loud, though it's made case temps very cool.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on December 29, 2010, 11:56:29 AM
I've been really happy with the Gigabyte version of the 1 GB GTX460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125333).  It doesn't exhaust outside the case, but the cooler on it is pretty damned quiet, even under load.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 29, 2010, 02:36:02 PM
I've been really happy with the Gigabyte version of the 1 GB GTX460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125333).  It doesn't exhaust outside the case, but the cooler on it is pretty damned quiet, even under load.

The success of a GPU cooler that doesn't exhaust out of the case is highly contingent upon how well the other case fans are venting hot air out. The issue with case ventilation is that you have to do some research on good cases or just spend a lot of money.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Raguel on January 01, 2011, 01:26:19 PM

About 2 months or so ago I basically got a new pc, however compared to others' experiences, I had incredibly poor performance while playing Rift. I'm hoping someone can help me out.

AMD Phenom II X6 1055T (2.8 GHz)
GTX 470 1280 MB
4 gig RAM  (DDR3) 1600 MHz
Gigabyte GA 890GPA UD3H
Hitachi Desktar  1 TB 7200 rpm


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on January 01, 2011, 03:22:35 PM
What is "incredibly poor performance"?

Is there any issue with RIFT on a six core, for some reason?  There's nothing in that build that looks like an outstanding issue to me (other than it being AMD, which I don't use). 

On my Q6600/8800gtx/4gig I was running 24-30fps Ultra in non-raid, 20fps low specs in raid during the invasions. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Raguel on January 01, 2011, 07:46:10 PM
What is "incredibly poor performance"?

Is there any issue with RIFT on a six core, for some reason?  There's nothing in that build that looks like an outstanding issue to me (other than it being AMD, which I don't use).  

On my Q6600/8800gtx/4gig I was running 24-30fps Ultra in non-raid, 20fps low specs in raid during the invasions.  

Threash and at least one other person in global chat say they were getting 40 60 fps during the raid with max settings. I was getting 8 fps and averaging 20 fps everywhere else. Friday morning tho I was getting 30 40  on average but still in the teens during the raid.

eta: does anyone own a Bigfoot Killer 2100? I'm curious if it's worth buying. I saw it at Fry's for about $90.00. Sounds a bit pricey for a nic.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on January 01, 2011, 09:44:47 PM
I stay away from 'performance' NICs. I sincerely doubt they will improve your latency issues if you're having any.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on January 02, 2011, 09:04:49 PM

About 2 months or so ago I basically got a new pc, however compared to others' experiences, I had incredibly poor performance while playing Rift. I'm hoping someone can help me out.

AMD Phenom II X6 1055T (2.8 GHz)
GTX 470 1280 MB
4 gig RAM  (DDR3) 1600 MHz
Gigabyte GA 890GPA UD3H
Hitachi Desktar  1 TB 7200 rpm

Probably your processor.  The game is still in Beta, so threading optimization and scalability past 2/4 cores may still be in the works, and they might be favouring Intel processors since they tend to be the performance king at the moment.  Might also be seeing a heavier than usual CPU load if they're solving outstanding GPU / sound hardware compatibility problems by running the problematic code in software mode.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on January 02, 2011, 11:18:55 PM
eta: does anyone own a Bigfoot Killer 2100? I'm curious if it's worth buying. I saw it at Fry's for about $90.00. Sounds a bit pricey for a nic.

I wouldn't buy it just for the reason of the tinkering it preforms to the Windows networking stack. In order to optimize performance it installs and utilizes it's own networking stack to avoid any slowdown. This leads into a whole new slew of support issues (search their forums for fios & bsod problems).

if your shopping for a good network card look at any Intel Gigabit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833106036). I've been using on-board for a long while, but recently had weird issues with a realtek on-board chip that I'm back to using Intel NIC's.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on January 03, 2011, 10:01:29 AM
Don't use RIFT as a performance gauge, especially now (when they're still tweaking the engine). Maybe once it's released and even then only if it's your primary game. Use more standard benchmarks, stuff you see the review sites using. And take anything anyone says about performance with a grain of salt, I call bullshit on anyone saying they were running ultra settings during one of the big raid events and getting 60fps.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Raguel on January 03, 2011, 01:10:09 PM

Thanks all.


Reading a bit on the official site, it looks like a lot of people with gtx's are having problems. I dunno if that's the root cause, but it's nice to know I'm not the only one having problems.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on January 17, 2011, 12:28:27 AM
So, anyone springing for a new Sandy Bridge CPU? I'm thinking about it, since my C2D6750 is getting a bit long in the tooth. I'm considering a Gigabyte motherboard for it. This one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128465) in particular, because it claims to have P67 'native' SATA6 controller rather than the tacked-on Marvel SATA6 controller the other Gigabyte boards have.

Any thoughts?

I have also heard from some folks that there's a new 'feature' on the CPU regarding 'DRM' control that is either a) a way for you to stream 1080p from providers since it encrypts the stream or b) a way for the man to control your computings. Anyone heard of this one way or another?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on January 17, 2011, 11:48:11 AM
There's a fair amount of info floating around, it's programmable stuff in the chip, Intel used the streaming DRM "It's not DRM, it's a content management system!" as an example. Early days yet to see if it's evil.

And why the hate on the marvell sata6? Even that board half the sata6 is marvell. It's not like there's even much sata6 out there yet, unless you're dropping big cash on one of the few ssds that support it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on January 17, 2011, 01:47:36 PM
I've been trying to sort out a i7 build for a friend who does freelance 2d art type stuff (product design/advertising stuff). They have been using a laptop with some shit Intel on-board video and its high time for a nice big upgrade so that all of the programs can be run at once with buttery smoothness. The laptop chugs just opening 600+ dpi files into photoshop I'm not sure how they can stand it.

I'm looking at the i7 options and it feels like a bit of a minefield considering the strange price spread on newegg. For mobo I was looking at Asus' Sabertooth x58 as the safe no brainer choice. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16813131665)

Video card though is giving me fits. Adobe says they give extra special blowjob support to GTX285 and GTX470 which I don't take that seriously but is still annoying. The GTX400's run too damn loud and too damn hot for my liking from the reviews I've read but I do prefer NVidia over ATI -I know that ATI is ascendant these days and I've had good ATI cards but for someone else NV still feels safer due to old prejudices- I love my GTX260 that I've had for years but what should I be looking at here?

For ram I wanted to fit 12GB just to do it but I've decided to not throw other people's money away and go with a more reasonable 6GB Corsair XMS3 set for $75 off the egg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820145258). Should get the jobs done no problem I think.

Budget is $1500 but I'm confident in coming in under while still buying parts that are way better than necessary.

Everything else is easy. Seasonic PSU that handles whatever GPU I choose, some case (letting them pick some they think look cool then will look up reviews) dvd drive and done.

Oh what level of Windows do people buy these days? I'm still running Vista 64 and never had problems with it so I'm clearly the wrong person to ask. I have no idea what the hell the difference between home/pro/ultimate 7-64bit are and hate Microsoft for even making me deal with that shit.

Budget is $1600 but I'm confident in coming under (don't need monitor so extra easy!) while still building a much beefier machine than they'll need. However this is clearly a wouldn't it be nice if they could use it for 6 years type rig so spending some extra cash on cpu/mobo isn't crazy despite the rumors of another quantum leap in the next year or so. Is it?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: veredus on January 17, 2011, 02:50:13 PM
For video cards I ended up going with this GTX460 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261076 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261076) not too long ago. It's actually pretty damn quiet and I ended up getting it for 189.99 plus free shipping. From all the research I did the 460 seems like one of the best bang for your buck cards out there.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on January 17, 2011, 03:08:37 PM
And why the hate on the marvell sata6? Even that board half the sata6 is marvell. It's not like there's even much sata6 out there yet, unless you're dropping big cash on one of the few ssds that support it.

Oh, I don't 'hate' anything. I just had heard that because its a separate chipset, instead of something directly connected to the P67 chipset, it isn't as fast, or takes more resources, or somesuch. I saw some benchmarks at some point on HardOCP and I vaguely remember Trippy talking about it a few pages back, or in another thread. Something to the effect that the marvel chipset takes up memory addresses otherwise used by the system for other things.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on January 17, 2011, 06:20:10 PM
Video card though is giving me fits. Adobe says they give extra special blowjob support to GTX285 and GTX470 which I don't take that seriously but is still annoying. The GTX400's run too damn loud and too damn hot for my liking from the reviews I've read but I do prefer NVidia over ATI -I know that ATI is ascendant these days and I've had good ATI cards but for someone else NV still feels safer due to old prejudices- I love my GTX260 that I've had for years but what should I be looking at here?

The GTX 460, single or SLI, is a hell of a card.  No, it's not hot, and it's not loud.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on January 18, 2011, 08:50:04 AM
I've been trying to sort out a i7 build for a friend who does freelance 2d art type stuff (product design/advertising stuff). They have been using a laptop with some shit Intel on-board video and its high time for a nice big upgrade so that all of the programs can be run at once with buttery smoothness. The laptop chugs just opening 600+ dpi files into photoshop I'm not sure how they can stand it.

I'm looking at the i7 options and it feels like a bit of a minefield considering the strange price spread on newegg. For mobo I was looking at Asus' Sabertooth x58 as the safe no brainer choice. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16813131665)

Video card though is giving me fits. Adobe says they give extra special blowjob support to GTX285 and GTX470 which I don't take that seriously but is still annoying. The GTX400's run too damn loud and too damn hot for my liking from the reviews I've read but I do prefer NVidia over ATI -I know that ATI is ascendant these days and I've had good ATI cards but for someone else NV still feels safer due to old prejudices- I love my GTX260 that I've had for years but what should I be looking at here?

For ram I wanted to fit 12GB just to do it but I've decided to not throw other people's money away and go with a more reasonable 6GB Corsair XMS3 set for $75 off the egg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820145258). Should get the jobs done no problem I think.

Budget is $1500 but I'm confident in coming in under while still buying parts that are way better than necessary.

Everything else is easy. Seasonic PSU that handles whatever GPU I choose, some case (letting them pick some they think look cool then will look up reviews) dvd drive and done.

Oh what level of Windows do people buy these days? I'm still running Vista 64 and never had problems with it so I'm clearly the wrong person to ask. I have no idea what the hell the difference between home/pro/ultimate 7-64bit are and hate Microsoft for even making me deal with that shit.

Budget is $1600 but I'm confident in coming under (don't need monitor so extra easy!) while still building a much beefier machine than they'll need. However this is clearly a wouldn't it be nice if they could use it for 6 years type rig so spending some extra cash on cpu/mobo isn't crazy despite the rumors of another quantum leap in the next year or so. Is it?

I'd suggest taking a look at the K-line Sandy Bridge processors on a good P67 board, since they apparently overclock easily and are a meaningful improvement over the other offerings available right now - comparisons between the 2500K and 2600K and the current $1K i7 procs have been tossed about by Anand (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4083/the-sandy-bridge-review-intel-core-i7-2600k-i5-2500k-core-i3-2100-tested/22) and others, with the general consensus being that the new models make it hard to justify a super high-end X58/1366 solution. 

Anand's Bench results between the ~$330 2600K and the $1K i7 980X. (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/287?vs=142)

If you're looking at bang for the buck in nVidia cards, the GTX460 is great.  Otherwise, the GTX570 is a solid card with significant improvements over the GTX470/480, particularly in power draw and noise (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4051/nvidias-geforce-gtx-570-filling-in-the-gaps/15) if you want something with more power than a 460. 

Beyond that, the GTX560 launches later this month (the 25th, I think), so you might want to wait and see what that looks like.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on January 18, 2011, 10:50:49 AM
The 560 looks to have great OC potential and huge SLI scaling, if you're into that. Very similiar to the 460 in that respect and probably around $225.

The K line Sandybridge do seem to be OCing quite well. 4.4 to 4.6 is almost a given, and 4.8 not uncommon. They do run well on air, but initial reports seem to indicate a good aftermarket cooler wouldn't be a bad idea. One core almost always seems to run hot. Those pushing into 5ghz territory are probably on thin ice. The only OCs I've seen in this region were well above the recommended voltage to the CPU. How SB stands up to being overvolted has yet to be seen, but according to Intel it's very risky business. All in all, the 2500k and 2600k appear to be the hot setup at a very reasonable cost.

I"m building my next box in about 5-6 months and I'll most likely be going 2500k. AMD might be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat with Bulldozer, but it looks late in the year--about when the new high end Intel chips will appear.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on January 18, 2011, 11:51:10 AM
Sandy Bridge, New SSDs, New Intel Cards just dropped. Guh, guess I should upgrade this year.

Anything else coming out this year that might be worth the wait?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on January 18, 2011, 12:22:57 PM
Sandy Bridge, New SSDs, New Intel Cards just dropped. Guh, guess I should upgrade this year.

Anything else coming out this year that might be worth the wait?

A high-end version of Sandy Bridge (higher wattages, 6-core procs, etc) is coming late this year on (wait for it...) yet another socket, according to that Anand article.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on January 18, 2011, 12:44:58 PM
/facepalm

Although I guess if its 6 core its probably triple channel which would explain the new socket. I thought that the whole triple channel with the early i7s had unmarketable results?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on January 18, 2011, 01:37:51 PM
So from the benchmarks I'm seeing it looks like i7 2600 > 950 especially for non gaming HT utilizing software. Switching the build to that isn't too hard except the motherboards for 1155 are all so new there doesn't seem to be a ton of consensus on what is reliable with good bios. I'm also stuck with ASUS having one of those annoying lineups where its hard as hell to tell what you are paying for are you move up their ladder. Annoying but thanks for pointing that out, I had written the sandy bridge stuff off as too new to be worth a serious look but it does seem like the superior option right now even though the price is surely going to stumble downwards over the course of 2011.

I see no reason to get the 2600K since the likelyhood of this user overclocking anything ever is nil but did I miss any other difference between the two that warrants the 10% price increase?

For dual channel ram in a 1155 setup thinking a 2x4GB Corsair XMS3 option.  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145315)

So far I've locked down:
PSU - (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151088) obvious choice is obvious. I know I could spend less or get by probably 450-500W but PSU money is almost never poorly spent in my experience. I could get the 560W version which has 46A on the 12 saving me $20 if I was scrounging...
GPU - (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130564) thanks to all for the votes of confidence in the 460, I had read so many bad 470 reviews awhile back I did not realize that the 460 was a different generation so to speak.
HD - (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136296) this is still a hold over while we wait for SSD to become better and cheaper. Will partition it into 75GB for OS and 75GB for anything else. User has a big external they barely dip into for storage.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on January 18, 2011, 02:02:31 PM
GPU - (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130564) thanks to all for the votes of confidence in the 460, I had read so many bad 470 reviews awhile back I did not realize that the 460 was a different generation so to speak.

If you're buying now (within the next day or so), NewEgg is selling an overclocked MSI 1GB GTX460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127551) for $170 with an additional $20 MiR and a download coupon for Just Cause 2 as an added bonus.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on January 18, 2011, 02:09:37 PM
Good looks but I love evga's warranty policy and was unable to find a review of that heatsink anywhere. MSI has two other cooler options that everyone talks about but I can't find anything on that particular setup. That evga card has been tested as quiet by multiple review sites I trust.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on January 18, 2011, 02:29:02 PM
I just noticed that you're looking at the 768MB version of the GTX460, which uses a 192-bit memory bus instead of the 256-bit bus of the 1GB version, and would suggest switching to one of the 1GB cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on February 03, 2011, 06:05:04 PM
Well I guess, this (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4142/intel-discovers-bug-in-6series-chipset-begins-recall) that puts a bit of a damper on my building a sandy bridge system for two months or so.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on February 03, 2011, 06:36:32 PM
Well I guess, this (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4142/intel-discovers-bug-in-6series-chipset-begins-recall) that puts a bit of a damper on my building a sandy bridge system for two months or so.

Heh - I just finished a P67 mATX build too.  That said, I don't have anything on the affected SATA ports, so I'm not too worried, but I'll be very interested to see what Asus will do - Gigabyte has already confirmed that they'll take the boards back and exchange them (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4146/gigabyte-announces-6series-motherboard-replacement-program) when the new board rev comes out - apparently Intel is footing the bill.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on February 03, 2011, 07:33:50 PM
You could also just put in a 6 Gbps SATA, clone it, and not worry about it, since it only affects the 3Gbps ports.

Quote
Interestingly enough the problem doesn’t affect ports 0 & 1 on the 6-series chipset. Remember that Intel has two 6Gbps ports and four 3Gbps ports on P67/H67, only the latter four are impacted by this problem.

That is, unless you got a motherboard with no 6 Gbps ports, for which you should be severely spanked anyway.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Severian on February 03, 2011, 09:52:00 PM
Heh - I just finished a P67 mATX build too.  That said, I don't have anything on the affected SATA ports, so I'm not too worried, but I'll be very interested to see what Asus will do

http://event.asus.com/2011/SandyBridge/notice/

I had been in the final stage of part selection for my first new PC in years (this thread was helpful), I waited for Sandy Bridge.
A couple more months, then.
Soldier on, brave P4 HT 3.4GHz!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 05, 2011, 02:15:52 AM
I've been planning on a new computer for a good 6 months or so, and now I finally have the available cash. Here's what I'm tentatively going with:

This Asus Mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131634) and the i5 760 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067) with this heatsink (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835106150). I saw some 1156 i7s, but wasn't sure if they were worth it, and I don't really want to spend the extra $250 going up to the 1366. Two of these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231303) for 8 gigs of RAM, a 2g GTX 460 video card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814187128), a 128g SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148348) for Windows/WoW and a 2 TB internal (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822145475) for everything else. A 750W PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006) to power it all, and a Blu-Ray burner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827118050) because well, why not?

I've still gotta pick out a case; is there any real difference between top and bottom mounted PSUs? It's been a while since I built a new system, so I'm not sure if it matters either way. I've also gotta pick up Windows 7; what's the cheapest I can get away with and still have a real 64 bit OS?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on February 05, 2011, 05:19:03 AM
Bottom mounted units tend to run cooler. If you don't mind spending money, you might want to look at the Silverstone FT02 case. Slick stuff, but probably not totally necessary with what you're building. Still, cool is good. They also have a large conveniance factor--for me--with your connectivity all on top. I was just fighting with my Coolermaster case this evening adding yet another USB gadget to the back. Damned nuisance with the way it sits between two desks.

Overall, pretty similar to what my plans are, but I need more vid power since the whole point of the next box is to move to 2560x1600 res. Since I'm still about five months out from dropping cash, I'm definately going Sandybridge.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on February 05, 2011, 10:06:34 AM
Get the W7 64bit system builders thing from newegg.  It's about 100 bucks.

As far as top or bottom mount PSU?  I prefer bottom.  Better heat isolation, less noise, and a more stable case.  The only issue I have with them is the 8 pin mobo connector usually has to run across the top of the mobo, over your graphics card and just looks cluttered.  I'm anal as hell about cable management.  You can buy an extender and run it behind the mobo, which is what I did.  I recently moved from an Antec 902 to a Corsair 600T, and could not be happier with it.  Quiet, cool, well layed out, and plenty of room.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 05, 2011, 10:24:45 AM
Ok, thanks guys.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on February 07, 2011, 10:15:17 AM
I've been planning on a new computer for a good 6 months or so, and now I finally have the available cash. Here's what I'm tentatively going with:

This Asus Mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131634) and the i5 760 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115067) with this heatsink (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835106150). I saw some 1156 i7s, but wasn't sure if they were worth it, and I don't really want to spend the extra $250 going up to the 1366. Two of these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231303) for 8 gigs of RAM, a 2g GTX 460 video card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814187128), a 128g SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148348) for Windows/WoW and a 2 TB internal (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822145475) for everything else. A 750W PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006) to power it all, and a Blu-Ray burner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827118050) because well, why not?

I've still gotta pick out a case; is there any real difference between top and bottom mounted PSUs? It's been a while since I built a new system, so I'm not sure if it matters either way. I've also gotta pick up Windows 7; what's the cheapest I can get away with and still have a real 64 bit OS?

This may be too late, but my 2 cents:

I'm partial to 2 4GB sticks, largely because it makes it easier to find the bad one if you have one crap out on you.  I used these (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231440) most recently.

I'm not sure how much of a performance boost the 460 gets from doubling the available memory, though what I've read seems to indicate that the benefit is pretty limited - I'd either save some cash and step back to a 1GB 460 with a good non-reference cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127518) so you can OC the crap out of it, or drop a bit more and get a 560 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127565).

Since you're not planning on going SLI later, that PSU is way overkill.  I'd recommend this one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207002) ($65 after rebate) - it's also Seasonic-built and single-rail like the one you're eyeing, but you won't have to hide a bunch of unused cables and will have plenty of power for any single-card machine you can build.  It's probably still overkill, but the rebate makes it a solid deal.

As for the case, without knowing what your priorities are, my default case recommendation is the Cooler Master 690 II Advanced (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119216).  It's not terribly spendy, has tons of room, good cooling and clean styling.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 07, 2011, 11:11:10 AM
Not too late, my taxes won't be here for another week or so. Thanks for the advice. I've always tried to fill all available memory slots on a mobo mostly out of habit, but using 2 4g chips is $20 cheaper so I switched. I also bumped up to the 560 card.

The PSU I linked was a combo deal with my hard drive, so it's $30 off ($10 now, $20 mail in); at that price it's only $5 more than the one you linked so I'm probably going to stick with it.

Edit: Do I need W7 Home Premium, or Professional?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on February 07, 2011, 11:20:33 AM
That Corsair PSU is the one I'm using at present. It's been a rock the past two years.

Personally, I went with the home premium edition W7. I don't have any particular use for the professional, but I do have some friends in IT and they do use it. Myself, being relatively clueless about such things, have found home fulfills my needs just fine.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on February 07, 2011, 11:28:02 AM
Only desirable feature I saw in professional was the remote desktop.  Premium has been fine for me. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: slog on February 07, 2011, 11:28:58 AM
Why would you buy a Lynnfield instead of a Sandy Bridge?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on February 07, 2011, 11:49:52 AM
The early SB mobos have a rather serious bug in their SATA controllers. Bad enough that Gigabyte and ASUS are recalling mobos. Sooo...some folks that have to build now might find Lynnfield a bit more friendly territory to frolic in. After all, there isn't THAT big of a difference between them.

But, yeah, if you can hold off a few months, then SB is definately the way to go.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: slog on February 07, 2011, 11:58:08 AM
The early SB mobos have a rather serious bug in their SATA controllers. Bad enough that Gigabyte and ASUS are recalling mobos. Sooo...some folks that have to build now might find Lynnfield a bit more friendly territory to frolic in. After all, there isn't THAT big of a difference between them.

But, yeah, if you can hold off a few months, then SB is definately the way to go.

I built a Sandy Bridge system 2 days before the recall :).  I have an ASUS mobo too.  No problems so far, and I'm just waiting out the recall.

Edit:  It's actually not even an issue for my MOBO, since I'm only using the 2 Marvel controller ports for 6 Gbps for my Hard Drives.  I suppose if I wanted to put more than 4 drives in then it could be a pain.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 07, 2011, 10:45:43 PM
Yea I had heard bad reviews about SB so just said fuck it; I've wanted a new system for a while (mostly because Rift runs like ass on mine) and don't feel like waiting for shit to be fixed.

Home Premium it is, thanks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rendakor on February 12, 2011, 12:18:08 AM
Taxes just got here, probably going to order everything tomorrow. Is newegg still the lowest price around, or are there other sites I should check for deals?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on February 12, 2011, 01:39:10 AM
Newegg is baseline for a start. You might find somewhat better deals with some serious looking around, but they probably won't be all that much better than the 'egg.

Check Amazon, too. You can find some surprisingly good deals there on computer parts.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: jakonovski on February 12, 2011, 01:26:02 PM
Any quiet computing enthusiasts here? I ordered a entire new cooler (Nexus FLC 3000 R2) for my computer after getting fed up with the stock AMD jet engine, and now I'm eyeing at the SO's computer too. Hers is not too loud but I want to move the components to a HTPC case and replace anything that makes a noise with something quiet. However, I don't really know how feasible that is.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on February 12, 2011, 03:49:05 PM
http://www.silentpcreview.com/


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on February 13, 2011, 08:18:43 AM
Taxes just got here, probably going to order everything tomorrow. Is newegg still the lowest price around, or are there other sites I should check for deals?

I just use Newegg unless there's some crazy deals on something I want/need at Amazon.  The convenience and service are still pretty tough to beat, even if you can save a couple of bucks at another retailer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: jakonovski on February 14, 2011, 12:49:41 PM
My cooler arrived, I installed it and...oh my god, I can't believe I've lived all my life with stock coolers. It's absolutely quiet, only the GPU fan can be heard.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on February 27, 2011, 03:48:03 PM
My cooler arrived, I installed it and...oh my god, I can't believe I've lived all my life with stock coolers. It's absolutely quiet, only the GPU fan can be heard.


I just put on a new case fan after about 3 years.  I hadn't noticed how loud it had gotten and I had been just tuning it out.  It's like a graveyard in here now.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 11, 2011, 08:15:09 PM
Inspired by PAX East, I'd like a new case, something that can manage airflow better. My computer runs a bit hot, and only way I can keep it from overheating is a floor fan next to an open side. Done everything I could, but there's just too many things in the way.

Here's my current setup:

CORSAIR CMPSU-650TX 650W ATX12V / EPS12V
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 (2.83 GHz/12M Cache/1333 MHz FSB)
Asus P5N-T Deluxe, 780i 3-way SLI (Socket 775)
Corsair XMS2 Xtreme 1024mb RAM (3gb since I'm only on WinXP SP3)
nVidia GTX 260 1gb RAM

My case is Case: NZXT Trinity ATX Mid-Tower Case. I've been eyeing an Antec Nine Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129021) or COOLER MASTER Storm Scout SGC-2000-KKN1-GP Black Steel (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119196). Both are mid-size towers too but the disposition of elements look like they could improve airflow.

It's this or I feel like i should go liquid cooling.

Also, worth going to Win7 to get more RAM? I don't feel like I'm missing anything TBH. I run pretty lean out of long habit, so not like I need to run high res Photoshop stuff while rendering some videos while playing Black Ops or whatever.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on March 11, 2011, 08:41:14 PM
What heatsink and fan(s) do you have on your CPU?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on March 11, 2011, 10:52:10 PM
The king of cool case-wise is (IMO) the Silverstone FT02. This is a large, pricey case, but when it comes to airflow it's the shiz-nite. Positive pressure case with fans drawing in at the base and blowing air out the top past the 90 degree rotated mobo. Very slick and very effective. Also, very expensive, but hey, it's only money. You'll make more.   :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 12, 2011, 06:10:09 PM
Wow, that is a nice case. Not sure I want to go $250 though as I also want to buy Win7 64bit and we just splurged on two new Verizon iPhones.

What heatsink and fan(s) do you have on your CPU?
Intel E21984 Socket 775 Copper Core/Aluminum Heat Sink (http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=E21984-001&cat=FAN), with two 80mm blowing in (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811999120) and one 120mm blowing out (http://www.sunbeamtech.com/PRODUCTS/wed/Silent_Core_Fan.HTML). The whole side of the case is open, but I've positioned both 80mm to blow across the CPU fan, with the grill in the back and the 120mm serving as exhaust. It's a retarded setup, but I've been so busy I hadn't really taxed it until Black Ops, and then again on Rift. Generally gets to about 88-92deg F under load. I set the alarm to go off at 98deg F, which I'd hit after about an hour of Black Ops.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 12, 2011, 10:00:09 PM
Hey guys, I need a cheap ass laptop.  I'm thinking of going with this: 
http://www.staples.com/Toshiba-Satellite-C655D-S5120-15.6-Laptop/product_915581?cmArea=FEATURED:SC3:CG71:DP4118

That is pretty much the ceiling of my budget and doesn't seem too crap.  I'd love for there to be something better out there though, if anyone knows of something.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on March 12, 2011, 10:42:49 PM
Hey guys, I need a cheap ass laptop.  I'm thinking of going with this: 
http://www.staples.com/Toshiba-Satellite-C655D-S5120-15.6-Laptop/product_915581?cmArea=FEATURED:SC3:CG71:DP4118

That is pretty much the ceiling of my budget and doesn't seem too crap.  I'd love for there to be something better out there though, if anyone knows of something.

I've worked on a few of these machines and I have to say the build quality is crap. Also; don't buy retail computers.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834146765&Tpk=Lenovo%20G555

If you can catch this thing on sale, go for this. I use this as my work machine and it's fantastic. Got it for 379.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on March 12, 2011, 10:46:21 PM
Inspired by PAX East, I'd like a new case, something that can manage airflow better. My computer runs a bit hot, and only way I can keep it from overheating is a floor fan next to an open side. Done everything I could, but there's just too many things in the way.

Here's my current setup:

CORSAIR CMPSU-650TX 650W ATX12V / EPS12V
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 (2.83 GHz/12M Cache/1333 MHz FSB)
Asus P5N-T Deluxe, 780i 3-way SLI (Socket 775)
Corsair XMS2 Xtreme 1024mb RAM (3gb since I'm only on WinXP SP3)
nVidia GTX 260 1gb RAM

My case is Case: NZXT Trinity ATX Mid-Tower Case. I've been eyeing an Antec Nine Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129021) or COOLER MASTER Storm Scout SGC-2000-KKN1-GP Black Steel (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119196). Both are mid-size towers too but the disposition of elements look like they could improve airflow.

It's this or I feel like i should go liquid cooling.

Also, worth going to Win7 to get more RAM? I don't feel like I'm missing anything TBH. I run pretty lean out of long habit, so not like I need to run high res Photoshop stuff while rendering some videos while playing Black Ops or whatever.

As Trippy is alluding to, I'd look into replacing the CPU heatsink first - the Cooler Master Hyper 212 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) is a cheap, effective upgrade from the stock cooler.  I also like the Xigmatek Dark Knight (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233029) and SD1283 Gaia (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082), since they're functionally identical, though the fan on the Gaia isn't as nice as the other two.

I'm using the CM Storm Scout to house my primary gaming desktop, and it's a great case as far as traditional air cooling goes - it doesn't hurt that it has the room to clear the largest of tower-type CPU coolers.  The biggest drawback to the Scout is the lack of any sort of concession to acoustics, but I'm not a silent PC type.  It could also use some holes near the front edge of the motherboard for cable management, but even without them it's a very nice case to build in.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 12, 2011, 10:51:42 PM
Hey guys, I need a cheap ass laptop.  I'm thinking of going with this: 
http://www.staples.com/Toshiba-Satellite-C655D-S5120-15.6-Laptop/product_915581?cmArea=FEATURED:SC3:CG71:DP4118

That is pretty much the ceiling of my budget and doesn't seem too crap.  I'd love for there to be something better out there though, if anyone knows of something.

I've worked on a few of these machines and I have to say the build quality is crap. Also; don't buy retail computers.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834146765&Tpk=Lenovo%20G555

If you can catch this thing on sale, go for this. I use this as my work machine and it's fantastic. Got it for 379.

Oh hell, I know I could do a lot better if I had the time to wait for the right sale.  Problem is I need to do something in at most 2 weeks...  preferably sooner...

I build my own desktops, wasn't aware there was a distinction in notebooks other than brand name tho.  Toshiba not so much?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on March 12, 2011, 11:43:15 PM
Hey guys, I need a cheap ass laptop.  I'm thinking of going with this: 
http://www.staples.com/Toshiba-Satellite-C655D-S5120-15.6-Laptop/product_915581?cmArea=FEATURED:SC3:CG71:DP4118

That is pretty much the ceiling of my budget and doesn't seem too crap.  I'd love for there to be something better out there though, if anyone knows of something.

I've worked on a few of these machines and I have to say the build quality is crap. Also; don't buy retail computers.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834146765&Tpk=Lenovo%20G555

If you can catch this thing on sale, go for this. I use this as my work machine and it's fantastic. Got it for 379.

Oh hell, I know I could do a lot better if I had the time to wait for the right sale.  Problem is I need to do something in at most 2 weeks...  preferably sooner...

I build my own desktops, wasn't aware there was a distinction in notebooks other than brand name tho.  Toshiba not so much?

Toshiba usually has an excellent build quality, but that particular machine felt flimsy and poorly made.

Just look around a little more, and if you do buy retail; remember a few golden rules

1 - Go in knowing what you need.
2 - Refuse the service plan unless you think you really need the accidental, in which case make sure you get the ACCIDENTAL coverage. Also, read the terms and ignore what the salesman has to say.
3 - Ask to see the laptop before you "decide" on anything, as a lot of stores like lying about inventory if you dont buy "attachments".


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 13, 2011, 10:54:30 AM
Amen to everything Mr. Noisy said re: Darniaq's issue. I bet you can drop the CPU temp by 20 degrees just going from stock to any one of those three cooling sinks Mr. Noisy mentions.

Grebo, I think you could get that Lenovo in a few days from New Egg. Just spend a bit more on shipping. You should still have plenty of time. Nightblade is right, retail laptops are awful awful awful, with the possible exception of Sony, but that's another topic.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 13, 2011, 12:35:15 PM
http://www.costcentral.com/proddetail/Lenovo_G555_0873_Athlon_II_M320_21_GHz/087325U/11085304/froogle/

Well, I found that there which I suppose I could do... but I'm still a bit confused about why it's not a "retail laptop".  There is some channel of laptops that are built for the drooling masses and another channel for people who care about things that matter?  How can I tell the difference?



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on March 13, 2011, 12:42:03 PM
Anything that is sold at Best Buy for all intents and purposes is poo.

The computer makers have to cut a lot of corners to keep a decent margin on these machines to keep them in the price range the retailers sell them for.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 13, 2011, 01:04:42 PM
Ah, that makes sense.

Sorry to crap up this thread with all my hand wringing but I'm basically broke, and with my family situation being what it is, I'm going to be broke for years.  Whatever I get I'm stuck with for quite a while...

What about this?:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834157516

It's a recert but i couldn't possibly care less if the case has some scratches.  Great specs tho for the money.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 13, 2011, 07:13:26 PM
As Trippy is alluding to, I'd look into replacing the CPU heatsink first - the Cooler Master Hyper 212 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) is a cheap, effective upgrade from the stock cooler.  I also like the Xigmatek Dark Knight (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233029) and SD1283 Gaia (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082), since they're functionally identical, though the fan on the Gaia isn't as nice as the other two.

I'm using the CM Storm Scout to house my primary gaming desktop, and it's a great case as far as traditional air cooling goes - it doesn't hurt that it has the room to clear the largest of tower-type CPU coolers.  The biggest drawback to the Scout is the lack of any sort of concession to acoustics, but I'm not a silent PC type.  It could also use some holes near the front edge of the motherboard for cable management, but even without them it's a very nice case to build in.

Cool thanks. I'll check out both the CPU fan and case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on March 14, 2011, 09:36:45 AM
Inspired by PAX East, I'd like a new case, something that can manage airflow better. My computer runs a bit hot, and only way I can keep it from overheating is a floor fan next to an open side. Done everything I could, but there's just too many things in the way.
You could try the externally-exhausted gtx 460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130568). It's really lowered case temps for me, though it's a bit loud when it cranks up to 80% or higher. Luckily, it rarely needs to do that. Huge difference from the internally-vented 8800gtx, like double digit reductions in case temps.

I hope they can get a higher quality fan in the next designs, but the concept is really the best way to go aside from maybe liquid cooling (which has its own issues). It makes no sense to vent the hottest air into the case and then try to cool that case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on March 14, 2011, 10:29:54 AM
The whole side of the case is open, but I've positioned both 80mm to blow across the CPU fan, with the grill in the back and the 120mm serving as exhaust. It's a retarded setup, but I've been so busy I hadn't really taxed it until Black Ops, and then again on Rift. Generally gets to about 88-92deg F under load. I set the alarm to go off at 98deg F, which I'd hit after about an hour of Black Ops.
I missed this the first time.  Your CPU or your case is reaching 100°F?  If it's the CPU then you're well under okay temperatures.  Mine's around 103°F (depending upon core and BIOS revision) at idle with a nice tower cooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 14, 2011, 10:42:22 AM
Oops, missed the F. 98 degrees F for a quad core is actually quite good. That CPU in particular is rated to go up to 160 F (71C TCase). (http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?spec=SLB8V)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 14, 2011, 07:23:20 PM
I missed this the first time.  Your CPU or your case is reaching 100°F?  If it's the CPU then you're well under okay temperatures.  Mine's around 103°F (depending upon core and BIOS revision) at idle with a nice tower cooler.
Oops, missed the F. 98 degrees F for a quad core is actually quite good. That CPU in particular is rated to go up to 160 F (71C TCase). (http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?spec=SLB8V)
Ok, I just realized I screwed something up. I thought RealTemp was telling me deg F, but it's actually Celcius. So my normal range is low-40sdeg C for CPUs Temp and low 40deg C for GPU Temp. Under load that goes to mid-80s CPU and mid-60s GPU.

I remember back about 18 months ago I had a similar problem. Someone thought it might be something with the thermal paste. I figure if I'm gonna get a new heatsink anyway, I'll take a look at that point.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on March 14, 2011, 07:49:15 PM
Nothing particularly wrong with that GPU temp under load from my experiences.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on March 14, 2011, 09:04:56 PM
Yeah, the GPU is okay, but the CPU should be a lot cooler.  So a new heat sink and/or checking the thermal paste is in order.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 15, 2011, 11:14:33 AM
Ya, sound like even under stock cooling, which is normally pretty bad for Intel CPUs of that generation, that temp's way too high. Thermal paste gets old, sometimes CPU coolers detach, especially the Intel push-pin stock coolers.

I know its a royal pain in the arse, but for the love of god and money, get a cooler that requires a back plate attachment. I used to 'make due' with a push pin for my Xigmatech, but it never quite cooled well. One weekend about a year ago, I got sick and tired of worrying, and just removed the motherboard and attached the backplate. Ever since then, my C2D 6750 idles in the high 20s C and only goes up to the low 50s C under continual load.

Your GPU temps are actually quite good, so you know its just your CPU heatsink that's not doing its job.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 15, 2011, 10:11:53 PM
Fantastic, thanks all. Very helpful. And yea, I figured this would be while moving to a new case, so a backplate would be in the cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on March 16, 2011, 08:16:54 AM
Good, good.  Push-pins are Evil.

Also, welcome back!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on March 16, 2011, 12:10:25 PM
Good, good.  Push-pins are Evil.

They carved out a new bolgia just for the guys who made them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 16, 2011, 07:17:10 PM
Good, good.  Push-pins are Evil.

Also, welcome back!

Thanks! :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 20, 2011, 09:43:12 AM
Went with the Antec Nine Hundred Two (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129097&cm_re=antec_nine_hundred_black-_-11-129-097-_-Product) and Corsair H5O liquid cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181010&cm_re=h50-_-35-181-010-_-Product). The latter was overkill, but I wanted to be sure.  Fringe benefit I didn't expect: way very quiet. Have four 120mm fans and a big 200mm on top, and it's quieter than our Wii.

