Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Morfiend on August 05, 2004, 03:57:45 PM We knew it would start. (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=178191&p=1#post178191)
Blizzard hasjust announced the cut of one of the first major game systems. The Hero Class. We knew they would have to start cutting stuff at some point. Also, this brings a little more credance to the rumor that Vivendi is pushing Blizzard to Freeze code by October and have a November release. Laught it up schild. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: HRose on August 05, 2004, 04:22:33 PM Wonderful choice. No jedis in WoW, please.
EDIT: I've read the thing. Yes, it doesn't look good. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: jpark on August 05, 2004, 05:02:05 PM My understanding is that Bill Roper and Blizzard North left when they found out Vivendi was in discussion with Microsoft for the sale of Blizzard. The deal did not go through - but the damage was done - and Roper and North left Blizzard.
So... what is the speculation on the movtivation behind this code freeze? Is it to improve Vivendi abysmal quarterly performance (not by realized revenue, but my meeting milestones) or to prep Blizzard up for sale? Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: geldonyetich on August 05, 2004, 05:57:58 PM We probably haven't seen the last of the hero class. I imagine it'd get implemented some time later when most of the players are in the end game and just begging for a reason to grind. However, it's not really neccessary to focus on the end game when people are just starting out.
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Rasix on August 05, 2004, 06:04:44 PM This is just standard MMOG development thinking. Really, we've seen this in just about every level based release to date. Dark Age thought no one would be taking relic keeps as early as they were; EQ has never had their end game raids ready by the time people were ready to take them on. But both dev teams thought they had ample time to just add them in later before people got too high.
There's some problems with this approach. A) Your content doesn't get sufficient testing before going live. You wasted the opportunity to test this when you had an army of fanbois eager to do it for free. And B) swarms of people will hit the end game while you're pulling people off feature X to get the bugs squashed that are popping up live or to fix some crucial imbalance or what not. A lot of people end up standing around holding their dicks waiting for you to deliver on your promises. This is bad for your reputation, but people don't really quit over either issue. Just par for the course. At least WoW is taking their history lessons to heart. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 05, 2004, 06:33:33 PM Honestly I'm not all that upset. I'm enjoying the hell out of WoW and not sitting there wondering if the fun will start when I reach the mythical endgame.
I figured they'd have to cut some stuff, my guess is PvP related stuff will also be moved to after release. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Krakrok on August 05, 2004, 06:37:26 PM Quote from: jpark My understanding is that Bill Roper and Blizzard North left when they found out Vivendi was in discussion with Microsoft for the sale of Blizzard. The deal did not go through - but the damage was done - and Roper and North left Blizzard. Odd. I'd consider Microsoft the lesser of the two evils. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 05, 2004, 06:43:32 PM Quote from: Krakrok Quote from: jpark My understanding is that Bill Roper and Blizzard North left when they found out Vivendi was in discussion with Microsoft for the sale of Blizzard. The deal did not go through - but the damage was done - and Roper and North left Blizzard. Odd. I'd consider Microsoft the lesser of the two evils. Vivendi is among the worst thing ever to happen to the computer gaming industry. Microsoft, despite my early fears, has been pretty good for the most part. Their worst sin is trying to make everything in their games revolve around some technology of theirs. (Using the zone to log into MMOs for instance) Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Glamdring on August 05, 2004, 07:14:20 PM For some reason one of the posts in that thread struck my jealousy cord.
Quote Besides, if I got a Hero class char just before release and it got wiped when release came... Well, I'd be a bit put out, to put it mildly Do beta testers get to keep their characters at launch? Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: jpark on August 05, 2004, 09:56:58 PM Quote from: Krakrok Odd. I'd consider Microsoft the lesser of the two evils. The explanation I heard was that the issue was not so much who the potential buyer was (Microsoft) but that such discusssions involving the sale of Blizzard occurred without the knowledge of Blizzard management. It would be interesting to know the timing - did they leave after they heard about the deal and its collapse or during negotiations? Beyond the "code freeze" I wonder if the recent exp change also reflects new "influence" on the direction of WoW developement (Vivendi pressure). "First Call" notes used by investment analysts that be helpful on this issue. I have still have some contacts in that industry, but that would require a favor to get recent comments on a public company. If anyone here is on the investment side I would appreciate it if you could peruse the First Call notes on Vivendi: 1. Do analysts see Blizzard impacting the company's stock? 2. The timeline of events mentioned above 3. Analyst estimates of WoW release date and if that has been revised this past month or so. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: stray on August 05, 2004, 11:22:11 PM Have any of you in beta hit max lvl yet? How long does it take (on average)? And, more importantly, is it boring to get there?
