|
Title: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on February 15, 2015, 07:17:48 AM Recently announced, a multi-player D&D RPG with a DM client (https://swordcoast.com/), supposedly to be released this year.
They are already pre-selling, and offering perks for 4 packs and such. On the plus side, a 4 player co-op dungeon crawler with possible DM involvement might be right up my alley. D&D license and lore can be a plus (can be, not is). Can be played single player. On the downside, could be micro-transactions out the ying yang since you can see in some of the more expensive pre-orders things like "Lost Mines dunegeon tile set for DMs" and worse, "Design council access - Help Dev's make decisions that shape the game" Could be way too action oriented since it's based on 5th edition D&D which gives all the appearance of standard MMORPG hot button combat. I'm going to stick this on my watch list. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Trippy on February 15, 2015, 09:23:26 AM I'm not sure I'm going to be able to get past the fact that the game's Web site is designed by somebody who still thinks we're in the 20th Century. Could be WotC's influence, though, cause the dev's Web site is using current design technology and patterns.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: schild on February 15, 2015, 09:41:37 AM If by watch list, you mean neighborhood watch list because a sex offender just moved in, then yes.
It's WOTC. Protect your butthole. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Samwise on February 15, 2015, 10:07:54 AM If by watch list, you mean neighborhood watch list because a sex offender just moved in, then yes. It's WOTC. Protect your butthole. (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/40386/Macros/orson_clapping.gif) Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Khaldun on February 15, 2015, 10:43:26 AM Does anybody know why WOTC is so utterly hapless when it comes to anything involving computers? Is it just being cheap as hell? Is there someone there in the corporate hierarchy who is just unusually stupid? Because this sounds a lot like the 4th edition digital tools etc etc and I just remember being kind of stunned that they couldn't even execute making a fucked-up version of what they'd announced--that they were too fucked up even to make a fuck up.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: HaemishM on February 15, 2015, 11:00:31 AM Does anybody know why WOTC is so utterly hapless when it comes to anything involving computers? Is it just being cheap as hell? Is there someone there in the corporate hierarchy who is just unusually stupid? I see no reason it can't be all of the above. Games Workshop has the same problem with digital shit - it's just a different mindset that they refuse or are incapable of moving past. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 15, 2015, 11:33:32 AM I was excited until I saw WOTC, myself. A good RPG with a proper DM Client is something I've been waiting for since the last NWN. Even NWN 2 didn't come close to the first one, which was really stellar (and which had an absolutely amazing mod community).
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: WayAbvPar on February 15, 2015, 02:41:31 PM Does anybody know why WOTC is so utterly hapless when it comes to anything involving computers? Is it just being cheap as hell? Is there someone there in the corporate hierarchy who is just unusually stupid? Because this sounds a lot like the 4th edition digital tools etc etc and I just remember being kind of stunned that they couldn't even execute making a fucked-up version of what they'd announced--that they were too fucked up even to make a fuck up. They are in a very tech-adverse location. The Puget Sound area has a real dearth of tech companies and workers. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: schild on February 15, 2015, 03:21:31 PM Not even. Lack of tech there means nothing. They pay fuckall and treat employees like shit. That's the actual problem.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Evildrider on February 15, 2015, 05:51:51 PM Someone please just make a faithful port and do a Baldur's Gate 3.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Torinak on February 15, 2015, 06:18:04 PM Does anybody know why WOTC is so utterly hapless when it comes to anything involving computers? Is it just being cheap as hell? Is there someone there in the corporate hierarchy who is just unusually stupid? Because this sounds a lot like the 4th edition digital tools etc etc and I just remember being kind of stunned that they couldn't even execute making a fucked-up version of what they'd announced--that they were too fucked up even to make a fuck up. They are in a very tech-adverse location. The Puget Sound area has a real dearth of tech companies and workers. This is supposed to be in green, right? Seattle alone has the second-highest tech concentration in the country (16% of all jobs in the area), second only to Silicon Valley... (edit: Yes, I think you know this, but schild's response seemed to miss the sarcasm) Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Trippy on February 15, 2015, 07:42:10 PM Back in the Peter Adkison days it was all about who you knew (usually Peter) rather than what you knew (i.e. had actual talent or skills). I have no idea what's been going on over there post-Adkison, though.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Merusk on February 15, 2015, 08:16:21 PM WOTC and GW both see physical product, not the rule sets, as their core widget. Looking at it from that mindset, the digital goods would only dilute and cheapen the brand. Yes it's a stupid 1980s view of things but it explains why they don't move pass paper books, cardboard rectangles, and plastic models.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Khaldun on February 15, 2015, 09:00:08 PM But I totally get that. It makes sense. Kind of stupid sense, but still. I just don't see then why to ever make moves towards digital. The outfits I know that have decided that some kind of brick-and-mortar is really their core thing tend to stick to it. If they decide not, they hire somebody who isn't completely clueless. Or maybe they do--once--and then get a clue. WOTC just seems to be in another realm of "whowowowowowhoooooa computers how do they work".
