f13.net

This is coming up soon and looks to be a good one.

It looks like, from this list (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/page/worldcup101-03012010/ce/us/best-players-2010-world-cup?cc=5901&ver=us), that Spain should be a major player in this year's cup.  I fully expect to see Spain and England underachieve and Germany, Italy, Brazil and probably Argentina in the finals, depending on the path to the final game. 

Spain will depend on David Villa and Fernando Torres' health. If they can keep it together, I back them - I'm not going to dismiss them like I did in Euro 2008. Brazil isn't as scary as it used to be and Argentina is one white powder sniff from deconstructing at any time. Italy doesn't scare me either.

Italy does however have plenty of time to get up to speed with the minnows in their group.

England are in awful shape for this World Cup. I expect we'll get through the group stages but I don't see us going much further.

For those watching from the States, have you seen ESPN's broadcast times?

http://www.espnmediazone3.com/us/2010/01/espn-inc-2010-fifa-world-cup-schedule/ (http://www.espnmediazone3.com/us/2010/01/espn-inc-2010-fifa-world-cup-schedule/)

Basically, for the Group Stages, every day from 6/11 thru 6/25 there will be a 7am, 9:30am, and 2pm (Eastern Time) game.

For the elimination rounds, the games are 9:30am & 2pm.

Semi's and finals at 2pm.

Hurray for DVR, although I usually try to watch at least one game a day at the pub.

I miss London.  There was a pub in the hallway between my dorms and the classrooms.

I have to look forward to a summer with loads of people complaining about France kicking Ireland out of the WC qualifyers and how we would be beating the crap out of the useless teams that did qualify.  :oh_i_see:

Planning to watch the US v England game at a pub, but will probably watch most of the rest at home. Can't wait!

My Tivo will be on fire during that week month.

EDIT: Because the World Cup is longer than a week, dumbass.

USA England really needs to be watched with a crowd and saved to either be savored again in delicious happiness or ritualistically savaged over drinks and bitter tears of loss.

It was flipping tapes in 98 that convinced me to get a DVR when the DISHplayer came out the next year.

WAKA WAKA RISEEEEEE  :drill: :drill: :drill:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGMyHtZpMwY
----

Starts tomorrow, 11th June.

Group A:

4pm CET - 10am EDT South Africa - Mexico
8.30pm CET - 2.30pm EDT  Uruguay - France

My prediction: 1-1, 0-1

I am a bundle of giddiness.

tomorrow el-tri 2 Bafanna Bafanna 1
Hand of Gaul1 Ura, ura, ura not gonna make it to the second round 0.

World Cup Calendar. (http://www.marca.com/deporte/futbol/mundial/sudafrica-2010/calendario-english.html)

I worry that England might win it, the loss of Rio isn't the worst thing that could happen as long as Ledley King stays fit they have the more stalwart defender. I fancy Argentina to make it to the Semis or final and I suspect USA to go to the second round only to be knocked out by Germany. My punt for the semi's will be Argentina, Spain (maybe Brazil), England and Netherlands.

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

 :why_so_serious:

Hmm, good point.

World Cup Bracket Poll

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=19349.0

Get your picks before matches start tomorrow…

Opening Ceremony starting any minute now.

Good start of the 2010 World Cup: 1-1 between Mexico and South Africa, I was right  :heart:

Mexico has a brilliant play, but the young age of some of their key elements is clearly showing, like Dos Santos and Vela. Too many chances wasted, too much playing around in the middle with useless one-twos, they were playing better when using the wingers. But hey, if they manage to get more serious and pass on to the next stage, they can wreak some havoc, they're quite unpredictable with their quickness.

South Africa, heart, long balls, but beside the great goal and Pienaar experience, their true key element is the experienced coach, Parreira. He surely knows how to place his pieces around the field.

Honor mention: Perez, Mexico goalkeeper. He's just a MESS, lol.

Oh, and by the way:

http://www.beet.tv/2010/06/world-cup-fever-internet-has-busiest-day-ever-.html

I still don't understand why that first goal wasn't given to Mexico.  What happened there?  There was a defender on the goal line so it clearly wasn't offsides.  I never really heard an explanation for it.

He was ruled offsides.

You are offside when the ball is played forward by your team from a position further from the goal line than the second to last player of the opposing team and you are closer to the goal line than the second to last player of the opposing team and you are ahead of the ball (unless you are in your own half, then you are never offside). The key thing here, is that the goalkeeper is just another player for the purpose of this rule, you don't get special credit for who happens to be the last and second to last man.

There was one defender on the goal line, the second to last player was the goalkeeper who had charged forward, the player who put the ball in the net was ahead of the goalkeeper when the ball was played forward. Ergo offside.

I can understand the confusion I've rarely seen that call come into play.

You can watch the games live on the internet through Univision here:

http://futbol.univision.com/fifacopamundial/partidos-en-vivo/

Also, you can watch them live on ESPN360.com if you have the right broadband provider. It's currently not working, probably because of too much demand.

The Uruguay-France match was a total letdown.  :oh_i_see:

Enjoyed the Bafana Bafana goal celebration.

Fixed that for you

Guess that's two fingers to those who thought France were the more attractive proposition than Ireland.

Right  :ye_gods:

Nothing really to comment about that match. Tomorrow should be interesting enough with the much anticipated debut of Argentina (Milito, Messi and everyone else) and USA vs. England (for many reasons, not only sport ones), of course. Oh, and the EXCITING Greece vs. South Korea at 1.30pm CET (7.30am EDT)

I was sure that was an onside play. It still doesn't make any sense to me, but I ain't a ref.

Shocked by the France game though. I didn't expect Uruguay to make much of a fight of it. France must have had sore hands.  :oh_i_see:

The South Africa-Mexico match was fun, though. Tshabalala looked pretty damn good, and I wouldn't be surprised if some European team gave him a look when this was over. He seemed a pretty decent Michael Essien type with a killer shot.

You need 2 defending players ahead of you to be on-side (usually a goalie and a defender). Goalie went out, so there was only one player left, hence off-side. I think I just paraphrased eldaec :grin:

30 minutes 'til Day 2 starts.

My predictions: Kor-Gre 1-2 (but quite uncertain on paper), Arg-Nig 3-1, Eng-Usa 2-0

May the Vuvulezas be with you.

Greece are playing some really sloppy football so far. If they'd played the way they did in the last 5 minute's for the past 20, they''d have gotten the lead, though.
Hoping to see a fistfight between the Greek keeper and his defender in the second half...

Looking forward to trying to stay awake for the England-US game later though.  :grin:


Greece doing the same thing I keep seeing lower-tier teams do (including Australia, I have to say) - fucking around passing the ball back and forth in your own half looking for the perfect play when a player from the other team has a go at them, gets the ball and puts it in the net.

Greece is a total trainwreck, horrible slow play and lack of attention, they're basically sleepwalking on the field. Deserved 2-0 lead for South Korea.

Greece have been playing much better in the second half, but too little, too late, and well outclassed by the Koreans. Argentina and Nigeria will show them the meaning of pain!

yep, "too little, too late" indeed. The difference of pace was embarassing sometimes, even in the second half (with that last save by Greece goalkeeper).

It was really important by either Greece and South Korea to start with a win given the other two teams of the group, so this might result as a fundamental win for the asians. It will be interesting to see them against Argentina.

hrm... Argentina v Nigeria in a few mins. I want to see this game, and also US-Eng. It's also 11:54pm, and I'll have to be up until aboput 5am..  :uhrr: :grin: :uhrr:

Argentina-Nigeria starting in a few minutes. Argentina is definitely one of the favorites in this edition. Nice initial line-up with Messi-Tevez-Higuain starting. But leaving Milito on the bench...Ugh.

If he comes up later in the match today or in the following ones, keep an eye out for argentinian player Pastore: I saw him playing all year here in Italy (he plays for Palermo) and he's very promising (he's an attacking midfielder)

Beautiful goal. Even Nigeria look so much more skilled than Korea. I'm going to enjoy watching Argentina vs Greece.  :drill:

Nice first half, especially the first part; great saves by Nigeria keeper!

Anyways, Argentina wingbacks, Jonas and Heinze, are clearly the weak spot, together with Demichelis, who is just an average full back, IMO (compared to World-class Samuel). Other, more talented attacks could really create problems.

...More great saves by the keeper, and chances wasted by Higuain and Messi. They could be punished with a draw, but Nigeria strikers weren't precise enough. Still some doubts about Argentina defense, but we'll see them against more "serious" attacks :).

And now waiting for England-USA...

Heh. That was fast.

Wow.  If England loses this game, their keeper is never going to be able to go outside again.  As the US announcer said, that's about the softest goal you'll ever see at a World Cup match.

AHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Well, LOL  :uhrr: :drill:

Shilton, Seaman, James, and now Green. I understand everyone wants to play the ball, but I can't remember any other country in the world hating the goalkeeper position as much as England.

Decent match by the US.  They are clearly overmatched in the talent department.  Good of them to hold it together.

It'll be interesting to see if England can recover from this, or if its the start of the inevitable death spiral. 

Ok, never judge a favorite team by their first World Cup match, but England really needs to find more fluidity in their game, they were quite clumsy. We've seen better stuff from Mexico and South Korea, just sayin'.

Tim Howard on his way to become a National Hero, but nice display by the U.S. ; their group is not impossible at all, they can score a good result both with Algeria and Slovenia.

Yeah, well, the eyes were fixed on the ball, at least...Butterhands! :P

(http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/93/fullj.7e102d9e194fc8591785851ffca27435/7e102d9e194fc8591785851ffca27435-getty-98627984bd108_england_v_usa.jpg)
(http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/0612/soc_g_green3x_576.jpg)

Here in Italy, we call an error like the one Green did a "papera", duckling (Green committed a duckling), probably referred to the clumsy way a duck walks, and hence a clumsy intervention/error.

Ahem, ok, lesson is over :P

Just seemed to me that the U.S. was much more meshed as a team. They just are not nearly as deep talent-wise.

Definitely happy with a draw as a result for going up against the heavy favorite in group play.

Fucking England, never a dull moment. Must be one of the worst international teams to support as we always find new and innovative ways to snatch calamity from the jaws of victory.

Fortunately we've been put in a group with us, the Yanks (who still haven't quite worked out they're not allowed to catch the ball), some Arab stoners and some country that is approximately 1/5th of the country it used to be in the old Eastern Europe (and it was small then). Please please don't let us fuck this up at qualification, my gran and her knitting circle could qualify from this group.

Afterthought: yes, yes, after Green's goalkeeping I shouldn't poke jibes at Yank outfield players. At least when they handle the ball it actually stops.

Fuck this bullshit.

Clearly overmatched?  Better, yes. Clearly so? No, fuck no.

Tomorrow, Day 3:

Algeria - Slovenia 1.30pm CET (7.30am EDT)

Serbia - Ghana 4pm CET (10am EDT)

Germany - Australia 8.30pm CET (2.30pm EDT)
---

Well, obviously very important for Algeria and Slovenia to get three points (draw may be useless for both, given their next matches), so one of them can immediately get ahead of the two other favourites of their group.

Serbia-Ghana should be interesting. Traditionally, Serbia is quite solid, traditional european play (that someone could define "boring", hopefully not as in "Greece-boring" like today :P) Ghana has rock solid players as well, mixed with agility.

And of course, the debut of Germany: "yeah, they don't seem to play that well...OMG boring, this and that"...And you always find them in the very final stages of the competion :P. Don't know how/if Australia progressed in the last four years.

Well that's one spill the US won't be angry about

The US played better as a team today, but England is much better at almost every position.  But that's why they play the games, isn't it?  It's a team sport and today team won.  I expect to see England get better as it goes on.

But you won the world cup in 1966!  :why_so_serious:

(Seriously, it might help you do better if your commentators and media actually shut up about that for 5 minutes)

and I disagree at the concept of almost every position and being much better. some places much better, sure, but the difference overall is smaller than you're seeing.

A draw for the US means is about the best result I could have expected. Now we need two good wins to gain some momentum.

Even that was a calamity. My Dad went and didn't take me!

My favorite comment from today was during the Argentinia-Nigeria match....

"They don't need a beautiful goal, a scruffy one will do."

I've always wondered if those giant Mickey Mouse hands they use actually make easy pickups harder.

It would depend on the design and the material used, I suppose. When I was a goalie in my school I always preferred to use my bare hands. Always felt I got a better grip. That said I didn't play very often and its one guys opinion, but whatever.

Went and watched the rest of Nigeria-Argentina from bed. Great keeping from the Nigerian. Lots of talent in both teams. Set the alarm for ENG-USA, then when it went off, fell asleep after turning it off. Made myself wake up almost an hour later and they were only 25mins in. Fell asleep again with about 5mins + injury time left. Not impressed with the game. Goalie fuckup notwithstanding, the USA played as a team and ENG played as 11 players. This cancelled out the skill difference, and the US deserved to draw against them.

I'm just going to give up on supporting England in their games from now on, despite the English roots I have. This shit seems to happen every time.

No way.  Those things are like those wide receiver gloves with that foamy shit that's almost too sticky to be legal.  There's just more foam.  Speaking as someone who played keeper in his younger days, trying to play without them would be a severe handicap.  Also, it would hurt.

Goalie gloves are specifically made so your fingers won't snap off when stopping the ball. I can't imagine playing at that level without them.

Oz is very defensive this year and unfortunately not that interesting to watch.

But w/e.

GOOOOOOOOOOO SOCCERROOS!!!!!!!!!

Yes. Back to the ultra-boring days of old. Watch them try to grind out a draw vs Germany tonight. Or not.  :uhrr:

(http://images.4chan.org/sp/src/1276416733757.jpg)

What's 4chan got to do with anything?

Morning :)

One hour 'til Day 3 Kick-off.

My predictions:

Algeria - Slovenia = no idea, but I think 0-2
Serbia - Ghana = 0-0
Germany - Australia = 2-0

This needs to become an internet meme:

(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/318368/beckhamface.jpg)


The US should have been three nil up in the first half.

The second half was better, but only because the full backs decided to ignore the wingers completely and attempt to play both positions themselves, and because Rooney seemed to realise he was going to have to go get the ball himself everytime it fell to a midfielder not wearing number 4.

England need to drop the 4-1-1.5 formation that sees us play with only 7 footballers, Emile Heskey, plus a dancing idiot on each wing and a tub of lard in the number eight shirt.

I don't remember seeing a single tackle from a midfielder whose name doesn't rhyme with Gteven Sterrard.

All that said England are getting better at running up cricket scores against rubbish teams, so there is a fair chance we'll still win the group.

Weellll, now that was quite a horrible match between Algeria and Slovenia (0-1).

Every match is another story, ok, but England and USA shouldn't really be worried about either of them (ok, file this under "last famous words" :P). Another hilarious blunder by the algerian goalikeeper, but yes, the infamous Adidas Jabulani ball really looks a bit unpredictable, it dropped quite suddenly (beside the awful placement of the goalie).

