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Title: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on September 04, 2010, 10:18:33 AM Winter patch being announced at PAX.
http://www.massively.com/2010/09/04/pax-2010-ccp-unveils-eve-onlines-latest-expansion/ Key features: - Update to PI - apparently to include rewarding people pushing buttons *even more*. I rather hope something has been lost in translation. Quote CCP became dissatisfied with the fact that players would set up their colonies and mining operations and then leave them be. So to encourage subscribers to keep tabs on their colonial investments, the game will now encourage players to check on their investments periodically and tweak them :ye_gods: - PQs for ratters - they are introducing a system where rats 'invade' space and groups of players have to eventually kill a 'mothership' at the core of the invasion. Expectation being that you need a small fleet to kill the incursion over the course of a week. Sounds a lot like a new type of a complex. - Some pointless bullshit associated with the spacebook thing. - A new portrait generator. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on September 04, 2010, 10:50:49 AM Raiding and faction supercarriers? Fuck CCP forever.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: IainC on September 04, 2010, 10:52:23 AM There's also a new trailer (http://www.eveuniversalglory.com) in which someone takes the loss of their Merlin very hard indeed.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: TripleDES on September 04, 2010, 11:24:24 AM Still no Incarna?
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: IainC on September 04, 2010, 11:34:26 AM Thank fuck there's still no Incarna. Seeing how CCP implemented stuff like PI, the new sovereignty system and Faction Warfare, I can only imagine how painful the control schema would be for moving around outside your ship.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on September 04, 2010, 11:46:34 AM 5 clicks for each step, 10 to turn.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Amarr HM on September 04, 2010, 12:04:12 PM This expansion looks even more pointless and mundane than the factional warfare one. It's also highly indicative of the flawed CCP design philosophy, they feel that a feature is broken because there isn't enough for the player to do when in fact the problem is there is too much to do and a feature that could be a one or two step process is a twenty step process. For me the main law of GUI/interface design is that nothing should be more than 1-2 clicks away, CCP obviously don't think this implies to games.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phildo on September 04, 2010, 12:08:20 PM Are these Incursion things going to be mainly in lowsec, or will we have to deal with them in 0.0 as well?
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: TripleDES on September 04, 2010, 12:08:34 PM Thank fuck there's still no Incarna. Seeing how CCP implemented stuff like PI, the new sovereignty system and Faction Warfare, I can only imagine how painful the control schema would be for moving around outside your ship. I don't want to imagine. I want to see and laugh.Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sparky on September 04, 2010, 12:11:05 PM With such an anaemic list of new shiney they'd have gotten infinitely more love just posting "No features this time, we're going to focus on bugs"
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on September 04, 2010, 12:37:55 PM Are these Incursion things going to be mainly in lowsec, or will we have to deal with them in 0.0 as well? I haven't seen anything definite - but I'd be very surprised if they don't turn up everywhere, and very surprised if they do anything so dramatic that you can't ignore it. They probably just take over the anomalies, or maybe some belts. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on September 04, 2010, 04:47:59 PM Winter patch being announced at PAX. http://www.massively.com/2010/09/04/pax-2010-ccp-unveils-eve-onlines-latest-expansion/ Key features: - Update to PI - apparently to include rewarding people pushing buttons *even more*. I rather hope something has been lost in translation. Quote CCP became dissatisfied with the fact that players would set up their colonies and mining operations and then leave them be. So to encourage subscribers to keep tabs on their colonial investments, the game will now encourage players to check on their investments periodically and tweak them :ye_gods: Ahh, good old CCP, reverting to type. I remember when you have to fuel towers every 3 days. They seem to have this stupid notion that if you are not 'man enough' to jump though their stupid hoops, then you don't deserve to be in 0.0. Fuckers. Quote - PQs for ratters - they are introducing a system where rats 'invade' space and groups of players have to eventually kill a 'mothership' at the core of the invasion. Expectation being that you need a small fleet to kill the incursion over the course of a week. Sounds a lot like a new type of a complex." Sounds like the events they used to run in earlier Eve which were actually secret giveaways too their favorite alliances. Typically there was a big ship to blow up with great loot inside. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Fordel on September 04, 2010, 09:43:36 PM Ahh, good old CCP, reverting to type. I remember when you have to fuel towers every 3 days. They seem to have this stupid notion that if you are not 'man enough' to jump though their stupid hoops, then you don't deserve to be in 0.0. Fuckers. That's been EVE since day 1 though. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phred on September 05, 2010, 04:13:36 AM Thank fuck there's still no Incarna. Seeing how CCP implemented stuff like PI, the new sovereignty system and Faction Warfare, I can only imagine how painful the control schema would be for moving around outside your ship. I don't want to imagine. I want to see and laugh.Didn't someone post a semi-joking picture of how walking would work in incarna where you had to select move left leg and move right leg from a right click menu? Someone with some history fu dig up that puppy and post it again please. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vinadil on September 07, 2010, 08:15:16 AM I know it might not do much for the long-term PvP crowd... but if they can pull off PQ like events on a random basis and get newer/empire players to get involved... then I would say that is a huge win. Events like that fill a huge void in this game for some average players of "I want to log on for 30-60 minutes and DO something interesting". Not saying they will get it right, but if they do then that alone is enough for the winter patch.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Setanta on September 07, 2010, 02:03:34 PM Fixing just 20% of all the bugs and flaws would be enough for the expansion. Unfortunately none of this seems to be CCP's priority.
