f13.net

Whoa. dat's allota cash (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119213265032356342.html?=djemalert)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Woohoo cheap Mass Effect for me!

oh god

i can't stop laughing

i think i'm laughing so hard blood is coming out of my face. eyes, ears everywhere

shift key broken it's so funny

Awesome, Mass Effect for Wii.

(http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/1665/mjpopcornak4.gif)

Gonna need me an explanation. Not up on the funny :)

Any bets on how many of the staff are going to bail and become re-ex-EA employees?

All of them?

Ah, fuck. RIP Bioware. Keep us informed of where you end up.

EA's CEO used to work at Elevation Partners. Gee, I wonder if he was a partner in the pool that owned VG?  

ohh god

i can't take it

it's seriously too much

WARHAMMER VS UNNAMED MMOG

2 GO IN
1 COME OUT
NOT SHIT! POWER!

How many days since Mythic delayed WAR? No fucking coincidence.

Get the Bioware guys on UO, STAT!

Next, Microsoft buys Take Two to kill the PS4. No, I didn't forget the green text.

(http://asms.k12.ar.us/classes/humanities/worldstud/97-98/imper/Philippines/M0Q5MHLG.JPG)

(http://www.sandakan-deathmarch.com/pic/logo.jpg)

Someone photoshop the map that came with baldur's gate onto that.

Well.  Fuck. 

Is it to late to have the guy in Mass Effect pull up to a Burger King to invetigate whether the enemy is hiding out there? It should only take the Bioware Devs a couple extra weekends to implement this.

I can't say I'm sad. I can't publically say why I'm not sad either.

But this is lol-fucking-city.

THE LOLLATORIUM EVEN.

(http://www.esreality.com/files/placeimages/2007/58312-bunny%20sad-thumb.jpg)

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh man.   :sad_panda:


Edit.... this hits way closer to home than I can say.   Yeesh.

(http://tn3-1.deviantart.com/fs8/300W/i/2005/332/a/6/Who__s_a_Sad_Panda__by_moochacha26.jpg)

(http://media.arstechnica.com/journals/science.media/Tai_Shan.jpg)

Aww man. EA destroys good companies. I didn't care about Mythic but losing Bioware is going to hurt.

So much for the mystery MMO, I was mildly curious about that since it was being developed here in Austin.  

edit: looks like EA is just running around buying multi-million dollar lottery tickets hoping they can hit the big one. 

Methinks it's time for a little Doors and Apocalypse...:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MI24HgwK4m0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MI24HgwK4m0)

You PC folks can bitch about "Consolization" of games, or you Console types about the "Wii-ilization" of games all you want.

It's shit like this that will kill gaming long before either one becomes a serious issue.

Farewell untitled MMORPG using the HeroEngine.

So, color me stupid but why does everyone think that EA buying Bioware automagically means their unnamed MMO is cancelled? Did I miss the memo where it was leaked out that it's a PVP-oriented fantasy diku-WoW clone?

It doesn't. It means a whole lot of funny for me though.

Are you familiar with the history of UO2 and UOX?

No, I was an EQ-tard and didn't pay much attention to UO. What was the deal?

An earth shattering kaboom.   Or more accurately, a large PHUT. 


(http://images.jupiterimages.com/common/detail/24/08/22850824.jpg)

Well, there goes another good dev studio. Alright, what's left for the evil disgusting giant to buy?

If Bioware isn't making a certified run away hit MMORPG, then it probably won't ever make it to retail.

I really liked the UOX/2, or whatever they called it, concept and thought that could have been a real good game.

I think EA's katamari had to get a bit bigger with these... Whats next? Engine developers id/Epic or other publishers?

Blizzard, obviously. If they put out all the games on the market, they make all the money.


It's so full of win.

 :sad_panda:


How long will it be until we start getting yearly installments of the Shock series?

Is there nothing EA won't buy and destroy?  So long Bioware, you were one of my favorites.  :sad_panda:

FUCK.


Seriously, I'm like the resident BioWare fanboi. Fuck.



Just....Fuck. Am I gonna have ta choke a bitch?

Really though, as long as the talent at Bioware got some of the phat lewtz from this takeover is it a bad thing?  Now those guys have the money to go out and try to form their own studios and shit right?  There's nothing that forces them to stick w/ Bioware now that it is owned by EA esp. once the great evil shitcans their MMO for not being Madden enough.

Just thinking out loud..  I don't track this kind of stuff often.

Before we all go  :mob: , is there any way that EA will maintain Bioware as a separate entity much like Sony has different parts of SOE?

I'm not down with how all this works, so for the more common of the posters like myself, I need clarification.

EA has a long history of buying the hottest, best loved, idea filled design studio and utterly destroying it.  There have been NO successes.

Will Wright?

lol


Well, to be fair, BioWare (Austin) is very seperate from BioWare (Edmonton). All the old talent is in Edmonton. So is Mass Effect.



Well, the only possible upside to this is that now BioWare should have access to enough money to keep Mass Effect in production until is COMPLETELY Done. None of this Obsidian half-assed-finished bullshit.