The US has a history of playing to their competition.  I'm not ready to wager the keys to the car on them yet.

Collective prayer :P

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/2010-world-cup/news/1008055/Jordaan-ponders-vuvuzela-ban

...But, on the other hand  :awesome_for_real: :drill:

http://www.spitorswallow.co.za/blowme.php

Kuzmanovic a HUGE douchebag.

Total self-destruction by Serbia in the last 20 minutes, holy shit. How do you give up a red card AND a penalty kick that late in the game???

This game got incredibly entertaining  :drill:

Awesome celebration in the stands. Ghana fans are always among the most funny and colourful :). Deserved win in the end. Serbia looks like a team which got assembled, like...a couple days ago. No cohesive game.

Now that was some shot by Podolski! Great start for this match...(well, at least from a neutral point of view :P)

The U.S. probably didn't deserve the draw since they couldn't seem to put the ball in the back of the net except when Robert Green has a seizure. They played well as a team and yes, Clint Dempsey is still THE LUCKIEST MOTHERFUCKER ON THE GODDAMN PLANET. Notice how he mostly disappeared in the second half. The U.S. started really tentative and got punished for it. Onyewu still doesn't know how to transition the ball from defense to attack quickly enough, but neither does anyone else in the backline so it's ok. Tim Howard was the motherfucking man. Jozy exposed Jamie Carragher in the second half - Carragher is really getting old and was already slow. I think Bradley should have started Feilhaber in the middle instead of Clark and used Bradley as the holding midfielder, then put Edson Buddle up front to start and bring Findley on later in the game. Findley looked kind of lost out there at times.

England though... woof. Milner gets 20 minutes and probably shouldn't have, not that Wright-Phillips did much better. Heskey SHOULD NOT have started. Crouch would have been better in that role, or hell, use Gerrard like Rafa did as kind of a hybrid attacking midfielder/second striker. Lampard was pretty worthless most of the game. England could certainly have benefited from moving Gerrard up, Lampard behind him and then some kind of holding midfielder in front of the gigantic tree stumps that is the England centre back corps. Cole was useless most of the game. Lennon did all right, Rooney would have done much better if anybody could have gotten him the ball in the first 60 minutes of the game. England's a fucking mess and yet should still make it through the group on individual talent alone. Fuck it, sit Robert Green down, don't worry about David James' injury, start Joe Hart in goal. He CANNOT do any worse than Green did.

Algeria/Slovenia was a goddamn horror show of a game. Those vuvuzelas create such a drone that it's almost a hypnotic sleeping pill, and then the game completely knocks you out. If England or the US have ANY trouble with either of these teams, they deserve to go the fuck home. Algeria at least looked like it had some semblance of creativity - they got beat by a shit goalkeeper and a stupid red card. Slovenia had one note the whole game - go route 1 and hope. What little they attempted to make use of the wings they fucked in the ear with the worst crossing I think I've ever seen. This team should never score against either the US or England but  :why_so_serious:

Heh, Deutschland Uber Alles :drill:

So I'm watching the World Cup for pretty much the first time ever...

What the hell is that buzzing swarming bee sound the crowd seems intent on making every single second of every single match?

That's those fucking vuvuzelas Lucas posted about above.

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y222/Abagadro/Vuvuzela_172950.jpg)

Ah.  Ok.  Yeesh.

Why, exactly?  Because I'm sitting here watching Ger v Aus, and I'm trying my best to get into it.  I really am.  Problem is, all I see is a bunch of guys running around - no doubt because I don't get the nuances of the sport you guys do.  So it's a bit boring, and that "vuvuzelas create such a drone that it's almost a hypnotic sleeping pill" thing is kicking in hard.

Ok, I'm a bit worried about Squirrel and Azazel, now  :ye_gods: :uhrr:

Yes, 'til we see them against more difficult teams, total ownage by Germany today. They are young, enthusiastic, well placed around the field, quite a change from the fecent past.

It will be a very interesting match against Ghana (last match of the group), especially because it will probably mean the leadership of the group.

Aussies, well, nothing much to say...

Oz got severely outplayed. But at least it was a somewhat entertaining game for the first half anyway.

Germany looks very strong, not just beating Oz but their timing and ball movement was killer.

The vuvuzela thing seems to have started in South Africa about 20 years ago, and there are apparently different and vague stories about the origins. Now, I am all for cultural differences but I can't wrap my head around it: WHY did it start in the first place? It's not just annoying to hear it, I suppose it's annoying to blow into it the whole fucking time too. Don't they like to just watch the game and loudly cuss when needed? Guess not.

Football-wise, I really like that young Özil guy.

Football fans have long used noise as part of the experience of supporting. People shout encouragement or abuse, people sing songs, often popular songs with simple refrains with the words changed, people toot horns and wave rattles.

Here's a football rattle, of the type popular in England from 1900-1960:

(http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/football-rattle1.jpg)

Frankly it's not about people watching on TV at home, if you're in a heaving surging shouting swearing crowd and if you believe that the louder you are the more your team wins then you make noise. Tools to make noise save you from shouting yourself hoarse.

Back to the world cup I really enjoyed the Ghana v Serbia game and the Germany v Aussies game. Heart goes out to Tim Cahill though, how Vidic didn't even get booked for his various lunges and scythes while Cahill got straight red for kneeing someone in the calf I don't know. On the other hand I appreciated the ref booking two divers.

Bit of a relief for an Englishman to see the terrible quality of our groupmates in the first match. Please please don't let us lose to opposition who are both worse than Crystal Palace reserves.

Bingo! Those dudes are making a fuss for a fuss' sake as I am pretty sure South Africa isn't playing every game every day. Anyway, how come the English stopped rattling their rattles after the sixties?

Hey Snake, some things to look for. Don't look so much where the ball is or rather don't focus on it.

look at the whole screen and look for people that are open or are moving to areas that if the ball was passed there would put the team with the ball with a free run to goal or at least past a level of the defense.  At this level, you can look for the people waving with the I'm open wave, they're usually right... well usually. Look for defenders that are getting drawn out of position so that they're creating gaps and then see if those gaps are being exploited.

after a bit you'll start to envision plays before they happen and that's usually when it clicks.


Besides, if something dramatic happens on the ball it will be replayed countless times. You won't always see the replay of the great diagonal run that set up the midfielders reception of the left backs chipped cross leading to a unmolested run at goal.

To add o the previous post. Approach the game more like hockey, with ebbs and flows, lots of build up, and then one quick thrust that is often parried away.

Well deserved victory to Germany this morning. But I have to say that despite all the goals against, Australia still played far better than quite a few of the other teams I've seen so far, and Australia still has a good chance to progress to the second round against Ghana and Serbia (WTF was up with Serbia?) I've got no illusions about winning or getting past the 16, but getting there is a victory in itself IMO. There's no shame in losing to the Germans, though. Especially this German side.

That was a bullshit red to Cahill though, as you said. Really though, I predict that the red will be not even a blip on the radar of controversial/bad referee decisions by the time this cup is through (or before the cup, if you're Irish). Every time there's the discussion about a video ref, and FIFA just seems to keep resisting. Same deal when you have the same refs making dodgy/controversial decisions - FIFA just seems to take the "suck it up, bitches" attitude. It's like they're afraid of doing anything the slightest bit controversial (like banning that fucking trumpet).

 

The problem with World Cup refereeing is that FIFA uses the World Cup Finals to launch new disciplinary initiatives without explaining them. There's no publicity saying don't do slide tackles. Instead dressing room buzz is frantically whispering "oh my god did you see that decision?" The interpretation of the rules has changed but the only way players find out about it is to be the unlucky one who gets punished.

My impression is that the referees are expert, that they know the rules and see the action clearly but that they are operating on guidelines that no one else is aware of.

This happens every four years, like clockwork World Cups start with a rash of cards and free kicks given against utterly bemused players because of some new initiative changing the way the law is applied.

Bill Shankly.

In the end, a good match by Holland (2-0 against Denmark). While they wait for Robben, Snejder is already taking the lead, and 23 yrs old Elia (he plays in german league with Hamburg), who came up from the bench, is very interesting.

Denmark was good in the first half: they are a well balanced team, but they totally lack quality and creativity upfront. Whille they battle when the score is 0-0, that may be alright, but when you have to show some sparkle of creativity to change gear, then they show they simply lack in that department.

I've seen him the last two years with the German team I follow, Werder Bremen. He is the REAL FUCKING DEAL. He's the reason Bremen let Diego go to Italy. He's a playmaker with serious skills, and he's only 21. I hope to God Bremen holds onto him, because I'm quite sure Bayern Munich or some other Euro squad will be itching to get their hands on him after this World Cup. I think he's every bit the player Cesc Fabregas is for Arsenal.

The Aussies didn't provide much challenge for the Germans, and I don't think it was because the Aussies suck. I think Germany is just that good. Spain, Brazil and Germany are the three teams I expect to see among the final 4.

Why do referees, when making any sort of gesture (like Back Off, Shitbag), keep their hands below their waists?  It's as if they've got their arms tied to their sides.  Always thought that was a bit queer.

Diving in an attempt to draw a penalty in the closing minutes while you're up 4-0 is pretty classless.  Fuck Germany.

Pronto per l'esordio degli azzurri...Forza Ragazzi!  :heart: :drill:

I assume this means "Fuck you, Italy" in which case I wholeheartedly agree.

Yeh I nearly choked when I saw that clip right after the match. The title could be fifa.completetwat

I thought this was amusing:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/41488/New-York-Post-Soccer.jpg)

Back off shitbag isn't an official signal and most refs are taught to keep their hands down unless they are making an official signal. You'll also see linesmen signal to the ref with hand signals below the waist. That way they get to tell the ref something without signalling an official decision to the teams, managers, commentators, etc.

http://itunes.apple.com/app/vuvuzela-2010/id326630627?mt=8

Samurai Japan pull off the biggest upset of the Cup so far- first World Cup victory not on Japanese soil for them.   Although that first half in particular was some ugly football. 

The Netherlands will flatten them, but I think Japan has a real chance to beat Denmark.  I'm not sure a draw and four total points will get them to the round of 16. 

I still am unclear on how Grp A will turn out. I'm 66% convinced S. Africa & Uruguay will make it, but the permutation is hard to visualize.

For tonight: Slovaks to snatch their easiest 3 points and rack up goals to up the goal difference vs New Zealand.
Brazil v N. Korea is going to be  :why_so_serious: I really can't tell.

Go New Zealand!

As unlikely as it is, I'd love to see them pull an upset. They're doing well though so far, with 0-0 almost 30mins in.

Seeing as how very little of this WC is turning out as expected thus far, I fully expect NZ to either draw or win against the Slovaks.  North Korea will either lose spectactularly, or they will declare war on Ronaldinho before the match and fire on the Brazilian team bus.

I watched my first game of the WC yesterday (Italy vs. Paraguay)
Completely missed Germany vs. Australia because I just assumed that Germany would play as they always do. Seriously what happened to our team?

Besides the Ita. vs. Parag. game being a snoozefest the biggest gripe for me is the constant buzzing noise those vuvuzuelas make. You don't hear anything. No fan songs, nothing shouted by either players or trainers. It even completely drowned out the british fans.

It's gotten so annoying that German stations installed filters that filter out the noise made by those hellish things.

What an awesome ending to the NZ-Slovak game.  :awesome_for_real:

I'd love to watch the next two games. but it's almost midnight, and fucking work expects me to turn up in the mornings...

Way to go, Slovakia.   :oh_i_see:

Cote d'Ivoire are really going at it now. Be a shame if Portugal pulled it out somehow.

I'm getting sick of the ties already, and we're not past the 5th day. 0-0 games at the highest level are why the United States will never accept this as a sport.

Almost half the matches as draws? Two entire groups tied? Fucking yawn.  :oh_i_see:

Brazil better stomp N. Korea, or I'm going to get really pissy.

Everyone fucking playing not to lose.  I almost wish they'd change the point system to address this, but I'm not sure how they'd manage it.

Not a huge soccer fan (live in the US) but I enjoy watching the World Cup.. when it's not USA playing I just root for the offense.. so yeah, the 0-0 games are horrendously boring for me. I enjoyed the first game today, did not see that last goal coming. From what the TV is telling me Brazil is way better than their opponent, so maybe that game will be more exciting.

I've watched some great matches that ended in draws. Some of them were even 0-0 draws. The score doesn't say anything about how interesting the game was to watch.

The score doesn't mean everything, but it's an indicator.  Several of these games have been pure bullshit.


I'm sure someone will claim something about the wonderful beauty of the game or somesuch about the pluckiness of those adorable North Koreans, but if Brazil doesn't win by at least 3 goals, then it will be another bullshit game.  They are several orders of magnitude better than NK.  It would be like a team of NFL All Pros taking on the Somalian side in American football.

Portugal and Cote d'Ivoire were not playing for the draw in the second half (first half was a yawner, I agree). The score really does not tell you how interesting or not the game was. The game is boring largely when you have two very tight defenses playing each other--if someone could figure out a way to discourage that kind of play, that would be a welcome rule change. Maybe something like a reverse-offsides or something like a time limit on how many defensive players can remain below the line at the top of the goal box, I dunno. But you can have a draw that's a thrilling game when it's either an attacking team versus a defensive team, or two attacking teams pounding at each other.

You say that now, but all these draws are going to make the last days of each group REALLY tense. It is very strange to see so many games with only 1 or 2 goals though. The last World Cup group stages already had most of the games having 3 or 4 goals in them in the opening days, even a 4-0 whooping by Spain on Ukraine. Better defending this time? I blame Jose Mourinho and the trendiness of 4-2-3-1 or other single-striker variants.

A lot of badly overhit crosses and soaring free-kicks. Maybe the highly paid whiners are right, the new ball is bouncy and weird?

Come on N.Korea . . . make daddy happy.  :grin:

Did I mention I am also a Browns (NFL) fan?

Wow, really? When I was playing keeper, I wouldn't have been caught dead in my bare hands. Different people are different, who knew!

There are some gloves that aren't the hilariously giant type, although I did indeed use the big-ass paddle ones most of the time (they were what my coaches always seemed to buy, and I wasn't SO into being a keeper I'd bother to buy my own). Basically in the spring (or sometimes summer we'd have a tournament) I'd be sweaty, so I wouldn't want to use my bare hands, and in the fall it would get cold enough where my hands would be numb and not as good.

I wanted to give the English keeper a hug after he fucked up. Every goalkeeper ever has done something completely fucktarded like that. They just tend to um. Not do it in the WORLD FREAKING CUP.

(Yeah I posted this WAY LATE, I was in NJ and wasn't bothering to post much! Nyah!)