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Trippy on February 15, 2015, 09:20:08 PM Which is weird cause Adkison has a CS degree.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on February 16, 2015, 06:57:02 AM But I totally get that. It makes sense. Kind of stupid sense, but still. I just don't see then why to ever make moves towards digital. The outfits I know that have decided that some kind of brick-and-mortar is really their core thing tend to stick to it. If they decide not, they hire somebody who isn't completely clueless. Or maybe they do--once--and then get a clue. WOTC just seems to be in another realm of "whowowowowowhoooooa computers how do they work". It really boils down to mis-management from both Hasbro and WotC. If you follow magic you might know the name John Loucks, who used to do the Limited Resources podcast some time ago but left that to join WotC on their digital design side. He didnt last long there, and when he left he gave a carefully worded look (https://adayintheloucks.wordpress.com/2014/07/12/leavingthedream/)at what is going on with WotC digital. To wit: Quote I would describe Wizards as “siloed.” Each department is fairly disconnected from the others. There are strict channels of communication, and the departments tend to look out for themselves. There are a lot of documents being “thrown over the wall” to other departments, without a lot of communication. So, it seems like classic bad leadership and management on the design side, most likely b/c that whole area is treated like the red headed stepchild, and who priority task is "dont do anything to screw up our paper products". I dont know if it mainly one person making the top level bone headed decisions that just set the stage for failure over and over, or a nice committee of the incompetant, but these chuckleheads cant even redesign their own website without making it worse. My only hope is when they hire outside studios to do digital work for them. And yes, "my watchlist" is combo of things i hope happen, and disasters i may want to rubberneck too :) Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Sophismata on February 17, 2015, 12:49:00 AM Quote Single player campaign created by members of the leadership team that brought you Dragon Age™: Origins This does not fill me with confidence. I thought DA:O had some pretty bad gameplay and a worse story.Could be way too action oriented since it's based on 5th edition D&D which gives all the appearance of standard MMORPG hot button combat. Really? 5th edition flows much like a very lean 3rd edition. The gamist one is 4th.Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xuri on February 17, 2015, 06:06:27 AM Quote Single player campaign created by members of the leadership team that brought you Dragon Age™: Origins This does not fill me with confidence. I thought DA:O had some pretty bad gameplay and a worse story.Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Paelos on February 17, 2015, 06:40:00 AM Quote Single player campaign created by members of the leadership team that brought you Dragon Age™: Origins This does not fill me with confidence. I thought DA:O had some pretty bad gameplay and a worse story.Is this a knock on the Western RPG in general, or this game specifically? Because I've probably spent more time on DA:O than any game in my steam library other than Mount and Blade Warband. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 17, 2015, 06:54:33 AM I liked, more or less, Dragon Age: Origin's gameplay. It was enough of a throwback to Baldur's Gate that it worked for me. On the other hand, the story drove me bonkers. I hate when RPGs daisy chain quests like "For me to help you do X," and then you get to doing X, and you meet another guy whose help you need for X, but then he demands you do Y, and then you are getting to do Y and you find another person who wants you to do Z so he can help you do Y.
