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Title: Endless Legend? Post by: pants on November 09, 2014, 04:29:39 PM Anyone given this a look yet -> Steam link here (http://store.steampowered.com/app/289130/)
I'm hearing good things from podcasts like 3 moves ahead, and it sounds a lot like the Civ IV mod that we shall not name. Just wondering if anyone else has given it a go before I take the plunge. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: lamaros on November 09, 2014, 05:37:20 PM I've been tempted, but supposedly there is a bit of overly complex stuff and really really bad AI.
They seems committed to updating it though, but I'm waiting for a sale. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Flood on November 09, 2014, 05:41:26 PM I bought it right after release. It's part of the "Endless <insert words>" series from Amplitude. (Endless Space, Dungeon of the Endless, Endless Legend).
It's a pretty game, and I like the different I've read many comparisons made to the recent Civ releases and it does share a lot of the basic elements, but not to the point of seeming annoyingly derivative. On the less <----> more scale of overall mechanic complexity comapred to Civ I'd say it's less complex. They've streamlined some things and in that regard I actually prefer EL to Civ5, although some of that might be just UI design and ease of clicking down into sub menus and stuff. On the flip side (some of the warts I mentioned briefly in another thread) are that on my rig the game plods at times. The unit movement across the map seems slow. When the AI is done processing it's turns, it indicates you're ready to go and start clicking away but you're really not - there's a 1-2 second hidden lag that's annoying when you're on turn 86 or something. Admittedly part of the issue might be the CPU power of my computer, but overall the game just seems slow. When I want to play I have to decide to set aside a block of time. It's hard to describe - but overall it's the affect of some of the minutiae of the game and UI that combine to make the game pace to seem to poke along. Also the game likes to crash at un-fun times, like around turn 60-100. TL;DR - I bought it at release price and have found the game worth it, caveat being I'd probably play even more if it wasn't for the sluggish pace stuff. P.S. - Dungeon of the Endless. I'm surprised no one has made a thread about it. I've never been into rogue-likes at all but it's a really fun little game, been playing it quite a bit. Highlevel of replayability, fun, some strategy involved minus the odd RNG bend over. Very much recommend it. I think there's even some sort of EL & Dungeon of the Endless crossover package / bonus item things involved too. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sir T on November 12, 2014, 10:22:31 AM I have endless space installed but I played it once for an hour and for some reason it didn't click with me. Is this a HOMM/AOW/MOM type game? it would be good to have a decent one of those to cry about not being able to afford.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Yegolev on November 12, 2014, 10:29:19 AM Looks good but I convinced myself to buy a Python book instead.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Hawkbit on November 12, 2014, 12:04:20 PM What book? I've gotten into Ruby a bit over the past six months, but think I might start digging into Django with my two-weeks holiday break from work.
Also trying to get my kid into programming basics soon using either Python or Ruby. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Yegolev on November 12, 2014, 01:32:11 PM Welp, it was recommended as a "learn python" book but it's really a "learn programming via python" book and so I've somehow found myself re-educating on Perl instead. The book is Learn Python the Hard Way and the first few chapters are a low-level grind while I try to distill some useful info that I didn't already know from ksh or Perl. And I managed to get to that point my trying to find out what I can do with bash arrays; turns out the answer is "nothing fancy".
Now I'm thinking I probably should have bought Dungeon of the Endless instead. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Paelos on November 12, 2014, 02:11:37 PM I thought the book was about snakes. :oh_i_see:
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Yegolev on November 13, 2014, 06:12:34 AM It is. Snakes love whitespace.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: bhodi on November 13, 2014, 06:48:50 AM Why would you buy a book when there is the internet? Tons of websites that teach you how to do whatever.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Yegolev on November 13, 2014, 07:19:14 AM A fair comment, and I'm well aware of the fact that the best reference for Python is the open source internet manual. Sometimes I want to read things on my paperwhite. It also ties into my OCD in a weird way.
Another consideration is that man pages do not provide best practices; this is something that I learned with Perl. Since I didn't actually take any computer classes in seven years of college other than CS101 (three times), I don't have a good grasp of the meta of programming. If it causes less commotion, I'm using my company's Books24x7 subscription to read Curtis Poe's Beginning Perl. Of course, I can only do this on my corp laptop. Might rename this thread "Endless Programming". Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on December 04, 2014, 10:20:08 AM This game seems amazing. I only had time for part of the tutorial last night, but the UI looks really competent and I like most of the mechanics revealed thus far.