Seems like the only people in that thread are catasses and are already twiddling their thumbs...Fuck 'em. If Blizzard is delaying a feature so they can finish up on 1-60 content, I don't see the problem. Sounds more like COH than it does SWG. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: eldaec on August 06, 2004, 12:46:16 AM Unless I'm missing something - all the link says is
Quote After achieving the maximum level in the game, players will be able try to become a Hero Class. Becoming a Hero will be very difficult and arduous, since you can only become a Hero until after maximum level, we do not plan to implement Hero Classes until after all of the game content is completed. ... Hero classes will be attainable only after max. level is achieved, and attaining Hero-class status will be extremely challenging From this hero classes are just another set of levels. Not knowing how long the existing levels will take, or how interesting they are/are not makes it somewhat difficult to care about the announcement of more levels or of not having more levels after all. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Soukyan on August 06, 2004, 04:44:01 AM Quote from: geldonyetich We probably haven't seen the last of the hero class. I imagine it'd get implemented some time later when most of the players are in the end game and just begging for a reason to grind. However, it's not really neccessary to focus on the end game when people are just starting out. Nope, we certainly have not seen the last of it. Just as AC2's Hero system was releaesd post-launch, so too will Blizzard's be. The powerlevelers will max out in about a month or two and begin the bitching about no character development after you attain the top level (irony?). But then again, everything I've heard about the game so far has pretty much been just that the quests are great fun, so the loss of the Hero system should not detract from the game. Also, I'd hope that if they're going to let beta testers keep characters, they would do a 3 day headstart like CoH did. Maybe not do all the pre-order folks, but definitely give the beta testers a little "gift". Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: El Gallo on August 06, 2004, 07:26:05 AM I am loving WoW. But this game will have no lifespan. Even moderately time starved powergamers will be capped in a few months. Unless they come up with TONS of good raid content -- and I mean tons as in "as much as the first 3 expansions of everquest" -- before release, that will be blown through pretty quickly too, because it is all instanced (they claim). Considering Blizzard's glacially slow expansion-generation rate, that will be chewed up and spat out long before the expansions come.
That leaves PvP as an endgame? Well, Blizzard's main talking head on the boards is the leader of a guild called "Kali Compton". That should give you a clue as to the juvenile fucktardery that will be WoW PvP. I can hear it now. PLAYER: Where's the high level content? BLIZZARD: See that player "MaZtAh~SlAyAH~69LOL" over there? That's your high level content. This is another reason they should never have gone no-NDA though. I hope I am wrong though. The low-mid game rocks. EDIT: I am pretty sure they have said several times the beta testers will get no edge, but may get a gift that does not affect play (like a cool shirt or something I guess). I am pretty hazy on that though. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: jpark on August 06, 2004, 07:45:08 AM Quote from: El Gallo I am loving WoW. But this game will have no lifespan. Even moderately time starved powergamers will be capped in a few months. Unless they come up with TONS of good raid content -- and I mean tons as in "as much as the first 3 expansions of everquest" -- before release, that will be blown through pretty quickly too, because it is all instanced (they claim). Considering Blizzard's glacially slow expansion-generation rate, that will be chewed up and spat out long before the expansions come. Unless they capitulate and go for an experience point curve reminiscent of EQ to greatly slow the leveling... or make the death penalty an experience point penalty... Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: kaid on August 06, 2004, 07:48:54 AM I see this no different than swg cutting player cities at release. I have no doubt they will put the hero class back in at a later time but now they are working hard to finish up the level 1 to 60 game and get the hunters done. It takes a lot of work to do a single character class as shown by the hunters. Heros would have delayed release a long time no reason not to just get what they have out and do heros as a post expansion release.
kaid Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Alluvian on August 06, 2004, 11:54:59 AM Increasing the exp needs 4 fold to slow the gamers down will result in breaking the whole point of the game which I thought was leveling through questing. A level through questing game that uses written quests and not random quests will suffer from overly fast leveling because there is only time to make so much hand made content before launch within budget.
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: stray on August 06, 2004, 01:39:31 PM Quote Unless they come up with TONS of good raid content -- and I mean tons as in "as much as the first 3 expansions of everquest" ....Quote That leaves PvP as an endgame? I'm just pointing out the obvious, but shit man, EQ has had like 5+ years to get it right. What do you expect? Nobody can crank out that much content except the players themselves. So unless NWN2 becomes a full blown player run MMO, it isn't ever going to happen again. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 06, 2004, 02:10:19 PM I am level 46 right now with the level cap at 50. About 3-4 people in my guild are maxed. They spend their time farming loot and helping other people level and get mounts.