Sadly, whenever I hear PQs I think of WAR and how the PQs were a ghost town that were non-soloable after the novelty wore off. FW implementation is what I'm expecting. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Stabs on September 28, 2010, 07:53:32 PM I was thinking about PQs just recently and came to the conclusion that what broke them in WAR was too many competing alternatives. You need to concentrate players into the PQs to make the system work. WAR buffed scenario exp just around the time of launch in response to player complaints, funneling players into scenarios and killing its Unique Selling Point.
Eve, being a sandbox game full of alternatives, would have been the last game I would have expected to adopt PQs. It seems totally the wrong tool for the job. Coop and drop-in in a game where other players are the enemy. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vinadil on September 30, 2010, 10:45:24 AM Well, I think for about 70% of their player base, other people aren't the enemy, at least not actively. But, even when other people are not actually trying to kill you, you have very little reason to group with them for anything... which kills retention. I could very easily see myself spending some time in high sec with random people doing PQ like missions, or in low-sec with mission runners in my alliance. Currently we all just run them solo, it is more efficient. We can still police a sector if any enemies come rolling through and the money is just better solo. But, toss some interesting group stuff in there... who knows.
And, if this turns out like most other PvP games I have played, once a group is formed PvP is MUCH more likely to happen after people spend 30-60 minutes talking and blowing stuff up. Groups have a way of talking themselves into doing stuff that solo players would never try. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Pezzle on September 30, 2010, 12:21:49 PM I have the opposite experience with EVE. The larger the group the less likely you get any meaningful pvp.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vinadil on September 30, 2010, 05:59:29 PM Might be true... unless you average group is 1 and you never see PvP other than random pirates trying to hunt you in your missions. I would have a hard time getting less, or worse PvP, and I could see the PvE side getting considerably better, even if it just means making it somewhat profitable to hang out with other people.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phildo on September 30, 2010, 07:07:59 PM Wormholes have been providing reasonable group PvE content for a while now.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 01, 2010, 12:22:30 AM Marcus Eikenberry (aka Markee Dragon) interviewed Scott Holden (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_GipBfh33U) and Noah Ward (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoeKjaTwpPA).
~emergent gameplay~ Also Shattered Crystal is having a sweepstake (http://www.shatteredcrystal.com/index.php/free_items) this month to give out a Megathron model signed by the Iceland devs. Get the World of Tanks beta code with the free Valentine tank too while you're at it tia. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on October 01, 2010, 10:57:18 PM Amusing they'd offer as a prize a model of a ship their PvP lack-of-design has driven into obsolescence. Anyway, watched the lead designer video and most of the other guy and got nothing from it. I can't tell if it was the interviewer, the lack of anything interesting in Eve to talk about or these people being boring but /yawn. The game is full of opportunities for improvement, and certain negative outcomes from their current game balance, but it doesn't seem to engage them at all. Talking about Eve-gate, terrible patches and character customisation just support the view these guys are detached from the actual game they supposedly work on. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 02, 2010, 04:08:05 AM Wow, you've turned into a bitter vet mighty fast, haven't you?
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on October 02, 2010, 07:13:38 AM Still, you have to admire the balls of CCP for selling those things for $125 a pop (http://store.eveonline.com/Gallente-Megathron-EVE-Battleship-Collection-P120.aspx).
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Count Nerfedalot on October 02, 2010, 10:14:22 PM Speaking of going from noob to bitter at warp speed, how the hell does a professional development team release a patch that borks their existing UI right and left? Did the client coders even bother to load it up and play the game for a few minutes? What happened to QA? Who OKed letting this pile of shite go live? Does anyone at CCP take any pride in their work?
The latest patch, and the patch to the patch, is absolute clownshoes, dipped in steaming turds. wtf??? Is this typical of the quality of work from CCP? If so how the hell has this game survived this long? Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phildo on October 02, 2010, 10:20:39 PM This is what local has looked like for me since the patch. Before and after the optional one.