I bought it solely on how much time Lantyssa has already racked up. Not disappointed. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Maledict on December 04, 2014, 03:04:10 PM Its the best turn based strategy game this year I think - Warlock 2 remains fundamentally broken due to its AI not working, Age of Wonders was good but is more hero battle than anything else, Beyond Earth was a lazy pile of rubbish.
EL on the other hand is actually really, really nice - some unique ideas, a nice setting, really well done races and nice graphics / music. Great little game. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Lantyssa on December 04, 2014, 07:40:13 PM I bought it solely on how much time Lantyssa has already racked up. Not disappointed. Keep in mind I often play things I can leave running in the background since I work from home. Not all that time is spent in game. (Though a lot of it was this week since I wasn't feeling well.)Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on December 04, 2014, 08:58:18 PM I don't see that as a demerit. The guitar often calls me mid-game. Or the cat.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Hoax on December 04, 2014, 11:37:24 PM This is good? I was super let down by Endless Space but then again as much as they sound like something I'd like its quite possible 4X is not for me. It just felt like the start of an Endless Space game was really slow and boring and that the tech tree felt super RPS and limiting.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Tebonas on December 04, 2014, 11:55:50 PM Somehow the (basically same) mechanics seem to work better in Endless Legend, I tried to replay Endless Space after I discovered how much I like Endless Legend but it still didn't click the same way it does. Don't know if its the setting that makes that much of a difference.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Lantyssa on December 05, 2014, 08:05:40 AM A lot of it is the tech tree, at least to me. Breaking things down into eras, and being in an era affecting the game itself has a pretty significant impact. Instead of trying to research everything you have to make a few choices and old techs often have an impact rather than become completely obsolete. I'd love to see Endless Space's tech redone in a similar fashion and think that would breath more life into the game.
Winter is also an interesting change. It annoyed me at first, but it is a regular event that impacts everyone, and gets worse as the game progresses. Being able to endure it, or better continue advancing despite it, adds a new element to your strategy. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Hutch on December 05, 2014, 07:36:48 PM I've started a thread in Radicalthons for this game. (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=24566.0)
Come make fun of me there :ye_gods: Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Lantyssa on December 06, 2014, 08:03:53 AM I don't want to ruin your thread by posting extraneous information, especially since you haven't gotten to assimilation basics yet. Having the Haunts be your minor race with the Wild Walkers is winning the Endless Legend lottery.
Haunts and Demons are the best melee faction by far. Driders are the best support faction. If I can get both I know I've won the game. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Hutch on December 06, 2014, 12:23:46 PM The assimilation has already happened, I just haven't gotten around to creating the post.
Feel free to post in the thread. I'm not claiming to be an expert, but ideally some kind of discussion will take place there. Edit to add: Also, information like that is going to be really helpful, not only to someone like me, who is still learning the game, but to people that haven't played it yet, and might stop by the thread in the future to try and find some tips. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Xilren's Twin on December 08, 2014, 08:15:12 PM I will say this game scratches the civ itch better that AoW3 for me. Picked it up during the latest sale for half off and it's well worth it at that price. The only part i wish was a little tighter is the combat section, but i can live with it.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Phildo on December 17, 2014, 02:00:03 PM This is currently half off on Steam.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Draegan on December 17, 2014, 02:06:01 PM Nice! Been waiting for this to go on sale. Thought I would have to wait for a while because I missed the last sale.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Draegan on December 19, 2014, 06:40:23 AM I got sucked into this game last night finally.
