f13.net

Remakes of classic movies almost never end well.  Especially when the classic in question - My Sassy Girl, quite possibly the greatest romantic comedy of all time - only came out 5 years ago and is still wildly popular on DVD.  But just like with Ringu, Shall We Dance?, and so many others, someone in a suit somewhere decided that the lack of white stars in a popular movie needed to be rectified.

End result?

We're getting an American remake of My Sassy Girl (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0404254/) next year.

If I were Jeon Ji-Hyeon, I'd be pissed off.  They already remade one of her recent films, Il Mare, into the forgettable The Lake House.  Given that they replaced her male lead with Keanu fucking Reeves, it's anybody's guess who they'll put into this one.

Do yourself a favor; if you liked My Sassy Girl, avoid this remake like the plague, and track down the lesser-seen but still good prequel, Windstruck, instead.

Last years remake of Wonka.  Simply. Did not. Need. To be made.

I thought it wasn't technically a remake, but a reinterpretation of the novel.  Granted, there were still singing and dancing Oompa Loompas, but yeah, that's the talk I heard about it when it came out.

I thought the original Ring was pretty good. Decent cinematography. The Ring 2 sucked.

Wonka? The girl and I were stunned in a perpetual state of wtf (though we only watched about fifteen minutes of it on HBO). The Oompa Loompa songs were atrocious, and the rest was completely unnecessary.

It's been on HBO the last week or two... I just to watch it every time it's on but it's just... painful.

The "re-imagining" of Willy Wonka is a crime against humanity. It is cinematic VD. Tim Burton needs to be flayed, for this, Sleepy Hollow and that shittastic Planet of the Apes. How do you fuck up Planet of the Apes?

The fog.

The remake was brain hemmoragingly bad.

I'm not looking forward to the Oldboy remake.

Definitely not looking forward to the Sunset Blvd remake.

Then again, some remakes of classics can be pretty good (Cape Fear, Manchurian Candidate, Dawn of the Dead, the Fly).

This remake has been in the works for more than a year.  Sassy Girl was a good (I don't know about great) movie, but a subtitled movie is almost never going to be a big market success here.  Somebody thinks they can make a lot of money remaking it for American audiences and they're probably right.   :-P

Tim Burton had a couple good movies back in the eighties, but otherwise pretty much just sucks ass.

I liked the Wonka remake.  It was more contemporary than they older version and had a very different feel to it.  Besides, I always thought the Wonka in the book was a pedophile anyway.  My daughter also prefered it to the Gene Wilder version. 

I agree with the theme of the thread though.  Most remakes just can't hold a candle to the original. The remake of Sabrina was horrible.  I think meet Joe Black was a reasonable exception.  I enjoyed the remake more than the original.

I only recently saw the Wonnka remake, and I enjoyed it. Having never been a fan of the old movie, and having not seen it for probably 15 years or so, this was basically like watching a new movie. Some of it was not so great, but over all it kept me entertained for 2 hours.

How about the Godzilla remake. Yuk.

The Godzilla remake was art compared to the anal wart that the Wonka or Apes remakes were.

Seth MacFarlane put it best when talking about remakes:

"Maybe they'll just put Johnny Depp in it and call it gold like they've done with every other fucking classic movie out there."

Put me in the (apparently) small group that liked the Wonka remake. Depp's Willy Wonka was creepy and came across as mildly dangerous and borderline perverted which fits my general impression from the book much better than Gene Wilder's version. Oddly I like the Wilder version better though. I chalk it up to nostalgia.

As for Planet of the Apes, I never thought the original was all that great so wasn't shocked that the remake was so-so. Godzilla should never have been made most likely.

The Fly, as someone else mentioned earlier, is a damn good remake and stands as an example that it can be done right sometimes.

Godzilla could have been decent if it had been "Random Movie About Large Creature in City" and not tried to attach it to the Godzilla name. Specially since the monster didnt look anything like Godzilla.

As is "The Thing".

Man, I hope no one does B.O.C. version of the song over, one of the best songs by them.

There have been 8 versions of the mighty lizard, plus three more if you count the cartoon, zilla (1998), and the Marvel comic.  Trying to keep up with the big Z in all his films is a headache.

The Depp version was good, you're not in a small group.  You're just stuck on a forum with a bunch of geeks.  Geeks hate change. Oddly, there was a comic about just this bit yesterday. Enjoy. (http://www.pvponline.com/archive.php3?archive=20060905) Apply it to anything that gets bitched about in the 70-80's pop culture revival. 

Bitching that a remake of a movie (for kids!) that somehow raped your childhood is an old and tired act.  Hyperbole^10 since at this point in the thread the CGI Godzilla has been called 'art' to prove a point, despite being a shitty movie, not just a 'rape' of Godzilla.

They're remaking Oldboy?  Sigh.

Why is it that the only subtitled movies anyone will watch is guys with swords killing shit?  Reading ain't hard, and My Sassy Girl seems to be doing pretty good in America in DVD sales/rentals at least.

Apparently they're going to set this version in the Midwest, with Elisha Cuthbert as The Girl.  I sense a disaster in the making.  How can they do the hotel scenes when you're not in a locale with love hotels?


Credit where credit is due, though; much as I liked the original Willy Wonka, I think the remake is better.

While I haven't seen it yet I have bad feelings about the Wicker Man remake. Somehow I don't think a Nic Cage vehicle is really going to improve on the original in any way (and that's considering making it contemporary a good thing).

