f13.net

Can you believe this shit?

http://www.gamestop.com/productmerch.asp?groupid=310

http://www.ebgames.com/ebx/categories/systems/xbox360/

That's right. No $299 system, no $399. If you want an Xbox 360, you're going to have to pony up at least $600.

Fuck you. Fuck you in the goat ass.

Knowing you're going to be the only game in town for a good 6 months seems to make you cocky.

The sad part is, I can't blame them.  There's plenty of people who will eat this shit up.

Hah. Seriously, it's time to stop caring about what Microsoft brings to the console world. Even if the 360 was superior and had good ideas behind it, they're still a fucking joke. They had a good run, but really, that was just a fluke. At the very least, they're not as big of a player in the console market to think that they have this kind of leverage.

I'll be glad to see them pull out after this run and Sega reclaiming it's rightful place.

Is there even in savings in the bundle?  And I feel this is more EBStop than it is Microsoft.

I just got off the phone with both EBGames and Gamestop. Here's the deal.

In-store you can preorder the $299 or $399 system, however, you will not get it until the mythical "2nd shipment" for which there isn't a date. If you want an Xbox 360 as soon as it's released, you have to buy a bundle which starts at $600 for EBGames and $700 for Gamestop.

Enjoy your $600 Xbox 360 schild, because you'll be the only person playing it.

Wow, looks like I won't be touching a 360 for a while.

As soon as I heard you had to pay extra for a HDD I decided against getting a 360.

Nintendo Revolution, you're our only hope.

That's the funny thing about bundles...basically no savings.

"It's like buying them all separately...only you have to!"

I wonder if all those games are actually going to ship on time. The XBox is looking more and more pathetic. $50 for a controller? $40 for a memory card? $12 for a battery and another $20 for a glorified battery charger?

Seriously...$32 for a battery plus charger.

The EB "core bundle" is $600 for the CORE FUCKING SYSTEM. You know, the sucky one. Let's pile on some bad value onto the already bad value!

And all the games are $60. Kameo, a reject Gamecube game, 60 bucks.

Zelda is going to be better than all the 360 launch games combined anyway.

We mostly buy everything... but we won't be buying that!

So um, is there any other place that will be selling just the 360?

Amazon I think.

Walmart.

I looked at Amazon and it doesn't seem to be available to order yet in the US.  It is available in the UK as a single unit, however.

I asked at Frye's today. November 2nd I should be able to buy mine in store at 9am for $399.99 with whatever games I want. $600 my cock.

So...no games?

Considering that these games have to go gold in 6 weeks or so and there has been basically nothing as far as hands-on play for most of them, I suspect a rash of mediocre rush-jobs. I'm sure they're all just XBox games with some new shaders thrown on.

I will speak for myself and Haemish when I say:

"FUCK YOU IN THE ASS YOU CUMGUZZLING SHITBAGS NO MONEY HAT FROM ME!"


Any how. $700 for a fucking console is insane. I agree with schild, Fry's here I come.

Be glad your not Canadian.   At those prices, I could buy a PS2, Gamecube AND XBox and still have change leftover......

Yeah.  See, I think I'll stick to my PS2 and GC.  There are still plenty of good games from '03 and '04 that I haven't played yet that I'd like to try, and they only cost me < $20.  And by this Christmas, a good bit of '05 will be that cheap too.  One 360, or 30 console games.  Hmm.

Except the line starts at 3pm two days before.

Oh wait, you have nothing but time.

The last company that tried to price a new console over $299 was 3DO. There is a demonstrable step function of price elasticity at the $300 price level. The curve is not smooth. The step function has probably even worsened since the 3DO debacle since there are a lot more alternatives and those alternatives have a shitload of games for under $30 now.

For those too young to remember, Trip Hawkins, the founder of EA, left to start 3DO. 3DO tried to break into the console market with a premium priced machine. There is a good write-up here. (http://darkwatcher.psxfanatics.com/console/3do.htm) Bottom line, no one would pay $700 for game console so the company morphed into a software developer and eventually went bust.

Elder Scrolls IV is coming out on the PC right?  Good, good.  I dodged an expensive bullet here.

But I'm willing to bet the PC version will show console limitations.

Yeah, um I am actually pretty curious about how they are going to handle the no hard drive on certain models of X-Box thingie.  One of the things about Morrowind was that your saves were persistent.  Kill everyone in an area (like say a dungeon) and everyone stayed dead and objects remained where you left them.  It would suck, a lot, if you had 'save points' and a non-persitent world.

Since they've come out and said you won't need a hard drive to play Oblivion on the 360, I'd expect some issues with persistent saves.

Honestly, Morrowind probably would have been a lot better with some console limitations.  Plus, 360 has a decent amount of RAM, so maybe they can refrain from making little areas with massive load times.

That being said, I'm not buying a next gen console for some time.  Fuck, I thought my PSP was expensive but this shit is just crazy.  If I'm spending $400 bucks on a console, I better walk out of there with one if not two games.  And that's all this crap is to me, it's a gaming console.  I have DVD player, I have a PC, I don't need a stupid console to be those things for me.

I hope it's not the neverending game again.  Don't get me wrong... I WANT my games to last for some time.  But Morrowind never ended for me.  It went on and on, endlessly, forever... much like I am right now.  It didn't matter how much I cheated, that game never stopped and I never finished it, even with a character fully edited to God-like.

And so consoles continue their march to edge out PCs as game platforms...  :roll:

Consoles are still too proprietary and badly marketed.  Though of course that could be Gates' plan... discredit the consoles, sell more copies of Vista 2010 over Dell Alienware killers!

I remember being appalled at how much time I was spending playing Morrowind so I decided to sabotage myself by cheating to see the ending immediately ( so that I would stop spending so much time playing ).  I no-clipped straight into the final dungeon with a god mode character and found out that it was impossible to kill the head boss without the quest received weapon and such.  The prick actually said something like "I can't believe [whoever] sent you here unprepared".

So I had to turn off the cheats and finish the very long story arc.  Then I kept playing, even after seeing the ending, trying to uncover all of the map, looking into the vampire thing, and seeing if I could kill that other god.

What's up with all the shock and outrage over bundling by major sellers at launch.

Were you in a cave when the PS2 launched?

I can't remember that far back. Beer.

I remember it because I had to buy one of the PS2 bundles. There's a funny workaround where you can return your unopened bundle games to places like Best Buy for store credit. That's what I did, and it worked out.

What? You can't afford $1200?

http://gamestop.com/product.asp?cookie%5Ftest=1&product%5Fid=B020253C

I refuse to step foot into Gamestop again after I noted the fact that their PC games "section" is literally a 5'X3' island off in the corner of the store.  Go fuck yourselves, I guess I'll head off to Best Buy or CompUSA.

Haven't we learned anything?

Never buy a new system till after the first or second price drop and when they actually start bundling software with the system.  Because by that time the first set of titles are mostly budget priced, and there are some games worth buying.

The first year of a console's life is mostly for people with more money than sense.  Its bragging rights only.  Though why one would want to brag about owning a system first and paying more cash for it is beyond me...

That's probably more space than it deserves in those stores.

Half of Morrowind's fun were the mods.

The Xbox version will not be moddable, therefore, it will be much less fun in the end. Go buy a GeForce 7800GTX, you'll be better off.

Buy a 7800GT instead. Nearly the same performance for a lower price.

I think they've moved the PC section ont a few racks in the middle of the store; It's not even on the wall anymore.  :|

Isn't that more expensive than an Xbox360 advanced or whatever they're calling it?


Can you ride it like a motorbike?

$395.00 at Newegg. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814125207)

I cannot fathom you people who'll pay that kind of money for a video card.  I've never paid more than $100 for a card, and everyone I've bought has had a lifespan of at least 2 years.  Hell, my GF FX 5200 still plays everything I throw at it (maybe not necessarily with all the details turned up), the only real limitation being that it's only got 128 megs of RAM.

Shit, just buy the best card currently available for aroun $100 and be done with it.

I used to be the same way, but I've since upped my limit to $200. It's not a bad compromise.

Yup, that's about where I stand.  God damn piece of shit Ti4600 should still work.

You're a dreamer, aren't you?

I spend $150-200 every 3 years or so on my video card, usually around the time things start coming out that simply will not run on my older card.  And hey, I have a friend who plays CoH with a GF4 TI4x00...  she has a bit more video lag than the rest of us, but it's still playable.

Alkiera

Everything but BF2 works fine.  Not stellar, just fine.

Heh, anyone got an old vid card they're going to trash?  I need one to rule that out as why the hell my computer is busted.   I know mine's bad, just don't know if I want to spend money on a whim where other crap could still be busted.

Damn I hate computer hardware... and I still hate you Xbox 360.

Your POS Ti4600 still has more pixel pushing power than most of the "budget" video cards these days (it's substantially faster than Big Gulp's 5200, for example). The problem with it is it doesn't fully support DirectX 9.0 and lazy ass companies like EA won't support earlier pixel shader versions on the PC for games like BF2  even though they did it for the fricking Xbox version.

No offence BG but the 5200 is the most worthless piece of crap in a box ever.

Well, I posted in the EQII forum a couple weeks ago that I'm getting rid of some cards. Schild has the better of the 4 on it's way. Next step below that is a 5200. The others are a 4200 (same as the 4600, but with only 64MB) and a Radeon 7500 (pretty worthless at this point in time).

Just in case the $1200 Gamestop Ultimate Bundle (http://www.gamestop.com/product.asp?product%5Fid=B020253C) was not enough for you they now have their $2000 Omega Bundle (http://www.gamestop.com/product.asp?cookie%5Ftest=1&product%5Fid=B020253D).

I don't have the words for that. And to think that I'm interviewing to manage one of those stores next week. *gasp* *cough* *wheeze* *spit blood* *leak grey matter*

That faceplate is really goddamn ugly.

Those lists of packed-in games looks a lot like a list of launch titles.