Played a few games where I played the empire that doesn't use food. I kept getting smashed because I couldn't make peace and a military geared empire would eventually smash me. I didn't really build up too much of a military, and that was my bad. Then I played a game with the Cultists last night. Holy shit that game is fun. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Hutch on December 19, 2014, 09:00:10 AM I got sucked into this game last night finally. Played a few games where I played the empire that doesn't use food. I kept getting smashed because I couldn't make peace and a military geared empire would eventually smash me. I didn't really build up too much of a military, and that was my bad. Sounds like Necrophages. The AI Necrophages always declare war on me, and then start acting like they're having second thoughts once I start taking their cities. But then when I agree to a truce, they're all "Psyche! War is our natural state!" Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Draegan on December 19, 2014, 12:11:30 PM I just finished a game on Cultists but only on normal difficulty. Once you get enough minor tribes you just steam roll people. I kind of like only having one city to manage.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: koro on December 19, 2014, 02:26:41 PM I am bad at this game, but I'm really loving it so far.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: pants on December 22, 2014, 06:10:31 PM Yep, 50% off is pretty good for me. Sold.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Flood on December 23, 2014, 02:00:23 PM Yep, 50% off is pretty good for me. Sold. I'm glad it went on sale and more F13'ers are picking it up, it's a neat game. Since my recent graphics card updgrade I've been playing it much more. The custom faction thing is fun to mess with and make imba civs. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on December 23, 2014, 02:20:09 PM Gah, fine, I'll buy it. Damn.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Soulflame on December 24, 2014, 10:32:57 AM You are weak, Highlander.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on December 28, 2014, 10:30:07 PM I spent some time today with this. Took a while to warm up to it, but now that I get how it all works, I found it reasonably diverting. AI factions don't really have that much distinctive personality except for the Necrophage guys. As with most 4xs, once you get up a head of steam, it's pretty much all over but the shouting. The Winter mechanic leads to some really annoying micromanaging--I find I have to shift a lot of workers to food production to make it through.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Phildo on December 29, 2014, 08:16:09 AM I like how each of the factions plays differently. Cultists and Vaulters are probably my favorites so far, though I've only done about half. The Vaulters were really nice near the endgame when I had nearly max resources and could gear up my armies however I wanted.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on December 29, 2014, 10:18:48 PM Yeah, they really do play differently in some interesting ways. Good!
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 01, 2015, 12:20:21 PM Cultists are hilarious fun. Takes a very different playstyle and they have a really different order of tech advances that they just have to get (and others that are of zero use). I found I had to have at least two roving single armies hoovering up all the Dust from ruins in the first two winters or I'd go completely broke. All the other factions laugh at you until you suddenly come and burn them to the ground.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 01:28:36 PM This is no reason for this game to be 1/10th as complex as it is. If you present me with a game setup screen that requires a CPA to navigate, there's a problem.
Why can't fucking neckbeards enjoy things that are streamlined. Jesus fuck. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: koro on January 01, 2015, 01:29:37 PM I have no idea what you're talking about.
Also, the Broken Lords get a bit... broken later in the game: Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 01:36:26 PM This game is complex for complexity's sake rather than to increase fun.
I would say the vast majority of systems beyond the top layer here could be removed and it would only *help* things. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 01:37:19 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PLvdmifDSk
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Draegan on January 01, 2015, 02:03:47 PM I thought it was a pretty easy game to comprehend and learn. I see no real complexity. You playing the same game? It's not EUiV or whatever that other game is.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: koro on January 01, 2015, 02:27:07 PM Yeah, Endless Legend is pretty poorly-documented, but it's no more complex than, say, Civ or anything.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 02:37:12 PM I thought it was a pretty easy game to comprehend and learn. I see no real complexity. You playing the same game? It's not EUiV or whatever that other game is. You're right, it's not the impenetrable shitshow that is Europa Universalis. Do you have any other absolutely pointless comparisons to make?Quote Yeah, Endless Legend is pretty poorly-documented, but it's no more complex than, say, Civ or anything. Again, being no more complex than something that has become needlessly complex is not a point in its favor. I'm sorry, I threw my Grognard hat out the window when I adopted "fun" as a requirement for playing games. I'm going to give Endless Legend a more serious chance at being a "fun" thing despite its shortfalls, but defending this thing is pointless. It's a disaster of 5 designs shoehorned into each other and there's no defending that. There is NO reason for a lot of the minutiae in the game to exist. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on January 01, 2015, 03:00:06 PM Something something consoles.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 03:10:51 PM Something something consoles. (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/39720/ANIMATED%20GIFS/OykMQFe.gif) Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on January 01, 2015, 03:14:48 PM (http://pullzone1.adrianlinks.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/batman-joker-animated-gif-311.gif)
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Rendakor on January 01, 2015, 03:17:21 PM Sky, image no worky.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 01, 2015, 03:17:26 PM From the first episode of Frasier:
Frasier: Have you ever had an unexpressed thought? Niles: I'm having one now. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Draegan on January 01, 2015, 07:28:20 PM I think as schild gets older, he gets worse at video games. Dude, this game has absolutely zero complexity outside of how different races play. It's a standard 4X game.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 01, 2015, 08:17:08 PM I think I get what he means--there's something about the presentation that's a bit "hmm, what is that?" at first--I forget what they call resources but it's some dumb acronym. I also found it a bit difficult to figure out stockpiles and boosters--using them well takes a while, but they actually add some nice strategic timing. In fact, what complexity there is largely helps to make the game more interesting in any given turn--I don't find that it has that "hit next turn and wait and wait and wait" thing that some 4X have except maybe for when you're doing your faction quest and there's some resource gate for the next stage and you decide that you're going to focus on advancing that over everything else.