Edit: Fixed. It worked yesterday for some reason. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Simond on October 03, 2010, 03:58:29 AM Speaking of going from noob to bitter at warp speed, how the hell does a professional development team release a patch that borks their existing UI right and left? Did the client coders even bother to load it up and play the game for a few minutes? What happened to QA? Who OKed letting this pile of shite go live? Does anyone at CCP take any pride in their work? The latest patch, and the patch to the patch, is absolute clownshoes, dipped in steaming turds. wtf??? Is this typical of the quality of work from CCP? Yeah, pretty much. See also: boot.ini, anything from the last two major expansion patches, the recent CSM debacle, T20 (former dev for techII blueprint distribution) spawning copies of said blueprints for the player alliance he was in, widespread corruption in their guide/RP event program, etc, etc. Quote If so how the hell has this game survived this long? How many other games like it are out there at the moment?This is what local has looked like for me since the patch. Before and after the optional one. Psst. Waffleimages doesn't work here. Try imgur or something.Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: ajax34i on October 03, 2010, 06:29:15 AM Speaking of going from noob to bitter at warp speed, how the hell does a professional development team release a patch that borks their existing UI right and left? They re-coded the UI core components (which is a significant change) and pushed the changes to the live servers after what they considered was enough bug testing (probably been working on it since the switch to Python 2.7 a month ago). Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vinadil on October 08, 2010, 07:27:06 PM I did not personally see any ill affects... but I still downloaded the optional patches, not sure why but I cannot just let a patch sit out there uninstalled...
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on October 08, 2010, 08:55:33 PM In all honesty I was primed for bitter vet-hood by reading about Eve for years prior to playing. Actually playing the game just allowed me to confirm the client really is that clunky and sticky-taped (their in-ability to find bugs is a good sign the code-base is borderline unmaintainable) and they've got more confidence and arrogance than ability. Though I give them a pass on being focused on Dust and WoD over Eve because that is probably based on an accurate assessment that Eve has peaked. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 10, 2010, 01:33:47 AM eve is dieing
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on October 10, 2010, 02:04:02 AM their in-ability to find bugs is a good sign the code-base is borderline unmaintainable Or they just compile it, run it and fill out a checkbox poll on "does it start up". I mean, there's no way they can NOT find bugs such as "corp members show up as alliance members" through any other means than "welp, we didn't even look".eve is dieing Dying :angryfist:Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on October 10, 2010, 02:58:02 AM their in-ability to find bugs is a good sign the code-base is borderline unmaintainable Or they just compile it, run it and fill out a checkbox poll on "does it start up". I mean, there's no way they can NOT find bugs such as "corp members show up as alliance members" through any other means than "welp, we didn't even look".Way back then they added Standing tags in local it was discovered there was a minor bug with your own character. Your character never showed up with the correct tag. You could be marked as corp, alliance, negative, whatever, totally at random. Their 'solution' was to dodge and set it so your own character never displayed a tag. Which to be fair was a nice workaround, but didn't fix the underlying problem. I was disappointed. I liked having a negative standing to myself. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Amarr HM on October 10, 2010, 06:58:03 AM eve is dieing Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Endie on October 10, 2010, 11:32:18 AM I've been playing for years and there have always been bitter vets evangelising about how eve was dying. And yet the subs keep rising. That is usually countered with a "no true Scotsman"-type argument.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: TripleDES on October 10, 2010, 02:40:05 PM Way back then they added Standing tags in local it was discovered there was a minor bug with your own character. Your character never showed up with the correct tag. You could be marked as corp, alliance, negative, whatever, totally at random. Their 'solution' was to dodge and set it so your own character never displayed a tag. Which to be fair was a nice workaround, but didn't fix the underlying problem. That almost definitely sounds like a hard case of variable not initialized. Their code probably skips your own character while computing the standings, leaving yours uninitialized and pick up whatever unoverwritten value there's in memory to which the variable points.Also, the new character creation looks nice. I wish these faggots would finally process the test server reactivations, so I can tinker with it. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on October 10, 2010, 03:58:25 PM I've been playing for years and there have always been bitter vets evangelising about how eve was dying. And yet the subs keep rising. That is usually countered with a "no true Scotsman"-type argument. Yeah, that's the standard response, but its overly simplistic. First because almost all of the people who play for any length of time have multiple accounts, and that's a trend which increased markedly over time. When I started it was rather uncommon. Second CCP made the mistake of saying once, when eve was about 3 or 4 years old, that the average length of time someone lasted in eve was only 3 months. Since many players play for years, that means that the VAST majority of people who try Eve quit long before then. Which means that eve drives off the vast majority of players who try it, which is not the sign of an off the cuff good game. Its the years long players who never seem to leave who keeps it going. And since those can have multiple subs 2 subs, the increase in sub numbers looks more shallow. And that's not including the isk sellers, who's numbers have increased as well. And CCP response is to take a cut. Yep, I'm being simplistic too, but subs doubling over 5 years, when you look at those factors, hardly seems impressive. Especially when the characters actually playing at peak has only gone up by 10-15k in that time Eve is basically a small, hard to get into and expensive to play mmo. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: ajax34i on October 10, 2010, 04:30:10 PM Actually the subs don't keep rising. Server numbers have been in a slight decline for a year now, at least according to what I can see on eve-offline.net.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on October 10, 2010, 11:21:52 PM Somebody make a chart please.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Amarr HM on October 11, 2010, 05:34:44 AM The decline is being stablised by Endie alts.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Endie on October 11, 2010, 06:05:14 AM Actually the subs don't keep rising. Server numbers have been in a slight decline for a year now, at least according to what I can see on eve-offline.net. http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility Past month and three months show rising trends. Past six months shows rising trend with a few outlier spikes during the big fights of winter and early spring. Last year is difficult to read, showing a narrowing of the variation but no obvious trend, upwards or downwards. Himo, as regards 3 month averages your problem there is that this includes all the people who never renew after the first subs period, who will always heavily skew such stats. One of the problems CCP has is that Eve is horrible for newbies who don't have friends playing, and another is that the genre and format simply aren't for a lot of people. A lot of the bitter vet "eve is dying" grumbling is because they keep trying to address that. Six months ago everyone was saying that the sov system was too static and would kill territorial warfare in Eve. Since then we have had the most fluid 0.0 in years, possibly since the first few months of 0.0 warfare. A year before that, it was declared that the nano nerf would kill eve, when all it did was help kill an incarnation of tri. Before that, the end of the three-year Great Wa was supposed to herald a mass-unsubscribe by sated vets. And so on and so on... Since most of you are goons just go and read TWR archives from any period since late 2007. Eve has huge fucking problems, with too many old, rich alliances compressed in too small a space to allow new powers in without support, too many alliances feeling they could lose their space if not part of a bloc and too much money buying too many supercapitals. But individuals claiming that the result of them giong through the same arc as everyone before them and that Eve is dying because they are not finding fun in the same old areas is solipsistic. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on October 11, 2010, 06:16:29 AM Six months ago everyone was saying that the sov system was too static and would kill territorial warfare in Eve. Since then we have had the most fluid 0.0 in years, possibly since the first few months of 0.0 warfare. Let's be fair, a lot of that territory being lost is due to Atlas and -A- dying like a pair of old arthritic grandpas.Also, this collapse would probably not have happened 6 months ago, because the supers etc would probably have been lost hilariously at some point due to blackscreening, so CCP have at least made territorial warfare possible again. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Endie on October 11, 2010, 10:08:25 AM Let's be fair, a lot of that territory being lost is due to Atlas and -A- dying like a pair of old arthritic grandpas. I totally agree, and I think that that is one of the great thing about the current sov system: if you are an afk alliance you will lose your space when attacked. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on October 11, 2010, 10:54:01 AM I totally agree, and I think that that is one of the great thing about the current sov system: if you are an afk alliance you will lose your space when attacked. Uh that would have happened in the old system too, its just that these days you don't have stupid doomsdays twinking the balance. Hell that's how AAA held onto HED for well over a year. We were beating the crap out of Atlas in the GFFL days before we went back to deal with Tri and never came back. If we had stayed on Atlas would have imploded right there. And in point of fact you were always saying that making it easier to defend would improve the game Himo, as regards 3 month averages your problem there is that this includes all the people who never renew after the first subs period, who will always heavily skew such stats. Uh Endie, that's exactly what I said, people try Eve and never come back. People get attracted by the shiney, try it, say fuck this and leave. People over inflate the success of Eve because they have a desperate need to have one successful MMO out there that isn't WOW. Plus, CCP are making a huge marketing push right now. I'm seeing ads for Eve all over the place. They pushed hard in Tyrannis to get people into the game. Boxed sets in shops and everything. Sub numbers didn't really rise much for all that effort. A lot of people tried eve and quit. And the fact is, the so called rise in Subs is simply not met by a corresponding rise in server numbers. I helped out with the recruitment thread because joining an alliance like Goonswarm and a corp like BAT is one of the few ways a newbie can join Eve and have fun. That's my contribution to peoples fun. Aside from that I wouldn't recommend Eve to a new player. I could rejoin tomorrow and have a kick arse character that could beat 99% of the population in a one on one fight. That's the draw on oldies, but whats there for a newbie? (without the opportunity of the recruitment thread, that is) Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on October 11, 2010, 11:32:59 AM The best thing dominion did was forcing alliance leaders to think of new ways to piss in each other's cheerios now that mind numbing sov grinds are much less practical than they used to be.
