f13.net

http://www.fromdustgame.com/

Dev diary trailery thing here: http://gamingbolt.com/from-dust-tech-demo-is-phenomenal

Anyone heard much about this game?

Looks like a god sim with lots of terraforming. Could be fun, could be a one-trick pony that gets to be boring after an hour.

Not to be released till Spring, I think.

Strikes me as Black and White meets Minecraft.  I saw this trailer the other day and was impressed.  Honestly though, this was just a tech demo and its going to really depend on how good the game the build around it actually plays.

God that art style is gorgeous.

It's Eric Chahi! I remember my mom buying me the French version of Future Wars in the hopes would learn the language better (I had just started French classes in school).

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETHGr3Gv_nk

There was an article about it in the last game developer mag. Very impressive.

My thoughts exactly. 

It's on Xbox Live / PSN so I am unsure whether it can develop into a compelling game.  The water looks amazing though so I would stare at that for a while at least.

That looks like the parts of B&W I loved multiplied by what I wanted Spore to be.

I was thinking Populous.

Reminds me of Ryzom.

I get a Populous feel meets Black & White vibe. I liked parts of both, but wasn't amazed by the whole.

That being said, I saw the developer and immediately thought, "Ah, right, the asshole DRM bandits I won't purchase shit from."  :oh_i_see:

It's a shame they come up with interesting ideas.

I did read somewhere (maybe in a YouTube comment) it is the spiritual successor to Populous.

Good to see I'm not the only one thinking the very same thing re: ubisoft. They have some damn interesting games, but I'm not buying them. It's really a damn shame.

It's a single-player game, so you can always just pirate it.   :awesome_for_real:

The land-building aspect looks cool, but I hope it's not a one trick pony. I have a hard time envisioning how the shiny erosion engine would interact meaningfully with challenging and enjoyable gameplay.

That's exactly what I thought too.

I'm dying to know if people like us are the cranky old weirdos in taking this stance and 99.9% of their potential market don't give a shit. Are Ubisoft's PC sales actually impacted by their DRM asshattery or not? How can we find this out?

My impression the last year has been that their main income is from younger people who don't really care about "minor things" like how they don't own a game, how they can't mod it, how the controls might be more awkward than necessary, etc etc etc. And they don't really give a flying fuck about PC gamers (like most of the PC developers these days), we're just icing on the cake for their profitability.

Pshhh, it's easy.  Go to a torrent site and check how many people are downloading our game compared to older titles with less annoying DRM.  If fewer people are downloading our game, it means our DRM is working, and we should continue to make it more intrusive to drive piracy down further.  If, on the other hand, more people are downloading it, it means our DRM is ineffective, and we need to make it more intrusive to counter the upswing in piracy.

I may actually prostrate myself before the Ubi DRM gods for this game. Srsly it's Eric Chahi!

UbiSoft is only using Steam's DRM for the release of RUSE. (http://www.destructoid.com/ubisoft-drops-online-only-drm-for-r-u-s-e--181199.phtml)

So they are testing to see how different methods work out for them.

Yeah, but they can patch it in later;  that's what happened to Borderlands.

That and they are going to test it on games I don't give a shit about, then declare it terrible when people don't buy them as much as their other more-anticipated titles.

Oh, release it on steam, get the sales, then force people to use the UBI auth servers?

I'm going to be giving UBI a wide berth for a while yet. From Dust looks interesting, though, so I do hope they'll keep on going in this direction (if they must have something online to start with).

That's interesting. I bought Borderlands on Steam a while back when there was a good offer, but have yet to try it. Are you saying they've patched the original Borderlands release with new DRM since then?

The graphics/physics engine in From Dust looks sweet (even more so from a developer/world-building perspective than from a player one, I suspect), but yeah. Ubisoft.  :heartbreak:

The first two Borderlands DLC expansions have some obnoxious DRM (a particularly heinous version of SecuROM) on them. It took me forever to get them to install properly.

Makes me glad I didn't pick them up, even on the cheap.

If that's their track record, I guess it's not safe to buy it even if they release a DRM-free version.   :uhrr:

Or can you maybe uncheck the "keep this game updated" option on Steam to keep it from patching in the herpes?

Wait, what?

How the hell do you patch in DRM? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of having it? I mean, it's already hit the street at that point. The box is wide open. That does absolutely NOTHING but piss off your customers.

I hope you're not suggesting logic applies to management.