But it's not complicated, not really. The gameplay is totally 4X in the most familiar way, and the wrinkles on the formula are mostly minor wrinkles. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: rk47 on January 01, 2015, 08:44:29 PM Still doesn't grab me after 60+ turns.
AI being rather robotic personality, and seeing all these villages giving +5% bonuses after I gifted a village of undead some dyes made me shrug and wonder if I should even take the lore seriously. The game setting tried to be some kind of fantasy but ended up being just a skin with stat bonuses and penalties of some kind. The lore didn't matter. Not one bit. I kinda miss Fall from Heaven flavors quest/alignment system (shit that mod was so good) and was hoping this game would give me more of the same feel, so far it hasn't. The whole resource gathering bored me. I walk around and whack trash mobs, raze down a trash village cause I can't be bothered to find resource X. Oh here's another ruin. Click. Some dust. Move on. Assign new production. How about new tech. Here we go. Oh this is nice. AI gives pitying diplomacy 'We're so happy that you're so pitiful while we're so great.' Wham wham wham. Took one city off them and they're ready for cease fire. I'm not sure why the combat is even designed to disable micro-ing and forces you to issue a general order. Is it because the AI would be exploited to death? Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 01, 2015, 09:42:19 PM I think I get what he means--there's something about the presentation that's a bit "hmm, what is that?" at first--I forget what they call resources but it's some dumb acronym. I also found it a bit difficult to figure out stockpiles and boosters--using them well takes a while, but they actually add some nice strategic timing. In fact, what complexity there is largely helps to make the game more interesting in any given turn--I don't find that it has that "hit next turn and wait and wait and wait" thing that some 4X have except maybe for when you're doing your faction quest and there's some resource gate for the next stage and you decide that you're going to focus on advancing that over everything else. Boosters are a goddamn footnote in the tutorial. I'm just sayin, half of these systems could be stripped down and thrown out the window whereas the other half could be made more robust at no cost to complexity and it would be a vastly superior game. I did a rough count, and this game has I think, Infinite Resources. Fucking really.But it's not complicated, not really. The gameplay is totally 4X in the most familiar way, and the wrinkles on the formula are mostly minor wrinkles. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Yegolev on January 02, 2015, 06:25:29 AM I get it on both sides, not that I've played this game yet because I need to finish more than one game in Civ since 2001. When I was younger I was in love with complex game systems, but now I mostly just want to shoot things because I have to figure out arbitrary systems in Real Life. It's probably very fun for some people to play with the game mechanics, but other people don't have time for that.
Just wait until you have a kid or three and you won't play any game more complicated than a lightswitch. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Typhon on January 02, 2015, 06:32:55 AM I didn't find the complexity especially confusing (except for the robots, they took a bit to figure what the fuck), but I didn't find it engaging or fun. I thought they had the makings of some interesting systems, but the designers needed more time to make them all cohesive. ... essentially I'm just saying the same thing rk47 said. I played 6 or 7 games a varying amount through, "won" most of them and stopped playing.
Not as disappointing as BE, but still disappointing. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Phildo on January 02, 2015, 06:56:56 AM Some of the decisions seem to be consistent with their other games, such as the FIDS (resource) system and the non-micro combat. The combat, in particular, is one of the things that I hated about Endless Space but it seems like it's part of their design philosophy. That said, I do like it better in this context.