Speaking of which, how does this affect Obsidian? Or were they part of Pandemic now?

I am curious did any of you behind the scene guys know this was coming?

UXO. And yea, me too. ;)

EA destroyed Maxis, though. They did finally realize after destroying Origin, Bullfrog and Westwood that maybe they need to keep him around so they did appease him by letting him keep a little studio in the East Bay for Spore rather than forcing him to commute across the Bay every day (which is a fricking pain in the ass) like what they did to what's left of the Maxis people.

You guys are looking at this all wrong.  You should be seeing this as EA dumping a bunch of talented meatplace developers on the market.

Guys. Guys. Guys.

I was going to write an article on this, but hell, here's why it's funny.

1. Pits Mythic against Bioware Austin.
2. Brings in a shitload of talent that will either quit, or help EA fix Madden (lol).
3. WARHAMMER or Bioware MYSTERY TITLE will see the light of day. One studio will engulf the studio of the other.
4. RACE TO BEAT WOW, LOLOLOLOLOLOL.
5. They just killed Atari in one, single blow. Next purchase, Atari, for pennies on the dollar.
6. They just bought the only decent RPG PC Group in America. Oh, right Obsidian. Bioware's bitch. Like they matter. Wriggling corpse of Black Isle imo.
7. LOL ATARI.
8. LOL WAR BETA.
9. LOL DRAGON AGE.
10. LOL - Pandemic is actually pretty good.
11. They just got a shitload of great licenses.

There's like 50 more reasons it's hilarious. Why don't I care? Because I'm a clown!

Nope!

Well, BioWare's forums are alive and well, seething with nerd fury.  And naturally, their completely retarded 'policy' of locking threads once they reach 10 pages makes reading the responses more of a chore than it ordinarilly would be.  Not one comment from anyone at BioWare regarding the future of their MMO, interestingly enough (or not).  Woo and Priestly are locking threads left and right with their cutesy "End of line!" and "Lockdown!" sign offs. 

If you take a gander, bring some marshmellows!

Indeed, from what I heard, guys AT the scene didn't know it was coming.

I think now would be a good time to start buying tons of EA stock.  Or applying for cushy profit-sharing jobs.  Yay, capitalism!

In buyouts like this, the core people usually get slung with long-term contracts that force them stick around for several years. The only people who'd be able to bail on the new EA-Bioware are the ones who didn't make tons of studio-forming money from the acquisition in the first place.

What I find amusing is there are probably people at the Austin studio who used to work at Origin when it was gobbled and destroyed. Maybe some of these people even quit because of their unhappiness over the way EA ran things. Fast forward several years, and now they're suddenly back at EA.  :angryfist:

Wow, I never thought of a company as big as Bioware as "Buyable"

What the fuck just happened here?

They aren't "forced" to stick around (that would be slavery) -- they are just given financial incentive to do so.

History repeated. Everyone is shocked.

<-------------- Not this guy.

Eric Schild. 

The Joan Rivers of gaming.

I wish it was that simple.  Lets face it this is the age of no-compete agreements, I bet most if not all of the key talent in Bioware has no-compete agreements which last years.  All hail the fascist age where you get the pleasure of selling your souls to parasitic corporations like EA for the privilege of working in the sweat shop.

Oh good God....

Those sorts blanket non-compete agreements are not valid in California.

Gah, they got Bioware!  This is just, just not cool.  EA is a bunch of knuckleheads, gonna be sad to see Bioware broken up and injested into the EA collective.

Any of you Bioware guys reading this I just wanna say "So long and thanks for all the games."

Well... "hi guys."  I figure I'd use this tasty bit of drama to make my first post.  Almost feels like losing my virginity or something (yes, it was that bad)... but I digress.    :nda:

Please correct me if I'm wrong... but didnt Bioware "technically" just buy Perpetual (i.e. paid ridiculous sums of money to "license" their gaming platform)?   And didn't Perpetual just turn GnH (pubbed by SOE) belly up?  Along with firing most of the staff.  Of course, now Perpetual is SUPPOSED to be concentrating on STO...  which by virtue of SOE pubbing GnH FIGURED to be gobbled up by SOE when the time came.  STO currently has no publisher btw, unless Perp. pubs it themselves or Paramount does it (doubtful).

But... seeing as how EA just bought up half the gamespace (Bioware included), I guess now Perpetual has (unwittingly I'm sure) just sold its vanguard gaming platform to EA!!!

<im starting to get a headache...  but I shall continue>

SOE now only has PotBS left as an upcoming project, after now losing Perpetual as a client.  You can bet your bottom dollar SOE had/has some trick up their sleeve to get into the door for STO.  But EA now "owns" errr... "rents" Perpetual's gaming platform.  Kind of a conflict of interest there.

Let's see.. I surmise that since Perpetual made beaucoup credits selling their platform to Bioware a.k.a. "EA" that they could afford to scrap GnH so close to launch and not care much.  Regardless, it could also be a sign they couldn't financially handle both projects.

This being the case...  it sure as hell feels like EA or SOE will make a move on Perpetual. 

btw: Between all the non-competes that must be out there... how the hell are these people supposed to get anything actually MADE??  :roll:

Your post doesn't make any fucking sense, newfish.

