f13.net

Pretend that I am the village idiot (yes, I know- quite a stretch). Tell me what this game is, how it plays, what it compares to (favorably and not so), etc. Give me the info I need to convince myself to buy it even though I hated GW I (but can't remember why!). I need an MMOG to play and this is next up, seemingly. Help a brother out!

No sub.  Just buy it.  I probably know less than you (disliked GW1 as well), and I did!  :awesome_for_real:

My reasons (since I'm a little bored and want to avoid doing actual work):

1) No sub.
2) PVP.  Some sort of massive looking PVP thing too.  No idea if it's fun, balanced, or runs at higher than 5 fps. 
3) Looks nice.
4) Not a lot of hot keys.
5) Small race I can be annoying with in PVP.
6) I'm going to run out of shit to do in TSW and even then goto 1).  My "no two subs at one time" rule here does not apply!
7) Trying to avoid diving back into LoL or DOTA2 full time (this would make me ragey 100% of the time). 
8) Nice youtube videos.
9) Lack of overwhelming negative comments here.
10) You can jump this time. 

Try reading this from someone who expected to hate GW2. http://sixdee.net/2012/04/last-portal-to-tyria/

It's a PvP focused game. If PvE is what you enjoy it doesn't look like there will be enough content to keep you busy for a while. PvE from what little I've experienced is decent but not great.

PvP is divided into two types -- small scale (like 5 on 5) and massive scale (world vs world, with 100s on each side). The massive scale PvP (WvW) feels like WAR (huge structures you can capture, siege weapons you can build, etc.) but unlike WAR you are fighting on instanced maps that aren't part of the "regular world". There are (semi) persistent benefits if your world does well (like a small boost to a crafting bonus) but it's not like the open world RvR that WAR has.

If you like PvP in MMORPGs (LOL) definitely give it a try.

Don't buy it

The only reason I'll be playing is because some of my friends are, however I don't see them lasting. 

The only thing that may keep me playing is the WvW but I was bored, even more than usual in an mmo, when I was trying to level with PvE.  That'll be the big test for me to even see if I can get to max level.  Let alone do all the exploring and stuff they want you to do to get the extra skill points.

Because they're doing something different and they've got the best art team in the industry.  Being a one-time cost, you should support them if for nothing else than encouraging future companies to stop making the same shit over and over.

The art team sucks compared to the one that did GW1 (plus the outside design firm whose name I don't remember that did a lot of the modelling and animation work). When I get home I'll post pics of my "studded leather" pants.

I like the art, and it win's over GW1 in having some fun PvE content. GW1 was soporific.

They're doing some interesting things in the MMO space, some of which work really well for casual co-operative PvE and PvP. There's a lot of content in the box, it's not that expensive and there's no sub. It's probably the safest MMO purchase I've seen.

That said if you want a competitive PvE end-game in which you race to get the purples and first boss-kills I've seen no suggestion GW2 even cares to compete.

Why you should buy....

1. No trinity. Every class has a heal on a timer. No class has a super heal.
2. WvW is pretty fun. If you liked DOAC, you will likely like this.
3. So you can play with me. Levels are irrelevant in this game for the most part. Not saying you can take your level 1 into a level 80 zone. But a level 80 still gets rewarded for grouping and doing stuff with a lower level person.
4. What else is there to do?

I want to farm nameds with Katiri!

I'm in, because I had fun. I play mmo wrong and just like messing around. This game is good for that. While TOR was the first game I wanted to group in, GW2 is the first game that makes me not hate random jackholes playing in the same area, the more the better! I don't really pvp much, but I guess I would at some point because apparently zerging evil doors is fun.

Hated GW1 so I was worried about this one, shouldn't have been.

I think Trippy is nuts about the art team, but...I also like dressing like a purple 70s pimp, so...and I was playing a mesmer who summons illusions of himself, so PURPLE PIMP POSSE!

No sub.

The art is a little schizophrenic. Some of the armor, for example, is jaw-droppingly good, some of it is so overdesigned it makes the worst excesses of WoW look like a line drawing.

I thought the GW1 art style was awful, but this seems marginally better to me for some reason.  Except the hydrocephalic faerie-things.   And the GW1 gameplay wore really thin for me really fast (I think I got to about level 8 or so).

But I am intrigued by the limiting of hotkeys, the lack of subscription, all this level-matching stuff, and the whole shitload of people (many of whom are not on F13  :grin:) saying 'it's awesome, and it's different then GW1, and good'.  If they ever have a demo or a beta I can actually get in, I'm there.  And if it goes on sale, I am prrrrrobably in.