I enjoyed the game right up until I got about 4 such recursions into the dwarf area in some kind of cave system(it's been a while I don't remember the specifics of story that well), said "fuck this" turned off the game and just never had any interest in firing it up again. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Sophismata on February 17, 2015, 07:18:38 AM Quote Single player campaign created by members of the leadership team that brought you Dragon Age™: Origins This does not fill me with confidence. I thought DA:O had some pretty bad gameplay and a worse story.Is this a knock on the Western RPG in general, or this game specifically? Because I've probably spent more time on DA:O than any game in my steam library other than Mount and Blade Warband. The gameplay was either way too easy, or damn stupid depending on your difficulty setting. 95% of my fights involved a train of combatants running literal circles around a lone archer or wizard that would gradually plink all the enemies to death. The fights never managed to be challenging or engaging. Characters couldn't melee a moving opponent. Mages were better than every other class with no downside and much of the setting theme was lost to the mechanical implementation of spellcasting. Story-wise, the side quests made no sense as components of the larger plot. I'm told to prepare the world for a coming storm with far-reaching consequences OH WAIT NO, AN ELF WANTS ME TO HELP HIM GET A GIRLFRIEND FIRST. That kind of random crap worked in BG2 because those sidequests were the objective, but they seem massively out of place in Dragon Age and Mass Effect. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Paelos on February 17, 2015, 07:28:47 AM Story-wise, the side quests made no sense as components of the larger plot. I'm told to prepare the world for a coming storm with far-reaching consequences OH WAIT NO, AN ELF WANTS ME TO HELP HIM GET A GIRLFRIEND FIRST. That kind of random crap worked in BG2 because those sidequests were the objective, but they seem massively out of place in Dragon Age and Mass Effect. Combat I get you. DA:O combat wasn't anything special, and some of the friendly fire stuff was downright dumb. Mages were OP with no consequence. But the story thing? I think it made sense. The world doesn't stop spinning just because you're under attack of a Blight. People still had needs, and they'd still beg the hero to help. People ask for dumb things all the time. Imagine being a city council guy and just going to lunch, you'd hear about bullshit constantly. It's no difference when you're the fucking Hero of Ferelden. My cat's in a tree, are you a hero or not? Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Lantyssa on February 17, 2015, 08:08:08 AM Sure, but they're not very interesting. We're trying to get away from our day jobs by playing a game.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 17, 2015, 08:11:42 AM I think DA:O was my western RPG breaking point (although I had similar issues with ME1). It definitely was for me. I was legitimately excited about it. I played the crap out of the old RPGs - Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, NWN, etc. Just couldn't get enough of it. I imagine it was me that changed more than the genre, but DA:O just caused something in snap and I haven't really played a game like that since. I WANT to like it again, and I'm waiting for something to change my mind. But, nothing has come along so far. Although I do still get a lot of enjoyment from the Bethesda RPGs for the most part. New Vegas is my favorite I think, I played that more than any other (non MMO) RPG in years. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Rendakor on February 17, 2015, 09:09:05 AM I thought it was just me. I played DA:O when it came out and it just felt like D&D and MMOs had a baby. The big choices in each area were interesting, but the shit you had to slog through to get there was so tedious. 99% of the combat on Normal was trivially easy, except one boss who I literally had to look up an insta-kill code because I couldn't beat him, couldn't zone out, and would had to re-do about 5 hours of gameplay from my previous save. I even went back to replay it a few months back and couldn't finish it this time either.
Admittedly, I was never a huge Bioware fan to begin with; I loved NWN and KOTOR but never played any of the Baldur's Gates (besides the PS2 ARPGs) and liked ME1 even less than DA:O. Bethesda scratches the itch much better for me, as do ATLUS and NIS. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on February 17, 2015, 09:29:19 AM I would like this to be good, but it won't be.
DA:O was wank. What I really want is someone to develop something that will allow me to play roleplaying games, either on my todd or with other people, using digital means. I can't remember the last roleplaying game I actually enjoyed, though I guess if you were being generous, you could put Grimrock in there. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: HaemishM on February 17, 2015, 09:31:08 AM Blackguards?