Management can be hilariously stupid, but not all the time. Sometimes they are just shortsighted in trying to do what they perceive will provide the most return for the business. Overly invasive DRM is one of those shortsighted things when it puts so much pressure on paying customers to jump through hoops. However, there is an actual argument for it, even if it's weak. Management typically does things for a reason, even if it's a ridiculous reason that has no basis in reality.

There is no argument for security months after the fact. There is no monetary gain associated with that. It's a wasted cost. If someone is actually trying to explain how such a move would be value-added beyond just saying, "Well we'll lure in customers with false promises then drop the real hammer on them," they are flat lying. Also, if that's the actual reason, they are shooting any goodwill they have with the customer in the foot.

I'm not saying they couldn't do it. I'm just saying if they are doing it, the company is doomed.

Just watched the video. Pretty.

I think that what they did with borderlands (which might not have come through well enough in this thread) was that the core game was with steam drm only, but the DLCs were protected with securom. If that's the case (I can't say either way, as I waited for a few weeks before looking at buying borderlands, and it sounded like it was a major disappointment so I won out), then there is probably some sort of argument that can be made for putting extra DRM on there.

Securing DLC to a "non-secured" game on the Steam format doesn't make sense. You know for a fact that you have customers out there who bought the legitimate title, and you know there were those that pirated it. Adding the DRM won't stop the pirates from doing it again with your DLC, and even if it does, who gives a shit? What you stopped them from getting access to is something worth $10 when the $50 game is already out there.

In addition, why would a paying customer who owns the base game suddenly decide to pirate the DLC? That's a rather large leap for people to make when they already own a legal copy, unless you fuck up the DRM so bad that they don't want to buy it for fear of their computer getting AIDS.

I concur. "Another World" was one of my favourite Amiga games ever. And Paul Cuisset's "Flashback" was also in the running.

I don't really remember 2k's position on the "used games market", but I know EA and UBI have been very vocal about how much money they're losing on that, and how DLC is the way to either make people pay more for their game, or to get the gamers who bought a used game, to pay them some for their game. In that regard, putting on some form of DRM does make sense.

No, I don't agree with it, since well, I think steam is enough. But I wouldn't be surprised if that's their reasoning. Or maybe they just forgot that the original game didn't have 3rd party DRM on. I don't know.

My main point is that a DLC is useless without the other. DRMing the game, and NOT doing it on the DLC? That makes total sense. The other way around is just bollocks.

The used game market is console games.  DRM mainly affects PC games.  There is very little overlap, so it doesn't make sense.

This is supposed to launch this week, supposedly.  They're saying XBLA for sure on 7/27, PC is also supposed to be 7/27 but there's no confirmation.  No PS3 date yet, other than 2011. 

I'll likely pick it up on PC, but I really, really wanted the PS3 version and don't feel like waiting. 

http://www.facebook.com/fromdustgame

I'm jonesing for this one, hard. I heard the PC version was the 29th on Steam, but the Steam store still has no mention whatsoever of the game.

Ubisoft seems to be trying to smother it, what with a near-total blackout on marketing.

Eh, this was on my radar last year but the more I see of it the less interesting it actually looks.  If its on Steam and looks decent on sale say, come the winter sale, I might pick it up.

It's part of summer of arcade, and I'm going to bet there's some idiotic rule against marketing it on other platforms due to that.

It's supposed to drop this week on PC, but there's dead air about it. And the ubi site basically turns into an idiotic loop to try and get information on it (ubi.com links official website to their facebook page. Facebook page's info links their official website to.. Ubi's product page which links you right back to the facebook page <3)

August 17 for PC now. 

Supposed to still go live for XBLA Wednesday.

*pinches bridge of nose to avoid going into rant-mode about god damn consoles*

IGN UK gave it an 8.5 overall.  They didn't really have much bad to say about it. 

I'm excited to try it out, and I hope the sandbox post-game is good.

Bah, I only have 900 points. Why can't I just pay in dollars FFS.

August 17th for PC it is, hopefully.

http://store.steampowered.com/app/33460/

Picked it up on xbox and I'm enjoying it so far.

HIGH SPEED INTERNET ACCESS AND CREATION OF A UBISOFT ACCOUNT ARE REQUIRED TO ACCESS THIS VIDEO GAME AND ONLINE FEATURES AND TO PLAY ONLINE. YOU MUST BE AT LEAST 13 TO CREATE A UBISOFT ACCOUNT WITHOUT PARENTAL CONSENT. UBISOFT MAY CANCEL ACCESS TO ONE OR MORE SPECIFIC ONLINE FEATURES UPON A 30-DAY PRIOR NOTICE PUBLISHED AT http://www.fromdustgame.com/

EDIT: Oh and I always like that this is part of the Terms of Use - "It is a violation of the Terms of Use to give false information or intentionally hide any information that is required by the Sites or the Software."