Ugh.  I have reservations about it because Neil Labutte is the director/screenwriter,  and I enjoy bad horror movies.  He likes to fuck with his audience just because he can.

Remakes aren't all bad.  The Thing and A Fistfull of Dollars (remake of Yojimbo).  There are some things just begging for a good remake,  like Omega Man (based on I am Legend, which is a badass book) which could be amazing with a good budget and cast.

The problem is that they don't take enough of the good ideas that had bad implementations and rework them.

Godzilla might have not sucked if there was more of what Godzilla normally does in it: smash a city and/or fight a giant space creature.  Instead I get a weak King-Kong-is-a-lizard... and Godzooki.  Fucking Godzooki.  I still cringe to think that it was so bad as to resurrect Toho from retirement in order to rectify the space-time continuum.

I'm sure Planet of the Apes was totally awesome when it was released.  I saw it during the 21st century, however, and it's OK.  Not awesome.  You know what sucks ape balls?  Beneath the Planet of the Apes.  Balls.

I enjoyed the recent Time Machine, as well as the Count of Monte Cristo.

Edit for picture of Godzooki hate.
(http://www.yegolev.com/images/onnotice.sidekicks.jpg)

There are good remakes, just people don't realize they are remakes because the originals aren't too good or popular. Just like book to move conversions - there are good one but usually not for the books you've actually read.

That's really the better strategy from an artistic standpoint - remake something that was neat but flawed. Remaking Planet of the Apes into a shitty action-fest with Marky Mark? Why bother?

Why do american studios even have the urge to badly remake perfectly good movies? I mean why for example remake something as stunningly good as "Der Himmel über Berlin" and, adding insult to injury, even cast fucking Nicolas Cage and Meg Ryan as leads? Why remake "flight of the phoenix" or "Oldboy" or "Poseidon Inferno" or one of all the other perfectly good films? Just dub them for christs sake.

I once saw an interview with the director of "city of angels" who basically said that they were remaking such films in order to dumb them down for the american audience because they "wouldn't get" those pesky foreign films otherwise. So every time such a film is released the american public is basically insulted by one of the film studios because they think people are too stupid to enjoy foreign films.

To get back to the topic. Most, if not all, remakes are very much superfluous and should be avoided like the plague especially if you have any kind of emotional attachment to the original.

Remakes are mostly bad.

However, I liked Burtons Wonka.  Mostly because it was about seventeen thousand times more faithful to the book and I liked what they did to Wonka.  He was never, ever, ever sane nor safe.

You get that the book is about torturing kids, right ?

What the hell is going on in this thread?

Charlie and the Chocolate Factory was awesome, as was Corpse Bride. Tim Burton has a bunch of really, really good movies. You people are all crazy   :-o

edit: ok finished reading the thread. There are sane people here after all.

Update: I haven't actually seen Il Mare, but I met a girl today who has and she told me it was a million times better than that Keanu Reeves shit.

I forgot The Thing? Damn. I must go stand in the corner like the Blair Witch kids now. I'm so ashamed. Hell I love that movie more than the Fly really.

You know, I never really considered The Thing to be much of a remake.  It expanded and improved so much it's almost its own man.

Just my opinion, of course.

Burton's Wonka was about Tim Burton creeping people out. Again, as if they hadn't seen his tired schtick sixteen billion times over. I've read Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. As a kid, I read the book, years before I ever saw the Gene Wilder movie. I don't recall anything about Wonka's father in the book, nor about Wonka wearing a Burton-esque BDSM headgear and braces. I don't recall rock-n-roll Oompa Loompas. The whole shitfest that is the Burton version is just disagreeable poop. It's the Corpse Bride for Wonka. It takes a perfectly good version of the book in Gene Wilder's film and turns it into Burton's masturbatory fantasies about creeping out "the mainstream."

Tim Burton is a talentless hack like Marilyn Manson. They have the same routine, and the same wasted ability.

I liked Sleepy Hollow, which I think Burton did.

Wonka never interested me so I never saw it. I didn't want to replace the already wonderful images the Wilder version put in my brain.

Ed Wood is a great movie. Big Fish is pretty good.

Among the many good things about them is that they're not rehashes of Beetlejuice and Edward Scissorhands (which were good as well....Just a bit played out).

Planet of the Apes definitely sucked, but I don't think it sucked by virtue of being "Burton-fied". It just sucked in general terms.

Both are based on the 1938 story "Who Goes There?" by John W. Campbell.  Of the two movies, the John Carpenter version is MUCH closer to the source material.

I usually agree with a lot of your reviews on movies, but in this case I disagree. Tim Burton has made some really great movies, some decently entertaining movies, and a few stinkers, but to call him a "Talentless Hack" is just sensasonalizm. You dont like his movies, fine, but a lot of people do. I have had many hours of happy movie watching from Tim Burton, and when it comes down to it, thats all I really want from a movie, keep me entertained.

Also, you might not like Marilyn Manson's music (I happen to enjoy it), but you have to give him credit for doing what he did and using the media and the publlic to really promote his albums.

Morphiend likes Marilyn Manson and Tim Burton?  It's like a goth fag fell into a suspended animation freezer in 1996 and was unthawed ten years later.