SOE ran away from GnH because it was _bad_.
SOE has DCU, The Agency, and other things in development.
Bioware simply licensed Perpetuals platform. Or rather, part of it. The chat part or some other senseless bullshit.
That was a bad purchase by Bioware, I would guess.
EA just bought up a tiny fraction of the gamespace - partly from a developer who was throwing a desperation pass (imo), with Mass Effect.
PotBS is not an SOE project. Stop spreading this misinformation and strangle whoever you learned it from.
Perpetual wasn't an SOE client.

Perpetual isn't worth buying.

Carry on.

I don't really think everyone should be freaking out, yet.

This is a proposed purchase and is still in the offer phase. It's not set to be complete until Jan 2008, and hasn't even been approved by the SEC, so it's too early to say anything except EA wants to buy Pandemic and Bioware.

The implications of this proposal are something different, but it's all speculation anyway, since nobody's bought anyone just yet.

I was more interested in the part involving $680 million dollar bids by EA.. Sheesh that's alot of moolah.

Eh? Freaking out? This is awesome.

-SOE had no reason to run away from GnH, they were only "publishing" it.  Perp. ran away from GnH because they themselves knew it sucked.
-PotBS is currently the only MMO SOE is pubbing that 's even on anyone's radar. (i should've been more specific there).  Seeing as how this is all about "WoW-scraps," I'm focusing on near term here.  Besides that... they're pubbing it, that makes it somewhat their project.
-Perpetual WAS an SOE client, since SOE was co-pubbing their game (SOE was paid or would have been paid to pub it).  Even if SOE was only handling distro and marketing, that still makes Perp. their client.
-The Perp. online platform per BIOWARE'S statements was basically to serve as the entire online backbone of their big secret MMO (billing, cust. service, server structure, community support, load, balance.. yada yada) Not just for "chat."  EA now owns this along with simutronics "HeroEngine" since they now own Bioware.
-Perpetual has the rights from PARAMOUNT to develop Star Trek Online, THAT my firend, makes them worth buying.

Hey, whadaya know... EA's CEO already had $300 million of his own money invested in Bioware and Pandemic.

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/aei/2007/10/electronic_arts_buys_biowarepandemic_for_860_million-2.html

Hey, welcome to Big Business.

The interesting question that those currently pounding thier heads into their keyboards is: why would EA buy Bioware?


You just like seeing Mark Jacobs cry, Schild.


EA doesn't need to fix Madden until 2010, when NFL exclusivity will threaten to run out.


EA will probably see both released, just to see if there is anything to this MMO market the boys in Vivendi keep telling them about. When neither achieves WoW numbers, they will be left on life support to die.


You can't kill Atari - they return after every defeat like a bad comic villain.


I think this is the heart of it. EA goes after industry-leading studios, even if just to grind them into dust. There are few positive dev studio brands that get people excited about their games and Bioware is one of those.


This will probably be the first game to quietly disappear.


Pandemic have some reasonable licences too. However, I'd expect them to be more likely gutted than Bioware.


Yep, there's another major reason. I envision KOTOR 8 being out by 2016.

In short, EA buys a well-known studio for the licenses and their credibility. Bioware and Pandemic employees polish up their resumes and start looking for work elsewhere.

That $300 million was Elevation Partners' money of which some fraction was his own.

Can this even be legal?  I mean, he basically quit EA... formed this investment firm and dumped $300 million (as stock) into BioWare/Pandemic... THEN, goes back to EA as CEO and gets EA to buy the company he has $300 million in stock in.  Next thing we'll see is Elevation Partners selling their stock in Bioware and making a crapload in profit.  Cant be legal, but I bet they'd find a way.

This whole thing just stinks to me.  Nothing good comes of any of this besides lining a few crusty old guys' pockets.  The wage-slaves and gaming industry all lose.  Not to mention some of the biggest games will probably be delayed releases now due to the fallout. (yet another reason why software lags so far behind hardware these days)

The only thought i have atm is will I as an endconsumer profit from this ?

i dont know if this is good or bad. Should i bet my money on Schild as he thinks this is waygood or shall i be the cryboy now as i see good company's being swallowed by the big whale ?


Dre

Lucky you signed your name there, it was hard to be sure who you were. Not that many people on these forums who can write with such excellence.

And you are ?

He means quit signing your posts because we see your name four inches away on the screen.

How precisely does this kill Atari, besides EA becoming more of a blasphemous behemoth?

Of course it's legal, this crap happens all the time. My company provides stock sharing, so recently they created "special stock" which basically means "stocks that have no votes" and thats what they give us now. They were afraid their employees might get a little uppity and take over the company or something. lol I need a new job.

Read the article.

nor in Canada, where Bioware's HQ is.  And Pandemic's I think is in Brisbane, which is also in an other country.  And while EA's HQ is in Redwood CA, their locus is still in Burnaby, BC, Canada.

Thing is, people have a way of being intimidated and shoved into rough corners in the consumer software industry without legal threat.  It's often not necessary.

