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Title: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Shockeye on May 11, 2005, 12:54:44 PM Quote from: AP Police Shoot Buffalo Escaping From Packing Plant (http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/4472052/detail.html#121) Monday Incident Mirrors Similar Shooting In 2003 POSTED: 11:29 am MDT May 10, 2005 COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. -- Police Monday shot and killed five buffaloes that escaped from a meatpacking plant. file photo Instead of fleeing, the buffalo began grazing in a yard and police fired at the buffalo with semiautomatic rifles as each charged officers one-by-one. "If five of them would have charged at once, I'm not sure we would have had enough manpower to kill all of them," Colorado Springs police Lt. Larry Laxson said. The buffalo managed to get out when a truck driver didn't properly park his truck in the delivery chute at the G & C Meatpacking Plant, said plant owner Frank Grindinger. Two homes were evacuated and police cordoned off several blocks. By the time all five animals were shot, at least 120 rounds had been fired, a few that hit empty houses and a nearby car, Laxson said. The first buffalo took several shots in the head and "didn't even flinch." "It was not a good ending. We did whatever we could to try to capture the animals without killing them," Laxson said. Nearby resident Martha Muehl said she felt bad for the animals, but added people are the main concern. "It's horrible, but it would have been even more sad if they had killed a person," Muehl said. Grindinger, the plant owner, said six buffalo escaped in December 2003. Three were also shot by police. Emphasis mine. Let's see. They're in a field grazing and you can't hit them. Nice. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: HaemishM on May 11, 2005, 12:58:53 PM Wow, hope they never have a hostage situation in that town that involves the need for a sniper.
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: WayAbvPar on May 11, 2005, 12:59:36 PM Good lord. see water, unable to hit falling out of a boat and broad side of a barn, missing.
Spray and pray ftw I guess. Also- Quote Grindinger, the plant owner What a great name for a meat-packing plant owner. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: blackotter on May 11, 2005, 01:00:35 PM Quote Instead of fleeing, the buffalo began grazing in a yard and police fired at the buffalo with semiautomatic rifles as each charged officers one-by-one. "If five of them would have charged at once, I'm not sure we would have had enough manpower to kill all of them," Colorado Springs police Lt. Larry Laxson said. Ah..the cops may be low level, but at least they know how to control aggro. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Pococurante on May 11, 2005, 01:14:30 PM Ah..the cops may be low level, but at least they know how to control aggro. /chuckle Buffalo are way cool and unless mistreated are mellow animals. Once I convince my wife they won't jump the fence I'm pasturing a couple. Then extending the fence up another six feet... Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: voodoolily on May 11, 2005, 03:57:34 PM Anyone who's ever played Oregon Trail knows how hard it is to bag a buffalo.
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: WayAbvPar on May 11, 2005, 04:10:00 PM Anyone who's ever played Oregon Trail knows how hard it is to bag a buffalo. Don't you mean Custer's Revenge (http://www.classicgaming.com/rotw/custer.shtml)? Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Samwise on May 11, 2005, 04:16:20 PM Buffalo are way cool and unless mistreated are mellow animals. Once I convince my wife they won't jump the fence I'm pasturing a couple. Then extending the fence up another six feet... There are buffalo living in Golden Gate Park in San Francisco with little but a thin chainlink fence separating them from humanity. If they ever got it in their heads to leave, I don't think the fence would stop them. And as far as I know they've been there for over 100 years without a single jailbreak attempt. "Mellow" is a severe understatement - a casual observer would probably conclude that they're stuffed. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: MaceVanHoffen on May 11, 2005, 04:22:48 PM "Mellow" is a severe understatement - a casual observer would probably conclude that they're stuffed. Heh when I moved here one of the first things I did was take a bike ride through Golden Gate Park. I had exactly that initial impression. I wondered why in the heck people would make a whole field of stuffed buffalo. I blamed it on those crazy San Franciscans. Then I saw one move. I still blamed it on those crazy San Franciscans. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Polysorbate80 on May 11, 2005, 05:04:11 PM Buffalo are big and not very smart; I'm not surprised it was hard to kill them They're big enough to absorb a lot of relatively small semiautomatic rifle rounds (I didn't see in the article how many of those 120 rounds actually hit the critters?)
(Which leaves unanswered the question of why the idiots shot the buffs in the first place...) Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Trippy on May 11, 2005, 08:30:37 PM There is something to this story they aren't telling us. Why would buffalo that are peacefully grazing suddenly start charging the cops one by one? It sounds more like the cops were antagonizing the buffalos individually, perhaps by doing something stupid like trying to tazer them, or perhaps by yelling at them on the bullhorn telling them to spit out their cuds and to step away from the grass.
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Nazrat on May 12, 2005, 04:57:06 AM They're coming right for us!!!
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Pococurante on May 12, 2005, 05:25:58 AM Damn all this talk of buffalo has me craving deep-red tasty ribeye. Beefalo is some of the most flavorful muscle tissue on this planet.