The discussion about eve dying is making you look retarded btw, just sayin. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Slayerik on October 11, 2010, 11:39:32 AM Weird, I logged into Eve for a sec here a work like an hour ago and there were 42,000 people logged on. That's a lot of people, dual-boxing or no.
Eve is a success, mostly just because it is the only reasonably good sandbox/GvG/PvP game. You two bicker like an old married couple. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: ajax34i on October 11, 2010, 03:05:32 PM http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility Past month and three months show rising trends. Past six months shows rising trend with a few outlier spikes during the big fights of winter and early spring. Endie, eve-offline.net charts are right-to-left. Most recent spike is on the left, oldest spike is on the right. As such, there's no way "past month" and "three months" show rising trends, they both show decreasing trends. Hold your mouse over the data to see a date pop-up. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vedi on October 11, 2010, 03:07:07 PM You two bicker like an old married couple. That's the recent influx you see on the pop graphs. "Notorius Poster Marries Ten Million Alt Entity; Sudden Interest in Eve from Second Lifers" Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Endie on October 11, 2010, 03:29:59 PM I totally agree, and I think that that is one of the great thing about the current sov system: if you are an afk alliance you will lose your space when attacked. Uh that would have happened in the old system too, its just that these days you don't have stupid doomsdays twinking the balance. Hell that's how AAA held onto HED for well over a year. We were beating the crap out of Atlas in the GFFL days before we went back to deal with Tri and never came back. If we had stayed on Atlas would have imploded right there. And in point of fact you were always saying that making it easier to defend would improve the game In the old system one person (xttz) could hold sov in a whole region a quarter of the eve gamespace away from his alliance merely by throwing money and logistical effort at a problem. No doomsdays, no fleets, no fights. The new system makes it easier to take undefended space while making it harder to take space from someone who is defending. That is good, and entirely in line with what I have been saying. Although I would make it even harder to take space that the owners want, in order to make people happier outside superblocs. And you are wrong about Atlas, partly because they had active and popular leadership at that point, partly because they had allies, partly because the situation with the Russians was different, partly because of game mechanics, but mainly because of the geography of their space. Their mistake this time round was in thinking that all those things still held, where in fact none of them did. They were fighting the last war (again). Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Amarr HM on October 12, 2010, 04:36:40 AM One of the problems CCP has is that Eve is horrible Ne'er a truer word spoken :grin: The solipsist part is a fair assumption though. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 18, 2010, 05:06:11 AM Let's confirm the rumors, shall we? T2 Hybrid ammo and rocket boost and fighterbomber nerf (if you could call it that).
http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=809&aid=105650 (http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=809&aid=105650) Quote from: CCP Chronotis The time of Incursion approaches as the shadow of the Sansha's Nation reaches across EVE Online. Incursion is bringing a great bag of awesome and it's time to mention some of the icing on cake changes coming as well, which will interest many of you covering some timely welcome additions and balancing. Tech II ammo getting some love Tech II ammo is getting some love in the coming expansion. We are focusing on the short range versions of the Tech II ammo such as Gleam, Conflagration, Hail, Quake, Void and Javelin. We are removing various negative effects from each, focusing on the drawbacks which penalize your ship itself and also stack per hardpoint loaded with the ammo. This means the ammo will be a good alternative to the faction ammo and, without such focused and sometimes crippling drawbacks, will be much more useful. Rockets Power Up Rockets have been given a power up with a focus on making them more effective against frigate sized ships. They gain a bonus to explosion velocity and damage whilst getting a slightly reduced rate of fire. In addition, the Hawk received some special attention with a change to its kinetic missile damage bonus to 10% per level and a little extra powergrid. SCC approves addition of faction ships to the market The SCC has been persuaded to relax their stringent hold on the market and will, with Incursion, allow the trade of all faction ships. This is pretty cool for those of you looking for pimp rides to show off whilst cruising around Yulai with more bling bling. Fighter Bombers no longer give the server a migraine Fighter bombers and supercarriers have shot up in popularity since Dominion where they got a boost and role change. The side effect of this is that fighter bombers are the "spawn of evil" in server performance terms. Team Gridlock who are leading the war on lag effort identified them as a major contributor to fleet fight lag as is demonstrated below. Not only are they drones which usually come in packs of 20 per ship but they fire missiles which all have to be tracked in the inventory and physical scene within the game. To alleviate this, we are switching fighter bombers to use "fake missiles". In doing so, we dramatically decrease the load induced by utilising fighter bombers. At the same time, the visual effect of the bombers attacking targets is now much more awesome whilst at the same time no longer causing as much load courtesy of our art and audio team. Below you can see the server load graphs of 30 supercarriers deploying their drones (the first CPU spike) and then ordering their drones to attack a target for about four minutes (the second event) so we can establish the average load and then finally recalling their drones. Graph A shows fighter bombers as they are today as you can see consuming the lion's share of the server CPU. Graph B shows the same fighter bombers now modified to use fake missiles in the same scenario and that the CPU used is now much lower. Graph C for comparison shows supercarriers with fighters as they are today (fighters cause more load because they fire more frequently) Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Simond on October 18, 2010, 05:14:08 AM Quote SCC approves addition of faction ships to the market Contract up your faction ships now, because this is sure as hell going to make prices drop.The SCC has been persuaded to relax their stringent hold on the market and will, with Incursion, allow the trade of all faction ships. This is pretty cool for those of you looking for pimp rides to show off whilst cruising around Yulai with more bling bling. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 18, 2010, 05:34:23 AM Can't wait to fly Frekis on Sisi :woop:
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on October 18, 2010, 05:37:17 AM Why faction gear is not tradeable on the market is bizarre. Contracts should be for fitted and rigged ships only.