Temperature certainly was solved. Under almost full load in Dragon Age 2 it's barely hitting what my idle temperature used to be.

Unfortunately i got a BSOD in Rift about 10 minutes in and a hard lock in DA2 about 10 minutes in. This being the first time I've ever transferred all components to a new case and added a cooling system, I expect I screwed something up.

- I've  got 3gb of RAM, two Corsair CM2X1024-6400C4 in the first two bays and a CM2X1024-6400 in bay four. According to CPU-Z, looks like I'm running at default (DRAM Freq is 400MHz, FSB:RAM is 5:6, 5CL, 5tRCD, 5tRP, 18tRAS, 22tRC and CR = 2T)
- Have reset Bios to factory (Rev 1201). Vcore voltage is 1.29v, 3.3v is 3.31v, 5v is 4.83v and 12v is 11.90v. These LOOK like they're in acceptable ranges, but I'm really not sure.
- Have run BurnInTest a number if times using different combinations of components under full load. All tests pass.
- Memtest86+ showed a lot of failures in test 5, which I understand from the nets that it could be memory controller or voltage? Is there any way to tell exactly which stick is causing the error, or is it trial and error (take one out, go full load, take another out, etc)? Also, it took over 8 hours to run through Test #8. That normal?
- CClean'd of course (do this pretty much weekly)

Running Defraggler at the moment but it's gonna take awhile.

Under light load the computer runs fine. It's been on for 20 hours. Quiet as heck and even on BurnIn

 I think I either screwed up something or a RAM stick went bad. I'm leaning on screwed-up because while the various plugs from the PSU looked like they only had one logical place to go based on what I was following from the Asus MB site, I could see myself putting too many things on one rail, or something like that. Plus, it'd be*real* coincidental for one stick to burn out right now (unless it was always bad but i was overheating before those areas of that stick were being accessed?)

Thoughts? 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on March 20, 2011, 10:22:34 AM
Isolating the sticks and putting a load on them always works for me.

As far as the transfer, were you using best practices, ie wrist strap and anti-static measures? If not, that could be the culprit. To be honest, I don't use a wrist strap. I've just been lucky (I do always make sure to ground myself before touching components, though).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on March 20, 2011, 11:08:59 AM
Before you get too drastic, have you tried just reseating the RAM?  Since you just switched cases, it's likely they wiggled loose a bit.  Push on any power connectors, too, to make sure.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 20, 2011, 11:25:37 AM
To answer the earlier question as to whether its 'normal' to have to wait till test 8 on memtest86, its not 'normal', but its not unheard of. Unfortunately, I think Sky is right. Isolate each memory stick and run the test.

Another possibility is that its a specific bank or even a particular memory slot that's bad, not the memory itself. I had this issue with my old 989 socket ASUS board back in the day. If you can remember which slot it was that gave you errors, try rotating your sticks through that slot and see if there's a difference.

Another memory tester on UBCD is the Windows Memory tester. In some instances I have found it to be faster at finding errors.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 20, 2011, 01:42:32 PM
Thanks. I'll try each stick. How can I can tell which bank it was? In Memtest the errors came up when the testing range was 2048M-3071M. I assume that's the third stick, but how can I tell which bank it is? My board is an ASUS P5N-T and I have 1gb sticks in DIMM bays A1, A2, and B2 (with B1 empty). But in looking at the manual (http://tirpitz.iat.sfu.ca/wiki/images/c/c7/P5N-T_Deluxe_manual_E3506.pdf) again, I'm thinking maybe 3Gb is just unstable altogether on this MB, since on page 39 diagramming RAM configs, there isn't one for 3GB.

I tried 4Gb prior but that kept crashing. I'm sticking with WinXP until I absolutely need the 4gb+ of RAM though, so I'm wondering if maybe I just need to stick with 2gb on this board until I go Win7 64bit.

I was being as careful as I could be on this, being my first time and all. And I'm hoping it's just RAM.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 20, 2011, 02:06:39 PM
The memory range does suggest its the 3rd stick or the 3rd slot. It may be that the board isn't handling 3 sticks when its best used when you have pairs. As a test, take out the A slot pair and leave the one stick in the single B slot, then run the test again. If it doesn't give memory errors, that suggests that the problem is having a pair and a single rather than a broken memory stick.

Also, remember that when you use 3 sticks in a dual channel board, you're losing the dual channel functionality of the board, and your speed is suffering, even if you have more memory.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on March 20, 2011, 02:30:25 PM
The memory range does suggest its the 3rd stick or the 3rd slot. It may be that the board isn't handling 3 sticks when its best used when you have pairs. As a test, take out the A slot pair and leave the one stick in the single B slot, then run the test again. If it doesn't give memory errors, that suggests that the problem is having a pair and a single rather than a broken memory stick.

Also, remember that when you use 3 sticks in a dual channel board, you're losing the dual channel functionality of the board, and your speed is suffering, even if you have more memory.

I'd place money on this being the issue, which would likely be solved by just installing the two matched sticks in the 2-stick configuration (A1+B1).  It may be worth looking into a mate for the third stick, since memory is pretty cheap right now (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145153).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 20, 2011, 02:44:24 PM
Cool thanks. Looks like a bad RAM stick. Does mean I'm down to 2gb for now, but I was mostly holding myself back by sticking with XP anyway. Guess it's time to bite the bullet for an upgrade. Even if I put 4gb in there, XP will only recognize 3. And the manual does recommend sticking with under 3gb if I'm using a 32bit OS anyway.

Which is funny because for a year I've had it set up like this, but with no time to game, I haven't pushed the limit enough. And then when i did it was the heat I was more worried about. Glad it happened this way, that old case sucked, was loud, and ive always wanted an excuse to get a new one anyway :)

I've heard conflicting things, so want to confirm: can I buy a Win7 upgrade to go from XP 32 to Win7 64 of some form? Or is it a new purchase altogether?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on March 20, 2011, 03:08:49 PM
I would think there would be no restriction on upgrading XP 32 to Win7 64 as the 64 bit version of XP was almost never installed on, well, anything.

(That is assuming you can still upgrade XP-7 directly, which I am fairly certain you can).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 20, 2011, 04:53:03 PM
Don't be confused by the term 'upgrade'. It will require a fresh reinstall either way. Go with 64 bit.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Venkman on March 20, 2011, 04:55:46 PM
Thanks guys. I was only thinking price. I don't install OSes unless it also includes a complete drive wipe :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on March 25, 2011, 09:52:54 PM
Hey folks, my monitor appears to have finally kicked it. What do you think of this as a quick replacement?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824176141


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on March 26, 2011, 12:11:56 AM
Good monitor, but go big or go home: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824176177


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on March 26, 2011, 01:12:26 AM
Hey folks, my monitor appears to have finally kicked it. What do you think of this as a quick replacement?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824176141

Its hard to say without seeing it. All the stats in the world won't account for the way it actually looks. That said, its probably pretty good. The expensive IPS monitor Shrike points out is probably great for movies and photo, but may not be that much better for gaming.

On the whole, however, I'm always a big advocate of spending as much on a monitor as you would for most of your system; after all, the monitor is what you're actually engaged with. I shake my head in wonder at folks that get multi-thousand dollar gaming rigs, then get some TN monitor for 200 bucks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on March 26, 2011, 03:05:44 AM
More seriously, the 24" HP is actually a pretty good monitor. Another worth looking at is the Dell U2411. IPS monitors are just going to cost a bit more, but they're generally worth it if you value picture quality.

I still maintain if you have the video horsepower you should go big--and that means 2560x1440 or 1600. The HP mentioned above, the Dell U2711, or the Dell 3011 (though I consider the HP superior--the Dell has a rep for color issues. The HP is wide gamut, though, and no OCD). Money spent on good monitors is never wasted. Also, if you roll Cupertino, the Apple 27" Cinema Display is pretty impressive, assuming you can get past the weirdo ergonomics and reliance on display port.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on March 26, 2011, 08:21:44 AM
I've got $300 I can spend. If I wanted to get a big, expensive monitor, that would mean no home computer until my tax return gets here. That would drive me insane.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on March 26, 2011, 09:00:30 AM

This one might cure what ails you:

http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=bsd&cs=04&sku=320-9270&~ck=baynoteSearch&baynote_bnrank=5&baynote_irrank=0

If one were to go multi-monitor for nVidia 3D surround or some such, it'd be high on one's list. It's about as cheap as it gets for a good IPS monitor. The only downside is it's 1920x1080, rather than 1920x1200, but the latter are getting damned hard to find and generally aren't as cheap.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on April 12, 2011, 06:27:38 PM
The tax return will be coming in the next few weeks. I'm starting to shop for a video card upgrade, which will almost certainly necessitate a PSU upgrade. My old card (Visiontek 512MB Radeon HD 4870) still works perfectly well, and can run modern games with little or no difficulty. But it is three years old, and on the advice of those here I undershot with a plan to upgrade in the computer's middle age.

What I want is something at the high end of "middle of the road" - good quality without paying through the nose for imperceptible (to me) improvements. DX11, 1GB of memory, and good heat management - the only thing I can really complain about the Visiontek is that it runs in the high 70s to low 80s, which seems high. I have no intention of using multiple monitors or Crossfire cards. Right now I'm looking at the Radeon HD 6850s, which have decent performance and cost under $200.

Most of these cards use PCIe 2.1. My motherboard is PCIe 2.0. The internet says the two should be compatible, but I wanted to ask here to be sure. Partly because I trust F13 internet people more than general internet people, partly because you'd note any caveats or gotchas others might gloss over.

As a first pass I'm looking at these: http://tinyurl.com/5uxbd3k

How am I doing so far? I'm not married to the 6850, so feel free to suggest a different type of Radeon. I'm not willing to shell out more than $300 or so. I want something good and reliable that will last a few years, not something bleeding edge (and likely incompatible with my current machine).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on April 13, 2011, 12:45:59 AM
New cards are backwards compatible, my mobo is over 4 yrs old. I really like my gtx 460, though the eventual plan is to SLI them in the computer I can't afford to build. Went in to replace an 8800gtx that was still a nice card (that died).

Despite the older bus tech and old cpu (c2d e6600), a few games can still make use of the whole gpu (divinity 2 pegs it). It does venture into low 90s territory on temps, though, despite being externally exhausted (which does mean it's not overly heating the rest of the innards of the pc, though!).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on April 13, 2011, 05:04:01 AM
Since you're already in the red camp, I'd look at the Radeon 6950. They're running about $280 for the 2gig model. This is a strong card. They can--generally--be flashed to 6970 specs, but rumor was AMD was going to correct that in later iterations of the card. I'm a bit out of the loop on this, so not sure where the 6900 series stands at the moment in that regard. There's also a 1gig model of this card floating around. If you're not pushing high resolutions and lots of AA, it might be worth a look, since it's a bit cheaper (knock off about $30).

If you want to cut down on cost even more, the 6870 is another good choice, weighing in at about $200. This card is much stronger than the 6850, which to my mind is a bit lackluster, considering there's only about 30-40 bucks difference in price. I think the 6870 is the real sweet spot if you're not pushing outrageous resolutions.

I'm not aware of any issues with this generation of cards and PCIe 2.0.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 13, 2011, 09:08:57 AM
I really like Shrike's suggestions.  Either a 6870 or 6950 would be good, depending on how much you want to spend.  I also like the GTX560ti, and have them installed in two different PCs currently - at 1080p, I've yet to find the game I can't run with everything cranked.  The 6950 2GB would definitely be a better fit if you run higher resolutions, though.

As for temp concerns, I like the 2-3 fan non-reference coolers (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131393), since they tend to outperform the blower-box style solutions by a fair amount in terms of heat.  The downside is that they're generally dependent on an 'enthusiast'-type case with good airflow to avoid slow-roasting the rest of your PC in the process.

You mention possibly needing a new PSU to power the new card - what are you using now?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ironwood on April 17, 2011, 05:38:44 AM
What's good in laptop land these days ?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 17, 2011, 10:24:11 AM
insufficient parameters for valid computation <beeep, bloop, bleng-di-bleng>


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: jakonovski on April 17, 2011, 10:35:52 AM
What's good in laptop land these days ?

iPads.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 17, 2011, 11:38:03 AM
What's good in laptop land these days ?

iPads.

 :facepalm:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: jakonovski on April 17, 2011, 11:46:01 AM


:why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on April 17, 2011, 12:25:16 PM
Hah. Laptops. Hehe. That's a good one.

Ummm, what's good is small, light, and can do whatever work needs to be done within the most comfortable manner possible given their other restrictions. For gaming? Not so much...  :awesome_for_real:

I've got some friends that use laptops for gaming, and it's just pathetic. So-called gaming laptops cost too much (3-4x than comparable desktops), weigh too much (not very portable), and use so much power than their batteries are essentially UPSs--which goes back to not very portable. For what high end laptops cost, you can build a hellacious desktop and have money left over for a couple of business laptops (or one and a balls-to-the-wall monitor) for work. And maybe a touch of retro-gaming on the road. The kind of thing a portable console can do (hinthint).

Yep, laptops.  :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ironwood on April 17, 2011, 12:26:30 PM
Sorry, I don't wanna game on it.  I just wanna do some browsing and some writing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on April 17, 2011, 12:44:15 PM
Macbook Air. The one with the SSDs. Yeah, it's Apple, but they do this stuff right. Mostly. At the moment.   

Basically, what galls me about laptops are the shitty monitors. My goal would be to find something with a good (really good) display.  Apple usually use pretty good displays. Dell had a few good ones, but availability comes and goes. I think HP had one model with a really good display, but it didn't last long.  For anything short of gaming, the other specs almost don't matter, except for disk read/write speeds. So the bottom line is SSDs for speed, and a good display. 

I suppose the keyboard is an issue as well. Most suck. Lenovo was good on this, but they could get pretty expensive (like Macbooks). I'm more agnostic on keyboards; they have to be REALLY bad to bother me, but displays are there out in front of God and everyone and shitty ones just aren't worth putting up with.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 17, 2011, 12:54:03 PM
At work, doing computer support for faculty, I see mostly Dells, with the occasional lenovo thinkpad or budget compaq picked up by an impulsive professor during his latest trip to costco. They all seem about the same, with some exceptions. Fujitsu has bit me in the arse lately, as its clear they have poor QA from some obvious problems with some of their tablet laptops. As a rule of thumb, stay away from 'bleeding edge' anything if you want it to 'just work'. Fingerprint readers, face recognition software, hybrid graphics, anything touted as ONLY available for this brand means that in 5 years there will be no driver support for a Windows OS upgrade.

Depending on your expertise, I would not buy one with an SSD, just buy an SSD separately and then do a disk-to-disk image using a USB external enclosure or somesuch.

Stay away from Sony because their builds make things very troublesome to do any maintenance yourself (switching HDs, memory, etc). They are slick and all that, but they are designed for people with lots of disposable income that repurchase a laptop every other year.

Finally, if you can actually get your hands on the prospective purchase, type on it for a bit. The ergonomics of it are 90% of its value to you.

RE: Shrike's kvetching about monitors, this is almost universally true, with the exception of MacBook Pros. They are all cheap ass TNs, even the MacBook Airs. If you want good quality, you are pretty much confined to Apple MacBook Pros and a few Lenovos (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4211/lenovo-announces-thinkpad-x220-series-12-ips-with-sandy-bridge)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on April 17, 2011, 02:21:19 PM
I was looking for a number-crunching laptop (science, I tried explaining that I could just build Quad-CPU Xenons server and set it up for remote access, but it has to be laptop *sigh*) for my SO and could not understand why SSD are so expensive option. I could buy SSD *much* cheaper and install it myself. Is there a reason, other than greed, they are such expensive option? Would typical laptop even support 6MB/s to really make that SSD work? What about battery life, is it significant improvement?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on April 17, 2011, 02:38:35 PM
Lots of limits with the Air. If you like OSX (and if it's not for gaming, you should!), the MacBook Pros are really sweet machines. We bought a laptop a little while ago and that's what we wanted, but they are spendy. Protip - always buy minimal RAM in an Apple machine and upgrade it yourself.

We ended up with a Dell Outlet (plus 20% coupon thanks to f13!) Dell Studio 1558 (http://www.dell.com/us/p/studio-1558/pd) refurb with an i5, 4GB and lit keyboard for $700. My only gripe is that it's not an Apple touchpad and no numeric pad. Other than that it's a phenomenal little work laptop, been doing my coursework on it and frankly, just about everything but gaming has moved on to it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 17, 2011, 03:50:09 PM
Is there a reason, other than greed, they are such expensive option?

No, not really. The number of people willing to switch out the SSD, find a way to clone it so that they don't have to re-buy the OS, etc, are small.

Would typical laptop even support 6MB/s to really make that SSD work? What about battery life, is it significant improvement?

6MB/s isn't really there yet in SSDs. There are some coming out, but I do not know any that are being put in laptops. Only recently have motherboards started supporting 6 MB/s sata ports that aren't an added chipset. No real sense as to how those perform, but I'm sure you can dig up a motherboard review on this particular aspect on either anandtech or bit-tech

That said, you don't need SSD for number crunching speed, just for data retrieval and writing speeds. If you have a loaded model in memory already, and the CPU just has to go through cycles, a faster HD isn't gonna help. If you are dead serious about a number cruncher, you could look at the Dell Precision line (http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/precision-laptop-deals) of laptops.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on April 17, 2011, 08:07:11 PM
It might be worth noting that SSD's are probably significantly more impact resistant.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Quinton on April 18, 2011, 07:50:28 AM
Yup, besides being faster than the typical 2.5" HDD in laptops, they are far far less likely to be destroyed if I drop my laptop.  Also quieter and lower power.

Laptop-wise, if gaming is not a concern, Thinkpad X series all the way.  I've been using 'em for years.  I run Linux (which runs well on Thinkpads) and do embedded systems development, so the lack of a nice GPU is not a showstopper.  I find the X200/201 is a nice compromise between size, weight, and compute.  Portable is also important to me in a laptop (hauling it around for business travel, etc), so something that weighs 3-3.5 lbs and is still reasonably snappy is a plus.

They're *finally* adding display port in the upcoming X220, which has been my major complaint with these machines apart from the GPU.  I rarely use an external display (portable being my interest), but when I do, I want a better option than VGA.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: lac on April 18, 2011, 08:33:20 AM
Any point in waiting for, or buying, the latest generation of SSD's when you are stuck with a 3 gb SATA controller anyway?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 18, 2011, 09:32:20 AM
The latest intel SSD has very good benchmarks despite it being only sata2. Its not all quite as clear cut as just the 3 vs 6 MB/s bandwidth. If you are holding off simply because your motherboard has only sata2, then I'd get a sata3 SSD, since they are backward compatible. That way you can use it in your new sata3 motherboard down the line.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nebu on April 18, 2011, 09:56:01 AM
Quick question: Where's the current bang-for-your-buck point with video cards?  ATI or NVidia?  How much memory?

I need to upgrade.  I currently have an Nvidia 9600GT.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 18, 2011, 10:11:20 AM
Quick question: Where's the current bang-for-your-buck point with video cards?  ATI or NVidia?  How much memory?

I need to upgrade.  I currently have an Nvidia 9600GT.

$200:  GTX460 1GB (avoid the GTX460 SE) or HD6850
$240-250:  GTX560ti 1GB or HD6950 1GB
$270-290:  HD6950 2GB

The GTX460 1GB is still probably the best in terms of performance/$$, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nebu on April 18, 2011, 10:12:42 AM
The GTX460 1GB is still probably the best in terms of performance/$$, though.

Thank you!  Next stop, Newegg.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 18, 2011, 10:17:12 AM
The GTX460 1GB is still probably the best in terms of performance/$$, though.

Thank you!  Next stop, Newegg.

I'd recommend avoiding this Gigabyte model (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125333) - their initial shipments were great, but more recent shipments of this card have been problematic for a lot of users.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nebu on April 18, 2011, 10:19:26 AM
Thanks for the tip.

I was considering this MSI card. 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127510

It seems to have good reviews, but looks like it eats up a lot of case space.  Fortunately, I have a big, empty box.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 18, 2011, 10:22:04 AM
Its worth getting the 'after market' fan. Standard video card cooling solutions blow proverbial capra aegagrus hircus.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Quinton on April 18, 2011, 11:37:27 AM
I upgraded from a GTX260 to a GTX560Ti yesterday (preparing for Portal 2), and am liking it.  I can crank up the effects in most stuff all the way and still have nice solid 60Hz framerates.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on April 18, 2011, 11:55:48 AM
Quick question: Where's the current bang-for-your-buck point with video cards?  ATI or NVidia?  How much memory?

I need to upgrade.  I currently have an Nvidia 9600GT.

Some more explanation might be good, but the short answer is the 560GTX is probably the best bang for the buck--just remember I don't like AMD cards, so there's going to be a bias here. If you're legacy box is red, then the AMD 6870 is probably your boy. I'd stay with whatver drivers are already on your machine. Less hassle is good, and swapping between these two is a hassle.

Needs drives the gear train. What do you need your new card to do? This will depend on games and what your monitor is or what you're upgrading your monitor to be.

If you're running 1080p or 1920x1200, then the 560 or 6870 are going to be hard to beat. The 560 is extremely overclockable--hugely so, but you'll probably need a third party cooler. If you're going multi-monitor or run something with 2560 in your horizontal resolution, then you need to spend more money. A lot more.

Also, if you REALLY like your eye-candy, and crank AA and whatnot to the max, you're probably going to have to think SLI or Crossfire. If you want to stay with a single card, then you're looking at the 6950/70 or the 580GTX. If you're running those extremely high resolutions and cranking filtering, you're going to need lot of onboard video memory, and right now that favors AMD. Supposedly, EVGA is bringing out a 3gig 580, which will be the shiz, but otherwise the 2gig AMD cards have a slight advantage under some cricumstances. There are some other 3gig 580s out there, but availablity is piss poor and there were/are some concerns with the Palit card. The Gainward (I think) is not available in the US, if that matters. Whatever you do, don't drop below 1gig of vid memory. High-res textures increasingly demand it with new games.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on April 18, 2011, 01:58:01 PM
Yeah, sorry, I disappeared into the hole of the weekend. Thanks for the advice so far.

You mention possibly needing a new PSU to power the new card - what are you using now?

I may not actually need one, now that I've gone back through my records. I have an Antec EarthWatts 650W power supply. What I'm looking at now suggests 500W PSU. Even assuming three years of wear, I think what i have will cover that. Of course, I'll still double-check with a PSU calculator.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371015

I've started looking at the 2GB 6950s, which are in a good place price-wise. These all seem pretty much interchangeable pure stats-wise; the most expensive has marginal edges in clock speed, but runs a slightly less-advanced version of OpenGL. The cheapest has only one fan, which inclines me against it - I don't think you can have too much cooling.

http://tinyurl.com/65uesjc


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on April 23, 2011, 04:26:38 PM
I just picked up a relatively cheapy SSD with TRIM support (64GB Kingston V100). It has firmware issues but I downloaded the update so it should be ready to go.

My question is if I set the BIOS to AHCI before installing Windows 7 then TRIM gets enabled? Anything else I need to do so the drive doesn't act funky?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MuffinMan on April 23, 2011, 04:38:00 PM
Be careful when you're pulling the SATA cable out of it. The plastic connector on my Kingston SSD broke off the first day so now the cable just kind of hangs onto the pins for dear life.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on April 24, 2011, 05:06:00 AM
Duly noted.

I may install AHCI drivers from AMD later because things went too smoothly and I like headaches. Decided to leave superfetch and indexing alone.

This thing is fast.   :heart: SSD


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on April 24, 2011, 09:39:12 PM
The 320 series Intel SSD's are also out now, that seems to be the bang for the buck laptop drive of the moment (3Gbps SATA), the main problem with ordering an SSD preinstalled in a laptop is they don't tell you what drive model they are dropping in there.  Not sure how it stands now but for a long time a samsung was the drive most manufacturers crammed in there and it was a piece of shit.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on May 26, 2011, 05:28:39 PM
So...

The machine will be used for 2d design software and basics -email, web, skype, etc.- across two monitors.

I only need the core components (psu, mobo, cpu, cooler, ram, gpu, case) and I'm looking for the usual sweet spot of $1100 - $1500.

PSU is going to be Seasonic of the appropriate size.

Mobo is going to be P67 Asus unless there is a feature or price point blip on a Z68 that I don't currently expect.

Cpu is either 2500, 2500K, 2600 or 2600K. I still need to read up on what K means and look at the price/performance changes in detail.

Cooler will be Noctua unless I find some great deal on something comparably awesome.

Ram will be some badass form of Corsair matched pairs, what exactly will depend on the cost of everything else. I can typically get some more ram into a system later without too much trouble.

I'm at a complete loss on gpu, Adobe, who's software will be in heavy heavy use, has a tiny list of "these guys sucked our cock enough to deserve mention video cards" that I don't take too seriously but still bugs me and the person the build is for has seen it. I saw some bang buck lists in the last couple pages of the thread and will start there and try to sort it out. I've never built a machine for anything but gaming and I've never used more than one monitor setup so I'm quite a bit worried about getting the gpu right.

The case is going to be a $200 or less Antec that I feel comfortable with. Depends on what deals are available at purchase time.

Anyone built any 2500 or 2600 systems lately and care to share what you went with and if you are happy or unhappy with any choices?

Thanks all.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 26, 2011, 05:48:34 PM
Cpu is either 2500, 2500K, 2600 or 2600K. I still need to read up on what K means and look at the price/performance changes in detail.

I'm at a complete loss on gpu, Adobe, who's software will be in heavy heavy use, has a tiny list of "these guys sucked our cock enough to deserve mention video cards" that I don't take too seriously but still bugs me and the person the build is for has seen it. I saw some bang buck lists in the last couple pages of the thread and will start there and try to sort it out. I've never built a machine for anything but gaming and I've never used more than one monitor setup so I'm quite a bit worried about getting the gpu right.
Thanks all.

The 'K' indicates that it's an unlocked-multiplier CPU and can be overclocked in P67 or Z68 boards.  I'd look strongly at the 2600K, since hyperthreading will actually be useful for the sorts of tasks you're talking about (as opposed to gaming - I'd recommend a 2500K for a gaming machine), and there's no reason to buy a $80 Noctua cooler unless you want to overclock - a $30 Hyper 212 will be fine at stock clocks.

Can't really help with the GPU/Adobe question, but I'm assuming you're referring to CUDA acceleration and nVidia cards?  If so, this (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/adobe-cs5-cuda-64-bit,2770-12.html) article may help, and would seem to indicate that as long as the application or plugin supports it, you'll see a nice boost from nVidia hardware.  There's a couple of 'GPU Compute' (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/GPU11/222) benchmarks on Anand that would seem to reinforce that as well.

If you go with nVidia, the GTX560ti is probably the best choice in the price range you're looking at right now.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 09, 2011, 11:15:50 PM
I have a problem.... my SSD performance significantly degraded to the point that it is noticeable.

I have Asus M4A89TD PRO/USB3 MB /w 1090T Phenom X6 that uses JMicron JMB36X Controller. My SSD is WD SiliconEdge Blue sitting on SATA1. When I originally installed OS I made sure to set it AHCI mode. I verified that trim mode is enabled.

After doing more research I found this article:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-performance-tweak,2911-2.html

Well, problem is that under IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers I have only "Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller" and no AHCI controllers whatsoever. I went to ASUS website trying to download/force AHCI drivers but they only have "install to floppy" utility and no regular driver installation.

I also have generic WD Caviar drive that was connected at SATA 2 that I disconnected while trying to get this working.

Questions:

1. Is my SSD in IDE mode despite SATA 1-4 set to AHCI mode in bios?
2. Where do I get AHCI driver and how can I force it? I don't mind quick reinstall but would like to avoid full disk wipe.



EDIT - tried forcing AHCI driver using "legacy driver" mode and found out that it was called AMD SATA Controller, and I already had it. So SSD is in AHCI mode and Trim is enabled. What else can cause slowdown?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on June 10, 2011, 11:22:03 AM
Drive failure.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 10, 2011, 05:53:03 PM
Drive failure.

I hope not.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on June 10, 2011, 09:13:58 PM
I'd hope not either, but SSD's haven't proven to be any more reliable than standard disks.  Back up your data while you can, just to be sure.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Minvaren on June 11, 2011, 11:01:19 AM
Less reliable for me - I've lost 2 SSDs in the last year to sudden and complete failure.  I back up my current SSD weekly now, and have a spare regular HD on hand for any future warranty swaps.

The speed's nice, but the tech is just starting to mature on them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on June 11, 2011, 11:31:31 AM
I was seriously considering an SSD for the new computer I"m building. After a lot of research, though, I've shitcanned the idea. I just can't consider them quite ready for primetime and the cost per gig is just too high. For now.

They have very real benefits, but just too much risk. I've especially read horror stories involving the OCZ drives (which doesn't surprise me particularly--no more of their shit in any of my boxes, ever). In a couple more years, I think they'll be the shiznit and I fully expect to see them in the next generation consoles. For now, though, I have to take a pass on them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 11, 2011, 02:30:37 PM
Well, I purchased WD SSD, advertised for reliability. It hasn't been 3 years, so they will have to send me a new one if it ever craps out. I already backup everything to regular HD.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 12, 2011, 12:39:40 PM
How are you verifying that the trim command is being passed to the SSD?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 12, 2011, 03:12:27 PM
fsutil behavior query DisableDeleteNotify


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Azazel on June 15, 2011, 05:10:19 PM
A friend at work has come to me for advice on what to buy for her new PC.
She and her husband want to doa custom build, so I advised her to go to centrecom, which is pretty much the cheapest place to do it, and they have reasonable service.

This is what they came to me with before checking the site as a base.

Quote
We need the computer for work stuff, some gaming (Call of Duty?), and kids' school stuff.  Not really video editing or high end gaming.
 
budget up to around $1500 - we already have the keyboard, mouse and monitor.

http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/default.php


Intel Core i5 2500, 3.3 GHZ.
Hard drive 2TB 7200 rpm 64mb. 
Memory 2x4 GB DDR3 SDRAM. 
Motherboard ASUS P8P 67pro version 3.
Video card gigabyte GTX560 1GB. 
optical liteon ihas 524. 
operating system windows 7 home premium 64 bit.
case thermaltake v9 black. 
power supply cooler master gx650w.
cooling coolermaster hyper 212.


while keeping in mind their overall wants and such (i5, 8gb, 2tb) I'm wondering what the best overall machine is that can be gotten for their budget. Using the above link.

thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on June 15, 2011, 09:02:46 PM
Their build is just peachy.  We're putting something very similar together for some work machines.  That machine will be able to play pretty much anything for a long time.

For cost/performance ratio, maybe look at the 1.0 and 1.5 TB drives, and a lower tier video card.  Cost savings wouldn't be huge, but they have room to downgrade, save a few dollars, and still have a great machine.

Oh yeah.  Get a tower cooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lt.Dan on June 16, 2011, 01:57:42 AM
A friend at work has come to me for advice on what to buy for her new PC.
She and her husband want to doa custom build, so I advised her to go to centrecom, which is pretty much the cheapest place to do it, and they have reasonable service.

This is what they came to me with before checking the site as a base.

Quote
We need the computer for work stuff, some gaming (Call of Duty?), and kids' school stuff.  Not really video editing or high end gaming.
 
budget up to around $1500 - we already have the keyboard, mouse and monitor.

http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/default.php


Intel Core i5 2500, 3.3 GHZ.
Hard drive 2TB 7200 rpm 64mb. 
Memory 2x4 GB DDR3 SDRAM. 
Motherboard ASUS P8P 67pro version 3.
Video card gigabyte GTX560 1GB. 
optical liteon ihas 524. 
operating system windows 7 home premium 64 bit.
case thermaltake v9 black. 
power supply cooler master gx650w.
cooling coolermaster hyper 212.


while keeping in mind their overall wants and such (i5, 8gb, 2tb) I'm wondering what the best overall machine is that can be gotten for their budget. Using the above link.

thanks!

Try www.pccasegear.com.au  I've shifted most of my purchases from Centrecom to PC Case Gear and found that they have more stuff in stock, generally cheaper, and are pretty good about getting other products in if they aren't listed on their site.

Instead of separate case and PSU check out the Antec Sonata III and IV cases with PSU included.  PSUs are reputable Antec units and the case isn't so ostentatious.  I've got the Sonata III and run a GTX 460 and i5 CPU with no problems.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on June 16, 2011, 08:37:32 AM
A friend at work has come to me for advice on what to buy for her new PC.
She and her husband want to doa custom build, so I advised her to go to centrecom, which is pretty much the cheapest place to do it, and they have reasonable service.

This is what they came to me with before checking the site as a base.

Quote
We need the computer for work stuff, some gaming (Call of Duty?), and kids' school stuff.  Not really video editing or high end gaming.
 
budget up to around $1500 - we already have the keyboard, mouse and monitor.

http://www.centrecom.com.au/catalog/default.php


Intel Core i5 2500, 3.3 GHZ.
Hard drive 2TB 7200 rpm 64mb. 
Memory 2x4 GB DDR3 SDRAM. 
Motherboard ASUS P8P 67pro version 3.
Video card gigabyte GTX560 1GB. 
optical liteon ihas 524. 
operating system windows 7 home premium 64 bit.
case thermaltake v9 black. 
power supply cooler master gx650w.
cooling coolermaster hyper 212.


while keeping in mind their overall wants and such (i5, 8gb, 2tb) I'm wondering what the best overall machine is that can be gotten for their budget. Using the above link.

thanks!

That build is great, though if it were me, I'd change the CPU to a 2500K for another $13 - they may not want to overclock now, but it's nice to be able to do it and not need to instead of the other way around.  The 2500K is a beast, and will happily run all day long at well over 4 GHz with that motherboard and cooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lucas on June 16, 2011, 12:22:06 PM
Just substituted my Nvidia 250GTS with a Geforce GTX 560 (I spent 225 Euros). Also changed the power supply.

Now my machine is as follows (I won't get into much detail regarding the various models):

Motherboard: Asus P6TD Deluxe
Power Supply: Itek ATX 720 mPower
Processor: Intel i7 920 2.67GHz (overclocked to 3GHz)
RAM: 6GB DDR3
Video Card: Nvidia Geforce 560GTX (EVGA if you want to know the producer)
OS: Windows 7 Home Edition 64-bit
Cooler Master CM-690

Nice for gaming, I guess  :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lucas on June 18, 2011, 05:43:57 AM
yeah, well, looks like I spoke too soon  :heartbreak: :heartbreak:

To keep the story short, 2 out of 2 EVGA 560GTX that I ordered turned out with manifacturing faults (first the fan, then the memory slots).

Now I'm happily writing from my mother's Toshiba laptop 1ghz 894MB RAM

 :ye_gods:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 18, 2011, 10:55:24 AM
Try to replace through the retailer (hopefully the egg). EVGA kept sending me refurbs and I finally just went back to newegg, explained the situation and was able to cross-ship a new card (and they accepted evga's refurb).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on June 18, 2011, 11:20:28 AM
What was the fan issue on the 560? I bought a cheap 6850 and the fan was going crazy until a bios update fixed the issue.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 18, 2011, 02:01:52 PM
I hate when  manufacturer sends you refurbs, fortunately for me that doesn't happen with high-end cards I tend to use, there are just not many refurbs out there.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Severian on June 18, 2011, 06:43:12 PM
AnandTech put up a new $500/1,000/2,000 Sandy Bridge Buyer's Guide (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4456/sandy-bridge-buyers-guide) yesterday.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on June 19, 2011, 08:58:28 AM
Kinda on the same subject but if anyone is in the market for a really nice monitor and wants to get away from TFT screens, the LG IPS236V is a damn fine monitor for ~220 USD.  My wife ganked my Dell IPS 24", which left me with my old Gateway FHD2400 with its insane amounts of backlight bleed and color shift if you moved your head an inch up or down.  Been using the LG for a bit of everything and the difference between an IPS (even an LED based one) and a TFT screen is amazing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 20, 2011, 09:12:12 AM
I hate when  manufacturer sends you refurbs, fortunately for me that doesn't happen with high-end cards I tend to use, there are just not many refurbs out there.
Pretty much every card from the first runs of evga's superclocked 8800gtx had bad paste on the memory sinks, and it was the highest end card at the time. I ended up not using that version after a lot of bullshittiness.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 20, 2011, 02:15:44 PM
Kinda on the same subject but if anyone is in the market for a really nice monitor and wants to get away from TFT screens, the LG IPS236V is a damn fine monitor for ~220 USD.  My wife ganked my Dell IPS 24", which left me with my old Gateway FHD2400 with its insane amounts of backlight bleed and color shift if you moved your head an inch up or down.  Been using the LG for a bit of everything and the difference between an IPS (even an LED based one) and a TFT screen is amazing.

QFT. I still have to wonder how they got the cost of the LG IPS down to $220.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 27, 2011, 03:54:57 PM
So I've been having this odd issue with Rift that's making me wonder if it's time to start saving my pennies for an upgrade (can't afford a new pc). The old girl is now 4-1/2 yrs old. For some reason Rift is pounding the shit out of the gpu...but only the heat. It's pretty much cpu-bound (C2D e6600/4GB/GTX460) but the gpu is almost perfect for Rift (scales up to about 80-90% utilization @ Ultra settings, about 400-600MB vram). Except at Ultra settings it's pegging out my evga monitor at 99C (the max it graphs!). Right now I'm running it at Medium settings with the gpu fan manually set at 100% (which will kill the bearings), the side off the case with a room fan blasting it at full speed...and that's keeping me around 80C  :uhrr: Which can get up to 90C with full-screen shaders, but that's ok temps wise. It's what I have to do to keep those temps, especially when it's not stressing the gpu performance-wise at all.

I'm torn. At the least it's reminding me I need to start saving, this computer won't game forever. On the other hand, it's just Rift and Rift isn't a game I'm willing to build a new pc for.

Right now I'm eyeing:

i5 2500k
ASUS P8P67 Pro
Corsair 8GB DDR3 1600
CM Hyper 212

Optionals depending on how my savings goes would be aftermarket cooling (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835426026) for my gtx460; or a second gtx460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130568); or both a second gpu and aftermarket coolers for both.

The base upgrade would run about $554. Adding the second gpu and cooling would push that to $874.

I'm mostly thinking about setting myself up for another couple years gaming with this pc.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 27, 2011, 04:23:32 PM
Aftermarket cooling kit for your GPU. I'm serious. I had a 8800GT that ran very hot till I got a Zalman kit. Made my video card essentially overheat proof.

Honestly, I think some Nvidia manufacturers really skimp on either the thermal paste or the materials or something. I've NEVER had an Nvidia card that didn't improve massively from an aftermarket cooler.

Now, my ATI 5870 never breaches 80 C. I managed to get it that high by running dual monitors with Eve on one screen and World of Tanks in the other. Still ran fine, with ~25 FPS in WoT, but the GPU was a bit toasty. Still safe, but toasty.

And this is with a similar rig to yours, Sky. A 6750 Core2Duo.