Alkiera

You realize what's going on here, don't you?  What happened at the last set of console launches?  The first shipments were sold out within days, and then people were buying them off of eBay for 50-100% more than retail.  EB/Gamestop is betting that Walmart, Amazon, etc., are going to sell out quickly, and then when the 14 year-olds are whining at their parents about their heads exploding if they don't get a XBox 360 right *now*, the choice will be between the bare-bones system on eBay for $600-1000, or these bundles with all of the games.  Sure, the games will mostly suck, but what they'll see is "$800 for the eBay machine, which may be used or broken, and then a couple of hundred more for new games, or $800 for a new system still in the box with 5 games worth $60 each?"

--Dave

That would be where the anger and outrage comes from, Mahrin. Blatant money grab on aisle 7.

I played WoW on a GeForce 2 MX400.  Oh, and with only half the "minimum" amount of RAM.  Capitals were a bit laggy, but otherwise I was fine.

Holy shit. I think someone from Microsoft just tried to steal my wallet out of my back pocket through my urethra with a catheter and a vaccum pump.

Without lube. Or even a good handjob.

WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU MONEY-GRUBBING COCKSHEATHES? YOU PEOPLE ARE SHITGUZZLING FORESKINS.

Needless to say, unless someone is buying it for me and I don't have to pay a cent, you won't see me buy one of these until they are priced in a sane manner.

I think this is just a matter of people thinking EB and Gamestop are sane. They aren't.

Just go buy it at Walmart.

Hold your nose.

I will buy the fucking thing at a garage sale in 2010 before I buy it a Wal*Mart.

Then buy it at Best Buy, Circuit City, Target, KMart, KB Toys, FYE, Frye's, Costco, or wherever. Point is, judging the cost via EBGames and Gamestop makes no sense to me.

Fry's not Frye's.

Spelling, it's what's for dinner.

I don't care about the spelling because in conversation I call it "Heaven on Earth."

First place I've ever seen with Resident Evil 2 in stock for the gamecube. I've got to go get that today or tomorrow.

Instead of playing on expected scarcity value, why doesn't Microsoft, you know, just make enough to go around. Take the Xbox's first month;s sales and manufacture twice that for the Xbox 360 launch.

I'll take the $210.00 Cdn www.atic.ca (http://www.atic.ca) 6600GT AGP I just bought that didn't require me to replace my motherboard again.


edit - damn nested quotes

Yeah, the 6600 GT is a spunky little card.

I bought one too, but the BFG overclocked model.

What happened to the common knowledge that a console MUST cost less than $200 and should be closer to $100? 

Are we watching Microsoft dig their own console grave here?

Yeah, right.  That'll be the happy happy joy joy day.

It disappeared when the Playstation 2 launched and stores still couldn't keep stock 2 years later. Hell, 4 years later.


I don't think Microsoft has ANYTHING to do with the shit Gamestop and EB are pulling. On that note - EB and GS did the same thing with the PSP and no one gave a shit. I'm sure you'll be able to buy a 360 by itself in those stores despite what noobler mcporkrinds said on the phone. This is just to rape the early early early moneybags adoptors. And drug dealers.

The only role MS plays here is the overpricing of all the components and accessories, which further drives up the prices of bundes.

Games are 60 bucks. Controllers 50. Cords and batteries and shit like that are 30-40. A 20 gig hard drive for $100! Right now you can get a 120GB HD for $20 with rebates! Everything related to XBox is overpriced, so of course the bundles are overpriced as well.

However, bundles are the new thing, and I doubt MS has anything to do with them directly. They are basically a giant fuck you to hardcore gamers - we know you want it early, so you have to pay out the nose.

The hard drive is a notebook 2.5" drive which are more expensive than the 3.5" desktop drives. Yes you are still being gouged on the price but not quite as bad as you might think. For example the cheapest 20 GB 2.5" drive Newegg sells is $67.00. Of course Microsoft is getting their parts for less than that but they have additional costs to create the actual SKU as well.

So now people can play their precious fucking Halo on the Xbox 3Shitty. Yay.

No it doesn't. No Halo or Halo 2 disc out there has any kind of backwards emulation code on it yet.

More:


That means things like Jade Empire, Halo 2, Battlefield 2, etc should (read: maybe, probably not, smoke, mirrors, etc) have the emulation tags on them.

Edit: Who knows what lurks in the shadows of binary? Shockeye knows.

I think it is incredibly naive to think that Microsoft is NOT micro-managing every damn detail of this product launch. Gamestop and EB have MSFT's blessing and support.

The game-specific shops have been selling first-run items as bundles for a few years now. It's not MS specific.

Yay, developers already fucking Microsofts strategy:


The developer of From said, in an article yesterday or the day before that the game will spread across 2, if not more DVDs. This is to say, people that like playing GAMES get the fullblown xbox. People that like playing Sports simulators get the shitty xbox.

And if you're wondering if From matters as a dev house? I'd say so. Armored Core, Tenchu, Kuon, Otogi. Japan likes them. I like them too.

Hell, just playing ResEvil online on the PS2 is annoying how some people make Hard Drive only games.

And what are they going to do about MMORPGs, mods, and other such things on the no-drive XBox? I'm going to guess that FFXI, which is supposed to be a launch or near-launch title, will require the HD. (It does on the PS2) What about just stupid crap like downloading extra costumes on for DOA.

It really does not make any sense to push Live as a big deal, then sell a no-drive version of the XBox. Internet connection + built-in network infrastructure = content to download = you need some place to put it.

Personally I hope that lots of games require the HD, and the core system is revealed as the POS it is.

The core system is admittedly a POS. They know what they've created and anyone with half a brain can see through it. The whole maneuver is brilliant - appeal to the people who say they want an Xbox360 but can't afford the real one. It's like buying a Rolex on the street of NY.

Except that a Rolex you buy on a street corner doesn't cost 75% of a real Rolex, and be upgraded to a real Rolex for another 50% on top of that...

I don't think it's brilliant at all. I think it's retarded, and I doubt it's going to help them move many more XBoxes. It's probably not worth the reputation hit, as well as retailers bitching to them that people keep trying to return the core system.

I'm going back to Nintendo.  I hope the Revolution is as cool as the SNES.

What really really really pisses me off about all this is if they release a really well done Battletech game with a really cool online persistent campaign I'm going to have to buy a fucking xbox.  Just thought I would share my disgust with that idea with the rest of you.


P.S.  Stupid consoles...

That's cute. Because the N64 and Gamecube were so well thought out, rite?

Anyway, I just talked to the guys at Gamestop, they aren't doing those stupid bundles in store. THat's ONLY for the website. Go, preorder, enjoy.

Well, you know, EA had a version of that which everyone played and though was very cool. But you know, EA and all.

 - meg

Meh.  At least I won't have to worry about which version of Revolution to get, aside from maybe color.  There will be one version, and at the least I know it will have awesome games available.  There is simply nothing I want to play more right now than SSBM online.

I know, in fact everyone 2 months or so I get an email from the Marik email list...  But its been quite for about a year now.

I loved my ppc vindicator in that game, such an underused medium.  The one flaw was that an atlas was easier to kill then an hbk because its head was so big that you really were a bad pilot if got anything other then headshots.  I think they might have changed that right at the end though.

Aside from that comment clearly being a stab at humor, the real issue is a confluence of my unwillingness to pay $400 dollars for a console, and a lack of time to play but sot many games.  I really wouldn't know from personal experience how well thought out N64 or GC were, because I never owned either.  Maybe I'm just being nostalgic, but I do/did  like Nintendo first party games, and even if that's all that was released for the system, I doubt I'd finish them all.

By the way, I recognize your antipathy for Nintendo from reading this site as I often do.  So, maybe from your perspective anyone who shills for Nintendo is pretty lame.  If I had my druthers I'd buy every system ever along with the complete library of all said systems and I'd beat every game.  But I'm in law school, and I can't do that.  I have an Xbox and I bought like 7 games, 3 of them sucked.  So, with that in mind, a a new Mario, a new Zelda, a new Metroid, possibly some form of RPG, and the obvious Madden would be all I may ever need (if not desire).

People keep harping on my antipathy towards Nintendo despite the fact I probably own, play and have beaten more Nintendo games than most if not all of the people yelling at me. And the biggest object of my hatred, the DS, by the second week of it's release I'd BEATEN (to a bloody pulp), over 50% of its launch titles. And right now I've gotten a Blue DS and 7 [new] games to exhaust. Getting an exclusive for 8 months on RE4 was the only thing that dug the Gamecube out of a box for me. I just recently started playing Baten Kaitos - which I bought on release day - and if it weren't for Killer 7, the cube would have gone back in zee box after I was done with RE4.

I like Nintendo - but this extra hardware bullshit for 5-10 games in the life of a system is just something I can't cope with. And now that they've decided to not go high-definition, they've just pissed me off further. They like rubbing salt in the wounds of their fanbase. They need to stop making consoles for the house and just make portable gear and software for the other systems. I don't care how many times someone says that the Gamecube was and is profitable - it only has an installed base of like 13% worldwide or someshit - if I were them, I'd want to be making games for the other 87% of the world. Seriously. Fuckers.

When you refer to "their" fanbase, do you really mean you, or people like you?  I would contend that you (obviously a pretty hardcore dude) aren't what they would consider their fanbase.  Now maybe they should, I don't know.  But they clearly have a different strategy, and I think for them, not having a huge parent company behind them, selling cheaper shit so they can profit from the systems is one of their priorities.  They then try to differentiate their products to make up for lower tech specs.  But I'm really just talking out of my ass at this point.  I don't know that much to really argue, but we have similiar interests.

The anger, it seems to stem from not enough Nintendo.  I agree, except for the part about not making a console.

I guess, deep down, we all have a sick, sick love for Nintendo and want to seem them rule the world like its 1993.

They're not going to rule shit by not supporting the HD features of my 3+ year old HDTV.

Much hate.

Agreed. Unfortunately they seem intent on making sure that never happens again.

Megaman Network Transmission was no Megaman 2 or 3.
Final Fantasy? Not for Nintendo.
Metroid Prime? Great stuff but no Metroid or Super Metroid.
Castlevania? Dead to them.
The nipponese strategy stuff? (Romance, Nobunaga, etc) Jumped ship to Sony.