Edit: also, of course it's legal for some founder or exec to quit, make a startup and then sell it back to his fomer company.  Happens all the damn time.  And yes, often it's not startup's and yes it's often very sleazy how it seems.  But it is legal, not speaking as a lawyer, but as someone who's lived a couple of times through that scenario as a manager.

Is this where we bet cigarettes on which new fish is the first to cry?

Screw Atari, if EA continues down it's current warpath then the next logical purchase would be funcom.  Then it releases all 3 MMO's (or is that 4 counting funcom's mystery alternate history game/mmo) and hopes one of them is the WoW Killer lottery ticket they are looking for.

Edit: I would also say Flagship is a target but Hellgate already has $$ painted all over it and I doubt they are in need of any additional capital to make it through the rest of this month to release.  So with a big payday just around the corner I think they would rather see it through as creators/owners instead of cashing in now.

A few articles and interviews popped up overnight.

Jakub over at Firing Squad, who is located in Edmonton, has some "insider views". (http://www.firingsquad.com/features/ea_buys_bioware/default.asp)  There are no names named, but it's not hard to imagine he has a few sources at Bioware.

Gamespot has an interview with the two doctors at Bioware. (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6180866.html?action=convert&om_clk=latestnews&tag=latestnews;title;1)

GameDaily has an interview with both the head Pandemic guys and the Bioware doctors. (http://biz.gamedaily.com/industry/feature/?id=17751)

Another Pandemic interview, at 1Up. (http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3163617)

The takeaway message seems to be that it's all this Riccitiello guy.  He supposedly wants to turn EA into something that isn't an entirely soulless money machine, and the optimists are saying, "okay, let's give this guy a chance".

edit: looks like all of these were in fact posted yesterday, but wuteva.

Don't worry... I wont let him corner me in the laundry room   :-o

When is EA just gonna release their own console?

Ok, I know you love jrpgs, but just because something is not one does not make it a "desperation pass". Jesus.

As for the rest of this: FUUUUUCCCCKKKKKK!!!!!

This is literally the worst gaming news I have heard since Black Isle closed down and Origin became nothing but a machine to make UO expansions. Seriously. If EA fucks up Bioware like they do everything else then the RPG market just got a lot shittier. *sighs*

I can't speak for everyone, but I'll tell you why I think that it means this. HeroEngine. Sure, they could buy Simutronics or live with the existing licensing. But I doubt that they will.

Maybe they can buy Infinium Labs and this can rise from the ashes:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/10/Phantom_prototype.jpg)

Of course I don't have your "leet insider infoz" but I would be really suprised if this happens.

Other than nothing, what happened to that thing?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Phantom_(game_system)



Heh, still remember the bruisings the Hardocp gave them everytime they came out with a press release.

You shouldn't be, EA are the fucking Kratos of game cancellations.

So I was playing some GoW1 the other night, fuck you guys.

All,

   Crying?  Hardly.  I can't talk about the details (obviously) but I am certainly not crying over this deal nor did the deal come as a surprise to me.  I'm really excited about having BioWare as part of EA (I know the Pandemic guys by rep only) and I can tell you that there is plenty of room for both BioWare's MMO and our MMO.  In terms of BioWare's talent, I've cited KOTOR as one of my favorite RPGs of all time in panels, EA meetings, etc. and having, IMHO, the premier RPG developers in the industry (and I've spoken with them several times over the years) as part of EA is fantastic.  Thinking that either MMO is going to be canceled because of this deal makes no sense whatsoever.  Quite the opposite actually.  I don't expect to be believed by everybody about this, but just wait and see what happens, it's going to be great for EA, Mythic, BioWare and the players.  As has been made clear in the articles that have been posted since the deal was announced (one reason I waited till today to post), nothing changes for Mythic and all of BioWare reports directly to the head of the Games Label, Frank Gibeau, the same guy I report to.  Perfection.

   Since the Mythic acquisition I've talked about how EA has never once said to me that I must put in a certain feature or support things like item sales in WAR or in-game advertising, etc.  They have allowed us to make the game our way.  If they allow us to do that, it is illogical to assume that having paid a lot more for BP, that they would give them less freedom than they give us.  I can imagine that they will be allowed to succeed or fail based on their talent just as we are.  John R. is anything but stupid and he would not buy two of the premier developers in the industry just to mess with them.  Just like I've said about Mythic, if they fail with their games, then that's the time to start to worry.  Until then, thinking that this deal means the end of what makes BioWare and Pandemic such great developers flies in the face of logic as well as how they have treated us since our acquisition.  JR and company have just landed a deal which will help determine his legacy at EA and anyone who thinks that he came back to fail, doesn't know him at all.  I can't guarantee that BP will always succeed just as I can't guarantee that Mythic will always succeed.  I can guarantee one thing however, the BP will be given the chance to succeed just as we have been given the chance to succeed.

   Believe what you will but you don't pay this much money for a couple of developers just to blow them up, mess with them and kill the golden goose. 

   And if anyone starts screaming Origins, Westwood, etc., check all the facts first before posting.  The same things I said when EA bought us is just as true today.