EDIT: My pet rule change for pepping up soccer some without totally fucking up the goddamn point of soccer would be more substitutions allowed.

No, sometimes the score won't give you a good indicator. Sometimes the keepers are playing spot on, denying all comers, and possession swings are 5 minutes at a time with tons of agressive action. At the end of all that, sometimes you get a tie.

That being said, none of the 0-0 games did that. I could maybe put the US-England game in that category, but I'm biased. Howard did make that worth the price of admission though.

I think this stage is in many ways the most charming stage of the World Cup. The fans of the various nations are always fantastic.

The North Korean fans (and there aren't many of them allowed out) are currently being conducted by a wonderful classical music conductor in a kind of orchestra of claps and chants on the terrace.

Also in the crowd is a Brazilian gentlemen who owns 1) a magnificent bandido moustache and 2) a replica of the World Cup trophy which he apparently spends every moment of the match hugging and kissing. If his wife ever divorces him for unfaithfulness she will have about 500 million witnesses.

Replying late to the question about why rattles were discontinued (it's been rattling around in my head for a couple of days, processing) I think it was the emergence of a more sophisticated singing culture. Many popular fan songs sung by crowds here are based on 50s and 60s culture - Doris Day (que sera sera), a John Wayne film (she wore a yellow ribbon), Gerry and the Pacemakers (you'll never walk alone). On top of the basic refrains opposing fans will often cleverly twist the already revised lyrics to riposte in a form of verbal sparring. It's a folk culture of great depth, complexity and subtlety.

Compared to that a machine for making a noise like a table falling down the stairs is a bit crap.

There is a rumor that NK had to hire a bunch of Chinese to act as their fans, simply because they aren't allowed out of their country.  If true, it's both depressing and awesome.


Edit:  Also, 34 minutes in, and zero goals from Brazil?  NK playing up to their level?  Is this the fucking Bizarro World Cup?

 :oh_i_see:

This has been the most interesting game of the tournament so far. A secretive red wall underdog waiting for its moments against the stylish and aggressive Brazilians. An unconventional pairing.

My favorite was the bit about the North Korean coach getting game time advice from Kim Jong Il through an invisible transmitter.

...and the NK goalkeeper is now scheduled for public execution.

Nonsense, all the North Korean team will be absolute heroes at home. They are the lowest ranked team in the tournament and took on the favourites with enormous heart, technical ability and discipline.

Certainly was the best match of the tournament so far, in fact it was possibly the match of the tournament when it was still 0-0.

The last match of the day did not disappoint. It ended up saving the day from the other two complete snoozefests.

Why change the point system?  Just have them play until someone fucking wins.

Edit:  and none of the damned shootout stuff, either.  These first round matches are like the western front.

Then it would be like playoff hockey, and thus far too cool to exist.

Alright folks. If tonight isn't going to have more than 2 goals per match I'm not going to bother watching the grp matches anymore.

Chile v Honduras : Same MO as Slovak vs NZ, can Chile grab the easiest 3 points in the grp? After NZ debacle, I'm not so sure. Office colleagues groaned cause they blew their Slovakia bet on the FINAL MINUTE.  :grin:

Spain v Switzerland : There shd be goals here. ENTERTAINMENT FFS. Backing Spain all the way.

My father writes a lot of Wikipedia articles and pays attention to how much attention they get, then tries to figure out what causes the highs and lows. This weekend every single article he's written (and, with a little investigation, every article on Wikipedia) was getting a strangely low number of hits. He couldn't figure out why. I informed him.

Spain-Switzerland should be 5-nil. 

Will Uruguay actually try to mount anything resembling offence against South Africa, or should I just play a tape of those fucking horns for 90 minutes while I do spreadsheets?

The world wants to know!

I thought Argentina was the favorite? I mean, Brazil is always a favorite but the little coverage I managed to watch would not fucking shut up about Argentina. Maybe they just want Maradona to do something completely insane and were talking up Argentina so Americans would realise they should care if he does.

Not to take away from North Korea hanging in with Brazil, of course, that's pretty awesome for them.

Argentina has the best player in the world, but the overall team is a little dicey and they are being led by a madman who smuggled cocaine in by dusting his beard with it.

He was pretty hilarious to watch during their match though!  :why_so_serious:

Maybe it differs according to which bookie you talk to. Maybe also it depends on how popular the subject of the bet is. In England not many people bet on Argentina simply because people rather dislike them. (They knocked us out of the 1986 World Cup with a handball goal and they invaded the Falkland Islands in 1982). It's probably bad news for bookies to give a favourite that people don't want to bet on because some people only like to back the favourite.

FWIW:

http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/ranking/lastranking/gender=m/fullranking.html

I think my "talk up Argentina so when their coach does something hilariously insane our American audience will have the faintest reason to care" theory is looking better and better!

Messi is the designated star of the tourney (not without reason) so the team will get a lot of pub, especially with Maradona being the usual attention whore, but their back line and especially midfield are highly questionable. Hell, they started Veron who didn't seem to be able to keep the jersey's straight as to who was actually on his team.

I also wanted to mention that the New Republic of all places has had some interesting commentary on its World Cup Blog (http://www.tnr.com/blogs/world-cup)

They should give yellows for diving based on video review after the match.  They should do the same in the NHL and NBA (one warning, then suspended for the rest of the series).  Obviously doesn't help in the last game, but at least \discourages the practice.  It's a hard call to make at full-speed in any of those sports.

While I'm wearing my "ugly American who watches soccer for a month every four years and now wants to tell you how your game should change to make me happier" hat: in a tie game, I'd like to see the team that actually pressed the attack rewarded with 2 or even the full 3 points.  That would require a stat (shots, corners, offensive zone possession time?) that captures "trying to score" in a non-gameable way, which is probably impossible.  The game is entertaining to watch when both teams are actually trying.  But it's way too possible for an outmanned team to turtle a 0-0 tie, and seemingly easy for a decent team to sit on a 1-0 lead against an evenly-matched squad.  I'm not asking for more goals - good defense is just as exciting as good offense.  I'm asking for both teams to actually try to score.

Note that the first professional soccer match I ever watched in my life was the 1990 finals, and it may have scarred me for life.  It was like watching the 2002 New Jersey Devils play against themselves, only 12 years earlier.  I may never recover.

The suggestion above might not be implemented, however, I am up for the sudden death settlement on draws. This might encourage diving or unsporting behavior whatever. But if both teams can't score in 90 mins, have them go for golden goal / silver goal in extra time.

It'll fuck up the match scheduling for those who bought tickets for multiple matches, but it'd sure add the extra motivation to settle it within 90 mins or risk another 15 minutes of hell and more drama + entertainment for watchers.

A win is 1 Point. A loss is 0.

There is no reward for stalemate but prolonged battle. SUFFER!

The overall dullness of the first matches will be compensated by the frantic scrabbling of the third matches. I don't think they need to fix draws, playing for a draw is sub-optimal and is really a case of fear of failure overriding logic. Draws simply defer
gratification. Expect drama.

Regarding UK betting odds Spain are now the favourites with Brazil second favourites. I'm sure local factors influence this, not many people here are inclined to support Germany, Argentina or Italy for historical political reasons and historical football reasons and we'd prefer to back a team that may be less likely to win but whose country we rather admire. It helps if the country never knocked us out of the World Cup on penalties.

North Korea are 5000-1.

http://www.williamhill.com/nui/world-cup-free-bet/#http://serve.williamhill.com/promoRedirect?member=wc2010gwhs23&campaign=DEFAULT&channel=wc23ad23&zone=593233285&lp=1468456104&var5=world%20cup&var6=5665137258

Yeah you guys are just getting it wrong. The statistic for first match is a loss means you have a 5% chance to advance, yes a win means you have an 85% chance to advance (keep that in mind for USA's group) but teams are playing to not lose for the most part in the first match. The second round and especially the relevant games of the third round will become much more open affairs.

Also this tournament is really suffering due to the altitude changes and in general some very shoddy pitches. I doubt the horns are helping either. As players adjust to all that games will get better.

Second Round Must See Games:

South Africa must go for a win against Uruguay which plays heavily into their strengths, if they can't get 3 points here they have to get them against France. Neither team can expect to advance with a loss so after the first goal the game will really open up.

Mexico v France is a similar deal thanks to everyone being tied.  Both of these teams have personality defects so anything could happen. This is less guaranteed to be dynamite but if it goes that route with an early goal there is plenty of talent on the pitch.

Slovenia v USA we have to win, we're also the favorites, massive pressure versus a well composed Eastern European defense, this looks bad.

Ghana v Australia the Aussies will have to go for the win while Ghana should play smart and look to capitalize on mistakes. Should be a good game.

Cameroon v Denmark loser goes home in this game as well, which means maybe someone will bother to do something with one of the beautiful one touch passes Eto'o keeps watching his teammates waste.

Slovakia v Paraguay this might be a boring game if not for the fact that one team is Paraguay they really only know how to play attack minded football.

Portugal v North Korea biggest choke artists versus biggest underdog in a must win game for Portugal and not even just must win but they need to run up the score? If you hate or love Christiano Ronaldo you should watch this.

Brasil v Ivory Coast you should always watch all their games.

Really I left off other games that are worth watching (England & Argentina's games, Nigeria v Greece in a must win between 2 teams that shouldn't suck as much as they looked like they did in round 1) the ties especially 0-0 ones are part of the first round. No matter what the Spain game will be must-see tv and I'd expect the Swiss v Chile will make this list as well.

I'm surprised you didn't include England or Argentina. Both countries are very capable of failing against minnows. While England beating Algeria is rather dull and predictable Algeria beating England would be a match to remember.

I think that's the aspect of football that Americans find unappealing. Football is much dullness interspersed with moments of high drama. It's the Eve Online of sports. Americans seem to prefer sports that give a steady stream of marginally significant point accumulation.

And that's why Algeria could beat England. Algeria will have about 3 attacks, England 15-20. If every attack was worth a point it would be dull. If every attack has a 10% chance of a goal then Algeria could, if it gets very lucky, win.

Point taken. I'd say boxing is probably the best of both worlds.
You get points for doing great moves and able to stage comebacks if you're behind points by a really good counter knockout. All those moves mattered.

I was surprised to find myself rooting(sp?) for the team from North Korea. I was surprised to see at least on player literally crying out loud while the national anthem was played.

Well, on one hand their country is run by insane people, but on the other hand there's no good reason why they wouldn't love their country like most of the rest of us do.

You need to watch more documentaries. They took the propaganda to EXTREME levels there.

The North Korean star player is a huge Jay-Z fan, loves his Hummer and unsurprisingly, doesn't spend much time in North Korea.

Spain might be on the ropes here, down 0-1 to the Swiss, who only have two shots in the entire game.

 :awesome_for_real:

 :ye_gods:

The goal was ugly as shit, too.  :awesome_for_real:


EDIT: Also Switzerland has a shit-ton of yellow cards now, I think? Those still carry over in the first round, or am I living in the PAST?

Didn't the US team beat Spain last year or something?  They can't be good.

Wow, that was a tense 15 minutes.

I know... I watched "Welcome to North Korea"... scary stuff.

This World Cup is getting more surreal by the day. What now? South Africa winning by 4 goals?

The other problem is it requires you to always be paying attention, much like hockey but even more extreme. American football and baseball and even basketball have natural pauses for you to catch your breath or converse with someone or grab a sandwich from the kitchen - watching a game of soccer if you go to the kitchen to get that sandwich you might miss the only goal in the entire game. We're used to our 'have to pay attention now' in somewhat smaller bites.

Final whistle. Well done Switzerland. Fantastic gritty job. Spain punished for a reluctance to pick players who ply their trade abroad - Torres needed more than 25 minutes and why the hell didn't they use Fabregas who devastates defences weekly for Arsenal?

I think the dull, play for draws phase is well and truly over. Both games today have been really good and the final game of the day is the first of the second group matches which many teams will be aiming to win to ensure qualification. Certainly anyone who drew or lost their first match has to go for a win, aiming to draw and then need a win in your fiinal group game is too high risk.

That was such an odd bungling goal, if you watch the replay and count how many random body parts it came off of, wtf.

No reason Spain can't advance with 6 from this group. They are fortunate that they have Honduras next which should help them regain some confidence and then a must win game against Chile which if Spain are as good as they have seemed the past four years should be a heavy favorite to win again but I expect Chile could be good for a goal as well, should be a fun one. The Swiss just booked themselves a ticket to the next phase though and possibly in first place, I can easily see them getting 7 or 9 points while I'm really high on their keeper and defensive organization after this game we just watched.

Looking way ahead if Spain was to advance in second place that means we get Spain (2H) v Brazil (1G) in the round of 16, entirely possible considering the Swiss will be in very high spirits going into their next game versus Chile and Honduras sucks.

Absolutely. The first game I went to, at Crystal Palace when I was about 7, had 4 goals all of which I managed to miss. Casting my eyes around the ground, looking at fans, passing birds, seeing what the goalie at the far end was doing I wasn't looking once when a goal was scored.

I did learn to watch football, I think with a game like Swiss v Spain the secret is to get so focused you're really not interested in anything else. Need a piss? Hold it. Want a sandwich? Wait.

I really hope so. 

I guess this makes Switzerland the favorites now? :grin:

South Africa had better put the pedal down if they want even to draw. Though that was a tough goal to block because of the deflection.

oh god the poor south africa back up goalie

I'm sitting here really worried about what this could do to the tournament overall. The fans are leaving in droves already.

If only FIFA would have rigged it and put Italy in South Africa's place.

Spain is one of the favorites to win the whole thing.  Even with this loss I think they will still be favorites.

The team we played was basically their practice squad.

They're leaving in droves only because there are roughly a gazillion South Africans at this game, it shouldn't affect the other nations THAT much I would think? I can't blame them for ditching though, watching your goalie draw a red card and making the back up have to face a penalty kick as his first act on the field is just ... painful.

Maybe dwindling fan numbers will make FIFA rethink their stance that money doesn't matter to their future choice of venue. 

What dwindling fan numbers? Every World Cup more people watch the final. Every match has almost certainly sold out, with fans flocking in from all over the world. TV rights are far more commercially important than bums on seats and the number of people watching this on TV will be incredible.

Football is sky-rocketing. Entire continents watch local lads go to Europe to earn more money than the working population of their entire village for doing something fun with almost no barriers to entry. Politicians bend over backwards to be associated with footballers - the Prime Minister of Slovenia has promised to wash the team's kit if they make the last 16.

If you mean people leaving before the final whistle they don't get a refund or anything. Numbers of fans inside the stadium dwindling before the end of a match affects no one commercially. If South Africa go out locals will just go along to watch other teams and enjoy having the world come visit. Besides there are some pretty good African teams that local people will root for. Not the same as your own country but Africans have a much stronger continental identity than most people living elsewhere.

I was just replying to this. 

that's it. I'm not surprised by anything anymore.