While this is concept art it should give you a good feeling for the wide range of the art:


Some of it really gets into Wayne Reynolds "I need straps with buckles to hold in place all the straps with buckles" territory for me. ("It looks good, but could you add a couple more capes?") But then other pieces are totally  :drill:.

So then, best place to buy? Price & pre-order rewards? Or are the rewards the same for everyone?

The world art is incredible, the actual characters, armor and particle effects I don't care for.  Some of the bosses look cool though.

I'm buying it because there is no sub and I'm sure it will have more than enough content to cover the purchase price, then whenever I want to PvP or explore I can always fire it up.

Also, Keg fights. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Zt1Q2W1Jvw8)

Some nut made a video with every race/armor combo. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEJDW8KjVos)

Even though I wasn't 100% impressed with it I'm still buying it.  It was fun and has some things going for it (and is a lot more actiony than other MMOs).  I decided to pull the trigger because:

1) Since they are an MMO mostly relying on box sales it's doubtful the cost will drop dramatically, at least not until an expansion or two has been released so I might as well get it now rather than trying to wait till ti's cheaper
2) There's no sub, so if I get bored I can pick it back up later at any point.

I also think part of my underwhelmed with the beta weekend I played was more that I had to get over the fact that it's not GW1 and that it's vastly different than any other MMO out there, and it's a bit overwhelming at first.

It's pretty low risk unless you are extremely strapped for cash.

Greenmangaming.com has had it for sale at 20-25% off and I think they will have it for sale again before release.  Just a quick note, your credit card may be flagged after your purchase as a potential fraudulent charge (happened to me, but I expected it after reading about it happening to others) and if this happens your bank will let you know.  My key was available right away though and registered on the GW2 site no problem.


I went in expecting to only PvP but I ended up loving the PvE because of how fun it was to explore everywhere.  I had a blast just cruising/swimming around, although I do wish the running speed was faster.  No trinity is the big draw for me because everyone can do everything, and on top of that:

• No quest givers, you just run around exploring and you bump into events that change based on what happens during the event.  After an event, NPCs can branch off and start new events.
• Everyone is always in a group (no kill steals, full xp for contributions, rewards for everyone, nodes/trees/plants can be gathered by everyone).
• Diversions all over the place just for exploring (vistas, jumping puzzles, crafting/cooking, points of interest, skill point challenges, etc).
• Down-leveling to help people stick together and it will keep you rewarded for exploring all areas and tagging skill points, even in other race's starting areas.

Before playing this for myself I was leaning toward a purchase just on videos mainly because:

Behold my "studded leather" pants:

(http://randjunk.com/images/guild_wars_2_studded_leather.jpg)

At least two people thought that art work was acceptable -- the person who created it and the person who approved it. Now I don't blame the person who created it, it may have been some junior person in China who did it and perhaps something got lost in translation along the way. The person who approved it, though, is an idiot.

Also note that my top is not quilted armor, it's also "studded leather".

I read through the blog and most of the features are really tempting if I had the time to play it.

The box price is pretty reasonable but ah life!

Pre-order rewards are the same wherever you buy it, thankfully.

I also hated those pants lol (thought its a sylvari thing ,them being gay elfs and all). But I think nitpicking over one particular set of outfits is just that - nitpicking. There are tons and tons of different and varied 
armor in the game and so what if some of them are not to everyone taste? Maybe someone want to make goofy looking characters. I mean after all I could pick on you for the acid bright green color you picked

Yeah, at this point, you pretty much missed the boat on the physical collectors edition, which is the only reason to NOT buy it directly from ArenaNet, unless you're one of those weirdos that wants a physical disk for an online only game.

https://buy.guildwars2.com/en/

edit:  this assumes you don't find it on sale from someone else, mind you

That was certainly the most egregious example I ran across during the final beta weekend but that wasn't the only bad bit of art design I ran across. I didn't bother to take pictures of the others, though. One animation in particular is giving what used to the stupidest attack animation I've ever seen in an MMORPG a run for its money, so to speak. In EQ II there is/was an animation where you are stabbing downward sort of standing sideways but you aren't holding the weapon in a reverse grip so you are stabbing downward with your thumb pointing down if you imagine it extended while holding a hilt of a blade with an arc that goes over your head because of the sideways position. In GW2 there's a "strong attack" move that's literally an uppercut sword swing and somehow magically your giant blade clears the ground while you are swinging upwards with two hands.