Mark

Mark, I'm just going to say the obvious.

People always wait and see with EA.
And it always ends badly.

And they constantly kill golden geese. A goose can't catch a football.

But hey, maybe ostriches can.

Until there's something for retail both WAR and Bioware's still unannounced MMO (stil!) are just theory.  When those teams reach GM, then players will be less skeptical. 

Schild,

   LOL, I'm many things, never been compared to an ostrich before.  Kinda not my personality but you would have to be here to know that.  Maybe I'm wrong and everyone is lying to me but that would fly in the face of the people who I've come to know and what I know about the same people from doing my own due diligence.  Who knows what will happen down the road but for now (and I've been part of EA for 16 months) they've lived up to my expectations.  Nothing is ever 100% wonderful (didn't expect it would be) and it certainly wasn't that way as an independent but so far, no secret implants, no attempts to hijack the studio or the game design just the usual stuff of being part of a large company.  And let me tell you, my nose and, at times, my neck is stuck into lots of places but never, ever the ground.


Mark

I'll agree with the notion that this will make or break Riticello.  There's a new sheriff in town, so old ways might not persist today.  However, I will also say again: Welcome to Big Business, the Cake is a Lie.

How's the beta going?   :hello_kitty:

schild's observation about EA's history is spot on. However, their new CEO has claimed he wants to do things differently so it could be different this time. I am not holding my breath, though.

You mean the guy that worked at Microsoft and engulfed companies and destroyed them. He'd have no interest in having Mythic fucked with because they killed off Mythica with a frivolous lawsuit.

So you are still alive, I thought between SOE and the cyst we had lost you.. Good post.

To be fair though, its not Mr. Jacobs fault that he's stuck in a situation few developers seem to escape intact from.  Here's hoping WAR is a great game.

The fact is though, Gamesworkshop has sunk lower and lower over the last five or so years so I'm really not going to be bothered to get excited by a product involving Mythic (DAOC balance 4tL, also coining the phrase RvR and pretending it means something special was pretty lame) EA (fucking evil) and Gamesworkshop (you used to be cool).


I would however like to bet Mr. Jacobs that Bioware's MMO never sees the light of release, state your terms ($1,000 or less please).

Hoax,

   Love to.  Here are my terms for the bet:

1) If the MMO that BioWare is working on never sees the light of day, I will post a full page apology for being a total monkey-boy for having faith in the wrong people.  It will, as always with me, be posted under my real name.  The apology must be well-written and contain lots and lots of wonderful language that makes me look like a complete idiot.

or

2) If the MMO does see the light of day, you will do the same and under your real name and state of residence, approach the apology from the perspective of being a totally cynical SOB, overly-jaded, etc.

As to the site of posting, if you don not to spend any money (which is fine by me), we can pick a site (here would be fine if Schild, etc. are okay with that?) or pick the newspaper of your choice and we can run it as an ad.

Work for you? :)

Mark

This is getting interesting.

An observation by someone that has been apart of two companies that were bought out by bigger companies:  The one getting bought up ends up with all the leverage.

So, past experience with such things actually leads me to believe that it is WAR that will never see the light of day, and NOT the unnamed fantasy DIKU clone that BioWare is working on.

Carry on pontificating.

Hmmm...

This might be a bit on the Pollyanna-ish side but let's say that Riccitello "gets it" and he wants to change the gamer perception of EA. If EA's reputation inside the dev community is as bad as it is with the gamers, he'd have no choice but to buy up other studios if he wants to get real talent in house to make those games, and associate the EA brand with non-derivative, creative games. Something tells me that putting up want ads and "Hai guyz weer good guyz now lolz!" posts in message boards ain't gonna cut it.

450,000 beta apps and not seeing the light of day? That would be a PR apocalypse for EA.

See now you're just taunting Mark Jacobs to wager even more.

I believe that's a good assesment, particualrly considering the new departmentalization of EA.  You'll have BAU in the Sims and Sports divisions, because the customers have no alternative or are ignorangutans, respectively, while the Casual dept will keep on-tenth of southeast Asia employed.  The Misc department will be used to gain some credibility, or at least have a toe in the hardcore gamer sector.  Too bad it's all called EA.

Edit for context.

Montague,

   I agree 100%.  For me, it all boils down to performance.  I've liked what I've seen so far about what JR has been doing and I'm willing to give the man a chance to change the culture at EA.  One of the reasons I agreed to being bought by EA was that there were other people then who wanted to change the culture as well.  The game developer and game player community should not be convinced just by words but by deeds.  Again, it's the same thing I said about DAoC and I am saying about WAR.  Wait to see what comes out and then draw your own conclusions.  Judging someone or something too early often fails miserably. 

   Here's something else you all should keep in mind.  When BioWare and Pandemic came together it was because they wanted to, not because they had to.  I know that BioWare had other suitors (when Mythic was independent, Mythic and TA (the guys that invested in us) were interested in doing what JR did) and they chose Elevation over all those other folks and I assume that Pandemic also had offers.  So, either they were very dumb and I'm being dumber now or they liked what they saw and heard from EP as I like what I'm hearing/seeing from JR. Again, time will tell. 