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on February 17, 2015, 09:44:54 AM I would like this to be good, but it won't be. DA:O was wank. What I really want is someone to develop something that will allow me to play roleplaying games, either on my todd or with other people, using digital means. I can't remember the last roleplaying game I actually enjoyed, though I guess if you were being generous, you could put Grimrock in there. Eh, most cRPGs the story is just window dressing and the game is all about the combat. Many recent rpgs have felt like a party focused, turn based diablo game. Divinity OS, Blackguards, Wasteland 2, etc all fall in this. Which are fine, but not what i really want as a rewarding RPG experience. To me, a good RPG should be about the story, so having a game with a DM should hopefully focus on shared story telling and not simply designing combat encounters. So, that means a game that can utilize non-combat skills/situations, and conversation and hopefully on the fly DM adjustments. I'm not holding my breathe for this particular game, but if they are willing to try a DM and small party design, i will listen. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 17, 2015, 10:17:39 AM A DM Client is definitely great for multiplayer, but even in single player there is a pretty big difference these days. Part of it, I think, is the prevalence of voice overs for all the dialog and the new dialog wheel thing that is popular. I much prefer good old fashioned text boxes and getting to choose my responses from a list. That is one of the reasons I liked those Shadow Run games that came out recently despite the fact that they were really quite linear. The pacing feels entirely different based on these two different ways of doing dialog. It's certainly not the only thing that matters, but it's definitely a personal preference that probably comes from growing up with it the one way. I like being able to imagine the voices and the characters more, and with better technology there is actually less room for that.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Rendakor on February 17, 2015, 10:29:12 AM I agree; Japanese VNs also spoil me in that regard as they often have an un-voiced protag even if all the other characters are voiced. It's much easier to immerse myself in the character when I can imagine him sounding like whatever I want; hearing someone else voice the MC makes it clear that it's not me playing him.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Paelos on February 17, 2015, 10:33:37 AM Some of these responses really make you sound like old RPG farts.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 17, 2015, 10:36:56 AM Some of these responses really make you sound like old RPG farts. Oh, I definitely am. I grew up playing pencil and paper D&D and that's always going to be the gold standard for RPGs for me. Obviously no cRPG (without a DM actively involved) can match that experience, but it is always going to be the experience that I am judging them against anyway. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on February 17, 2015, 11:54:01 AM Some of these responses really make you sound like old RPG farts. I'm about half way to 90. Get off my virtual lawn. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Merusk on February 17, 2015, 12:47:45 PM ed: Carly's? Fucking phones. Anyway, to expand, none of the storys of the past were well fleshed-out or well-written. It's the nostalgia of time and 10-20 years separation that makes you think it. None of the games I've revisited have held-up on a story level. There was a lot more personal in-fill than I would have expected and the tropes that are tired at 40 were fresh under 30. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on February 17, 2015, 02:24:36 PM Some of these responses really make you sound like old RPG farts. Hi, I don't think we've met. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Lantyssa on February 18, 2015, 07:35:40 AM Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on February 18, 2015, 08:38:29 AM Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Lantyssa on February 18, 2015, 09:22:04 AM <nod>
In many ways I view NWN as a toolset rather than a single game, too. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on February 18, 2015, 09:42:27 AM Undrentide et al showed what could be done with that motherfucker.
Yeah. Shame about it. Like most, if the community doesn't get easy access, it doesn't matter. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 18, 2015, 11:22:23 AM The NWN Modding community was absolutely brilliant. (I know, I was part of it :oh_i_see:). But seriously, I did work on some PW Story servers and it was an absolutely amazing toolset to work with. Furthermore, the inclusion of a DM client was great, but the community really made the DM tools that made doing truly amazing, creative, things possible on the fly while running a campaign. NWN 2's toolset just didn't match up, although it wasn't terrible and it was far more inscrutable to modders.
I've said it before, but NWN PW Story servers are pretty much a prototype for my ideal MMO in many ways. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ingmar on February 18, 2015, 11:48:37 AM NWN's live DM tools were still insufficient IMO (not saying anything bad about the modding tools here). None of these games are ever going to solve the fundamental problem of trying to react to 4 players who are acting in real time, not until they ditch the real time element.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Malakili on February 18, 2015, 12:03:49 PM I played a great campaign with a guy who ran multiple campaigns. He would recruit players from one to help him DM the other (since the DM client did support multiple DMs in one game). If you have 2-3 DMs for a group of 4-6 players it becomes more manageable.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on October 14, 2015, 01:34:33 PM So this is out in 6 days. Anyone got any inside scoop on it ?