What online features does it even have?

The feature to not work when Ubisoft decides it doesn't want the it to work.  :why_so_serious:

The online feature being turning on the game.  :oh_i_see:

Here's the Escapist Article on the internet connection broohaha (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/111941-From-Dust-Always-On-DRM-Rumors-Denied-UPDATED)

I'll believe it when I see it about the updated quote from Ubi.

Did the x360 version require an Ubi account?

This is really disappointing. 

Remember at Ubisoft, you're not customers, you're fucking criminals that must be contained.

No. Just boot it up and play.

Thanks, Nix.  I'll just hold out for the PS3 version, which hopefully won't require all that jazz.

I was likely going to buy it twice (PC, PS3) because I liked the style, idea and price point so much.  In this case, we both lose. 

Heh. Figures. The first game in a loooong time that even vaguely reminds me of populous of olde, and it's got the online requirement.

To be fair, it was to be expected, what with it being released by ubisoft, so not really all that surprising.

Just realized this was only 15 bucks. Still don't plan on buying it, but it seems a lot more viable at that price to me, DRM not withstanding.

I thought Ubi was backing off on their DRM, though.  AC Brotherhood doesn't use it, as far as I know. 

I'm still reserving judgement on this one.  It doesn't say that a constant connection is required (the way it does for Settlers), so maybe it's just the less annoying version where you just need it to log in or install.

I'm not going to go "hah!", but I strongly doubt they're going to deviate any time soon. They might not go for the always-on, but I would be highly surprised if they never wavered from the activate-online DRM from here on out. At least it sounds like they're not suffering too much overall, profit-wise, but I suspect that's the consoles carrying them, and I seem to remember that their PC share (profit within the company, not in the industry overall) is laughably small these days.

Ubisoft did apparently deny that From Dust will have always on DRM.  So, it still might have something sketchy, but most likely it seems like it'll be worth waiting to see what happens with it on PC. 

I bought this game on steam without even noticing it was Ubisoft and stupid me, was all wtf when to play the game I have to create a Ubi account.  Also made me realise the last time I played a ubisoft game was Beyond Good and Evil quite some years ago farcry 1 which was still quite a while a go but it looks like I must have made some sort of account back then.

On the bright side, as far as I can tell, the game doesn't have the always-online Hitler's sphincter DRM.  Switched my modem off while I was playing and it ran fine.  It did bitch at me when I quit about being unable to synch savegames, but it still loaded fine when I started again, and synched fine that time (when I didn't disconnect my modem).  You do have to log in first, though.

Game seems pretty fun.  Mostly it's a graphics/environment thing for me, though.  Playing in the sand, making these barren islands into tropical paradises, it's all very relaxing.  I can see it getting frustrating in the later levels if things get difficult, though, because the controls are rather floaty.

There is much wailing and gnashing of teeth on the FB page.  Personally, I'm having a good time with it.  Sadly, I will consume this game too fast.  I will get more than my $15 out of it, but I like it so much that I will want much, much more.

My kid it playing it, too.  Six years old, she is pretty good at understanding what to do. 

I managed to get 30 minutes in yesterday after it released, and it seemed pretty fun. I enjoyed dicking around with erosion and redirecting rivers.

I expect it'll be pretty short, as I got through 3(?) levels and the little progression meter level-selection gizmo seemed to say that I was 1/4 of the way through the game...

http://lo-ping.org/2011/08/18/steam-offering-refund-for-ever-sold-copy-of-from-dust/

That sucks (that they included UbiDRM). Looked like a cool game, hopefully they remove it later.

I'm no anti-drm nut, but Ubi is where I draw the line.

The ubi bloatware started getting bad last night and this morning.  The 'sync saves' screen was locking up when I would quit the game.  Had to reboot each time. 

I just requested a refund, we'll see if I get it.  I'll buy this on PS3 or Steam again if they remove that crap. 

I haven't had that sync saves thing work for me once yet.  It didn't crash my computer though.

Steam denied my first attempt at refund.  I replied to them with about four articles and links to three different threads on this, including this from the Ubisoft forums:

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/6645/drmgo.jpg

The camera-controls on the PC-version are HORRENDOUS.

They denied mine also.

Agree on the camera for sure. I'm a sucker for this kind of game but man the camera is totally annoying the shit out of me on the PC.

If you've got a gamepad, start using it. Camera control was clearly designed around two thumbsticks.

Never buy a pc game from Ubisoft. Ever.