I still don't get why the fact super-carrier * 20 fighter bombers * X missiles in flight was not considered in terms of CPU cost at the design phase, during testing or during play. Considering it as a recently "identifier" issue is :uhrr: Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on October 18, 2010, 05:51:21 AM *ahem* 4 optional patches due to more or less obvious UI fuckery, and you wonder why they missed SCs having a high CPU usage?
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Setanta on October 19, 2010, 07:15:46 AM Does the rocket "fix" mean that T2 Amarr frigates (and the Caldari Hawk) finally become usable? I hope so, because the AF with rockets attached was pathetic.
Still no AF fix for the "missing" stats I see. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 19, 2010, 12:13:52 PM If it will make the Heretic go up in price we'll lose a cheap disposable dictor. If it turns into a ship on par with the Sabre however, then hell yeah, Amarr Victor.
It won't though. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on October 19, 2010, 04:48:41 PM Even if this made rockets competitive with projectile guns (it doesn't), the Sabre would still have far greater fitting flexibility.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phildo on October 19, 2010, 04:56:39 PM And be faster. And more agile. And do instant damage instead of delayed missile damage.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: MahrinSkel on October 19, 2010, 06:06:34 PM And a better native resist profile (for what that's worth in a tin can).
--Dave Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Thrawn on October 19, 2010, 07:08:53 PM *edit* durr, need a delete key
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Goumindong on October 21, 2010, 06:39:35 PM Contract up your faction ships now, because this is sure as hell going to make prices drop. That depends entirely on who bears the brunt of the transaction costs imposed by contracts. If its the people who have to search through stuff to find what they want(where they want it and at what price) instead of going to the market then prices will rise rather than fall since it will be easier to find things. Note that this means equilibrium price, information obfuscation involved in the contracting system does mean that some people can hold out for higher prices when selling and vice versa for hold outs on lower prices. Those hold outs will be less possible in the open market. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on October 22, 2010, 01:18:25 AM The first paragraph of what you said makes absolutely no sense.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Goumindong on October 22, 2010, 10:34:28 AM The first paragraph of what you said makes absolutely no sense. Whether or not prices rise or fall depends on who bears the non-pecuniary costs associated with the contracting system. If those contracting costs are borne by the buyer, then prices will rise. If those contracting costs are borne but the seller then prices will fall. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on October 22, 2010, 02:58:32 PM You should stop theorycrafting. Seriously.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Goumindong on October 22, 2010, 03:14:00 PM You should stop theorycrafting. Seriously. Its pretty simple economics. Maybe you should get educated. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on October 22, 2010, 11:06:04 PM You should stop replying to Goumindong. Seriously.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Vinadil on October 23, 2010, 09:45:52 AM In layman's terms... I am one of those people who NEVER shop contracts because the search system is so stupidly convoluted. I would, however, purchase faction ships for lots of millions of ISK if they were easy to find on the market.
So, demand will increase because of buyers like me... which will increase prices. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: MahrinSkel on October 23, 2010, 10:55:04 AM If it's like other things that have moved from contracts to the market, you're going to see more volume, an overall higher price, and a much tighter spread. Overall, for specialist market-makers this will mean more profit.
--Dave Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Trouble on October 25, 2010, 11:13:50 PM I just run my market bot and train my 11 accounts. I can't stand to actually play the game.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: NiX on November 03, 2010, 05:16:45 AM I just run my market bot and train my 11 accounts. I can't stand to actually play the game. :awesome_for_real:Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Surlyboi on November 12, 2010, 08:56:18 AM Some key bits of Incursion pushed back 'til next year. (http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=814)
tl;dr... Quote We discussed a few of the options we have with the CSM, and I think we‘re very unified that the best course of action is: Release a first-step patch with a collection of player requested improvements November 30th. Release a second-step patch before Christmas (Only Santa knows what will be in this patch!) Release key features of this expansion such as the Incarna Character Creator and Sansha Incursions in January 2011 Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Phildo on November 12, 2010, 09:38:55 AM Apparently the last patch enabled HTML in chat.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on November 12, 2010, 09:41:09 AM And ccp have declared html to be an exploit.