Thing about Nintendo is I was always about their third party stuff as much if not more than the first party stuff.

I concede the above points.  Although, I must question whether not supporting HDTV is that big of a deal.  I guess for some it is, but those some are a (I would think) small minority. 

Let's put it this way. The hardcore of the hardcore gamers have HDTVs or will have them this christmas. Once people see how much better it is and all the support MS and Sony are giving them, it will be at the top of the list for necessary gadgets. Add to that the revolution is a full christmas or two away (they are notorious for delaying consoles, NOTORIOUS - that spring release date is nothing more than smoke & mirrors to scare Sony for being last to release, imo). Nintendo basically bent over and inserted a cactus all on their own.

It's a big deal for those of us that are looking to buy an HDTV.  I've owned the NES, SNES, N64 (uggg) and Gamecube.  I never bought another console brand until my Xbox and PSP.  I was given a Playstation but never caved to buying a PS2 (wish I had). 

And now, I probably won't buy the Revolution at all.  I can live without the exclusive Nintendo titles.  They're simply not getting the games I want to play. I thank them for bringing me the joys of video gaming in my youth and beyond, but it's time for them to go the way of Sega.

I wish I knew some of you in real life...you're all just so hardcore.  I saw a dude playing WoW in the law library today, but he is kind of a douche.

8 of us live in Phoenix. Yet we've never gamed together. Ironic that. If shockeye would get his bitchass over here, we'd get some Mario Power Tennis Golf Baseball going.

HD support is definitely overrated. That said, everyone know's what Nintendo's problem is. The first party games generally kick ass, but the 3rd party games are sparse.

That's a holdover of the days of NES and SNES when Nintendo had a lot of power and pushed devs around. Now that those devs have other options they are taking them. That wasn't a viable choice in the mid 90s.

Nintendo really needs to offer an olive branch to devs. Lower the price of the dev setups, make it easier to get them, etc. The game making side of Nintendo absolutely kicks ass. (I would say it is the best console game maker, by far) It's really the biz-dev side that is the problem.

I want Sega to rule consoles, and Commodore to rule the computer roost.

I only like Nintendo now that their ego has been smashed up and they have to stop bossing gamers and developers around. 

Aren't God of War and ICO inhouse SCE/A products? Sorry, but those are better than anything Nintendo has put out in a decade. Also, Capcom continues to impress nonstop - and they have since the days of NES. Nintendo's stuff is top-tier definately, but they haven't made anything on the level of the previously mentioned games since the Super Nintendo.

I will cry when the day comes that a console Requires HDTV. There are 3 TVs in my house. None of them are HD.

Hell, my TV is from 1987. It gets the job done fine, though I will cry when it dies.

It's really heavy.

There are so many reasons I quit playing games for nearly the entirety of college.

Upgrading shit was the big one. Thank god the Dreamcast had such terrible copy protection.

Black Sharpie Magic?

Give it a chance!  You've lived there like ten minutes!  I'm sure you guys will get sick of the sight of each other soon enough.

ICO is awesome, but I've only played through it all the way twice.  I have played Super Metroid, all the way through, at least once every year.  I admit I am totally biased, but still, Sony's best shit still sits in the shadow of Nintendo's best.  They are improving, though.

I'm afraid I cannot comment on God of War, I will not pay full price for a game that may cause me to break yet another controller.

Why would you break a controller over god of war? Normal difficulty is perfect.

The game is perfect as well. And people laughed when I said it was game of the year in April.

I broke two controllers over Metal Gear Solid. :nintendo:

I have anger issues, I guess.

Wal-Mart was feeling left out (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/09/01/news_6132378.html)

My 61" hdtv is only 105lbs.

Anyway, minority or no, I'd think one would have to consider the full lifespan of the console. a couple years from now, a whole lot of people will have hdtvs, even if it's a cheapy set. A lot more will have walmart edtvs, so widescreen support is going to be more important in the short term, but ultimately, not having hd is going to bite them in the ass.

I wouldn't consider a non-hd gaming platform, but again, I'm a bit ahead of the curve as I've been hd gaming for a couple years now. I think I may have mentioned how much I love it once or twice ;)

On Nintendo: Eternal Darkness and the Resident Evils were pretty much worth the console imo, but I won't buy another console for a couple of games, and neither of those games looks any good on my hdtv, though I admit it's partially my fault for not buying the component cable (for a couple games that aren't progressive scan nor widescreen anyway).

Your avatar makes me hate you.

Just don't get your blood on my new clown suit or go around asking jackassy questions.

There is no excuse for a console manufacturer to not provide legitimate game developers complete dev setups at no cost.

I'd think it would be easier to charge some amount of money for dev kits rather than try to determine who is legit or not - legit ones will pay the fee because they know they can recoup it.

I don't remember anyone laughing. I was saying the same thing, though I think RE4 is up there as well.

I got my GC that included Super MArio SUnshine for $100, and got a free game for preordering Wind Waker. I think I ended up getting 3 games plus WW plus the console for under $200, with all the coupons and registration and shit. Pick something up after the holidays and they usually have leftover bargain shit.

Eternal Darkness is highly worth it, but I got mine for the Zelda shit. Metroid PRime is fun if you just wanna blow shit up. And of course all the Mario multi-player fun so you can rebuff any accusations that you're antisocial.

NiNteNd0 4 Life, ninja!

Like I said, 5-10 games in the life of the system.

Xbox is no different, perhaps even worse in terms of Great games.  I don't see 360 being much different.  In retrospect, actually, quite a few systems suffer from the 5-10 games syndrome, at least from my perspective.  If one doesn't resort to picking nits, I can only think of the PSX and SNES as having been different, with PS2 coming close.  I guess it depends on what you are looking for in a game.  For what I want, Nintendo always provides.  Sony comes close.  Microsoft couldn't come close in it's wildest dreams, and the whole xbox culture turns me off to even thinking of picking up their garbage.  I don't play games because it's now acceptable in the mainstream, the trendy and hip thing to do, nor do I have the time to play a hundred "okay" games with extra shiney.  I'll take those 5-10, thank you, and any extra is pure bonus for me.

Yah, but she brought up an important point: Eternal Darkness.  I think whatever system gets the sequel (PLEASE MAKE ONE), I'm forced to buy.

Here's how I look at it:

Nintendo: RE4 & Eternal Darkness. Upcoming: Uhhhh, Fire Emblem (which apparently sucks). While, technically, I was impressed by Mario Sunshine, Melee, and Windwaker - they bored me to tears. I probably would have liked Metroid Prime if it weren't surrounded by games I was more interested in (2d metroid plz). Baten Kaitos' voice acting ruined it.

Xbox: Ninja Gaiden, Phantom Dust, Links, the online capabilities, and the best cross-platform ports. Upcoming: Stubbs the Zombie,  Castlevania: Curse of Darkness, and the 360.

PS2: Disgaea, God of War, REZ, ICO, Shadow of Rome, Stella Deus, Atelier Iris, Shadow Hearts, Katmari Damacy 1, Harvest Moon: Save the Homeland, Upcoming: Katamari 2, Radiata Stories, Magna Carta, Genji, Trapt, Suikoden Tactics, Fatal Frame III, Gitaroo Man, Wild Arms Alter Code F, Drakengard II, Resident Evil IV, and of course, Dragon Quest VIII.

The Xboxen I own were bought for media center capabilities and my inability to not buy special editions. My gamecube was bought to play Naruto 2 and then I started playing American stuff. The PS2 in my house probably has 4-5 times the games the GC has and about 2-3 times the amount of the xbox.

So your personal taste is a preference of third-party games, generally those that find their way to Sony's systems.  You listed RE4 twice, and Isn't Wild Arms Alter Code F a remake of the original on the PSX?

Internet forums for dummies: How to quote and "Sir Bruce" a poster using BBCode - An example.


Coincidental. I didn't list that many of the games I had. I just listed decent reasons for me to own systems. Nintendo being the weakest because...


The PS2 version of RE4 has an assload more content. Assload.


Yes.

I don't care which particular style you use to reply, but doing it that way is annoying.

BBCode is my arch nemesis.

It's not a coincidence, a lot of the more impressive third party games find their way on Sony's box.  I myself prefer first-party games of Nintendo and Sony over a lot of the third-party games, except for Square-Enix and perhaps Capcom.

So the PS2 RE4 has assloads more content?  Cool.  Too bad I myself have never been interested in Capcoms "extras" that they like to tack onto the RE rereleases.

I hope they are going to fix Wild Arms ridiculous random battle rate and maybe tweak that game's status effects for the remake, otherwise I just couldn't find myself enduring that game again even if the graphics are great.  If they pull it off as well as was done with MGS:Twin Snakes, then I will probably pick that up as well.  I had fond memories of playing an early PSX rpg that was not complete and total fucking ass(I'm looking at YOU, Beyond the Beyond).

What, you never played King's Field, which was pretty cool for its time or Vandal Hearts?

For shame!

Actually, I own Vandal Hearts.  Fantastic game.  However, in the early days I was on the lookout for a traditional RPG to hold me over till FF7 came out, and failed to notice the awesome Suikoden then because of the hideous box art.

King's Field made me angry, in many of the same ways that Morrowind does, but I admit it was quite ambitious and could have been one of the greatest games ever, if you ignore the simplistic graphics.  Plus, at the time my friends and I were still happily fighting each other in Toshinden.

It's got to be personal taste or some shit.  The awesome N titles are done at least with outside help, though.  The 3D Metroids are awesome and not to be confused with a FPS.  I love me some Super Metroid, and I love me some Primes for the same reasons.  You have to at least respect a team that can implement the Screw Attack in 3D and have it not suck.  There's also Paper Mario which fixes all that is broken with console RPGs.  Wind Waker was the next best thing to Ocarina.

I like Baten Kaitos, but I have +5 to my save vs bad voiceover.

Nintendo needs to open up to the 3rd parties, no doubt, but their quality control needs to stay in place.  A fine line to walk.  The library is all that is wrong with Nintendo, and is exactly why I take the PS2 with me when I travel instead of the Cube.