Mark

Well aren't you on a tear, Mark.

What is "light of day", in this context?  Do WAR, TR, AoC, G&H count? And Spore what about that?

The other, slightly smaller evil disgusting giants. Like Ubisoft.

lol thats a good point, with the secrecy of the Bioware project he could win the bet if they ever release an MMO at any point in the future.  Even if EA releases an MMO 5 years from now with a shrouded origin you could point and say "Oh ya that was the Bioware mystery MMO".  

Personally I think it will see the light of day, but on the flipside it's chances of being amazing have gone down.  I was already somewhat of a sceptic in regards to it's potential greatness due to the craptastic UI and playability of the NWN games.  I liked the concept/content and for something that included a world builder tool it had decent enough graphics but I never could get immersed so to speak because I was always annoyed by what a pain in the ass it was to make the character do anything.

Add EA to the mix which has UI issues of it's own to solve (not to mention a habit of screwing up dev teams) and I have all but written this mystery game off.

Guys.

Bioware CA has nothing to do with Bioware US in terms of craptacular crapiness. In fact, I'd trust CA to make a better MMOG than the US team.

That US team, it smells like West Virginia.

If he does indeed "Get It" then he needs to get the fuck up from his office, go over to the EA Sports division, pull out his hopefully gigantic, steel penis and dickslap every bitchass cunt working in that office from the receptionist to the guy in charge to the fucking janitor. The shit they are doing to their sports franchises is fucking criminal.

Hoax got served...Response is mandatory.

I didn't respond because Every single MMOG designer in the industry owes us all public apologies for making diku bullshit over and over.

As such, I thought the wager was, how do you say in America, weak sauce.

Works for me.

Let's be clear though:

-Light of day = released to public.
-I fully expect you to use the term "monkey boy".
-Your terms sound fine for what I have to do.
-The letter will be posted on f13, unless Schild suggests a better idea for the venue (again, go easy on my wallet man).

Also this isn't supposed to be some sort of call out bullshit, just a funny bet, so lets be clear that I am not nor have I ever been a dev stalker.  I do totally expect EA to fuck people over though.  Good show to Mr. Jacobs for picking up my jovially tossed gauntlet.

***

To people saying WAR will not get released, you are out of your freaking minds, the old GW might have considered pulling the plug if they didn't like the way it looked but the new one is so money hungry they just want some of those money hats they've seen the Blizzard guys wearing.

EA does stuff with its sports division?

As far as I can tell there have been maybe 3 Madden games since the Genesis days, and the rest have been minor versions at best.

This has been witnessed. The bet is made.

May the best man win.

All,

   Hmm, good point about the mystery BioWare MMO.  My intent is certainly not to look at Spore or some other game (4 years from now) and claim that's the mystery MMO.  Lots of people at EA what it is and of course BioWare knows what it is but nobody can talk about it yet even though it is well into development.  As to when they are going to talk about it, that's not up to me.  I didn't propose the wager but I'm happy to follow through on it by stating some simple terms.  I'm sure that the BioWare will announce it at some point and if not, and it doesn't get released, there will be plenty of people talking about the game that never was.  I'm happy to have BS called on me by guys like Rich or Gordon who, of course, know the truth if I tried to pull that. I'm just as happy to forget the whole thing if Hoax likes since he was the one who called me out on the bet.

   Either way, bet or no bet,  I'm excited by the MMO and when it is announced I think the community will be as well.

Mark

Hoax,

   Agreed to all your terms, especially the term monkey-boy for my naivety, foolishness and gullibility.  As to call-out BS, I couldn't agree more, that's why I suggested here as my first option as opposed to the newspaper.  This is a great bet and I look forward to seeing the results. 

   As to Mr. Jacobs, please, it's Mark, always has been, always will be. 

   As to WAR not getting released, I also agree.  As has been pointed out already, we have 450K+ true beta signups (excluding Asia), great pre-sales and tons of interest in Asia.  It's getting released when it is the game it should be or you'll see  EA throwing my butt out the door with a vengeance.

Mark 

Re: Riccitello being Robot Jesus instead of Baby Eating Jesus:

(http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/9910/iwanttobelievesmalltd3.th.jpg) (http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iwanttobelievesmalltd3.jpg)

That said, I really do hope he can compartmentalize the Old EA mentality to the business units that do fine with that model (e.g. EA Sports). What I'm surprised about is that Riccitello isn't going the route that the movie studios have used for decades now: form wholly-owned subsidiary brands in order to escape the taint that the "EA" mark sticks on a title for certain markets.

The stage is set!
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a2/STGameTrisk.jpg)

"Dun dun dun duun dunn da ta da da dun dun dunn da ta da daaa"

<obligatory wager of an arbritrary number of quatloos on the newcomer>

Or you could stave off the inevitable and quit early.  EA bought you.  That means your company is no more, it will... cease to be.   And its usually sooner rather than later.  Sadly, you guys don't have the cache one would figure Westwood and Origin had, which still didn't help them.  Except they actually use Westwood IP as opposed to whatever tiny smidgen of necrophilia they do to Origin's top flight IPs.  (Well they were top flight.  These days its more of a "huh"? and wondering why anyone cares.  Wing Commander had a movie, an animated series, and a bunch of kickass games.  Since EA got em?  A shitty XBLA action game  similar in IP insult as Mech Assault or Shadowrun.  Hmm.. and what happened to Fasa Studios anyhow?  Oh.  Same thing that happens to companies EA buys.)