Tim Burton made Ed Wood and Beetlejuice. His ego made all of his other movies. Ed Wood would not have been half the movie it was without Depp and Landau; in fact, it would have been shit. I've always gotten the feeling that his movies would be about 20 times better were it not for his irrational need to rubber stamp the thing with his "wacky, look at me I'm so dark and twisted and goth" style on everything. It's like some teenage high school Bauhaus-fanatic got shit-faced on schnapps and X and then threw up on film.

What about Sissorhands and Nightmare Before Xmas, both of those where very enjoyable movies. And I happen to like the "Wacky Dark look at me im Goth" aspect of his movies, at least its not standard Hollywood schtick.

I've never been able to make myself watch Scissorhands. Nightmare Before Xmas was bearably silly. The problem I have with the "Look at me, I'm goth!" schtick is that after about the 4th or 5th time seeing it, it no longer has any significance whatsoever. It's like Manson's thing, it's only shocking the first few times, then it just looks sily and becomes a caricature of itself.

I did forget Burton's Batman and Batman Returns. Returns would have been a perfectly good Batman movie, had Burton not decided to goth up the Penguin. There was actually one scene in the thing that was almost cinematic perfection. And then the Penguin bursts through the floor and the movie goes downhill from there.

I am a Burton fan. I admit it. Especially when he teams with Depp.

Though, if you watch An Evening with Kevin Smith he has a topic about Tim Burton that is hilarious. He made a joke about one of Burton's movies and said something along the lines of "and then he dropped the artsy shtick and came after me with the claws out."

I am with Haemish (surprise!). Some of Burton's stuff has been decent/tolerable. but the vast majority of it is pure crap.

Heading back to the original topic, Gainax is remaking Evangelion. (http://imagesocket.com/view/up135620c43.jpg)

A remake worthy of greatness:

A Fistful of Dollars


On the flipside, and I'm sure I'm going against popular opinion here: The Magnificent Seven. It sucked. Prime example of how American sensibility can screw up a thing.

And I really don't want to crack a Brokeback joke, but needless to say, I think the trend of gay cowboys really starts there (with Steve fucking McQueen, no less!).


I'm not a big Marilyn Manson fan (I loved the first album though), but I'll give him some credit. He was the last thing in rock that scared and pissed people off.

Besides the actual music, that should be the secondary function of rock 'n' roll. To be the thing parents love to hate. This was an age old tradition beginning with Elvis, to Lennon, to Jim Morrison, to Ozzy, to Bowie, to Iggy, Punk in general, to NWA, to even Prince and Madonna. Marilyn Manson was the last one. Or maybe Eminem?

I've enjoyed the Tim Burton movies, for the most part.  They make me feel less weird.  I didn't find the new Willie Wonka to be that different from the old one, except Johnny Depp was a bit more childlike in his interpretation.  The oompa songs were better in the original.

PS  I am a big fan of Marilyn Manson.   :-)

Sissorhands is right up there with Beetlejuce as Burtons greatest work, IMO. You probably wont find it that good cause you have seen a lot of his other movies, and he pulls a lot from Sissorhands, but it is THE original Burton/Depp movie, and his best one. Also, a lot of it will probably seem cliche, but thats just cause so much has been done after it, at the time of release it was an amazing movie (again, IMO). You really should watch it, but if you do, try and go in to it with a neutral attitude, and not thinking about burtons other movies. Whichg would be hard, but the only way to do it justice.

Oh SNAP! WUN, I guess that makes Signe a Fag Goth also.

Well, Signe does like men. Close enough for gothness, anyway.

As for Manson being the last thing in popular music that "scared and pissed off parents," hardly. You have those scary black people singing rap music and looking for white girls, the gayness of Lance Bass, and just teen rebellion in general. Manson pissed off people who should have known better. He was a great RL version of an Internet troll. He was Hyuocrity made flesh.

I'm too far gone to look at Scissorhands objectively. It may have been the last "original" thing Burton did.

Big Fish and Ed Wood came after Scissorhands. They were original enough (granted, one was a biopic, but still).


Anyways, I like Edward Scissorhands. I even bought a DVD a while back. Thing is, it's still in the shrinkwrap. I don't know...I thought it was a good idea to buy it at the time, but I can't really bring myself to watch it again. Blonde Winona Ryder or not.

I like it, but I partly agree with Haemish too.

Manson had some great rock music. The last album of his I bought, Mechanical Animals had a few great tracks on it, even. His early shows behind the first album were sick.

Scissorhands is far and away his best movie.  He's almost been trying to remake it his entire career it was so good.

Pee-Wee's Big Adventure is also a great Burton movie IMO.

I remember dragging my brother to watch that with me when it came out (because I was too little to go alone). I liked Pee Wee Herman a little too much as a kid, I think. Hell, I still want that house of his.

My Sassy Girl sucked.

Just remembered. One of my favorite movies is actually a remake: Breathless (yes, the cheesy Richard Gere version).

It's nowhere near the classic that A bout de souffle is, but it's almost a perfect Americanized representation of the same story. It's the Hamburger to A bout de souffle's Chateaubriand. Watching the two together makes one realize just how lowbrow us Americans really are (and how charming that can be sometimes).

Breathless was also the first movie I ever went to in the theaters. My Dad dragged me along, I was about 6 years old then, so I didn't understand much about it except that it had nudity, and that Gere was possibly the coolest character ever in it (he's a bit retarded as well....But that's beside the point. He was still cool. Rockabilly schtick, crazy pants, Silver Surfer fan. What's not to like?). I still think this way about it.

[EDIT]

Speaking of the Magnificent Seven, supposedly there's another remake of the Seven Samurai in the works. This time with......George Clooney???