The Xbox... Ninja Gaiden, Azurik (hey, it was a release title), Phantom Dust, Jade Empire, maybe some more I forgot but not too many must-have exclusives there.  I can get Butcher Bay, Armed-N-Dangerous, the "good" Fable, etc for PC now (or soon).  It's got the best online setup and the console FPS crap all the kids are playing, but otherwise it's way behind the PS2 but in a different way.  It's just an alternate-universe GameCube, except I can't think of one big redeeming factor to make me choose it over either competitor.

Azurik was good? It boggles the mind.

Azurik, yes.  Adjust for time of release, blah blah, excuses, backtracking....

I did like the elemental combination system but compared to modern games the controls are crap.  On the other hand, it had relatively painless loading times compared to modern games (eat me Bioware).  The ending credits are the Best Ever, however; they are unmatched by any game I have ever completed.

Nintendo fans, myself included, are loyal to a fault. I will buy any console they produce as long as Zelda and Mario are there. Anything decent they do besides those two franchises is just gravy. Baten KAitos, bless its heart, had so much potential for a turn-based, card battle RPG (pick a genre plzkthx). I was SO excited for it, but then yes, the voice acting. The horrible, horrible voice acting. And the blatant FFX ripoff was a little tough to take.

Star Control 2.  Game.  Set.  Match.

And if you haven't played and completed SC2, why the fuck not?  Its free now!

I don't remember if I beat that one. I had it long, long ago (downloaded the abandonware recently though).

I played the battle mode of SC2 at a museum once, it was fun.

I just downloaded a version of it. It is not decidedly less fun.

Get the cluebook which is available in PDF form online, and DEFINATELY get the map.  It really makes the game great.
Don't feel like goofing around so much?  Just visit every point of interest on the map, and keep a notepad and markers so you know where you have gone.

Its what I did back in the day with the original map and the game.  (No cluebook though.)

Pkunk armada defeated all in my original play.  But I was wierd that way.  Not enough Arilou ships for me to bring in I think.  (Played ENTIRELY too much SC1 on the Sega Genesis.  Became a near god with the Arilou Skiff, especially when I had to play this guy who was an absolute DEMON with the Spathi.  It was more like ballet then a duel.  BEST MULTIPLAYER EXPERIENCE EVER.)

You can read the original story here. (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26008)

Yet another reason to avoid the launch pricing of the 360.

I think I already mentioned this, I don't see a lot of these games are going to ship on time. The schedule is just too tight. 9/10 launch games are just going to be normal XBox games with some higher res textures and some last minute shaders hacked in.

If you have completed Azurik, I'll go get SC2 this evening.

Got SC2 anyway, stayed up until 0200 playing it.  Awesome so far.

Fun, innit?  And you get the benefits of improved graphics and sound thanks to the Ur Quan Masters project.
I would recommend getting a control pad for the game though.

Maybe that was my problem....

Using the keyboard was pointless.

Xbox Live Supercharges Xbox 360 Online (http://www.xbox.com/en-US/news/2005/0908-xbox360online.htm?level1=enushome&level2=live4&level3=2005-0908-xbox360online)

I was considering it for Super Metroid, and I can see the value in UQM as well.  Right now I am sneaking around in unoccupied space, sending crew to their doom to collect useless rocks.


Put as much frosting on that turd as you like, Bill.

I don't see it as frosting. Removing the credit card is huge. They wouldn't have blindsided me with renewal like this. Now I have a year and I don't even have an xbox hooked up to the net atm.

I don't even use my account....but I don't know how to turn auto-renew off.

If you are going to get a 360 anyway, yeah it's gravy.  I remember your media prowess, so I think you are getting one asap?  I'm not going to get a 360 until later.  You know, once there's a reason to get one... maybe a game for it.  In my cryptic analogy, the 360 is the bloody stool while Live is the delicious strawberry frosting.

More than likely, I'm going to opt out of this entire upcoming console generation, with a slight chance of getting a Revolution.

You aren't the only one.

100-200 more for the console and an extra 10-15 dollars a game?

Please.

As it stands, in 3 months I'll have $700 to spend on a system.  90% chance to upgrade my computer and revisit the consoles at a later date.

(http://www.f13.net/images/necropost.gif)

I just found my original receipt for my Playstation. $329.99 on launch day before tax.

I have NO problem paying $399.99 for the Xbox premium kit now. And neither should you.

Too bad, I still do. Prices like that are why I don't buy consoles on launch day.

I just got three N64 games, a GC game and a game for the GBA for fifty. And I'm as giddy as a schoolgirl about it.

No offense, but based on the size of your game collection, you have no problem paying any price for just about anything gaming related.

If the new Zelda cost $100, I'd still buy it. Such is the nature of my disease.

I have to pay $3600 in property taxes by Nov 15, and I owe $1400 for homeowners insurance, plus the usual bills... so no thanks.  Did I mention I am now paying $63 a week for fucking gasoline?  I didn't have those kind of bills when I got my PS2. That half-baked release-version 360 can go suck a turd.  I'll get one later with a HD-DVD drive, and after the Rev and PS3 hit, there might be a game for the 360 besides PDZ.

That said, I'll buy the Rev and Twilight Princess no matter the price point.  Go go gadget hypocrisy.

/high five

It all comes down to the games to me. When I bought my PS2 it was essentially for one thing - GTA3.

Essentially I payed about $275 for GTA 3

Me too. =/


I thought you just were at all times.  :evil:

(http://www.emerchandise.com/images/p/SNL/pdTSSNL0007.jpg)

I used this piece of new technology called the Telephone.

Cool, you're telling us all what we should think now?

I paid $700 for an import JPN PS1 when it was released, but the days of me caring enough to take it up the ass on (or before) release date are done.
My slavering fanboi days are long over...

I'm not telling you what to think in the above post, just showing that it's not that much gouging all things considered. And it's true given the cost of all those peripherals sepearately. There's a simple argument to be made that all the accessories are overpriced and they probably are but it doesn't make the point less relevant. For the wireless controller, headset, and harddrive with the bundle - you're saving ~$60 (over retail). $700 though. Damn. What game did you get it for?

Links to the cluebook and map?

I found the game, which is leeching as I type. Enjoyed the hell out of this on my 3DO back in the day, it was one of the few games I kept out when I recently unpacked my 3DO into the loungeroom and went on a game cull. Keyboard + mouse would be much nicer...

I should have pointed out those were Australian dollars, though the .au$ was decent at the time.. call it about US$560. It came with Tohshinden, Ridge Racer, 2 pads, and.. one other game. I think.

I agree that the bundle saves you a lot of money off the seperate retail costs of the bitz seperately, but it's manufactured "value" as MS just sets the retail of the individual items for whatever they like. Between my work and wife, (and Warhammer hobby) I've got buckets of good games still to play/barely touched for my PC/PS2/X-Box/GC as well as plenty of retrogaming to do on my PS1/N64/SNES. I'm in no need for a quick fix of fractionally upgraded graphics on the same old games rehashed yet again at the prices they're asking.

I'm sure I'll eventually get all three new boxes, just because I'm a fucking idiot that way, but I'm in no rush. Next Christmas looks like a good time to start considering one of them.. price war, the best titles will go "Platinum", the usual.. you know the drill as well as I do. The following year they'll be even cheaper.

Hell, I'm considering getting a new X-Box to sit aside my current one, just so I can get it modded for media centre and MAME-ness on the big TV. SF2 anniversary arcade stick + MAME FTW! Seems like more fun to be had there than from the 360 in the next year or so.

IIRC, it was gotten off a fansite hosted by Classicgaming.com.  Check there.

At this point I don't think you CAN buy an Xbox 360 on launch day without Ebay or standing in line at a store at some ungodly hour. Most online outlets (including Amazon and Walmart) are sold out now.

Eh, I can wait. I still haven't picked up Ninja Gaiden for the Xbox (now that Old Man Easy mode is in, I can buy it!)

With the 360 coming out so soon, I forsee those X-Box titles I never got around to buying yet dropping in price bigtime within the next 6 months or so. I'll check them when they do that, and move to "Classics"..

Truth.  Ninja Gaiden Black is on the list, for when I get some free cash.

Another 360 game won't be on the shelf on launch day. (http://www.ebgames.com/ebx/product/256988.asp)

The jiggly will still arrive before Jesus' birthday, so it isn't all that terrible.

Saw the demo at Best Buy.

The fucking box is waaaaay bigger than the pictures make it out to be.

Have a demo at EB. Still smaller than the current xbox and looks about 500x better.

The title of this thread should have been "All I want is the $50 system." That would have made a lot more sense.

What happens to all the people who shelled out $1000 for some super-bundle then it turns out a bunch of those games aren't actually coming out at launch?

Go measure your original xbox.

(http://media.teamxbox.com/dailyposts/xbox360/specs/xbox360dimensions.jpg)

Edit:  1/2 an inch shorter.  From 12.6 to 12.1".  Awesome.

It's still ugly.

Fighting game with plenty of digital tits.. first person WW2 shooter.. yeah I can see where I'd be satisfied with that replacement.

I saw the nice little Call of Duty 2 demo on the 360 they were running at Best Buy.

On the TV/monitor/HD thing they had, it looked quite nice. Nice booming sound. I couldn't help but notice just how jaggedy and aliased the whole thing was, though, especially when compared to a computer with a decent video card set on a good bit of anti-aliasing. From a distance of my couch it might not be so noticeable. I also don't know if the TV they were using was HD or not, though it certainly had crisp color and good sound.

But it was still jaggedy. Enough so that it didn't make me want the system immediately. And especially not at a $400 price point. Half that, with a library of at least 10 games I want and another 20 I don't care about. That's what it'll take to make me want a 360.

*bites tongue*

If I'm spending $400 on a new system that won't reliably play all my existing X-Box games, they goddam better make me wet my fucking pants with the smooth crispness of the graphics, TV resolution or not. Nothing I saw made me think I couldn't see the same thing on the X-Box.