Leveling in WoW is the most fun I've had in any MMO period. To give you an idea I've played: UO, AC, AO, AC2,DAOC, SWG, COH and I'm pretty sure 1 or 2 others I've forgotten. What makes leveling in WoW fun is that you ALWAYS have something to do. My quest log is constantly full, in fact, I have to abandon alot of quests simply to make room for new ones that look interestings. Some of the quests are of the irritating "Collect X Woozits" variety but for the most part they're still fun. In any case, I think WoW will bore powergamers because they'll miss the point. They'll rush to get to the end because they're so used to the "End=fun" aspect. In WoW by contrast, I've had fun at every single level of the game. That's right no "I can't wait to hit max level so I can start having fun syndrome". Sure, there's a bit of the old "man I can't wait til I can get that piece of equipment" or "I want my mount now!" but in general that's seperate from "these low levels are boring". Another thing to note is that Blizzard has said that leveling will be slowed down somewhat, though not by a great amount. Blizzard also says they are holding content back for release, including entire "Raid zones". I've heard this quite a few times from many MMO publishers in the past so I'm taking that with a grain of salt for the moment. I'll be blunt. WoW in its current state would probably be released by most publishers. It would also be terribly fun. Blizzard is holding it back though for at least a few more months to finetune some stuff. I've finally found my game and barring one or two issues, it's the one I've been looking for ever since early UO.[/i] Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: CassandraR on August 06, 2004, 02:19:55 PM Overly slow leveling is the bane of my enjoyment of MMOs. I simply cannot focus all my attention on one character. I generally have 3-4 I play off and on and if I can't advance with them at a reasonable rate (80-120 hours to max level, not including gathering equipment, or alterent advancement schemes etc.) Then I quickly lose interest and stop playing. If there is any fun repeatable content at the top im the type that can stay there for a while though. Never understand why people race through a game and quit. If I actually get to the top I'll stay there for a while.
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: kaid on August 06, 2004, 02:20:24 PM My guess is once they finish the talent system and get hunters up and working and somewhat tested the game will be put gold and shipped. Not to surprising about the Hero thing frankly I am surprised we didn't hear they had decided that sooner. It was probably one of those SWG things where they were hoping against hope that they could get it done before release.
kaid Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Morfiend on August 08, 2004, 11:10:41 AM Quote from: El Gallo That leaves PvP as an endgame? Well, Blizzard's main talking head on the boards is the leader of a guild called "Kali Compton". That should give you a clue as to the juvenile fucktardery that will be WoW PvP. Actually, their name is "Kali Swarm" they are a fairly dominant allaince guild on the PVP server. His character name is Windy. Kali Swarm like any large MMOG guild have some major assholes, and also some cool people. I was questing (lvl 30 at the time) and ran in to a lvl 50 (capped) Gnome Mage from Kali Swarm. In mose cases this would mean a quick trip to the graveyard, and a short corpse run. Instead, she talked with me a ffew minutes, and let me live, as long as I didnt kill any of the Alliance factioned mobs right there. (little bit of RP). As to leveling speed. My main is a lvl 36 Undead Warrior, I have 4 days and 20 hours /played right now. My bro who was level 50 had about 15 days played. The cap at release will be 60. Now, you have to take in to account that we play on the PVP server, and some times it can be a LOT slower to level there, due to the other faction raiding towns or stopping you from questing in certen areas. A bunch of people on the boards are crying for slower leveling. I hope they dont do this for two reasions. 1) If you slow down leveling much, it will be possible to run out of quests, leading to spawn camping and shit like that, that sucks in MMOGs and you dont have to do in WoW. 2) if they slow down leveling, it could get REALLY slow on the PVP server. I did a /suggest just yesterday, that they should double the exp for quests that take place in contested areas on the pvp server. (Contested being open PVP zones). Fun factor. I agree with riggs. (i thinkit was riggs) who said endgame != fun, in WoW, you are having fun all the time. Even more so that CoH. Take CoH, give all the zones a VERY distinct feel, and make the quests WAY WAY WAY more interesting, and you have a base of how WoW plays. If any one here in the beta is PVP/Horde, send me a /t Morvant, I am in a really cool guild if any one wants to be guilded. EDIT. Code Freeze. They have been talking about a code freeze a month and a half to two months before release, just to do bug fixes and balance tweeks. I hope they do this, as CoH did this and they had a lot more bug free release than say, Shadowbane or SWG who both didnt code freeze untill 2 days before release. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: kaid on August 11, 2004, 07:51:07 AM Unfortunatly until they finish their talent system and get the hunters in and tested there really is no way for them to code freeze at this point without looking really ugly with imbalances at release.