Fucking hell. I'm predicting triple draws tonight. AND SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING GERMANY & HOLLAND to win this world cup.
If Robben comes back, I'm 100% behind the Oranges.

The new balls suck monkey anus. Way too many shots that sail horribly high. Why the fuck does FIFA insist on trying out new balls in the World Cup so that the skilled players can't use their normal skills?

What the fuck, Spain? Seriously? I blame that on Casillas. Why go at the guy with your feet when your hands have a better chance to redirect the ball even if you can't smother it? It was a good game other than that. Those Swiss strikers did some good graft when they actually saw the ball. Torres looked rusty.

Brazil/North Korea was damn fun. That NK Striker was pretty impressive against clearly better opposition. The first Brazil goal was a fluke, the second was pure Brazil.

Two of the red cards so far have been pretty weak.

The South Africa keeper baaaaaaaaaaaaaarely hit the tip of the guys toe. In the replays, it looks to me like he dragged his feet to force the contact because the ball had already gotten away from him. It's unfortunate the letter of the law required it.

The one that just happened here in Nigeria was more obvious. Dude obviously wasn't thinking straight, but come on... the way the Greek player crumpled on the ground? Give that guy at least a yellow to go with it. And here I was about to come on here and say Nigeria were looking to be one of the better playing African teams so far.

Yeah the Greek player was blatantly shamming. He didn't react instantly, you could see the penny drop that his opponent had just attempted to kick him and only then he decided to act injured. He hadn't even felt it. Doesn't matter though - attempting to attack someone off the ball is always straight red. You have a case for the Greek player getting booked too but certainly a red for Kaita.

The worst red card of the tournament for me has been Cahill's. It's a real shame we can't have consistent refereeing, Cahill's challenge wouldn't have even been a yellow in the Premier League and I don't think he intended any malice. What's more Cahill is a world class player in a very mediocre squad the worst possible person for Australia to lose.

I agree with this 100%  Red carding Cahill was essentially kicking Austrailia out of the World Cup. 

It's looking like Argentina may be the real deal. 

I was totally pissed at that red card, partly because the dude felt his foot get touched and suddenly was all OH GOD MY ENTIRE LOWER BODY JUST SHATTERED.

How they can allow stuff like this is beyond me and ruins my attempts to love this tournament.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McOZNikzr8U

Looks like the guy's Achillles gets stepped on at full stride. He doesn't have the ball so there isn't any point to diving there.

Or that sniper in the crowd finally did what he was paid to do.  :why_so_serious:

Interestingly, from the shit youtube resolution, he doesn't really change his running gait at all until he drops. Then again, its youtube.

Best way (http://www.vuvuzela-time.co.uk/forums.f13.net) to read this thread.

The little dude in the corner made me lose my shit and I don't even know why.  :heart:

Yeah, I gotta say that actually looked legit for once.

(http://d.yimg.com/a/p/net/20100616/capt.310bc8e0f00f179c70417e1aa27fc9f3.jpeg?x=400&y=218&q=85&sig=RexSgWL7Ub6YzYZqvQIn2g--)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100616/wl_africa_afp/safricamarketingbeernetherlandsfblwc2010_20100616180248

Also:

 :grin:

The thing about the women getting arrested...I mean, I get that it was probably illegal ambush marketing, but on what sane planet is that an arrestable offense?

Nobody fucks with Budweiser!

Lol France.

Your eyes are better than mine then, since it didn't even look like he was touched to me.

Well done Mexico! They look electrifying going forward, even though they're not highly rated I fear for England if we get drawn against them.

Oh, come on.  Rooney will eat their sweeper's head right off his shoulders.

De Rossi injured himself just prior to the Cup and aggravated it during his sprint down field. It does manage to look like a blatant flop though.

edit: Errrm... I think he's holding the wrong leg if that was it.

I could be seeing things I suppose but it seems he is clipped. He basically got what we used to do to each other as kids called a "flat tire" only at full speed with cleats.  Since he didn't have the ball I'm not sure what diving would accomplish.

I was thinking of the other end of the pitch where Carragher and Terry would be trying to contain three superfast strikers. One of them did Evra for pace, Evra the fastest defender in the Premier League.

Have to say I'm looking forward to tomorrow's England match immensely. I'm watching it with my Dad. My Mum, a former headmistress, has apparently confiscated our vuvu horn so I'll go over a little early to charm it out of her. We had a deal where we got to keep the vuvu as long as we only vu-ed when England score but she appears to have reneged.

Broadcaster fail:

Fucking Nigeria. That was the big shame of today. Not because they were looking good at all but because it denies us a winner goes through game between Korea and Nigeria and potentially we might have to see Greece for two more games which is just fucking awful.

LoL France. On some level normally I'd feel a bit bad for them, that first goal is called offsides in most games and the pk was just a stupid foul in the box. But they did job Ireland and they have played like absolute shit. So if they aren't even going to bring Bezema to the cup or let Cisse or Henry on the field they can just fuck right the fuck off.

I have to imagine that France might still sneak in, after all Mexico v Uruguay are playing for the right to not face a nasty looking Argentina and Mexico should know that it doesn't want any part of that match up so I expect them to play on the safe side but still take chances and look for the win and first place with a nice tune up game in the round of 16 against Korea (unless Greece pulls some really lame shit and forces me to watch them more, see above).

Argentina may be peaking too early? They look good and I like a South American team to win this cup because Europeans outside of Europe blah blah.

Germany looked awful good.  I'm anxious to see them play again tomorrow.

I would have agreed with them calling Mexico's first goal off.  It was close, but it looked offside.  The second goal they deserved, and so as far as I'm concerned it was a deserved win.  Also, Blanco achieves Pancho Villa Mexican Legend Status.

Pretty sure the abbreviation for Nigeria is NGA so I'm thinking that is a "clever" shop.

Yes.

Cheating French fucks should have stayed at home.

If the refs keep on giving cards for such common fouls like Klose's or that Aussie player's then we'll be seeing a lot of reds and yellow/red  combos going forward. Hint: if it wouldn't get carded in the Spanish, English or Italian premier leagues then just don't do it at the World Cup either.

Hope Germany pulls through even with only ten on the pitch.

Wow. Just Wow.

I'd just like to quote myself to start:


Serbia's goal was a good one, as was their save. Despite both of those, I think the Serb man of the match has to be Podolski, though. Well, and Mallenco.

This. Give an established ball a new pretty pattern so you can still get your merchandising money, but let the players have a tool that they all know how to bloody use.

Okay.  Germany loses to Serbia? 

I hate this world cup.

Goal to Slovenia? US Keeper doing his best impression of a statue there, too...

Uh, you might want to close on the guy taking 15 seconds to line up a shot.

It wasn't the keeper's fault.  Who was marking that guy?  Hello........defense?

He had no chance on that. That goal is on the back line. Onyewu is a stiff.

SHOOT AT THE GOAL! Jeez.

An that yellow was fucking ridiculous.

Tourney over.

So much shoddy defending. Cherundelo is the only defender worth a damn the US has. I've said that a million times though. Unlucky in a way with 3-4 very good chances just moments before, I wish Donovan had slid into that cross but he clearly was surprised by the defender.

FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

Our defense is a joke.

We don't defend and really don't finish well, either.  The US may be the most overrated team in the tourney, and in recent memory.

inclined to agree right now. Jesus Fuck what a pile of dogshit.

US looks way too tentative on offense.  Some of those passes in the box were terrible... signs of weak indecision. 

The US is done.  I'm not really surprised, but thought they have a good shot in this match. 

Germany. What.The.Fuck?

Well, I still have Japan.  :grin:

Wow.

HOLY SHIT FUCK YEAH LANDON!

They needed that kind of assertive striking in the first half.  Too little too late?  We'll see.

Podolski and Klose doing their best to fuck up our chances. They'll be torn to shreds in the papers tomorrow.

edit: typing is hard

That was a great goal.

AAAAHHHHAHAHAHYEAAAAAAAAAA


FUCK YEAH

THIS IS WHY I LOVE THIS GAME

WHAT THE FUCK!?!

That is the Podolski I know....
(I live in Cologne)

The US got completely hosed on that call taking away the goal. Sad that such a great comeback can be robbed because of a horrible ref.

Absolutely fucking hosed by that call.

Wow, sounds like an entertaining game.  I just went to the bbc to check the score and the commentators are all saying this was the best game of the world cup so far.

They are also saying all the replays show the call on the goal was BS.

Maybe he just hates freedom  :why_so_serious:

--but yeah, I agree. From what I saw, that was suspect.

:edit- interestingly, ESPN is hosed atm. Guess the comments finally got the best of them.

I've been saying this for ages, and I am from one of the most traditionalist countries in the world where football is holier than the pope: this sport is a joke without instant replay. And the US have just been robbed.

Utterly shitty call.

The Americans actually got fouled on that score, so it was worse than a bad call, it was a willful miscarriage.

There were 3 fouls in the box on that goal, Slovenia had been unable to defend without just bear hugging players on every set piece. Jozy was fouled essentially every time he got the ball and only got 2/3rds of the calls. The goal is mystifying. That said the US has no excuse for giving up either of those goals. Neither came off any sustained pressure, lightning counter or brilliant balls in. Just sloppy lack of fundamentals and concentration.

In game 3:
-Can we finally keep a clean sheet?
-Who partners w/ Jozy since Findley is suspended?
-Do either Torres or Edu start in the midfield?

Game 2 thoughts:
-Bocanegra was caught out over and over the entire first half, for some reason Slovenia went away from abusing him the 2nd possibly because they had been scored on.
-Dempsey didn't have much of a game, thank god Jozy decided to show up huge.
-Why the fuck has Torres gotten no playtime in any of the lead up to this game? If we're going to throw him in as our best possession option why hasn't he had one minute of any friendly or tune up game? The biggest mystery of the Bob Bradley regime has been why the fuck has Torres been in the doghouse for over a year.
-DeMerrit and Onyewu had their worst game at the same time, the US is lucky we only gave up to. DeMerrit was just playing sloppy, lots of bad clearance, bad touches, slow reactions and his usual rediculous fouls. Gooch though hasn't looked that bad since '02 he was ball watching the entire game and its a fucking shame we have no other option in central defense because he's clearly just not all there.
-Free kicks, though Donovan is still good for some bad corners this was the best game of free kicks for the US in recent memory. Torres' take especially stands out and I must admit I thought Slovenia's marking was atrocious and that may have made them look better but it seemed like we were getting them long and into the danger area between keeper and defenders with regularity, I hope that continues.

That's probably the worst call I've seen short of the hand of god.

The game should have ended 3-1.  The offsides call that was missed in the first half versus the crap call on the last US goal. 

He did not look offsides to me but I only got to see one angle. He double didn't look offsides the way offsides has been called this week in the world cup, since suddenly we have some tie goes to the runner type rule I'd never heard about in effect.


I'm sure if I see it a few more times someone can find me a US player who shoves or holds a defender. The real bitch is that the announcers at least led me to believe that the flag was up for offsides and that is just fucking horseshit through and through.

I didn't think that was offsides either. I thought the last defender call was going to be a red though.

It was probably just the angle I saw-  watching at work and just got a quick replay.

Falconeer is right though.  Replay is a must for football.  There are too many sketchy offsides calls in the course of games that need review.

In case someone less familiar with football is wondering what the hell the ref called there, it's the infamous "confusion foul". It's what the referee calls when he wants to make sure nothing will happen cause he's unsure about some previous decision. Basically, he wasn't sure about the call that generated that free kick (the foul on Altidore), this because the lineman DIDN'T raise his flag. Consequentially, and given the huge amount of physical play, he obviously decided preemptively that calling a generic confusion foul (which you won't find in any rulebook, but is well known to anyone who played football) would have been the best solution. He made sure to whistle BEFORE the ball reached the area confiding that, even with a replay, there would have certainly been some physical action on both sides enough to justify a call.

So, I am not sure my English makes sense here, but bottom line is that what happened is sadly common: many referees are afraid of making a mistake in the final minutes of a tight match and with a box packed with 20 angry players, so by whistling in advance he cowardly decides that it's best to skip forward and invalidate such a dangerous (for him) situation. It usually works, most of the times (unlike this one) there is such a confused mess in the area that a call could go either way.

Italian Serie A 1999-2000 was almost decided by the same ghost foul, when Cannavaro (playing with Parma) scored against Juventus with 10 minutes on the clock but the referee whistled in advance just to make sure nothing meaningful could happen. Juventus managed to lose the championship anyway by losing in the last game the following week. Justice had been done.

At this point I really hope USA will make it to the next round.

Instant replay just doesn't work real well in a game like soccer though. It screws up the game flow in America football sometimes, which stops naturally after every play, I can only imagine how it would screw up soccer's flow, even if they kept it JUST to "was that a goal? I think it was a goal." I'm not sure it's a good trade off. Yeah, it sucks when you're on the fucked end of a shit call, but I don't think it would actually be good for the game on the whole.


EDIT: In the LAWS OF TEH GAME the catch-all name for "I dunno what just happened but I'm calling SOMEthing" is unsportsmanlike conduct.  :drillf:

It would break the flow, which is better than breaking hearts, or thousand of hours of training and hopes. Football is a low-scoring game, it's all based on very very very small details and almost invisible chances. The goal should be to make sure the winner is the one who deserved it, not the lucky one who picks up a match-deciding referee mistake. To have your dedication, hard work, let alone money blasted away by an often blatant mistake of the referee is too harsh. I say this not just as a supporter but as a player myself. It can really fuck with your mind when you know you have been robbed and video keeps reminding you forever that you have been robbed, no matter how hard you trained, worked, played. I mean, seriously, Ireland-France anyone?

They should just use the Instant Replay for goal situations. And injuries, real AND fake, break the flow of the game anyway so in my opinion the trade off between Flow and Justice is a no brainer.

 :heartbreak:

It wouldn't be that big of a deal if they just did reviews on goals or fouls in the box, neither of which happen very often.  Or you give each coach one challenge per half.

Injuries break the flow, sure, but you aren't going to get a lot of those in a game REALLY. Blown calls are part of the game, soccer is a game where a blown call on one end of the field can turn into a complete game changer on the other side. It's too hard to draw a line where "yes, this is what we'll review because it could change the whole game." Does it suck? Yes. But I don't think it would fix nearly as much as you hope, and I don't know if the trade off would be a good one. I don't think "breaking the flow" is, in fact, better than "breaking hearts." Part of the reason the game is so loved IS because of the way its paced and shit! And I know it sucks as a player to have a badly called game go against you. I've certainly played in my share of those.

I could see reviewing goals and fouls in the box, but what happens when it's just outside the box? Then people will shriek that needs reviewing too. What if someone draws their second yellow in midfield, which puts their team a man down and oh god ref what were you thinking he barely touched the guuuuuy. And so on. The whole field affects the game.