I like Clooney and all, but.....No.

If McQueen, Bronson, and Coburn can't hold a candle to Mifune and Kurosawa, then Clooney sure as hell can't.

There's a Chinese cast in it as well (Donnie Yen and Zhang Ziyi being the big names). I wonder what they're up to?

Yeah, you two are peas in a pod.  You both like Burton, Manson, and men.  Now get your ass back to Hot Topic, cocksucker.

Moving on, I'll give Burton credit for Pee Wee's Big Adventure and Beetlejuice.  Everything else he's made can kiss my ass.  Yes, that includes the Batman movies.  Meanwhile Manson is an unredeemed hack who attained fame primarily by pissing off ignorant easily-frightened "morality" types.  Then Eminem came along and frightened those same types even more, leaving Manson as nothing but a has-been wearing prosthetic tits.

You have no soul.  Die in a Korean fire.  I've seen a lot of romantic comedies (yeah, so shoot me) and it was one of the first and only I've seen where they came up with a female lead who was actually genuinely attractive, personality-wise.  Gyeon-woo makes a better, more relateable male lead char than whatever poor man's Richard Gere they're sticking in romantic comedies this week (It's really sad how far David Duchovny has fallen).  I'll admit that Windstruck was a bit tone-deaf as a prequel, but the original stands up incredibly well to multiple viewings in its own right; I'm not the type to re-watch things usually, but I've seen My Sassy Girl about 4 or 5 times.

Re: Marilyn Manson - I only hear the singles he puts on the radio, and about half of them are catchy and fun - mobscene, rock is dead, the beautiful people, etc.  It's like Rob Zombie - vaguely metal-esque pop that the whole family can enjoy.  If you can listen to his songs and just sort of smile and tap your foot, it doesn't really matter whether he's "talented" or not - Tatu were never talented, but that one song they had that translates to "prostitute whore" in English (Prosthie d-something) was one of the best pop songs around when it came out.  Even my mom kinda gets into Manson when his songs come on.

Re: Tim Burton - Nightmare Before Christmas, Edward Scissorhands, Willy Wonka, and Corpse Bride were all enjoyable movies.  They did lay it a bit thick on the gothfaggery at times, but the all-time most obnoxious movie in that regard for me is still Shrek (Worst ending ever), and they didn't even reach half of that level.

Re: Hot Topic, since WuA mentioned it - assuming you avoid about 90% of their merchandise, you can actually find some good stuff there.  Last time I passed through, I got myself an "I'm the Gangster of Love" arm sweatband.  They also have unique and interesting hats, suitable for any Silly Hat Day festivities you may find yourself invited to.

Blech. Just when I was hoping that overrated piece of shit would fade into obscurity finally.

I like how you enjoy all the things on my "goth fag" list and feel compelled to stick up for them, but only in a really half-assed dismissive fashion, like you're waiting for me to tell you it's cool to like those things as long as you don't like them too much.

Too bad, you Burton-watching Hot Topic emo!

(http://www.ritachu.com/jon/Pictures/weirdal/alshow/ep3601-emo.jpg)

At least Morphiend basically just says "I like those things so fuck you!"

Manson's version of Screamin' Jay Hawkin's 'I Put A Spell On You' is great. I use elements of it when I sing it (though the Animals and CCR have great versions, too). And no more apt artist for Manson to cover, imo. The stuff he did with Daisy was very strong. 1996 was a great punky anthem. The radio tracks after Antichrist Superstar were his weakest stuff, imo. I wish I could remember the names of the couple of outstanding tracks on Mechanical Animals. To me, Mechanical Animals is almost Bowie-esque. He kinda took a lot of flack for that and that's when he started churning out generic goth stuff (imo, I haven't listened to much of the later stuff, so it's an ignorant statement, possibly).

I'm willing to mock pop fad rock with the best of them, but Manson was a bit more than that.

I'd barely even associate Manson with Goth. Goths makes albums like "The Decomposition of Violets" and have band names like "Miranda Sex Garden" and "Clan of Xymox", not "Anti-Christ Superstar" and "Marilyn Manson". Manson is metal and/or industrial metal. He's more of hyper version of Alice Cooper than he is Peter Murphy.

I might enjoy Manson but I love Bauhaus. 

Signe really is a goth fag.  :evil:

I was never a goth fag, and NEVER even close to emo. If you must know I was in to punk. Misfits and DK and such. I liked to make all the shit hot topic made so trendy. When the store first opened around here I was excited, a store where you could buy a already made chain wallet. Never again would it be me and a hole puncher and the hardware store. Then I realized what they did. They brought all the cool shit to the suburben masses and made it suck.

So WUN, yeah, I like Burton, I like Manson, but I like Jello and DK better, so put my cock back in your mouth and keep sucking you little shit.

I used to buy chain wallets at Harley stores. Same goes for my boots and jacket. Now even that place sucks, as you can't find anything in a Harley shop without HUGE, tacky Harley logos on it. Even the boots.....Which sucks since I can't seem to find a place that sells cool motorcycle boots anymore. Jackets are a little easier.

I dropped the chain wallet for, not to be ironic or anything, a stingray wallet. As in, my wallet is made out of stingray skin. So is my belt.

I don't step anywhere near Hot Topic.

Maybe I'm just eclectic.  That must be it.