I have, of course, seen all the videos and twitches and whatnot. But will it be GOOD ? Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Tannhauser on October 17, 2015, 04:14:54 AM Just pre-ordered it. No scoop to give. The forum warriors beat their chests and cry out that the editor is limited to making dungeon crawls and lack a lot of functionality. Which is all 'eh' to me. None of my friends are interested in it, so I'll just play the campaign and mess around with the editor. Maybe they'll improve the editing tools down the line.
I just want to try out this game with the 5e DND ruleset (roughly). Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on October 17, 2015, 04:20:44 AM Hmmm, not sure they're right there tho; I've seen the editor make a lot of differing scenarios, city, above ground, that kinda thing.
The combat 'look' bothers me though - seems to have more in common with D&D on the PlayStation than on the PC, but hey ho. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: amiable on October 19, 2015, 04:57:36 AM I got it and have been playing single player over the weekend. My impression: If you liked the Baldur's gate series you will adore this game. Decent writing, combat ifs fun and challenging. Not sure if it is worth 35$ but I am an old man now and can afford to spend money on my nostalgia indulgences.
Edit: They use a "modified" 5e system that has skill trees, so don't expect pure 5e if you play. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: shiznitz on October 19, 2015, 11:47:52 AM Edit: They use a "modified" 5e system that has skill trees, so don't expect pure 5e if you play. You might have just sold me there. Still 3-18 DnD stats? Prestige classes? Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: amiable on October 20, 2015, 04:29:34 AM Edit: They use a "modified" 5e system that has skill trees, so don't expect pure 5e if you play. You might have just sold me there. Still 3-18 DnD stats? Prestige classes? Nope pure classes based on skill trees. Surprising flexibility with what you can do if you want to be creative. Mellee wizard? Sure. Spellcasting, control oriented rogue? yYp. Buff-focused fighter? Yep. I am having too much fun restarting. At least in the beginning hard mode is actually quite difficult. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Bunk on October 20, 2015, 10:16:15 AM General chatter in this on the Reddit /r is pretty stinky. Reviews are far from stellar as well.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on October 20, 2015, 11:20:38 AM For single player the /r/swordcoast just seems like a lot of people that were expecting pure translation of D&D with no adaption to a video game media.
For their multiplayer complaints I can see some of them making sense. These are the big ones imo: -The DM tool is lacking and needs a map editor, scripting events, and to allow for custom made items (possibly quests too). -Looting in multiplayer needs improving (it's first come first serve and trading is through dropping on the ground last I saw). Overall, I'm enjoying the campaign as a single player, but if someone is planning on only playing single player then waiting for a price drop makes sense. If you want to get in on multiplayer then it's okay at this price but waiting might not be too bad of an idea either. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on October 20, 2015, 01:39:14 PM Reddit would appear to be crapping on this from a great height.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Montague on October 20, 2015, 01:48:05 PM Reddit would appear to be crapping on this from a great height. They're getting hammered on Steam as well. Was about to buy this first day but it looks like they hacked this thing to pieces in order to get it out the door. Oh well, back to Baldur's Gate I-II EE. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Tannhauser on October 20, 2015, 02:19:20 PM I bought the $60 version. Stay far away.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Threash on October 20, 2015, 03:41:16 PM Reddit would appear to be crapping on this from a great height. They're getting hammered on Steam as well. Was about to buy this first day but it looks like they hacked this thing to pieces in order to get it out the door. Oh well, back to Baldur's Gate I-II EE. And SA for what that's worth. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on October 21, 2015, 05:27:31 AM Yeah, this is no where close to a good game at present.