So, save yourself some money and get yourself one of these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835426026

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186046


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 27, 2011, 04:33:13 PM
Actually I could grab one of those right now with some bottle returns, I bet. I was looking at those over the weekend (note my link to the gelid), I like the look of the zalman but apparently they don't rikey the 460. At worst I still start saving pennies for whatever is the sweet spot when I have enough pennies.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on June 27, 2011, 04:39:21 PM
I like the aftermarket cooler suggestion, since the reference blower-box type cooler isn't doing the job and you seem happy with the performance of the 460 (aside from the heat).  As Engels alludes to, you may want to try just removing the stock cooler, cleaning and reapplying new thermal paste and reinstalling it to see if that fixes the issue before you drop $55 on the Accelero, since you'll only be out a few bucks (assuming you don't already have a tube of thermal compound laying around) and 30 minutes that way.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 28, 2011, 03:09:01 PM
Ordered the Accelero. I figure it'll carry over to the new pc with the gpu, and I'm not happy with the noise of the EE edition 460 anyway. I bought the 3-fan version, we'll see if it fits in the case  :awesome_for_real: I figure if the 8800GTX fit, anything will (the cooler is about 3/4" longer)

Also thinking about avoiding evga in the future. Shitty thermal paste/poor adhesion on the vrm sinks was the problem with the 8800s and it took me several tries to get a decent one. Great once I got it, but if the 460s are the same (if not as severe), it's a manufacturing problem. Either that or I'll just put on an aftermarket cooler as part of the cost of doing business.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on June 28, 2011, 03:24:21 PM
Make sure you run your card "stock" for a while to make sure its not defective,  replacing cooler is all but guaranteed to void the warranty.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 28, 2011, 03:34:10 PM
I've had the 460 since October. One of evga's strengths is their warranty program (and step up). As long as you can put it back to stock, it doesn't void the warranty.

Did I mention Rift toasted my 8800GTX?  :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on June 29, 2011, 12:02:57 PM
Ordered the Accelero.

When you install this, would you measure the width of the card please?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on June 29, 2011, 02:02:51 PM
You mean the width of the cooler or the card or both mated together?

If I remember, I want to snap some pics while I'm doing it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on June 30, 2011, 11:58:44 AM
Cooler and the card together.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 01, 2011, 11:22:32 AM
Ok, I'm now a fan (har) of aftermarket cooling.

Rift, medium settings; stock cooling, fan manually set to 100% (hair dryer) and case open with floor fan blowing on full over the innards: 80C

Rift, max settings (all sliders pegged right); accelero set to auto (got to around 50%, silent): 70C

So I net 10C cooling, the pc becomes silent and I go from mediocre visuals to all the game has to offer. That's pretty awesome.

SC, width of the setup is 2-1/2". Length took some doing. Forgot when I put in the shorter 460 I put in a HD cage. I have the antec P180 with removable cages. To accommodate the length of the accelero I had to remove the cage and squeeze the drive in the lower section, which is tight up against a fan because my PSU is also long, heh. But after some wrangling, everything fits nice and it's running great.

On the stock evga cooling setup: they had absolutely gobbed the thermal goop on. And the RAM was only being served by some sort of strip of a vinyl-like material; even that was not making proper contact in some areas. No cooling on the voltage regulators at all.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 01, 2011, 03:01:35 PM
Nice, thanks man


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 03, 2011, 02:23:31 PM
Great results! Glad it worked out. Still want a pic.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 03, 2011, 03:01:54 PM
Yeah, long weekend and I'm lazy. I'll bring the camera into work and upload while I'm disk imaging. Forgot to snap a pic of the final product because the last bit of install was fiddly.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 05, 2011, 09:14:56 AM
Pics as promised. As I said, forgot to get the final install because zomg can't stop gaming. When I was telling my fiancee about it, I realized it's really the best the computer's been running, since I've always run stock heatsinks and heat has always been an issue. The gtx460 is really a hell of a card for $200....if it's cooled properly. Was this overkill? Maybe. She's just happy it's quiet. Really quiet.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on July 05, 2011, 10:20:14 AM
Do you imagine you'll be able to transfer the cooler to your next card? Did you compare the Accelero to any of the Zalman aftermarket options?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 05, 2011, 10:30:08 AM
Holy crap that thing is huge  :drill:.  (that's what she said)

Too big to do an SLI set up in my case due to the proximity of the two cards.  From the looks of it, it just blows the hot air around in your case?  Depending on your case, it may be worth it to swap the front fans around to exhaust rather than intake?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 05, 2011, 10:46:57 AM
I've got a 12cm intake fan and a 12cm outflow fan, front to back. (also a 12cm fan on the Scythe HS for the cpu that blows to the outflow). Optimally, the intake could be a couple inches higher to make a direct front-to-back path. Haven't measured the cpu temps yet. One of the things I'm going to do as part of the wrap-up.

Hoax, the equivalent Zalman didn't appear to be compatible with the gtx460. It would be nice to take to the next card, even if I have to mod it some (since the next card will probably be years from now and new architecture). When I do upgrade my pc at some point, I'm hoping to get a board that can accomodate two 460s with these on them in SLI. Hey, I can dream.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on July 05, 2011, 10:58:48 AM
Thanks Sky,

My problem is that I have an old GTX260 that can still run pretty much everything I want but its starting to have stock cooler issues but it seems stupid to spend money on aftermarket cooling instead of a new card. I may do it anyways as if I can extend the life of this card out it can be passed down where if I don't its going to fuck up and may take some of the machine with it when it does.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 05, 2011, 11:48:11 AM
So there's a pretty good compatibility spread. At worst you'd need a new plate and maybe some heatsinks for the components (but I was able to make do with all the extras they send). I paid $70 through mwave.com.

http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/cooling/vga/376/accelero-xtreme-plus-ii.html


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 05, 2011, 12:44:58 PM
I've got a 12cm intake fan and a 12cm outflow fan, front to back. (also a 12cm fan on the Scythe HS for the cpu that blows to the outflow). Optimally, the intake could be a couple inches higher to make a direct front-to-back path. Haven't measured the cpu temps yet. One of the things I'm going to do as part of the wrap-up.

Something like this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817993002) or this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817996019) would be an easy way to add additional intake airflow in line with the CPU cooler, since you have 3 unused 5.25" bays under your optical drive.  You could also fabricate a bracket from sheetmetal pretty easily to do the same thing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 05, 2011, 01:27:03 PM
Oh, good idea.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 05, 2011, 02:13:17 PM
Hell, some proper cable management would do wonders for airflow.  That picture gives the neatfreak in me the heebie jeebies and would keep me up at night.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 05, 2011, 02:59:05 PM
IT'S NOT THAT BAD.

It just doesn't photograph well!

 :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 05, 2011, 03:31:30 PM
Yeah, its not that bad. Some people really :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 06, 2011, 08:53:12 AM
Yeah, I'm one of those people when it comes to stuff like that.  It took me three days of planning/building/rebuilding/routing/rerouting my PC until I was done.  And that doesn't include the freaking near week it took me to cable management behind my desk before I was happy.

Clutter is the one thing that puts me in the nuthouse - even if I don't see it, I know it's there and my eye twitches.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 06, 2011, 09:13:11 AM
I honestly do not have enough time in the day to worry about clutter. I'm jealous!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 06, 2011, 02:58:07 PM
I dunno - you don't have to take three days to plan out the wiring to avoid clutter in the case (to be honest, I can't imagine it ever taking that long unless you're going bananas and re-sleeving all the wires while you're at it), but a case that has provisions for cable management and/or a modular PSU goes a long way towards making it easier.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on July 06, 2011, 03:59:42 PM
It's not like I put 72 hours into it.  An hour or two, possibly three, a day messing with it, mocking it up, sleeving up wires, etc.  Some of it was 'research' into how others did it, that sort of thing.  The result was an exceptionally clean install with no wires stretched over my motherboard that includes SLI, XiFi sound card, Corsair H50 with dual fans for push pull with a shroud from the top front fan of my Antec 902.  Did some additional rewiring of the case fans to elminate plugs and excess wire.  The painted the clear side black and added sound deadener to the sides.   

I'm a detail oriented guy that believes if you're going to do something, do it right.  I ended up with a PC that's exceptionally quiet, stays remarkably cool even when overclocked, and is a breeze to clean when I need to dump a can of compressed air into it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on July 06, 2011, 04:16:05 PM
My cable management guide:

Cables fit (shove as necessary) and side panel closes.
Computer boots. 
No weird noises.
Temps OK. 

Yep? GAME ON.

The only temp increases I've seen since install (and minor at that) is when it got pretty dusty and I had to clean the filter and when it stopped being winter in Arizona. I installed in a historically cold time in the state.

If I really had the time to blow on optimizing the setup, I might.  I don't like fiddling with the computer's innards and unplugging shit once everything's working fine, however.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Soln on July 06, 2011, 04:19:15 PM
for a new system is there any reason not to invest in a full tower? 

also, any drawbacks with investing in an i7 2600k?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on July 06, 2011, 04:22:27 PM
Size/space, weight?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 06, 2011, 05:12:53 PM
also, any drawbacks with investing in an i7 2600k?

If you're using it for tasks that will benefit from HyperThreading (video encoding, etc), go for it.  If it's primarily a gaming machine, I'd stick with the 2500K and save the $100 - there isn't a whole lot of difference between the two in games (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/287?vs=288).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Soln on July 06, 2011, 05:19:06 PM
Size/space, weight?

thanks.   Just thinking blank canvas.

also, any drawbacks with investing in an i7 2600k?

If you're using it for tasks that will benefit from HyperThreading (video encoding, etc), go for it.  If it's primarily a gaming machine, I'd stick with the 2500K and save the $100 - there isn't a whole lot of difference between the two in games (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/287?vs=288).

thanks. I'll think about the 2500k only.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 07, 2011, 10:34:33 AM
My cable management guide:

Cables fit (shove as necessary) and side panel closes.
Computer boots. 
No weird noises.
Temps OK. 

Yep? GAME ON.

This. There is an argument that for airflow reasons, you should tuck everything neatly away. Sure, you don't want a beaver damn of muck obstructing airflow, but Sky's set up is not particularly obstructing and by normal standards is positively neat.

As for aesthetics, the case is closed :P


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 07, 2011, 10:45:34 AM
As I said, the cabling is mostly tight up against the case walls. The tangle at the bottom of the top chamber isn't really in the airflow (and can't really be helped, anyway). In my last line of defense, the middle cage is gone, so the power and sata are now both in the lower chamber. That's actually my current concern, 2hdds and the psu with just a 12cm and the psu fan. But when the cage was in there, the gpu was exhausting externally (albeit noisily), so that mitigated the airflow issues of having the hdd and cabling in the intake stream.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 07, 2011, 11:00:08 AM
I know what you mean because I own a P180 myself, but I think that's difficult to translate unless folks know about its construction. For what its worth, I too have had cooling issues with the P180. Its a case built for silence, not thermals, and it has always been a struggle. I finally gave it to the GF who never runs anything above 1280x1024 so heat's not a problem.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 18, 2011, 06:02:18 PM
Ugh, I've put off building a computer for the past 2 years. I've put up with my 4850 whirring like a helicopter when I play games, but now the HDD is going and the motherboard has given up on 4 of its 6 USB ports and occasionally doesn't even get past posting.

Budget is $1000

Don't need a monitor, keyboard, mouse, speakers or DVD Drive.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on July 18, 2011, 06:03:27 PM
Do you need a case and power supply or are you going to be reusing those?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 18, 2011, 06:17:42 PM
Case and power supply. Preferably a quieter case too, this Antec 300 doesn't stop anything.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 18, 2011, 06:52:41 PM
I was gonna suggest this case

http://www.fractal-design.com/?view=product&category=2&prod=53

Was on sale at New egg, but its been pulled/soldout. So, well, got nuthin.

I'm also eyeing a new system.

Is there any advantage to having an X68 chipset mobo over a P67 if I'm gonna have my discrete vid card anyway?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 19, 2011, 12:03:40 AM
I've put up with my 4850 whirring like a helicopter when I play games
So there's a pretty good compatibility spread. At worst you'd need a new plate and maybe some heatsinks for the components (but I was able to make do with all the extras they send). I paid $70 through mwave.com.

http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/cooling/vga/376/accelero-xtreme-plus-ii.html

Other than that, get an i5-2500k, load it up with some RAM on an ASUS P8Z68 Deluxe.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on July 19, 2011, 12:33:57 AM
At $1,000 does he really need the Z68?

Its pretty easy to build a machine right now since there are such consensus cpu's on the market. From there go with your brand loyalties and the stuff you trust and if there is anything you aren't sure about post it and people can chime in. I mean your biggest question will probably end up being ram v gpu where to spend the $$$ and on what exactly and that may come down to what's on sale that day.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 19, 2011, 08:17:56 AM
At $1,000 does he really need the Z68?

Its pretty easy to build a machine right now since there are such consensus cpu's on the market. From there go with your brand loyalties and the stuff you trust and if there is anything you aren't sure about post it and people can chime in. I mean your biggest question will probably end up being ram v gpu where to spend the $$$ and on what exactly and that may come down to what's on sale that day.
I don't have any loyalties nor do I recall most of what's in my current computer, which is why I came here. I found this build (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=17748926), but I'm not so sure I need a honking aftermarket cooler or that kind of PSU. I was always under the assumption that 500W should be enough unless you're using SLI/Crossfire or overclocking.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 19, 2011, 09:16:20 AM
I don't have any loyalties nor do I recall most of what's in my current computer, which is why I came here. I found this build (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=17748926), but I'm not so sure I need a honking aftermarket cooler or that kind of PSU. I was always under the assumption that 500W should be enough unless you're using SLI/Crossfire or overclocking.

Nice build, though I think I'd probably replace the HDD with the Samsung F3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152185), a Caviar Black or an SSD if you're feeling really spendy.

The XFX 'Core Edition' power supplies are quite good and a decently priced alternative to the one in that wishlist.  650W unit for $90 ($70 after MiR) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207014).  Not modular, though.

Newegg charges too much for the Hyper 212 - you can get it on Amazon for $30 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B002G1YPH0/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&qid=1311084650&sr=8-1&condition=new).  The Xigmatek Gaia SD1283 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082) is a great direct replacement if you'd like to avoid splitting up your order.  

At $30, a good CPU cooler is worth the extra cash just for the reduction in noise, and both of those coolers will comfortably let you drive a 2500K well past 4GHz.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 19, 2011, 09:38:52 AM
Awesome, thanks!

Ignore that the wishlist is on Newegg, that's just what they had it setup with. I'll probably be buying from NCIX.com or CanadaComputers.com.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on July 19, 2011, 10:54:36 AM
The cooler is worth it, even if you don't overclock. (I have one of the Xigmatechs.)  A cool CPU means a happy CPU.

Absolutely get a backing plate for it though.  Pushpins are the devil's work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 19, 2011, 11:20:21 AM
At $1,000 does he really need the Z68?
I was just looking at components over the weekend and the Z68 seems to have fixed some of the problems with the first gen 1155 boards. The P67 boards I have in the list are ASUS P8P67 PRO (REV 3.0) and ASRock P67 EXTREME6 (B3). I'm still considering the ASUS P67, but I really like the features on the Z68 deluxe. I also need enough room for (hopefully) SLI and my X-Fi. I would also use the Hyper 212 for the CPU.

I'm pretty happy with my gtx460 + aftermarket cooling, which would run like $100 less than the frozr, but I'm not one to say spend less on the gpu. Almost always pays off. I'd still say put the aftermarket cooler on the 570, you'll get better performance at lower temps with almost no noise.

4GB might be a bit light for a new system, I've got 8GB specced for my rebuild (8GB of Corsair PC3 12800 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233147) for $80).

Also wondering about the green hdd, aren't those rated for less power usage at the cost of some performance?

About the PSU: the gtx 570 draws 38A off the 12V rail, the Corsair has 62A and the XFX has 53A. The i5-2500K pulls 98W and the 570 pulls 330W (under gaming load). So the XFX should be good enough, but I like to build in plenty of headroom.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on July 19, 2011, 11:36:52 AM
At $1,000 does he really need the Z68?

Its pretty easy to build a machine right now since there are such consensus cpu's on the market. From there go with your brand loyalties and the stuff you trust and if there is anything you aren't sure about post it and people can chime in. I mean your biggest question will probably end up being ram v gpu where to spend the $$$ and on what exactly and that may come down to what's on sale that day.
I don't have any loyalties nor do I recall most of what's in my current computer, which is why I came here. I found this build (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=17748926), but I'm not so sure I need a honking aftermarket cooler or that kind of PSU. I was always under the assumption that 500W should be enough unless you're using SLI/Crossfire or overclocking.

Couple observations on that list:
-The hyper 212 was easy to install for me and has been running great with my current setup.  Looks big, but fit pretty easy inside my Antec 300 M.
-Why limit yourself to 4GB on a new install.  Go with 8, imo.
-I love Corsair PSUs.  Hard to go wrong there. Not sure you need one that nice, however, and you could save some money.
-You could save money on the GPU.  My 470 Twin Frozr was just a touch about 200.  I'm not really sure what the sweet spot is now on GPUs but that seems high.

If you find what you want, have a little flexibility, and watch sales: you can save a decent amount on your total build price.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 19, 2011, 11:56:23 AM
I'm pretty happy with my gtx460 + aftermarket cooling, which would run like $100 less than the frozr, but I'm not one to say spend less on the gpu. Almost always pays off. I'd still say put the aftermarket cooler on the 570, you'll get better performance at lower temps with almost no noise.

The MSI in the wishlist should be fine - both the MSI Twin Frozr II and the new ASUS DirectCu2 non-reference coolers are pretty comparable to a decent aftermarket solution unless you're going bananas overclocking the GPU, where the 3-fan Accelero will pull ahead.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 19, 2011, 02:41:10 PM
Couple observations on that list:
-The hyper 212 was easy to install for me and has been running great with my current setup.  Looks big, but fit pretty easy inside my Antec 300 M.
-Why limit yourself to 4GB on a new install.  Go with 8, imo.
-I love Corsair PSUs.  Hard to go wrong there. Not sure you need one that nice, however, and you could save some money.
-You could save money on the GPU.  My 470 Twin Frozr was just a touch about 200.  I'm not really sure what the sweet spot is now on GPUs but that seems high.

If you find what you want, have a little flexibility, and watch sales: you can save a decent amount on your total build price.

I went to price out the build with the suggested adjustments and it turns out they don't have the 4GB kit selected and I decided it would be better to have 2x4GB instead of 2x2GB, but thanks for confirming. I figured the Corsair model given was a bit much and might be using the assumption of future use of two cards, which would make sense. I don't think I'd ever do that.

The GPU has been a sticking point for me. If the price difference is justified with the 560 with some assurance it'll last a lot longer with the added performance, I'm ok with it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on July 19, 2011, 04:58:04 PM
Absolutely get a backing plate for it though.  Pushpins are the devil's work.

This. When I built my system 2 years ago or so, I didn't consider this...took close to an hour to ensure that all 4 stupid pins were engaged.  :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on July 19, 2011, 06:49:07 PM
In addition to the time, I scraped the skin off two knuckles trying to push the damn things in, and then it popped off while running a few months later.  Which led to me having pull the entire system apart to put a bracket on anyways, and nearly breaking my motherboard because one of the pushpins broke in such a fashion it never wanted to release.

The. Devil's. Work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 20, 2011, 10:16:22 AM
I've never seen plates sold separately. Or is this a suggestion to get a case that comes with one?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 20, 2011, 10:57:00 AM
I've never seen plates sold separately. Or is this a suggestion to get a case that comes with one?

No.  They generally come with your CPU cooler (very few good coolers come without them).  I think it's a suggestion to get a decent aftermarket cooler more than anything else.  :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 20, 2011, 11:06:27 AM
I just checked the Hyper 212 and it does come with the backplate. The scissor bracket looks a bit odd, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on July 20, 2011, 11:09:51 AM
It's pretty easy to install.  Took me no time at all, and I had never installed a non-stock heat sink before.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on July 20, 2011, 12:51:41 PM
Plates could be standard now.  They weren't when I got mine, but then tower coolers were just coming on the market.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 20, 2011, 01:38:15 PM
I can't even remember because my computer was built in Feb 2007  :crying_panda:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on July 20, 2011, 03:24:42 PM
So, uhm, P67 or Z68? From what I can gather, there's some new feature with the Z68 regarding using an SSD as a sort of swap file, and the integrated video that can be used for video encoding jobs better than a dedicated video card, but none of that's really pertinent.

Opinions?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on July 20, 2011, 03:28:41 PM
My thoughts on getting the deluxe Z68 were more about the deluxe features. Both the P67 boards I'm looking at look good, too.

Anand did some testing on the SSD caching thing and found it worked but with lots of limitations and you were still basically better off with a traditional SSD setup.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on July 20, 2011, 11:31:16 PM
If you can go Z68 without giving up real features like usb slots or whatever and without it costing more AND word of mouth is that the bios are stable and good then 100% you should do it, those features sound like they could end up being really cool.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on July 29, 2011, 09:28:04 PM
Any alternatives to the ASRock P67 EXTREME4 B3? Seems like no one in my area stocks it anymore.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on July 30, 2011, 06:32:39 AM
Any alternatives to the ASRock P67 EXTREME4 B3? Seems like no one in my area stocks it anymore.

ASUS P8P67 Pro (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131703) would be a good choice.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on July 30, 2011, 12:28:40 PM
I have it in the Z68 and it's a nice motherboard.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on July 31, 2011, 01:54:07 PM
So my tax return finally comes in, and I'm ready to order the new video card I talked about back in March or so.

I go to Newegg and the whole line of cards is sold out and won't be restocked. The pace of tech generations is killing me.

/reroll

So what's the top of the line Radeon these days? The 6950 or the 6970? Their arbitrary numbering system has always thrown me. I read a Tom's article that showed the 1GB Radeons are outperforming the 2GB in nearly every standard of meaure, which kind of blew my mind. I'm still getting a 2GB.

I'm also going to be looking for a smallish LCD monitor that's okay for gaming, but not optimized for it. I'm giving my wife my previous machine for internets and so on. She wants something lightweight that can fit on a small desk. (Something that can survive my children would be nice too, but I don't think even DARPA could swing it.)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on July 31, 2011, 03:26:31 PM
Their arbitrary numbering system has always thrown me.
Nvidia is doing it too now.  A 550 ti is worse than an 460 gtx


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Yegolev on July 31, 2011, 06:20:12 PM
I might not mind so much except it seems more difficult to get a GFX ranking article out of a trustworthy tech site these days.

My current purchase queue:
1. New mobo+CPU to get my wife's rig back into operation.  Seeing a replacement mobo of her current socket is over $200 means I may as well just get something newer.  I don't know what to get, however.
2. New GFX for my machine... once it is operational.  Still waiting on the mobo RMA from ASUS.  The 5780 that I got from the Sapphire RMA is crap, so I'm going back to Nvidia once I figure out what I need.  Worst case, I will go to newegg and sort by price.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on July 31, 2011, 07:52:35 PM
Most likely bitcoin farmers are buying out all the high end AMD cards. I'd look at the nvidia stuff instead.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Soln on August 01, 2011, 01:34:15 AM
Any complaints against the Sapphire Radeon 6850?  I'm looking for a mid-tier ($100-200) purchase.  If there's better, please recommend. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Minvaren on August 01, 2011, 08:00:17 AM
Found a good local deal on a 6790 1GB over the weekend and decided to upgrade the old 4870 512MB.

An hour after I installed it, I had to turn down the ceiling fan in the room afterward due to the room being cooler!  Apparently there's close to a 50W difference between the two cards at idle and under load.  Think this is the first time a (slight) PC upgrade will help pay for itself in electricity savings...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 01, 2011, 09:33:01 AM
Any complaints against the Sapphire Radeon 6850?  I'm looking for a mid-tier ($100-200) purchase.  If there's better, please recommend.  

I bought one for a super budget gaming PC (total cost for the complete system was under $500) for my father a month or two ago.  It's a good choice in the ~$150 range.  The 6870 can be found for as low as $175 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102948) right now, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on August 01, 2011, 04:00:50 PM
6870 is what I would do instead of a 6850. Plus then you can farm bitcoins.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on August 01, 2011, 05:27:29 PM
I had to Google "bitcoin farming." It sounds like a scam to me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on August 01, 2011, 06:20:40 PM
I'm happy with my 6850. I play at 1920x1080 and in Witcher 2 I get 40-60 fps with everything high / vsync on / aa and ssao off. I considered the 6950 or the 5850 but power supply and $$$ consideration put the 6850 in front.

6970 > 6950, but the original 6950's can be easily flashed to unlock shaders to make it exactly a 6970. I'd buy one of those 6950s and flash it. I ended up flashing and overclocking my 6850 for a couple extra frames.

I haven't heard of bitcoin farming either but now I think I've solved a mystery. A guy on craigslist kept listing high end 6950ish video cards for free, saying he would give away the card in exchange for electricity for a computational project he was doing. I didn't want to end up in a car's trunk trying to test out the deal so I ignored it but I guess he's farming!

On a random tangent I thought I'd splurge on a mouse and got the G500. This thing is huge. I need both hands and both feet to use it. I think I'm getting an Intellimouse instead.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on August 01, 2011, 06:27:39 PM
Yea - now's a great time to sell your 5850's and 5830's on craigslist.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on August 01, 2011, 06:52:40 PM
I'm leaning towards this at the moment. It hits a nice sweet spot between price and capability, it has good reviews, and it's reputed to be quiet (my HD4870 is fairly loud when used for games). My questions at the moment are size (is it too long to fit in my case?) and power supply. I have a 650w Antec Earthwatts, which was more than I needed when I bought it, but after a three years it may have degraded to the point that a new card would require replacement.

HIS IceQ X Turbo H695QNT2G2M Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16, $260 after rebate

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161372


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on August 01, 2011, 10:59:28 PM
Looks like a winner to me. Price is pretty good.

Can't say on card length, but the 6990 is the one that usually causes a lot of trouble, not the 6950/70. I'd think you'd have to have a pretty small case for it to be an issue.

Your Antec PSU is actually a Delta, which is a damned good manufacturer. The 6950 uses about 50 more watts than the 4870, so I'd think you'd be OK in that department--assuming you aren't running something weird like 8 HDDs and a beer cooler from your PC.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on August 01, 2011, 11:02:31 PM
On a random tangent I thought I'd splurge on a mouse and got the G500. This thing is huge. I need both hands and both feet to use it. I think I'm getting an Intellimouse instead.

Man up and grow bigger hands.

Seriously though, it took me a while to get used to the size too, but it's actually pretty comfy and the only two buttons which aren't well placed are the DPI adjustments.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 02, 2011, 08:27:11 AM
On a random tangent I thought I'd splurge on a mouse and got the G500. This thing is huge. I need both hands and both feet to use it. I think I'm getting an Intellimouse instead.

The Logitech G9-x (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826104261) is a great alternative if you like smaller mice but are otherwise happy with your G500.  Same specs and features in a more compact package.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Tarami on August 03, 2011, 06:50:31 AM
Here here. G9(x) is a great mouse. Very solid feel and the flywheel scroll wheel kills. First mouse in many years I'm actually happy to use and in particular, play with.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on August 03, 2011, 10:56:47 AM
Not sure if anyone here actually has the Hyper 212, but on average what are people's CPU temps with an aftermarket cooler? Mine is sitting around 39.5-40.5 with the Hyper 212.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Nightblade on August 03, 2011, 11:03:08 AM
http://www.cmstorm.com/en/products/peripherals/spawn/

This is supposed to be a good mouse and considered flaweless by even the most anal of PC gamers. Mine is coming in today; If anyone is curious I'll post my thoughts.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on August 03, 2011, 11:08:51 AM
Not sure if anyone here actually has the Hyper 212, but on average what are people's CPU temps with an aftermarket cooler? Mine is sitting around 39.5-40.5 with the Hyper 212.

Haven't checked in a while, but I think it was around 34-40 during normal operation.  This on an i5 760.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 08, 2011, 12:28:40 PM
So, I finally bit the bullet and upgraded this weekend. It is now my 'dream machine', approximately costing me ~$1300.

Core i7 2600k CPU
Gigabyte Z68 motherboard
4x2 Corsair XMS ram
Intel 510 250GB SSD
Ximatek Dark Knight CPU cooler

All other parts taken from my old system, including Thermaltake 750 Watt PSU, 5890 ATI video card and Lian Li case.

The most interesting element of the switch over was the video card behavior from an P35 chipset 755 socket Core2Duo system to this new system.

While under full load in the old system, the video card stayed at ~70 C degrees. In the new system, it ratcheted up to 85C. This was bad news for my card. It apparently did some damage and now I get distortion effects on the second monitor when using two monitors.

As a solution, I have under clocked the card's GPU and memory to the lowest possible hertz. This now keeps the temps at around 72C.

I attribute this rise in temperature to the increased bus speed from the P35 to the Z68, allowing far greater performance allowed by the card. To give an practical example, my FPS in World of Tanks went from ~23 FPS to ~100 FPS with the new system. Even with the system entirely underclocked, I still get a solid 70 FPS.

Anyone else experience this phenomenon?



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 08, 2011, 01:22:17 PM
If you had put in a i5-2500K you could've slapped on the amazing gpu cooler I got a month ago or so and still had money for a couple cases of beer.  :grin: Not going to knock a better cpu too hard, though. Just don't see hyperthreading being a big deal for gaming.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 08, 2011, 01:59:52 PM
Hindsight is 20/20. Since I had never had a cooling issue before, I probably would have not got myself a GPU cooler before it was too late in any case.

I hear ya about the 2500k, and I nearly did just go for that one, but what are tax refunds for if not buying something you don't technically need.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 08, 2011, 02:54:57 PM
but what are tax refunds for if not buying something you don't technically need. paying off a first-time home buyer "credit" that is actually a loan repayable over 15 years of tax refunds if you took the "credit" in the first few months, because after that it was a true credit without the repayment component NOT THAT I'M FUCKING BITTER I'LL BE PAYING OVER $300/YR TO UNCLE SAM FOR THE NEXT 14 YEARS
Ahem.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 08, 2011, 04:28:00 PM
Hey, you're now a home owner. You get to mow your lawn, dredge out roof drains, buy your own washer and dryer, paint, remodel, re-wallpaper. What's there not to love?
 :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: dusematic on August 08, 2011, 05:03:03 PM
Intel Core i5-2500K retail      =           $219.99
ASUS P8P67 motherboard =             $164.99
G.Skill 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3-1333 1.5v =$79.99
Powercolor Radeon 6950 1GB =        $244.99
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1TB     =        $64.99

Thinking of pulling the trigger on this build.  My only question is whether my case and power supply will be ok for it.  I currently have an Antec SLK3800B (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129163)

I think the size of the case will be fine.  When I built my system in 2006, 400W was considered crazy overkill.  Not sure if it will be enough for the above build or how to determine how much you need.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on August 08, 2011, 05:46:16 PM
The PS is borderline. On this page (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/24) you can see the delta between idle power usage and the Furmark power usage is ~160W.  The 2nd 12V line on your PS is 12V@15A = 180W and the delta in the previous sentence does not include the power usage at idle so the actually usage is 160W + idle power usage which is probably >= 180W.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 08, 2011, 06:08:28 PM
Also, what kind of monitor setup are you going to use? a 6950 is overkill if you're using a 1680x1050 monitor. It may even be overkill for a single 1980x1200 monitor. If you're using dual monitors, then yes, its gonna be worth it. Otherwise, maybe consider a 6870. Either way, don't be me, watch those thermals, since according to reviews, that thing under load gets up to the high 70Cs


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: dusematic on August 08, 2011, 06:15:16 PM
Also, what kind of monitor setup are you going to use? a 6950 is overkill if you're using a 1680x1050 monitor. It may even be overkill for a single 1980x1200 monitor. If you're using dual monitors, then yes, its gonna be worth it. Otherwise, maybe consider a 6870. Either way, don't be me, watch those thermals, since according to reviews, that thing under load gets up to the high 70Cs


1680x1050.  I will take your advice into consideration and maybe drop it down to 6870.  But from what I've read, no modern game on single monitor can bottleneck an i-5.  So I don't want it to be my graphics card. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 08, 2011, 06:21:06 PM
This PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371048) would be fine for almost any budget-minded single GPU build, and it's fairly cheap. ($50 after MiR)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stormwaltz on August 11, 2011, 12:05:54 AM
HIS IceQ X Turbo H695QNT2G2M Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16, $260 after rebate

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161372

Got this and installed it this evening. And Shrike, thanks for the good word on my PSU. You're right, it works without a hitch.

My desktop is 1920x1600. Compared to the old Visiontek Radeon HD 4870, the new card runs at half the volume, and a good 30C cooler. I had to crank up the fan controls to get the 4870 below 81C at idle in a room with air conditioning. Currently I have the AC off, and this card is idling at 48C.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 11, 2011, 11:14:00 AM
ATI vastly improved the idling speed of their video cards in the 5000 series onwards. Under load its expected that they reach the high 70s, but at idle, depending on your case's internal cooling efficiency, its quite possible to have the card idle in the high 30s.

Unfortunately for me, the one game I have been looking forward to for years and years, IL-2 Cliffs of Dover, is so poorly coded that it doesn't send the card the signal to start working at performance speed, so you need to get 3rd party software to prevent the card from idling down. Neither here nor there really, but I thought it an interesting tidbit about changing technology.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 11, 2011, 11:26:50 AM
I had to crank up the fan controls to get the 4870 below 81C at idle in a room with air conditioning. Currently I have the AC off, and this card is idling at 48C.
:ye_gods: And I thought I had it bad enough to add aftermarket cooling!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 16, 2011, 11:34:40 AM
Cut/paste from my reply to Mr Noisy's post in the 'whatchoo playin', playa?' thread.

My plan is to hold off on my new build until the new AMD part drops in late September. At this point I'm still looking at the i5-2500K SB system unless Ivy Bridge a) actually comes out in the next few months and b) is a significant upgrade over SB and c) isn't $$$ over SB. So...probably building the SB system, hopefully shave a few bucks off due to the AMD part in competition. If not, I'm comfortable with where it's priced now and I hope RAM stays at depressed pricing like it is right now.

The current upgrade spec:

   
ASUS P8Z68 Deluxe  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131753)
$259.99   -$10.00 Instant   $249.99
   
Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072)
$219.99       $219.99
      
CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233147)
$74.99       $74.99
   
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065)
$29.99   -$1.00 Instant   $28.99
   
Nexus BASIC D12SL-12 120mm Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835610006)
$11.99    x4=   $47.96

XIGMATEK CCA-EMFCB-U01 4 in 3 HDD Cage Extra Hard Drive Bay (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817996019)
$24.99       $24.99

Total=$646.91

HDD cage for cooling in the upper part of the pc because it was originally set up for external venting of the gpu. New case fans because the current ones are getting a bit grindy. Z68 deluxe mobo because I just like the features and layout...but I do have a couple concerns. One is the tall heatsinks on the RAM not fitting with the hyper 212. The other is that it might be tight with my X-Fi in the lowest slot if I SLI another GTX 460 with the (awesome) aftermarket cooler on it.

Also, there's the oddness with my current router where the wireless signal is much faster than the wired signal. Still haven't figured that out, and a PCI wireless NIC would not work with SLI. So maybe something like this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833130111), if my wired issues continue.

Other options would be different mobos, mostly, though I do have to come up with an alternative RAM, given the possible issue I mentioned earlier. The GB Z68 is into the crazy expensive zone, but it also features full x16/x16 lanes, which should be better for SLI, yeah?

   
GIGABYTE GA-Z68X-UD7-B3
$349.99       $349.99
   
ASUS P8P67 PRO (REV 3.0)
$189.99   -$10.00 Instant   $179.99
   
ASRock P67 EXTREME6 (B3)
$219.99   -$30.00 Instant   $189.99


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 16, 2011, 12:15:52 PM
The current upgrade spec:
(snip)

As far as I know, there isn't a huge difference between x8/x8 and x16/x16 at current GPU performance levels, but the differences are there - they're just so small that you'd be hard-pressed to notice them.  If you're willing to use a board that runs SLI at x8/x8, I really like the ASRock Extreme4 boards in P67 and Z68 flavors (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=asrock+extreme4+gen3&x=0&y=0) - I just ordered (and am still waiting for) the Z68 Gen3, so I'll let you know how it goes.

Corsair is now making low-profile (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233199) versions (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233186) of their Vengeance memory as well.  CAS latency isn't quite as nice on the ones I see for sale on Newegg, but it's an option to consider.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 16, 2011, 12:19:06 PM
Sky,

It may be worth examining the various kinds of Z68 boards the Asus has. The Deluxe is grand and all that, but after doing a feature for feature analysis on their site, I would have been content with the Pro version, shaving off some bucks. I ended up getting a Gigabyte board, more out of 'loyalty' than anything else.

I'm not sure if 16x16 is that important. What kind of monitor are you running? Remember, anything over, what, 50FPS, you're not even going to notice. Its a biological impossibility. Also, running two cards is gonna heat up your system, so you're gonna have to have leaf blower type action to get it into reasonable temp ranges. Trading noise for performance is ok if you play with headphones most of the time, so its a viable option.

Also, although you don't touch on it directly, ram speed differences after 1600 make little difference in Anand's benchmarks. Its not worth fussing over. Just get a 1600 rated board and you're golden.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on August 16, 2011, 12:22:38 PM
I can almost guarantee the IB will be substantially more expensive than SB. Unless you need hyperthreading for something (or 8 real cores), the 2500K is about optimal.

If you're not going with an SSD, I'm not sure I'd bother with the Z68 and maybe not even then if the SSD is the system drive. I've read a lot on the Z68 and I'm still not sure what this really has to offer over the P67 boards. The SSD thing is its main feature, seemingly, but if you're not using one, I think the P67 would be indicated.

As for SLI, x8/x8 is enough for anything out there right now. Hardocp had some extensive tests on various lane configurations and differences between 16/16, 8/16, 8/8 were minimal.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 16, 2011, 01:42:42 PM
Well, the thing about Ivy is that it would be nice if I could pull the same longevity out of this upgrade as the original computer, which was built in Feb. 2007 (!). Honestly, it can handle just about any game pretty well, but the loong load times (and you know what in November) have me considering the upgrade, especially as I have a (very) small stash of dough that would cover it. But I also don't like skimping to save money, since longevity and performance are important...

The SSD feature on the Z68 is for a system cache, to speed up systems with SATA drives. I'm not intending on using it. I do like the board itself and I'm a whore for heatsinks, though I guess I could glue some of my own on and save a few bucks. That's why I have the P67 boards listed, I believe Gigabyte has a P67 board with x16/x16, though again, not really sold on that.

The RAM numbers I've seen are that the cutoff for performance gains for SB is at 1333, so I have been considering lower speed RAM, though I do like headroom, better bins and whatnot. GSkill seems to be the big name right now, I always thought that was just due to the cheap price, is the quality any good? I've always stuck with Crucial, but had a stick actually fail a couple years ago (the first ever failure of Crucial RAM for me, personally or professionally).

So, as an alternative...