You certainly could do that. In my defense the colors looked fine with my starter armor and I didn't realize those colors carried over to every armor piece I found. I thought it would be like GW 1 where most things were a "neutral" color when picked up and you had to explicitly dye things to get other colors.

I challenge you to a Bad Armor Off!  (You can just randomly pick anything from the raid tiers and save me the effort. :-P)

I'm glad I worked on my hom cause I do agree all newb armor looks like complete ass.  The starting armor on the other hand looks pretty good so you feel like you are downgrading when you start to find gear.

Over the BWEs and stress tests I've come to appreciate the way this game lets you tailor the experience to you play style.  For my unfocussed dinking around distracted by the new shiny all the time way of playing it is just about perfect, I don't have a quest list staring me in the face when I log in so I can do whatever I feel like.  Thanks to fairly seamless downleveling if I want to check out another race's starting area or help a friend, I don't have to roll a new character but can just take my level whatever guy over there and play.  The personal story looks interesting but at least through level 25ish or so it was entirely optional as far as I could tell.  I really liked the way the game encourages cooperation in PVE by rewarding everyone involved in a kill with full loot and XP.  I found myself playing in spontaneous groups ranging from duos to mass event zergs for surprisingly long stretches of time.  

The small group PvP I did seemed fun enough but by its nature requires a lot more organization and focus than I'm likely to invest in the game.  WvW was a ton of fun either running around as part of the zerg or in the semi organized BC groups that popped up.  

My only real gripe is that after playing GW2 I can't bring myself to play GW1 any more so I'm never getting past the heritage armor in the Hall of Legends.  

I was the complete opposite, every weekend event  encouraged me to try again.  I'm hoping this stress test will push to get the last  2 points for 30/50.

I should really work on my HoM again. I think I'm just at the grindy or expensive bits I don't want to deal with though. Like armor sets.

Having rareish minipets and unopened 6th+ birthday presents is a good way to get enough $ for at least the low 20s in the HOM (esp if you already had pets saved up).

That, or a GW1 sugar{daddy/mommy}. :p

I had a 7th birthday present that lasted me until 28/50.  I was also very lazy choosing to pay for stuff like the black moa mini rather than work on it myself though.

I have every single GW1 present from the first through the last anniversary unopened. Is there a guide somewhere that can just help me knock this out in the shortest amount of time?

Unless you're a female caster, then your starting 'armor' is lingerie.  :oh_i_see:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/8510-comprehensive-hall-of-monuments-guide/

I like about half the female caster armor. The other half is absurd.

I really like most of the medium armor for everyone that I've seen. Even the silly low tier sets seem fine to me.

Good stuff so far- thanks for the feedback. Some more specific questions-

Is it a one character does everything/choose your skillset each session, or is it the multiple alts thing if you want to experience different professions? Is combat twitchy at all, or straight DIKU? Is their any decent crafting?

I have to admit I love what I see so far about no quest hubs and exploring the world willy nilly. That alone has me reaching for my credit card. My biggest problem is the first day of pre-release is the same day I have 2 fantasy football drafts to attend in person. I will be exhausted and shitfaced when I get home late that night, so it might make for an interesting[/] first play session  :awesome_for_real:

Multiple alts (race + class is a character)

Combat is a bit more twitchy than a diku, not as twitchy as say TERA. Projectiles can be side stepped, there is an active dodge mechanics, but you can either tab/click target or attack and allow soft targeting to pick the closest thing you were aiming near.

Crafting: very useful, pretty painless. Amusingly, a decent source of XP for leveling as well. I kind of like the exploration system in the crafting (most notable with .. whatever the staff making one is. It also makes potions if you experiment with ingredients from the other crafting professions)

The first step should be selling the 7th birthday presents for around 30-35 ectos, 6th birthday also but i am not sure what those are worth.  Right now there are a lot more people trying to get shit for HoM than there are collectors of random useless crap that buy stuff like that so the sooner you sell the better.

Thanks. Guess I can grind it out this weekend.

Edit: And I've totally forgotten how to play. I don't even know how to move my level 20 over to Eye of the North. Or if I even can. And this is why if I don't play an MMORPG on Day 1, I never play it.

There should be an asura gate near whatever capital your char is that will take you to eye of the north.  And one weekend is highly optimistic for grinding out anything in guild wars.

You know what, fuck this. I don't have the patience for it at all.

Getting enough points for the heritage armor takes virtually zero effort, if you played the game at all before you should have a few points and you get 3 just for having all expansions.

I tried twice to do HoM and failed. They seemed to have rebalanced the game around these crazy 3 ritualist builds.  I don't even have one ritualist hero with most chars. There is probably some trick I am missing, but it was anti-fun to figure out why chars who had previously won their campaigns were complete garage now so I moved on.