Code freezes are a very good idea but you have to get the basic feature set in before you can freeze it. kaid Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Soukyan on August 11, 2004, 08:08:52 AM Quote from: Morphiend As to leveling speed. My main is a lvl 36 Undead Warrior, I have 4 days and 20 hours /played right now. My bro who was level 50 had about 15 days played. The cap at release will be 60. 15 days to level 50 might be tolerable, but I think it's still pushing it a bit. It took me 30 days /played to get my first DAoC character to 50 and that actually took me over a year, almost a year and a half of casual play. The time played on your character is more acceptable to me, but it might mean that the level grind post 40 gets sickening, in which case, meh. Why the need for exponential increases and diminishing rewards? Anyhow, a comfortable pacing for me would be about 10 days played to reach level 60. That would take me 4 to 6 months to "finish". While I'm not even fond of that slow because I would prefer to be able to max out a character for a bunch of different classes to experience them all, I understand that's something that MMOG developers just won't do. But most players wouldn't even like my 10 days played to level 60 preference either. I guess a lot of gamers just have an excess of disposable time. For the developers out there, I've got lots of disposable income for those who would like to cater to me. ;) Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Morfiend on August 11, 2004, 10:35:27 AM Quote from: Soukyan stuff From what I have been hearing on the forums, the avarage /played for a lvl 50 character is around 10-12 days. That is mostly on the allaince side, and it has been proven and stated by Blizzard that the allaince side can level a lot faster. They are planning on brinning the horde side up to par with the alliance. As of yet no one knows what level past 50 is like, but the next patch that raises th elevel cap to 55, should be out some time this week. Also Hunters are to be released, as well as a major update to PVP, and hopefully the Horde/Alliance level speed. This is supposed to be a MAJOR patch. I think if every thing goes well, they will have maybe one more patch before the code freeze. That is IMO why it has taken so long for this last patch to be released. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: El Gallo on August 11, 2004, 10:35:49 AM RE: Kali Comption/Swarm. If you go to their website, the guild appears to be named "Kali Compton" but they do use "Kali Swarm" in WoW. Either one translates into English as "I am a fucking moron" though. I am sure they have some decent players, but the fact that the biggest Blizzard mouth on the official boards runs a guild with that name does not inspire confidence. Not to mention the favoritism accusations that are already all over the place. Anyway, I am going to steer away from WoW PvE, both because I am not much of a PvPer and because of the kind of people I think will be attracted to a PvP game with Blizzard's name on it :)
RE: Content. I play horde/PvE, and am afraid of running out of content before they can make an expansion. Then again, we haven't seen any of the PvE endgame stuff yet. I usually play 10-20 hours a week, depending on weekends, so YMMV. Slow levelling does not bother me as long as I have enough fun content. The fact that some guy in some zone I have never been to has a sword of asswhoopage does not bother me as long as I have enough fun content. Hell, I had fun most of the time in EQ when I was uncapped, and the un-fun thing about that period was not "damn, I wish I was capped" but rather "damn, I have run out of fun things to do at this level." Content is king. RE: I am a fanboi whore with no dignity. This game is fun as hell, and was vastly more polished 2 months ago when I started betaing than Star Wars Galaxies was 4 months after it was released, when I quit. The low and mid game in WoW is about as functional and vastly more entertaining that EQs is, 5 years after its release. Sufficient content is literally the only long term fear I have about this game. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: HRose on August 11, 2004, 10:57:30 AM I'm making a list with the *systems* still missing from the game. And not a wish list, just what they announced.