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 16, 2011, 03:49:44 PM
Well, the thing about Ivy is that it would be nice if I could pull the same longevity out of this upgrade as the original computer, which was built in Feb. 2007 (!). Honestly, it can handle just about any game pretty well, but the loong load times (and you know what in November) have me considering the upgrade, especially as I have a (very) small stash of dough that would cover it. But I also don't like skimping to save money, since longevity and performance are important...

The SSD feature on the Z68 is for a system cache, to speed up systems with SATA drives. I'm not intending on using it. I do like the board itself and I'm a whore for heatsinks, though I guess I could glue some of my own on and save a few bucks. That's why I have the P67 boards listed, I believe Gigabyte has a P67 board with x16/x16, though again, not really sold on that.

The RAM numbers I've seen are that the cutoff for performance gains for SB is at 1333, so I have been considering lower speed RAM, though I do like headroom, better bins and whatnot. GSkill seems to be the big name right now, I always thought that was just due to the cheap price, is the quality any good? I've always stuck with Crucial, but had a stick actually fail a couple years ago (the first ever failure of Crucial RAM for me, personally or professionally).

So, as an alternative...



I've heard bad things about the new MSI 'Click' BIOS on their P67/Z68 offerings from a usability standpoint, but generally you rarely need to enter the BIOS anyway, so I wouldn't worry about that too much.  I've been happy with all of the MSI boards I've purchased in the past, and the one you've chosen looks good.

I wouldn't worry too much about longevity with a 2500K.  At stock clocks, the 2500K is enough for any game, and you can OC to 4.5 GHz easily with the Hyper 212 on it.

G.Skill has replaced Corsair as my default memory supplier - I've bought something like 8 kits over the last year and a half from them and never had a bad experience - they've always performed well at their rated specs and often well beyond them, plus the prices are great.

Any cash left over for a case replacement?  I know you're enamored of your Antec, but the Fractal Design Define R3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811352002) would be a worthwhile upgrade - it's got most of the same silencing features, plus modern cable management functionality.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 16, 2011, 04:27:12 PM
I'll be the resident cheap ass and say "why spend more than you have to?"

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128487

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130582

If I were looking to build a new system, I'd go with this one and a micro ATX case with corsair h60 water cooling and aftermarket cooling for the gpu for super quiet gaming goodness.  I wouldn't even put a DVD/BR drive on it.  Just pick up an external to use when I needed it (never):

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128495


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 16, 2011, 09:18:12 PM
Would really prefer to have to Marvell SATA3 for when I get around to throwing in an SSD. Getting real close to my buy point on those, though looking over the state of the market, it seems like I should almost get one now (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148348&T) to get the 32nm drives, everyone is slagging the 22nm newer ones, apparently. But that $100 difference isn't going to really buy me anything I'd want, and I've used ASUS for over ten years (had an Abit once in the 90s). So I'll probably stick with my cadillac Z68 board but go with the GSkill just because it's lower rise and cheap to replace (or double).

Not going to buy a new case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on August 16, 2011, 09:33:06 PM
Fuck water cooling - just something else to fail...and if it fails, it's catastrophic.

Also seems completely unnecessary.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on August 16, 2011, 10:33:24 PM
^ This is huge.  I'm on my fourth or fifth PC build in the last 15 years, and each time I keep it simple.  I rarely run into issues, in fact (knock on wood) this current build is four years old and has no failures.  Besides dumping a coffee in my kyb, dammit. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Shrike on August 16, 2011, 11:15:25 PM
Simple is good. Whenever I got overly ambitious with a build, bad things tended to follow.

My present machine is a 2500K on a UD3 Gigabyte mobo. It has 8gigs of 1333 DDR3 (Crucial, if it matters), and a 580GTX vid card. Simple and it's hella fast. The goal was to drive a 2560x1600 monitor at good framerates. This it does quite well. The only upgrade I'm planning for it is to switch the vid card to a Kepler part when (if) they hit the shelves. And I might hold out on that for another three-four months past release. It does run that well.

Its predecessor (which is still running quite well after 3.5 years) is very similar. i5 750 on a Gigabyte mobo. 4gigs of Corsair RAM, and a 260GTX vid card. It drives an aging Philips 1920x1200 monitor. It's a little twitchy on networking, but runs great otherwise.

Simple is good.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 16, 2011, 11:24:50 PM
Forgot to mention in those posts that I'm on a 1080p monitor, see my greef tittle :) (even though George is technically retired to some redneck's trailer).

George Jr is a 65" Mitsu 1080p 120Hz 3D DLP (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889248061)

So the GTX 460 is mostly cool for my resolution (especially with the aftermarket cooler), I'm cpu-bound like heck in a couple games, though (Civ V, notably, but Rift was a beast, too).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on August 17, 2011, 01:21:42 AM
I've been running G.Skill memory for a while now, and I've got no complaints.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 17, 2011, 10:50:14 AM
Forgot to mention in those posts that I'm on a 1080p monitor, see my greef tittle :) (even though George is technically retired to some redneck's trailer).

George Jr is a 65" Mitsu 1080p 120Hz 3D DLP (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889248061)

So the GTX 460 is mostly cool for my resolution (especially with the aftermarket cooler), I'm cpu-bound like heck in a couple games, though (Civ V, notably, but Rift was a beast, too).

I'm curious; that 'monitor' is only 1920 x 1080, despite its size. Does that mean you don't need a particularly awesome video card for it, or does 'size matter', even if resolution doesn't?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 17, 2011, 11:28:00 AM
Fuck water cooling - just something else to fail...and if it fails, it's catastrophic.

Also seems completely unnecessary.

I've used the Corsair H-series watercoolers for the last...2 years? and have been exceptionally pleased with them.  Plus Corsair will replace any/all damaged items as a result of failure (which has only happened a couple times from reading about them on their forums, hardforum.com and overclock.net).  They're extremely easy to put in and perform well and really freaking quiet - plus they make for a clean install which appeals to my OCD.  Currently running an i5-750 at 4.2Ghz with low-mid 30's at the idle, and low-mid 60's at full bore Prime95 stress testing.

Not my PC, but the difference in looks (even if I only see it when I pop the case every other month or so to spray out the dust bunnies) is worth the price of admission:

H50

Hyper 212 plus


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on August 17, 2011, 11:34:01 AM
Why would you use ties on a hyper 212?  I had no issues clipping the fan on and it's been running fine with just one fan on the heat sink.  No heat issues at all here.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 17, 2011, 12:29:02 PM
No idea why they did that.  Was just an image I picked out of GIS.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on August 17, 2011, 12:57:41 PM
Ok that shot of the H50 is very clean and appealing. You fucker, now I am curious enough to spend the rest of the day reading about it.

Still debating a new build. My e8400 has been performing solidly for years now, I know it's starting to creep up on EOL with the SB stuff out now, but I wonder how much more I can pull out of it if I drop a new vid card in along with a bump in memory.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 17, 2011, 01:20:37 PM
Get the H60.  Better rad design and better pump/CPU unit design.  I'm going to pull mine apart the next couple of days and spray it out.  I'll post up pics if I remember to do so.

I am tempted, oh so tempted, to pull the H50 out of mine, upgrade it to an H60, then see about hooking the "old" H50 it up to a GTX460 video card.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 17, 2011, 01:34:04 PM
I've always been a fan of giant air coolers - partly because I don't want to deal with the perils of water cooling (whether through a one-box solution like the H-series or a full custom water loop), but also because I just really like the look of big honking air coolers.  

Despite not wanting to do it myself, I'm always impressed with the work that goes into a full CPU/chipset/GPU water loop - it's just not for me.

Also, Corsair recently released the H100 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181017) - a 2x120 rad self-contained solution.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 17, 2011, 02:15:03 PM
I'm curious; that 'monitor' is only 1920 x 1080, despite its size. Does that mean you don't need a particularly awesome video card for it, or does 'size matter', even if resolution doesn't?
1080 can be tough on 40yr old eyes from 10' away :) But as far as a gpu, right now the 460 is doing pretty damned well with most games. It's desirable to have it run at 60fps so you can sync it, and the more bells and whistles, the better, I say. Also, as I mentioned about other things, I prefer a lot of headroom, less heat and stress on the parts. But 1080p is 1080p, whether it's 65" or 23". Imo, it's almost a perfect living room res, only gets tough on games that won't scale the UI (like Dawn of Discovery :( ).

With your gpu, don't forget to cool the RAM and voltage regulators. The honking system I use is quiet and cool as hell, I may have gushed a bit about it  :why_so_serious:

Giving thought to the H60 idea. With the cage fan for the extra pull, it could make for a nice system. Still like the idea of 4 12cm fans across the top layer of the pc, though (if I were to go with a hyper212 with push/pull).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 17, 2011, 02:24:38 PM
Also, Corsair recently released the H100 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181017) - a 2x120 rad self-contained solution.

Since I made my post earlier, I went browsing to see what new stuff Corsair had come out with and saw that.  Sexy.  It pretty much made up my mind that I am going to yank out my H50 and see about modding it to it a GPU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 17, 2011, 02:30:06 PM
Again, I don't think cooling the gpu with that would be ideal. Hell, the main issue I've had with evga stock cooling is they don't properly cool the components other than the gpu.

And you need the right case for the H100, it's huuuge. For me, anyway, H60 would be about perfect, other than the fact that it will cut airflow out of the case, especially compared to putting in the hyper212, which would give me more room for push/pull on it (the old scythe ninja could work with push/pull, but barely). Having that honking radiator blocking the outflow fan is not insignificant when considering the other components in the case. Maybe if I top-mounted it, but I like the nice neat airflow of front to back without the top swirling that around.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 17, 2011, 03:17:26 PM
Stop being sensible and let me do crazy shit to GPU okay?  ok.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on August 17, 2011, 04:41:25 PM
I've always thought that water cooling was certainly interesting, but...since I'm going to be moving around overseas every few years, that just doesn't seem practical.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on August 17, 2011, 10:59:12 PM
Water is that scarce in Africa?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on August 18, 2011, 01:11:25 AM
I think it's because their water runs on a different voltage.

I bought a fancy new GTX570 (or whatever the proper nomenclature for the 570 is), but I haven't been able to try it out yet as we're still in the middle of an intergalactic move.  Should be a nice upgrade for my GTX285 - which I should add has been quite an able piece of kit.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Daeven on August 18, 2011, 01:04:45 PM
Stop being sensible and let me do crazy shit to GPU okay?  ok.

If money is no object you could get really psycho with one of these: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130665

I admit to being slightly tempted to sell off an organ or three so I could build a 990x system around that card, but it seems slightly silly.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 18, 2011, 01:11:40 PM
It's not that money is or isn't an object; it's that buying it already done like that defeats the purpose of doing it myself.  Plus you'd have to buy the pump and resevoir and everything else putting it at or near 1,000 bucks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Daeven on August 18, 2011, 01:15:15 PM
I can't argue with that.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 18, 2011, 01:33:58 PM
It's not that money is or isn't an object; it's that buying it already done like that defeats the purpose of doing it myself.  Plus you'd have to buy the pump and resevoir and everything else putting it at or near 1,000 bucks.
http://www.mwave.com/mwave/SKUSearch.asp?scriteria=AA79128

 :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 18, 2011, 03:16:20 PM
I can't argue with that.

Plus I'd expect the GTX 6xx cards due out sometime first half of next year to totally obsolesce the 5xx series.  If the air cooled GTX 590 were in the mid 300-400 range, I'd consider it.  I'd just sell my GTX 460 1GB cards.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on August 18, 2011, 03:23:03 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121429

Seriously? 2 slot single card?  :uhrr:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 18, 2011, 03:27:53 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121429

Seriously? 2 slot single card?  :uhrr:

Three, actually.  I'm still waiting for my three-slot GTX570 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121432) to arrive. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: SnakeCharmer on August 18, 2011, 03:53:32 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121429

Seriously? 2 slot single card?  :uhrr:

Looks like the extra slot is made up of copper cooling pipes and such.  I imagine that the cooling solution that Sky posted up there takes up about the same amount of room, just without the fancy plastic cover that this one has.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on August 18, 2011, 04:54:52 PM
Water is that scarce in Africa?

No, but the system would be way more vulnerable to damage while in-transit, and if something breaks I won't be able to just drive to Best Buy or something to buy a replacement.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 20, 2011, 05:39:39 PM
So I'm finally looking at having some time to actually play games again and have finally gotten sick of my 3600's tendency to crap out out on me. I'll get a display driver crashed error after everything freezes for 10 seconds or so and my screen reboots. This will even very occasionally happen just in windows but a recent attempt to play R:TW found it happening roughly every 5 seconds on the Campaign map. It has persisted through every driver update I've tried, although it will stop crashing sometimes for no apparent reason. I bought it cause it was on offer and was skimping on the system, it's lasted a year and I'd like to replace it with something that will let me play with a few bells and whistles but no real serious need for power. I've got a 1080 monitor and a lot of the games I'm playing are a year or so old but I'd like to be able to play Skyrim at a decent framerate (assuming that the rest of my PC can handle it) as an example. I've got an i7 920 on an ASUS P6T motherboard and generally a woeful lack of knowledge on hardware beyond knowing some the relevant manufacturer names and having heard of some of the latest cards. Budget wise I'd like to keep it under £200 but feel free to suggest stuff that will work well with what I've got, hell feel free to just tell me what are decent cards out now and I'll go do all the compatibility checking myself. It's just I go to on-line shops and am confronted with page upon page of cards for different prices that have similar words and numbers with pretty pictures and none of it makes any fucking sense.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on August 20, 2011, 11:55:39 PM
For under £200 I'd say either GTX560 or Radeon 6870. They should both be available for around £130-150.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 21, 2011, 03:26:48 AM
That sounds way more simple than my slightly ranting post expected. Is there any real difference between then two? Also is there realistically any difference between card manufacturers?

Edit: Probably more importantly, if I'm running a single monitor would it be worth looking at a 2gb model over the 1gb? Or will that give me a very negligible performance boost for a noticeable amount of cash?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 21, 2011, 02:19:28 PM
I read on Anand that the difference between 2 and 1 gb in memory is negligible at this stage.

With regards to the 5000 series of ATI cards, I have to warn ya, I have one, and I have a flickering issue (just type 'ATI 5870 flickering' in google) when using dual monitors (has to do with dropping core and memory clock speeds to super low idle rates when switching between performance states).

It took me forever to fix, after much googling and trying various solutions.

Other than that, its a good card, but honestly, this was such clownshoes, and so easy for ATI to fix, that I think that Nvidia is probably the way to go.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 21, 2011, 02:54:05 PM
Yeah ATI cards really seem to be beset with stupid driver problems. On the other hand I've found a 6870 for £135, which seems to be a decent amount cheaper than anything similar. Enough that I feel it'd be worth dropping an extra 2GB RAM chip into the motherboard as well. Seems like this might offer me the best overall performance boost for the price, I just really hope I don't discover the same problem with the ATI card if I go for it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 21, 2011, 05:16:19 PM
Decided to finally get around to bumping up my creaky old e6600. Unfortunately, a couple years ago I replaced a bad stick of my ddr2-1000 with ddr2-800, so my RAM was a bit limiting on the fun.

Went from straight stock 2.4GHz to 3.0 without breaking a sweat, but can't get anything else out of it because the ram is being bitchy and the stupid C2D capped multiplier (capped at x9, x11 would be nice). Forget the exact setting I had to use with the ram, bumped down two technology notches in the list (technically running at 834MHz, iirc) and timing went from the stock 4-4-4-12 to 5-5-5-15.

PCMarks went from 1889 to 2143 (with the ram auto-timed to 5-6-6-18, I fixed that after running the test) and 3DMarks went from P2837 to P3007, with the physics/combined scores going from 1935/1849 to 2288/2173.

So a nice little bump to tide me over to sandier bridges.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on August 21, 2011, 05:25:47 PM
Or perhaps Ivy-er Bridges. :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on August 21, 2011, 05:53:12 PM
I am going to have to manage on my e8400 Wolfdale till I start getting back into the black. Means I'll have to bump the memory up a bit and get rid of this tired 8800GT and pray a lot but the chip is still running solid OC'd @ 3.4gHz on the stock sink. Memory is easy enough to take care of, but I am going to have to read a few pages about Vid cards...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on August 22, 2011, 12:14:54 AM
Yeah ATI cards really seem to be beset with stupid driver problems. On the other hand I've found a 6870 for £135, which seems to be a decent amount cheaper than anything similar. Enough that I feel it'd be worth dropping an extra 2GB RAM chip into the motherboard as well. Seems like this might offer me the best overall performance boost for the price, I just really hope I don't discover the same problem with the ATI card if I go for it.

I really have nothing useful to offer on the ATI vs nVidia debate. I've stuck doggedly with nVidia for 10 years after having no end of trouble with an ATI card once, which I know is just prejudice, but there ya go. For a long time now ATI seem to have been edging out nVidia on the price:performance scale in the mid-range, but I have also heard a lot of people talk about driver problems.

At the end of the day the performance difference between cards of the same tier is minimal. Tom's Hardware regularly (every couple of months) runs a "best graphics card for the money" article that has a hierarchy chart (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-performance-radeon-geforce,2997-7.html) of graphics cards. My advice is to decide your price point and then look at cards within 1 tier either side of that and look for the things that are important to you - noise, dual outputs, number of slots required, etc.

Personally I won't touch ATIs with a barge-pole, but like I said, I know that's just stupid prejudice.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 22, 2011, 12:32:22 AM
I tend to fall on the nvidia side, but I try to re-evaluate with every upgrade. The 8800GTX was a beast, and the GTX460 is a great mid-range card. But then, nvidia also has me locked in with 3D Vision.

My last ATI was a 9800Pro, which was amazing for its time.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 22, 2011, 07:49:29 PM
Well, the parts from Newegg arrived finally:


Core i5-2500K
ASRock Z68 Extreme4 Gen3 - great board, but the heatsinks around the socket are a pain in the ass
8GB Corsair Vengeance - finally, Corsair makes nice modules with low-profile heat spreaders
ASUS GTX570 - This thing is heavy as hell and while I was somewhat worried about the sagging visible in the pic, I don't plan to tote this PC around anywhere, so it hopefully isn't too much of an issue
Corsair Nova2 60GB SSD + Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB
NZXT Hale90 750W
NZXT Phantom - good lord this case is huge
CM Hyper 212 - the motherboard's heatsinks were just too big for me to fit my original choice  :heartbreak:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on August 22, 2011, 09:20:07 PM
That looks very sweet, and the cable management hand-wringers of F13 will surely approve :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on August 22, 2011, 09:29:38 PM
 :heart: the case. Is that powder coated inside? Really slick looking and huuuge. It might even fit that honking cooler I have on the 460.

Looks like you'd still have room for the taller heat spreaders with the hyper212 on that mobo, wonder if that's reference spacing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 22, 2011, 09:42:38 PM
:heart: the case. Is that powder coated inside? Really slick looking and huuuge. It might even fit that honking cooler I have on the 460.

Looks like you'd still have room for the taller heat spreaders with the hyper212 on that mobo, wonder if that's reference spacing.

It's gloss paint - the same stuff they use on everything but the plastic front fascia - and has a nice hard durable finish.  I'm pretty sure that the Accelero wouldn't be an issue at all - there's probably well over a foot of room between the expansion slot backplane and the back side of the HDD cage (for reference, the fans on top are 200mm NZXT units).

I'd originally intended to use the Cooler Master V6GT (which would have hung over the RAM slots) as I did in my i5-760 box, but it's heatpipes interfered with the bulky heatsinks above the CPU socket.  Fortunately, I had a Hyper 212 sitting here, which I'd planned to use on my brother's upcoming PC build.  Looks like he just got a free CPU cooler upgrade.   :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Tale on August 23, 2011, 05:29:10 AM
I've built my own PCs for the last 15 years, because it was always so much more worthwhile than what you could buy. Time came for a new build, I thought about an i7 rig with 8Gb RAM and up-to-date graphics. Then I looked around at the insanely low prices of prebuilt notebook PCs with similar specs and thought hell no, I'm getting an i7 sandy bridge notebook for A$800, putting a $200 SSD in it and using it as my desktop.

Works great for anything I can currently throw at it. It's got Radeon HD 6770 2Gb, fingerprint security, HDMI out and USB 3.0 to which I've connected my old SATA desktop drives in an A$80 dock. It's compact, portable if need be, has a UPS otherwise known as a battery, and my desktop monitor doubles as a USB hub. I've already got a netbook for knockabout tasks around the house.

Screw building me a desktop PC in the current market.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 23, 2011, 05:45:29 AM
But then you don't get the fun of random components not working or trying to fight your way round seemingly random, unlabelled wires and pins slotting into different places. Surely that alone is worth a little extra cost? :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 23, 2011, 08:19:15 AM
But then you don't get the fun of random components not working or trying to fight your way round seemingly random, unlabelled wires and pins slotting into different places. Surely that alone is worth a little extra cost? :awesome_for_real:

Exactly!  You're missing out on the fun!  :)  Kidding aside, I know that there are more convenient options, but I love putting these things together and tinkering, even (especially?) when it starts getting a bit more involved - it's like really expensive LEGO.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Soln on August 26, 2011, 02:55:45 PM
Can we sticky this thread?  It's very useful.  I keep coming back to it for build stories like Noisy's and other recommendations.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 27, 2011, 04:22:49 AM
Since the partition I'm running Windows on (70GB) is looking worryingly full and the drive itself is getting on a bit in age, I'm looking at replacing it with something to boost my system performance a tad. SSDs seem to have a 'reasonable' pricing up to the 80-90GB mark, which would be perfect for an OS drive at the moment but I'm slightly worried about whether that would be enough space if MS releases a massive new service pack for W7. Or, while it seems like XP to be one of those OSes I'll be sticking with for quite a few years, if they bring out a new one that needs more space will that SSD be able to do the job? Not wanting to spend a twice as much for 50% more space I think that's a concern.

The other option is getting a hybrid drive that uses a small SSD as a buffer, which is much cheaper but I haven't really seen any strong opinions on. Are they really significantly better than regular drives and would they make a worthwhile new drive for sticking an OS on?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on August 27, 2011, 05:04:59 AM
My Win7 folder is actually only 18Gb - it's the user directories and Program Files that seems to take a lot of space. You can probably shift a lot of that stuff off of the primary drive if you run out of space.

SSDs seem to be in a major state of flux atm. I'm guessing that price per Gb will drop considerably over the next year or so, so it's probably not worth spending a fortune on them now, just get the minimum size you need maybe?

Edit: Tom's Hardware just put up a "Best SSDs for the money (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-solid-state-nand-reliability,2998.html)" article that may be helpful.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 27, 2011, 05:22:58 AM
Really? I've got a few programs I know I installed there but not that many. I'll need to check and seriously prune back that partition. My inclination at the moment, if hybrid drives are good bang for the buck, would be to get a 500gb one and use it with an OS partition for everything and then move the OS to an SSD at some later date, keeping that drive for running programs on. I'm just not sure what sort of features I should be looking for with those drives or whether they're actually worth the money over regular HDDs.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 29, 2011, 04:25:13 PM
Since the partition I'm running Windows on (70GB) is looking worryingly full and the drive itself is getting on a bit in age, I'm looking at replacing it with something to boost my system performance a tad. SSDs seem to have a 'reasonable' pricing up to the 80-90GB mark, which would be perfect for an OS drive at the moment but I'm slightly worried about whether that would be enough space if MS releases a massive new service pack for W7. Or, while it seems like XP to be one of those OSes I'll be sticking with for quite a few years, if they bring out a new one that needs more space will that SSD be able to do the job? Not wanting to spend a twice as much for 50% more space I think that's a concern.

The other option is getting a hybrid drive that uses a small SSD as a buffer, which is much cheaper but I haven't really seen any strong opinions on. Are they really significantly better than regular drives and would they make a worthwhile new drive for sticking an OS on?

My most recent build uses a 60GB SSD as the OS/primary application (browsers, etc) drive and a 1TB Samsung as the 'everything else' drive.  As long as you remember to remap all your 'documents'/media folders to the secondary conventional drive and make sure that new installs go there, you'll be good (and don't forget to install Steam to the big conventional drive too!)  

SSD as boot drive is pretty slick - even my budget SATA2 Corsair SSD boots so fast that Windows is at login before the windows splash animation is half-done.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on August 29, 2011, 11:47:28 PM
Well, the parts from Newegg arrived finally:


Core i5-2500K
ASRock Z68 Extreme4 Gen3 - great board, but the heatsinks around the socket are a pain in the ass
8GB Corsair Vengeance - finally, Corsair makes nice modules with low-profile heat spreaders
ASUS GTX570 - This thing is heavy as hell and while I was somewhat worried about the sagging visible in the pic, I don't plan to tote this PC around anywhere, so it hopefully isn't too much of an issue
Corsair Nova2 60GB SSD + Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB
NZXT Hale90 750W
NZXT Phantom - good lord this case is huge
CM Hyper 212 - the motherboard's heatsinks were just too big for me to fit my original choice  :heartbreak:

Aside from your CPU heatsink, did you have to buy any after market fans for your NZXT phantom? I remember my last coolermaster came with a lot of air vents but no actual fans.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Soln on August 30, 2011, 12:58:07 AM
Anyone have a favorite KVM solution?  Something that won't hang on resolution changes?  Or degrade the experience on your preferred machine?  thanks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on August 30, 2011, 02:18:04 AM
Anyone have a favorite KVM solution?  Something that won't hang on resolution changes?  Or degrade the experience on your preferred machine?  thanks.
I have this one for my DVI input/output: http://www.iogear.com/product/GCS1104/

I have 2 PCs and 2 Macs hooked up to it.


And I have this one for my HDMI input/output: http://www.iogear.com/product/GCS1794/

This one I have a PC, a Mac and my PS3 hooked up to it.

Both are outputting to 1080p displays. The DVI one has been rock-solid -- I've had that one for a while. The HDMI one is pretty new and is a bit glitchy on the keyboard on my Mac -- occasionally a key will get stuck and repeat for some reason. Hitting any key will stop it. Doesn't seem to be happening on the PC.

On both I have my mice hooked up through the extra USB port(s) rather than the dedicated mouse USB port since my mice have extra functions that get messed up through the normal mouse port.

Edit: typos


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on August 30, 2011, 03:59:16 AM
Aside from your CPU heatsink, did you have to buy any after market fans for your NZXT phantom? I remember my last coolermaster came with a lot of air vents but no actual fans.

I added a 140mm Lian-Li fan from my previous case as intake to the front panel and ordered another NZXT 200mm fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835146007) for the top - the case comes with three 120mm fans (1 exhaust and two flowing air through the HDD cages from the left door) and 1 200mm fan in the top rear position.  I don't know if the extra fans are actually necessary, to be honest.  

The case has an additional mounting point on the left door for another 200mm fan parked right on top of the motherboard, but installing it will interfere with large CPU coolers.

If you have the room for it and like the styling, the Phantom is a really nice case to build in with a fair amount of bells and whistles.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NowhereMan on August 30, 2011, 05:47:03 AM
My most recent build uses a 60GB SSD as the OS/primary application (browsers, etc) drive and a 1TB Samsung as the 'everything else' drive.  As long as you remember to remap all your 'documents'/media folders to the secondary conventional drive and make sure that new installs go there, you'll be good (and don't forget to install Steam to the big conventional drive too!)  

SSD as boot drive is pretty slick - even my budget SATA2 Corsair SSD boots so fast that Windows is at login before the windows splash animation is half-done.

Yeah on further examination my W7 folder is clocking in around 22GB and there's about 7GB from the pagefile and hiberfile.sys, moving the libraries to a different file freed up a bit more (although I've never really put anything into those, not sure what program was copying my music files into My Music). It could happily live on a 60GB drive with room for expansion but Crucial UK have been selling refurbed C300's for really low prices so I've just nabbed a 128GB for £90 that hopefully doesn't just nuke itself a day after warranty ends. I'll stick the OS and some of the larger programs (like Photoshop) onto that one. Firefox has been really slow to load from start up for quite a while now (as in launching after boot. Fucker takes longer than Steam and sometimes seems like Windows forgets I've tried to launch it). I'm curious to see if this improves that. I'm going to try and extend the D: partition on the original drive and just use that for games and other assorted programs as it could do with some more room too (I noticed the other day that my Steam folder was up to 150GB, really need to uninstall some of that stuff).

In case anyone else is wondering after examining hybrid drives it seems like most of them have a really small flash cache (4GB or so) that really precludes them being great for booting or launching programs. They're certainly far cheaper than SSDs right now but that's changing slowly and they lack a lot of the other nice features. Although you don't have to worry about the whole drive suddenly not being there anymore after a firmware hiccup.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on August 31, 2011, 05:37:49 AM
Aside from your CPU heatsink, did you have to buy any after market fans for your NZXT phantom? I remember my last coolermaster came with a lot of air vents but no actual fans.

I added a 140mm Lian-Li fan from my previous case as intake to the front panel and ordered another NZXT 200mm fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835146007) for the top - the case comes with three 120mm fans (1 exhaust and two flowing air through the HDD cages from the left door) and 1 200mm fan in the top rear position.  I don't know if the extra fans are actually necessary, to be honest.  

The case has an additional mounting point on the left door for another 200mm fan parked right on top of the motherboard, but installing it will interfere with large CPU coolers.

If you have the room for it and like the styling, the Phantom is a really nice case to build in with a fair amount of bells and whistles.

Great thanks. I was thinking of using it for my next build since it looks pretty awesome.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: tgr on August 31, 2011, 05:47:32 AM
Personally, re: win7 and C:, I'm contemplating going for 160 or 200GB SSD once they reach a certain price point (i.e. around 2000NOK, or 375-400 usd), for one simple reason: I'm getting tired of having to constantly watch how much space is left. I think I had a 20G C: partition back in the XP days, and I installed all programs on the larger data disk/partition, and that was fine. I increased that to 30G for win7, but even that isn't enough. So overkill it is. :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on August 31, 2011, 10:18:20 AM
I got a good deal on the Corsair c300 (256gb) last year, and have been using it as a boot drive. Still have 60gb free even with all my steam stuff, and windows launches fast. Quite happy with it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 02, 2011, 08:26:01 AM
So here is what I'm looking at. I basically just copied the Sandy Bridge high range buyers guide from anand, but swapped out the ram, case, and mobo.

Intel Core i7-2600K Sandy Bridge
ASUS P8Z68-V PRO LGA 1155
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 1600
EVGA 015-P3-1580-AR GeForce GTX 580
Intel 510 Series 120GB SSD
Samsung SpinPoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB HDD
ASUS DRW-24B1ST SATA 24X DVD Burner
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1 CPU cooler   
NZXT Phantom PHAN-001WT ATX Full Tower Computer Case
Corsair Professional Series AX750 750W PSU

I'll probably have to switch the PSU since I'm buying all these parts over seas, assuming I don't get totally raped after checking out amazon.co.jp.  I just wanted an initial build to work off of when deciding what to order. I haven't given a shit about computer parts in years, so I have no idea how to compare all of Intel's new tech terms for what looks like more meaningless stuff on their chips. But what do I know. I went with the Asus PRO because it has 8 USB slots instead of 4 from what the ananad guys recommended. Although I'm thinking that big expensive GTX 580 might not be worth it.

Total is $1,750 which seems excessive to me, suggestions?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 02, 2011, 10:48:42 AM
So here is what I'm looking at. I basically just copied the Sandy Bridge high range buyers guide from anand, but swapped out the ram, case, and mobo.

Intel Core i7-2600K Sandy Bridge
ASUS P8Z68-V PRO LGA 1155
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 1600
EVGA 015-P3-1580-AR GeForce GTX 580
Intel 510 Series 120GB SSD
Samsung SpinPoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB HDD
ASUS DRW-24B1ST SATA 24X DVD Burner
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1 CPU cooler   
NZXT Phantom PHAN-001WT ATX Full Tower Computer Case
Corsair Professional Series AX750 750W PSU

I'll probably have to switch the PSU since I'm buying all these parts over seas, assuming I don't get totally raped after checking out amazon.co.jp.  I just wanted an initial build to work off of when deciding what to order. I haven't given a shit about computer parts in years, so I have no idea how to compare all of Intel's new tech terms for what looks like more meaningless stuff on their chips. But what do I know. I went with the Asus PRO because it has 8 USB slots instead of 4 from what the ananad guys recommended. Although I'm thinking that big expensive GTX 580 might not be worth it.

Total is $1,750 which seems excessive to me, suggestions?

Unless you use a lot of applications that will benefit from HyperThreading (video compression, etc.), drop to a 2500K and save around $100 - the 2500K and 2600K are so close as to be practically identical in terms of gaming performance.  Similarly, a GTX570 may make more sense unless you game at bonkers resolutions and would save you $150+.

With the Phantom you've got both room and airflow to spare, so you can skip the blower box cards and get a video card with a good non-reference type solution.  The coolers on the MSI 'Twin Frozr' and ASUS 'DirectCuII' cards are quite nice (though the ASUS takes up three slots and weighs a ton).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 02, 2011, 11:13:14 AM
Any reason for the Intel SSD rather than the C300, save a few bucks there, too. You could shave $20 going with an MSI P67A-GD65 motherboard (though I like ASUS and it's a MIR). You could also drop to 1033 RAM. The egg shocker right now is 8GB of Patriot ddr3 1600 for $30 with MIR. And to extend Mr N's advice on gpu cooling, the gpu cooler I put on my 460 is so much better (and QUIETER) than a stock blower, it's really worth it imo, you'll get better performance and longer life from your card, which is usually the single most expensive component.

Now that I've spec'd out my upgrade I'm dyyyying to build it, but have to hold off until the end of October. If I lose my job, a new pc doesn't seem so important anymore....


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 02, 2011, 11:52:20 AM
Another thing - if you're not going to be using the SSD caching feature of the Z68 motherboard (it looks like you'll just be going with the SSD as OS), you may want to look at a comparable P67 board (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131771) instead, which will probably be about $30-40 cheaper.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 02, 2011, 10:14:46 PM
With the Phantom you've got both room and airflow to spare, so you can skip the blower box cards and get a video card with a good non-reference type solution.  The coolers on the MSI 'Twin Frozr' and ASUS 'DirectCuII' cards are quite nice (though the ASUS takes up three slots and weighs a ton).

Sorry, how do I tell if a GPU come with a box blower or non-reference cooler? I tend to like EVGA but I don't see any type of cooler options on their 570 cards, but then my last card that I actually bought a 9800 Pro...

Another thing - if you're not going to be using the SSD caching feature of the Z68 motherboard (it looks like you'll just be going with the SSD as OS), you may want to look at a comparable P67 board (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131771) instead, which will probably be about $30-40 cheaper.

From what I gather it helps if you are watching a lot of HD videos? If so I may just leave it since I seem to do that a lot.

After making the changes that dropped it down to 1,478 which is a lot more manageable.

Now my problem is that after building a comparable PC on amazon.co.jp, after the exchange rate I'm paying an extra $500 just to get the parts which isn't cool.

Hey Noisy, how much do you think your PC weighs with all the components in it? I'm contemplating just shipping it to someone in the states and having them ship it to me since it could possibly be cheaper.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 03, 2011, 03:03:04 AM
Sorry, how do I tell if a GPU come with a box blower or non-reference cooler? I tend to like EVGA but I don't see any type of cooler options on their 570 cards, but then my last card that I actually bought a 9800 Pro...

Hey Noisy, how much do you think your PC weighs with all the components in it? I'm contemplating just shipping it to someone in the states and having them ship it to me since it could possibly be cheaper.

The empty chassis is about 20 pounds, with the system fully built weighing about twice that in total.  I also wouldn't ship that PC via any carrier without removing the video card and CPU cooler - those things are heavy, with all the weight standing off the motherboard.

As for the video card cooler thing, this one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130593) has a 'reference'/box type cooler - single intake and closed around the card itself - all air is exhausted out of the chassis, while this MSI (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127564) has a non-reference two-fan solution.  You likely won't have an issue either way, to be honest - that case will be pushing a lot of air around - so if you like EVGA's warranty, etc then stick with them.  The two/three fan-cooled cards do tend to run cooler and quieter, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on September 03, 2011, 09:13:50 AM
Note that evga's warranty allows you to install an aftermarket cooler as long as you keep the original cooler and return it to stock for RMA. But on the other hand, you'll be getting a refurbished replacement...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 05, 2011, 01:48:09 AM
Note that evga's warranty allows you to install an aftermarket cooler as long as you keep the original cooler and return it to stock for RMA. But on the other hand, you'll be getting a refurbished replacement...

I suppose if it worked then thats alright.

After visting the nearest computer parts store, the cheapest way to get this done is to use various sources like kakaku.com, this component store, and then amazon. I'm wondering if I'm asking for trouble by buying parts from various vendors, in case something goes wrong in which I have to deal with RMA'ing parts to a multitude of places vs just dealing with one vendor. I had a nightmare with newegg a few years back trying to RMA some parts and I've been weary ever since. Also, are there components which generally have more problems than others, in which I should pay the extra yen and get from a local store which I can take things back too as opposed to dealing with faceless internet sellers? I was thinking I could at least save some dough by getting the case, ram, and possibly CPU online.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 06, 2011, 08:45:50 AM
After visting the nearest computer parts store, the cheapest way to get this done is to use various sources like kakaku.com, this component store, and then amazon. I'm wondering if I'm asking for trouble by buying parts from various vendors, in case something goes wrong in which I have to deal with RMA'ing parts to a multitude of places vs just dealing with one vendor. I had a nightmare with newegg a few years back trying to RMA some parts and I've been weary ever since. Also, are there components which generally have more problems than others, in which I should pay the extra yen and get from a local store which I can take things back too as opposed to dealing with faceless internet sellers? I was thinking I could at least save some dough by getting the case, ram, and possibly CPU online.

If the prices are comparable, I'd say get as much as possible locally, though the only nonfunctional part I've received in quite some time (not counting the original P67 SATA controller design flaw) was a bad stick of DDR2 memory a little over a year ago.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 08, 2011, 03:57:27 AM
Does anyone who has ordered all of their stuff from the Egg remember how big the box was that contained everything aside form the case? Assuming it doesn't weigh too much it might literally be cheaper to get everything aside from the case and PSU shipped from Newegg to the states, and then shipped to me in Japan.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 08, 2011, 08:26:29 AM
My order came in a few boxes - the case was just shipped by itself, while the rest came in a couple of boxes i'd guess to be about 30"x24"x12" or so.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on September 08, 2011, 09:43:28 AM
My order came in a few boxes - the case was just shipped by itself, while the rest came in a couple of boxes i'd guess to be about 30"x24"x12" or so.

Yeah, Egg tends to ship in boxes that fit the product. The only thing I did not really like was their way of shipping sticks of ram. Bubble envelops scare me esp sent USPS... scare me even more when they are sending ram sticks in flimsy plastic in said envelops. But if you get, say a processor and sticks of ram, it all comes in a fairly small box. Case though... well I'll get my cases from somewhere else because they ship them in their packaging box and come usually banged to shit or in my latest case, busted in the front. Luckily, I am handy and could "fix" it myself, but still.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 08, 2011, 12:45:59 PM
Case though... well I'll get my cases from somewhere else because they ship them in their packaging box and come usually banged to shit or in my latest case, busted in the front. Luckily, I am handy and could "fix" it myself, but still.