I started a game as the Broken Lords, but I get the feeling that they're a pain in the ass with a larger empire. Is there a way to automate population expansion? It would be nice if you could budget x% of your income towards that each turn. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: schild on January 02, 2015, 10:03:00 AM I didn't find the complexity especially confusing (except for the robots, they took a bit to figure what the fuck), but I didn't find it engaging or fun. I thought they had the makings of some interesting systems, but the designers needed more time to make them all cohesive. This is the problem. If any measure of complexity doesn't add to the "fun," all it does is hurt a game. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Kitsune on January 05, 2015, 02:09:43 PM I'm having a good time with this so far. Anyone complaining about unfun complexity has clearly managed to forget MoO3, and yes I'm bitter enough to want to remind others about it so they can suffer as I suffered. If I have to remember MoO3, everyone has to remember MoO3.
I've also been playing SMAC recently, and I have to say Alpha Centauri is more complex than this. Most of the game mechanics are straightforward Civ-style mechanics. Select things to research, select things to build, click army, click destination, click next turn button. The only things that step away from basic Civ gameplay are customizing your troops (which is done in a way that's much less cumbersome the Alpha Centauri's troop customizing), handling heroes (which is a step up in complexity but worth it for being able to custom-build your city governor or general), and dealing with the minor factions, which isn't at all difficult to get my head around. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Typhon on January 05, 2015, 06:16:45 PM [snip]If I have to remember MoO3, everyone has to remember MoO3. [snip] bad man! Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: rk47 on January 05, 2015, 11:03:43 PM There's MOO3? :why_so_serious:
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Lantyssa on January 06, 2015, 09:24:19 AM I'm having a good time with this so far. Anyone complaining about unfun complexity has clearly managed to forget MoO3, and yes I'm bitter enough to want to remind others about it so they can suffer as I suffered. If I have to remember MoO3, everyone has to remember MoO3. Eff you, man! MoO3 was the start of my gaming cynicism.Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Thrawn on January 06, 2015, 07:15:00 PM Uninstalling this already. I didn't hate it, but it also didn't really scratch any itch that Civ V/IV/FFH doesn't already scratch. Nothing about the game felt new or interesting enough to get me addicted to it at all.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on January 07, 2015, 08:46:01 AM I'm pretty much with Thrawn, though I need to give it a bit longer game to feel it out. But I had the same initial reaction with Kael's Stardock stuff, I kept thinking "Why not just play FFH2?" Between that for depth and Civ V for modern interface, I'm good. Of course, if Firaxis would just hire Kael to make a new FFH in the Civ V engine (or in the Civ VI engine...), we could all be happy.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Ragnoros on January 10, 2015, 10:50:54 PM Having played Civ5 for 247 hours, I can say this will not get more than a dozen from me.
It is indeed needlessly complex as schild says. Systems stacked on systems. Also, the whole death stack of army is annoying. Upgrading your guys is not interesting enough to be fun, but takes long enough to be annoying. The turn based battle thing is way less interesting then Civ5's simple move and attack board game style. Flavor is tacked on. Yeah. What people said. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Maledict on January 11, 2015, 03:42:43 AM I'm pretty much with Thrawn, though I need to give it a bit longer game to feel it out. But I had the same initial reaction with Kael's Stardock stuff, I kept thinking "Why not just play FFH2?" Between that for depth and Civ V for modern interface, I'm good. Of course, if Firaxis would just hire Kael to make a new FFH in the Civ V engine (or in the Civ VI engine...), we could all be happy. to be fair, his stardock stuff is junk for the basic reason that Elemental was flawed from the start and no amount of paint and tweaking is going to correct the unmitigated shitstain that is the basic game. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Teleku on January 11, 2015, 05:02:33 AM I'm pretty much with Thrawn, though I need to give it a bit longer game to feel it out. But I had the same initial reaction with Kael's Stardock stuff, I kept thinking "Why not just play FFH2?" Between that for depth and Civ V for modern interface, I'm good. Of course, if Firaxis would just hire Kael to make a new FFH in the Civ V engine (or in the Civ VI engine...), we could all be happy. Preferably Civ 5 engine. I really have a hard time going back to the older civ games now that I'm use to the advances of 5. No death stacks and every unit being able swim just helps it sooooo God damn much, even if I wish they would bring back a little more of the depth some of the older ones had.I'm having a hard time getting into this game as well, but haven't given it much time yet. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 11, 2015, 06:09:05 AM I get the point about how Civ V gets rid of the death stack, but in a funny sort of way, I kind of enjoy playing a 4X where that's going on. It's almost nostalgic. But yeah, it does pretty much mean game over if your death stack meets an AI death stack and loses. It's simplistic compared to the way Civ V approaches military power.