That's where I am right now as well.

Just like the xbox's flagship title Halo, it seems like the 360 is going to be nothing but a small evolutionary step in places others have been to before.  Who'd thought Microsoft would do such a thing?

The only good thing I can think of the release of the 360 is that now I can pick up a regular old XBox for way cheaper (and then I can play Siberia without having to boot Sauced off CoV). Seriously, as whorish as we both are for toys, we have tried two or three times to convince each other/ourselves that we should get an XBox and have just not quite been able to do it due to lack of games that interest us. I can still find a copy of Conkers Bad Fur Day for the N64 on eBay, so it's not really pressing.

No DOA4 and no Oblivion?  I wasn't really considering buying a launch 360 (read: you will be buying ver 2 in 8 months) only toying with the idea but now it is absolutely out of the question.

As far was what I expect graphics wise from the system?  It's a ramped up Mac with a good video card; the only thing it's really got going for it is that developers are able to focus on that set of specific design features.  Any improvements you see are going to be merely generational, as opposed to the PS3 or Revolution who are at least attempting break new paths.

They will experience as much personal growth as when their lottery numbers didn't hit.  Life's lessons are harsh.

I'm pretty much a playstation devotee. It's where my money goes. Unfortunately they are going to be much like the 360 in this battle. Which is ok with me.

As for Nintendo, another system I'll own 10-20 games for over the life of the console and be pissed that I bought one at launch instead of waiting.

You should institue a buy-ten-get-one-free punch card system. Hell, just make one yourself to take in to EB and look at them like they're crazy if they refuse to give you a free game for your ten stamps.

For someone who is such a fanboi of innovation, you sure do hate Nintendo and the Revolution.

I give an edge to the PS3 over 360 since I expect to see games like Ico, Colossus, Katamari, RotTK, and a host of tactics games exclusive to the platform.  Sony's edge is their library.  I am always irked that I keep finding PS2 exclusives even today.  Maybe some Japanese will learn to program for the 360, or programming for the Rev won't be like pulling teeth.

From everything I've read, Nintendo is doing their best of make the Revolution very developer friendly.

It's even funnier than that. I'm willing to buy a guitar, wireless arcade stick, a taiko drum - and hell, possibly even the chainsaw for RE4 because it's Better than the dual shock. But buying little dongles for a remote control seems insane to me. There's no logic here, just well...this:

(http://69.2.200.115/downloads/wizard-lucas.jpg)
"The power glove. It's so bad."

Yegolev, the list of Japanese developers for the 360 looks to be near as long as the PS3 one. There are a couple SCEJ groups - like Ueda's Ico/Colossus team that obviously won't jump ship. The endorsements by Team Ninja and Q/Mizoguchi will go a long way for the 360. They've also got a handful of VERY Japanese games on the horizon for 1st quarter 2006. I think localization is even more likely from their camp as Microsoft is probably going to use the localize and dump strategy that SCEA embraced about 80% of the time.

Someone may have posted this but... Final Xbox360 Launch list - far as I can tell:


Seems in line from what we've read. I guess all I'll be getting is Perfect Dark and Condemned.  :| I'm not even buying one on launch day now. A King Kong purchase is a possibility. I want an RPG and Soul Calibur 3.

Looks like most of that list is ports. I'll wait until next year.

Come now, it's not Microsoft's fault that sports games are easy to port and make assloads of money.

The old thread title was much better.   :cry:

Except I don't even want the $400 system anymore.

Meh, the $400 system will be priced-down to match the PS3 at it's release AND you'll have the bonus of not being one of the test-monkey generation boxes.  Has there been a single CD-generation console that didn't have something wacky in the first gen?

Yeah that launch list will so take me away from Dragon Quest 8 which comes out next week.

By take me away I mean money I can save for games and systems I would want to play, or use to
pay off bills faster.

What a shit release list for a system that isn't all that in the first place.

As long as you hide the huge and ugly power supply - which I guess stores do.

The King Kong demo is way better than the CoD demo Haem,check it out.

But still, I'm not excited about it at all.

Other than an irrational want-to-buy-it-cuz-its-new-and-shiney factor.

Wow, that might be the worst launch list I've ever seen. Basically all ports and sequels - how exciting!


HA HA HA..God that is hilarious. That's what you get for ordering months in advance - fucked! I wonder if they even bother to notify people that the bundle they already paid for changed.

If they had any class at all they would just ship it without DOA4 and include a $50 coupon or something.

Also on a random note programming for the GC was very easy, it was based on essentially OpenGL. Programming for the PS2 was very hard. Yet look at the PS2. I've said it before and I will say it again - ease of programming does not matter one bit. It never has any effect on game quality. And in a lot of cases "into to program" turns into "easy to program badly." (CE based Dreamcast games anyone?)

It's something programmers grumble about but not how decisions get made. The people who green-light games don't give a shit what system the programmers think is the best to work with. As a programmer you're just hoping the company decides to work on an easier system to make your life a little better.

List of backwards compatible games here...
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/backwardcompatibilitygameslist.htm

 Ya know, people can just trade in the Call of Duty. It's going to be a sealed retail copy and they'll have a receipt.

Saw a 360 playing Call of Duty at walmart, on a 20"ish widescreen set. Looked ok on the smaller screen. Some teen was playing and getting massacred. I mentioned I hated playing shooters with thumbsticks and he agreed, saying he prefered a mouse. Smart boy!

Anyway, this wasn't to bash consoles  :hello_kitty:, just to add to the news that demo units are out and about for people to check out if they're interested.

When I played the King Kong demo it seemed like the game stuttered a bit.

Great.  So half my collection won't work.  How nice!

And here is a 1up article about system launches clearly written by a retard:

http://www.1up.com/do/feature?cId=3145578&did=1 

I guess one would think the 360's launch lineup is good if they approved of the N64 and SNES launch lists..

The N64 and SNES didn't launch with a lot of games, but they did launch with good games. Mario 64 was amazing, and the SNES had both F-Zero and Super Mario World. Not quantitiy but at least quality.

The XBox doesn't have a single launch game that sounds the least bit exciting. Perfect Dark has gotten very mediocre previews, and when a game get poor previews you *know* it's going to be bad.

I wish they would just explain the backwards compatibility stuff already. Fuck the system is supposed to be out in a few weeks or so. Why don't they just fucking tell people how it is going to work?

My guess is the answer is that you need the hard drive and they don't want to come out and say it because it makes them look like retards for selling the "core" system without one. They are still being so vague about how it will work. "You need an emulator software program..." How about you tell us how I get the emulator, where it is stored, etc? Assholes.

What a load of bullshit.

The cube launched with Rogue Squadron and SSBM in just a short few weeks after the system.  I've yet to play a fighting game as entertaining as SSBM(yes, even Soul Calibur).

The PSX launch games were pretty good all things considered(Jumping Flash, yo!), but the goddamn thing was $400, an atrocious price at the time that conjured images of another Saturn.

The PSP launch was absolute garbage.  It had Lumines, Untold Legends, and then some movies, plus Metal Gear AC!D if you enjoy tactics games(which I do but could not stand the ridiculous amount of text involved).

I haven't bought 20 games for a system since the NES.  That's why I'm getting  a Revolution.  I haven't had a Nintendo since SNES, and I miss being able to count on guaranteed "money" games.  I don't have to read a review  of Nintendo first party games, I know they will be good.  It just makes the most sense for me in my life at this point.

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/backwardcompatibilityqa.htm

So about backwards compatibility:

You need a hard drive.
You can't transfer saved games.
You can't transfer downloadable content that you paid for!

The interview basically reads like this:

"Halo Halo 2 blah blah blah Halo blah blah blah Halo 2!"

Also the games will run at 1080/720. They will be "upscaled" and anti-aliased so they will look much better than they ever did on the XBox! (Of course, we've seen this before - essentially doing pixel doubling then anti-aliasing often looks blurry and distorted)

I think it's pretty weak overall, given that on the PS2 you could use your PS1 memory cards. I feel sorry for people that paid for downloadable content. So now your choices are pay again, don't bother with the content you paid for, or keep your original XBox hooked up as well. (If you can fit both into your entertainment center)

So yeah...the reason they have been quiet on the backwards compatibillity is because it sucks. I feel really sorry for the people who get a core system then want the compatibility.

Core system has got to be one of the worst ideas in the history of consoles.

I count that as 207 out of 769 (http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/catalog.aspx?g=0&c=10&s=0&xlm=0&h=0&r=0&p=1) making for 27% backwards compatibility.  That's rather pathetic.

It also says "A software emulator is required for each original Xbox game you play on your Xbox 360™ console", now does that mean you have to download a patch of sorts for each and every game?

Based off of that interview:

Yes. Yes it does.

27% of the games aren't worth playing. Seen the list. Not that bad.

The only thing you got hosed on is downloadable content you paid for. If you bought a core system you're a tool anyway.

"Hosed" is too strong a word: After all, your original XBox will not seize up and stop functioning just because you bring the 360 into the house. Just keep playing your XBox content on that.

That said, the backward compatibility seems to join the XBox Live camera as one of the "features" that won't be there much at launch. Then again, we are too jaded to have fallen for that hype anyway.

Haha did i miss the part where ya'll realise that you are buying a console from Microsoft?

 - meg

Another thing to think about is this.

Ok, you can drop 400 bucks on release day for shit games.

OR

Buy titles like Mario Kart DS, Dragon Quest 8, Guitar Heroes, and many other must have titles over every other currently out console that are all great fucking games worthy of your time.

I can get a ton of great games for 400 bucks. 

Then wait till the 360 is worth 2 shits.  Which won't be for at least a year.  Hell, maybe the PSP will even drop in price so Sony can grab a few people with money to burn on a new system.  (They just have released a 300 dollar PSP with a 1 gig memory stick in it after all.  250 for 32 meg vs 300 for a gigger?)

Hell, it might even be time to try out a Mac Mini or grab an iPod/Generic MP3 player of your choice.