Unfortunately, that's not limited to Newegg - Amazon shipped me a NZXT Vulcan in the packaging box, and the mesh part of the door had been beat up by UPS - I ended up replacing the damaged part with an acrylic window.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on September 08, 2011, 02:15:36 PM
Case though... well I'll get my cases from somewhere else because they ship them in their packaging box and come usually banged to shit or in my latest case, busted in the front. Luckily, I am handy and could "fix" it myself, but still.

Unfortunately, that's not limited to Newegg - Amazon shipped me a NZXT Vulcan in the packaging box, and the mesh part of the door had been beat up by UPS - I ended up replacing the damaged part with an acrylic window.

Noted. Think I should just find a brick and mortar store... though I love my sunbeam case and will definately reuse it on my next build.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 09, 2011, 03:17:19 AM
Yeah Ill probably end up getting the CPU, GPU, RAM, heatsink, and SSD from newegg and have it shipped. Below is my final compiled list, if someone could give it a quick look over before I pull the trigger that would be awesome.


MB: Asus Z68 V (Unless someone thinks the V-Pro is worth the extra cash)
CPU: i5-2500K
GPU: SAPPHIRE Toxic 100312TXSR Radeon HD 6950 2GB
RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333
HDD: Samsung Spin Point 1 TB
SSD: Crucial M4 128 GB
DVD: Liteon iHas324-27
CASE: NZXT Phantom
PSU: Corsair TX750

I'm getting raped on PSU prices over here but unless I get some Japanese brand PSU I know nothing about, I have little choice.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: tgr on September 09, 2011, 06:41:09 AM
I've been told the crucials might have a problem causing lockups, not sure if they've fixed that in the firmware or if you might want to go for an intel 320 instead. I just got mine last weekend, and apart from the fact I had to move tons of data off to be able to migrate the C: partition to the SSD (long story short: old main disk was 250G disk partitioned into 30G C: rest D:, the intel migration thingy didn't want to do this until the entire partition setup on the old isk was less than 160GB. No biggie, really, but annoying if you've got a bigger disk/partition as your C: drive), it's been a-ok.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 09, 2011, 07:32:55 AM
Yeah Ill probably end up getting the CPU, GPU, RAM, heatsink, and SSD from newegg and have it shipped. Below is my final compiled list, if someone could give it a quick look over before I pull the trigger that would be awesome.

MB: Asus Z68 V (Unless someone thinks the V-Pro is worth the extra cash)
CPU: i5-2500K
GPU: SAPPHIRE Toxic 100312TXSR Radeon HD 6950 2GB
RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333
HDD: Samsung Spin Point 1 TB
SSD: Crucial M4 128 GB
DVD: Liteon iHas324-27
CASE: NZXT Phantom
PSU: Corsair TX750

I'm getting raped on PSU prices over here but unless I get some Japanese brand PSU I know nothing about, I have little choice.

Looks good to me, though unless you have another one in mind, go ahead and add a $30 Hyper 212 or Xigmatek Gaia/Balder/Dark Knight CPU cooler to that build list - you've got the room for it in that case and it'll be much quieter than the stock Intel cooler.  The Phantom does have a backplate cutout, but it's positioned more for LGA1366 so you have to pull the motherboard if you want to add a CPU cooler later - best to install one from the beginning.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on September 09, 2011, 07:42:05 AM
Am I broken for seriously considering buying a Razer Nostromo N52 (http://www.amazon.com/Razer-Nostromo-Gaming-Keypad-RZ07-00490100-R3/dp/B004AM5RB6/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1315572554&sr=8-3)?

I've seen some people say that once you start using one it's nearly impossible to give up.  Anyone her have any experience with one?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 09, 2011, 07:49:48 AM
Am I broken for seriously considering buying a Razer Nostromo N52 (http://www.amazon.com/Razer-Nostromo-Gaming-Keypad-RZ07-00490100-R3/dp/B004AM5RB6/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1315572554&sr=8-3)?

I've seen some people say that once you start using one it's nearly impossible to give up.  Anyone her have any experience with one?

When they were made by Belkin, I saw/played around with one in a store display and didn't care for the buttons, particularly the one on the side under the joystick - they were super mushy and unpleasant feeling, though that may have changed.  I loved my old N50, but it died after many years of hard use.  I'm tempted to try Logitech's take on the concept (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823126050), though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Rasix on September 09, 2011, 12:23:20 PM
How the hell do you use one of those contraptions.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on September 09, 2011, 01:07:02 PM
How the hell do you use one of those contraptions.

I recall talking to someone who had one and used it religiously. Said it took him about a week to get used to but now he can't go back to a regular KB/Mouse set up anymore while playing any PC game. I am a little hesitant  to try it out, but I have bene flirting with the idea.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 09, 2011, 06:13:15 PM
Silly cabling tricks:

(http://i.imgur.com/KxqXH.jpg)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Vision on September 12, 2011, 02:53:07 AM
If I'm using an SSD as a OS/Games drive, is there any advantage to getting a SATA 6.0GB/s versus a SATA 3.0 HDD?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on September 12, 2011, 07:24:47 AM
If I'm using an SSD as a OS/Games drive, is there any advantage to getting a SATA 6.0GB/s versus a SATA 3.0 HDD?

Yes because the things you store on the SATA drive are going to be those large files that benefit from high amounts of bandwidth.  Is that enough reason to justify the price difference?  Depends on how much you will use those files.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Strazos on September 12, 2011, 05:01:46 PM
I recall talking to someone who had one and used it religiously. Said it took him about a week to get used to but now he can't go back to a regular KB/Mouse set up anymore while playing any PC game. I am a little hesitant  to try it out, but I have bene flirting with the idea.

I can't help but feel as if there's no way the precision and dexterity in a thumb can outpace what you can do when you can use your whole arm with a mouse.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 12, 2011, 05:46:28 PM
I recall talking to someone who had one and used it religiously. Said it took him about a week to get used to but now he can't go back to a regular KB/Mouse set up anymore while playing any PC game. I am a little hesitant  to try it out, but I have bene flirting with the idea.

I can't help but feel as if there's no way the precision and dexterity in a thumb can outpace what you can do when you can use your whole arm with a mouse.

The thumbstick doesn't replace the mouse - it replaces WASD.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on September 12, 2011, 06:21:44 PM
Thumbstick to replace wsad would be killer.  I've go a Nostromo and I can't use it because it's made for hands of a 6'4 guy, apparently.  If it were a wiimote nunchuck, however, that'd be awesome.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 12, 2011, 06:47:39 PM
Thumbstick to replace wsad would be killer.  I've go a Nostromo and I can't use it because it's made for hands of a 6'4 guy, apparently.  If it were a wiimote nunchuck, however, that'd be awesome.

Something like this? (http://www.splitfish.com/index.php/en/products/fragfx-shark)  The two parts can apparently be used independently.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Bunk on September 20, 2011, 08:27:34 AM
So I had been having crashes lately when playing games - just complete system lockups. Installed a device monitor, and found my CPU was getting up around 69c just loading the minecraft launch screen  :ye_gods:. That's on an AMD Athalon X2 3.2GHz.

I'd already tried redoing the thermal paste (which I think I suck at) and it didn't help, plus the stock heat sink was a little scratched up. So I decided to make my first foray in to 3rd party heat sinks. Found an Artic Cooling Freezer 13 pro on sale for $29. Yea, it fits in my case with about 3/16ths of an inch clearance. It's about 8 times the size of my stock heat sink.

Took five minutes to install, and dropped my cpu temp under load from 69c to about 45c. I'm a happy camper.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on September 20, 2011, 12:31:50 PM
So I had been having crashes lately when playing games - just complete system lockups. Installed a device monitor, and found my CPU was getting up around 69c just loading the minecraft launch screen  :ye_gods:. That's on an AMD Athalon X2 3.2GHz.

I'd already tried redoing the thermal paste (which I think I suck at) and it didn't help, plus the stock heat sink was a little scratched up. So I decided to make my first foray in to 3rd party heat sinks. Found an Artic Cooling Freezer 13 pro on sale for $29. Yea, it fits in my case with about 3/16ths of an inch clearance. It's about 8 times the size of my stock heat sink.

Took five minutes to install, and dropped my cpu temp under load from 69c to about 45c. I'm a happy camper.
Which monitor did you use to track this?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on September 20, 2011, 01:11:15 PM
Which monitor did you use to track this?

I like HWMonitor (http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor.html) for that stuff.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Bunk on September 20, 2011, 02:15:20 PM
I tried several, and the one linked above was by far the best.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: NiX on September 20, 2011, 07:14:47 PM
Thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on October 04, 2011, 06:02:29 PM
Question for the people in the know. My current mobo is AM3, there is (beta) firmware that suppose to get it to AM3+. I plan to upgrade CPU to AM3+, but read that AM3 mobos getting patched to AM3+ are not as good as native AM3+. Any idea if this is BS, and if it isn't how much of a performance loss would I suffer?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on October 05, 2011, 08:42:21 PM
There is an AM3+ socket?

I don't see any processors for sale yet that are above AM3. Though there is a new FM1 socket for the Llano chips (but those are not high end).



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 05, 2011, 10:16:52 PM
There is an AM3+ socket?

I don't see any processors for sale yet that are above AM3. Though there is a new FM1 socket for the Llano chips (but those are not high end).

It's for the oft-delayed Bulldozer/Zambezi chips, currently slated for launch sometime in Q4.  To be honest, my expectations from the new architecture are pretty low, though I'd like a competitive AMD - it's just been so long since they were actually really relevant to 'power users' at anything but the low/value end.

Releasing stuff like this doesn't help their case at all - that 980x they're comparing the new CPU to is comparable in almost every way to the same ~$300 2600K you've been able to buy for some time, and Intel is sitting on both Ivy Bridge and Sandy Bridge-E as counters to anything AMD releases.

(http://i.imgur.com/UGCXL.jpg)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: HaemishM on October 06, 2011, 09:34:27 AM
So is the consensus that buying an AMD CPU is a bad idea even though you'll probably pay like $100-$200 less for the computer over a comparable Intel version?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 06, 2011, 09:52:30 AM
So is the consensus that buying an AMD CPU is a bad idea even though you'll probably pay like $100-$200 less for the computer over a comparable Intel version?

I don't know about that - at the lower end of the spectrum, they make more sense.  I just don't think that their newer stuff has done a good job at all of keeping pace with Intel when we're talking about high end performance, and I don't know if Bulldozer/Zambezi is going to change that.

Fusion is pretty slick for mobile, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on October 06, 2011, 12:14:27 PM
Hamish, as MisterNoisy alludes to, the high end performance CPU of AMD is probably not going to be competitively priced. That's half the reason Intel has been kicking AMD's ass. Intel packs far more power per dollar than previous AMD processors. The chart above is comparing the flagship CPU of AMDs with the first of the i7s. That does NOT bode well for AMD at all.

I was unable to find much information on sinji's original question as to whether the older motheboards with a socket CMOS patch to accommodate AM3+ CPUs are going to perform as well as newer AM3+ ready boards.

If Intel is anything to go by, when motherboards came with the ability to upgrade to newer ram, say, motherboards with both DDR2 and DDR3 sockets, results have been very mixed. Some people reported no problems, others had a major headache and had to go back.

Personally, if you're going to use after market cooling that is going to require removing the motherboard from the case anyway to install the fan, I'd buy a new motherboard for the CPU as well. This way you also get the benefits of SATA3 and USB3. Chances are the PCI lanes will be greater in the new motherboards as well, giving your video card better performance. This is, however, speculative.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on October 06, 2011, 04:06:44 PM
So is the consensus that buying an AMD CPU is a bad idea even though you'll probably pay like $100-$200 less for the computer over a comparable Intel version?

Depends what you want out of your PC. Intel for best-in-class performance with zero upgradability, AMD for value and very high chance to have an ability to upgrade to new CPU when it comes out. I have (SO desktop) M3A mobo that I upgraded CPU 3 times now, every time for about ~$100, it doesn't get any more cost-effective than that.

Personally, if you're going to use after market cooling that is going to require removing the motherboard from the case anyway to install the fan, I'd buy a new motherboard for the CPU as well. This way you also get the benefits of SATA3 and USB3. Chances are the PCI lanes will be greater in the new motherboards as well, giving your video card better performance. This is, however, speculative.

My mobo is M4A89TD PRO/USB3, it already has SATA3 and USB3. Question is if I am going to see improvement moving from Phenom II 1090T to bulldozer and if its worth the price. I am not planning to upgrade PC for another year, this is more of a mid-cycle upgrade, maybe $250 if I get decent performance gain out of it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on October 08, 2011, 11:22:44 AM
So is the consensus that buying an AMD CPU is a bad idea even though you'll probably pay like $100-$200 less for the computer over a comparable Intel version?

Depends what you want out of your PC. Intel for best-in-class performance with zero upgradability,

You *should* be able to carry forward a LGA 1155 board to ivy bridge and that will give you another 2+years of life. But your pretty much SOL with 1366/1156.

I just finished up replacing my HTPC with a new Intel G620T (http://ark.intel.com/products/53481/Intel-Pentium-Processor-G620T-(3M-Cache-2_20-GHz)) and an Intel DH67CF (http://ark.intel.com/products/50092/Intel-Desktop-Board-DH67CF) motherboard. The processor was $70 and the motherboard $120 which is quite crazy. Honestly I went with an expensive motherboard to have intel nic, uefi, and low power consumption. You can find a decent board in the $90-100 range(see asus).

If I built a Llano an A6-3500 is $90 and A75 board is $75, a cost savings of $25 which would come down to a $5 savings for a non Intel board.

I'm shocked at how good the CPU is, it's so fast I don't need a dedicated GPU for any playback yet. Alas the Llano GPU hands down stronger but Ivy bridge is reported to close the gap.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 12, 2011, 08:22:04 AM
My mobo is M4A89TD PRO/USB3, it already has SATA3 and USB3. Question is if I am going to see improvement moving from Phenom II 1090T to bulldozer and if its worth the price. I am not planning to upgrade PC for another year, this is more of a mid-cycle upgrade, maybe $250 if I get decent performance gain out of it.

Bulldozer benchmarks are out and based on them, I'd wait.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on October 12, 2011, 08:32:18 AM
My mobo is M4A89TD PRO/USB3, it already has SATA3 and USB3. Question is if I am going to see improvement moving from Phenom II 1090T to bulldozer and if its worth the price. I am not planning to upgrade PC for another year, this is more of a mid-cycle upgrade, maybe $250 if I get decent performance gain out of it.

Bulldozer benchmarks are out and based on them, I'd wait.

Any good links with that? I am curious and have a moron friend who has his cheerleading skirt on for this chip and routinely calls me an Intel fanboi.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on October 12, 2011, 08:47:58 AM
The fuck?

The guy know the P4 / Athlon 64 shit is old hat, right?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 12, 2011, 09:17:46 AM
Any good links with that? I am curious and have a moron friend who has his cheerleading skirt on for this chip and routinely calls me an Intel fanboi.

HardOCP (http://www.hardocp.com/article/2011/10/11/amd_bulldozer_fx8150_gameplay_performance_review/)
Anand (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4955/the-bulldozer-review-amd-fx8150-tested/8)
Guru3D (http://www.guru3d.com/article/amd-fx-8150-processor-review/19)
Tom's (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-8150-zambezi-bulldozer-990fx,3043-24.html)
HardwareCanucks (http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/47155-amd-bulldozer-fx-8150-processor-review-13.html)
LegitReviews (http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1741/20/)
Bjorn3D (http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=2125&pageID=11110)

If you use crazily multithreaded applications, there's something there.  For everyone else, it's at best a wash with the year-old 2500K/2600K (and rarely even that).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on October 12, 2011, 10:33:48 AM
My mobo is M4A89TD PRO/USB3, it already has SATA3 and USB3. Question is if I am going to see improvement moving from Phenom II 1090T to bulldozer and if its worth the price. I am not planning to upgrade PC for another year, this is more of a mid-cycle upgrade, maybe $250 if I get decent performance gain out of it.

Bulldozer benchmarks are out and based on them, I'd wait.

Sadly, I agree. I wouldn't get noticeable upgrade.  I don't understand why they bother with core parking (supported only in Windows 8!) while neglecting base, 2-core performance that is used in 75%+ of all applications.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on October 12, 2011, 11:01:57 AM
For everyone else, it's at best a wash with the year-old 2500K/2600K (and rarely even that).

Considering its power consumption and heat is off the scale. It's over 229w full load (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4955/the-bulldozer-review-amd-fx8150-tested/9)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 11:10:01 AM
That's for a full system. It still seems off, though. The max power usage is spec'd at 125 W so it's unclear why the Bulldozer system is drawing so much more power compared to the Intel systems.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 11:38:19 AM
Query: I have the following right now: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115215

I'm considering getting the following if/once the price drops more: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115213

Worthy upgrade, or save up for a new mobo/CPU combo of a more current gen?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 11:54:47 AM
Not worth it unless you desperately need HT.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 12:09:42 PM
Not worth it unless you desperately need HT.


I figured as much...so perhaps a jump from 4 to 8+ gigs of memory then?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 12:19:36 PM
Are you swapping now?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 12:26:46 PM
Are you swapping now?


I'm wanting to upgrade in some fashion.  Trying to get most bang for buck.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on October 12, 2011, 12:31:07 PM
SSD?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 12:37:19 PM
SSD?

I've got a 300GB WD VelociRaptor right now, with a 1TB documents and stuff drive on the side.  I've always pondered the jump to SSD, but then I always choke when I think about the reliability and longevity.  I understand Sandforce-based SSDs are decent...any other recommendations?

Edit: Grammar and proper naming...

Edit 2: Checked prices...the Vertex 2 60GB now under $100?  Hmm...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 01:05:32 PM
Are you swapping now?
I'm wanting to upgrade in some fashion.  Trying to get most bang for buck.
What's your GPU?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 01:07:43 PM
A Radeon HD 6850


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2011, 02:49:16 PM
Ok, we're a couple weeks out from The Big Scary News, however, thanks to good, knowledge-living voters I should still have a job despite our budget getting cut by 9/13ths. (Seriously, holy shit!)

So I'm still considering my upgrade I talked about earlier in the summer. Since it doesn't look like there are any big announcements that would affect me (right? I'm not on top of the hardware world these days), here's the current scenario. Probably pull the trigger at the end of the month. Oddly, one of the big games I wanted to upgrade for runs great on my current creaker of a system...

Current:
C2D e6600 @ 4GHz
4GB DDR2 800
GTX 460 1GB
ASUS P5WDH-Deluxe
X-Fi

Keeping the case/psu/sound/hdd:
i5 2500K
8GB DDR3 12800
ASUS P8P67 PRO
CM Hyper212
4 new case fans

I decided to downgrade it from the ASUS P8Z68 and from Corsair to G.Skill to save enough to SLI the GTX 460 on the new mobo. Also need a wireless NIC, since my current one is on the mobo, looking at this one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833704045), because I don't have a dual band router. Also looking at a cooling cage for the optical bay to pull across the top of the case, pushed out behind the cpu. For $25, I think it would be worth the increased airflow. Also, 8GB or 16GB RAM? 16GB wouldn't bust the budget with RAM prices where they are now.

Total bacon is $765

Concerns are mostly that the X-Fi fits with the added GPU and that my current aftermarket cooler will allow a second gpu, since it's giant. I would probably add an aftermarket cooler to the second gpu as well, so a few more bucks and really threatening that lonely PCI slot. Even if the second gpu fit, having the fans from the first gpu almost literally on top of the second board worries me. Since I've actually never run SLI before, do both cards have to be identical? Are there still issues with games not using/being buggy with SLI? A single 570 would fry the bacon to $935, a 580 would blacken the bacon at $1265; not sure a single 560 would be worth the upgrade vs the horsepower of 460SLI.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 03:20:55 PM
A Radeon HD 6850
A 6950 might be a good upgrade but it depends a lot on the game and whether or you get CPU-limited:

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=670789


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on October 12, 2011, 03:25:12 PM
Sky, that's a USB 3.0 motherboard, but does your old case support it? If not you're sort of wasting that capability.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on October 12, 2011, 03:26:41 PM
A Radeon HD 6850
A 6950 might be a good upgrade but it depends a lot on the game and whether or you get CPU-limited:

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=670789


I have a personal policy on video card upgrades: every other generation.  When the 8xxx series is out, I'll be there  :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2011, 03:49:37 PM
Sky, that's a USB 3.0 motherboard, but does your old case support it? If not you're sort of wasting that capability.
Aren't the connectors the same? Cat busted my front two case connectors ages ago, anyway. And really, it's not like I have any USB 3 devices...


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 12, 2011, 03:50:23 PM

(snip)

Concerns are mostly that the X-Fi fits with the added GPU and that my current aftermarket cooler will allow a second gpu, since it's giant. I would probably add an aftermarket cooler to the second gpu as well, so a few more bucks and really threatening that lonely PCI slot. Even if the second gpu fit, having the fans from the first gpu almost literally on top of the second board worries me. Since I've actually never run SLI before, do both cards have to be identical? Are there still issues with games not using/being buggy with SLI? A single 570 would fry the bacon to $935, a 580 would blacken the bacon at $1265; not sure a single 560 would be worth the upgrade vs the horsepower of 460SLI.

You should be able to fit two 460's in there, even with the Accelero strapped to the one you have now, but you'll likely lose the two slots between the cards - if I'm not mistaken, that cooler basically makes your video cards 3-slot affairs.  The sound card is probably not going to fit with a second GPU with an Accelero bolted to it unless it's PCI-E, in which case you can probably cram it into the slot closest to the CPU socket on that board - the Hyper 212 is big but not that big.

SLI is definitely not as trouble-free as a single card solution (and yea, some games have issues), but as long as your 460s match re: RAM, you should be fine, even if the cards aren't 100% identical (http://www.slizone.com/page/slizone_faq.html#c17).

Sky, that's a USB 3.0 motherboard, but does your old case support it? If not you're sort of wasting that capability.

There will still be USB 3.0 ports on the I/O plane and there are drive bay solutions that can add front-mounted USB 3.0.  Hell - my motherboard came with a 3.5" bay device with 2 USB 3.0 ports that I don't have room for in my case (all my bays are full) - if you want it for your build, shoot me a PM, Sky.

Aren't the connectors the same? Cat busted my front two case connectors ages ago, anyway. And really, it's not like I have any USB 3 devices...

Nope - different header (20 pins instead of 9).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on October 12, 2011, 04:18:16 PM
My current and future build plans are pretty identical to Sky's.  The only thing I guess I want to really know is if it's worth getting a Z68 chipset board for the SSD caching (Intel SRT?) over the P67?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2011, 07:11:31 PM
Tests showed it's a decent tech, but not all that impressive. Better off getting a decent SSD for OS and a few games.

Another thing I thought of...I suck at PSU calculations :) I overbought /at the time/ but I wasn't considering SLI, I've always done big single cards. So...will this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703005) melt down with two GTX 460 1GBs?

I could also shave another $30 off if I don't have to match GPU, going with an MSI Hawk 460. And maybe that cooler would allow the X-Fi (regular PCI) to live at the bottom.

Mr. N, if the ASUS doesn't come with a bay doohickey, I'll take you up on the offer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on October 12, 2011, 07:22:04 PM
If your case is big enough, just get 2 supplies.  :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ingmar on October 12, 2011, 08:00:19 PM
I think you might be right on the edge there, Sky, but I also suck at PSU calculations.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on October 12, 2011, 08:43:30 PM
Your PSU supplies 49 @ 12v.  Find out what your card draws, multiply it by two.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 08:44:38 PM
Tests showed it's a decent tech, but not all that impressive. Better off getting a decent SSD for OS and a few games.

Another thing I thought of...I suck at PSU calculations :) I overbought /at the time/ but I wasn't considering SLI, I've always done big single cards. So...will this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703005) melt down with two GTX 460 1GBs?
460 GTX should draw max around 13A - 14A at +12V and Nvidia recommends at least 24A on +12V for a single card for the full system -- so that would be ~13A - 14A for video card and  ~10A - 11A at +12V for the other system components. For your system let's say you'll need, padding a bit, 14A + 14A + 14A (for rest of system) at +12V = 42A +12V. Your power supply puts out 49A at +12V so you should be fine.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2011, 10:15:50 PM
Thanks, Trippy. You continue to be the man, to rock, to firmly wear the ubergeek crown of f13, etc  :grin:

You don't think 7A is cutting it close for 2 HDD, an optical, several USB (xbox controller/3D vision/mouse/wireless keyboard remote), plus the x-fi? ASUS's site says I should look at an 850W supply, but they don't talk amperage. It's always fun to poke at the holey spots in my knowledge and feel dumb after building badass pcs for myself and many others for almost 20 years  :oh_i_see:

I always used to throw money at it and over-engineer everything, but that's not going to work this build. I see a few nice PSUs...but they all have top/bottom fans and the Antec p180 vents out the back. The top/sides/bottom of the psu are covered...Budgets suck.

edit: Now I'm thinking maybe I should think about dropping the X-Fi if the onboard is good enough. I've always been a fan of discrete sound cards, though. But it's probably not going to fit with that MSI card, and definitely not if I mod it with another arctic cooler. I could probably also pull the old XP drive since I haven't booted into it in ages but the current Windows 7 install wants it there.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on October 12, 2011, 10:42:37 PM
It's not 7A that's left for the rest of your system it's 14A + 7A or 21A at +12V. I.e. your cards will use up around 26A - 28A combined so you'll have 49A - 28A = ~21A left for everything else that needs to use the +12V. NVIDIA does recommend 650W as the minimum for dual 460 GTXs but it really depends on the power supply.

I always used to throw money at it and over-engineer everything, but that's not going to work this build. I see a few nice PSUs...but they all have top/bottom fans and the Antec p180 vents out the back. The top/sides/bottom of the psu are covered...Budgets suck.
Just flip the power supply up-side down.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 12, 2011, 11:03:10 PM
Ah, I see where you put 14+14+14, woops. Upside-down could work, there's about an inch clearance where I guess it could pull in air. But I'll have to stick with my current PSU because the bank, it's busted. If I use the MSI gpu and MSI mobo, I could get back $50 in MIR, though. Might actually be room on the MSI mobo to squeeze in the X-Fi if onboard doesn't work for me.

Ok, modified list:

 MSI P67A-GD65  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130574) $160
 Intel Core i5-2500K (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072) $220
 MSI N460GTX Hawk GeForce GTX 460 1GB  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127518) $170
 G.SKILL 8GB DDR3 1600 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314) $52
 COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) $26
 TP-LINK TL-WN722N USB 2.0 High Gain Wireless Adapter (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833704045) $19
 XIGMATEK CCA-EMFCB-U01  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817996019) $25
 Nexus BASIC D12SL-12 120mm Case Fan x 4 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835610006) $48

$720 with $30 MIR (+ $20 more MIR if I game it).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 13, 2011, 03:29:25 PM
Newegg just put something else on a wee sale, $710. And they sent me a code for the 2500K, extra $15 off. So $665 without gaming the system for the extra $20 (only 1 MIR per household for MSI parts).

That's adding a whole 'nother gpu compared to my original spec, only $8 more.  :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on October 13, 2011, 11:59:49 PM
That's for a full system. It still seems off, though. The max power usage is spec'd at 125 W so it's unclear why the Bulldozer system is drawing so much more power compared to the Intel systems.

HardOCP has some more numbers (http://hardocp.com/article/2011/10/11/amd_bulldozer_fx8150_desktop_performance_review/9) at stock clocks were still talking 75-100w more power consumption under full load.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on October 14, 2011, 07:33:44 AM
Newegg just put something else on a wee sale, $710. And they sent me a code for the 2500K, extra $15 off. So $665 without gaming the system for the extra $20 (only 1 MIR per household for MSI parts).

That's adding a whole 'nother gpu compared to my original spec, only $8 more.  :grin:

If you have a Microcenter near you they have the 2500K on sale for $179.99.

http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0354589&bc=


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 14, 2011, 08:44:28 AM
Thanks for the heads-up. However, any 'if you have X near you' is bound to fail. I truly live in a ghetto. Think of the middle of NY like the middle of Mississippi. Because that's what it is, without the funny accents.

I'm pretty close to pulling the trigger, so if anyone sees any red flags, lemme know.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: HaemishM on October 14, 2011, 10:01:56 AM
Thanks for the heads-up. However, any 'if you have X near you' is bound to fail. I truly live in a ghetto. Think of the middle of NY like the middle of Mississippi. Because that's what it is, without the funny accents.

Sounds like funny accents to me.  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Reg on October 14, 2011, 01:47:21 PM
Does he talk through his nose and say "warsh" instead of wash?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 14, 2011, 01:54:19 PM
And mayshur instead of measure, git you some. Mom's side of the family is from MS and ME, somehow I avoided most of both accents, though I do use wicked a lot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 14, 2011, 10:36:56 PM
I know there's always new tech around the corner and it's best to buy what's price/performance now...but LGA 2011 looks real interesting...


Man, talk about being able to jettison the PCI X-Fi!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on October 14, 2011, 10:45:56 PM
That's just Gigabyte.  They make nice shit.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 15, 2011, 12:18:46 AM
I was talking more about the platform, but incorporating the X-Fi tech is a pretty nice bonus on that one board. There are also a couple nice MSI boards in that photo spread.

Wonder when it's going to hit, and how steep the pricing will be.

Google research dep't says November 11 (good!) but you won't be touching a hexacore, unlocked version for under $500 (BAD). Even the quad core is almost $300. I'm still tempted to wait, if only it wouldn't bust the budget. Looks like a nice tech (the memory bandwidth, no space wasted on the on-die gpu, etc). Ah well, hopefully the next pc will allow for a better budget (FJ will be paid off by then). Quite a power draw on the cpu, too....looks like for now I'm better off waiting for that tech to mature a bit imo (or at least until I can swing a psu as well!)

 :grin: edit: trigger pulled! :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Severian on October 18, 2011, 02:00:06 PM
If you have a Microcenter near you they have the 2500K on sale for $179.99.

http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0354589&bc=

Still on sale now and I just grabbed one, although it's a longish drive. Thanks!
I heard that while the flooding in Thailand had the biggest impact on Western Digital and therefore hard drives in general, it may affect Intel Sandy Bridge in the next six weeks as well.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2011, 01:05:01 PM
Got everything up and running, it's a bit hotter than the old single-card gtx 460 machine I had been running, but that had the monster Accelero cooler and sat alone in the middle of the case. Also don't have all the cooling in place yet, but I think I'm going to need to dremel the side panel and add an intake fan blowing over the expansion card region. It's packed tight as sardines in there, main gpu is a three-spacer; secondary gpu is a dual-spacer; also squoze in the X-Fi to get the extra 8% (or whatever) out of the cpu.

After fumbling with activation and updates (Note to self: install the high-gain usb wireless FIRST, my downloads increased an order of magnitude), it was kinda late to be running through the OC/test/tweak cycles. So I powered down and hit the "OC Genie" button on the MSI mobo just for grins. Put on a 4.2GHz OC to the cpu, heat went from 40C idle to 46C idle, so I'll take that. No need to push it to the 4.7 or so I should be able to get pretty easily.

GPU temp with the single card used to idle around 35C and nothing could push it past 75C (except fucking Rift, which would hit low 80s...that game has issues). Now the dual cards are idling around 49C and hitting mid-70s pretty regularly, I imagine low 80s will be normal once everything is closed up. Tempted to put Rift on the machine just to see how it handles that mess....but I think I'll pass on that idea. The Twin Frozr card is running fans around 50%-70%, but the Accelero-cooled card is running fans 20% slower at all times (even scaling with the Frozr).

3dMark 11 at a hair under 7000.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on October 20, 2011, 02:25:14 PM
If you just kind of read Sky's post in a stream of consciousness sort of way it sounds kind of like he's an old-school test pilot reading off the gages of his instruments to flight control.

Sierra-Kilo-Yankee Niner you are cleared to launch on runway 13.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2011, 02:41:11 PM
If you just kind of read Sky's post in a stream of consciousness sort of way
This is indeed the correct way to read my posts!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 20, 2011, 02:41:22 PM
Got everything up and running, it's a bit hotter than the old single-card gtx 460 machine I had been running, but that had the monster Accelero cooler and sat alone in the middle of the case. Also don't have all the cooling in place yet, but I think I'm going to need to dremel the side panel and add an intake fan blowing over the expansion card region. It's packed tight as sardines in there, main gpu is a three-spacer; secondary gpu is a dual-spacer; also squoze in the X-Fi to get the extra 8% (or whatever) out of the cpu.

After fumbling with activation and updates (Note to self: install the high-gain usb wireless FIRST, my downloads increased an order of magnitude), it was kinda late to be running through the OC/test/tweak cycles. So I powered down and hit the "OC Genie" button on the MSI mobo just for grins. Put on a 4.2GHz OC to the cpu, heat went from 40C idle to 46C idle, so I'll take that. No need to push it to the 4.7 or so I should be able to get pretty easily.

GPU temp with the single card used to idle around 35C and nothing could push it past 75C (except fucking Rift, which would hit low 80s...that game has issues). Now the dual cards are idling around 49C and hitting mid-70s pretty regularly, I imagine low 80s will be normal once everything is closed up. Tempted to put Rift on the machine just to see how it handles that mess....but I think I'll pass on that idea. The Twin Frozr card is running fans around 50%-70%, but the Accelero-cooled card is running fans 20% slower at all times (even scaling with the Frozr).

3dMark 11 at a hair under 7000.

Nice.  Are you running a single fan on the Hyper 212?  A PWM y-cable (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812718001) and second fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103069) would help keep the CPU temps down when OCing - my 2500K runs at practically the same temps at 4.4GHz as it does at stock clocks with the second fan on there.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 20, 2011, 03:15:10 PM
I do have a second fan for the hyper 212. Right now I've just got the stock push fan on it. The splitter is a good idea, hadn't thought of that for the PWM control; I was just going to slap it into a case fan outlet.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on October 23, 2011, 06:57:32 PM
Generally I buy overkill power supply with detachable lines then move it from machine to machine. My current power supply is 800W, I purchased it about 4 years and 2 builds ago.

Plus, PSU issues are hardest to diagnose, so you _really_ want to make sure you are more than fine.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on October 24, 2011, 12:36:14 AM
Seems to be kicking ass. It was an overkill psu 5 years ago, it's adequate now. If I start getting buggy behaviour, it's the first thing I'll suspect.

So far really happy with the build, though the only things I've thrown at it have been 3dmark and metro 2033. Makes it tempting to get Skyrim, since :nda: isn't much of a stress-test.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on October 25, 2011, 07:01:58 PM
I dunno if anyone is looking to build a new box or upgrade soon, but Newegg has a Zotac GTX570 for $300 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500215).  Given that 570s generally go for $330-350, it's a pretty good deal.

Just bought one as part of my brother's Christmas present - he's never built a PC before, so I'm buying the parts and we'll put it together over the holiday.  Should be good times.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on November 01, 2011, 03:38:35 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129185

What is the deal with this being so cheap? I am looking to upgrade just my vid card since the old 8800gt is on its way out the door in a ripping and tearing hurry. I haven't been in the arena since well over a year or two ago and need something to marry with a e8400 CPU/4g of RAM/WIN7 64b system till tax day when I can start building a new system. $80 seems like there should be a huge red flag with it.

Other than that... I was leaning toward a 460GTX since I have been a nVidia person as of late... my last radeon was a 9500 I think.

...but really, I have no preference other that drivers that fucking work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 01, 2011, 04:14:23 PM
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2917

That's why its so cheap. Don't get me wrong, probably still an upgrade, but only just barely. Look at the Far Cry 2 benchmark, this card is just a bit above the 8800 GT.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 01, 2011, 09:02:11 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129185

What is the deal with this being so cheap? I am looking to upgrade just my vid card since the old 8800gt is on its way out the door in a ripping and tearing hurry. I haven't been in the arena since well over a year or two ago and need something to marry with a e8400 CPU/4g of RAM/WIN7 64b system till tax day when I can start building a new system. $80 seems like there should be a huge red flag with it.

Other than that... I was leaning toward a 460GTX since I have been a nVidia person as of late... my last radeon was a 9500 I think.

...but really, I have no preference other that drivers that fucking work.

Engels is spot on -- go with the GTX460.  Avoid the SE models (cut down pretty heavily).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on November 02, 2011, 02:23:34 AM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129185

What is the deal with this being so cheap? I am looking to upgrade just my vid card since the old 8800gt is on its way out the door in a ripping and tearing hurry. I haven't been in the arena since well over a year or two ago and need something to marry with a e8400 CPU/4g of RAM/WIN7 64b system till tax day when I can start building a new system. $80 seems like there should be a huge red flag with it.

Other than that... I was leaning toward a 460GTX since I have been a nVidia person as of late... my last radeon was a 9500 I think.

...but really, I have no preference other that drivers that fucking work.

Noted. Thanks... I generally do a lot of cross comparison when I start building a system, but for now I want to squeeze the life outta my hardware but the vid card is a definite need at this point.
Engels is spot on -- go with the GTX460.  Avoid the SE models (cut down pretty heavily).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 02, 2011, 08:59:33 AM
I'm normally not an SLI guy, but I really like my current setup with dual gtx 460s. And I came about it in a similar way to where you are, had to upgrade my gpu (rift killed my 8800gtx) and went with the 460. Later you can SLI it and get performance that's nothing to sneeze at, competitive with top-end single card setups.

Although I do heartily recommend slapping an Accelero on it if you can swing it. My solo 460+cooler performed amazing and never broke a sweat.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 02, 2011, 10:29:03 AM
I'm normally not an SLI guy, but I really like my current setup with dual gtx 460s. And I came about it in a similar way to where you are, had to upgrade my gpu (rift killed my 8800gtx) and went with the 460. Later you can SLI it and get performance that's nothing to sneeze at, competitive with top-end single card setups.

Although I do heartily recommend slapping an Accelero on it if you can swing it. My solo 460+cooler performed amazing and never broke a sweat.

I dunno - as long as you get a card with a decent cooler (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127518) installed from the factory (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121391) and have a case with fair to middling airflow or better, you'll generally be fine without aftermarket cooling.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 02, 2011, 11:10:43 AM
YEEEEPPP! Dammit, now I have Dave Hester in my brain for the day. Thanks, tv forum (ok, my own fault).

Anyway, the card I bought for the second in SLI is the MSI card. It does run hotter than the Accelero (I talked about that upthread) and has to push the fans harder, but it's still a great stock cooler.

Avoid EVGA stock cooling. They're awesome if you plan to add your own cooling, because as long as you can return it to stock for RMA, they'll honor their lifetime warranty. But their stock cooling is trash.