I swear to Mithra, you're such a fucking douche.  The only thing more teenager-lame than shopping at Hot Topic?  Whining about Hot Topic and how you have more cred than the "suburben" kids who do shop there.  What are you, fucking fifteen?

Oh ya. A Death Race remake coming soon to a theater straight to video bin near you.

"Death Race 3000" to be exact. Done by AvP/Mortal Kombat director Paul W.S. Anderson.

I hate to say this, but it might be the one movie where Uwe Boll would do a better job. Anderson is going to try and take it seriously. It won't suck necessarily, but it'll be boring.

I love Bauhaus. No shame in that.

First off: Motorcycle boots (Hell, any sort of boots on men), chain wallets, etc. have never been cool.  Kids who turn their choice of music and clothing into a reflection of some larger "lifestyle" have never been cool.

Secondly, I'm not half-assedly defending Manson; the half-assed thing would be to say he's only worth listening to as part of some lifestyle package.  Manson makes good, hard pop music, and I can appreciate that.  Calling it pop music isn't diminutive in any way, because there is not, and has not been, anything wrong with making pop music - that's a silly notion created out of whole cloth by slow teens, and for the most part the rest of the world seems to know that better than in America; Pink Floyd could go on Top of the Pops in the UK without worrying about losing 'street cred'.  By saying Manson is pop, I'm saying that he has appeal beyond a niche of largely silly people, and that people like my mom can enjoy him too.  There's never been anything wrong with, or less cool about, enjoying the same music as your parents.  (Exception: My dad is into Enya.  That's just too much.)

Love Manson.  He's not a breakthrough musician, and he's said as much.  "Others make the hammer, we apply it."  He's a storyteller, and  the stories he tells are complex and interesting.  But you have to be willing to buy into it.  A lot of you aren't.  That's fine.  But there's more to it than you're seeing.  Antichrist Superstar, Mechanical Animals, and Holy Wood are all retellings of a larger story with different twists and endings in each.  His most recent, "The Golden Age Of Grotesque" broke away from the trilogy and told a different sort of a story, more autobiographical than the previous ones.  But if you're mistaking him for a serious musician, you can only really blame yourself.  One of his more recent songs even includes the lines, "This isn't music, and we're not a band, we're five middle fingers on a motherfucking hand."  Comparing him to someone like, for instance, Dream Theatre is pointless.  They're as different as dogs and dinosaurs, to quote a line from Peewee's Playhouse.  But no, his music isn't for everyone.  (Sky, I recommend you check out a few tracks on Groteqsue.  'The New Shit' especially is very good.)

Frankly, I've decided I don't like most Burton movies.  They're not bad movies, though.  He's pioneered his style and refined it, and, with the exception of Planet of the Apes, has applied it strongly and consistently.  I'm just tired of it, personally.  It doesn't speak to me as deeply as some other styles.  Were I a different sort of person, it might.  My earlier fascination with Burton's style was just charm, I believe, and not any real sense of resonance with his methods.  That doesn't make the movies bad, just like my not liking country music doesn't make Johnny Cash bad.

I honestly do feel that some individuals on this site need to learn that concept.  Some things are just bad.  Some things are just what they are, and they may or may not be for you.  And some things are universally awesome.  That middle category is too frequently blended into the other two, and the meaning is confused, and suddenly people start flaming each other and calling each other goth fags.  Get over yourselves.  Honestly.  You're adults.

Deleted my post. Ill reference this instead.


Great post.

She partied without dancing. She partied with my heart.

The hell you talking about? Boots, of all types, are cool. What kind of statement is that?

And you know what? You might be "Hyu", but I'm still cool enough to say that Jew Fros are cool. I have no snappy comeback here.

I had to back and make sure you'd said this.  You're not correct.  Male Boots on manly men are always cool.

Always.

I've tried for years to get a proper pair of boots, but you can forget about it around here.

Price? Availability (in Europe?!)?

Saw a beautiful pair in Italy when I was over, but missed the boat.

I was talking about Scotland, really, as I've never managed to go further afield - I realise that this is probably something I could sort with 5 minutes effort on the web, but, hey, who understands the Internet ?

Price should never be an issue for something you want. 

Scotland does not go in for boots unless they're wellies.  To understand why, don a pair and go into The Clansman around closing time.

:)

Nice boots on feet in general are pretty cool. 

(http://hpbimg.petitepersonalshopper.com/blk%20boot%20heels.jpg)

Motorcycle boots, cowboy boots, combat boots, etc.  are cool.  Well, not wellies, really.  Or Gary Glitter boots.

I suppose we'll chalk that one up to different taste, then.  I really don't know any men who've actually attempted wearing boots, except for the "we're so punk look how punk we are" kids, and they usually end up looking like the guy from that 'Heavy Hitters' image that kept getting tossed around here.  Well, except Lugz.  For most guys I know, it's generally Pumas, Adidas, Converse, or perhaps Onitsuka Tigers if you're feeling funky.

Cowboy boots?  That I have a hard time seeing.  I'm just having a hard time imagining what sort of outfit man-boots would really go with (Cowboy boots immediately conjure up images of tight bluejeans and an ill-fitting "Don't Mess With Texas" t-shirt).  Picsplzifpossible - expand my imagination.  In keeping with Llava's post, I won't pass judgment until I see all that's out there.

You can wear cowboy boots with any sort of trouser.  Most men don't wear them over the trouser legs.  All you see is the bottom, just like shoes.  I'm sure if someone is all dressed up, they wouldn't wear scuffy ones, either.  You're really kind of weird.