So why exactly should I spend 400 bucks on a brand new system without a single fucking game I would buy if it were on any other system?
Elder Scrolls Oblivion aint out till 2nd quarter.  The Namco zombie game with the malls and the clotheslining of zombies aint out till who knows when.
Madden can fuck itself, and a pair of FPS games don't make me all excited in the bathing suit area.  Nor does Kameo, which I didn't care about when it
was a smeggin X Box game.  King Kong?  Its coming out for everything, not that I would want it anyhow.

Haven't the complete jokes that have been every other system launch taught us any fucking thing?

THE FIRST YEAR MOSTLY BLOWS.  WAIT A YEAR AND ITS CHEAPER AND BETTER.

The only two games I'm remotely interested in that're on the 360 are Call of Duty 2 and Oblivion.

...both of which will be/are available on PC. I played some CoD2 on the 360 demo station at my local Best Buy today. Eh, I'm getting the PC version.

As for Oblivion, what person who likes the Elder Scrolls series will get the version that can't be modded by end users?

Because Sony is a happy fun love company?

Yeah, fuck the 360 release. The X-Box games I'd be worried about playing on the new system aren't on the backwards compatibility list (the ESPN sports games), and since I couldn't even import saved games or downloaded content anyway, why the fuck would I want to do that? Their backward compatibility is just nil, at least for me. The web camera can go eat a bag of fucking hell and die. Their launch list is pretty much a joke. Ports, shooters and maybe 1 or 2 game I give a shit about. And they cost $10 more than other games. No thanks.

Maybe next Christmas it'll be worth it (and a reasonable price). But not now.

Not to defend the 360, more to bash the Xbox, but there were plenty of non-transferable savegames in the first place.  KOTOR comes to mind.  Not because the saves are too big for the standard card, either, since I grafted a large USB solid-state into the slot and the savegames still wouldn't copy.  Damn lazy-ass programmers.

It's a choice between the lesser of two weevils.

But hey, it's not like i paid for my ps2 (gifts are wonderful), and i use it for pretty much two things only - playing dvds and DDR. I suppose i will pick up Soul Calibur 3 sometime as well. However, i'm not sure what kind of raving consumer fanatic you'd have to be to even consider forking over US700+ up front for a glorified paperweight.

 - meg

See? I'm not the hatiest of the resident console haters.

Yes but by far the ugliest.

  - meg

 :-D

The 360, dissected.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2610&p=1

Love that external power supply.

That's not a power supply, that's a weapon. 

My "inside source" at Best Buy tells me that they are having some serious issues with their display models. Things like the controllers not working right, the machine just hard locking up in games, etc.

Yep, 6-month moratorium minimum.

Where does the headset plug into, the core box or controller?  If the former, doesn't that defeat the purpose of a wireless controller, esp. since MS is pushing hard to make XBox Life in every game, and the headset a core piece of that strategy?  If the controller... does it have the bandwidth for that sort of thing?

Anandtech is saying they think the 360 is due for a processor die-shrink by the end of next year. Sounds like next xmas might be the time to start thinking about the console. They also think we won't see good multithreading, thus the power of both 360/PS3, for at least two more years, more an end-of-cycle boost.

Some interesting reading over there, as usual.

It's a no-brainer to wait when you compare, using PS2 as an example, King's Field with God of War.  I'll get a 360, but probably not in 2006.

The first 360 price drop will depend heavily on whether the CPU and GPU have a die shrink and when the Revolution and PS3 come out and at what price. I'm guessing the first price drop will hit around E3 of next year with a $249/$349 most likely. E3 of next year we should start seeing a larger number of quality exclusive titles hitting as well. I would expect myself to be getting a 360 around that time.

Played Perfect Dark Zero and Condemned tonight on the xbox 360 demo unit. Aside from the LCDs they shipped being shiiiiiiiiiiiiiity, it was pretty damn good. Condemned had amazing lighting. And is possibly the scariest game I've ever played.

The original Xboxes were crashing in the demo displays too, if you'll recall.  It's just generally unwise to buy the early models of a console, as they're often shoved out the door with a bare minimum of quality control to meet the demands of zillions of consumers.  A few months down the road after the first revision is out, then it should be safe.

It's important to look at the inside of that xbox display. It's rigged all weird. Most of the stuff in that display isn't actually in the xbox unit. It's plugged into weird external shit that is no doubt meant to be a security thing incase someone steals the actual box (the display xboxen won't work if it's taken out, no question about that).

My local Wal Mart already has the games for sale and Perfect Dark Zero is the only one sold out, with Call of Duty 2 having a single copy left.

Of course there was tons of Kameos unsold, and the usual EA crap stinking up the shelves.

Man, they are making it SOOO easy for me to keep the hype from causing me to do something stupid and dipshitty like showing up at the 24 hour Wal Mart tomorrow night to buy one just because.  A little restraint on my part and I can avoid being a dumbass tomorrow night....

Kameo, PDZ, Call of Duty 2, PGR3, and Condemned are disappearing pretty damn fast from Gamestops around here. Myself? I'm having trouble finding copies of Ridge Racer 6 and NHL06, so they either shipped too few of them (likely) or are sold out most places (less likely).

So today in the newspaper the top story above the fold on page A1 is about the 360. Thank you for buying yourself into the news Microsoft. Please fuck off.

Useless advertorial 4TW!

At the moment I am planning on going to the 24 hour Wal Mart tonight.  I hope someone kicks me in the balls as I exit my house to prevent this
amazingly stupid turn of events.  Because while I have the money, the amount of self loathing I will inflict on myself for being a colossal douchebag
consumer sheep shithead will be HUGE.  And I only have 4 bottles of Sam Adams Light, and a 3rd of a bottle of 100 proof Southern Comfort
hanging around.

Maybe itll be sold out before 11.  There will be too many people there, yeah!  Or maybe the N Gage game package, my Dragon Quesr 8 package,
or the friggin Nintendo WiFi dongle I ordered nearly a week before Mario Kart DS came out will still show up on my doorstep within the next
2 hours so I will be distracted by the shiney and don't end up like the morons on G4 TV.

I suppose I could blame it on having to go to probate court wednesday before working the holiday weekend to take care of my father's estate,
but I will know deep down that I deserve a swift kick in the ass at the least, and being forced to go to a furry convention at the most as punishment
for being massively STUPID.

FUCK YOU GIANT HYPE MACHINE.  STOP GIVING MY ELECTRONICS PURCHASING ADDICTION ANY MORE FUEL FUCKBAGS.

Remember, the first lemming is one brave sonovabitch!!

(http://www.goofyphotos.com/fun/lemming.jpg)

Pussy.

It's new and shiney.

I may be a weak man.

Here's to hoping nobody nearby has stock.

And a big fuck you to pa.com.

That's it?   I deserve FAR worse than that dude. 

Shockeye is just upset cuz he isn't getting one. Everyone send him a teddybear. And a tiny violin. MUAH.  :evil:

Well I am now not an idiot.  Was 52nd in line with 48 systems in stock, 32 of which were the good version, all of which were confirmed to be bought.
Not wanting to stand in line for an hour for the shitty system with which to play games I honestly don't give a damn about, I left.

The highlights?  2 middle aged people buying the systems SOLEY to sell on ebay since they saw them going for 2000 dollars today.  Only one of them was gonna get one, with the other person missing out.  Some asshole that had been there since 10 AM who was 16th in line was willing to selll his spot in line for 350 bucks. 
A surprising number of people with younger kids there buying them as well.  Nice to know some kids are spoiled rotten.  And that people are loser enough to stand in line for 10 HOURS or more.

Will I end up getting a 360 this year now?  Even if available probably not.  Maybe not even at the first price drop.

However Apple is having a sale friday so I might just be ordering an Imac or Mac Mini depending on what sort of deal is going on.

I almost picked up a PSP Gig Pack today, but then realized its a 300 dollar system with games I don't really want except for 1 EA game.
Saving me money yet again.

So Microsoft's hype has turned from making me enthusiastic about the 360 to making me bitter and hostile towards it, which is even less
respect I had for the system than before.

The mere existence of the Core System, the absolute stupidity of a worldwide launch (im sorry but Japan doesn't really care so why even
bother there so soon?) causing even less systems, and the launch list which is full of games I wouldn't ever normally buy for the X Box
or PS2 in the first place doesn't exactly make me jump for joy.  Sadly Sony will almost certainly pull this same sort of crap when they
release the PS3, cept with hardware that breaks down more.  Nintendo's utter lack of popularity should guarantee me a Revolution at
launch should I want one.

I went to the store knowing I was stupid for going.  I was rewarded with a waste of my time.

GO GO WORLDWIDE RELEASE~!

Just checked out the local site.. http://www.xbox.com.au

Hm.. lots of hype.. a link to the US site to tell us how AWESOME the thing is.. no details on price or release date or anything..


So I ring a local EB, just for gits and shiggles.. the servitor was nice enough, they have no definate info on it yet, but they're hoping for a March or April release, and "don't quote me on this" the price they think will be around the AU$600-$700 mark. A direct currency conversion to US$ is $440-514. No clue as to whetherthats the barebones system or the fully loaded one..

But the good news is that I can play all of my XBox games on it! Obviously someone's not fully informed.. and I can play all my XBox games on my XBox, too. Of course, it's only $10 to preorder it, and I can trade in any number of games for $10 credit each towards it (New games here cost $80-90)

Yeah.. XBox 360 might be something for me to look at in 2007, I think...

Penny-Arcade?

While I'm not as critical of them as some people are, I'm sure their special relationships in the industry would help them to get a pair of release core packs as well as whatever all the release software is. Screeners cost nothing after all...

Not that they can neccessarily be bought, per se, but I'm sure that if I had a free 360 with bucket of free games delivered to my door, that my honest opinion of the exciting new toy would be that much more positive than if I paid, you know, $1000 that I can't afford on it.


 

So myself and a friend where planning on going to try and get some at a wal*mart near me. But in a last ditch attempt to stop myself, I turn to my trusted* gamespy.