So I second the MSI recommendation, I guess :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: lamaros on November 08, 2011, 01:19:29 AM
I'm trying to talk my gf out of wasting her money on a MacBook. Can anyone recommend a decent quality laptop as an alternative? Has to be aesthetically pleasing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 08, 2011, 09:56:50 AM
A Macbook is not a waste of money, they are awesome laptops. Always at the tops of consumer reports. If you have the money, it's usually the right choice.

We've been happy with our $700 i5 Dell Studio refurb, since we don't have Apple money.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 08, 2011, 10:27:00 AM
There's nothing wrong with the laptop, its just the OS that's the problem. I've often considered taking a Mac Book Pro and splashing it with Windows 7, and then I remember the danged mouse pad.

Dell's are good. Take a peek at the new XPS 15z, the new sleek one.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on November 08, 2011, 12:01:50 PM
There's nothing wrong with the laptop, its just the OS that's the problem.

From what point of view?  From an OS point of view OSX is a much better OS than Windows 7 in almost every measurable way.  If what you want to do is play games, then yeah, not so good.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 08, 2011, 12:38:22 PM
There's nothing wrong with the laptop, its just the OS that's the problem.

From what point of view?  From an OS point of view OSX is a much better OS than Windows 7 in almost every measurable way.  If what you want to do is play games, then yeah, not so good.

It was a snarky anti-Apple comment meant to troll Sky (and you apparently  :awesome_for_real:) Not meant for deep analysis.

You really can't compare the OSes since their whole philosophy of design and target audience is different. Can you really separate Windows 7 from their Office suite products, for example? OSX has nothing to even compare it to. And if you take out the Office suite apps, then you're left with a gaming platform that out performs OSX to the point that the comparison is meaningless.

OSX is relegated to photoshop, music, other arts and some fairly esoteric scientific tools that have correlates in the *nix verse, so that's not really saying much.

But I'm happy to learn.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 08, 2011, 02:17:17 PM
Can you really separate Windows 7 from their Office suite products, for example? OSX has nothing to even compare it to.
http://www.microsoft.com/mac

(The newest version of Office is the Mac version btw)

 :grin:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on November 08, 2011, 03:28:17 PM
...and some fairly esoteric scientific tools that have correlates in the *nix verse, so that's not really saying much.


That's pretty much what I use mine for so I, uh, I got nothing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 08, 2011, 04:37:22 PM
Can you really separate Windows 7 from their Office suite products, for example? OSX has nothing to even compare it to.
http://www.microsoft.com/mac

(The newest version of Office is the Mac version btw)

 :grin:

Nice reverse troll there! You nearly had me writing out a full paragraph spluttering on about Microsoft having to code for Apple to keep it in business ;)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 09, 2011, 02:38:27 AM
I'm trying to talk my gf out of wasting her money on a MacBook. Can anyone recommend a decent quality laptop as an alternative? Has to be aesthetically pleasing.

Possibly look at the 'ultrabook' category that owes most of it's existence to the MacBook Air?  The ASUS Zenbook (http://zenbook.asus.com/) looks damned sharp and can be had for just under $1000 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834230168).

If that's too steep, the new Dell Inspiron 14z (http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-n411z/pd?p=inspiron-n411z&ref=bThin1I) is very tempting.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on November 09, 2011, 07:39:49 AM
There's nothing wrong with the laptop, its just the OS that's the problem. I've often considered taking a Mac Book Pro and splashing it with Windows 7, and then I remember the danged mouse pad.

If you mean the one button thing, Macbook trackpads have had right and left click for at least 2 years now. Even before they took the seam off the bottom of the pad where the button is there was a left and a right side click sensor under the single button that would recognize which side you clicked.

Friend of mine has an Air for work and has been running Win7 on it for almost a year with no issues. (He is an exchange admin for the university so running windows makes his life easier).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 09, 2011, 08:46:55 AM
I love the Apple trackpads, their multitouch is the best I've used by a long shot. Probably my single biggest complaint about the Dell Studio is the archaic side and bottom strips for scrolling.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 09, 2011, 09:16:04 AM
Hmm, my experience with the macbook trackpad while using Windows 7 is not a good one. Perhaps it has a learning curve.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 09, 2011, 10:30:18 AM
Hmm, my experience with the macbook trackpad while using Windows 7 is not a good one. Perhaps it has a learning curve.
the macbook trackpad while using Windows 7 is not a good one.
while using Windows 7
Windows 7


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 09, 2011, 10:36:52 AM
Seriously, you're blaming Windows 7 for the performance of a MacBook trackpad in Windows 7? I hope that's a troll :P


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 09, 2011, 11:41:35 AM
Since it works awesome in OSX. Yes.

You might be able to blame the drivers, but what moron runs Windows 7 on a perfectly good macbook?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 09, 2011, 12:46:27 PM
Its not a driver problem, its the single mouse button mentality of Job's design. Now, you have context menus in OSX that are extremely useful, but you have to hold down the ctrl key to get them up. In a more modern track pad, you have to put two fingers on the trackpad, and then press the mouse button.

A cut off your nose to spite your face solution if I've ever seen one, its on up there with 'computer games can't tell stories' boondogles of Job's vision. Great in many regards, abysmally shortsighted in others.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on November 09, 2011, 12:50:03 PM
Its not a driver problem, its the single mouse button mentality of Job's design. Now, you have context menus in OSX that are extremely useful, but you have to hold down the ctrl key to get them up. In a more modern track pad, you have to put two fingers on the trackpad, and then press the mouse button.

A cut off your nose to spite your face solution if I've ever seen one, its on up there with 'computer games can't tell stories' boondogles of Job's vision. Great in many regards, abysmally shortsighted in others.

Two fingers, tap pad, get right-click menu.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 09, 2011, 12:53:55 PM
Yep, as I mentioned above. Maybe its a learning curve, but it doesn't work for me, since the track pad is too sensitive and stuff skips all over the danged place.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 09, 2011, 01:10:16 PM
 :oh_i_see:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 09, 2011, 01:59:14 PM
Yep, as I mentioned above. Maybe its a learning curve, but it doesn't work for me, since the track pad is too sensitive and stuff skips all over the danged place.
You can configure the right click to be the bottom right or bottom left corner of the pad.

The thing that irks me is no middle mouse button. No middle mouse button on a Unix-based OS is :uhrr:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 09, 2011, 03:51:45 PM
Veering way off topic here, but I'm curious what a middle button does for one in a Unix based environment?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on November 09, 2011, 04:29:19 PM
Veering way off topic here, but I'm curious what a middle button does for one in a Unix based environment?
Copy and paste highlighted text.

e: actually it depends but it's often copy and paste.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on November 15, 2011, 03:52:41 PM
It has been 4 years since I upgraded my PC.  I used to not care what I spent but my gaming is less frequent so I am not looking to drop more than $2K.

What are the basic ingredients for a PC game being released in the next 6 months?  I always go with Intel and NVIDIA just because I am lazy.

Is there any reason to push beyond the i5-2500 and the GTX550s?  Should I bother with SLI?  I never have and things have always been fine.  What is the difference betwee the i5-2500 and i5-2500K?  Seems to be a $10 difference on most gaming PC websites.  

RAM will be 8GB.  On HDDs, I want a 128GB SSD and a 500GB standard.  I don't need a lot of storage since my current 150GB HDD is only 70% full, but I am willing to listen to alternative arguments.  The SSD will be for the OS and system stuff only.  My monitors will be a new 27" paired with my current 24".  I don't want to dual screen for games.  I use the second for skype/surfing/etc. while I play.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 15, 2011, 03:54:53 PM
The "K" means it's unlocked making it super easy to OC.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on November 15, 2011, 03:57:05 PM
The "K" means it's unlocked making it super easy to OC.


Ah. Well, if I don't buy it overclocked to start with I won;t be overclocking at all unless OCing has gotten more user friendly.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on November 15, 2011, 04:14:50 PM
It has.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on November 15, 2011, 04:15:18 PM
The "K" means it's unlocked making it super easy to OC.


Ah. Well, if I don't buy it overclocked to start with I won;t be overclocking at all unless OCing has gotten more user friendly.

Look at it as that the 'K' is a more robust part.  The better bins of parts are the ones that get sold as over-clockable chips, I would spend the 10 bux even if not considering overclocking potential (which is considerable, actually).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on November 15, 2011, 05:07:43 PM
First, a few questions:

Do you plan on installing games on the system SSD, or on the separate drive? I ask because it somewhat defeats the point of having an SSD, since the large data pulls happen with games, not with the system itself. Sure, your browser will pull up a few nanoseconds faster with an SSD system drive, but the difference is felt in those heavy loading Dragon Age/Skyrim levels, for instance, not in anything done as a routine OS level interaction.

Secondly, why not have two monitors while playing games? I don't mean using both monitors to display the game, but having one display the game, the other for other things, such as pandora, or your chat box, or your skyp, etc. I do this, and so far, it works spelendidly.

I think the video card sweetspot is the 560 rather than the 550 (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2011/03/15/nvidia-geforce-gtx-550-ti-1gb-review/1) but others should corroborate. I'm using a 5870 in a similar set up, cept its a 2700k and an SSD system/game drive (250GB) and I couldn't be happier.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 15, 2011, 05:33:14 PM
I won;t be overclocking at all unless OCing has gotten more user friendly.
I literally pushed a button on my motherboard and got a 900MHz OC. I could tweak it and go much higher, but eh. 4.2GHz is cool imo.

The 2500K is awesome. Look back over my agonizing over a couple mobos for some infos (actually skimming the last few pages would still be relevant). I'm SLI'ing two GTX460s, just because that's how it worked out. I had to upgrade my gpu last year before I could upgrade the pc, so for $130 I went SLI rather than big single card as I always have done. It works really, really well with games that support SLI, once I loaded the Skyrim profile I was able to max everything at 1080p and get a great framerate.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 15, 2011, 08:23:56 PM
It has been 4 years since I upgraded my PC.  I used to not care what I spent but my gaming is less frequent so I am not looking to drop more than $2K.

What are the basic ingredients for a PC game being released in the next 6 months?  I always go with Intel and NVIDIA just because I am lazy.

Is there any reason to push beyond the i5-2500 and the GTX550s?  Should I bother with SLI?  I never have and things have always been fine.  What is the difference betwee the i5-2500 and i5-2500K?  Seems to be a $10 difference on most gaming PC websites.  

RAM will be 8GB.  On HDDs, I want a 128GB SSD and a 500GB standard.  I don't need a lot of storage since my current 150GB HDD is only 70% full, but I am willing to listen to alternative arguments.  The SSD will be for the OS and system stuff only.  My monitors will be a new 27" paired with my current 24".  I don't want to dual screen for games.  I use the second for skype/surfing/etc. while I play.

$2K will buy a hell of a machine - I don't think you need to spend anywhere near that much:

Good P67 mobo (ASUS P67 PRO (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131771) or MSI P67 GD-65 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130574), alternately ASRock P67 Extreme4 Gen3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157265)).  If you don't mind going micro-ATX, I really like the ASUS Maximus IV Gene-Z (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131759) - $140-170

Core i5 2500K (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072) - $215 and the locked base 2500 is only $5 cheaper.

A good value CPU heatsink like the Cooler Master Hyper 212 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065)/Hyper 212 EVO (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103099) or the Xigmatek Gaia (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082) or Balder (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233040) - they never top the charts at the crazy overclocker hangouts, but they're cheap, easy to install and offer great performance per dollar and are tons quieter than the stock cooler - $25-45

Any of a number of decent 8 GB DDR3 kits.  I like both G.Skill (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428) or Corsair (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145345) - $45-60

Depending on your preference, either the GTX560ti or HD6950 at the sweet spot, or the GTX570 or HD6970 one step up.  I prefer non-reference coolers that have two or more fans and vent into a case with good airflow. ~$230-250 for the sweet spot cards and $320-350 at the high end.

Figure $100-150 for a PSU and $60-150 for a case and $50-150 or so for accessory crap like optical drive, additional fans, card readers, etc.

Add your HDDs (good luck with finding a mechanical hard drive for anything less than 'why u no use lube?!' prices - the flooding in Thailand has destroyed HDD manufacturing and prices have skyrocketed - the same 1 TB Spinpoint F3 I bought at $60 a couple of months ago is now $160 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152185)).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on November 17, 2011, 02:33:12 PM
First, a few questions:

Do you plan on installing games on the system SSD, or on the separate drive? I ask because it somewhat defeats the point of having an SSD, since the large data pulls happen with games, not with the system itself. Sure, your browser will pull up a few nanoseconds faster with an SSD system drive, but the difference is felt in those heavy loading Dragon Age/Skyrim levels, for instance, not in anything done as a routine OS level interaction.

Secondly, why not have two monitors while playing games? I don't mean using both monitors to display the game, but having one display the game, the other for other things, such as pandora, or your chat box, or your skyp, etc. I do this, and so far, it works spelendidly.

I think the video card sweetspot is the 560 rather than the 550 (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2011/03/15/nvidia-geforce-gtx-550-ti-1gb-review/1) but others should corroborate. I'm using a 5870 in a similar set up, cept its a 2700k and an SSD system/game drive (250GB) and I couldn't be happier.

I didn't really think about putting games on the SSD as opposed to the spinners just due to size, but your argument makes complete sense.  I could use the SSD for games only and leave all the other stuff on the spinners.  That could push me to a bigger SSD, but that's fine. 

Thanks for the link on the vid card. 

On the monitors, I wasn't clear.  I do and plan to continue exactly what you described.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on November 20, 2011, 01:11:06 AM

Any of a number of decent 8 GB DDR3 kits.  I like both G.Skill (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428) or Corsair (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145345) - $45-60


Holy f--, RAM got cheap. Any idea why?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on November 20, 2011, 12:16:09 PM
Holy f--, RAM got cheap. Any idea why?

Oversupply, if you can find a good sale its $35-40 (http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=57869&vpn=KHX1600C9D3K2%2F8GX&manufacture=Kingston&promoid=1190)(CAD) for 8GB now.

edit: Back to the mac discussion I'm honestly thinking of purchasing a mac book air for a user in our company as a netbook replacement and load Windows 7 on it. The form factor and hardware is enough to excuse the higher price point, take a look at any business class latitude and your in the same range. Downside it's close enough now to wait for the Ivy Bridge (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Bridge#Ivy_Bridge) refreshes with the better GPU/reduced TDP.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on November 20, 2011, 02:03:43 PM
So I don't feel like putting a system together myself.  the 50+ hour work weeks combined with after-school activities for the kids mean I say "fuck this" to a lot of tinkering these days. 

However, I know that buying a Dell, HP or (ha) Alienware is a good way to throw some money away on substandard parts and/ or undersized components. Dell w/ power supplies, specifically.  My 6 year old beast here would last me a lot longer if I could upgrade the GPU.. but I'm maxed out on the card it can power with an olda Geforce 9500GT.  :heartbreak:

So I'm looking to find someplace that will put a PC together without ripping me off too badly.  I know Ibuypower is pretty lulzworthy on prices but how about Cyberpowerpc?

http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/CyberPower_X58_Configurator/

This rig will cost me $1982 and gets me a monitor, nice G15 and a Razr mouse, where it costs about $2200 to get something similar from Alienware without a monitor. (and Dell's 8600's don't tell you what their power supply is, which makes me wary.)

Any thoughts? Any suggestions? Anyplace else to look?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sand on November 20, 2011, 03:05:10 PM
My wireless router (Netgear WNR854t) seems to have given up the ghost this past week.

I reset it to factory settings, flashed the firmware, and it still only provides service reluctantly and intermittently.

So Im running to BestBuy this evening to get another one. Any solid performers out there these days? Im tired of the old standard of having to cycle the router off and on to get it to work every few hours. It ruins my gaming.
Belkin? Cisco? Stay with Netgear? Who should I be looking at?




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on November 20, 2011, 05:47:25 PM
Newegg will build systems for you iirc, or if you're near a Fry's, they do an okay job, and have a decent warrantee. I'm making my boss have Fry's do his next system, so they can deal with all the stupid shit he and his kids do to it, instead of me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on November 20, 2011, 06:52:55 PM

Belkin? Cisco? Stay with Netgear? Who should I be looking at?

Don't ever buy a Belkin router. The things are the worst you can buy.

Cisco-Linksys are probably the most consistent quality but any SOHO grade networking equipment is always going to have a high likelihood of failing after a couple of years. If you have one last you 2 years you have probably gotten your money's worth.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sand on November 20, 2011, 09:20:52 PM

Belkin? Cisco? Stay with Netgear? Who should I be looking at?

Don't ever buy a Belkin router. The things are the worst you can buy.

Cisco-Linksys are probably the most consistent quality but any SOHO grade networking equipment is always going to have a high likelihood of failing after a couple of years. If you have one last you 2 years you have probably gotten your money's worth.

Had the last one three years so I guess we got our money out of it.
We ended up buying the Cisco Model E3200 dual band super duper model.

So far so good.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on November 21, 2011, 03:35:24 PM
Newegg will build systems for you iirc, or if you're near a Fry's, they do an okay job, and have a decent warrantee. I'm making my boss have Fry's do his next system, so they can deal with all the stupid shit he and his kids do to it, instead of me.

No Fry's in the area and I didn't see any links to have Newgg build a system, only prebuilt systems.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 22, 2011, 11:54:16 PM
So I don't feel like putting a system together myself.  the 50+ hour work weeks combined with after-school activities for the kids mean I say "fuck this" to a lot of tinkering these days.  

However, I know that buying a Dell, HP or (ha) Alienware is a good way to throw some money away on substandard parts and/ or undersized components. Dell w/ power supplies, specifically.  My 6 year old beast here would last me a lot longer if I could upgrade the GPU.. but I'm maxed out on the card it can power with an olda Geforce 9500GT.  :heartbreak:

So I'm looking to find someplace that will put a PC together without ripping me off too badly.  I know Ibuypower is pretty lulzworthy on prices but how about Cyberpowerpc?

http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/CyberPower_X58_Configurator/

This rig will cost me $1982 and gets me a monitor, nice G15 and a Razr mouse, where it costs about $2200 to get something similar from Alienware without a monitor. (and Dell's 8600's don't tell you what their power supply is, which makes me wary.)

Any thoughts? Any suggestions? Anyplace else to look?

My brother and I just built a machine from start to finish over the last 2 days (it would have been a single afternoon, but we got a bad mobo that had to be RMA'd with Newegg, who managed to ship a replacement from CA to NC in one day - badass customer service).

Core i5 2500K on a ASUS Maximus IV Gene-Z, GTX570, 8GB RAM, 60GB SSD + 1TB HDD, nice case/decent PSU/great CPU cooler, and all the ancillary stuff for $1300.


If you're determined to buy a prebuilt from there, at least go with the Z68 option (http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/CyberPower_Z68_Configurator/) with either a 2500K or 2600K instead of X58.  You'll likely spend a fair bit less for equal performance, and X58 is a dead end - at least with Z68, you can eventually drop an Ivy Bridge proc in later if you want.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 23, 2011, 10:17:32 AM
What's with the dust sucker on the bottom of that thing?  :why_so_serious:

I like those cases, hidden wire runs is a nice thing. I need to actually finish my build (couple more fans need installed), but I lose all momentum when stuff works well. But the expansions are packed tighter than a bingo hall with free candy. I want to get a pic up for grins. Runs great, looks  :ye_gods:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on November 23, 2011, 05:21:43 PM
Thanks for the guidance, Noisy. It's stuff like that I had no idea on.

However, providence being a bitch my funds were just slammed to repair the brake lights on the wife's car instead.  /sigh


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 23, 2011, 05:34:40 PM
What's with the dust sucker on the bottom of that thing?  :why_so_serious:

I like those cases, hidden wire runs is a nice thing. I need to actually finish my build (couple more fans need installed), but I lose all momentum when stuff works well. But the expansions are packed tighter than a bingo hall with free candy. I want to get a pic up for grins. Runs great, looks  :ye_gods:

Just an additional intake fan - there's a removable/washable filter that covers the entire bottom of the chassis, so that should keep it from being too much of a dust collector.

Thanks for the guidance, Noisy. It's stuff like that I had no idea on.

However, providence being a bitch my funds were just slammed to repair the brake lights on the wife's car instead.  /sigh

Ack.  No fun.  On the bright side, Ivy Bridge and the new nVidia/AMD video cards should be out soon (I think that AMD will launch new cards in Q1, while nViidia is supposed to drop in Q2), so you may get to skip Sandy Bridge and the 6xxx/5xx cards altogether.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 23, 2011, 06:44:35 PM
my funds were just slammed to repair the brake lights on the wife's car
I'm guessing you don't mean replacing the bulbs?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on November 23, 2011, 08:08:32 PM
No, the switch under the brake pedal went bad.  So that, along with the a put-off AC leak drained about $650.  So I'll just throw the rest into the Christmas & vacation pot and put the computer off until June or so.

Old and responsible sucks.  I miss young and heedless.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: fuser on November 23, 2011, 09:31:02 PM
My wireless router (Netgear WNR854t) seems to have given up the ghost this past week.

I reset it to factory settings, flashed the firmware, and it still only provides service reluctantly and intermittently.

So Im running to BestBuy this evening to get another one. Any solid performers out there these days? Im tired of the old standard of having to cycle the router off and on to get it to work every few hours. It ruins my gaming.
Belkin? Cisco? Stay with Netgear? Who should I be looking at?

It's probably too late but something to consider in the future is a RouterBoard (http://routerboard.com/). You can buy just the guts and use your own cards or buy a pre built device. The newest soho wifi model (http://routerboard.com/RB751U-2HnD) looks very nice for the $59 pricetag. It's built on Linux but has a nice web ui, cli and quite stable. Take a look at the webfig from their on-line demo (http://demo.mt.lv/) / manual (http://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:TOC) to see if it's too technical to use.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 26, 2011, 04:27:01 PM
So, since I've picked up a bit of overtime at work, I've treated myself to a couple upgrades for my rig, which I haven't modified in over two years now.

First, I'm going from 4GB to 16GB of memory, thanks to a NewEgg sale of $54 for the 16GB kit.

Second, NewEgg was also seeling the OCZ Agility 3 60GB for 64.99 with rebate.  I figure a $1 a gig for a cutting edge SSD was decent enough.  I haven't played with the tech yet, so I'm gonna play it safe and just use it as a boot drive for now, and regulate my current VelociRaptor to Program Files, Users files and the Page File.

Thoughts?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Reg on November 26, 2011, 05:23:06 PM
I've heard that for most applications you wouldn't even notice the difference between 4gig and 16 but if I'm wrong let me know. It's a nice cheap upgrade if it's worth doing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 26, 2011, 06:28:16 PM
I've heard that for most applications you wouldn't even notice the difference between 4gig and 16 but if I'm wrong let me know. It's a nice cheap upgrade if it's worth doing.
It's worth it right now for x64 Win7 apps and services, as they can address the extra memory.  Once more games and apps go x64, such as what WoW Pandaria may be bringing, it'll be a nice boost for them as well.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on November 27, 2011, 01:02:58 AM
I've got 8GB in the machine right now and didn't pay much for it....but it's so damned tempting to buy more ram with prices in the gutter.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on November 29, 2011, 08:49:51 AM
I've got 8GB in the machine right now and didn't pay much for it....but it's so damned tempting to buy more ram with prices in the gutter.

I'm in the same boat - about to pull the trigger on 2 more 8GB kits - one to match the 8GB kit in my main gaming desktop, and one to replace the 4GB kit in my HTPC/portable gaming box.  Even if I never see any benefit, it's cheap enough to not really care if I do.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 29, 2011, 08:53:13 AM
I've got 8GB in the machine right now and didn't pay much for it....but it's so damned tempting to buy more ram with prices in the gutter.

I'm in the same boat - about to pull the trigger on 2 more 8GB kits - one to match the 8GB kit in my main gaming desktop, and one to replace the 4GB kit in my HTPC/portable gaming box.  Even if I never see any benefit, it's cheap enough to not really care if I do.

Like I said, future=proofing isn't a bad thing.  As more programs go x64, so too will the memory footprint for those apps increase. 

For example, running SWTOR this weekend, I noticed that it consumed about 1.5GB of memory while running  :ye_gods:.  I can only imagine how much more it could consume once it has more room to grow.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sand on November 29, 2011, 12:58:00 PM
Vista x32 limited usable memory to around 3-4 gigs of RAM. Anything more and it wouldnt recognize or use it.

With the update to Windows 7 is this still a x32 limitation? Do I need to go x64 in order to use anything over 4 gigs?


Basically wondering if I need to plop down $200 bucks to update my OS, in order to add more RAM.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 29, 2011, 01:05:38 PM
Vista x32 limited usable memory to around 3-4 gigs of RAM. Anything more and it wouldnt recognize or use it.

With the update to Windows 7 is this still a x32 limitation? Do I need to go x64 in order to use anything over 4 gigs?


Basically wondering if I need to plop down $200 bucks to update my OS, in order to add more RAM.

Yes, you need to go x64 in order for Windows to address and utilize more than 4GB of memory.  It's a computer architectural thing, based on the bits of information that the processor can address at any given time. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on November 29, 2011, 01:09:42 PM
Newegg dropped OEM Win7 home premium to $80 last week. FYI. Usually $100... which is appalling to me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 30, 2011, 05:24:40 AM
UPS sez my stuff's out for delivery right now  :woot:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on November 30, 2011, 08:32:58 PM
Gear has arrived.  Started with the 16GB.  My board only picked up half on boot, and Win7 actually saw all 16 but said only 8 was usable  :ye_gods:

A flash-update of the BIOS solved nothing, but apparently playing musical chairs with the sticks fixed it.  Go figure.   :why_so_serious:  Phase 1 complete.

SSD hooked up and powered on.  Looks like I got a newer one...already has the latest firmware on it from OCZ, which I'm told is a good thing based on previous reviews of the Agility 3.

Backing up and deactivating softwares now.  Will rearrange drives and do the fresh Win7 install in the morning.  So looking forward to the speed ^_^


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: luckton on December 01, 2011, 07:56:52 PM
SSD install went off without a hitch.  Everything's smooth like butter now  :drill:

WEI Numbers before the memory and SSD
CPU:        7.3
Memory:   7.4
Graphics:   7.7
Prime HD: 5.9

New numbers:
CPU:        7.3
Memory:   7.5
Graphics:   7.7
Prime HD: 7.7

 :awesome_for_real:

I think I should be good to go for at least a couple more years.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Minvaren on December 02, 2011, 08:16:48 PM
Once you meet or exceed 4GB of memory, you can likely kill your swap file for a minor speed boost.

TOR, DA, and Witcher 2 (anyone see a pattern here?   :why_so_serious:) all complained about this though, so I recently upgraded to 8GB.  Could probably put 32GB of DDR3 in a machine for what I spent on the DDR2 for my motherboard, though.   :?



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on December 03, 2011, 07:17:33 AM
Once you meet or exceed 4GB of memory, you can likely kill your swap file for a minor speed boost.

This is a poor idea.  Total virtual memory addressing for each program running on a system can well exceed 4GB.  The increased penalty to checking the cache (page swap file) on a cache miss when you are already reading from disk should be trivially small and on a read hit (data is in the swap file) the benefit can be quite large.

Unless you have a recent study that demonstrates some poorly known feature of Windows Memory Management to back this up?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on December 03, 2011, 08:26:03 AM
Why the hell does my computer part shopping always grind to a halt when choosing a mobo? CPU, no worries. Ram, need speed, but overall pretty easy. PSU I know what companies I have had good success with. Mobo...errr, ummm.. weeks of research.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 03, 2011, 01:37:19 PM
Break it down to features. Do you need two separate raid controllers? Probably not. Do you want USB3 or SATAIII? How many PCI-E slots do you need? Two if you're going SLI. Do you care about using the new types of GUI BIOS configs? If so, stick to Asus. If you don't, go for Gigabyte. Do you want onboard video afforded by the new Core i series?

That's all the real questions I could think of. In terms of brands, most people have decent luck with Asus or Gigabyte. Some like other brands, but those two have always been solid for me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on December 03, 2011, 01:44:12 PM
Break it down to features. Do you need two separate raid controllers? Probably not. Do you want USB3 or SATAIII? How many PCI-E slots do you need? Two if you're going SLI. Do you care about using the new types of GUI BIOS configs? If so, stick to Asus. If you don't, go for Gigabyte. Do you want onboard video afforded by the new Core i series?

That's all the real questions I could think of. In terms of brands, most people have decent luck with Asus or Gigabyte. Some like other brands, but those two have always been solid for me.

I used gigabbyte for my last two builds. Never had a problem other than it being pissy about type and size of the ram sticks it plays with. But that was a limitation of the board I knew about when I got it. I may just stick with Giga. I am definitely looking for USB 3.0 but the rest I have no interest/clue about. I normally take a month to research this stuff then pull the trigger.

I blame my mother since she asked me to get her a new computer and I told her I'd just build one for her. Looking at all those PC parts got my juices flowing.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 03, 2011, 02:48:33 PM
So I was looking at this Qnap NAS (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822107053), my desktop drive is getting full, I don't really care to leave my desktop on all the time and I want to start using my laptop more.  The qnap is small, quiet, power efficient, will stream media (to phone/ps3) and has a built in web server.  This all sounded amazing until I started taking a closer look, it recommends enterprise quality drives (although users say desktop drives seem to work fine) and the web server/linux package management is a mess (slow hard to upgrade).  

This all got me thinking I could build my own quiet low power HTPC-like NAS + web + media server, I snatched up a 2tb WD green drive for $89 bucks via target but the rest of my build is still up in the air.  

Here is what I have on the drawing board:

  • $126.99 - SeaSonic X series SS-400FL Active PFC F3 400W ATX12V Fanless (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151097), might be a bit overkill.
  • $39.99 - Kingston HyperX Blu 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104231), HyperX is just a habit of mine
  • $89.99 - LGA 1155 Intel H67 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121506), since Asus got all crappy I am never sure what to do for MB's anymore.
  • $129.99 - Intel Core i3-2120 Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz LGA 1155 65W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115077), low power, on board HD.
  • $84.00 - Silverstone Black Aluminum Grandia Series GD05B micro-ATX (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163166), seems to be a decent HTPC case with big slow fans.

Initially I was going to go ITX but I want to leave this on 24x7 and was worried about heat, plus micro ATX seems more cost effective.  I guess my fear here (aside from the normal does this all look good) is Linux compatibility and how this might hold up as an always on type of thing.  I am not really worried about how well it plays video (have the ps3 for that) and I may not even bother loading a gui and just go with ubuntu server.  Most of the time this box will be idle and awaiting my commands.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Merusk on December 03, 2011, 02:51:28 PM
Oh.. hello there unexpected X-mas bonus.. You're about to become a new PC and 24" monitor.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on December 07, 2011, 01:48:01 PM
Anyone RMA to newegg after you have processed a rebate? Will that matter since they required the boxes UPC label? Damn video card will no longer recognize at boot even though the 6pin PCI-E connectors are fine and the voltages are right where they should be. Put in my old 8800 and it works fine other than the fan not being happy so I know it is not the PCI-Exp slot either. Any other troubleshooting tips outside of dropping it into someone else's box to test it out?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 09, 2011, 03:31:05 PM
  • $126.99 - SeaSonic X series SS-400FL Active PFC F3 400W ATX12V Fanless (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151097), might be a bit overkill.
  • $39.99 - Kingston HyperX Blu 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104231), HyperX is just a habit of mine
  • $89.99 - LGA 1155 Intel H67 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121506), since Asus got all crappy I am never sure what to do for MB's anymore.
  • $129.99 - Intel Core i3-2120 Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz LGA 1155 65W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115077), low power, on board HD.
  • $84.00 - Silverstone Black Aluminum Grandia Series GD05B micro-ATX (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163166), seems to be a decent HTPC case with big slow fans.

Parts are in, box is built, pretty quiet but if there is no other noise going on I can hear the flow of the air through the case (not necessarily the fans themselves though).  

Currently working my way through this todo list:
  • Ubuntu Server 11.10 / done.
  • LAMP Stack up and running but just default apache test page, waiting for a new router before I open it up to the outside world.
  • PS3 Media Server is up and running (currently in the process of moving my video collection).
  • Samba is installed going to set it up as a PDC this weekend.
  • Install postfix or some other light weight way to send email via php.
  • Need to set up fail2ban, suhosin and various other server hardening things.


Anyone have some ideas for cool things I can throw at my new minion?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 09, 2011, 09:39:43 PM
http://www.minecraft.net/download


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: sinij on December 09, 2011, 11:33:40 PM
Anyone RMA to newegg after you have processed a rebate? Will that matter since they required the boxes UPC label? Damn video card will no longer recognize at boot even though the 6pin PCI-E connectors are fine and the voltages are right where they should be. Put in my old 8800 and it works fine other than the fan not being happy so I know it is not the PCI-Exp slot either. Any other troubleshooting tips outside of dropping it into someone else's box to test it out?

Don't RMA, return it as defective and exchange for exactly the same. Then there shouldn't be any issues with rebate.

Still, rebates make me rage. The best way to get me not to buy your stuff is to stick a mail-in rebate on it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on December 10, 2011, 12:56:02 AM
http://www.minecraft.net/download
Cool but not really looking to run my own minecraft server. 

I did just finish setting up some dvd ripping utils, I think i'll try and automate as much of that as I can.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on December 10, 2011, 07:15:27 AM

Still, rebates make me rage. The best way to get me not to buy your stuff is to stick a mail-in rebate on it.

That's a little spergy.  These days they send you a prepaid credit card with the money on it.  Mail in rebates for something I was going to buy anyway fund a good portion of my Starbucks addiction.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on December 10, 2011, 12:32:50 PM

Still, rebates make me rage. The best way to get me not to buy your stuff is to stick a mail-in rebate on it.

That's a little spergy.  These days they send you a prepaid credit card with the money on it.  Mail in rebates for something I was going to buy anyway fund a good portion of my Starbucks addiction.

I'm somewhere in between - I just don't factor rebates into the price, since they don't change my out of pocket expense.  If they actually manage to send me the rebate check/card, its like getting free money.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 10, 2011, 03:38:00 PM
I love rebates, I got $50 off my last build.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on December 10, 2011, 07:13:09 PM
I am fully on lusting after MicroCenter having just got back from the store in Cleveland. i5 2500K, Gigabyte Z68 board, and 8g of RAM for $335 plus $50 in rebate slips. I am more than willing to make the two hour trip for shit.  :drill:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on December 12, 2011, 04:11:54 PM
Got an email from newegg that has 4gb Kingston hyper x ddr3 for 9.99 after rebate. Ends at midnight pst.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on December 12, 2011, 04:58:51 PM
Got an email from newegg that has 4gb Kingston hyper x ddr3 for 9.99 after rebate. Ends at midnight pst.

All sold out already.  Not surprising at that price.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on December 14, 2011, 01:17:28 PM
Quick question, does anyone have any idea about the current graphics card release cycle?

The GTX260 in my main gaming rig is dying and I'd like to replace it sometime soon. To go 3+ tiers up from it probably means a something like a 570 but I'd like the price of them to drop a bit first. They're about £260 here, which is over my comfort limit. If there's new cards coming then hopefully it'll bump the rest down a price bracket.

I'm very out of touch with these things so I have no idea if we're talking 3, 6, 12 months.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on December 14, 2011, 02:50:41 PM
3 months looks about the likely window for both Red and Green to get their next-gen cards out. 570s are only about $300 to $350 here in 'Murika, and the new "560ti with 448 cores" are a bit less. If you can limp your 260 on for a bit, it's almost always worth waiting.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on December 15, 2011, 12:24:25 AM
Cool, thanks. If the 570 or the 560ti drop to ~£160-180 I could probably afford one.

I hope the 260 will last, it's just getting really noisy and running really hot. Idles at 60-64oC, hits 90+ under heavy load. Cleaned out the case and fans as much as I can. I'll try and keep any extended gaming sessions to the downstairs PC for a while, which has the same card but runs 20oC cooler.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on December 15, 2011, 08:30:05 AM
You could try re-seating the cooling on the hotter card, clean it up and put on new thermal goop and whatnot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on December 15, 2011, 09:42:09 AM
I have considered that, however right now, if I fuck it up I will only be able to afford to replace it with a minor upgrade.

If I wait until I can afford a decent upgrade and *then* try fixing it I'm covered if I make a dogs arse of it.  :drill:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on December 15, 2011, 06:06:56 PM
3 months looks about the likely window for both Red and Green to get their next-gen cards out. 570s are only about $300 to $350 here in 'Murika, and the new "560ti with 448 cores" are a bit less. If you can limp your 260 on for a bit, it's almost always worth waiting.

I think that ATI is very soon (later this month (http://vr-zone.com/articles/amd-brings-the-launch-of-radeon-hd-7900-series-forward-december-22nd-2011/14255.html)), while nVidia is probably a quarter or two out.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on December 16, 2011, 12:16:37 AM
Sorry, should have said, I don't do ATI. Great hardware, drivers cobbled together from old mattress parts and chewing gum. By monkeys.

Luckily it's winter now so the ambient temperatures in my gaming room are rapidly approaching a point where PC cooling becomes superfluous...  :why_so_serious:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on December 16, 2011, 01:27:56 AM
I've always wanted to stick my case in a dry place outside just to see how far I could overclock it.  Unfortunately, the "dry" part is hard, even in winter.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on December 17, 2011, 08:28:04 AM
Sorry, should have said, I don't do ATI. Great hardware, drivers cobbled together from old mattress parts and chewing gum. By monkeys.

ATI's drivers have been fine for the most part for the last few years. I have seen just as many nVidia driver problems as I have seen ATI ones since I built my machine in 2008.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: rattran on December 17, 2011, 09:38:15 AM
Over the last year or so, ATI drivers seem to have gotten back to being extra special. I've switched back to Nvidia after using Radeon flavored cards since the 4870, and recommending them.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 17, 2011, 10:09:54 AM
I have to concur. I had to tweak the files for my 5870 because the dumb thing would go from powered to idle low voltage state any time you weren't actively in a high graphics window. So if I was playing a dx9 game in a window, with a browser in the other monitor, and I switched over to the other monitor (just bringing focus to the browser rather than the game) the whole danged screen would flicker. I had to go in and manually create a preset profile that would keep the card's voltage higher when going to 'low voltage' states to stop the flickering.

This isn't some fancy set up I have here. This is a dx9 game in windowed mode in one monitor, youtube or f13 in another monitor. Hardly pushing the boundaries of hardware expectation, especially not with a 5870. And the problem was fixable with 3 lines of edited code in a freakin' .ini file!

ATI driver writers are just flat out clownshoes.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on December 17, 2011, 11:24:18 AM
Yeah, I'm not avoiding ATI just because their drivers once touched me in a bad place in 2003, but because pretty much every single week I see someone post a complaint about their drivers on these and other forums.

Just in recent weeks I've seen people having issues in Skyrim, SWTOR, Dungeon Defenders, World of Tanks.

So, I am sticking with nVidia for the foreseeable future and that's not even remotely up for debate. /derail.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sand on December 19, 2011, 10:14:59 PM
With the release of SWTOR I thought of cobbling some cash together to build myself a new desktop gaming rig, since the ole Lenovo T500 laptop isnt doing so well these days with my return to gaming.
Wife's response: "Your laptop is only three years old."