You'll be scared. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Soukyan on August 11, 2004, 11:19:40 AM Quote from: HRose I'm making a list with the *systems* still missing from the game. And not a wish list, just what they announced. You'll be scared. That's exactly what I thought. Heh. Gotta keep the skepticism alive. And Morphiend, thanks for that info. I could deal with 10-12 days played to level 50, I suppose. As Gallo said, if I'm being entertained, it's all good. If I get to a level where I need to grind before I get my next dosage of entertainment, that's where the game would lose me. Thanks again. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Lum on August 11, 2004, 11:35:43 AM Quote from: El Gallo the guild appears to be named "Kali Compton" but they do use "Kali Swarm" in WoW. Either one translates into English as "I am a fucking moron" though. No, it's just history. Kali was the IPX emulator used to play Warcraft 2 over the Internet. Geoff Frazier, who goes by "Nebu" now, used to go by the nick "Shlonglor". He wrote the definitive Warcraft 2 strategy page and was one of the most famous War2 players on Kali (he beat me the 2 times we played). Blizzard hired him to work on their web site because, well, they wanted him to do what he did for Warcraft 2 for their other games. He's basically responsible for the Diablo 2 and Warcraft 3 strat guides on battle.net. And no, I'm not sticking up for him because I'm his Compton buddy or in his guild or anything like that. Just that for some of us old farts Kali wasn't just the Hindu goddess of death. You can get a pretty good idea for exactly how much of a gentle, caring person Nebu is from his FAQ. Thankfully, being gentle and caring isn't a requirement for working on MMOs, or I would have had to find a real job. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Nebu on August 11, 2004, 11:42:27 AM Quote from: Lum Geoff Frazier, who goes by "Nebu" now, used to go by the nick "Shlonglor". He wrote the definitive Warcraft 2 strategy page and was one of the most famous War2 players on Kali (he beat me the 2 times we played). Blizzard hired him to work on their web site because, well, they wanted him to do what he did for Warcraft 2 for their other games. He's basically responsible for the Diablo 2 and Warcraft 3 strat guides on battle.net. For clarification: I am not nor have I ever been this particular "Nebu". I am, however, the "Nebu" that used to be an area designer for several small but popular Diku muds "back in the day". Whoever the guy is, please have him tell all of those rabid WoW fanbois to quit dry humping me everytime I post somewhere. edit: spelling and punctuation wtfpwnd me Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Trippy on August 11, 2004, 12:55:08 PM Quote from: El Gallo RE: Kali Comption/Swarm. If you go to their website, the guild appears to be named "Kali Compton" but they do use "Kali Swarm" in WoW. Either one translates into English as "I am a fucking moron" though. At least they are upfront about being a Zerg guild. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: El Gallo on August 11, 2004, 12:57:44 PM It's almost like you can't make snarky, uninformed one-liners around here anymore.
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Trippy on August 11, 2004, 01:06:20 PM Quote from: Morphiend As of yet no one knows what level past 50 is like, but the next patch that raises th elevel cap to 55, should be out some time this week. Also Hunters are to be released, as well as a major update to PVP, and hopefully the Horde/Alliance level speed. This is supposed to be a MAJOR patch. I think if every thing goes well, they will have maybe one more patch before the code freeze. That is IMO why it has taken so long for this last patch to be released. I think you mean "feature freeze" not "code freeze". In any case, I seriously hope you are wrong about that. Only two of the classes have their talents in place and it's going to take more than one more patch after this upcoming one to bring the classes into even a resemblance of balance in my opinion. Edit: Fixed the quoting Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: HaemishM on August 11, 2004, 01:07:02 PM Any guild with the word "Compton" in its name in a fantasy-themed MMOG deserves all the derision it can get, whether they are nice to their mother or not.
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 11, 2004, 03:53:16 PM Talents all need to be in before a code freeze can take place. Right now only warriors and mages have them. Rogues and Priests are next. Probably after that will be Paladins and Shamans. Then finally Warlocks and Druids. Hunters last of all because they'll be new.
After all of that and fixes to make griefing harder and such they'll probably code freeze. All I know is I'm having a hell of a good time. Got my character to 48 now, will hit 49 tonight or tomorrow and have 2 tradeskills almost up to the artisan level. (Equvialent of Master in SWG). WoW is it for me. I might give EQ2 a whirl, but really, you guys are scared of B.net fanbois ( a concern I think is blown out of proportion, they're the group whining about having to pay), I'm concerned about Sony having the capability of making a good MMO. EQ never really impressed me. SWG was like being assraped by a Wookiee with cat hairs on his dick. I've watched the videos for EQ2 and the characters looked stiff and the combat looked boring and overly reliant on autoattack. After playing a warrior with 4 taskbars needed (battle stance, defense stance, crafting, and bezerk stance) I am a little leery of an EQ-clone warrior who stands their bored out of their minds. I only have one complaint about high-end WoW play right now and that is that it is turning into the "Perfect group" model. One warrior. Two priests. Two Mages. That said, a group of 4, me included, took on the hardest Mob currently in the game and won last night. Group was a warrior (me), a priest, a mage, and a druid. So maybe it's the mentality of the players (alot of whom come from EQ) more than the content itself that is forcing this group dynamic. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: schild on August 11, 2004, 06:19:32 PM You're level 48 in a beta? Heh. I wouldn't even bother playing after the beta. Way to wear what little content they might have!
Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: geldonyetich on August 11, 2004, 06:25:01 PM Quote from: Riggswolf I've watched the videos for EQ2 and the characters looked stiff and the combat looked boring and overly reliant on autoattack. After playing a warrior with 4 taskbars needed (battle stance, defense stance, crafting, and bezerk stance) I am a little leery of an EQ-clone warrior who stands their bored out of their minds. Me rikey sounds of this rong time. Pointless eastern derogatroy statement aside, it's going to come down to the interactiveness of the combat mechanic to get me to decide between FFXI, EQ2, and Worlds of Warcraft. (Yes, I'm playing Star Wars Galaxies here, but obviously it's not for the gameplay so much as the broad reaching consiquences.) (City of Heroes also has very good interactive combat, but I found the soloability of it actually shot it's social interaction in the shoot.) EQ2 does look like it will at least have multiple mob engagement, where EQ1 you either had an extra warrior to stick on your adds, were capable of mezzing them, or were dead meat. I'll get my chance to decide for myself. WoW will eventually have an open beta, unless they change their mind. EQ2 I'll get a shot at prior to release, with any luck. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 11, 2004, 07:29:46 PM Quote from: schild You're level 48 in a beta? Heh. I wouldn't even bother playing after the beta. Way to wear what little content they might have! Lol. I have seen maybe 1/3-1/2 of the world. I've dropped alot of quests because I've outleveled them. Just on the alliance side I've seen very, very little of the Night Elf content, maybe 1/3 of the dwarf content, and perhaps 2/3 of the human content if that. I've seen none of the horde content at all. You don't want to play WoW in the first place so why make comments about if you hit Level X in the beta you'd not play retail? Yes. I'm level 48. In one class. On one race. And your point is? The "little content" comment is so off base I don't know where to start. WoW at this point has more content than most games launch with. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: MrHat on August 11, 2004, 07:33:30 PM Quote from: Riggswolfe Lol. I have seen maybe 1/3-1/2 of the world. I've dropped alot of quests because I've outleveled them. Can you go back and do them? Will the difficulty of the quest scale w/ your level if you do? Edit=Quotes are hard. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Trippy on August 11, 2004, 09:13:34 PM Quote from: MrHat Can you go back and do them? If you cancel a quest you can go back and do it later though some quests are bugged right now and won't let you. Quote Will the difficulty of the quest scale w/ your level if you do? No, it's not like CoH's indoor missions where the mobs (except bosses) spawn at a level relative to the level of the mission owner. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: AOFanboi on August 12, 2004, 06:56:08 AM Quote from: Trippy No, it's not like CoH's indoor missions where the mobs (except bosses) spawn at a level relative to the level of the mission owner. Well, non-named bosses spawn at relative level as well, but keep in mind that a level X Lieutenant cons as a level X+1 Minion, and a level X Boss as a Level X + 2 Minion. That is, if the Minions con white, Lieutenants will con yellow and Bosses orange, even if their stated level number is the same. This is apparently to account for higher hit points and abilities. There is also the problem with front- and rear-loaded missions, where the first mobs will either be much lower or higher than "normal", and the other way around at the end of the mission. But what do I care, I've canceled anyway. :) Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: El Gallo on August 12, 2004, 08:06:20 AM Quote from: Riggswolfe That said, a group of 4, me included, took on the hardest Mob currently in the game and won last night. Group was a warrior (me), a priest, a mage, and a druid. So maybe it's the mentality of the players (alot of whom come from EQ) more than the content itself that is forcing this group dynamic. I have never fought it myself, but have a hard time believing you took out a 60+ mob like Razelikh or even Antu'sul with 4 people and a level 48 warrior. Maybe if you abuse the hell out of certain soon-to-be-nerfed tactics. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Morfiend on August 12, 2004, 09:14:14 PM Quote from: schild You're level 48 in a beta? Heh. I wouldn't even bother playing after the beta. Way to wear what little content they might have! Because unlike other game, that are work to get a little content. WoW is fun. It ius enjoyable to play, the same sort of way a singleplayer RPG is fun to play. That is really all I can say. WoW is fun, not a second job. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 13, 2004, 03:21:01 AM Quote from: El Gallo I have never fought it myself, but have a hard time believing you took out a 60+ mob like Razelikh or even Antu'sul with 4 people and a level 48 warrior. Maybe if you abuse the hell out of certain soon-to-be-nerfed tactics. Combat drinking? Yep. That we did. It was EXTREMELY close a time or two and we all used our various long recharge emergency type abilities but we pulled it off. Mostly due to the druid's player. He told me literally where to stand. And no, it wasn't a 60+ mob, it was Eranikus in the Sunken Temple. (Which to my knowledge is the hardest mob currently in the game. I could be wrong though). Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 13, 2004, 03:23:33 AM Quote from: Morphiend Because unlike other game, that are work to get a little content. WoW is fun. It ius enjoyable to play, the same sort of way a singleplayer RPG is fun to play. That is really all I can say. WoW is fun, not a second job. Morphiend hit the nail on the head. It's just...fun. Sure there is only a limited selection of quests, but they are saying they'll do some kind of monthly update (akin to AC). Whether or not they do remains to be seen but I hope so. Also, there are interesting things in game like the Dark Portal (which I saw today before being chased away by a small group of high level demons warriors). Supposedly in the live game a large group of warlock players can open that portal and go to...umm..damn forgot the name of the world. Someone more up on their lore can fill it in. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Soukyan on August 13, 2004, 05:00:37 AM Quote from: Riggswolfe Quote from: Morphiend Because unlike other game, that are work to get a little content. WoW is fun. It ius enjoyable to play, the same sort of way a singleplayer RPG is fun to play. That is really all I can say. WoW is fun, not a second job. Morphiend hit the nail on the head. It's just...fun. Sure there is only a limited selection of quests, but they are saying they'll do some kind of monthly update (akin to AC). Whether or not they do remains to be seen but I hope so. Also, there are interesting things in game like the Dark Portal (which I saw today before being chased away by a small group of high level demons warriors). Supposedly in the live game a large group of warlock players can open that portal and go to...umm..damn forgot the name of the world. Someone more up on their lore can fill it in. Sounds like EQ planes. "Unlock" it or port up or... you get the idea. Interesting, but not terribly different. Not that I was expecting something different. I think the fun in WoW is coming more from the fact that it's a new world, new lore and new original areas to explore. It's that feeling we all had when we first played EQ. As to the monthly updates that are being "promised", well, let's just hope they hold up to it. I can remember when EQ promised the same and I rarely, if ever, saw an event in that game. But then again, I shouldn't compare to that because Blizzard is a different company. Monthly content takes a fair amount of work. I hope they have a crew specifically for it. Then again, the monthly updates could just be tiny. Bah. Too many unknowns. Will just have to wait for release and then hold off on playing for 6 months to see how it all pans out. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: El Gallo on August 13, 2004, 08:11:35 AM Yeah, there are tougher mobs than Eriankus, Razelikh and that drake in the blasted lands come to mind. Have not read about anyone killing that drake yet. Anyway, that's a nitpick, nice kill on Eriankus :)
New info-dump here, not much new or suprising though: Quote http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=197451&p=1#post197451 We were surprised to find out that some of you still had questions about the game. Just kidding; we weren’t really surprised. The dev. team is working hard to prepare the next beta patch, but we did manage to snag some time with EnoYls, who provided the bulk of the answers below. Thanks go out to everyone who helped put together this Q&A, and thanks to you all for bringing up some good topics for discussion. What should players expect in the World of Warcraft end-game? That is, is there an end-game for casual gamers as well as power gamers, small guilds, groups of friends, large guilds, etc.? New content will be continuously added into the game and players can always expect to see new events and things for them to do and achieve in the game. Players that do eventually hit the level cap will have the option to participate in a variety of end-game content, such as: Individual players can work toward a hero class. The PvP System will be more advanced than it is today -- including the addition of rewards. Guilds will have an extensive amount of raid content available to them with many zones and "uber" bosses to defeat. How much of the world, including dungeons, is unlocked and available to testers today? What is the end-of-beta goal that the developers want to see for released/tested content? With the next patch, we will be raising the level cap to level 55 and we will be opening up the corresponding zones and dungeons to accommodate characters of that level. We have almost finished all the adventuring zones for characters up to level 60, and we only have a few more outdoor zones and dungeons to go. We are also adding "raid" content to the game (epic encounters that take several groups to defeat); however, while we intend to have a great deal of this content, we will only beta test a small amount and reserve the rest for discovery by players on release. Will there be any special areas in the game that require a lot of effort before they can be entered? Yes, there is actually a full spectrum of areas that will challenge players and require them to exert some (or a lot of) effort in order to gain access to them. By "full spectrum" we mean that we intend to have areas that are challenging for casual gamers and some that will even test the hardcore "power gamers'" abilities. The Scarlet Monastery is an example of a quest area that requires a small amount of effort to unlock, as players merely need to find a key to gain access to the more advanced parts of the Monastery. Conversely, opening the Dark Portal is an example of a very difficult and epic quest that would require lots of effort on the part of many Warlocks to complete. Does Blizzard have a team for designing world events, role-playing