I didn't want to do the quest to take a character to the Eye of the North area. I don't actually know how to play anymore and kept hitting spacebar which is apparently autorun.

I'm still pissed, YEARS later, about not being able to jump.

Did you beat all three campaigns or just one? It took me a day or two to get the hang of playing also, but there is a ton of low hanging fruit in the HoM someone with access to cash can hit.  I played for a month when the game launched and just started back up a couple months ago to work on the HoM, once you get a good crop of heroes with decent builds you can pretty much faceroll through everything in normal mode.

The quest to get to the Eye is really short. You do some tunnel thingy that's 90% running away, and then ignore the quests in the next area and just walk to the Eye. That's the HoM.

What is a bit obnoxious is getting tapestries to enable the HoM panels. If you have a bunch of 20s, run them all to the HoM once to get a free one, and use it. The HoM itself is per account, so they should stay enabled across all characters instead of actually having to do the Eye stories for more.

Easier to bank them and use them all on the char that has the best heroes and easier shot and hom stuff.

Can't you go there at level 10 or something? Seem to remember you get a buff that boosts you up to level 20 in EotN if you're not already.

Good to know you only have to the tapestries once. I looked up good builds but they all based 3Rit backline.  How does one get 3 Rit heroes?

Funny how they went from no jumping in gw1 to jump puzzles in gw2  :why_so_serious:

Yes, you do.

Is it actually 3 Rit/*, or can */Rit work for them? Last time I looked most of them actually just cared that Rit was in there for the skills.

As for 3 Rit heroes, probably mercs if you want to spend the money. I know I never ran three Rit/*s

I never used 3 rits either, i use 2 rits 2 mesmers 2 necros 1 monk.  Just google 7 hero support.  There ARE three rit heroes though, Razza Xandra and Zei Ri, but you are almost better off turning Razza into a mesmer if you get the other two rits.

There's also the fact that by the time you've unlocked Zei Ri you're probably done with most everything else also. 

Geez.  I don't even have Zei Ri, and I've got 30 points.  (Of course Winds of Change was really annoying back when I tried.)

Yeah, I don't have her either because Winds of Change sucks balls.  I couldn't get past the 4 player party missions.  I'm willing to admit the problem is me, and I'm okay with that because I'm done with the game for the most part anyhow.

Only reason to bother is because it does give you a shit ton of cash rewards, plus and extra rit is always handy.

I'm not going to bother with the HOM stuff, though I bet I am going to regret that.  But this blog post from 2010 (right after HOM was implemented) has good tips about the 'easy 30' that might be helpful for some:

http://huntersinsight.com/the-easy-30/

This is what I should do this weekend. I checked and I'm only at 17. Cry.

I surrendered on the HOM. I finally got my NC Soft account unblocked and rejoiced, then when I tried to log into GW found out they still have that account locked and want me to go through the entire "call them during business hours" nonsense.

I never even played GW1... but I will be around for the launch of this titanic.

Getting to 20 is the easy part.  Beating all 4 campaigns and kitting out heroes so you can get the rest of the points is not, especially if it's been a while since you've played the game.  It'll take way more than a weekend to do.  Don't let the guides mislead you, it's extremely time consuming to get to 30.  Even getting to 15 mostly requires beating the 3 main campaigns.

On the other hand it is also not a terrible game.  I enjoyed playing through the campaigns once, and building a hero team is something i will miss in GW2.  It's a bit late in the game if you are starting from scratch but you can get a few things done in a couple weeks, specially if you already played at some point in the past.

I'd suggest nightfall first. If you want to try it. Has a fairly short campaign, and gives you most of the heroes you need to build a great team.

A pretty big caveat for the HOM is that you pretty much need all of the GW1 expansions* to get a decent number of points (you may be able to skimp on Prophecies). Of course this isn't an issue for those of us who already had the game+all expansions to begin with...

* Nightfall so you start with some good heroes + get easy access to elite hero armor for the statues, Factions is a must for ritualists, and EOTN is obviously required; you also need all 4 campaigns to do the black moa quest, unlock MOX for a free statue, etc. Prophecies is good because it has a lot of cheap elite armor for the armor monument. Another big thing is that I'm fairly sure that the best 7-hero builds use skills from all 4 campaigns, and coming up with suitable substitutes may not be easy.

Of course this has nothing to do with whether you should buy GW2 because I'd expect all these rewards are cosmetic and GW1 is nothing like GW2.