 :facepalm:  Non-gamers just dont understand.

 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on December 20, 2011, 09:47:24 AM
With the release of SWTOR I thought of cobbling some cash together to build myself a new desktop gaming rig, since the ole Lenovo T500 laptop isnt doing so well these days with my return to gaming.
Wife's response: "Your laptop is only three years old."

 :facepalm:  Non-gamers just dont understand.

<$400 will get you a full system that will rock SWTOR.  You're a dentist right?  Tell a couple people your putting in real gold fillings and then use fake stuff.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?hl=en%20_US&hl=en_US&key=0AvaYhPmP5kwadHZsOW9%20QVFRkZEpzcUplak5zZFUyYnc&output=html


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on December 20, 2011, 10:30:54 AM
I think you confused Sand with Ghost, who's an orthodontist. Sand is Broughden who's occupation probably involves a deep fryer somewhere.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on December 20, 2011, 11:11:10 AM
I think you confused Sand with Ghost, who's an orthodontist. Sand is Broughden who's occupation probably involves a deep fryer somewhere.

Ahh, yes.  My mistake.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Reborne on December 22, 2011, 11:47:03 PM
Ok, I'm looking at buying my first gaming laptop, mainly for use at work and LANs as I have a good desktop.

I'm not great on hardware so here is the one that I'm thinking of buying. (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/360316425418?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649)

Quote
Key Features

  Intel Core i7 - 2.93GHz Turbo
  17.3 "  WXGA Bright Wide Screen
  640GB 7200RPM ULTRA SATA Hard Drive
  8GB Memory ( check specs for upgrade options)
  Build in Web Camera !
  1GB Dedicated Video ATI HD 5870
  Super Multi 8x DVD+RW  -Write DVD and CD
  3D Audio with EAX Advanced HD 4.0

  Wireless Internet with WIFI A/G/N Wireless Card

  Windows 7 Premium 64bit

I'm not looking for the absolute best, just something that will run recent games fairly well. (Skyrim, Saints Row The Third, Arkham City, etc)
Does this sound like a good machine?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on December 23, 2011, 04:16:57 PM
Performance should be decent (as notebooks go) however you should check and see if ATI's notebook drivers are still vendor-dependent. NVIDIA wised-up a while back and made their generic drivers usable on any manufacturers NVIDIA-equipped notebooks. This makes updating NVIDIA notebook drivers much easier than before where you had to hack INI files or hope and pray somebody made a custom config for your notebook. If ATI is still like that I would be hesitant to get an ATI-powered notebook especially given how bad their drivers have been of late.
 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on January 24, 2012, 02:16:25 AM
I think you confused Sand with Ghost, who's an orthodontist. Sand is Broughden who's occupation probably involves a deep fryer somewhere.

Isn't that being mean to Arcadian Del Sol? Wait, he stopped managing the chicken place didn't he.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Ironwood on January 24, 2012, 08:35:58 AM
Did he ?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on January 25, 2012, 05:34:29 PM
Man...  As happy as I am with the Phantom, the new Cosmos II (http://www.coolermaster-usa.com/product.php?product_id=3071&product_name=Cosmos%20II) is really tempting.  The $350 price tag less so.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on February 05, 2012, 02:31:11 PM
CPU:Intel Core i7-2600K 3.40 GHz 8M Intel Smart Cache LGA1155 (All Venom OC Certified) [-30]
CD:24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive (BLACK COLOR)
HDD:120 GB ADATA S511 SATA-III 6.0Gb/s SSD - 550MB/s Read & 510MB/s Write [+35] (Single Drive)
HDD2:500GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD [+94] (Single Hard Drive)
MEMORY:8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1600MHz Dual Channel Memory [+3] (Kingston HyperX)
MOTHERBOARD:[CrossFireX/SLI] Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z/GEN3 Intel Z68 mATX Mainboard w/ ROG Connect, Lucid Virtu and Intel SRT & 7.1 SupremeFX Audio, Intel GbLAN, HDMI, USB 3.0, SATA-III RAID, 2x Gen3 PCIe X16 & 1 PCIe X4 (All Venom OC Certified) [+96]
VIDEO:NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560 Ti 1GB 16X PCIe Video Card (Major Brand Powered by NVIDIA)
POWERSUPPLY:700 Watts - Standard Power Supply - SLI/CrossFireX Ready
OS:Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium (64-bit Edition)

Will this last a few years? The 500GB HDD is smal, I know, but I just don;t need it.  I have external drives up the wazoo and constantly move stuff I don't use or watch anymore off my machine.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on February 05, 2012, 03:12:38 PM
CPU:Intel Core i7-2600K 3.40 GHz 8M Intel Smart Cache LGA1155 (All Venom OC Certified) [-30]
CD:24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive (BLACK COLOR)
HDD:120 GB ADATA S511 SATA-III 6.0Gb/s SSD - 550MB/s Read & 510MB/s Write [+35] (Single Drive)
HDD2:500GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD [+94] (Single Hard Drive)
MEMORY:8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1600MHz Dual Channel Memory [+3] (Kingston HyperX)
MOTHERBOARD:[CrossFireX/SLI] Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z/GEN3 Intel Z68 mATX Mainboard w/ ROG Connect, Lucid Virtu and Intel SRT & 7.1 SupremeFX Audio, Intel GbLAN, HDMI, USB 3.0, SATA-III RAID, 2x Gen3 PCIe X16 & 1 PCIe X4 (All Venom OC Certified) [+96]
VIDEO:NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560 Ti 1GB 16X PCIe Video Card (Major Brand Powered by NVIDIA)
POWERSUPPLY:700 Watts - Standard Power Supply - SLI/CrossFireX Ready
OS:Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium (64-bit Edition)

Will this last a few years? The 500GB HDD is smal, I know, but I just don;t need it.  I have external drives up the wazoo and constantly move stuff I don't use or watch anymore off my machine.

I can't see why not.  That said, if you can hold off a bit longer, you might want to wait until Kepler and Ivy Bridge hit later this year.

Beyond that, if you're comfortable with that HDD array, the only other thing I'd do is maybe change the 560ti to a 448-core 560ti or a 570 (depending on budget - you can drop the CPU to a 2500K with no real decrease in gaming performance to make up the difference) and specify a 'branded' (Seasonic, Corsair, XFX, NZXT, etc.) mid to high-end PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on February 05, 2012, 03:21:23 PM
CPU:Intel Core i7-2600K 3.40 GHz 8M Intel Smart Cache LGA1155 (All Venom OC Certified) [-30]
CD:24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive (BLACK COLOR)
HDD:120 GB ADATA S511 SATA-III 6.0Gb/s SSD - 550MB/s Read & 510MB/s Write [+35] (Single Drive)
HDD2:500GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD [+94] (Single Hard Drive)
MEMORY:8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1600MHz Dual Channel Memory [+3] (Kingston HyperX)
MOTHERBOARD:[CrossFireX/SLI] Asus Maximus IV Gene-Z/GEN3 Intel Z68 mATX Mainboard w/ ROG Connect, Lucid Virtu and Intel SRT & 7.1 SupremeFX Audio, Intel GbLAN, HDMI, USB 3.0, SATA-III RAID, 2x Gen3 PCIe X16 & 1 PCIe X4 (All Venom OC Certified) [+96]
VIDEO:NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560 Ti 1GB 16X PCIe Video Card (Major Brand Powered by NVIDIA)
POWERSUPPLY:700 Watts - Standard Power Supply - SLI/CrossFireX Ready
OS:Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium (64-bit Edition)

Will this last a few years? The 500GB HDD is smal, I know, but I just don;t need it.  I have external drives up the wazoo and constantly move stuff I don't use or watch anymore off my machine.
For another $10, you can RAID two of these SSD's (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227725).  Same capacity, twice the performance.

--Dave


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on February 06, 2012, 08:58:13 AM
For another $10, you can RAID two of these SSD's (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227725).  Same capacity, twice the performance.

--Dave

Does RAID support TRIM yet?  I was under the impression that non-enterprise SSD's + RAID wasn't a very good idea.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MahrinSkel on February 06, 2012, 03:13:46 PM
For another $10, you can RAID two of these SSD's (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227725).  Same capacity, twice the performance.

--Dave

Does RAID support TRIM yet?  I was under the impression that non-enterprise SSD's + RAID wasn't a very good idea.
TRIM affects mostly write speed performance, without it writes onto previously-occupied blocks require an erase cycle, slowing them down to roughly 1/10th of nominal speed.  As far as I know, no RAID controller (other than some of those built into PCIe-based cards) supports TRIM yet.  But in most cases, you want to minimize write cycles to an SSD, anyway (by putting transient data onto an HDD, usually).  Read speeds of 1GB+/sec are probably worth worst-case write speeds of 100MB/sec (still faster than most HDD's).

--Dave


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on February 08, 2012, 02:54:04 PM
bleh my graphics card fan went out and possibly melted stuff.  It was a redeon 4850 HD and I wasn't unhappy with it to the point of thinking about an upgrade.  What is a decent sub $150 card with dual DVI out that I can replace it with?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on February 08, 2012, 04:11:39 PM
bleh my graphics card fan went out and possibly melted stuff.  It was a redeon 4850 HD and I wasn't unhappy with it to the point of thinking about an upgrade.  What is a decent sub $150 card with dual DVI out that I can replace it with?

If you want to stick with AMD, the Radeon 6850 for around $135-140 or the 6870 for $155 and up.  Performance comparison between the two (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/291?vs=290). 

Alternately, if you want to go nVidia, the GTX460 is pretty much a direct counterpart to the 6850.  6850 vs GTX460 (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/291?vs=313)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on February 08, 2012, 06:31:42 PM
Cool, went with the 6850.

edit: While installing the new card I decided to get an ssd and do complete reinstall of w7.  I also am trying out waterfox.  Probably the ssd or maybe the clean w7 install but even web browsing seems noticeably snappier.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 14, 2012, 10:30:07 PM
This here (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=14063349) is probably what I'm doing.  Basically for some work stuff and playing some Skyrim and minesweeper and whatever.  I already have an Antec 300 case left over and most likely a decent sized sata HDD.

Please clue me in if I'm spending a bunch of extra money on something useless or am being dumb in some way?  I've been out of the loop for quite a while.

Thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on March 14, 2012, 10:46:37 PM
Do you need 6 cores? E.g. are you doing video or graphics rendering of some sort? I would go for something like the FX-4170 instead.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on March 15, 2012, 08:48:06 AM
For $100 more you can double the size of the SSD.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: grebo on March 15, 2012, 10:56:04 AM
Hmm, if the processor was faster even though it had less cores it would be better in most things.  I don't plan on doing any video editing stuff in the near future, so thanks for that.

I'm pretty sure I have a 500GB or so sata drive from my old system that should still work.  I'm wondering if I need more than 160gb for OS and programs and 500 gb for "video" and other stuff...  I'll think about it.

Thanks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on March 22, 2014, 09:21:48 AM
nVidia GTX680 reviews are out:

HardOCP (http://hardocp.com/article/2012/03/22/nvidia_kepler_gpu_geforce_gtx_680_video_card_review/1)

Anand (http://www.anandtech.com/show/5699/nvidia-geforce-gtx-680-review)

Tom's (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-680-review-benchmark,3161.html)

tl;dr:  Faster than 7970 while also drawing less power and adding some new features like 'GPU Boost' (basically self-overclocking, much like Turbo Boost is for CPUs), adaptive vsync (dynamically swapping to real-time in the event that the card can't sustain 60FPS instead of dropping to 30 or lower) and TXAA.

Can't say I'm looking for a $500 video card just yet, but the inevitable 670/660 should make things very interesting across the board.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Special J on March 22, 2014, 11:46:39 AM
So I've manged to get myself into speccing out a system for a buddy and I haven't done a gaming rig in years, so I'm behind.


So after a bit of research I came up with this:

CPU:  Intel Core i7-2600K 3.40 GHz Quad-Core
MB:    ASUS P8Z68-V/GEN3 Intel Z68
RAM:  Corsair CMZ8GX3M2X1600C8B Vengeance 8GB (2x 4GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz
HDD:  OCZ Vertex Plus 120GB 2.5" SATA II SSD
HDD2:  Seagate ST1000DM003 Barracuda  - 1TB, 7200RPM
VIDEO:  EVGA 01G-P3-1460-KR GeForce GTX 560  - 1GB, GDDR5
Case:  Corsair CC-9011012-WW Carbide Series 500R Mid Tower
PSU:  OCZ ModXStream Pro Power Supply - 700-Watt
DVD:  Lite-On Internal 24X DVD Writer

Sound card would be a PCI card recycled from his previous system that he wants to continue using.

Add on Windows 7 and it comes in uunder the $1500 (CDN) budget and if he wants to go the SLI road and double up the GPUs, only slightly over.  I've never really been in the SLI/Crossfire game.  First is it worthwhile? And second I haven't had much luck finding the PSU requirement, a single card says a 450W supply.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on March 22, 2014, 12:02:56 PM
Don't get the Vertex SSD, there are deals galore on the top tier consumer SSD's happening.  Currently they are $30 more than the Vertex (maybe worth that even) but if you watch it for a week or so I bet you could snag one for sub $150.  I think I saw the 128gb Samsung 830 for $140 a few days ago, the Crucial M4 has been on sale repeatedly as well.  The new Intel Cherryville drives were even going for $170 a week or so ago and they are supposed to be the cream of the Sandforce crop.  

edit - Looks like here is the current deal of the day: Mushkin Enhanced Chronos MKNSSDCR120GB 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC (http://www.neweggbusiness.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226236), and you can use coupon code MEMKMYPTS20 to get $20 off of a $100 purchase, bringing it down to $109 for a SATA III 120gb drive.  The downside is you have to create a newegg business account which requires you to provide your SSN or EIN.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Special J on March 22, 2014, 12:31:23 PM
Yeah I goofed on listing that SSD as I noticed it's a SATA II.  Will find an alternative.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on March 22, 2014, 12:33:22 PM
The direction the egg has been taking with the business site: I approve. A few changes they'd been making on the consumer side were bugging me from work. Still  :heart: the egg after all these years, even if they don't send me xmas swag anymore.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: dusematic on April 03, 2012, 04:57:28 PM
Not sure why anyone would get a 2600k instead of a 2500k unless money is no object.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on April 04, 2012, 08:38:09 AM
At least 25% of the price difference is justified by the cool factor of watching 8 cpu threads in the system monitor. 

If you are a VM user it is also nice to assign multiple cpu's to your VM.  At work I have a Linux host with w7 running in seamless mode (always on) it would be worth $100 to assign multiple cpu threads to the w7 VM while still leaving plenty for the host OS.

Also over the life of the machine this works out to what a few $$ a month?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on April 04, 2012, 09:22:02 AM
The network guy and I have really started using VMs a lot more to do modeling; 4 cores gets limiting really fast.

For a gaming machine? i5-2500k.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on April 04, 2012, 09:34:34 AM
So I'm doing a staggered upgrade for now on an aging machine. Going to bottleneck a new GPU with my old air cooled Q6600 figure it will still give a big performance boost over the GTX260 that its been running for the last 3+ years. I'm also looking at system RAM (because its practically free these days) and a SSD for steam and my OS.

Right now I'm looking mostly at GTX560ti's though not the 448 cores or 2gb versions which seem to be past the price hump.

I was also checking out 460's but what are the ATI cards I should bother looking at in this price range?

The this can't be too retarded choices would be between:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130610

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130604

but I suppose I should double check if any of ATI's stuff is beating those cards at that price point or lower if anyone has any suggestions?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on April 04, 2012, 01:13:12 PM
I am intrigued by the new Alienware X51 small form factor PC.  The reviews are filled with quality issues, but I expect those will get ironed out over time.  I like the idea of a small box and this is much cheaper than a Geekbox or many of the brand name boxes.  I just wonder how easy it is to upgrade RAM and vid.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on April 04, 2012, 02:10:23 PM
Not sure why anyone would get a 2600k instead of a 2500k unless money is no object.

Actually, for many people who just want to run certain programs they might actually be hurting their performance by using SMT.  If the software designers aren't paying much attention to how they are affecting the cache SMT can cause issues with thrashing that you don't get without it.

SMT on something that uses it well is great and on many things is neutral but it's not a panacea and even if money is no object it may not be the best solution.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Special J on April 04, 2012, 06:50:44 PM
Not sure why anyone would get a 2600k instead of a 2500k unless money is no object.

Well that's why I post this stuff.  In the end thanks to a promotion it was a $75 difference, so not a huge deal.  He's got his box and he's happy.

OTOH when I (hopefully) can scrape something together get me a new box I'll have to be a little more frugal, so thanks for the heads up.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 04, 2012, 06:51:34 PM
I am intrigued by the new Alienware X51 small form factor PC.  The reviews are filled with quality issues, but I expect those will get ironed out over time.  I like the idea of a small box and this is much cheaper than a Geekbox or many of the brand name boxes.  I just wonder how easy it is to upgrade RAM and vid.

There's a new Z77 mini-ITX motherboard coming from ASUS (http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/03/06/asus_shows_off_z77_motherboards/) that looks like a really spiffy option for building a SFF gaming rig when combined with any of a number of very solid mITX cases from Silverstone or Lian-Li (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=7&Description=&Type=&N=100007583&IsNodeId=1&IsPowerSearch=1&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&Manufactory=2031&Manufactory=1375&PropertyCodeValue=548%3A48187&PropertyCodeValue=548%3A26848).  Most of those cases have room for a 2-slot card and a 'real' PSU.  Since you're using 'real' parts, upgrades are as with any other desktop.  SFF builds can be somewhat 'interesting' in the Confucian sense, though - the tight space makes things like cooler selection and cable management a bit trickier, yet simultaneously more important.  Alternately, use a mATX board and case if you don't need the absolute smallest PC possible but still want something smaller than a traditional mid-tower.

...I suppose I should double check if any of ATI's stuff is beating those cards at that price point or lower if anyone has any suggestions?

The HD7850 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102986) is the most powerful AMD offering in the same general price range as the 560ti.  Comparison here (http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/547?vs=549).



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on April 05, 2012, 12:12:40 PM
Thanks for that Noisy, is anyone doing lifetime warranty these days besides eVGA? I used to buy from XFX as well but things I'm reading says they aren't what they used to be?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 05, 2012, 09:12:12 PM
Thanks for that Noisy, is anyone doing lifetime warranty these days besides eVGA? I used to buy from XFX as well but things I'm reading says they aren't what they used to be?

I wish I knew - to be honest, I'd be surprised if a PC lasted me more than a year or two any more - I get the upgrade/new build bug too often lately, and there's tons of people at work and elsewhere that are more than happy to buy my 'old' machines.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on April 05, 2012, 11:47:15 PM
It does seem like Moore's law isn't applying the last 10 years.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on April 06, 2012, 06:20:11 AM
I'm fine with that.  It's nice not feeling like I need to upgrade my computer every year.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hoax on April 06, 2012, 11:45:33 AM
Thanks for that Noisy, is anyone doing lifetime warranty these days besides eVGA? I used to buy from XFX as well but things I'm reading says they aren't what they used to be?

I wish I knew - to be honest, I'd be surprised if a PC lasted me more than a year or two any more - I get the upgrade/new build bug too often lately, and there's tons of people at work and elsewhere that are more than happy to buy my 'old' machines.

That's the thing though my old machines go to family pc's and so do my replaced individual components. Its pretty sweet to be able to RMA a gpu 4+ years down the road.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on April 09, 2012, 11:16:13 AM
It does seem like Moore's law isn't applying the last 10 years.

It just switched focus to phone processors.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Fabricated on April 17, 2012, 11:27:47 AM
Man, the GeForce 680 is flying off the shelves. It was sold out the instant it dropped on newegg, so I got on auto-notify. I walked to go get some lunch just now, and in that 10 minutes I got an email from newegg they were back in stock, then they ran out of stock again. Yeesh.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: shiznitz on April 18, 2012, 09:45:10 AM
What game is driving demand for it?  My old 8800 is still doing a decent job on 1 year old games.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: tgr on April 23, 2012, 04:12:36 AM
In my case it wasn't a specific game which drove it, but the fact the old 285 died, and I didn't discover it was just the 285 which died until I'd replaced the entire innard of the machine. So I decided to just say fuck it and go for the 680 instead of the 570 or 580 because "why not?".


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on April 24, 2012, 01:03:59 PM
In my case it wasn't a specific game which drove it, but the fact the old 285 died, and I didn't discover it was just the 285 which died until I'd replaced the entire innard of the machine. So I decided to just say fuck it and go for the 680 instead of the 570 or 580 because "why not?".

So, any impressions on the 680? My vid card, an ATI 5870, is starting to act up, so I think I'm in the market too.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on April 25, 2012, 02:11:14 AM
Any recommendations for a particular power supply to pair with a 680?  The recommendation on the EVGA 680 page is a minimum 550 watts with +12v rail of 38 Amps.  I never understood the 12v rail distinction. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 25, 2012, 10:41:12 AM
Any recommendations for a particular power supply to pair with a 680?  The recommendation on the EVGA 680 page is a minimum 550 watts with +12v rail of 38 Amps.  I never understood the 12v rail distinction.  

I like XFX, Silverstone, the NZXT HALE82/90 series units, Seasonic and Corsair's higher end units, all of which are (I think) rebranded Seasonic or SuperFlower PSUs.

Doing a quick Newegg search, the NZXT HALE82 650W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817116014), Corsair TX650W v2 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139020), XFX Core 650W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207014) and the PC Power and Cooling Silencer II 750W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703027) would all be good choices in the ~$100 range.  Some are modular, which makes cable management easier.  Most of the 650W units also have 750W/850W+ counterparts for a few bucks more.

If you're looking to save a few bucks, the Antec Neo ECO Series 620W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371031) is a decent choice - it's a Seasonic S12II under the housing.  I've used a bunch of these as replacements for shitty OEM PSUs and in budget builds for friends/family.  For the price, they're outstanding.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on April 25, 2012, 10:59:22 AM
I never understood the 12v rail distinction. 

I think you'd struggle to find a modern PSU without a 12V rail. It just means that one of the regulated voltages it can supply is 12V, and that's what the 680 requires.

I would also vote for getting a modular one if you can. Really makes a huge difference in getting a nice, neat layout inside the case.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 25, 2012, 11:16:36 AM
I never understood the 12v rail distinction.  

I think you'd struggle to find a modern PSU without a 12V rail. It just means that one of the regulated voltages it can supply is 12V, and that's what the 680 requires.

I would also vote for getting a modular one if you can. Really makes a huge difference in getting a nice, neat layout inside the case.

Actually, it's pretty much impossible, since your PC will require +/-12V, 5V and 3.3V outputs to function at all, and your video card will pull a certain amount from the 12V 'rail'.  If you look on Newegg's 'Details' tab on their product pages, you'll see the output on each rail, usually in this format:

+3.3V@30A, +5V@30A, +12V@54A, -12V@0.8A, +5VSB@3A

Good quality PSUs generally use a DC-DC design - they first convert power to 12V DC then step that down in later stages for the lesser rails.  As a result, you can usually spot them pretty easily - (+12v rail amps * 12) should be very close to the total output of the PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: apocrypha on April 25, 2012, 11:54:28 AM
+3.3V@30A, +5V@30A, +12V@54A, -12V@0.8A, +5VSB@3A

I like the way that the forum thinks one of those is an email address  :awesome_for_real:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on April 25, 2012, 01:25:50 PM
Shocking!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on April 27, 2012, 09:05:29 PM
Went with the XFX 650W since it was a bit cheaper after rebate.  Had no idea it was rebranded Seasonic.  MisterNoisy's math got me curious so I looked at my current PSU and see its 12v load is 408W which is pretty far off from its 500W total.  In contrast XFX's 12v load is 636W.

This model didn't have a modular option in stock, figured it wouldn't be a big deal.

(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2938963/DSCF2524.jpg)

 :ye_gods:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on April 27, 2012, 11:56:40 PM
Jesus wept who needs that many SATA power connectors (is it 12)?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on April 28, 2012, 01:52:01 PM

(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2938963/DSCF2524.jpg)

 :ye_gods:
:cthulu:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on April 30, 2012, 01:55:07 PM
If you're looking to save a few bucks, the Antec Neo ECO Series 620W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371031) is a decent choice - it's a Seasonic S12II under the housing.  I've used a bunch of these as replacements for shitty OEM PSUs and in budget builds for friends/family.  For the price, they're outstanding.

Dunno if anyone's looking for a PSU right now, but this PSU is $35 (after MiR) today at Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371031).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Fabricated on May 01, 2012, 06:46:36 AM
Verdict on Ivy Bridge so far is basically that it's the "tick" of the typical Intel "tick, tock" shedule in processor power. It's a small boost in speed/performance and some new features, rather than the huge leap from Core 2's to iSeries. I guess it runs a tad hotter too, which is a bummer.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sheepherder on May 02, 2012, 03:44:32 AM
I never understood the 12v rail distinction.

Because Wattage is a measure of energy, not electricity.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 10, 2012, 01:11:47 PM
Looks like the GTX670 benches are up, and it certainly makes things interesting, even at $400:

HardOCP (http://hardocp.com/article/2012/05/10/nvidia_geforce_gtx_670_video_card_review)
Tom's (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-gtx-670-review,3200.html)
Anand (http://www.anandtech.com/show/5818/nvidia-geforce-gtx-670-review-feat-evga)

Ordered the three-fan Gigabyte to replace my 570, which a coworker will be buying off of me.  Good times.  :)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 10, 2012, 02:38:59 PM
Not going with the 690? :eat:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 10, 2012, 05:13:53 PM
Good god, no.  $1K is a bit much, methinks.  I was considering a 680, but the 670 comes incredibly close to its performance for 20% less cash.  Since I found a buyer for my 570 beforehand, it's actually a reasonably-priced upgrade now.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 14, 2012, 07:03:33 AM
I struggle to find a reason to be even tempted to upgrade my GTX570.  I mean, it plays everything I have at max settings and max quality at high framerate (or close enough that it is negligible).  We seem to have reached some weird state where not only is tech not advancing as fast as it once did, but at the same time the software isn't requiring it to (and the two things are probably quite related).  I don't think this is a good thing.

There is an interesting discussion in this somewhere.  Are we running out of ways to advance the tech (beyond the fake bullshit of adding extra cores to everything)?  Has the console plague finally started holding advancement back in earnest?  Are we simply satisfied as consumers at the point we've reached (graphically speaking) and simply aren't asking for more?  Or have we simply seen what Uncanny Valley looks like and are afraid to cross it?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on May 14, 2012, 07:12:29 AM
Probably more that development technique/focus has evolved enough so that playing games at lower settings isn't as painful as it used to be.  Also, blame Blizzard for demonstrating that selling boxes to lower end hardware makes just as much (or more) money as selling boxes to early adopters.

That said, we're kind of at a lull in new super hot graphics engine development and once the next gen engines start becoming available I'm sure we will see resource hogging back in full swing again.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 14, 2012, 07:24:52 AM
There is something to be said about the Blizzard effect, but I wonder if all the crummy social games are a better analogy.  Facebook, iphones, all that stuff.

That lull you are talking about, however...I'd argue we've been in it for YEARS.  A game like Crysis would still be considered a pretty spiffy game by current measures.  And I recall my 8800GT doing a fairly decent (not great) job of running it....5 years ago or so.  My 570 is something like five or six generations beyond that 8800GT, but it isn't like it is exponentially better like we would normally expect.  A five generation difference back in The Day was a massive chasm.  What card came 5 gens prior to the 8800GT and how would it measure up?  It wouldn't.

So, not sure it is a lull.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 14, 2012, 08:41:21 AM
I'd go with 'has to run on 360/PS3'.

That said, my gtx 460 sli is pretty decent, though it does get a bit toasty with rift or TOR. Played a bit of Metro 2033 over the weekend and it definitely slows a bit with all the ambient occlusion and volumetric effects at 1080p. For sake of TDP and cooling, I'd prefer to go back to a single card solution at some point.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Murgos on May 14, 2012, 09:02:30 AM
So, not sure it is a lull.

See, Cry engine 3 any minute now and the latest Id tech is just now starting to be used for outside development and also there is a new Unreal Engine due out at the end of this year.  So yeah, a lull.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 14, 2012, 02:46:42 PM
I'd go with 'has to run on 360/PS3'.

That said, my gtx 460 sli is pretty decent, though it does get a bit toasty with rift or TOR. Played a bit of Metro 2033 over the weekend and it definitely slows a bit with all the ambient occlusion and volumetric effects at 1080p. For sake of TDP and cooling, I'd prefer to go back to a single card solution at some point.

You could probably cut the heat down by transplanting everything into a newer case.  Antec even has the P280 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129179) out now if you like the aesthetics of the old P180 series cases, but want more modern features (layout, cable management, USB 3.0, etc).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 14, 2012, 02:54:32 PM
It's fine with everything but those two mmo. I put a couple 120mm fans on the side, but I need to dremel out the case a bit to fit them in properly. With those on, keeps it at 60C even with the mmos.

Also, lack of funds for a new case. I won't be doing anything computer upgrade-related for years.

Also, looking at that case, hard to see how that's much of an improvement since it deletes the intake fans and opens the lower chamber. I'll stick with ye olde 180, it's a great layout. The main issue with SLI is that I've got two of the biggest coolers known to man on them, and the acelero is trying to vent directly onto the twin frozr's backside. Introduced the two side intakes and it's all good. Also put in the 4-in-3 bay you mentioned, which just completely vents the top portion of the upper chamber without breaking the airflow through the cpu (the 280's design is odd imo), and adds a bit of extra cooling over the RAM. Just need to put in a better fan because ZOMGTEHLEDS.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 14, 2012, 03:28:35 PM
Also, looking at that case, hard to see how that's much of an improvement since it deletes the intake fans and opens the lower chamber. I'll stick with ye olde 180, it's a great layout. The main issue with SLI is that I've got two of the biggest coolers known to man on them, and the acelero is trying to vent directly onto the twin frozr's backside. Introduced the two side intakes and it's all good.

Actually, the front intake fan mounts are still there, but you have to supply the fans.  As far as the lower chamber goes, now you mount the PSU intake-side down on the bottom, effectively creating a closed system for the PSU.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 14, 2012, 07:47:39 PM
I hate to DP, but I figured I'd post my best bud's new PC build.  Under $1k total got him this (admittedly the video card was purchased at a discount, since it was used):

Core i5 2500K under a CoolerMaster Hyper 212+
ASUS P8Z77-V-LK
8GB Corsair Vengeance
ASUS ENGTX570 DirectCu2
Crucial M4 128GB
(Data/storage drive TBA)
Corsair TX750-V2
NZXT Tempest 410
Xigmatek XLF 120/140mm fans

For his first pass at cable management, I'd say he did pretty well.

EDIT:  Spoilered titanic image


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 14, 2012, 10:09:03 PM
My computer room is really, really dusty.  I've done about all I can with daily sweeping and air filters.  Are there any cases that are better at keeping dust out of a case?  Maybe with removable filters or something.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: ffc on May 14, 2012, 10:15:50 PM
Dust filter on the front of my antec sonata and then duct taping every hole that doesn't have an active exhaust has worked out pretty good for me.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 14, 2012, 10:51:17 PM
My computer room is really, really dusty.  I've done about all I can with daily sweeping and air filters.  Are there any cases that are better at keeping dust out of a case?  Maybe with removable filters or something.

The NZXT H2 and Lian Li K63 are both fairly inexpensive and have filters on all of the intakes.  Without knowing your other requirements, it'd be hard to say, though.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 15, 2012, 12:03:37 AM
I'm going to do a build this summer, but I'm so sick of the dust in my Antec 900 and really want a less dusty case.  I was originally going to splurge on the Corsair 600t, but it looks like it might be a dusthog too.

I don't overclock, I'm not liquid cooling.  I just tend to build solid systems that last for 3-5 years, then I do a full new build.  My latest system is *gasp* nearly 5 years old and is just now giving me issues with being unable to run newer games smoothly.

Are Hazaro's builds on Neogaf still pretty competent?  I know I'm going with 16gig memory and likely a gtx670 from what I've read here.  That $3-400 pricepoint on the graphics card seems pretty decent.  I still have yet to research CPUs, and I'm on the fence about trying a SSD yet. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on May 15, 2012, 02:25:45 AM
I love my ssd. I call it Lenny.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on May 15, 2012, 08:31:05 AM
When you are considering $300-$400 graphics cards and the top tier ssd's are selling under $1/gb the only thing you should be on the fence about is which ssd to get.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 15, 2012, 09:03:25 AM
I love my ssd. I call it Lenny.
Careful with that.

Hawkbit: clean your room. If you've got clean filters on the pc and still need to dust it daily, that's insane. It's not that bad in the circulation office here which handles a thousand or more books a day and is legendary for dust creation. Are you sanding drywall daily or something? Filter your intakes and maybe seal any gaps, dust should not be able to get into the case in any appreciable amount. When I cracked mine open last year, it was almost clean inside (I blame the seams around unused 5-1/4 drive bays).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 15, 2012, 09:37:24 AM
Are Hazaro's builds on Neogaf still pretty competent?  I know I'm going with 16gig memory and likely a gtx670 from what I've read here.  That $3-400 pricepoint on the graphics card seems pretty decent.  I still have yet to research CPUs, and I'm on the fence about trying a SSD yet. 

Yea - my taste in cases differs, but otherwise, I like the stuff he's got posted there.  I'd have a hard time recommending anything other than a 2500K unless price is no object, and once you're above $1K, an SSD is definitely worth picking up.

Also, interesting Ivy Bridge tidbit (http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/proof_%E2%80%93_switch_fluxless_solder_thermal_paste_cause_poor_ivy_bridge_overclocking_temperatures#slide-0).

Quote
The thermal interface material change made by Intel when it went from Sandy Bridge to Ivy Bridge is indeed the cause of the excessive temperatures we’ve observed while overclocking.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 15, 2012, 09:45:25 AM
This new place is just crazy dusty.  It uses radiant heat, as opposed to every other place we've lived that uses forced air.  The downside to radiant heat is that there is literally no air movement through the house, hence the portable air filters.  I'm using a filter that is rated to turn air over roughly 23 times an hour or something, and pretty much looks like R2D2.  The biggest problem is that our cats hang out down there because that area is gated off from the dog.  So no air movement and cats pretty much destroys a room.  

Anyways, thanks for the tips, all.  As I get closer to putting a build together I'll post it up.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 15, 2012, 11:25:07 AM
Forced air puts more particulates into the air. I didn't realize you were using some portable air filter, you'd be better off just doing more vacuuming with a hepa vac, because an air filter isn't going to remove the source of the particulates.

When we're talking about filters, we mean filters on the intake fans of the computer (or the passive grills if you don't use intakes). If you don't do that, in your situation you're creating a vacuum for any particulates you or the furry ones stir up moving about the room. With the active air filter, it's adding to suspension of the particulates in the room, too.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 15, 2012, 07:52:23 PM
Got my GTX670 in, and also installed a new SSD since the old one was giving me fits.  The 670 is something of a beast - P9209 3DMarks (http://3dmark.com/3dm11/3436385)!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 15, 2012, 10:51:27 PM
Forced air puts more particulates into the air. I didn't realize you were using some portable air filter, you'd be better off just doing more vacuuming with a hepa vac, because an air filter isn't going to remove the source of the particulates.

When we're talking about filters, we mean filters on the intake fans of the computer (or the passive grills if you don't use intakes). If you don't do that, in your situation you're creating a vacuum for any particulates you or the furry ones stir up moving about the room. With the active air filter, it's adding to suspension of the particulates in the room, too.

Common sense tells me you're right.  However, actually experience leads to a different conclusion.  If I don't run the portable air filter my front grills are dusty in 24 hours; with air filters running I get a week tops before needing to clean.  I haven't mentioned it, but I hate this fucking house.

Regarding your comment on passive grills, are there any aftermarket or homemade jobs that might help cut down on the dust on the intakes?  Again, it's an Antec900, so it has a fairly large amount of open space to cover.  If it wouldn't kill the airflow and create a fire hazard I'd just wrap the whole thing in pantyhose to make it look like a bank robber.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 15, 2012, 11:08:46 PM
Got my GTX670 in, and also installed a new SSD since the old one was giving me fits.  The 670 is something of a beast - P9209 3DMarks (http://3dmark.com/3dm11/3436385)!
You've got double the RAM (in more slots, too), a more aggressive overclock and the Z68; but yeah, that's a heck of a card over my dual 460 system's P6937 3DMarks (http://3dmark.com/3dm11/3437083).

And Hawkbit, my gpus hit 71 and 66 running the full 3dmark11 demo+test using a couple swiffers as intake filters. They probably cut some airflow, but I'm ok with it and they pick up a lot of dust. Just make sure to test your system after any change like that, stress it and keep an eye on temps for a while.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 15, 2012, 11:47:58 PM
Swiffers, perfect idea.  Thanks. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: 01101010 on May 16, 2012, 05:30:01 AM
Swiffers, perfect idea.  Thanks. 

You can also use dryer sheets (used... I suggest twice-used sheets). They provide enough airflow and are easy to switch to new ones without a ton of cost.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 16, 2012, 06:19:29 AM
I just recently installed a new motorized projector screen for my man cave (had a cheap-ish home built frame that I have been using the past few years, which served me well).  300 diagonal inches of pure joy when matched to my 1080p projector.  I may have to go buy D3 and play it on there tonight.

I mention it here because I cannot emphasize enough how much you are missing out if you don't have such a setup.  It really isn't that expensive, and to be frank...it beats the ever loving shit out of the average movie theater setup.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 16, 2012, 08:39:00 AM
I just recently installed a new motorized projector screen for my man cave (had a cheap-ish home built frame that I have been using the past few years, which served me well).  300 diagonal inches of pure joy when matched to my 1080p projector.  I may have to go buy D3 and play it on there tonight.

I mention it here because I cannot emphasize enough how much you are missing out if you don't have such a setup.  It really isn't that expensive, and to be frank...it beats the ever loving shit out of the average movie theater setup.
Be careful with that shit.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 16, 2012, 08:39:42 AM
Also, screw you guys. Now I'm jonesing for an SSD and I'm broke  :sad_panda:


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Stewie on May 18, 2012, 02:11:06 PM
I just went out at lunch and picked my 1st ssd, this one: http://ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=62603&vpn=OCZSSD2-1VTXPL120G&manufacture=OCZ%20Technology&promoid=1114

 Cant wait to get home and do a fresh install of win7


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 21, 2012, 06:13:36 AM
I just recently installed a new motorized projector screen for my man cave (had a cheap-ish home built frame that I have been using the past few years, which served me well).  300 diagonal inches of pure joy when matched to my 1080p projector.  I may have to go buy D3 and play it on there tonight.

I mention it here because I cannot emphasize enough how much you are missing out if you don't have such a setup.  It really isn't that expensive, and to be frank...it beats the ever loving shit out of the average movie theater setup.
Be careful with that shit.