Good: the character system will actually let you develop very different characters from a single base class with the multiple skill trees. Bad: Everything else, from the UI (has some options you need to turn off before you start else the annoy you to death in the first 5 minutes) to the game pacing, NPC pathing and skill use, and dumb decisions like multiplayer looting being free for all which equals whoever gets to the chest first gets it all - good luck ranged classes. Ugly: Content creation is an unfunny joke. If you can't do custom maps, monsters, loot, scripted events, and even the dialogue options are awful, whats the point? Stay away for another 6 months at best, probably forever. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ghambit on October 23, 2015, 08:44:55 PM Not even. Lack of tech there means nothing. They pay fuckall and treat employees like shit. That's the actual problem. I've heard this same thing before. Also, that there is an overarching "conspiracy" to keep the products from merging with digital assets as much as they should. It's a fine line in a market share they don't want to see decline. You're better off using Divinity to run games in this way currently. That has a realtime DM no? Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on October 24, 2015, 09:29:49 AM You're better off using Divinity to run games in this way currently. That has a realtime DM no? No, not even close. It has 2 player coop by default, and 4 player via a mod, but that is in the same story/campaign as single player. There are a few custom maps/quests made by modders, but they're pretty stingy in how they work and what bugs them out Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on October 30, 2015, 06:58:06 AM You're better off using Divinity to run games in this way currently. That has a realtime DM no? No, not even close. It has 2 player coop by default, and 4 player via a mod, but that is in the same story/campaign as single player. There are a few custom maps/quests made by modders, but they're pretty stingy in how they work and what bugs them out The sad thing about SCL is that the single player campaign is actually pretty good once it gets going. I've put 20 hours into it so far and am only level 11. It has all things content creators would want - varied environments, skill checks in dialogues/interactions with other stuff, decent puzzles of both mechanical and logic, trigger events, nice customized weapons, decent combat with varied enemy groups, cut scenes, etc. There's just none of that in the content creation or DM tools. From what i gather, they also stretched 5th Ed rules quite a bit by bumping normal hit points up by a ton, and allowing ability score items to stack so it's not hard to be running around with 20+ in your main stats. That contributes to the most overpowered part of the game, wisdom based DC saves on CC spells like, sleep, hold monster and charm. A high INT caster can basically dictate the fights pretty well with just those spells. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Rendakor on October 30, 2015, 07:09:26 AM So, it's just like real D&D then.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on October 30, 2015, 08:38:41 AM The sad thing about SCL is that the single player campaign is actually pretty good once it gets going. I've put 20 hours into it so far and am only level 11. It has all things content creators would want - varied environments, skill checks in dialogues/interactions with other stuff, decent puzzles of both mechanical and logic, trigger events, nice customized weapons, decent combat with varied enemy groups, cut scenes, etc. There's just none of that in the content creation or DM tools. From what i gather, they also stretched 5th Ed rules quite a bit by bumping normal hit points up by a ton, and allowing ability score items to stack so it's not hard to be running around with 20+ in your main stats. That contributes to the most overpowered part of the game, wisdom based DC saves on CC spells like, sleep, hold monster and charm. A high INT caster can basically dictate the fights pretty well with just those spells. Yes, I liked the single player campaign it felt like Dragon Age Origins-lite without the ability to setup tactics for your companions. Some of the choices they forced on you were interesting, the skill checks felt good, though the quest markers not updating was annoying but that is pretty minor. I did like the puzzles and I still never did find all 10 rubies or all of the parts the blacksmith could craft so they did a good job of hiding those. One thing I found annoying (and it's kind of like this in a lot of multiplayer maps) is the need for a rogue/ranger/whatever to constantly use search. I think that should be switched to be a passive ability and maybe renamed to awareness, but I don't know how that works in 5th Ed or D&D in general as I never really played P&P. As for using the DM tools in actual play, I've played with a live DM and they did a really good job of setting up a scenario by manually-spawning mobs to simulate triggering events. I found that great on their part and shitty on SCL's part since he should never have had to have worked that hard to create a scenario (even if he did seem to be enjoying it and had the time to do so because combat is kind of slower). This should have been available to him, but sadly the devs want the tools to be approachable by kids and are already falling behind the "we're watching metrics" excuse and not reading up on how many people they've scared off because of how simplistic of an approach they've taken. Regarding stretching the 5th Ed rules, I read a little about some of the rules and a big one that kept coming up was the main stat going over 