There isnt a single launch title that I want. I am not about to rush out and grab this thing just to not have any games I want. Also, I have a WOW guildie who works at best buy, and he said they are getting a LARGE shipment in two weeks. This small release is just to drive the consumer in to a buying frenzy when the next batch hits stores.

I do want to see it on my new TV soon though. Hey Hat... nener nener nener.

I like mine.

Since I haven't owned a console since the NES, when will the 2nd gen systems drop in price?  I might be able to justify a PS2 for the children :wink: if Sony decides to lower prices for Christmas.

I felt like a marketing whore when I bought that Powerbook earlier this year, but you Xbox fellators redeemed me and showed me you can do worse. Thank you!

I was there too at Walmart, like a fool.  They had only 14 units at their superstore, with only 6 of them being the good units.  They had 14 chairs lined up (4 empty) at 5:30 PM and briefly considered being an ebay whore before going home. 

Since the first people in line were getting the good units I actually talked some of the later people out of line.  A lot of people don't realize the core system will not allow you to play the old x-box games.  I'm guessing this will turn around and bite Microsoft in the ass.

I don't think Sony's going to be loweirng the PS2 price from it's $150 zone for a few months yet.  If you're buying for the "kids" get a Gamecube, it's only $99 and you can usually get a bundle with a game for that price.  Despite the hate here, it's a far better system than the PS2 or the X-box IMO, since there's plenty of games for my kids and myself on it. Plus they're all pretty damn fun.  Too many people stuck in the 'worrying about what other people think' part of their lives give the cube a hard time because the games are 'cute.'

Don't get me wrong, I don't regret my PS2, because I bought it for the PS backwards compat and FFX, but I've enjoyed the Cube more.

The Cube certainly fits the price range.  What are the best games for 5 and 3 year old boys?  I see Lego Star Wars which would seem right up their alley.  Paper Mario? 

I know RE4 will have to be Daddy's game but I don't follow many of the "cute" games for some reason.

Oh: Something else I really like about the Cube.. you can have 4 players on it straight out of the box, and most kids games support that many players.  A big plus when you have to occupy the kids, or you want to play with them and not leave anyone out.

Super Smash Brothers Melee is a must unless you disagree with 2d fighting games.  Lots of unlockables and you get to beat on each other with the iconic Nintento characters of past and present.

Mario Kart is supposed to be really good, but my daughter wanted Kirby's Air Ride instead. (she's 7) I think it's pretty fun, and also has lots of unlockables in terms of cars and tracks.

My wife bought Lego Star Wars for the Gameboy, and it was damn fun.  I imagine the Cube version is just a bigger world, so yeah, I'd put that on the list.

They'd probably like Viewtiful Joe, though it might be a little frustrating for kids that young.  Depends on how their skills are and how into video games they get.

 I have a few games just for myself, Soul Caliber 2, Zelda, Metroid, and the rest I rent before buying.  Custom Robo's on my rental list, but I don't think I'd buy it because there didn't seem to be a lot to it.  Shrek 2, Mario Party (version whatever), Pokemon Colosseum, and Super Monkey Ball round-out our library.

Best Buy has a bundle with both Metroid Prime and Zelda:Wind Walkers.  However, it is sold out online and the nearest store with the bundle is a 45 minute trip one way.  The local store has the Smash Bros. bundle. 

I may need to convince the wife that the kid's need a console for Christmas.

Does anyone play Animal Crossing or Harvest Moon?  Those seem like games that would interest both the kids and the adults.

I will agree that the Cube is a better system than the PS2, except for the ginormous library of games the PS2 has. But the X-Box? No. It just isn't. It has no online play, and the X-Box's online play is luv with the right games (and there are a ton of those games).

But for younger kids, yes the Cube is the best option especially when you consider the price. Hell, buy a used Cube for $79 at EB. That's what I did. Also, if you buy a Cube and don't buy either Eternal Darkness or Resident Evil 4, you are a fool who deserves to buy a 360 at release in the part of the country where every game is sold out. They are just that good.

My 5 year-old son plays his Gamecube quite a bit. He enjoys any Star Wars game he can get his hands on, especially Lego Star Wars. He also has been playing Mario Superstar Baseball and Sonic the Hedgehog games. As for 3 year-olds, the Gamecube does have some Winnie the Pooh games.

I don't need one. I don't need any game machine, really. So what if I miss out on the latest shiny? Most of the games out there are poor ports of games for existing systems. Sure the graphics are nicer, but to rush the games out the door they dropped modes and gameplay elements found in other versions of the same game.

The lack of a hard drive being standard is also a very big negative to me. Very big.

Paper Mario is fabulous. It should've been called "My First RPG".

I wrote a review for LEgo Star Wars (that didn't get posted) that specifically said it was a great game to play with your kids. It's easy enough for lil' tykes and fun enough to play with them.

Played 'em both, loved 'em both, but they both get grindy after awhile, as there are no real events. Might be good teething rings for future MMOG players, though. ANimal Crossing is in real time, however, so if it's it your birthday irl, the critters give you a present (usually a playable NES game that you can actually play in your little house). And if it's the middle of the night irl, the animals in your town are mostly asleep.

Mario Kart: Double Dash!! is love on the 'Cube for any age, IMHO. And there are a host of other titles as well, but despite the "quality over quantity" premise, there are some clunkers (DDR Mario and Universal Theme Park come to mind).

I'll skip on the X360 and instead get a GameBoy Micro to weld my favorite GBA game - Pinball Deluxe - into. What I wouldn't give for a version of that game with actual hiscore saving!

Only video pinball game I ever cared for was Pinball Illusions. I'd rather play a real table.

Well, that's one half of Pinball Deluxe, the other being (of course) Pinball Dreams.

Then again, some people have been saying nice things about Metroid Pinball on the DS.

Real pinball machines decay: In Gothenburg there is an arcade with 5 or so Addams Family machines - one of the best pinball machines of its generation. But all of them have defects from wear and use. Pinball sims don't have that issue.

*installs Pro Pinball: Big Race USA on the PC*

The only way the hard drive isn't standard is if you think of the core system as a viable option. I think of it as ghetto subsidization and pretend it doesn't exist. Then there's only the "regular" bundle. Where things like "Can the PS3 be $400 too? I'd pay it again." pop into my head. But seriously, there's only one bundle. Ignore the low end. If you can form the words 'hard drive" and "standard"  without stuttering, it's not for you.[/b]

Ok, you're telling me Pinball Illusions is on the GBA?

And second, I completely agree with Addams Family being a great machine. The local second-run movie theatre here has an Addams Family machine in great condition.

The hard drive is not assumed by developers and therefore not standard. Games will be developed with the harddrive as an "maybe" instead of a "definitely".

I'm gonna pass for at least the next 6 months.

Oh yeah.  Don't forget the Gamecube has the Gameboy Player attachment.  Run all Gb-GbA games on your Cube.

Ill ditto the love for Eternal Darkness, and add in Beach Spikers, Phantasy Star Online (With offline Coop play!  Just have
a strategy guide handy for weapon stats.), Super Monkey Ball, and Skies of Arcadia as games that are quite good.

I goofed: Binary Nine took the "prequels" Pinbal Dreams and Pinball Fantasies (not Pinball Illusions) from the Amiga, made picture- and physics-perfect (including the odd ball movements at times) copies of them and put them into a GBA cartridge, and had Ubisoft publish it as Pinball Challenge Deluxe (forgot the middle part, just had a look at the cart though).

Sans any battery save, the cheapskates.

Digital Illusions' pinball games (http://www.mobygames.com/game_group/sheet/gameGroupId,2888/): The two on the cart are the two earliest ones, then.

Edit: Since Digital Illusions, better known as DICE (http://www.dice.se) were bought by EA if memory serves, the chance we'll get to see Pinball Illusion on e.g. the DS is slim I'd say. A pity.

Dammit Morph.

As I was playing it at BB today, I wanted to take it and hook it up to the SXRD on display.

If you get a cube for the kids, the Mario Party series is actually very good, particularly the latest one. Essentially it's a consolised boardgame, with cute little mini-games that aren't too hard for younger kinds/wives/girlfriends etc and other non-gamers. Lego Star Wars is also a very good buy (though I have it on PS2).

IMO the only people playing the "console love/hate" game should be 16 year old little pimply morons, certainly not posters to this site..

And splitting the userbase by harddrive worked really well for that PS2 hard drive, didn't it?

Yeah, splitting the userbase from the get-go was a smaaaart idea... I'm sure the initial launch will be very successful, but then again, so was the Saturn's.

Comparing the Xbox to a machine doomed from the start isn't fair. It's not going anywhere and Microsoft has enough Japanese/American developer support to sell a slew of consoles. Deal with it.

I'll try to deal with it, but it'll be hard, you know? I'm close to tears on the topic as it is. :roll:

I know MS has a fuckton of money behind them, and they certainly have brandname recognition amongst the kids these days, I just think it's a severely fucked move to release the unit without the HDD, and that even if it doesn't bite MS in the ass, it'll definately bite people like yourself in the ass when 75% of games don't support the HDD much beyond using it as a giant memory card, when it could be so much more.

Then again, probably 60% of those games will be cross-platform ports, and so will be programmed to the lowest common denominator of all three. Maybe with some extra bump-mapping or ani-aliasing on the side for localisation..

I'm not filled with love for Sony (go go rootkit, go go one colcole per-disc technology) or Nintendo (nunchaku controller) either, but I'll call a retarded move a retarded move, when I see one.

Seems to be a frighteningly large failure rate out there (obviously not a scientific poll):

http://forum.teamxbox.com/showthread.php?t=392599

With this being the common crash:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80491849@N00/

Well, if the units are returned, perhaps they'll recoup the $126 loss per machine (http://businessweek.com/technology/content/nov2005/tc20051122_410710.htm). How many games per box does that translate to?

Am I just imagining things, or did I hear that the 360 controllers will work with the original X-Box machines? If so, I might have to get one, as I like the feel of the new controllers.

Those crashes look an awful lot like overheating related video card lockups to me.

Not that my 64meg GF2 ever tossed out a screen full of artifacts and locked up or anything. Never.