:oh_i_see: :oh_i_see: Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on November 12, 2010, 09:55:55 AM Yes.
[23:27:59] GM Grave > The only people who are permitted to use coloured text are CCP employees and ISD volunteers. As such anyone who colours or sizes their text in any way will be considered to be performing an exploit and dealt with accordingly. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 12, 2010, 10:33:50 AM I always thought Evechat ran partly on HTML or something similar anyway, and that was how you could paste links into chat and so forth.
Just received my second "Please come back, you'll get 5 days free!!!" email from CCP in 3 days. :oh_i_see: Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Surlyboi on November 12, 2010, 10:37:23 AM I just got that one too.
That said, the new character creator, when it works, is a thing of beauty on the test server. The level of customization is pretty high. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Pennilenko on November 12, 2010, 03:20:26 PM I always thought Evechat ran partly on HTML or something similar anyway, and that was how you could paste links into chat and so forth. Just received my second "Please come back, you'll get 5 days free!!!" email from CCP in 3 days. :oh_i_see: Just ignore it, you won't regret it later. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: tgr on November 12, 2010, 04:17:27 PM Quote from: http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?7118-html-code-in-local-chat&p=132615&viewfull=1#post132615 Exploiting From: GM Horse Sent: 2010.11.12 22:41 To: xxxxxxxx, This is an official warning for using an exploit. Exploiting bugs in game mechanics is a EULA Violation and any further violations of this nature may lead to a permanent ban being placed upon your account. 22:42:29 Info You have been gagged by GM Horse until 2010.11.12 23:11:51. GM Horse's reason was: Colour text exploit. Quote from: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1413692&page=1#14 Quote from: CCP Jericho It's not an exploit, but intended new feature. It's now possible for players to talk in colors in game. Enjoy~ugh Slap me I made a mistake. Typing in colors is considered an exploit. Don't use it.Edit: This is a lie!!! CCP is already working on fixing it. Color text is an exploit. Only CCP can manage to make something as innocuous available to the general public as ... coloured text, and actually threaten to ban people who use it. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 12, 2010, 04:25:23 PM I always thought Evechat ran partly on HTML or something similar anyway, and that was how you could paste links into chat and so forth. Just received my second "Please come back, you'll get 5 days free!!!" email from CCP in 3 days. :oh_i_see: Just ignore it, you won't regret it later. No worries, I wasn't even tempted. I'd have to download the client which rates a giant meh to me. Nice email though, even had a pic of my avatar in the corner Quote Himo Amasacia, A free five-day reactivation still awaits you, but time is running out. From now until November 21st, you can reactivate your EVE Online account for free for five days. Return in time for the upcoming expansion for the reduced price of 19.95 for 60 days. Reactivate and Save FIVE DAYS OF FREE EVE ONLINE Offer expires November 21st, 2010 LAST MINUTE BONUS FOR RETURNING PLAYERS In response to the overwhelming interest that we have seen recently for the upcoming expansion content, for the next five days the Singularity Test server will be public and available to all accounts that are eligible for this reactivation offer. Reactivating players will find that copies of their characters have already been placed on Singularity, eliminating the necessity to request and wait for a manual transfer. To install the test server client visit the Singularity page in EVElopedia. This extended service is for a limited time only and may be shortened if emergency testing is needed. - EVE Online Dev Team Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on November 15, 2010, 01:53:05 AM http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1412947&page=1#13 (http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1412947&page=1#13)
This is how to post. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 15, 2010, 04:33:16 AM Urrgh, every time I look at the CCP forums these days I come away feeling soiled.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on November 15, 2010, 02:19:18 PM I've given up on the main boards. Kugutsumen for a slightly less retarded COAD and scrapheap challenge general for discussion of game trends (plus goons board) is enough. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on November 15, 2010, 02:32:55 PM I tend to think of it as Kugu for North-wing commentary, SHC for South-wing commentary. SHC is Fox and Kugu is MSNBC you see.
EVE News 24 isn't horrible for purely factual content. EVE-O strictly for trolling. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on November 20, 2010, 10:36:01 AM Incursion träilör (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejX0Rym0NZw)
It reminds me of a gimmick some folk discarded about a year ago. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on November 20, 2010, 06:11:50 PM They really do bag out people who decide to mine in both their videos and their announcements. Also no idea why they're releasing a video for stuff that's still months off. The first dribble of their patch is just a couple of minor game-balances fixes. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Simond on November 21, 2010, 04:19:53 AM :ccp:
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 21, 2010, 05:48:32 AM I actually kinda like that trailer, but I like overly dramatic claptrap. :oh_i_see: But yeah they seem to have a hardon for huge hardfaught battles against mining barges and freighters.