Quote If they ever got it in their heads to leave, I don't think the fence would stop them. Yup that's true - one to two tons of attitude can be pretty convincing. The young ones are amazingly nimble but even a full-grown adult can leap over an eight foot fence. Kind of like watching a pickup truck suddenly decide gravity is optional. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: UD_Delt on May 12, 2005, 07:28:43 AM They're coming right for us!!! Glad to see I wasn't the only one who thought of that South Park episode... Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Mortriden on May 12, 2005, 08:38:24 AM Anyone who's ever played Oregon Trail knows how hard it is to bag a buffalo. Holy Christ. I thought we were the only ones to play that game in school. It was always fun to laugh at the poor bastards who tried to take the "shortcut". Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: kaid on May 12, 2005, 09:48:25 AM They also mention in the article how many times they shot the buffalo in the head. The head is probably the LAST place you should shoot a buffalo with small caliber rounds and assult rifle type ammo. I have doubts the bullets would even penetrate the skull of a buffalo.
You pretty much would want a chest shot to lung shoot it or hit the heart but from the sounds of it they were going head on at the buffalo which is really not how you want to have to put one down. kaid Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Fargull on May 12, 2005, 01:46:05 PM Emphasis mine. Let's see. They're in a field grazing and you can't hit them. Nice. Gorgious. Probably part of the NRA. Sited later as a reason hunters need automatic weapons for deer. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Hoax on May 12, 2005, 05:32:53 PM There are buffalo living in Golden Gate Park in San Francisco with little but a thin chainlink fence separating them from humanity. If they ever got it in their heads to leave, I don't think the fence would stop them. And as far as I know they've been there for over 100 years without a single jailbreak attempt. "Mellow" is a severe understatement - a casual observer would probably conclude that they're stuffed. Those are water buffalo right? I dont know if there is a diff but they sure are mellow as hell. For much of my early childhood I was not sure if they were alive or not. Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Samwise on May 12, 2005, 05:59:21 PM Nope, American Bison, aka American Western Buffalo, aka Bison bison. Technically not really a buffalo, but only nitpicky biologist types care about stuff like that. :wink:
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Strazos on May 13, 2005, 07:15:28 AM Funny, people didn't have a ton of trouble taking out this kind of Big Game in the 19th century.
Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: kaid on May 13, 2005, 07:27:58 AM I have been on buffalo farms when I was doing my time working for the govt and the females and calves are all pretty mellow. They may circle up if they feel threatened but most of the time you can walk through their pastures without any more worry than you would with normal meat cows. Males tend to be more fiesty but frankly I have seen bulls that are FAR worse tempered than most american buffalos I have had contact with.
And like most herd animals get them to respect the fence young and they will never even attempt to go through it. I have seen some weak freaking fences "holding" 50 or so head of buffalo. If those things wanted out that fence would not have a freaking prayer of stopping them. If there happens to be a hole in the fence though or part of it fell over its fair game and the buggers will do their best to sneak out. Basically the story above is a sad one its to bad the buffalo had to be put down and it goes to show that you have to use the right tools for the job or it looks sloppy. The cops weapons are not big game hunting weapons and it shows. One good old boy with a 30 06 probably could have taken all 5 down no fuss no muss. kaid Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Murgos on May 13, 2005, 07:28:12 AM Funny, people didn't have a ton of trouble taking out this kind of Big Game in the 19th century. They used those big caliber hunting rifles that apparently aren't as dangerous as assault weapons.Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Pococurante on May 13, 2005, 10:29:15 AM I fired a repro Hawkens once - shoulder ached for days.
Fer them as cares fer such things... http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3730/is_199909/ai_n8864814 Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Samwise on May 13, 2005, 11:12:00 AM They used those big caliber hunting rifles that apparently aren't as dangerous as assault weapons. Assault weapons are usually designed to be fired at soft, squishy things. Like unarmored humans. Surprisingly, a gun is much more effective when you're shooting at something the bullet can actually penetrate. (edit: as the CoC players know all too well. :evil:) Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Sky on May 13, 2005, 12:26:08 PM I grew up near a hippy petting zoo, it was pretty cool, used to volunteer there. Lions, bison, all kinds of stuff. The bison were some of the coolest animals ever, docile and well-tempered, but you did have to know to avoid pissing them off. They're HUGE and can be dangerous. They'd escape now and again, but nobody was ever injured, place is still running.
But to kill a buffalo? That's easy: Aim for the wings! Title: Re: I guess it's tough to aim at a buffalo. Post by: Murgos on May 13, 2005, 02:18:06 PM They used those big caliber hunting rifles that apparently aren't as dangerous as assault weapons. Assault weapons are usually designed to be fired at soft, squishy things. Like unarmored humans. Surprisingly, a gun is much more effective when you're shooting at something the bullet can actually penetrate. (edit: as the CoC players know all too well. :evil:) Actually assault weapons are designed to be lightweight, easy to maintain and effective when used by the marginally trained while being able to provide large amounts of suppression fire at ranges around 2 - 300 meters. The machine gunner in a modern rifle squad is actually the position thats going to cause the majority of the enemy casualties, everything else is just to support him (see basic infantry manual). Large caliber very accurate repeating rifles are mostly just a waste on the modern battlefield except in the hands of a few very expensively trained individuals. Also, the lighter round used by assault rifles is designed to incapacitate rather than kill (actually it open for debate whether that was a design 'goal' or just happy accident, but it's aknowledged as a desirable 'feature' anyway) causing more stress on the enemies support infrastructure. So yes, in fact, assault rifles are inherently less dangerous by design than a mid 19th century game rifle. |