Part of my "oh god the floooooooow" is from watching refs in American football take TWENTY FUCKIN' YEARS to review a play. It would KILL soccer if that happened, especially in America. It's slow paced enough. :P

1985, one of the most ridiculous and significant referee mistake ever, especially considering it costed Liverpool a European Champions' Cup, arguably the most important trophy for club teams.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4I9bkMpNexI

Now, that tragic night is famous for something else, but this call is an insult to the sport, and pure robbery.

FAKE EDIT: This is robbery too (skip forward to 1:25), and decided a World Cup, but I can concede on them not having instant replays in 1966. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RE-wKAooU20

Sjofn, nothing can kill football, it's immortal and very healthy (outside of North America, of course). Having only goal situations reviewed, which by the way would happen eventually once or twice in a game, is better than nothing at all. And it could be just for the second half of the game.
Fuck flow if anything I do, any effort, any talent can be crushed by a blind referee in a matter of seconds. Sometimes things are just that obvious.

Bad calls are part of every sport. You can't replay every single bad call. Even American football realised that. Instant replay isn't the infallible problem solver you seem to think it is. Even if you have it, sometimes the camera angles don't help at all.

Only "goal situations?" That's totally fuzzy, especially in soccer! It's easy to pick through games and find calls you don't like, that you think cost a team a game. It's not so easy to find places to draw the line as to which ones should honestly be reviewed. You've already found one that shows "within the 18/goals" wouldn't have helped, even.  :grin:

The addition of Instant replay to several major American sports has been a life saver, and I'm glad they've done it (and wish they would extend it).  The extra time taken doesn't seem to ever break the flow of the game to me, as everybody is more excited over the outcome of the call.  Soccer would be much improved with a system similar to the way football does it.  Especially when BS like this happens as much as Falconeer says.

Football and soccer are vastly different games, I wouldn't look to football as a way it should be done in soccer. Hockey maybe.


EDIT: Like how would you do challenge flags in soccer? You can't, you'd have the asshole coaches throwing flags just to stop the game. There's nothing like a timeout to cost a team in soccer. You could maybe do yellow cards if you were wrong, but that's a pretty nasty penalty. Give the other team a free kick? Maybe, but if the goal was to give your team a chance to get back on defense, the free kick is a small price to pay. Only allow challenges when the play is stopped anyway? What happens when a guy is utterly mauled yet somehow no call is made just outside the 18 and then it gets cleared and the play never actually stops? Etc.

I like instant replay fine in games that naturally stop anyway, but I hate the way every time there's something even remotely questionable (this case is beyond that but go with me here) that might've affected an outcome, people complain there's not ENOUGH instant replay. Because apparently we want to sit and wait for the refs, whom you don't trust to start with, to decide if they fucked up or not every time anything ever happens.

Its basically exactly what Falconeer was suggesting.  Each team gets 2 challenges per game.

I can find you thousands of simple TV replays where you can easily see the blatant mistake and that YES it would have saved the game. Sometimes it's fuzzy, but most of the times it is not. Instant replays would have fixed countless situations that happened so far, and there's no way around it. Hell, you can't dismiss something as huge and obvious as Ireland-France with "Bad calls are part of every sport". Technology is now ready to help the sport to be fairer than it has been in the past. It should be used.

I mean, fuck this shit

(http://www.qaranimo.com/images/2009/nov/Thierry-Henry-handball-ag-002.jpg)

(http://runningdownhill.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/handofgod.jpg)


FAKE EDIT: Football and soccer are the same game. American Football is the word you are looking for Sjofn  :drillf:

And when I say "flow" I don't mean "oh noes now we have boring parts." I mean for the players on the field, it wrecks momentum if they have to stop and hang around waiting for refs to get their shit together and see what the call was. It wrecks it in football, which stops anyway, so I'm pretty sure it would utterly fuck up soccer.


This doesn't really matter, as I am pretty sure Jesus himself would have to come down from the heavens and command FIFA to add it before it even got considered.


EDIT: Bite me, Falconeer, I specified American football several times, and figured it was finally to the point it would be redundant to do so further. :P

There's a lot they could do to improve the refereeing without resorting to replay. Adding more refs would seem to be the obvious step to me.

What people should be mad at for stealing the flow away from American sports is advertising, not instant replays. I still can't believe they really delay the game for TV shit.

And sorry for being a jerk about terminology. I apologise. It just strikes a nerve every time, part of that tradition shit I mentioned before. My bad.

I believe they have multiple Refs in championship games in Gaelic Football. One ref is in charge of the others, but there are multiple on the pitch. The system works pretty well and could be adapted for soccer.

You know, they call it Soccer in South Africa.   :why_so_serious:

Not only would instant replay break the flow of the game, but it would also take away some of the humanity of the sport. Part of the beauty of soccer is that kids in a field can play under conditions nearly identical to the pros. The more basic the game stays, the more appeal it has, heartbreak or no. You just have to trust the refs to be properly trained and good at their jobs.

It seems like every American sport has instant replay. I need something that doesn't allow for commercial breaks unless it's halftime.

Smart post, replay is shit. They should test/continue to test another official standing near the post on the other side of the goal from the linesman. It would be his job to judge infractions during free kicks, look for hand balls in the box, help judge if the ball crossed the goal line and especially look for clear dives by strikers in the box.

The reality is the US didn't get robbed, they gave up two very horrible, very lazy defending goals in the first half.

This is stupid. You don't even deserve a metaphor.

That bird on the Algerian goal looks really comfy.  :awesome_for_real:

No, this is how all sports fans in the SF Bay Area are. We are keenly aware when our guys screwed something up and missed the easy way to win. We have years and years of practice with it.

It's 80' in my house. I'm watching the world cup.

And I'm thinking of making coffee instead of pouring a beer.

Sad. Very sad.

See, I'm enjoying the hell out of the England/Algeria game. Algeria's been fun to watch, anyway. :P

Rooting for the 0-0 magic here.

Always fun seeing that tosser Becham looking like he has a spicy taco shoved up his ass.  :grin:

Well!

What an odd odd day of football.

England seemed really ... blah, the whole time. Algeria was a pip though!

The officiating was good.  :drillf:

i want my 2 hours back honestly. I'll never watch an england match again. Capello you dumbfuck.

Yea, it must be the coach when 11 of his millionaire chavs can't keep their shit together.
I don't know anything about Capello or England, all I keep seeing is these 'all star' teams looking like asses when faced against anything coordinated.

I'm rooting for North Korea, it's about time a team from Mars won the world cup.

Sweet jesus I just watched the first half of the Germany game. That is some of the most perplexingly stupid and crazy ref'ing I've ever seen.

BUT

Why the fuck did nobody on Germany ever react to the way he was calling it. Stop making stupid unnecessarry bungled tackles from behind every 10 minutes you idiots. They teach you that when you are 12 years old, react to what the ref is letting go and what he isn't.

England deserves to go home and get some blue collar pub boot squarely up the ass.  What a pathetic effort.  They'll somehow beat Slovenia and stagger into the round of 16, though. 

Someone in Great Britain please tell me there will be rioting if England draws their third game... bonus points if its 0-0.

While tonight we were shit I thought we actually played quite well against the States. Unlucky fumble, lots of chances created and missed, very few scoring opportunities conceded.

I thought tonight it wasn't so much a bad team performance but the fact that a couple of people went completely offline in front of a well organised defensive Algerian team. Lampard did nothing about from one tackle and 2 shots that he choked on. Lennon never got himself in a good position to receive the ball (except once near the end of the first half). And Rooney miscontrolled every pass he received. The rest of them played pretty well, Carragher was great, Gerrard and Barry full of energy.

I think England will be better against Slovenia. I don't actually think Slovenia are all that good, USA made them look amazing in the first half by giving them each 20 yards of space. So we don't need England at our best, just the standard we played at against USA will suffice.

Now while we do tend to concede people space when we get nervous like most teams we don't start games like that and I think England will hammer them before we get panicked enough to screw ourselves up.

We were so lucky to get such a soft group. If you had said to us before the World Cup beat Slovenia for a last 16 spot we would have jumped at it.

In a wierd way it might help England having a bad start. We can usually put together a run of 4 great matches then have an awful one. Getting the awful one out of the way might let us have a run of great matches after the group stage.

But no, no riots if we go out. Might be fights in a few pubs but most England fans are used to the hype bubble to banality cycle.

I've yet to see any compelling reason to keep with Heskey. This supposed dynamic with him and Rooney hasn't seemed to materialize here where it counts. And why does Joe Cole get stuck on the bench? He was the best player at 2006 after Hargreaves, and the only England player in the squad with any bit of craft and guile to his game. SWP and Lennon are just fast with listless an erratic service.

I'm not feeling the love for Argentina from what I've watched. Heinze and Gutiérrez aren't convincing full backs, and will get severely exposed when they have to go up against people like Robben, Maicon, or Alves in the semis.

He waited too long before taking Heskey off the pitch, that guy is past his expiry date and should not even start at all. All that screaming and shouting amounted to nothing if you never take out the non performing player from the pitch. He can't pass, he can't dribble, and he got no pace, barely heads. So what good is his value?! If you want physical presence, go for Crouch imo.

I'm not watching another England game ever again. That was just pathetic. Zizou's genes must be within those Algerians and the most ironic thing is that they're playing better than France at the moment with confidence and pace that made million dollar a year players from EPL scared.

At least at this point, even with the draw, for the US it's very simple... win and you're in.

I can't really want more than that with one game to play.

My fiance is praying for a Japanese draw against the Netherlands, but that's probably unrealistic.  Hopefully Cameroon and Denmark draw- seems likely as both teams have been shit.   

Denmark was hardly shit, with a heroic finish in the first 20 min that game could have gone differently. If Cameroon isn't going to play a much better game I like Denmark to cruise to a 2-0 win.

re: Heskey

I think the Heskey is utter shite meme is mostly scapegoating, he has done more not that its saying much then most people on England have in these first two games. Rooney is clearly the striker letting people down and once again Fat Frank + Gerrard in the midfield isn't working for shit. Really though everyone has been saying and I agree that England don't look like they are having fun, there is no enjoyment or really any positive emotion to their play they look like they are going through the motions and just expecting the wins to come for free.

Yeah. I was impressed with the Algerians in comparison. The English side had better players but the Algerians were a team and played with confidence.. I think that was the difference. I'm sure the Algerians were pretty happy with the draw too,

Netherlands v Japan isn't doing much for me so far. I'd like to want to root for the Dutch, what with my European roots and all, but their overly-defensive formation and boring play makes me hope that Japan gets the victory.

Highlight of the game so far, at 32mins in: The referee isn't a giant douchebag.

Great comment on English TV:

Great first half defense by Japan.  They actually had a couple real counterattacking chances- more than the Dutch in the final 15 or 20, despite the Dutch holding the ball two-thirds of the time. 

Don't like my chances of staying up for 2 more hours to see the next match. Australia may have to lose this one without my direct support.

Bang! 1-0 . Japan seem to slacken in 2nd half. at 70% possession, I doubt Dutch going to lose 2 points on this one.

Ghana have given the Aussies a headstart. I thought the handicap system for for golf, not football.

I can see this tournament going to whoever has a keeper who doesn't make a mistake.

Oh God, poor Australia. I'm rooting for Ghana but ...  :ye_gods:

Ha ha not to be outdone the Aussies just gave the Ghanaians a goal back and volunteered to play them a man down. It's like that Laurel and Hardy sketch where they're trying to go through a door and both insisting "After you." "No, after you."

sigh. Good luck, Aussies. You're all going to need it.

Aussie should have won that game with such a very wide open chance late in the game totally squandered.

That being said, Ghana also totally misplayed a wide-open header that could have put the game away.

I should make this my sig. Free goal gifted to Cameroon courtesy of the Danish keeper.

That wasn't the keeper that was the defender who played a lazy ball not realizing how far up Cameroon was pushing the pressure.

Keeper is just as guilty as the lazy pass from the defender. There's no reason to play that ball to a man facing backwards surrounded by three green jerseys. It's a high risk, zero reward distribution.

EDIT: LOL the announcers are totally ripping on the defense for both sides. Simply amazing the game is still 1-1.  :why_so_serious:

Just seen it again, you're quite right.

That stadium in Durban is beautiful. :heart:

Oh my, New Zealand. 1 up after 5 minutes through an offside goal that was allowed to stand. Italy have come back with a penalty.

Kiwis really punching above their weight. They got their first ever world cup point this week and are taking the game to the world champions. They also tried a campaign of physical intimidation against the Italian defence who are famous for dishing it out. The ref unfortunately saw that off very quickly.

Rumors are coming in that the French team is completely self-destructing, refusing to train, and their coach has resigned.

Man, the kiwis really fought hard for that draw.

And the guy in the kiwi suit in the stands made me laugh ridiculously hard.

New Zealand 1 - Italy 1.

Wonderful, wonderful result for the Kiwis, ranked 78th in the world, against the current cup holders. They earned it too, not only did they take the lead but Chris Wood of West Brom went very close 10 minutes from time. One of the subs who came on isn't even a professional footballer - he works in a bank. And the goal was scored by Smelz, formerly of AFC Wimbledon and Mansfield Town and Halifax Town. Bet Halifax are wishing they'd kept him!

This is pretty typical for the Italian team. They start out sorta sleepy, and then they find their groove. They will probably do far better in coming matches. Still, this was pretty humiliating :)

That goal was not offsides (the only one to touch it was the defender) and the penalty was a typical Italian flop job, but nice result.

I wanted to root for Ivory Coast, since they're the underdogs, but they are such a bunch of false-foul drama queens that I'm now rooting for Brazil. I know every team does it to some extent, but the last 10 minutes of the first half had so many pretend injuries I thought I was watching House.

Did the ball bounce off the Brazilian player's arm TWICE on that goal or am I hallucinating?

It did. Not that they need it. Ivory just lack the spark. Too focused on Drogba. Then came that playacting. GEEZ.

Not a very interesting match. Still, Brazil had some amazing plays here and there. They may not win many World Cups, but to my inexpert eyes, they are always the most graceful team.

That was the coolest control I've seen over the match by Dunga's Brazil. I mean, not even once were they in a rush, or panicking. I thought Ivory got a major chunk of possession in the first half, but came that defensive error and after that, coming back is always going to be hard without a creative player.

Yeah, ultimately it didn't matter a bit, but it was still sort of sad it got missed. :P

I turned off the game after the third goal, the second half felt pretty boring even with the scoring.

U missed the worst part tho. Kaka got RED CARDED.

Have you all guys seen the replay that shows the referee approaching Luis Fabiano, mimicking is HANDBALL and smiling condescendly at him in a "I saw you, dude" fashion while the Brasilian forward puts up the "me? what? no, never!" act?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq0LuOW7y3Q (at the end of this crappy video)

I wonder what that shit means. The ref clearly states that he saw the handball (handballs, there were TWO), so why the hell he didn't call it?