content, etc.? We do have a world event team that will be in charge of maintaining and adding to the calendar of events that will span across the world. World of Warcraft is structured to have world events, contests and other social events regularly so that events can be experienced by all players. The event system, and the world event team that will run it, will ensure that players will always have something to do beyond the quests and activities that players participate in on a day-to-day basis. We don't want to tip our hand just yet, but you can look forward to celebrating real-world and Azeroth-based holidays, world events like having a Human zeppelin raid The Crossroads, worldwide fishing contests and much, much more! What is the target average number of players going to be on retail servers? The concurrency rate is currently planned to be around 2000-2500 players at peak times. There won't be a maximum amount of players that are allowed to "live" on a server, but this is the amount of characters we expect to actually be in the world at any given time. Will there be a role-playing server at retail (one that will have a more strict role-playing and behavior etiquette)? We do not currently have plans to incorporate this in retail, but we'll continue to evaluate demand and see if it warrants the creation of role-playing servers. Will there be more options for character customization in the future -- to include, more faces, hairstyles, maybe weight/height, and even some rare armor recipes that have variable ingredients to modify the color (different dyes)? We don't have a significant number of additions in mind, but we will occasionally be adding new hairstyles, different faces and other customization details to the character-creation screen as we get closer to launch. As for apparel and armor, there will be a very large variety of pieces that can be collected, and we're continually adding new pieces, but there will not be an option to dye armor to change its color. Will maximum guild size be limited in World of Warcraft? Has this size been decided yet? We're still evaluating whether or not we want to put a cap on the amount of members any one guild can have. Will there be secret and hard-to-find pets and mounts that are rarer than others? Yes. =) Will there be pet and mount emotes? It's not likely that we will be able to add this in time for launch, but it is on our wish list of things that we'd like to add as time permits. Is the skill system going to be revised in the future? Yes, you'll see changes to the skill system not in the upcoming patch, but in the one after that. Will letters sent in the mail system be able to hold more than one item/stack? This is actually one of the topics that we're discussing, as a number of players have brought it to our attention. We don't have an answer to this question yet, but we do feel that it is a positive idea that we want to incorporate into the game -- one of a few "polish" tweaks that would be a positive addition to the overall feel of the game. It may or may not make it into the game in time for ship, but we do encourage players to send more feedback about changes like this that they'd really like to see. Will there be top hats to go with the tuxes already in game? They haven't been made yet, but we plan on getting them into the game soon, hopefully by launch. Are there going to be any rules put in place against corpse camping? We're currently discussing what sort of polices and procedures we would like to incorporate in the game to keep instances of griefing like this at a minimum. We'll continue to observe and balance how the PvP aspect of the game works, and we will incorporate changes in the game or policies as needed. Are more riddle/puzzle quests coming? We do plan on adding a few more riddle/puzzle quests into the game, in addition to the ones that are already available, such as Cortello's Riddle or some of the other quests like Captain Sander’s Treasure Map and Sweet Amber. If you would like to see more quests of this type, or any other type, please be sure to /suggest them. With there be more weather effects than the random lightning by the Dark Portal? Yes, we do plan on adding more of these types of effects. This is on our list of things to do, but we don't have an ETA at this time. Will items produced by the Horde trade-skillers look different from those created by Alliance members when the final product is released? Trade skill items with the same name will not be different across factions, but there already are (and will be more) items that are specific to the Alliance and the Horde. For example, Horde players cannot make Ironforge Breastplates, and Alliance players cannot make any of the Barbaric Iron Armor pieces. Will we be able to untrain talents in the retail product? In the upcoming beta patch, we plan to allow characters to untrain in talents freely in order to better help balance the talents. However, we feel that investing in talents is a commitment that defines and distinguishes one's character and should not be allowed to be changed freely. Although we do not have a structure for how this will work in retail as of yet, we do intend to have a penalty to prevent players from talent-hopping to suit situations on the fly. Title: And So It Begins (WoW Releated) Post by: Riggswolfe on August 13, 2004, 10:43:56 PM Quote from: El Gallo Yeah, there are tougher mobs than Eriankus, Razelikh and that drake in the blasted lands come to mind. Have not read about anyone killing that drake yet. Anyway, that's a nitpick, nice kill on Eriankus :) Well, as I said in my reply to Schild's sarcasm, I've not come close to seeing everything in the game. |