(http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2001/01/21/wbush321.jpeg)

The phrase 'full of shit' leaps to mind.

But I dislike offending people for no reason at all.

Sometimes Pumas and Adidas can look OK, but I can't believe you mentioned Chuck Taylor's, man.

Anyways.....You're like what? 20-22?

You can't pull that off as much later on, I'll say that much. There's just a careless and juvenile look about tennis shoes, no matter how shiny they are, and no matter how much you compensate in other areas (the same partly goes for t-shirts and baggy pants, but that's beside the point).

Time and a place for everything, of course, but you should make a habit of not looking like an overgrown kid now. The dorm room and/or teenage mall shopping look is not that cool, no matter what you think.

The only time boots aren't appropriate is when you're wearing shorts (well that, and they should never be worn over pants). Besides that, depending on the boot (and you should have more than one type), they can pretty much work for anything. Even a suit (though I wouldn't recommend that necessarily).

As for cowboy boots, I don't know. The only time they struck me as really fucking cool (black and silver-tipped at that!) was in an old Ray Liotta movie (Something Wild...Check it out if you want. I don't have pics).

FWIW, appropriately styled converse go very well with a nice suit.  (By nice suit, I mean one with a cut appropriate to something other than just the office; united colors of benetton two-buttons, for instance, something that gives you some shape)

Sure, you can only rock that until age 29ish, but longer if you can keep your hair and look younger than your age.  And past that, it's a bland world of khakis anyhow.

No, No, No. Fucking clown shoes. If you insist on tennis shoes, get some skate shoes or something. Wearing them with a suit (ughh) will at least get you the "bohemian" label. Not the "dork" label.

About the only kind of suit that'll work with Converse is a suit with a bunch of Question Marks all over it. Like the Riddler's. Or that Ask Lesko!! guy.

Don't be this guy Tele. It's not cool. It's not even funny. It's just stupid.

(http://index.hu/cikkepek/cinematrix/0411/gala/.gdata/gp_02.jpg)



Hell, even scroungry ass boots AND a chain wallet beats that:

(http://www.johnnydeppfan.com/portraits/p191.jpg)

I like whatever Tele does not like, and vice-versa. I figure that's a safe approach, since Tele is basically the living definition of lame.

I don't know who those people are in Stray's first pic... or I don't recognise them.  They both look fine to me, though. I have no problem with anyone of any age wearing tennis shoes... they're comfy.  What are older people supposed to wear?  Dockers with no socks?  Wing-tips?  Slippers?  Flippers? 

I have no problem with tennis shoes (like I said, there's a time and place for everything). I just think that tennis shoes, especially Converse ones, with a suit, is stupid.

If you didn't notice, one of the guys in the first pic is doing that (I don't know who he is either).

You're a kid with the really annoying idea that what your limited experience has taught you can be applied to the rest of the world.

Actually on the whole converse with suits thing, that's what they went for with the latest Doctor Who and I've got to admit I think it looks pretty good.
link to the best full length pic (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/gallery/doctor10_01/800/doctor2.jpg). There's lots of others (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/gallery/doctor10_01/index.shtml) with better pics of the suit.

Perhaps the whole Doctor Who and eccentric clothing helps pull this off but I have got to side with Hyu on thinking this can look good. Of course a grey suit with bright red sneaker or something would look horrible but it can work.

When you're basing your fashion decisions on Doctor Who, you may as well just kill yourself.

Dr. Who can teach us all a great lesson in how to look absolutely fabulous via the use of ten foot scarves.

(http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Zone/3746/FigE.jpg)

NowhereMan you are taking the side of someone who thinks that these look good. (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=7894.msg216124#msg216124)

Scarf length aside, that's actually a pretty good outfit.  Farnsworth would be proud.

Re: The earlier pictures - the reason the guy looks clownshoes in that first pic, IMHO, is because he's wearing the tightest goddamn pants imaginable with that suit - which not 100% always inadvisable, but usually makes your feet look gigantic, even if you're wearing normal matching shoes.  A slim fitted suit doesn't have to be skin-tight.

As for the second one, yes, it looks cool.  But at the same time, it's motherfucking Johnny Depp doing cosplay (We've already been into my feelings on Mr. Depp) - you could stick a potato sack on him, and he'd find some way to wear it with flair, but that doesn't necessarily do much for the rest of us, even beyond the fact that its almost a period costume.

Anyone could wear what Depp is wearing and get less laughs than some dork wearing Chuck Taylor's and a suit (good cut or not).


Speak for yourself. You're the one with the problems.

Tele, when you think you have found something that looks cool, please, think again.

I still say the look works on the good Dr. at least, though I don't think it's one I'd go for myself.

And yes those sneakers do look firmly like ass, anyone wearing them outside of camouflage in some post-apocalyptic graffiti covered wasteland should be beaten to death with fluffy toys, to ensure they have plenty of time to consider just how fucking stupid a decision it was.

Show me a candid shot of any regular Joe who's not Johnny Depp dressing like that and having it look good.  I don't think it can be done.

Also, as far as the converse with a suit go, I'm a firm believer that you should never dress completely normal - so the idea that if some point somebody laughs at your outfit, you've done something wrong, that's a bit silly.  I have a wide variety of multicolored knit gloves, scarves, and socks for just such purposes.  Not all at once, of course, but each in its stead.  When I wear converse with a suit, I usually go with dark olive/black ones that don't stand out as much, but I have a matching tie so it does work well. ;p

It's just black pin striped pants, a white shirt, and a vest. Take out the "uncool" chain wallet and boots if you must (just don't fucking wear Cons). Either way, there's nothing "period" about it.