20, and yeah it's really easy to do. What I found during my playing is that some race/class/origin combos can have 2 stats at 20, with the rest at 12-16 and then any gear brings your main stats well over 20 and you can even get into the 30s if you gear for it. This is a pretty big issue with dex since it not only grants dmg but AC as well. So rogues, rangers, and dex fighters can just stack both dps/defense with one stat, and work on desired stats for saves. Even worse is that stat stacking is less of a problem then stacking cooldown reduction which can easily be stacked into the upper 70%. So even though most cooldowns kind of suck (and the majority are a dps loss), for paladins it's incredible. Having something like Avenging Angel (+50% action speed, +x% move speed, bonus str, I think bonus ac), Aura of Vita (aura healing friendlies every round), Bless (bonus to attack and saving rolls), Crusader's mantle (gives allies +radiant dmg on hit), and then the -ac and -movement speed debuffs 100% uptime (and your heals are at like a 4-8s cooldown) makes pallies pretty damn sick and it's why they're viewed as one of the best classes right now. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on October 30, 2015, 10:28:25 AM This just in, they released an update and roadmap today and it seems they are headed in the right direction (tile based creation, branching dialogue trees). I'll quote the relevant parts less the marketing speak.
Quote Sword Coast Legends: State of the Game 10/30 As much and as long as we've labored to launch SCL, this is really just step one, a foundation for an even greater experience we have always intended to improve and expand. Our goal has always been to put Sword Coast Legends into the hands of would-be adventurers and to work with them to improve that experience. We have an aggressive list of content and updates planned for the near-term... one that will be delivered to you at no additional charge, starting TODAY! Halloween Update: "The Pumpkin Patch": October 30th New "Liars' Night" themed area and placeables in the spirit of Halloween Cemetery DM location with over 35 new placeable objects and new player gear Screen nudge with mouse (toggled option) - Players will now be able to move the camera by nudging the edges of the screen. The WASD keys and the middle mouse button will still work the way they currently do. Auto-heal at Adventurer's Camp - When entering the adventurer's camp, the party will heal any damage previously taken. DM collect quests will display "x of x found" on the HUD Hotkey added to re-center camera on player Doubled the max length for DM quest conversation text Added the option to lock your cursor to the window Bug fixes Community Pack 1: Week of November 9th Companion-Specific Skill Trees Unlocked for Players - Existing unique companion skill trees will become available to players Nature Set - New outdoor area cleared and ready for customization with over 150 new placeable nature objects for DMs. Ability Respec - Characters wishing to forget their prior training will be able to do so. All character points will be refunded, allowing players to change builds or reselect their characters' abilities. Player Stash - Players will be able to store additional items within their own personal stash. Skill Rolls - Players will be able to use ability rolls that take their character's bonuses into account. For instance, characters will be able to specifically make a "Strength" roll and have their Strength modifier automatically added to the roll. Increased Number of Available Monster Abilities - Custom creatures will have additional monster abilities available to them. Bug fixes and additional community feedback items as time allows Community Pack 2: Week of November 30th Address concerns with ninja looting in multi-player games New Playable Sub-race: Drow Elves (including access to Darkness and Faerie Fire abilities) DM-placeable visual effects (fire, smoke, etc.) Revisions and improvements to the rules for death, party wipe, and stabilize, including new options for players that want more challenge Village area and village-related placeable objects for DMs to use in their modules Ability to give ambient text to NPCs on select Ability for DMs to change the randomized interiors of every tile Lock/unlock locations on all quest states (give/update/complete) Bug fixes and additional community feedback items as time allows Community Pack 3: December Official introduction of mod support, including Tile based level editor Branching dialog editor Adjustable game systems, ex: round timer, loot tables, etc. Community facing development of these features to begin immediately Option to disable monster level scaling in DM campaigns Bug fixes and additional community feedback items as time allows Rage of Demons: Coming Soon Return to the Underdark in this all-new adventure taking place as part of D&D's "Rage of Demons" storyline, featuring the legendary outcast drow Drizzt Do'Urden and some of the deadliest enemies ever to terrify Faerûn. New Rage of Demons tile sets and placeable objects New playable race: Tieflings New creatures available for DMs New Playable class based on community input Allow player-created characters as companions in story mode Enable players to control their characters' movement with the WASD keys Bug fixes and additional community feedback items as time allows Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on October 30, 2015, 10:49:04 AM Not sure that helps when most of your intended audience didn't purchase your game.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on October 30, 2015, 11:32:40 AM That is a good start, sadly most of it should have been in the game a long time ago and they just flat-out fucked up.