I have bought almost every Games Workshop based game released since 91-92.  Yours is being published by EA.  It will be the end of the streak. 

EA needs to go fuck itself.  They are Wal Marting up videogames and generally killing many of the game series I loved as a teenager and young adult.

I will be avoiding anything Bioware does now too.  Hell, EA is only distributing Orange Box and I am on the fence about it!  There are a good 15-20 million morons who buy Madden every year so my refusal to give EA any cash is moot, but I don't care.

Maybe one day they will fix their assholeness the way Nintendo did.  (Getting your ass kicked helps!  Late 80s- Early 90s Nintendo were complete douches.  Now?  Not so much.)

I've got a question for those "in the know."  Seems like everyone kinda likes Mr. John Riccitiello, but didnt he leave EA in 2004 (fairly recently)?  Didnt EA make craptastic games and destroy good titles (like Earth and Beyond and others) during his tenure there?

I guess I'm trying to say, "what makes him so special?"

To me, he only looks like some hoity toidy big business exec out to make nothing more then a profit.  The line with this whole EA-thing still reads to me like EA is JR's lil' private investment piggy bank.  He's made over 100% profit in a few years by getting EA (which he heads basically) to buy his investment companie's ONLY smart buy (VG holdings).  Elevation Partners btw, didnt seem to be doing too well until the VG Holdings buy.  Mind you, this 100% profit doesnt even really include the equity and stock options EP gets from the deal after everything funnels down.  Not to mention, we're forgetting about the what?  $135 million of the deal that went to grease the bigwigs at VG Holdings to agree to the deal in the first place.  hmmm, I'd like to see who at Bioware/Pandemic got a piece of that kickback.

I ask again, how is any of this beneficial to BP or the gaming industry in general??  It's NOT.  It's purely a monetary, greed-based transaction that simply waters-down the industry with blatant speculation and nothing concrete.  Get paid now, worry about the rest later.

BP didnt need EA, their rep just went DOWN by letting EA buy them out.  Yes, EA paid to gain BP's rep (a record sum for gaming purchases btw).  But I'm more inclined to believe it was simply to get their stock to rise 5% in 24hrs (along with lining people's pockets with cash).  I seriously doubt this deal is for the "betterment of mankind." 

Oh yeah... my contribution to the bet:
(http://www.infiniteless.com/d/196-2/amoktime.jpg)

Question though... which one of the betters has the Pon Farr?

If you knew about them, they wouldn't be secret, would they?

So the mystery MMOG is going to be recoded to use Mythic's engine rather than HeroEngine? :P

I agree with this. If Riticello can't make his revenue targets while trying to turn EA into  :hello_kitty: to gamers, he's out. The next replacement would then play it safe and cut those titles that haven't proven themselves. Sekret unnamed projects, like the Bioware one (and Pandemic has 4 sekret projects listed on their site) would be the first to be dumped.

If WAR doesn't meet its targets (and sorry, but until about a week before launch day it's pretty hard to work out which way the wind is blowing on this) then that Bioware MMO is going to also get looked at carefully. If Mass Effect doesn't break some sales records, or if Dragon Age doesn't do ... well, whatever Dragon Age is meant to do - again, Bioware is likely to suddenly finds itself on a tighter leash.

It's not the first game that I expect the relationship between EA and whoever they bought recently to be tested - that kind of thing starts to come in when projects don't achieve what they are expected to achieve. It's those post-problem games that are likely to be more EA-hands on.

Oh, and there may be three other worlds that see the Bioware MMO cancelled: World of Starcraft. Blizzard announces that and MMO devs everywhere will just go into the fetal position for about 4 years.

That last part pisses me off, because I wouldn't even want to play a World of Starcraft. I don't even like Starcraft.

I think it sucks that BioWare is going to be part of EA and hope this does not end as badly as past EA transactions, but I expect it will.

On the bet, I am looking forward to seeing the outcome no matter who loses.

Are we even sure that it's World of Starcraft, rather than World of Diablo that's being worked on in seekret?  I've been figuring they were gonna go there with Diablo next, since SC2 is the other in-dev game.

I think that a tiered release of SC2 and WoStarcraft would be amazing and full of win for Blizzard.

I doubt it would happen though.

Yes, lately they've been taking established series like Madden and Fifa and pissing on the updates. Both Madden 08 and Fifa 08 for the Wii were goddamn shovelware travesties. One would expect that while 08 wouldn't be that different from 07, it wouldn't be demostrably worse. After all, they are just polishing the chrome on a well-iterated engine, right?