The officiating has been horrible in this cup.  Every game that I've watched has had at least a questionable call, and the Kaka red was just ridiculous.  The guy just ran into him and fell down, Italian style.  FIFA really needs to look at their officiating and consider some replay. 

I really think the red card on Kaka was a goofy way to compensate for the ridiculous non-call on the handball. A bone thrown at Ivory Coast players to have them believe, in the aftermath of the match, that the ref was not openly against them. And yes, that shit (the guy who fell on the ground pretending to be hit by Kaka) is rightfully called "Italian" since the country is led by an elected guy who basically fosters and sponsors that kind of behaviour, not just in football, and is loved and voted because of that.

I usually root for the underdog but it was pretty impossible after the ridiculous sending off.  With Brazil already through the suspension shouldn't affect them much though.

Also, the French team seems to have exploded today.

Come to think of it, yeah, Kaka profited from the suspension. With that, he can get into the next stage with cleared records of yellow card accumulation.

Of course, FIFA can do a video review and take action against that guy who suffered from face spasms after being nudged on the chest.

"AH SHIT MY NIPPLES!!!!! THE SHAMEEE!" And down he goes. I was hysterical. Until the ref gave the red. Jeebus. And yes I saw that smile, the BBC half time commentators summed it up perfectly.

Ref: Did you use the hand to control the ball?
Scorer: Nope.  :grin: I chested it
Ref:  :oh_i_see:

I am suddenly in favor of France to win it all...  :grin:

Looks like the English are jealous of the imploding (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/england-divided-how-terry-tried-to-organise-coup-against-capello-2006139.html)

1. I'm really not sure what the convo about the hand ball was, either he was saying "I suspect you used your hand the second time but I didn't see it" or honestly I have no idea.

2. Kaka deserved to be sent off. You have to look at the entire sequence of events in that final 10 minutes. Kaka was at the middle of all of that. He was carded, a Ivorian was carded going after him, he went after someone else (he clearly intends to body check the guy) Kaka was not heeding the earlier warning and the game was becoming dangerously out of control there had been a slew of bad dangerous plays and someone needed to be sent off to get the teams to calm the fuck down and return to actually playing soccer. That is good reffing. Kaka was being a bitch and in the wrong place at the wrong time did something childish and stupid for the second time.

3. Overall the reffing in this cup has been great. Germany v Serbia is the only completely fucking flabbergasting game I've seen besides that its been a few calls people didn't like. The guy who did USA v Slovenia didn't control the nonsense in the box and was unlucky that the USA scored when he had already decided to blow his whistle on that free kick no matter what. I felt his control of the game was poor but he didn't let any dangerous shit go on or force the game to be dictated by his whims if anything he was far too lenient in both the wrestling in the box and all the hands they were putting on Jozy in the first half.

If somebody is going to say "but what about Italy's pk omg" don't bother. You don't tug a jersey for that long in the box ever. If you do you deserve the pk you've just given away, same goes for people sticking their goddamn arms out (Australia, Vidic for Serbia etc) in the box.

I'm very disappointed in FIFA since they know that the play in the box on freekicks is a mess currently but clearly they haven't given the refs a proper set of guidelines on what do about it and I bet we wont have that until after this WC is over. But to say this is some terribly officiated cup so far is just plain not true.

You are trying to justify a make up call.

I mean really, that's ridiculous. Get real, that play was so horrendous they suspended the damn ref because they couldn't let it dominate the group round.

I guess the rule is thus: "slightly tug on an Italian's shirt, PK for Italy; bear hug an American, no goal for America"

They denied a penalty of Lucio on Drogba (although now that I think of it, it was probably out of the box, but no call anyway) for more significant shirt holding than the New Zealand player on the Italian comedian. I am pretty sure the ref gave them the penalty to even-out the wrong call on NZ goal (it was offside).

I haven't been able to find anything that suggests this is true.


I just can't ever support the Italian diving team in World Cups anymore. It's just too much.

I just really wish that Wood's shot would have curved the other direction and gone in instead of wide by less than a foot. Then the Italians and their diving BS would have been for naught.

The reason people are upset about the Italy PK is not that it was not a foul at all, but every other game in this Cup has had much more blatant jersey pulling and holding in the box and not had PKs called on them. There needs to be some consistency.

Secret Italian training vid (http://usa.worldcupblog.org/group-e/secret-italian-training-video.html)  :awesome_for_real:

Looks legit to me.

 :oh_i_see:

5-0 . Geez, this tourney's weird.

Heroic free champions of capitalism, Portugal, beat Stalinist masters of oppression North Korea 7-0 in a clear display of cultural supremacy! Huzzah! Long live consumerism, the Euro and national debt!

Heh. I'm pretty sure I first saw that in the last cup right after they played Australia. Wouldn't surprise me if it's been doing the rounds for a lot longer than that.

Great match. Watching Portugal was just enjoyable, especially without any cards or other bullshit to mar the experience. They're right up there with Argentina now in teams I just enjoyed watching.

This. Fucking Di Rossi is such a goddamned douchebag. I hope him and the rest of the Italian Dive Team go home with France after the group stage.

Sadly, the goal WAS offside, there's clearly a soft touch by Reid, but the dive is pathetic. I hate the Italian team, reading the papers today was so much fun. I'd pay for them to be kicked out by Slovakia.

The way the CBC announcers explained it here was that it wasn't offside because the Italian defender touched the ball before Reid tapped in it. I'm a soccer fan every four years, so I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but the offside wasn't called because Reid wasn't affecting the play, the Italian defender (two of them in fact) touched the ball before he did, so it negated the offside...

A handball *could* have also been called on the Italian defender before Reid got it anyways.

Long weekend of football.

Germany/Serbia: This was a good game, totally fucked to hell and back by a ridiculous ref. Yes, Klose made some stupid tackles, but the first most certainly was not a red card. That ref was looking to give away cards, and he did, and it influenced the game. Of course, if Podolski could hit a goddamn penalty kick, Germany at least gets a point so I can't exactly say they were robbed. That guy on the wing for Serbia, Krasic, he was fucking amazing. He totally made Badstuber his bitch. Also, new Liverpool signing Jovanovic looked good as well.

USA/Slovenia: Fuck no, the USA was robbed robbed fucking ROBBED. Yes, they let in two goals by not pressing the ball. Their first half was mostly terrible, no rhythm, no passing skill. Every pass seemed like the ball had a weight attached to it. But, that second half was awesome. Donovan's first goal was fantastic (please let him go back to the EPL, MLS - I'd prefer in a Liverpool jersey). Jozy had a right to be pissed off by the end. He might as well have been wearing a Slovenian jersey for as much as those bastards were hanging on to him in the box. Yes, there's always tugging, pushing, shoving and pulling in the box. This was fucking RIDICULOUS. The disallowed third goal was a fucking disgrace to the game. The ref continually called phantom fouls on the US in the opposition box, fouls which were not called when Slovenia was in the US box.

England/Algeria: It was late in the night when I started watching this on Tivo, and I cannot claim to have been awake for more than 5 minutes consecutively through the whole match. Goddamn, it was boring. What I did see is that Algeria is a better side than their points indicate - Zanni on the wing is especially good. The England team is absolutely clueless. Their whole formation is wrong. If you insist on having a guy in there to head the ball as the withdrawn striker, go with Crouch because Heskey is a fucking joke. But really, if they are going to insist on having Lampard in there with Gerrard, put Rooney up front as the lone striker (he's been getting service like he's a long striker anyway), put Gerrard and Lampard behind, use Cole/Lennon/Wright-Phillips/Milner on the wings and put either Barry or Carrick as the holding midfielder. Of course, their leaky defense is about to get leakier, with Carragher missing the 3rd game with 2 yellows, King not being well. I think Michael Dawson is their last option.  :oh_i_see:

Brazil/Ivory Coast: You know what? Dunga is a douchebag. He needs to sit down and stop bitching at every foul that comes up. That said, the Ivory Coast team needs to stop playing like fucking bitch ass thugs. It's like 11 Drogba's on the field. That red card to Kaka was retarded, because he didn't really do much of anything and the refs bought the bullshit playacting. I'll be glad to see Ivory Coast go if only so that bullshit gets punished by results.

Italy/New Zealand: My wife is Italian and roots for them, but I can't. That bunch of whining, diving pussfaces piss me off. I'll be overjoyed if they don't make it out of the group stages. New Zealand played like motherfuckers and Italy played like shit. They have limped through both of their games and I really hope they go home.

France:  :why_so_serious:

ivory's gone with the 7-0 drubbing by portugal, the goal difference is just insane. Unless Portugal loses by 3-0 and Ivory trashes North Korea by 7-0 ....Not gonna happen.

"I don't care who win as long as it's not Italy" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2JEpEj10a8).

Sucks that there's no subtitled version, but that's pretty much what the corus says. I got a rough translation from a friend and I agree with 99% of the lyrics.


Automated translation and German lyrics under the spoiler tag:

I'm just hoping that Brazil and Portugal come out to play real football when they meet.  That could be a great match, if they go at it hard.

It may be entertaining for the exact opposite reason:  They likely won't go too hard, because they're both through.  That might open up the field pretty nicely, however.

I don't think Portugal has much for Brazil anyways, it would be a great game against old Brazil but Dunga's Brazil is so much more disciplined and tight at the back that I suspect nothing at all will happen for most of the first half and then at some point Brazil being Brazil will unlock them with some creativity out of nowhere and then the game will return to being mostly blunted attacks and lots of possession going nowhere. If you go into that one hoping for a shoot out your going to be disappointed.

Spain coming up, I need to look up the over/under on goals.

I'm currently in Portugal & the locals are ecstatic, but nothing compared to the Brazilian community over here who went absolutely nuts outside our hotel last night, street was closed for three hours.  Shame we're not going to be here for the final as they are the definite favourites.

In other news Cappello is 100% to blame for Englands shitness, I think the best formation he has is with Joe Cole or Gerrard in the hole and Rooney the lone Striker cause Heskey is appalling and only worth ten minutes at the end when all other options have been exhausted, starting Defoe would be the less sensible option. I keep thinking he would have been wise to gamble on one of the form players like Zamora or Parker, but he seems to prefer experience over form. I mean they hired Capello for x million and he's basically playing the same formation as the last guy.

EDIT: The table I was looking at earlier had a mistake on it.

The disallowed goal was BS, but I have trouble hating on the referee when our boy Dempsey slammed his elbow into a Slovenian's face and then lied to the referee to get out of any penalty by indicating that it had been head-on-head contact.  We probably should've played with 10 men for 88 minutes, which is probably worth at least a goal.

Dempsey is the luckiest motherfucker on the planet.

Good bye France.  :awesome_for_real:

I think South Africa has to run up the score 5-0 on the French while the Mexicans have to lose to Uruguay to have a remote shot.

Also, how hilarious would it be if France didn't score a goal in this entire group round before getting shamed back home.

Good to see France doing so well at this point. Entertaining game between Uruguay and Mexico as well. I'm mostly watching that one and just flipping across now and then to the FRA/RSA game.

I really want to watch Argentina v Greece later tonight. But 4-4:30am kick off.  :uhrr:

South Africa needs 2 more goals if my (shaky) math is right.

2-1, RSA needs a miracle.  :oh_i_see:

Not a disaster for South African football. They punched above their weight in a horrible group. Finished on a win and beating France, even emo nerd rage I'm taking my ball home disastrous France is still a hell of a scalp for a small country.

As for the French - apparently the government is talking about a national inquiry. Do they still guillotine people over there?

No, they probably just make you eat imported cheese or something.

But good on RSA, even if if this was a self-destructing France.

Karma. Although I kinda respect that they stuck up for Anelka, wish Ireland did something similar with the Keane & the Saipan incident.

Uruguay is looking strong.

Yep, this. Fuck you, France. Also, good on South Africa for beating a big team like that, even if it still didn't get them through the group. They showed themselves well, and never seemed to engage in the shitty thug behavior like the Ivory Coast did.

Keane was a primadonna that didn't want to play, called his manager a fucking wanker and quite rightly got booted home, and the Irish team united, got stuck in and did pretty bloody well in the tournament without him, thank you very much. And Keane spent the rest of his career quitting when things got difficult. Seriously, I'm sick and tired of hearing about him.

This is nowhere close to that situation. But yeah good riddance to France.

http://www.vuvuzela-time.co.uk/

Argentina v Mexico = bye bye Mexico. While I really do think this is Mexico's best team, I think its only their best team until next world cup they have so much young talent that will play for top sides during the next four years. Losing Vela is a big blow Franco looked like shit out there. The decision to yank Ochoa bugs me as well, he might be less reliable but he's much more capable of a monster game. They need a monster game from their keeper to beat Argentina. Not that I don't think it could end 3 to 2 and be one of the most entertaining matches of the tournament but Argentina seems more in form and on point and the teams know each other well.

Uruguay versus whoever comes out in second sounds pretty good for Uruguay. I expect them to advance past Nigeria/Korea without conceding their first goal of the tournament. I'm torn on who I want to make it. Korea has played much better football but I feel really bad that on home continent every single African team has conspired to be so goddamn, well African about making the least of their opportunities. Also nobody has looked worse than Nigeria on balance over two games in my opinion except France.

re: France

What the fuck was FFF thinking with a lame duck manager? My French friends tell me the entire last 3 years have been a conspiracy to try to get Platani to come back and coach for them but its not working.

What's with all the enthusiasm for player revolts? They have never once in the history of professional football done anything but fuck up teams. In a World Cup you're stuck with the manager even if he's crap and doing everything wrong. Usually they're sparked by some egomaniac being subbed or dropped, not exactly the most rational reason for persuading half the squad not to put any effort in for your manager. They just throw petrol on the fire.

Well done Capello for nipping ours in the bud. You have to be a complete cunt to want to lead a player mutiny at this stage, the only hope is to all get behind the manager. Knife him secretly in the back to the suits if you want but for god's sake don't run to the newspapers crying about how misunderstood you are (or in Terry's case how misunderstood his clubmate is) and how it's all the manager's fault.

John Terry, proving once again how big of a dickbag you must be to play for Chelsea.

Looks like Korea may end up going through.  Wow.  Unless Greece or Nigeria go apeshit in the next 20 minutes.

Good job South Korea, they've been very watchable. Pity for them that draws in the elimination rounds won't be decided by Sudden Death Starcraft.

Argentina look majestic. I notice that Maradona kisses his players all the time. I wonder if Fabio is taking notes.

Man, Nigeria could not buy a goal at the end there.

I just saw the highlights of that game. Some Nigerian strikers will have nightmares tonight.