I was denied again.  Lesson learned; $14.99 out of my pocket, but that seems pretty cheap to learn that a) I'll guaranteed never buy an Ubisoft product again, and b) Steam just got a big black mark in my book for not supporting its customers. 

When I was a kid, my dad would take me to the arcade at the mall and we'd spent $10 or so every week in there.  One day, he put a token in a machine, but it was broke.  He asked the attendant for a token since the machine was broken.  The guy walked over, verified the machine was broken and told my dad "no refunds".  We never spent another penny in there again.  It's no surprise that a few years later, the arcade closed down. 

Not saying I'll never buy another Steam product (indies!), but instead of being all frothy about Steam, I'll just shop around now.  They also just guaranteed lost my Deux Ex sale, which I was likely going to buy from Steam if this all worked out.  Now it goes to PS3. 

Buy it used on the PS3 to really stick it to the :P

Not until they rethink their life goals.

It's been a long time since I have. I'm going back on the wagon. Basically this is a Populous with very nice art direction, some retarded controls and pathfinding, and a camera on the PC that would be more manipulable if it had drunk a fifth of whisky and was looking at porn while you tried to get it to go where you wanted.

From http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9751064939/m/1511052349


Second post: 

I'm shocked they left something like that in the game! Shocked!

Good luck trying to sell the next Anno with a huge pile on computer AIDS attached to it, Ubi.

I love the apologists in that thread.

Sounds like I will be buying From Dust in approximately two weeks, if they are telling the truth.

It's Ubi... Can you really ever trust them?

I still trust Steam if they tell me that there is no copy protection anymore. Of course, Ubi could turn the table on them a second time. Hmm

I never trust that a game being sold on Steam doesn't have DRM on it when it's new. It always seems to take 1-2 weeks (sometimes more, though) before they update the store page with that information. It might be what the publisher demands, it might be that the publisher just lies to valve, I don't know. All I know is that I'm not pre-purchasing, and I'm always googling the games to see if people in general say it's actually removed.

Especially with ubisoft.

So, I preordered this on Steam and played it over the course of last week and the weekend. It took, all told, about five hours to finish.

I didn't have the issues most other people have been reporting with the camera, so I found it pretty enjoyable. The last couple levels were creeping into annoyance territory - I liked the calmer ones, where you had to figure out how to achieve your goals organically and slowly. The later levels rely more on planning at the outset and use of special powers rather than manipulation of terrain, and they tended to have a "tipping point," whereby the level was really really hard until you got some combination of powers, and then it was just a bit of mop-up work.

After playing the final level, I kind of felt like they'd built a beautiful and powerful engine and then thrown away the opportunity to reinvent the god-game genre. With some more mechanics building on the growth and development of villages, this'd be a nice Populous-Lite.

As is, I'd advise most folks to wait for a Steam sale, really.

I suspect that they will only remove the connection issue, but we'll still have to launch the Ubilauncher to get into the game.  It's better than having the DRM, but it's still bogus.  I hope I'm wrong. 

I'll reinstall it once the patch hits.  From there, I personally feel that I will get my $15 out of it, but like Yoru, it would be okay to wait for it to hit $5.  There's such significant potential for a massive sandbox type game here, but it's so damn short as it stands. 

From Steam just a bit ago:

That happened with Black and White for me. The tutorial and first level were this awesome sandboxy god game where you got to fool around for hours in a cool setting and then someone decided to slap a shitty RTS onto it. Never did finish the second level. The day Molyneux died imo.

What always gets me is when they throw a timed element on top of things, that always makes it go from fun screwing around to chore.

My refund just went through.

So uh.... Other than DRM madness (!). Is the game any fun? Looks fun.

So does that mean you love steam again?  :awesome_for_real:

Kinda.  Their wording was less than generous.  Phrases such as


and


mean that Steam never really stood up to Ubisoft for their customers, rather Ubisoft caved under the pressure.  Steam could have made themselves look a lot better by telling us how much they went to bat for the customers, but they didn't. 

The whole experience went from having me be "100% onboard with Steam, they can do no wrong", to recognizing that they're just there for the dollars.  As they should be, but I just had the false impression they gave a shit. 

Steam gives a shit. Just not about UbiSoft's shit.

It's buyer beware, which we should all be MORE than aware of by now.

I suppose. Steam has enough weight by now: it should basically be enforcing a design minimum. You want in, you don't fucking do Ubi shit. Otherwise go sell it in your horrible little online slum that you made yourself.

God, I wish they would do exactly that. That way I would know that if it's on steam, that's all I would have to worry about.