No, wrong. They fucked 08 up beyond belief, and I've heard rumblings that every version since 2006 on the next-gen platforms has been just as buggy. But morons like me need our updated rosters, and so we buy it. I likely won't buy Madden again, but Fifa I will, because Fifa 07 was one of my most favorite games ever.

Hellgate may have stolen their world of diablo thunder.  I'm with cmlancas I want to see world of starcraft, wasnt starcraft ghost supposed to be something along these lines?

The general concensus IMO upon hearing of the release of Starcraft 2 was disappointment (at least in my gaming circles).  Most people expected and were damn near BEGGING for a World of Starcraft.  Why Blizzard didnt listen just tells me that once again they're looking to milk that cash-cow till it runs dry; as others on these forums have suggested.  If you follow Warcraft, it was basically the same deal.... there were 3 of em before the MMO came out.

Now that the dust has settled, I think most people believe Starcraft 2 will be a dud.  Myself included.

I'm inclined to believe the Bioware MMO will be some kind of sci-fi title; the void is still gaping in that genre since Blizz isnt going to run with World of Starcraft and Perp. is tanking with STO.  Perhaps Blizz knew this and that's why they werent going ahead with it.  Then there's also Tabula Rasa, which steals a bit of the sci-fi market as it is.  And remember, much of Blizz's staff is working on WoW expansions, not new games. (aside from starcraft)

Speaking strictly for myself, I've almost universally preferred single-player content to online content.  Starcraft, in particular, was no fun at all for me online.  And for personal reasons, I avoid MMOs like the plague.  So I'm pretty excited for Starcraft 2, and would most likely not buy any kind of World of Starcraft or World of Diablo game.   Unless, of course, it came with cake.

Also: Ghost, as I recall, was supposed to be an FPS.

Starcraft Ghost? 3rd Person Action, I believe. You don't model a chick like that and then make it first person. It's a waste of time.

Yeah, pretty sure Ghost was 3PS with stealth elements. It's too hard to do a FPS with stealth elements since you can't really see what you need to see.

Despite (imo) RTS games being a much lesser draw than they were 5 years ago, Starcraft 2 won't tank. There are millions worldwide who want to see the SP and MP aspects of this game. However, if Blizzard doesn't see that (again imo) RTS games have moved away from being slow moving resource crunching games to faster moving battles, I think they won't have the success they are aiming for.

That said: World of Starcraft would blow the sales of Starcraft 2 out of the water, imo.

In my earlier post, I forgot about the World of Diablo concept. It's too close to WoW for Blizzard to do and not be seen as completely derivative.

I seriously doubt SC2 will tank and I for one am looking forward to playing it. 

Seems like Blizzard would have a ton to gain from cranking out a starcraft MMO utilizing WoW's game engine before it becomes too outdated. 

SC2 wont tank at release... quite the contrary, they'll make beaucoup dollars off of box sales I'm sure.  That doesnt mean the game wont tank;  I just dont think another RTS rehash of an old game is something that cool.  Besides that, the vids. and info. I've seen of it arent that compelling.  I'm looking forward to playing it as well, but I doubt I'll be doing-so for very long.  Such is the life for most RTSs these days - even the good ones.

Thief

I prefer the slower-paced games myself.  C&C III and Ages of Empires kick my ass.  I don't want playing against the computer to be like playing against a Korean 13 year-old, that's what online content is for.

Naeg. I can still hop into an EBStop and buy a SC battle chest. This game is older than some of the gamers playing it now.

You make it first person if you can look down at boobies.

Hah.

Gonzo FPS.

End boss is a tentacle monster.

:D

I heard there will be cake for us once Mercs 2 ships.

Who has two thumbs and called it?

I'll give you a hint:

(http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/8156/thisguyrt4.jpg)

I assume this is what you are talking about schild:

Atari Announce Restructuring (http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/15088/Atari-Announces-Restructuring/)

Hello article that neglects to mention that the CEO quit. And that the restructuring will probably lead to DEATH. >_< Well ok, maybe not death. But an Acclaim like death. A company that just doesn't matter anymore.

Atari hasn't mattered in over 20 years.

Mattered to Bioware and a few other companies. As they supposedly were a decent publisher to work with.

Maybe they'll be the new Atlus?

Nope. NISA is the new Atlus. Atlus is dicking around with DS games, though they have FES, Riviera, and Baroque coming down the pipe. As well as a few *other* things.

Atari hasn't mattered in over 20 years.
[/quote]
Mattered to Bioware and a few other companies. As they supposedly were a decent publisher to work with.
[/quote]

This surprises me. Mostly because the games I've bought from Atari have invariably ended up shitty shit shit and/or bugged to hell.   

Lol NWN.

I thought "Atari" was Infogrames, anyway.

It is.  Apparently the talk in the streets is its Infogrames in the US so if/when it fucks up the original company is still fine.

By "a few other things" are you referring to Spectral Force 3 coming to the U.S. (having been released in last year in Japan on the 360) and Operation Darkness which both just got announced for the 360?

There's some more PS2 stuff as well.

I love the sound of Operation Darkness (from Gamespot (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6183068.html?action=convert&om_clk=latestnews&tag=latestnews;title;2)):