They were the second worst team of the tournament besides France, their play was apathetic at best most of the time, the mental lapses were awful and the lack of urgency, pace or guile was obnoxious considering the talent they have on the field. I hate Nigeria by the end of this world cup and I started off rooting for them had they gone through it would have been purely luck and they would have been crushed by Uruguay at least Korea will try very hard to score and actually has been taking the chances given to them.

tl;dr fuck Nigeria what a disgrace they have been playing on home continent.

Are there any African teams qualified for the next round?

If Ghana holds Germany to a draw they'll go through.

C'mon England!

<<Toots Vuvu>>

 :heartbreak:

Yeah, right.

 :awesome_for_real:

I'm hoping England and the US both win.

USA is so fucked

We're starting are absolute worst option at left back. Beasley would be a better left back. Bornstein has shown without fail he does not have the awareness or pace to play at CONCACAF qualifying level let alone world cup level against a fast team.

Fuck me Bradley I hope I eat these words but I just don't get it. I get why you had to get Gooch off because he is Captain head in the clouds for the first 30 min of every game but I am so scared right now.

Gomez starting, its the most like for like replacement we have but is the theory that Gomez can't go a full 90 or that he's just better off the bench? This change worries me in the sense that we always do so well bringing speed of the bench late if we need a goal or just to reverse the flow of the game and increase pressure and now we're very short on options to do that.

U.S. gets hosed AGAIN!

England are looking a lot more inspired and enthusiastic today.

And the US is looking very US.

I have a feeling that England advance.

Fuuck, England are all over the Slovenia goal at the moment.

God the U.S. needs someone who can finish.

And we've been saying that for how many years?

Painful to watch all those chances lost, but there are worse alternatives (ie, England v. Algeria zzzzzz). Other than the two blown offsides calls, at least the reffing seems reasonable, if strict. But given a goal was taken back, that's a pretty big "other than."

Opps. My hair just turned grey.

When is Dempsey going to pull his head out of his ass?

COMMON. SOMEONE. GAAAAH.

!!! FINALLY

YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.  :drill: :drill: :drill: :drill:

Haha, US got a last minute goal?

Poor Slovenia, great match for England though.

USA - FUCK YA

Wow.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Crazy.  The U.S wins the Group after all that.

At the 90' mark I'm told

I caught the last 4 minutes of the game. I'm glad of that. I think I would have had an ulcer.

My stomach was clenched the whole time.   Ugh, thank you jebus.

Now we get to find out who we'll all be playing. England had a great game though, worlds different from the first two. James Milner was great, Cole was great, Rooney did better (although he is still off his usual pace). If we can keep up this form we could go a ways.

Yes I agree - England was much improved, not to the standard that they need to be playing at, but if they're coming alive a bit late that's okay. I hope they can build on it.

I have a feeling Germany will pound Ghana.

Well, from reading the synopsis of the last two US games, I've come to the conclusion that even the US Soccer team thinks the sport is boring, and are purposefully trying to make the games more exciting.  Christ that was close.

If we play Serbia, that's going to be an intensely political game.  The Serbians are very very angry with us.

Any particular reason why?

Mainly for our support of Independence for Kosovo, though that's on top of lingering resentment over the bombing campaign back in the 90's.  But yeah, they are REALLY mad about Kosovo right now.  It also didn't help when ESPN put out this poster for Serbia:

(http://www.worldcupbuzz.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Serbia.jpg)

Which cut out Kosovo, amongst many other insulting things to them (http://jockpost.com/espn-serbia-world-cup-mural-poster-called-disgrace-humiliation/).

So losing to us in world cup would be just about the most shameful thing that could possibly happen.  They'll be out for blood.

Wow. I am drained after watching that game. About 88 minutes in I had finally given up hope- they were starting to drag their heels a bit from exhaustion. Probably best that I was home alone when the goal went in- I am sure I looked like a loon. How bad is it that I was celebrating while keeping one eye on the ref/linesmen to make sure they didn't scumbag us out of another good goal?

Algeria made no attempt to move on. I would be embarrassed if the US sat back and defended when they needed to win by more than one goal to advance. So fuck them, good riddance, and glad the two best teams made it through eventually.

I may need to order a new liver for Saturday.

Seriously fuck Algeria. Fucking dirty bitches.

Man of the match is Altidore for me despite him missing a clear chance when both he and Donovan had the play on that rebound.

Hats off to coach Bradley and the team we have looked shakey in defense but dangerous in attack throughout and played today with poise and determination like we belonged.

Bring on Serbia, I like that match up compared to Ghana again.


I prefer the version with music:

http://deadspin.com/5570855/heres-video-of-landon-donovans-winner

also this site has some great comments and content though its all over the place in terms of sports.

Whelp, Serbia has new things to be pissed about?  :drillf:

The street outside is literally crammed with German fans waving flags and blowing horns. It's a good job I'm off sick from work because there's no way anyone in the altstadt is getting any sleep tonight.

The draw works out at

USA vs Ghana

Uraguay vs South Korea

for a place in the semi finals.

England have the Germans AGAIN.     1938 since the germans FAILED to reach at least the quarters.

The US could actually get through that. In fact, the US should get through that.

If we do, I'll put ten buck my partner goes into labor an hour before the match.

At least the American audience will get to see what a game that goes to penalties looks like.

Best part of the US winning the group is that they get the late game on Saturday so I don't have to get up at the ass crack of dawn to drive to a bar to watch the game  :drill:

USA, Saturday, Tanqueray.

This is my plan.

You should drink an Amuricun alcohol like bourbon or moonshine.

I concur.

It was kind of hell this morning needing to go to work after the match and not being able to drink.

OTOH, American alcohol & soccer and I'm having horrible flashbacks to one too many can of Schlitz at Screaming Eagle & Sam's Army tailgates.

Change that to Jager Bombs and Yuenglings at American outlaws rallies and I can relate.

Jaeger isn't so American though.


This is a good plan.

no, but it doesn't make me throw up like bourbon to beer  :uhrr:

Let's get the party rolling!  :awesome_for_real: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_dm8vCXkqI)

oh hell, I despair for some of my fellow countrymen at times

Who the heck teaches these hicks to sing a song that's gotta be at least 60 years old?

Woof, had to listen to the 2nd US match on radio while driving, saw the 3rd, finally have Internet access again.  Yes, 2nd match gave up goals like bitches in first half (watched the game on DVR later that day) but seriously, listen to the pansy whining futbol experts here who don't credit the comeback, which was fucking awesome and should have yielded a win.  Today should have been 2-nil, Algerians just wanted to spoil rather than win, fuckers all of them. Good shit, at any rate, except for FIFA motherfuckers.

ADD: and Hoax.

If only they did, Australia might have made it through...   :heartbreak:

Good game from Australia but just too late, although I'm looking forward to old rivalry with Germany vs England (Go Deutschland!).

USA should have a fair chance progress playing Ghana...

Bring on Brazil Portugal excitement!

I think England will end up regretting a hatful of missed chances that gives us the Germany > Argentina route.

Still at least we didn't bomb out. Never seen Fabio looking so excited, I think our whiff of player revolt really concentrated his mind. Much better performance but we still have some of our big names hiding (Lampard, Rooney). How refreshing it was to see Defoe playing as an old-fashioned goal hanger, fuck tackling back, fuck "linking the play",  just stay up there on the shoulder of the last defender and wait for the chances.

Rooney looks as if he may be injured, to my eye.  He seems a bit slower than normal against what should be much weaker competition in some of these defenses he has faced so far.  I hope he pulls it together against Germany.

Woo hoo! Slovakia 1 - Italy 0 after 24 minutes. As things stand Paraguay and Slovakia would go through, Italy would finish bottom of their group. Nice to see England aren't the only ones suffering nervous matches!

Bastards at work spoiled the USA game before I had a chance to watch it on the Tivo. Watched it anyway and loved it. USA played a good, attacking game and Algeria sat back like they didn't give a shit about winning. I want to know how many times the US is going to get jobbed on goals this tournament. It's getting damn ridiculous. Finishing is one of our problems, but having watched a bunch of games in the tournament, I really do blame the ball for a lot of these missed chances. It is a shit ball that sails at the slightest provocation and really seems to throw even the best players off of their game. Jabluani can JA-BLOW-ME. I don't think Ghana is a gimme game at all - that side is a lot better than it would appear at first.

What little I saw of the England game was a definitely improvement. Heskey being off the pitch was a big help. England still has serious issues at the back, but luckily Slovenia is not that creative. Germany, however, is going to give them fits. Osil will eat their lunch if they aren't careful.

Speaking of Germany, good on them. That Ghana side is tougher than anyone gives them credit for, and not having Klose really restricted Germany's options up front. Osil though... he is the real deal. I just know some cocksucker team like Bayern is going to come along and steal him from Werder Bremen after this tournament. Having Klose back against England is going to help a great deal. I expect Germany to go through with a leaky, creaky England defense and the English inability to break down defenses.

GO GO SLOVAKIA!

Still Slovakia 1 - Italy 0. Martin Skrtel just cleared a ball off the line that may have been over, goal not given. Slovak striker Stoch has had a couple of good opportunities.

If you're not watching and you possibly can tune in, it's a cracker.

EDIT: IT'S 2-0. SLOVAKIA 2 - ITALY 0, Vitec, what a star, can't wait for him to arrive at Anfield!

EDIT: 2-1 and there's a fight in the goal mouth, lol. 81m played.

EDIT: Italy just scored again and it was disallowed. 85m played. 2-1 to Slovakia.

Hang in there Slovakia!  2-1!  Arrrrgghhh!

They also need New Zealand to draw or lose to go through. If there's any justice though the Italians will still be bottom of the group.

Slovakia 3 - Italy 1. Va fanculo arseholes!

EDIT: Slovakia 3 - Italy 2. 91m played, 2m 15s left.

EDIT: 95m played, Italy just missed from 7 yards. Slovaks dropping like flies with pretended injuries.

EDIT: Final whistle. Slovakia 3 - Italy 2. Almost 7 minutes of added time. What a game! Game of the tournament. Paraguay and Slovakia go forward from the group.

EDIT: Forget that, Italy scored again lol

EDIT 2: Yep, and Italy's out for sure, and dead last in their group.

Only important thing is for Italy to fail.

Bwahaaahaaaaaaaaa!   Suck it Italy!

Arrivederci Italy.

The Italian team should fake an injury so they don't have to fly home coach like the French.

The BBC's football web page won't load. Must be jammed with Brits who didn't skive off work and now wish they had.

Fuck you, Italian team. Go home in disgrace!  :awesome_for_real: I hope this means they'll fire Lippi and hire a coach who doesn't teach his players to be diving, whiny bitches.

Howard Webb has had an AWFUL season in the premier league. ALmost every decision wrong etc etc ..

thought he handled the match well - got the decisions right and controlled some pretty volatile incidents without getting card happy.


And yes

Italy / France double is so win!

Then you want to look outside that country. In Italy they teach you to dive since you are a kid in football school.

New Zealand - Undefeated.

Italy's game so good to watch, roller coaster excitement.

So, I know Italy was defending champs and all, but why the hate? I mean, sure, they do their usual tomfoolery on the field, but they never struck me as the assholes of the cup.

It is that selfsame tomfoolery of which you speak.  The level to which those assholes dive around the pitch faking injuries to draw cards or penalties is a disgrace to sportsmanship.  It's disgusting behavior, and if there's such thing as karma then every one of those dicks needs to get run over by a beer truck - that way they'll know what real pain is and have an actual reason to roll around like a bunch of whiney fucks.

And yes, the above is an accurate representation of how most people view them.  Not Italians in general, just their soccer players.

I do not hate them. I thought they made a good fight out of it in the final third of the game, but I guess people can't get over their diving reputation.

Oh yeah welcome to World Cup 2010, where both the 2006 finalists are knocked out in first stage. The sun sets over Europe.

I didn't get the sense that Algeria wasn't trying to win; shots and possession time were about even and they got 6 corners to 4 from the US.  If they had turtled, I wouldn't think that we would've had so many great scoring chances.   I just thought they weren't as good.  But I may be missing something subtler.

Algeria didn't seem like they were pushing up at all. They seemed to be playing the counter-attack exclusively, and the only reason they go so many chances or corners is that the US defenders are really slow.

Also, the Italians deserve their diving rep. They should have gone to penalties against Germany in the '06 Semi but one of their bitches dove in the box in stoppage time and got a penalty if I remember right. Of course, then Germany collapsed and gave up another goal toot suite.

He was right Mick McCarthy is a wanker, also he had a terrible first touch which was the other thing Keane said. As far being a primadonna Keane had a short temper fair enough but he was totally setup, they held a press conference with him present and read out a statement of things that should have been kept behind closed doors and dealt with properly. His stance was he wanted to be 100% prepared and FAI are a bunch of amateurs and have been for a long time, which was true.

Regardless they wanted rid of him even though he was the main reason we got to the World cup but I guess the average punter who knows nothing about football wouldn't be aware of this, I went to see two of the qualifiers and we were fucked without Keane especially when McCarthy threw away a solid lead against Portugal and Holland by taking all our forwards off in the last fifteen minutes of both games. 2002 was the worst quality World cup I've ever seen we should have easily made the quarters we had one of our best teams at the time, it was a joke to be honest. But I guess second round will always be good enough for Ireland.

/rant

Excuse the derail, split it off maybe.

^all that. But I'm not real Irish (thank god) so I'm not allowed to debate this point as I've learned.

re: Italy.

I hate Italians too. Not Falc but the ones in America who have been here forever and are still annoying greasy slimy bitchfuck Catholic dicks. Fuck essentially all of those Jersey Italians. Back to their team. Fuck them. If Zizzou is on that pitch Italy never wins the cup in the first place. Everything they accomplish comes with so many caveats and asterisks. They are just dirty in every sense of the word and take pride in that fact. I'd wager without a doubt they are the most hated team on the planet and with good reason.

re: the bracket

How crazy is it that it looks like only Brasil and Netherlands will be on one side and every other team with the potential to win it all is on the other side? Of course we still have 2 huge games coming up. Can Portugal steal first place against a Brazil without Kaka (answer is no in case you were wondering) and what will Spain do? Despite how good they are Torres is clearly off his game and it is still Spain you never know when they'll just self destruct it all.

re: Ghana v USA

Fucking Ghana. They looked amazing for 60 min against Germany. Anyone who knows football and watched that game should be terrified of that team showing up for a full 90 against the US. They looked European in terms of calm and control in possession but coupled with desire speed and strength all over the pitch and despite their terrible finishing they looked very dangerous every time the ball was in Germany's final third. I pray that game comes down to finishing but considering how apt we are to make a goal really really really easy on the opposition I'm so nervous I'm already losing sleep over the game. I hope that Americans are buying up as many tickets as they can from South Africans for that game to reduce the home team advantage.

I hate Italians for so many reasons, most of them cultural/political. The football playstyle 100% mirrors the current Italian mentality. They are probably the worst people in the world right now on average. Stress on right now and on average.