I also get tired of how the AI spams settlers for certain factions (Wind Walkers most notably) and actually uses the settlers to defend weak cities (if a settler is in an otherwise undefended city and the settler 'retreats' and survives, the city survives too, which shouldn't happen). It can sometimes keep cities alive for the two turns that it takes to get a hero-led death stack there to confront a raiding stack that should have been able to burn down the city and run. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on January 13, 2015, 08:38:46 AM I wouldn't mind a bit more of a compromise between death stack and 1 military unit per hex. And I don't like embarkation at all, I miss my transport units and the tactics and logistics they created. One of my biggest complaints about the Civ V engine.
And yeah, I don't blame Kael for his games; I don't know that anyone could make a good game at Stardock. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Teleku on January 13, 2015, 12:15:05 PM The problem is that the Civ AI never EVER figured out those logistics. Now, it can kind of sort of smartly attack across water (still not the best, but for once it can actually be a threat for the first time in the history of civ). Naval invasions were beyond anything the AI could ever do effectivly in any previous version of the game. I pretty much haven't bothered playing anything other than the Pangaea map since civ 2, just so I can get a decent game in. I accept a little of the dumbing down there for the benefits it brings.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 13, 2015, 02:28:53 PM Speaking of this, it's one of the things the Endless Legend AI is pretty dumb about. If it's sending a couple of big stacks to fight your big stacks via water, and you make it so there's only one landing hex, it'll land its stacks one at a time and let them get ripped to shreds. It's actually kind of bad that you can't interfere with stacks when they're on water.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Megrim on January 13, 2015, 10:04:39 PM The problem is that the Civ AI never EVER figured out those logistics. Now, it can kind of sort of smartly attack across water (still not the best, but for once it can actually be a threat for the first time in the history of civ). Navel invasions were beyond anything the AI could ever do effectivly in any previous version of the game. I pretty much haven't bothered playing anything other than the Pangaea map since civ 2, just so I can get a decent game in. I accept a little of the dumbing down there for the benefits it brings. I too, am concerned, when the AI attempts to invade my navel. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: amiable on January 14, 2015, 11:11:17 AM The tactical map in this game is absolutely terrible on almost every level. Pathing is horrible. Your troops don't follow the orders you give them making it impossible to position or use terrain to your advantage. If another mob attacks you before your turn, you lose your turn entirely on that unit. The reinforcement mechanic is clunky as fuck and often leads to funneling troops into the ai/opponent for you to kill. I don't even know why they added it to the game.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Sky on January 14, 2015, 01:27:27 PM I too, am concerned, when the AI attempts to invade my navel. It interrupts my contemplation.Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Khaldun on January 14, 2015, 07:49:25 PM The tactical game is pretty bad, yeah. I generally don't bother with it except in a few really particular kinds of battles where careful tactical management might help. You really can't control things that you would need to control for any semblance of a tactical-level game experience to kick in meaningfully.
Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Phildo on January 15, 2015, 07:33:33 AM I had a similar complaint about the combat in Endless Space. They gave you the illusion of control with the cinematic video of combat, but the outcome was largely predetermined from the start. I get the feeling that trying to manually control the combat beyond assigning targeting would just mess things up for you in this game.