I'm not sure why ability balancing isn't in there though. Most of the cooldown abilities (especially for mages) need a damage boost. Especially the abilities where rank 1 costs 2 points, then ranks 2-4 are 1 point each but only give about a 3-5% increase in damage making the entire ability path not worth investing in. And omg the stash <3 Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Xilren's Twin on November 02, 2015, 07:23:55 AM Not sure that helps when most of your intended audience didn't purchase your game. Best i can tell, it got pushed out the door due to publishing deadlines despite them knowing the important half of draw of this game (the content creation) was MIA. Good job sabotaging your own offering publisher.... Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on November 14, 2015, 01:01:32 PM From Ash on the SCL forums:
Quote Look under your chair! You MAY be getting an extra SCL key. As a big “thank you” to our community, we are randomly issuing Sword Coast Legends Steam Keys to active community members to share with friends and family. Players don’t have to do anything special to be eligible and will be randomly selected through auto-magic. Good luck! So check your email associated with , you may have a free Steam key Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ginaz on December 16, 2015, 03:13:32 AM There's a free weekend for this coming up between 17-22 Dec. on Steam in case you ever wanted to try it.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on December 16, 2015, 03:21:18 AM Is it worth it ? Did it get ANY better ??
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ginaz on December 16, 2015, 03:24:21 AM Is it worth it ? Did it get ANY better ?? No idea. I'd check it out myself but I'm going to visit my family this weekend for Christmas and probably won't have time to play. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on December 16, 2015, 09:25:15 AM It became better, if only so very slightly. However, until Community Pack 3 hits, save your time and money. It might be worth something at that point, but I kind of doubt it.
I think it basically comes down to this - If you're going for singleplayer campaign, then just go replay Dragon Age: Origins, which was just better in every way. If you're going for multiplayer and to use a game as a way to roleplay or even just dungeon crawl, then wait until CP3 when mod support finally makes its way into the game and maybe it will be worth checking on. Bring your own friends though if you do pick it up, since damn near no one plays this game any more, and I'm not sure it can be saved. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on December 16, 2015, 10:38:18 AM I am disappoint.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Segoris on December 16, 2015, 11:11:56 AM You, and the 500 people that bought this :why_so_serious:
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on December 18, 2015, 12:57:27 PM Oh Dear God, this is utter dogshit.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: jakonovski on December 18, 2015, 02:19:13 PM Whoa, someone bought this. Tell us more plz! :why_so_serious:
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on December 18, 2015, 02:36:18 PM Nope, just using the freebie thing.
And I can tell you it's not worth that. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ard on December 18, 2015, 05:16:56 PM I seriously uninstalled in around 5 minutes of playing, most of that in character creation. Most of that time was spent bitching to Seg and not actually playing. I haven't seen an rpg this bad in a while. They made a mistake by doing a free weekend. It's likely going to cost them future sales from people like me who would have bought it blind cheap.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Soulflame on December 18, 2015, 09:24:08 PM Well, this thread has helped me to not put that on my wishlist.
Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Tannhauser on December 19, 2015, 02:34:39 AM I paid full price for this POS. :oops:
It looks and runs terrible on my 970M. Title: Re: Yet another NWN successor enters the fray - Sword Coast Legends Post by: Ironwood on December 19, 2015, 05:59:54 AM Yeah, that's the most egregious thing about it ; it's nothing more than original Neverwinter and it runs like utter, utter CRAP on a high end system. There's no excuse at all.
Everything about this is awful. You'd be better picking up the original NWN and playing through that. It's cheaper and better. |