I was half expecting, once I saw them mining ice, to hear them saying "1000101110110110101010101010010101010101010" or something in Chinese :awesome_for_real: Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: ajax34i on November 21, 2010, 10:07:53 AM Must be a fantasy of theirs, since no miner in his right mind would order "keep your distance we don't know what they're up to" whenever his belt lights up with red crosses. Or even unknowns.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Furiously on November 21, 2010, 10:11:26 AM Who doesn't dream of blowing up a mining fleet???
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Pennilenko on November 21, 2010, 11:07:44 AM Who doesn't dream of blowing up a mining fleet??? The people running the mining fleet? Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Furiously on November 21, 2010, 11:13:09 AM Who doesn't dream of blowing up a mining fleet??? The people running the mining fleet? Bet half of them dream of it too. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Brolan on November 21, 2010, 01:19:37 PM Must be a fantasy of theirs, since no miner in his right mind would order "keep your distance we don't know what they're up to" whenever his belt lights up with red crosses. Or even unknowns. Exactly, he would be warping as soon as they showed up. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 21, 2010, 01:47:09 PM Another thing is the scene at the gate with all the traffic slowly moving to the gate when the 6 Nightmare battleships appear. Amongst other things like the helpless traders not doing things like warping off, it seems they still have the pre warp to zero scenes in their minds.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Amarr HM on November 21, 2010, 05:27:23 PM You remember that time the Mothership crashed into the station? That wasn't plausible either.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Comstar on November 21, 2010, 08:06:38 PM It's happen though- you'll get AFK industrials and freighters auto-piloting in Empire and getting killed 15km from the gate.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Sir T on November 22, 2010, 05:27:28 AM True.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on January 25, 2011, 09:19:50 AM Incursions are a clusterfuck of 900 people bashing at really difficult NPCs all day and only removing 30% of the negative influence while creating massive piles of wrecks.
So go fit a Drake with a rack of salvagers and go make bank! Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Numtini on January 25, 2011, 10:15:38 AM Apparently it's also a great opportunity to wait until someone in a logi reps you, then blow them up.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Surlyboi on January 25, 2011, 04:36:43 PM Yeah, the transition between test server and live lost something in translation. I managed to send a bunch of sanshas to the great beyond on singularity, haven't splashed one on live.
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Kageru on January 25, 2011, 04:52:08 PM LoL-CCP. You'd think even a 5 minute conversation over lunch at CCP would have raised the problem of how to do co-operative PvE in an environment where the "hostility" flag is contagious and in many cases an instant death. Then again I'm still convinced CCP are the first "griefing" development studio and do this sort of stuff on purpose. I mean the way no one gets badges out of the event until and only if the boss mob dies is brilliance. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on March 19, 2011, 02:36:28 AM This has moved on a fair bit as the player base has worked out how to do this.
Incursion fleets are now 10 man AHAC gangs (exactly 3 Guardians 7 Zealots/Lokis) taking just under 100M per hour per member plus LP by beating on sleeper frigates, until the pinata spawns after a few days and drops another 100M each plus a handful of cool BPCs. Its a more accessible complex. And sucks a litle bit less than the rest of EVE PVE. Biggest challenge is logistics, you have to get to the staging site fast to take advantage as they will only last a few days - ideally you want a guardian (with mining drones lol ccp) and a zealot or loki on hand for the initial sites and a shieldfleet ship (basilisk, maelstrom, tengu) for the pinata phase. As you'll only be interested in low or null sec incursions, best solution is a carrier. Quote from: Local [ 2011.03.18 23:41:35 ] Sswarog > Thanks GoonSwarm for clarification of system from Sansha nation))) For us all work have made) [ 2011.03.18 23:41:47 ] Sswarog > ) [ 2011.03.18 23:41:57 ] Grey Requiem > vote for mittani [ 2011.03.18 23:42:08 ] Admiral Feelgood > vote for themittani for csm [ 2011.03.18 23:42:11 ] tasty food > vote cile rat [ 2011.03.18 23:42:18 ] Grey Requiem > vote for themittani for csm [ 2011.03.18 23:45:37 ] Sswarog > I not the politician I the pirate but all the same thanks) [ 2011.03.18 23:48:17 ] Sswarog > All happily successful processing Sansha ) Oh how we have fallen. Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: Gets on March 19, 2011, 08:42:12 AM You forgot Legions!
Title: Re: Winter patch 2010 Post by: eldaec on April 04, 2011, 06:40:59 AM Making so much Isk in these.
Paid for my incursion travelling gypsy fleet (zealot, absolution, guardian, maelstrom, nightmare, scimitar) and I'm over 2.5 billion plus 300k lp up, and still owed about 1B from loot sales. |