Last night I was sieging the Cultists' city and they had a ton of random monster stacks roaming around their territory. One of them engaged me and I was outnumbered about 17-9, but the attacking stack only had 4 so I faced 6 enemies (4+2 reinforcements) and was able to annihilate them, then spend the second half of the battle gang-banging the reinforcements two at a time. Title: Re: Endless Legend? Post by: Lucas on January 20, 2015, 06:10:55 PM New patch (updates to 1.0.30) :
Quote RELEASE NOTES [1.0.30] Changes and Additions Added a tooltip with the total output when colonising a new region or extending a city [G2G Vote] Increased vision height value of ridges from 2 to 4 Reduced of 1 vision range bonus of the City Hall default city improvement at city creation Reduced of 1 vision range of extractors region buildings Settlers are now Infantry units Added abilities to Quest weapons and shields Added the Vaccination ability to the Proliferator unit (when targeting an ally, it makes them immune to any disease) Removed warnings and compliments from the computation of the Diplomacy victory Balanced the Chain Lightning ability Slightly improved default level of army units spawning through quests, based on current turn and game speed Balanced the AI targeting rules Balanced the whole AI for the diplomacy: it should be easier to have a consistent relationship with the AI Added more variety to AI empire armies Enabled the force truce/peace/alliance for the AI when playing the Drakken The AI empires can retrofit heroes' weapons, armours and accessories Reduced the AI trade heuristics for Spices and Dust Orchid Improved the ridges and cliffs visuals Optimised the size of some textures Changed the name of the soundtrack folder (in order to be readable by the Steam music player) Important Fixes Fixed an issue where an "Out of Range Exception" can occur with certain saves Fixed an issue where an assert is displayed when loading a save with a commander having lost its army Fixed an issue where an assert is displayed when an AI empire computes the income of an invalid trade route Fixed an issue where an assert is displayed when trying to open the city view after conquering a city Fixed an issue where an assert is displayed when one city along the trade route was razed during the turn (this happens when minor factions or Cultists attack and raze a city) Fixed an issue where an assert can be generated sometimes by the simulation when displaying a tooltip Fixed an issue where Game creation fails after loading a mod or resetting to default Fixed an issue where a skippable assert generated in late game, at the beginning of the turn in a multiplayer session Fixed an issue where a skippable assert is generated when the player exits to menu, while a unit receives damage in combat Fixed an issue where a stuck situation is encountered when loading the session Fixed an issue where a dead lock between encounters can occur Other Fixes Fixed an issue where the battle is stuck when using the reset deployment button Fixed an issue where the battle unit does not move when the target is inaccessible Fixed an issue where Settlers do not attack during manual combat Fixed an issue where the Militia does not get XP per turn Fixed an issue where the Militia is not available at the creation of a city Fixed an issue where Militia units do not participate in battles to defend cities Fixed an issue where the Charge ability gives a bonus when the unit does not move Fixed an issue where the Proliferator unit can create new units for the opponent Fixed an issue where units garrisoned in converted villages do not receive XP per turn although the tooltip states otherwise Fixed an issue where assimilating a new faction costs the same as replacing an assimilated one Fixed an issue where Districts are not prioritised as drop locations whenever armies are teleported to a city Fixed an issue where the building buyout and population buyout do not use real resources Fixed an issue where city improvements can be destroyed instantly during a siege before the city is captured Fixed an issue where the Highway improvement does not override the tile cost Fixed an issue where Tier 3 military plan and Cannon Fodder trait reduce army cost to 0 for Necrophages Fixed an issue where the cost for the first pillars/spells for Ardent Mage faction is wrong (used to be 10 instead of 6) Fixed an issue where the tooltip when recruiting heroes is disabled because of a market ban in the Academy screen Fixed an issue with the spawned armies in the Broken Lords faction quest chapter 6 and 7 Fixed an issue where the player cannot complete the Broken Lords chapter 7alt step 1 of the "Death or Glory" quest Fixed an issue where the Broken Lords chapter 3 "Perilous Frontiers" cannot be completed by colonising new regions if the first city is placed in a low Dust income area Fixed an issue where the Scepter of Auir is displayed as a ring in its tooltip Fixed an issue where quest armies are stuck on water tiles, making quests unfinishable Fixed an issue where loading/saving/loading too much could solve quests Fixed an issue where the "Digging In" quest cannot be completed when the game was saved before pacifying any village Fixed an issue where the "Manual Labour" quest can be triggered without at least 1 Delvers village in the neighbouring regions Fixed an issue where unequipping two-handed weapons, shields and armour will automatically unequip items in different slots Fixed an issue where default two-handed items are not reset when removing the left hand part Fixed an issue where removing a torso item by drag and dropping it in the middle of the panel, the head armour is also removed Fixed an issue where the same item can be received multiple times as either a quest reward or when searching ruins Fixed an issue where AI empires are able to search unavailable technologies Fixed an issue where several luxury resources do not modify the AI deal attitude bar during trade Fixed an issue where AI prioritises Borough streets instead of less expensive improvements in newly built cities Fixed an issue where AI major factions besiege the closest city to their empire regardless of the odds of success during war Fixed an issue where Advanced Diarchy trait has same tooltip info twice Fixed an issue where the wrong icon is displayed for the Sweep Strike Back 3 ability Fixed an issue where the Truce icon is too large on the Diplomatic screen Fixed an issue where the player receives a notification informing him/her that he must colonise a region when an AI has to colonise a region or be eliminated |