Uh oh.  I'm not becoming That Guy, am I?    :ye_gods:

Still, there is a ton of bang-for-buck here if you have room for it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 21, 2012, 09:33:53 AM
Uh oh.  I'm not becoming That Guy, am I?    :ye_gods:

Still, there is a ton of bang-for-buck here if you have room for it.
Yeah, I know. Just like in getting a nice DLP monitor in 2003   :why_so_serious:

My house is old, with small rooms (which I like), so the monitor still works better for me. I wouldn't get much more than its 65" with a projector, and I'd lose a ton of versatility (putting it in the corner, for instance). I move my furniture around at least three times a year.

Still, after big screen gaming for almost ten years, it's pretty funny to think of gaming hunched over a desk on a little monitor.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 21, 2012, 12:39:48 PM
Uh oh.  I'm not becoming That Guy, am I?    :ye_gods:

Still, there is a ton of bang-for-buck here if you have room for it.
Yeah, I know. Just like in getting a nice DLP monitor in 2003   :why_so_serious:

My house is old, with small rooms (which I like), so the monitor still works better for me. I wouldn't get much more than its 65" with a projector, and I'd lose a ton of versatility (putting it in the corner, for instance). I move my furniture around at least three times a year.

Still, after big screen gaming for almost ten years, it's pretty funny to think of gaming hunched over a desk on a little monitor.

Although I've asserted that, were I single, I would only have a projector, the reality is that it's probably something you do in addition to what you already have.  You certainly need a good amount of room for it (though much less than you probably think...these days they can produce big viewing areas at quite a short throw distance).  You probably also need a partner that is more or less cool with it, even when it is relegated to the man cave.  I still will sit in front of my monitor when I want things to be...prettier, because the projector doesn't duplicate color quite as well for games (for movies it's quite good, however).  I prefer Skyrim on the monitor, for example.  For sheer thrills, though, it goes up on the big screen.

I just realized I got the size wrong, too.  Not 300 inches, no idea where that number came from.  I fucking wish.  150 inches max, but in 16x9 mode it is a little less than that.




Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 21, 2012, 01:31:03 PM
Big screen gaming pre-dates (har) the fiancee, so she knew what she was signing up for. I try not to play explodey stuff too much, she hates the Bounty Hunter in TOR, the combat parts anyway. She's also quick to point out how silly it is to have a 65" monitor powered by 2 gtx 460s (though she doesn't know the tech part of that) to play minecraft.

Can't you calibrate your pc with the projector for better color reproduction?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 22, 2012, 12:30:54 AM
Can't you calibrate your pc with the projector for better color reproduction?

It isn't so much that it is BAD...I mean, if you didn't know any better, you'd look at it and be impressed.  And it certainly looks the business for most things.  It is just that certain games like Skyrim, which (IMO) look amazing in general, just look better on a really good monitor.  The colors contrast a little better or something, and DPI will also come into play somewhat when you are projecting something that large.  I am a bit of a graphics whore, so I usually want those kinds of games on the best possible medium.  In short, it is perfect for everything other than extremely gorgeous PC games (perfect for the more ordinary PC games, 360, PS3, Blu Ray movies, etc.). 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 22, 2012, 04:04:37 PM
Considering the 128g SSDs, is there any distinct reason to buy a second storage HDD if I never have more than 90gigs used on my system?  I've noticed with platter drives in the past that they can bog down a bit when there's more than 50% data on them, but with SSDs being solid state I'd have to imagine that is no longer an issue. 

Also, should I consider the 2600k at all for photoshop work, or just stick with the 2500k?  I do some of it for classwork, but for what I'm using it for, my q6600 has been passable.  It's not like it's a career at this point.

Starting a build on paper now, I'll be posting it in the next few weeks.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 22, 2012, 07:43:50 PM
Considering the 128g SSDs, is there any distinct reason to buy a second storage HDD if I never have more than 90gigs used on my system?  I've noticed with platter drives in the past that they can bog down a bit when there's more than 50% data on them, but with SSDs being solid state I'd have to imagine that is no longer an issue. 

Also, should I consider the 2600k at all for photoshop work, or just stick with the 2500k?  I do some of it for classwork, but for what I'm using it for, my q6600 has been passable.  It's not like it's a career at this point.

Starting a build on paper now, I'll be posting it in the next few weeks.

I'd honestly have a hard time recommending anything besides the 2500K unless you're not on a budget. 

As for the secondary drive, I've found that SSDs actually slow down significantly as they fill up, and demand always expands to meet/exceed capacity (my Steam directory is over 400GB alone!).  An added bonus of having a second drive with all your games/media is that if you need to reinstall Windows (as I did recently when replacing my original 60GB SSD), it's hilariously easy to just pop in the disc, install Windows and have it find everything right where you left it.

Steam in particular benefits from this - after installing Windows, just rename/move the \Steam\steamapps\common folder, install Steam to your mechanical HDD and then put the moved folder's contents into the new \Steam\steamapps\common directory.  Tell Steam to update and you've just reinstalled three dozen games in 10 minutes.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 22, 2012, 09:15:33 PM
Thanks.  I'll be back in a few weeks to pester you again, I wager.  ;)


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on May 23, 2012, 10:25:58 AM
Also, some SSD's allow you to under provision the drive and the 'unused' portion is used by the drive controller to extend life & improve performance.  Intel drives were the 1st to do this but I am pretty sure they handle the provisioning at the factory and the advertised HD size is what is available to you.  My Samsung drive had a utility that allowed me to specify this when formatting (I think I allocated 20%).  

Probably one of the main differences between a top tier drive vs. the rest is how they perform over the life of the drive/as they get full.  With prices as they are now, there really isn't a reason to get anything but a top tier drive.  My limited knowledge personal preference on the pecking order for SSD's is Intel 520 series, Samsung 830, Crucial M4, then I suppose the chronos drives.  I specify limited knowledge because I haven't done any homework in 3 months and this market changes fast.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 25, 2012, 12:39:24 PM
My first pass at this build is here, let me know what you think.  I'll likely buy in the next four weeks.  Total right now is around $1600, but I haven't done any real shopping around yet.  It's a bit more than I was hoping to spend, but I will usually get a solid 3-4 years out of my builds so far.  Hard to complain at those timeframes.

The only thing set in stone is the Antec P280, which I've already bought because I had a ton of promo credit with Amazon.

Quote
i5 2500K 4C/4T @3.3
ASUS P8Z77-V LK LGA 1155
CORSAIR Vengeance LP 16GB (4 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 
MSI N670GTX-PM2D2GD5/OC GeForce GTX 670 2GB 
SAMSUNG 830 Series MZ-7PC128D/AM 2.5" 128GB 
SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM 
oos - ? - ASUS XONAR_DG 5.1 Channels PCI Interface
CORSAIR Enthusiast Series TX750 V2 750W
Antec P280 ATX

Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit - OEM
Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound

CAT5 20' - networking old PC
cheap LCD, mouse, kyb, speakers - for daughter's build

Things I'm on the fence about: 

1.  COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO - I've always used stock fans and I've never had a problem.  I'm not overclocking.  Do I really need this?
2.  RAM - I can't remember what timing to buy, how do I choose the right kind?
3.  GPU - I like the 670, but what are the current 'solid' brands?  These cards are oos quite a bit.
4.  The Xonar is oos, wondering if I really need a dedicated sound card anymore. 

I'm not cannibalizing my old rig at all because I'm giving it to my daughter.  Any recommendations on a cheap 20" LCD for her? 

Any advice/ripping is appreciated.  Thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Furiously on May 25, 2012, 01:11:03 PM
I'd look at the ax version of that power supply. Cable management is is a lot easier.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 25, 2012, 01:22:21 PM
My first pass at this build is here, let me know what you think.  I'll likely buy in the next four weeks.  Total right now is around $1600, but I haven't done any real shopping around yet.  It's a bit more than I was hoping to spend, but I will usually get a solid 3-4 years out of my builds so far.  Hard to complain at those timeframes.

The only thing set in stone is the Antec P280, which I've already bought because I had a ton of promo credit with Amazon.

(Build snipped)

Things I'm on the fence about:  

1.  COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO - I've always used stock fans and I've never had a problem.  I'm not overclocking.  Do I really need this?
2.  RAM - I can't remember what timing to buy, how do I choose the right kind?
3.  GPU - I like the 670, but what are the current 'solid' brands?  These cards are oos quite a bit.
4.  The Xonar is oos, wondering if I really need a dedicated sound card anymore.  

I'm not cannibalizing my old rig at all because I'm giving it to my daughter.  Any recommendations on a cheap 20" LCD for her?  

Any advice/ripping is appreciated.  Thanks!

Looks good to me, though I also prefer modular PSUs - The NZXT Hale82 750W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817116015) would be a very comparable option with the bonus of modular cabling (also, if you buy before the 28th, you can get 15% off at Newegg with code 'NZXTMAY12').  As for your fence items:

1.  The CPU heatsink isn't absolutely necessary, but will go a long way towards much quieter/cooler operation.  For at or under $30, I wouldn't build a PC without some flavor of aftermarket cooler, and why buy a 2500K if you're not even going to play around just a little with overclocking?  :)

2.  Almost any matched 1333MHz or faster 1.5v or less RAM will run about the same unless you start going for crazy benchmarks.  I like G.Skill and Corsair, particularly their low-profile kits.

3.  Video cards are like everything else - people have brand preferences, etc. despite them being largely the same.  I mostly look for big non-reference coolers with multiple fans, while a lot of people swear by EVGA's policies/warranty, despite them only offering reference designs.  670 availability is pretty tight (though not as bad as the 680s), but if it were for my own machine, I'd hold out for the Gigabyte 670OC (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125423) or either of the two ASUS DirectCuII (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=100006662&isNodeId=1&Description=ASUS+670&x=28&y=11) models.

4.  I haven't used a sound card in over ten years and don't miss them at all, but I'm not an audiophile.  One of my machines is connected to my A/V receiver solely using DVI/HDMI from the video card.  If I had to choose between a sound card and a CPU cooler, the cooler would win every time.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on May 25, 2012, 01:25:01 PM
I'd look at the ax version of that power supply. Cable management is is a lot easier.

This. I just got one, the Ax750, and its positively dreamy. Silent and far less muss with the cables. Also gold rated.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: HaemishM on May 25, 2012, 01:38:46 PM
I'd honestly have a hard time recommending anything besides the 2500K unless you're not on a budget. 

Just a addition to this. I got an off the shelf Asus computer at Christmas with an i5 2500K in it and the fucking thing hasn't had any trouble with anything I've thrown at it. With an Nvidia 460 GTX in there, the only trouble I have is heat because the case puts the video card/power supply/CPU fan blowing into each other, so on a game like Napoleon Total War, I get some hot CPU temps. But performance-wise, the goddamn thing is shit hot.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Trippy on May 25, 2012, 01:49:45 PM
3.  Video cards are like everything else - people have brand preferences, etc. despite them being largely the same.  I mostly look for big non-reference coolers with multiple fans, while a lot of people swear by EVGA's policies/warranty, despite them only offering reference designs.  670 availability is pretty tight (though not as bad as the 680s), but if it were for my own machine, I'd hold out for the Gigabyte 670OC (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125423) or either of the two ASUS DirectCuII (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=100006662&isNodeId=1&Description=ASUS+670&x=28&y=11) models.
I managed to get the Gigabyte from Amazon at regular retail ($399) before the prices got jacked up like they are on the 680. Working well so far. Card didn't come with any fancy utilities like some of the other cards do these days (overclocking tool, benchmarking apps, etc. -- just the NVIDIA drivers for the 6xx series -- though some people might consider that a plus.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Lantyssa on May 25, 2012, 01:52:09 PM
Get a better Windows version than Home.  You're already spending that much, no point in skimping.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 25, 2012, 01:55:46 PM
3.  Video cards are like everything else - people have brand preferences, etc. despite them being largely the same.  I mostly look for big non-reference coolers with multiple fans, while a lot of people swear by EVGA's policies/warranty, despite them only offering reference designs.  670 availability is pretty tight (though not as bad as the 680s), but if it were for my own machine, I'd hold out for the Gigabyte 670OC (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125423) or either of the two ASUS DirectCuII (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&N=100006662&isNodeId=1&Description=ASUS+670&x=28&y=11) models.
I managed to get the Gigabyte from Amazon at regular retail ($399) before the prices got jacked up like they are on the 680. Working well so far. Card didn't come with any fancy utilities like some of the other cards do these days (overclocking tool, benchmarking apps, etc. -- just the NVIDIA drivers for the 6xx series -- though some people might consider that a plus.

Same here, though I got mine from the 'egg, and I couldn't be happier with it:


I'm pretty sure that EVGA Precision and MSI Afterburner work with it though.

Get a better Windows version than Home.  You're already spending that much, no point in skimping.

Why?  Unless there's a specific function in Pro that you need (http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/386085/windows_7_home_premium_vs_windows_7_professional/?pp=2), I can't see any reason to pony up for anything but Home Premium.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 25, 2012, 02:21:56 PM
Thanks for the info, all.  I'll tweak this over the next week or two then repost with the near-final build.  Much appreciated.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 25, 2012, 02:43:40 PM
I mostly look for big non-reference coolers with multiple fans, while a lot of people swear by EVGA's policies/warranty, despite them only offering reference designs.
I've been going with evga for the last few builds, mostly because of the warranty - it applies even if you add aftermarket coolers, as long as you save the factory cooler. And I tried going with the non-reference factory cooler for this last upgrade cycle (the MSI Twin Frozr GTX460 as #2 in SLI) and honestly: the aftermarket cooler is worth it. I have an Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme Plus II (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186048), which despite being a mouthful and not exactly cheap, performs amazingly, astonishingly well and is super quiet. It's especially good on an evga board because they are usually sketchy when it comes to attaching the cooling, especially on the VRAM. The Frozr will be audible and ramping to 60% fans to keep up with the whisper 30% fans of the aftermarket card.

Home Premium is mostly good, but I recently wanted to run some remote stuff that's blocked in that version. I guess I could get tricky with it, but I get enough of that stuff at work to bother at home.

Another recommend for the 2500k, mine's running at 4.1 or 4.2 GHz without breaking a sweat on that Hyper212. Just an awesome cpu.

I use a discreet audio solution (an X-Fi Fatal1ty), but I just like to offload the processing and get a 5.1 optical out to my receiver...and it's a holdover from really bad onboard audio. Things might be better now (I'd like a return of the soundstorm chipset, nvidia).


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 26, 2012, 01:02:29 PM

Another recommend for the 2500k, mine's running at 4.1 or 4.2 GHz without breaking a sweat on that Hyper212. Just an awesome cpu.

I use a discreet audio solution (an X-Fi Fatal1ty), but I just like to offload the processing and get a 5.1 optical out to my receiver...and it's a holdover from really bad onboard audio. Things might be better now (I'd like a return of the soundstorm chipset, nvidia).

This and this.  Unless you have money to blow, there is no reason to not get the 2500k.  Most everything I have heard says that the i7 chips don't really offer a whole lot more real world performance for most things.  I'd only over go beyond the 2500k if I had more money than I knew what to do with.

Same on the audio card for me...I just got it to free up some processing.  Or that is what I told myself.  I also try to convince myself that it sounds better, but it's honestly hard to tell (and that is even when hooked up to a full blown monster of a 7.1 system).  Onboard audio these days does a pretty good job.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 30, 2012, 07:03:55 PM
My P280 came today, I had to buy that a bit early because of some Amazon credit I had.

It has three 120mm fans (2top out, 1 rear out) with 4 front optional bays for fans.  What do you recommend for fan number and position in this case?  Once built, it will have a CM 212 EVO on the CPU, GPU fans and a PSU fan in place besides the 3base fans.  I will not be overclocking and this system will be used in my super dusty room, unfortunately.  Should I look at doing a positive pressure setup?

I'll likely be posting my revised build in the next few days, getting ready for a purchase soon.  Thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 30, 2012, 07:57:06 PM
My P280 came today, I had to buy that a bit early because of some Amazon credit I had.

It has three 120mm fans (2top out, 1 rear out) with 4 front optional bays for fans.  What do you recommend for fan number and position in this case?  Once built, it will have a CM 212 EVO on the CPU, GPU fans and a PSU fan in place besides the 3base fans.  I will not be overclocking and this system will be used in my super dusty room, unfortunately.  Should I look at doing a positive pressure setup?

I'll likely be posting my revised build in the next few days, getting ready for a purchase soon.  Thanks!

If it were me, I'd load every single one of those fan mounts up, and start looking for ways to add more, but I'm a bit weird in that regard (and very good at tuning out fan noise).  That said, I'd start with two intake fans in front behind the HDD racks (they'll be quieter in that position than just behind the door/filter), two top exhaust and 1 rear exhaust, ideally with a decent fan controller so you can dial down the fans (particularly the exhaust ones) while you're not gaming.

You may be able to improve airflow slightly later on by adding an additional pair of fans in front of the HDD racks just behind the filter as well, but I'd wager that won't actually be necessary unless you get some really hot-running parts.  If in doubt, use HWMonitor (http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor.html) while you're gaming/stress testing to make sure everything's running cool.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 30, 2012, 10:37:10 PM
Thanks, will do! 

Here's the rundown.  Any last minute changes you would make? 

1. I know you mentioned waiting for the Gigabyte 670OC, but is there an estimate that you're hearing on those being available?  If it's not too big a deal I'd like to just get the order in.
2. Is my RAM decent enough?  Went 16gig, low profile.
3. Upped the PSU to the AX750.
4. Upped to Win7 Pro, just because I'm used to it.
5. Missing anything?  Something doesn't quite seem right about the list, but I can't figure it out.

Thanks again - I think the only thing I'm really unsure about is making sure I have the correct RAM - it used to be such a pain in the ass to make sure the right kind was in there, now I guess it's less of a deal?  Any advice on the whole build would be stellar.  It's coming in around $1700 right now, before shopping around.


CPU   i5 2500K 4C/4T @3.3
MB   ASUS P8Z77-V LK LGA 1155
RAM   CORSAIR Vengeance LP 16GB (4 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233239
GPU   MSI N670GTX-PM2D2GD5/OC GeForce GTX 670 2GB 
PSU   CORSAIR Professional Series Gold AX750
DVD   SONY Black 18X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM

SSD   SAMSUNG 830 Series MZ-7PC128D/AM 2.5" 128GB 
HDD   SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM 

CPU Fan   COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO
Case   Antec P280 ATX - *purchased*
Case Fan   Antec 761345-75026-4 120mm Red LED Case Fan - front intake
Case Fan   Antec 761345-75026-4 120mm Red LED Case Fan - front intake

O/S   Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 64-bit - OEM
Therm   Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 31, 2012, 12:51:23 AM
Here's the rundown.  Any last minute changes you would make? 

1. I know you mentioned waiting for the Gigabyte 670OC, but is there an estimate that you're hearing on those being available?  If it's not too big a deal I'd like to just get the order in.
2. Is my RAM decent enough?  Went 16gig, low profile.
3. Upped the PSU to the AX750.
4. Upped to Win7 Pro, just because I'm used to it.
5. Missing anything?  Something doesn't quite seem right about the list, but I can't figure it out.

Looks like a complete build to me - possibly add a fan controller (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811992007) (I assume you're keen on minimizing fan noise based on your choice of cases) and that's about it.  As for the card, I'm pretty sure any 670 will be fine - if you're going with a reference design, get an EVGA for the warranty and other benefits.  The RAM is good - basically any DDR3 kit that's 1.5v or less will work.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on May 31, 2012, 02:14:31 AM
That's really helpful, thanks so much for looking it over.  I'll likely start ordering in the next week.  I'll let you know how it goes.  Thanks!


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Cyrrex on May 31, 2012, 03:21:11 AM
Just a thought:  Do you have an existing card that is good enough to hold you over for a while?  Because then you could hold out for an OC card.  It won't take too long until they are easy to get and basically the same price as the reference cards.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Sky on May 31, 2012, 08:51:27 AM
Put the Accelero on it! It's not cheap, but it's an investment you can put on new gpus for some time to come. The loudest and hottest thing in any gaming pc is always the video card. This remedies that issue short of putting in water cooling. If I had the dollars, I'd rip off the Twin Frozr (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127519) (which is a really good factory cooler!) and put on a second Accelero.

Ok, I'm done cheerleading.

But really, one of the coolest (har) things I've installed in twenty years of building computers.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on May 31, 2012, 09:11:07 AM
That's really helpful, thanks so much for looking it over.  I'll likely start ordering in the next week.  I'll let you know how it goes.  Thanks!

Newegg is currently offering $15 off your motherboard with coupon code 'EMCNEGJ37'.  I think the promo code is good through the weekend, so just a heads up.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on June 08, 2012, 12:15:01 PM
So it appears that the GIGABYTE GV-N670OC-2GD GeForce GTX 670 2GB are back in stock.  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125423

The listing looks slightly different, though.  Still a great card to pick up?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on June 08, 2012, 01:29:23 PM
So it appears that the GIGABYTE GV-N670OC-2GD GeForce GTX 670 2GB are back in stock.  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125423

The listing looks slightly different, though.  Still a great card to pick up?

Yes -- if you wanted one, I hope you picked it up already, as they're out of stock again.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Hawkbit on June 08, 2012, 02:22:35 PM
Thx.  Missed it, but that's okay.  If it's that popular I'm sure they'll make more. 


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on June 09, 2012, 04:35:58 PM
Trying to decide if I should upgrade my video card + get a SSD on my existing box or wait a bit and go whole hog on a new system. My processor and RAM are probably still good enough but my 4870 is getting a bit long in the tooth and SSDs make everything seem so much better.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Engels on June 10, 2012, 10:47:09 AM
Well, what is your processor and ram?


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on June 10, 2012, 11:04:49 AM
Well, what is your processor and ram?

I have a Phenom X4 9950 (unlocked so i could OC if I felt like it) and 8GB RAM.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: MisterNoisy on June 10, 2012, 11:45:44 AM
Well, what is your processor and ram?

I have a Phenom X4 9950 (unlocked so i could OC if I felt like it) and 8GB RAM.


Maybe a little of both?  Buy the video card for your new rig now and install it in the current box and then buy the rest later.  Then you put the 4870 back in it's original home and give/sell it to someone that can use it.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Salamok on June 11, 2012, 11:04:29 AM
Latest and greatest vid card is what makes a new rig special though, it would be the last component I would buy not the 1st. Get the SSD first, current ones are fast enough to remove the bottleneck, faster future ssd's won't produce the same level of noticeable improvement over what is out there now.


Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Chimpy on June 11, 2012, 12:43:22 PM
I would not be buying a super duper video card anyway. Probably something in the $150 range.

I think I am going to wait either way at this point as I had two interviews for higher paying jobs that went really well last week so I might come into more income and have a bit of cushion to "splurge" on a new machine.



Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
Post by: Mrbloodworth on June 13, 2012, 12:10:38 PM
Hay guys.

Any suggestions on what to replace my GeForce GTS 250 ( That was a quick buy to replace my failed 8800 )?

Looking for around 200$, as ill need to buy two of them for two different machines. I Prefer Nvidea, and EVGA. I'm just no longer sure what all the numbers are on cards anymore. I can give more info on the machine when I get home if needed.

EDIT:

Found my old build thread. So, im still running this machine here:

Quote
Item List
    • VGA EVGA 512-P3-N801-AR 8800GT 512M (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130318) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$189.99)
    • CASE SIGMA|LA VIE LBNWBP 500W RTL (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811226013) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$69.99)
    • DVD ROM LITE-ON|DH-16D2S-04 SATA % (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106095) - OEM (Qty=1, Price=$17.99)
    • MB ASUS P5K-E/WIFI-AP P35 775 RT (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131196) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$149.99)
    • CPU INTEL|C2Q Q6600 2.40G 775 8M R (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115017) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$239.99)
    • MEM 2Gx2|GSK F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK R (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$144.99)
    • MNTR HANNSG|LCD 19" 5MS JW-199DPB R (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824254001) - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$169.99)


    I DID upgrade the power supply, Corsair something or other.[/list]


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 13, 2012, 01:10:25 PM
    I had an evga 8800 fail. I'm going to make another post about aftermarket cooling, especially for evga cards. They suck at attaching heat sinks. My 460 had some kind of thermal pad that was barely attached to the RAM and there was almost no thermal paste on the gpu heatsink. At the very least you should re-apply the heatsink with some arctic silver applied properly.

    Love evga's hardware and warranty, but their cooling is the pits.

    Plus, it's awesome spending $200 and immediately disassembling the part and putting it back together again!


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Kitsune on June 13, 2012, 01:14:36 PM
    If you can afford to wait a bit, I'd suggest waiting for the GTX 660s to hit the market.  The new 600 series is pretty damn fantastic, my 670 is crazy powerful, but the cards in your price range aren't available yet.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Mrbloodworth on June 13, 2012, 01:32:06 PM
    I had an evga 8800 fail.

    Well, mine was just butt old. I'm also trying to track down a whine somewhere in the case. What made me notice I need an upgrade was Skyrm, and also prepping for Planetside 2. I can certainly Waite, I'm just trying to understand the crazy model numbers thees days. I had honestly thought my 250 was something new! Come to find out, its a relabeled, tweaked 9800++ something. The price range is because, well, I can't just get a video card for me, and not the misses!

    However, looking at my system, it seems closer and closer to just making a new rig all together. Any idea when the new cards come out Kitsune?


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Trippy on June 13, 2012, 03:35:27 PM
    Supposedly last week in June but it'll still be out of your price range especially if supplies are low and they are marked up like the 670s and 680s currently are.

    The GTX 560 Ti is probably your best bet. The 448 core edition (which is really a slightly slower 570 than a faster 560) is a bit more expensive but if you can find a good deal on one you should consider it.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 13, 2012, 03:58:53 PM
    You should probably only ever look at the GTX lines.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Mrbloodworth on June 13, 2012, 04:39:57 PM
    Ah, now that I'm home. The power supply is a Corsair TX650w.

    That 560 looks fine for my needs, I was asking about the new 600's as I figured when they come out other cards will drop in price some.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: HaemishM on June 13, 2012, 05:04:16 PM
    My GTX 460 has been absolutely perfect for everything I've done with it since I got it. Battlefield 3 on the highest settings, even the Total War games - I only turned down the settings in Napoleon: Total War because it was causing my CPU to overheat. The graphics card handled it all just fine.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Cyrrex on June 15, 2012, 01:39:04 PM
    I think it was in this thread that we talked about that Yamakasi Catleap WQHD 27" LED monitor...anyway, I used my birthday money and got one, just hooked it up.  First impression: resolution is sharper than shit.  Everything is now tiny by default as a result of the super high resolution.  Don't see any visible pixel errors, and brightness and contrast looks clean and even.

    Going to try some Skyrim first to see how that looks.  If it even supports the resolution, but I assume it will!

    You can get them down around 300 bucks now, by the way.  Prices have fallen a tad.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: MisterNoisy on June 15, 2012, 02:54:16 PM
    My GTX 460 has been absolutely perfect for everything I've done with it since I got it. Battlefield 3 on the highest settings, even the Total War games - I only turned down the settings in Napoleon: Total War because it was causing my CPU to overheat. The graphics card handled it all just fine.

    What are you using as a CPU cooler?  A Hyper 212+ is $30 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065) (currently also has a $10 MiR on top of that) and installs pretty easily.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: veredus on June 15, 2012, 05:28:27 PM
    Looking at getting a new monitor and frankly not sure what the hell I'm doing. Haven't bought one in a long ass time. Have about $300 to spend, was looking at something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286) or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551). Any suggestions?


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Trippy on June 15, 2012, 06:51:13 PM
    Looking at getting a new monitor and frankly not sure what the hell I'm doing. Haven't bought one in a long ass time. Have about $300 to spend, was looking at something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286) or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551). Any suggestions?
    The panels on those monitors will be comparable (i.e. both are crappy 27" 1080P TN panels) so it's more about the features (ports, controls, etc.) than the panels themselves. I'm not a fan of that style of Samsung monitor base (aka their "Touch of Color" design) though I'm not sure if the LG base is much better.

    Cyrrex posted above a 27" 2560 x 1440 S-IPS monitor for a super low price (for an IPS display). There must be a catch (like it's using 6-bit panels) but if you have a video card that can drive that high a resolution well in games it's something to consider.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: MisterNoisy on June 15, 2012, 11:53:26 PM
    Looking at getting a new monitor and frankly not sure what the hell I'm doing. Haven't bought one in a long ass time. Have about $300 to spend, was looking at something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286) or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551). Any suggestions?

    If I had to choose between those two, I'd go with the LG just because it has VESA mount holes.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Chimpy on June 16, 2012, 09:46:32 PM
    So I decided to get a SSD as Newegg has a promo deal on 256gb Crucial m4 drives for 179.99 which amazon has lowered their price to match. Will just do a fresh install of Windows on there as I had some registry shit happen that totally broke Office and made it unusable, unable to be uninstalled properly in any fashion and unable to be reinstalled due to that.

    I may decide tomorrow to go ahead and just buy the rest of the parts for a new build but I will probably wait until I have time to play a game I would need the extra HP for.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Cyrrex on June 18, 2012, 01:25:05 AM
    Looking at getting a new monitor and frankly not sure what the hell I'm doing. Haven't bought one in a long ass time. Have about $300 to spend, was looking at something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824005286) or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001551). Any suggestions?
    The panels on those monitors will be comparable (i.e. both are crappy 27" 1080P TN panels) so it's more about the features (ports, controls, etc.) than the panels themselves. I'm not a fan of that style of Samsung monitor base (aka their "Touch of Color" design) though I'm not sure if the LG base is much better.

    Cyrrex posted above a 27" 2560 x 1440 S-IPS monitor for a super low price (for an IPS display). There must be a catch (like it's using 6-bit panels) but if you have a video card that can drive that high a resolution well in games it's something to consider.


    Aye, there is a catch or two (or potential catches).  First, you can only get these thing from South Korea, so you have to be willing to take the risk of ordering something that might turn out to be a total stinker and have issues that you will not have a chance of getting fixed.  Second, these monitors have a reputation - say a 5 to 10% chance - that they will have issues with the backlight.  Supposedly, sometimes one side of the screen is noticeably brighter than the other.  Thirdly, the constant disclaimers from the various sellers regarding pixel errors (and how up to 5 is acceptable in Korea) will add to your nervousness.  Fourth, unless you are willing to pay more to guarantee it, you may not always be sure if you are getting the model with the glossy screen and/or the one with the built in speakers.  These usually cost extra in order to be certain, but if you are lucky you might get them anyway.

    For what it is worth, I have not had any of these issues.  The panel seems to be in perfect condition, and the backlight is just fine.  I got the glossy screen and the speakers (I didn't care much either way).  The color reproduction is fantastic.  The contrast is fantastic.  The speed seems good, but I haven't really tested it with anything that would push it.  The resolution is incredible.

    HOWEVER!  The stand is total shit.  The casing (or whatever you call it) in which the panel is mounted is not terribly high quality.  You only get the DVI Dual Link input, unless you want to fork out another 100 bucks for HDMI.  It won't win any awards for asthetics, that's for sure.

    In short, it seems to be a fantastic panel surrounded by a bit of a chintzy exterior.  Some of the internal electronics are probably lower end as well, I imagine, and I hope they will hold together.  I would not buy something like this unless I already had a very good, reliable monitor, because I knew darn well that I was taking a chance.  It appears to have paid off, though.  Skyrim looked so good I wanted to cry.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Engels on June 18, 2012, 11:06:00 AM
    Read an article on these at OC Gamers or some-such that said that these monitors are the 'throwaway' monitors from LG. Monitors that aren't quite up to spec to distribute to Apple, or NEC or other IPS manufacturers. The irony is that they achieve the lower latency by precisely not giving it the bells and whistles that leading manufacturers give their monitors. No OSD, fewer inputs, etc. You are essentially getting a 'bare bones' IPS from LG that, because it isn't overproduced, suits gamer needs while preserving the color fidelity and viewing angles that make IPS awesome.

    If I didn't already have a 24 inch NEC IPS display, I'm be insanely tempted to throw my credit card at the internet's great beyond for a 90% chance of getting a gaming-friendly IPS display that aparently can ALSO do 120Hz if tweaked.

    Also, and I know some of you are going to scream heresy at this, IPS monitors really do look better with glossy finish, rather than mat. I have a mat finish on one of mine, and glossy on another, and its just indisputable to me that the glossy looks best, assuming you aren't going to have reflection issues.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: apocrypha on June 18, 2012, 12:22:11 PM
    I got one of these Catleap Q270's a few weeks ago and I love it. I totally agree with Engels about glossy monitors, the picture on them is just flat out superior as long as you can control reflections in your room.

    Paid an extra £40 or so to get a "pixel perfect" one from eBay, i.e. it had been checked for and guaranteed <10 dead pixels. Mine turned out to have 0 dead pixels!

    It's a gorgeous panel with superb colour, great contrast, deep blacks and clean whites. Calibrated fine with a hardware colorimeter, and it definitely needed calibration for my purposes, it had a distinct red cast out of the box. The build quality of the enclosure is so-so. Very bare bones, and the stand is a wobbly piece of shit, but at least it's a standard VESA mount so you can replace that if you want.

    I can't find any drivers for it so it's just installed in win7 as a generic pnp monitor, but I have no problems with it.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 18, 2012, 01:19:02 PM
    So I decided to get a SSD as Newegg has a promo deal on 256gb Crucial m4 drives for 179.99 which amazon has lowered their price to match.
    Damn you for tempting me. But I'm still holding out in that price range for a starter violin. Imo, better way to spend it, I've spent too much on technology lately.

    And really, how much speed does one need for minecraft?  :grin:


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Chimpy on June 18, 2012, 01:33:50 PM
    Decided today after pricing out an entire rig that I would get a modest graphics upgrade as well and string the machine I have out for a bit longer. Bought a HD 7770 which while not supremely fast, is quite a bump up from ye olde 4870 and it will use considerably less juice in the process.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Cyrrex on June 19, 2012, 12:01:04 AM
    I got one of these Catleap Q270's a few weeks ago and I love it. I totally agree with Engels about glossy monitors, the picture on them is just flat out superior as long as you can control reflections in your room.

    Agreed.  I would have been fine with a matte one, but the glossy sure does look nice.  Makes it pop a little better.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: veredus on June 20, 2012, 10:41:13 AM
    Ended up getting the LG.  Like it so far.  Upgraded from a cheap non HD monitor so big difference in pictures quality. 




    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Furiously on June 20, 2012, 08:03:14 PM
    Any way other than eBay to get one?


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Salamok on June 21, 2012, 12:38:27 AM
    Any way other than eBay to get one?

    You could keep an eye on microcenter, they ordered a batch last month.
    http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0384780

    This wasn't the catleap, there are a slew of these Korean monitors that use different controller boards, the good catleaps only supported DVI because the bad ones that supported other shit had crap response times.  This microcenter one had display port support which is pretty much necessary in an eyefinity setup.  As far as I can tell the whole binning process for the panels has reached the point where more good panels are being produced than apple and dell can sell so your odds of getting a good panel are decent but that doesn't mean the offbrand stuff is using the same quality of controller board.  Overclock.net was also arranging a group buy at one point if ebay isn't your thing.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 21, 2012, 09:42:32 AM
    The ebay marketing materials are AWESOME.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-YAMAKASI-CATLEAP-Q270-LED-SE-27-2560X1440-WQHD-DVI-D-Dual-Computer-Monitor-/120911008070?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item1c26db9146#ht_36915wt_1180


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Chimpy on June 21, 2012, 11:35:37 AM
    Never lost chanches!


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 21, 2012, 11:41:59 AM
    I have no choice but to be sestive to good performance, because it's monitor's expression!


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Eldron on June 22, 2012, 08:03:01 AM
    Anyone got a suggestion for what fan will work on my ZOTAC GeForce GTX 560 Ti (2 GB)

    It's not reference design and can's seem to find someone writing that a certain fan will work. I have regret buying the Zotac alot.

    When playing there are no problems with the gfx, but just playing Diablo III or BF3 i am almost afraid to let the kids in the room in fear of they will get sucked into the fan....


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Sky on June 22, 2012, 09:02:04 AM
    How far off reference is it? I recommend http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/cooling/vga/376/accelero-xtreme-plus-ii.html ad nauseum. There's a compatibility chart on the product page. Might have to dig to see how far off reference your card is and whether that affects the Accelero or not. As I've said before, it's barely audible vs the Twin Frozr (which is a great stock cooler) that runs pretty loud....but I would've thought the Frozr quiet compared to any other stock I'd used in the last 10 years.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: MisterNoisy on June 22, 2012, 11:04:58 AM
    The Arctic Cooling Twin Turbo II (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186052) may be an option as well, It's 560ti compatible and is a good bit cheaper than the 3-fan Accelero models (as well being a hell of a lot easier to cram into a case).


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: shiznitz on June 22, 2012, 11:25:29 AM
    The ebay marketing materials are AWESOME.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-YAMAKASI-CATLEAP-Q270-LED-SE-27-2560X1440-WQHD-DVI-D-Dual-Computer-Monitor-/120911008070?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item1c26db9146#ht_36915wt_1180

    Free express shipping from Korea? How. The. Fuck.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Furiously on June 22, 2012, 04:19:22 PM
    Well.. I just spent a bit more than 400 bucks to get a pixel perfect one.. Hopefully it all works out.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Chimpy on June 23, 2012, 07:25:38 AM
    Well.. I just spent a bit more than 400 bucks to get a pixel perfect one.. Hopefully it all works out.


    God damn these things are tempting.



    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Hawkbit on June 23, 2012, 05:25:08 PM
    Well.. I just spent a bit more than 400 bucks to get a pixel perfect one.. Hopefully it all works out.

    Let us know how the Air Hores work out. 

    I want one, but can't quite justify the expense of a game of roulette right now.  I'm putting off my PC build until a month from now, simply better timing.  Too busy with school right now.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Chimpy on June 24, 2012, 12:39:48 AM
    So after about having a heart attack after updating my BIOS and not having it recognize any bootable disks, I was able to get Win7 ultimate installed on the SSD and get the new card installed. Still have a few bajillion little things to get installed and setup but I think it is going to be good. New graphics card only uses 1 6-pin versus the 2 my old one did so that alone is a nice boost. Unfortunately I won't get the entire SSD goodness since my board only does sata2. But it is still a lot faster than before with the platters.


    Title: Re: The 'Build Me A PC' Thread
    Post by: Cyrrex on June 24, 2012, 01:17:30 AM
    Well.. I just spent a bit more than 400 bucks to get a pixel perfect one.. Hopefully it all works out.

    Let us know how the Air Hores work out. 

    I want one, but can't quite justify the expense of a game of roulette right now.  I'm putting off my PC build until a month from now, simply better timing.  Too busy with school right now.

    You all laugh, but I ordered mine from this same motherfucker, complete with Air Hores and High Monitor Pride.  The prices seem to be dropping even further.

    And yes, the shipping was free, and rocket fast.  Ordered on a Saturday, and arrived on Wednesday, and that was after a holdover in customs (yeah, you'll want to factor that possibility in  :oh_i_see:).  No