And what's a regular Joe anyways? You've got a Jew Fro and I'm a 6'4" Half Scandi/Half Asian guy.

My final word for now about the shoes: I think you're a troll even in real life, Mediocre. Probably not as bad as on the net, but a troll nonetheless (note: I don't necessarily consider this a bad thing). If you honestly think it's OK to wear Converse shoes (especially like the ones above) with a suit, then I can't help but think that you're looking for as much attention as possible.

Thing is, you'd probably get more attention if you did the complete opposite (Hey, I think this just might be the perfect motivation for you. I should have said this before).

Your only options aren't Bozo the Clown or "Normal" Guy in Khaki pants. There's so much more. Not necessarily anything "overdressed" either (hardly that).

You could even throw in almost any kind of quirky shit you want -- There just needs to be some balance -- and certain things knock the "quirky" look totally off the scale (Converse All Stars with Suit, Hip packs, Geordi Le Forge sunglasses, etc..).


OK, I'm done. Stay tuned next week for Stray's Fashion Tips 101. Next Episode: Tightrolled Jeans, Vannila Rice, and Inspiration from Goatse.

You guys are discussing shoes?! What's wrong with you people?!

Boots, man. Boots.

Tele is a pathetic attention whore? What gave it away?

Was it everything he's ever said, or something else?

Renaissance Faires.  No, I'm not kidding.  Just about the only place to find high-quality leather goods anymore.

--Dave

Loafers are my shoe of choice.

I'd wear them to the gym if you could run in them.

If you are wearing a suit and don't have at least JAM quality dress shoes on you don't look very good.  I prefer cap toes or split toes.  Wearing Chucks with one makes you look like the short-bus let you off at the wrong place: both retarded AND confused.

The whole point, if you're wearing a suit, is to convey a certain impression.  It's generally a "I respect the rest of you people enough at this wedding/funeral/business meeting that I'll put on this hot, uncomfortable monkey outfit and try hard to make a good impression."

Wearing something as odd as sneakers/converse is slick and ironic, if you're young, but defeats the whole purpose in putting on the suit in the first place. 

Just wear a shirt that says "Fuck You".  It's more honest,  and less smarmy.

There really isn't a situation that exists where I'd wear anything more than a sportscoat, nice t-shirt (single color, nice material), jeans, and a decent pair of shoes these days. Except family events where my mom dictates the level of clothing like a wedding or bar mitzvah. You never want to piss the parents or grandparents off.

Seriously though. Black tie wedding? Sportscoat and jeans. Funeral? Sportscoat and jeans. It's not that I'm non-conformist, it's that I just don't give a fuck. Comfort trumps all. The last 4 interviews I've gone to, I've worn a sportscoat, jeans and expensive shoes and gotten the jobs. Granted, my t-shirts (or polos - sometimes) cost as much as most peoples Nice Shoes or Jackets and my sportscoats definately cost more than most peoples suits, I tend to get away with it.

You don't wear a suit to convey an impression anymore. You wear it to say "Sure, I'd bend over a table for you." You can say that's an impression, and I suppose it is, but any person with hiring power who won't hire me for not wearing a suit isn't worth my fucking time.

But Converse sneakers?

Don't be a dickhead.

Round-up style post, and then I'm done with this thread for a while, at least so long as we're on fashion.  I think we've all gone through pretty much all there is to say.


Heh, fair enough.  Though for me, it's the vest that does it; outside of a vest along with a full suit, I think the percentage of men who can actually pull off a vest decently is very slim, maybe one in a hundred.


The mere existence of a suit no longer conveys that impression, I'd agree.  The difference between an ill-fitting one and a really good one does say something, IMHO, in about the same way you cited the quality of your sportscoats and t-shirts.

The specific look isn't so important as whether or not a given person can pull it off.  IMHO, some of the things we've been talking about (chain wallets, boots, vests) have a very high ratio of "people who wear them" to "people who wear them well".

Also, I'd never wear converse with a suit to an interview, or to work.  For an interview, it'd be standard JAM-ish stuff, roughly along the lines Abogadro laid down.

I wear suits a lot of places.  The last time I wore a suit with converse was to a Wu-Tang Clan concert.  (And yes, I slamdanced there too, thankyouverymuch Mr. The-Jews-Can't-Have-Any-Fun)


This is a primary point of differing perspectives, I guess; I've never considered suits to be uncomfortable or hot, and so I never looked at putting one on as a sacrifice.  I like ties, too.  I just look at them as nice outfits.


Quoting PJ O'Rourke from memory: "The weirder you're going to act, the more normal you should look.  The converse is also true.  When I see a person with green hair and three rings sticking out of his nose, I know there is absolutely nothing extraordinary about him."


Hip packs are actually making a huge comeback among Korean girls, and they rock them rather well; Big designers (and knockoff producers) are churning them out now because they're The New Thing.  I've never seen a guy pull them off well, though.

Geordi Le Forge sunglasses?  Not a bad idea, but I'm more of the Stunner Shades type (Hearken back to the hip hop thread!) - on that note, there will be an avatar update as soon as I get bluetooth permission.

No no. You missed the point.

Don't wear Converse shoes with a suit. Period.