My house had it's on for roughly 12 hours yesterday. it never so much as got hot. But then, we were smart enough to sit the power supply and unit about 3 inches off the ground off wire mesh with 1 inch holes in a room with good circulation. It couldn't get hot it if wanted to.

This guy says it'll work with any PC running Windoze XP, too.

 Linky for Haemish (http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,1884833,00.asp?rsDis=Xbox_360_Controller_for_Windows-Page001-164918)

Windows XP, yes.

Original xbox, I don't think so.

In THEORY it'll work for the original xbox, but only if you're brave.

There are people who have chopped up USB cables and chopped up original xbox controller cables, spliced the correct wires, and had the original xbox controller working on PC.

Later, someone made a xbox controller -> usb deally that worked on PC.

You'd need the reverse of that. Since it has the same buttons plus that big thing in the center, I don't see why it wouldn't work.

Someone donate $40 to me and i'll fuck with it this weekend to see if it's possible. If it works I'll send the finished results to you.

I made a USB to Xbox cable and a cable for Xbox to USB to use my Xbox controller on my PC. Maybe I'll bring my Xbox to USB cable over to schilds and see if an original Xbox controller works on his 360. Provided I'm allowed to touch it.

Not like that you aren't. I'm going to go as long as humanly possible without using anything but the two buttons on the front of the unit. I don't want to chance first-gen hardware explodering. I currently charge my 360 controllers on my PC. Far away from the virgin USB slots on the 360.

Die in a Xbox fire. (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/11/23/xbox_blaze/)

the top two shoulder buttons just don't sit right for me

If I had to complain.

That's one of my big problems. Fortunately, it's still 10x better than the slightly awkward black and white buttons on the original. I think I just have to remember that they exist as I quickly wonder where zee new buttons went. The controller itself though? Super comfortable.

Slightly?  They were downright unusable.

Ive not even picked up one of the new controllers yet but that was my main gripe with the xbox S controller. Buttons there just seem perfect to me. Middle finger triggers, index taps.

Does it not work as good as it should?

I never had a problem with the black/white buttons on the S controller. The buttons above the triggers on the 360 I really dislike. I already hated the Z button on the Gamecube controller, this is more of the same. Ick.

Z button sucked.

L and R on snes was fine. L + R + triggers underneath just seems great.

Please tell me the default gear change buttons in PGR3 are the white/black top buttons, and brake/gas are the triggers. It just makes too much sense.

L an d R are the brake/gas for Ridge Racer 6. I haven't tried manual transmission yet despite driving one irl.

The best controller I had, button-wise, was the old thrustmaster firestorm. Four shoulders ala PS2 plus two triggers ala xbox S. I could fly a plane like a mofo with that thing, but the formfactor sucked, sharpy corners for the ache. I feel restricted with only 4 non-face buttons, whether they be 4 shoulders/no trigger or 2 shoulders/2 triggers.

I love the logitech wireless rumblepad 2 I've got for the pc, but it's only got two shoulders and I can't use it for flying in bf2 for crap :(

edit: the thrustmaster I mentioned:

(http://www.matos2000.com/Aut/manettes/thrustmaster-firestorm-dual-power-gamepad-usb/dessous.jpg)

A lot of store displays had overheating problems. Maybe it will be like some of the first Saturns that caused fires in Japan.

Logistically, the store displays are designed in a way that no home user could ever recreate. Horrible cooling, bad vent placement. They're just shit.

You're like an over-protective dad. It's sweet.

(http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/Infographic-Xbox-360-C.article.jpg)

Usually you're pretty good at baiting. That's just weak. Must have had an off morning.

He's no WUA WUN.

Christ, show somebody who gives a fuck on the doll where I touched you all. I'll get me coat.

Alright, i messed with the new controller last night and I agree, the trigger/button placement sucks.

If they added top buttons to the xbox S controller it would have worked out much better. There needs to be more space between the triggers and the index-finger buttons.

The 360 and SWG seems to have sucked the humour right out of everyone around here.  If SWG every did come out for the 360, this board would assplode.

Not everyone! I'm surprised that this and SWG thread have more than 5 pages myself. These are two subjects totally not worth talking about THAT much....Let alone losing humor over.

Also, SWG would never make it to a Microsoft console. Have no fear for that at least.

SOE may be the developer of SWG but LucasArts/Lucasfilms is the publisher, IP holder, and copyright holder of the game. SOE might be able to refuse to do an Xbox/360 port of the game (dunno what their contract stipulates) but LucasArts could certainly find somebody else to do the porting work if they were willing to spend that kind of money.

I laughed.

"Can turn all the way around, apparently"
Hey people, it's just a new toy with a stupid name (not that I'm not working my ass off trying to get MS to part with one... preferably before the 2nd when they're released here...)

So Schild, are you going to secondhand the 1st-gen one you have right now when the next revision of the things come out (with less potential explodeyness)?

Also, does that giant powersupply get hot? I read about your placement of it, and that does seem the smartest way to have the thing, just that those kinds of boxes do tend to heat up regardless, so I'm wondering what the 360 ones are like.

I liked the onion graphic. They're always worth a chuckle.

My old xboxen have been relegated to networked media center status. They are by far the best, cheapest and easiest media streaming boxes on the market.


Neither the 360 or the power supply ever get hot. I have a feeling that the people with problems have done one of the following things:

A. Sat it on the old Xbox.
B. Stuffed it into a home entertainment center of some sort with zero airflow.
C. Sat it on carpeting.
D. Sat it next to something that produces just as much heat and blows it towards the xbox.

Those are the kinds of things Joe Sixpack would do. I wish I could empathize, but people really should know better. Especially after they see the nuclear device that powers the 360.

Or they could just get a Nintendo instead, since they make hardware that can take a beating, and was built to last, designed for consumers.

Game consoles are MEANT for carpets.  Microsoft should like know that. 

No game console was ever meant for carpeting. That's just insane. Have dry winters? Static electricity will kill your console. Don't put the goddamn thing on a carpet. None of them. Not even the original NES. Hell, I knew better when I was 6.

No, I dont mean your XBox 1s, I mean your first-gen, fragile-may-explode-at-any-moment brand-new 360.




Neither the 360 or the power supply ever get hot. I have a feeling that the people with problems have done one of the following things:

A. Sat it on the old Xbox.
B. Stuffed it into a home entertainment center of some sort with zero airflow.
C. Sat it on carpeting.
D. Sat it next to something that produces just as much heat and blows it towards the xbox.

Those are the kinds of things Joe Sixpack would do. I wish I could empathize, but people really should know better. Especially after they see the nuclear device that powers the 360.

Well, A, C and D I can agree with you on, but the fact is that MS should know that the things are really very much going to be stuffed into B's and perhaps design accordingly. After reading those links on the explosive XBox 1s though.. ergh.

As for using your <console name here> controllers on the 360, just give it a month or three and then check out this link. There will be stuff there, very very soon...
http://www.lik-sang.com/list.php?nav=left_top&category=160&

Have I mentioned lately that I'm quite glad I'm waiting until next year to get one of these newfangled 360 things?

Japan Analysts Cold Shoulder Xbox 360 (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1814&Itemid=2)

On the eve of Xbox 360's Japanese launch, leading analysts in the country are all but writing off Microsoft's chances of seriously challenging Sony, or even of launching a successful platform.

Nobuyuki Kawamata of Tokai Tokyo Research Center said, "No one -- consumers or software makers -- has been talking about the Xbox 360 lately, although we only have a couple of days before the release. Given also the fact that basic functions of Xbox 360 are inferior to Sony's next-generation machine, and that there are not many newly-developed titles ready for the Japanese launch, Xbox 360 is not likely to become a must-buy console here in Japan."

Hirotoshi Murakami at Mitsubishi UFJ Securities said, "We had previously thought that Xbox 360 could gain a major share of the Japanese market by taking some market share from front-runner Sony Computer. But we now think that such a prospect may not be realized, given the limited attractiveness of its titles and its lukewarm functions."

Shinko Securities analyst Yuichi Kobayashi said, "Given declining enthusiasm for the Xbox 360 by Japanese players and software makers, it would be almost impossible for Microsoft to overtake Sony or even Nintendo. Even from the global viewpoint, unless Sony fails to bring the next-generation PlayStation 3 consoles to the market on time, Microsoft appears to have almost no chance to be the industry leader."
 
Japan is seen as crucial top Microsoft's global Xbox 360 strategy. Yoshihiro Maruyama (pictured) , head of Xbox Japan said, "Japan is a very important market for our global strategy, and launching our console ahead of rival platforms will give us a certain advantage. Unless we achieve meaningful success here, we cannot say we are a winner in the next-generation console battle."

Fucktard. We don't even KNOW the basic fucking functions of the PS3 yet. They haven't even released the specs that would lead anyone to say they know for sure what those functions are. Smells like someone has his nose firmly entrenched in Sony's behind.

Emphasis mine.  And, ouch.  8)

Alkiera

He meant in Japan.  The original X-box was far, far behind the Cube in Japanese sales, if I recall correctly.

In any given week in Japan the sales of the XBox for the past year or so have been on the order of tens to the low hundreds. They probably sold a couple thousand Xboxes in Japan ALL of last year.

One big problem is the major games are games the Japanese don't care about. Call of Duty? Perfect Dark? Madden?

The 2 big "next-gen" consoles are realy over-rated in terms of horsepower anyway.

Yes, they are. As I've pointed out, to support HD you need a 4x increase in performance to break even. Then there is the issue that in HD if you have the same number of polys on screen it will be more noticeable, so you really need to increase the number of polys you can display as well, just to break even. So you need 4x the fill rate, 4x texture memory (for higher res textures), 4x the number of polygons, etc, just to take advantage of HD support. (Which means, if you are not running in HD, your are using 1/4th of the power you theoretically have.

Now of course 4x the number of polys in HD is still 4x on a normal TV, but much less noticeable.

Every new system over-promises, with the exception on Nintendo, they typically are at least more honest, at least with the GC and Rev. (The N64/Ultra64 was pretty guilty of overselling)