Hell, don't ever wear them.

You aren't black.

You aren't old school.

You're a born post-1980 white jew guy with a fro.

You've no place wearing converse shoes. Especially colored one-stars.

I don't either.


I've figured it out. Your mom didn't love you enough. No one should need that much attention. Please refer to the third point above, btw. But even then, it's questionable when black people where them. I should probably append that to say "black people who are also super skinny who are also rock stars who are also rich enough that it wouldn't matter if they replaced the one stars with burlap sacks tied off at the ankle." Even then, it's still an asshole move.

Black people!

(http://show.imagehosting.us/show/1603066/0/nouser_1603/T0_-1_1603066.jpg)

No, that's the worlds first Orc-Pimp.

Nice attempt, you let a whole one other person post before you posted again. I knew it was too good to be true.

I liked this site better before 50% of the posts were by the same self-absorbed, completely unaware troll.

What Tele doesn't realize is that the world is full of people just like him. He even quoted O'Rourke making that very point about him, but is apparently too stupid to realize that it applies to him.

Incredibly stupid people who fancy themselves clever annoy me.

Thanks for pointing that out.  I just skip his posts and would have missed an incredible gem.

I just rocked out a pair of jeans, combat boots, a pinstriped waistcoat, wide striped tie and french cuffed shirt and looked positively badass. Oh, and I'm over 30.

It's not what you wear, it's how you wear it and the confidence with which you wear it.

Quit "rocking" your clothing and just try wearing it.

Fuckin' kids...

I'll stop rockin' when I'm dead, ya old myopic turd burglar.  :evil:

I'm so late to this thread that there about nine different topics floating around in it.

I'm wearing Dockers and sandals (no socks). At least I don't wear sweats to work like I did in my tech support days.

Tim Burton: I've always considered myself a fan, but this thread made me want to step back and look at what he's done. I haven't seen Ed Wood, because I keep forgetting to, and Willy Wonka, because it just looks painful.

I'll take the lazy route and give ratings out of 5

Corpse Bride (2005)                     4                 
Big Fish (2003)                            3
Planet of the Apes (2001)            2
Sleepy Hollow (1999)                   3.5
Mars Attacks! (1996)                    4
Batman Returns (1992)                3
Edward Scissorhands (1990)          3.5
Batman (1989)                            4
Beetle Juice (1988)                      4
Pee-wee's Big Adventure (1985)   4
Nightmare Before Christmas           3.5

Does anyone really care? Probably not, but giving ratings is fun. His dark brooding style works for some movies (but he should have never fucked with Heston and McDowell).

Shoes - Converse have been and still are fucking clown shoes, doesn't matter what the fuck you wear them with.

Boots - some guys can pull it off, some can't. Just don't wear any goddamn shiny belt buckles unless you are a real goddam Cowboy from Calgary or one of them Texasy places. Otherwise, you look like John Travolta.

It makes me sad that Tele and Tom Baker share the same hairdo.

Yeah, you've really got to see Ed Wood.

It's got Bill Murray and George the Animal Steele in it. And it's about....Ed Wood. Martin Landau is amazing in it. You can't go wrong.


Surlyboi and I are both Texans (I think?). Maybe that explains something..

Coincidentally, I watched Wonka again at the weekend with Elena and her cousins - all boys of varying ages from 7 to 10.

Everyone loved it.  Everyone.

It's the best goddamn adaptation of the book Evar and as for the Wonka backstory - it's almost exactly what Dahl would have written, imo. 

I really think peoples style comes a lot from where they live, and grew up. I have lived in Southern California the majority of my life, but traveled a lot. I have no problem with converse, they are a staple of SoCal, and EVERYONE had a pair growing up at some point. I think they are still decent shoes, if you have the right style. I dont wear them, I am more of a Vans guy.

Im wearing these right now.

(http://www.calsk8.com/skateshop/product_thumb.php?img=images/halfcabblack.jpg&w=200&h=151)

I also had a pair of these recently.

(http://www.sneakerland.com/images/img/vans_0207276B_img.jpg)

Boots are fine, if done with jeans or black slacks. As for sandles, thongs (Flip-flops, you pervs) only and never, EVER EVER EVER with socks. Tivas scream tourist or inland dork. But I grew up in a surfing community that is close to LA, so everyone around here is pretty fashion concious.

SoCal. Vans. The choice of Spicoli.

I used to buy Vans hightops all the time. They were never very durable for skating, but they were comfortable and cheap. Nowadays, they're extremly overpriced. I used to be able to buy two pairs at a time, for around $40 (this wasn't that long ago either). Now I can't even get one pair for that.

I never liked Chucks, but the same deal goes for them. Somehow they've gotten popular, and the prices have escalated. They're just plain canvas shoes like those Vans. They shouldn't cost any more than $25.

Anyways, I like those shoes and all, but if I'm gonna pay 40 or 50 bucks (or more), I'll get something that'll last longer.

(http://www.vincev.com/images/GQ_terrencehoward.jpg)

I think this look would be pretty sharp. Especially if you wanted to go with something unusual for style.

You would look adorable in that, Monkey Boy!

I'm serious, by the way.

Or maybe something like this-

(http://chronicle.augusta.com/images/headlines/072803/9064_512.jpg)

Yes!  But it should be a bit brighter, maybe.  Paelos would look lovely in both of those outfits. 

He so cute.

There's nothing quite like a dancing monkey in a hat.