Hell, I don't even consider myself Italian, and I hate my passport for stubbornly stating otherwise. I am doing my best to change that anyway.

For me and my son this has been a great day, screaming to the top of our lungs as if we founded Slovakia and survival was at stake. Now watchin TV is suddenly fun again: the QQ just started, it will last for days, and it tastes so good...

From a football perspective there are several reasons to dislike Italy

1) They really pioneered simulating back in the 60s and 70s. Nowadays everyone does it, football commentators and managers even criticise players for being too honest when they stay on their feet after a foul sometimes and Italy don't do it much more than anyone else. But they pioneered it, popularised it and beat a lot of more honest teams doing it.

2) They pioneered time wasting. Back in the days when goalkeepers could pick up the ball they kept the ball between keeper and backs for several minutes at a time when 1-0 up.

3) Traditionally they've been very defensive and risk averse. They're spoilers rather than entertainers. (There are exceptions and when they do score the goals are usually very watchable).

4) They have a horrible reputation for crippling good players. Even in today's match Gatuso kicked a lump out of an opponent's kneecap in what a British commentator described as an "honest attempt to play the ball". If you look at that incident again you really can't tell if it was accidental or deliberate but if you look at Gatuso's track record he has more of those "accidents" than most whole teams do. Very clever, very cynical. In older, more naive days they did the same without the disguise, men like Claudio Gentile were legendary for damaging opponents. Gentile actually has a very good disciplinary record but it's because he was proficient at not getting caught.

5) They lack popular players. In Britain we're fairly averse to Argentina but everyone loves Tevez for his work ethic honesty and passion just as we loved Ardiles a generation earlier. The only Italian that most Brits have anything approaching a soft spot for is Gianfranco Zola.

Japan... GOOOAALLL!! brought to you by Honda.  

:drill:

now Endo... :drill:

 :cry:

Wow, props for remembering the Lord of the Goons, Claudio Gentile. Interesting to notice that he was appointed as coach of Italy U21 squad a few years ago. I don't even want to know what he taught those young players.

Anyway, there are every now and then a few good Italians, Zola was one and even Gianluca Vialli wasn't that bad of a human being. Roberto Mancini is a dick, but he's totally un-Italian in his straightforward ways. I'm not surprised they all ended up in England at some point, they are between the few that I can recall right now that had a different mentality compared to the typical Italian player/citizen.

But Fabio Capello? He's Italian to the bone, a dick, a poor human being, a coward, an asshole and as you can see not that great as a coach either despite his teams wins. When England chose him to save the day, I died a little inside.

Good lord! How did I forget Capello?

What you say might be true but as far as the English are concerned he walks on water right now. If he steers us as far as the semis he'll become the most popular Italian here since Julius Caesar.

Found this story:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/jun/04/serieafootball.internazionale

Rising sun.  Japan making some noise.

Woo Japan!

The dink and pass by Honda on that last Japanese goal was fucking stunning.  :drill:

It seems he's this kind of Honda rather than an Acclaim.

(http://ww1.honda.co.uk/motorcycles/2010/galleria/CBR1000RRFireblade/9.jpg)

(http://www.rvgfanatic.com/mediac/400_0/media/DIR_593415/HondaSF1.JPG)

Heh, saw this quote going around yesterday:
Now the Japanese are kicking ass, maybe we can end this thing with a US/Japan fight.   :awesome_for_real:

(Also, the Italians folded like a wet napkin against everybody they played).

Edit:  To bad there isn't a Danish street fighter character you could show Honda smacking.

/clap

GANBATTE BLUE SAMURAI!!

I didn't think it was physically possible for that team to score three goals, but they really opened it up.  I was sure they'd play for the 0-0 draw, give up a goal, and die. 

With offense like that they could beat Paraguay.  Then, on to Brazil  :oh_i_see:

Better description of Slovakia last night, not Italy. The goalie was a disgrace.

Not that Italy deserved to go through. Would have loved to see New Zealand win the group just for giggles. Alas...

Italy is traditionally the Munchkin of football.

They use every loophole, every advantage they get. They trash talk, they dive, they try to disrupt the other team's play by any means necessary. Tugging at jerseys, pushing and tactical fouls to wear down players. (Either by frustrating them and putting them on tilt or by injuring them in an attempt to "play the ball")

This is combined with a usually ultra defensive line up (some jokingly refer to it as 0-0-11). That's why Italy's games usually end up a draw or 1:0. They wear the other team down and score late after the ohter team ran out of steam.

Games usually tend to go in one of two directions.
They play an offensive team, where the offensive team wears itself down trying to get around the Italian defense, after 90 minutes or after overtime their opponents are usually so exhausted that they easily score the one goal they need.
They play a defensive team then it's an utter snoozefest for 90 minutes and it usually goes to overtime or penalties.
Somehow they have perfected the skill of doing the most damage when the ref isn't looking.

Their style of play is utterly frustrating to the opposing team and the crowd but usually pays off. On the other hand if they are behind they tend to either play brilliantly or completely fall apart.

The half final of the 2006 World Cup where Italy played Germany was a perfect example. They played ultra defensively for 118 minutes until the German side was completely exhausted and then they scored two goals in 2 minutes and in the final they actually managed to have an opposing player completely lose his shit. All the while playing dirty as hell, diving and fouling and using every opportunity they could get. You should have heard the cheers when Zidane headbutted Matterazzi. I suppose that every player that had the Misfortune to play against Italy harboured a similar thought at one point or other.

I'm not exactly sad that they got eliminated. Unfortunately with Portugal another team that subscribes to the same "play dirty" antics is still in the tournament.

Germany vs. England is always an instant classic. Although if my German team keeps playing the way they did vs. Ghana and Serbia, then England has a very good chance of actually winning.

It will - as usual- come down to penalties however. Every time when Germany and England play each other they should just skip regular play and just start with penalties, would save each side and the crowd 120 minutes  :why_so_serious:

Portugal vs Brazil -  game of the Cup?
                         ^
                         worst

 :uhrr:

edit: because this game is just shit. more fun watching the Ivory Coast

I'm looking forward to it in a few minutes

Heh, John Stewart [eventually] offers John Oliver help if the English need it against the Germans....again. (http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-june-23-2010/world-cup-2010--into-africa---us-beats-algeria).

Tiago diving? Disgusting, I hope someone beats him in the head tonight after the game.

You know, it is really fairly spectacular that the People's Republic of Korea even qualified for the cup.

Hey, they defeated Brazil and drew their last match with Portugal, that's pretty damn impressive:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jb610TPkAw

Bicycle tire pressure reform? wat?

 :why_so_serious:

Sweet goal by Villa. Uh, goalie, don't come 30 yards off the line for no reason.

Barcelona are going to be unstoppable with him there next season. He is just a fantastic player.

Once they grab Torres, Barca will basically be the Spanish national team plus Messi.

Is Harkes going to be calling color on the U.S. game? That guy is worthless. Watching these two games reminds me how much better I like Ekoku or McCoist on color commentary.

Man, Spain finally decided to show up.

You know what, despite the beautiful and skilled way Spain play, they sure like to crowd, intimidate, and whine at the ref. And Torres fucking sold that like a bitch.

From what I have heard he is scheduled to do all the US games.  :oh_i_see:

He is terrible.

Freddy Adu was born in Ghana. I'm almost happy for him they didn't include him in the (US) World Cup team. That would have been crazy.

The US has the easiest run to the final out of all the knockout pairings. Granted, I don't think they'll do it (they'll lose to Uruguay in the quarter), but they have a fantastic chance to have a strong/lucky game or two and BAM they're in touching distance of the weird gold lump.

God I love the World Cup, even more so when the US does well. It's the only time I feel like a normal person, because everyone else around me is talking about "soccer".

About Fernando...
(http://img13.abload.de/img/1277496422531i1sy.gif)

 :awesome_for_real: Chile probably deserved a red, but not that one. Utterly wtf.

Torres, I would love to be his son just to spit on his face when he gets home: "dad, you are a fucking diver! Shame!" *spit*

Eric Wynalda's wife disagrees.

That actually doesn't look like a dive from what I can see.  He was running, and the guy in the red shirt came up behind him.  The guy in blue's right leg got out in front of the guy in red, who's kneecap just barley hit his foot.  This pushed blue guys leg to the left so that when it came forward, it ran into the back of his left leg instead of going in front of him, causing the tumble.  That's what it looks like to me at least.

Ya, wasn't a dive. There is a better angle that clearly shows he was clipped. No need for a card there, but it wasn't a dive.

He totally leaped into the air and flopped on the ground. Yes there was contact, which was minimal and accidental. But his reaction to it was contrived and dishonest. If Cristiano Ronaldo or Gilardino did that, there would be pitchforks and stakes out for them. But it's Spain, who get the benefit of the doubt because they're supposed to be the team for the purists, the saints of football saving the modern game from pragmatism and drudgery.

Any game where you have to question the motives of a player after a "foul" is ridiculous, and I captained my damn team in it in high school.

Also I was a keeper, so fuck prima-forwards and their shit.

They need to just get over themselves and put in replay for good in soccer/football. We all see what happened after the fact, and is anyone punished? Nooooooo, it's part of the game.

(http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/1452/torresdive.gif)  :grin:

^ THIS. ^ It was a bitch foul, a free kick at best but definitely not dude's second yellow.

Now, Torres will go down on occasion (though he's no Italian). Of course, in the Premier League, he gets beat to shit and back, so I don't blame him for that. And he's with Liverpool, so fuck off - at least for the time being.

Barca with Villa will be fucking unstoppable. I look forward to seeing Real Madrid's big expensive tears in bigger expensive bowls full of tears this year. Unfortunately, it means Valencia is going to struggle mightily, especially if Silva goes to Chelsea or Man City.

That Chilean side is impressive.

It really did look like an accidental clip, I don't think any card was deserved (but I'm not really sure how they deal out punishment in soccer.  I'm assuming a yellow card is only given out for intentionally fouling somebody).

That gif that rk47 posted reminds me that, as the US government owns AIG now, we really need to change the corporate logo so we can make that soccer team display it.  Maybe USA with a crying eagle or something.  As a taxpayer (and thus, shareholder) I demand it!

Again, not a dive.  People don't seem to get that these people are running at full speed shifting around their body weight and making quick cuts. He clearly tripped himself up and there should be no foul, but that isn't a dive.

The story of Uncle Dino (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/id/5308513/ce/us/david-vanole-esophagus-saved-us-soccer&cc=5901?ver=us), who saved U.S. Soccer.

Yeah that second one is just a total faceplant, nobody is going to take a dive face first like that, they might actually get hurt.  :-P

point being there's no fucking way that's a yellow.

Going to get drunk now. I'm decked out in my outlaws gear. this should be fun! And by fun I mean either sheer ecstasy or heartache with a large amount of nerves thrown in.

South Korea-Uruguay should be interesting.  They both know the winner will face a winnable game against the US or Ghana.  I can't believe that quadrant of the bracket managed to avoid all heavyweights.  ANY of the four teams could believably hit the semis. 

WOW.  Beautiful second goal by Suarez in the 80th minute.  I don't think Korea can come back from that.

That game's a grind to be honest. I'm rooting for USA to be more exciting than that.

Unreal. Horrible turnover and crappy backline play.

Oh Jesus.

He should sub out Clark right now.

Yeah, he looiks too wound up.  They won't come back in this game with 10 men.

What shitty fucking defense.  They'll give up another one before the 20 minute mark if they don't change.

What's the deal in that group? Do they both need to win to go through?

Wat?

We're in the part where if you lose you go home now, lac. :)

If the U.S. just had a midfield, backline and finishers, they'd really have something.

We're past the group stages. Each match is sudden death.

The US need to at least equalise before the end of 90 minutes or they're out. I expect them to give it a hell of a good go in the second half, they have a history of extraordinary team spirit.

You expect so much! Hater.

At this stage everyone's eyes are filled with the inadequacies of their players. I'm sure many Ghanaian fans are just as worried.

They may be worried but ... Ghana just flat out looked better that first half.

Ah crap, I thought we were still in the group stages.
Well I'm a happy regardless of who wins then. I was hoping Ghana would survive the group stages because they were the last African team in the running and I was rooting for the USA because of the bad referee calls they had to endure.

And it's all open again.

Woot!

Coolly taken penalty.

So I know this makes me unamerican and whatnot, but I really would like to punch that Donovan guy in the face. I don't even know why.

That said, woot.  :awesome_for_real:

The US really is the comeback kid in this world cup. Guess that's why you have Clinton in the stands.

Glad he made the penalty. The foul should have been awarded with a red instead of a yellow card. Preventing a clear goal attempt with the goalie being last man.  

Donovan is now the all time top scoring American in a World Cup with 5 goals apparently.

Altidore needs to learn not to try to dribble through two guys.

5 min till the end of the second half and the US isn't even trying to set up plays. Looks like they're just trying to run out the clock. Ghana seems a tighter team.

Augh my univision thing keeps screwing up, I can hear the announcers but the pictures don't move augh.

wtb the ability to understand spanish pst

I noticed this too. Then I realised I was running flash 10.0 rather than 10.1. I upgraded and the glitching/hangs went away. YMMV

Will you look at that.

How on earth do you keep giving up goals with a 2 on 1 defender advantage?

Oho, I'll have to try that, I'm not sure if my flash player is behind or not.

also zomg ghana

Magnificent finish. Now it's time for America to dig deep.

The good with the bad is that there are still 25 minutes left.

About 5 mins left and they look tired, so very tired.

Yea, it's over.

Ghana were far and away the better team.

Bummer. 

You suck Bocanegra.

US had plenty of chances, and couldn't finish.

Hard luck chaps.

I have to say both teams really brought a wonderful element to the tournament. The game was sporting and compelling, football at its finest. Thank you USA, good luck Ghana, you've both been terrific.

Better team won, can't be too unhappy. Plus the Ghanans (Ghananians? Ghanaians? GHANA PEEPS) just look so happy, it's too adorable to not be happy for them.  :heart:

The main thing I've learned is that this US team just really can't string together 90 whole minutes of decent soccer, and don't even joke about MORE than that.

Ya, I'm not unhappy about the result. I was rooting for the US, but let's face it, Ghana kicked major butt right there. Aren't they like a nobody too?

They are the U21 World Champs, rough around the edges but a good pedigree. Also that was without Essien, so they aren't a soft touch.

Unlucky to the US just ran out of sparkle and that bit of luck.

Another bright side is now I can root for whoever the fuck I want!

It was an entertaining game, let's hope Super Sunday tomorrow brings some good footie aswell.

Ya, I think I'm gonna be rooting for Ghana now. Last African team in the first African continent World Cup, facing seriously stiff opposition. I love me some tough underdogs.

Tomorrow is gonna be interesting. England vs Germany at 6:30 am PST.

Bob Bradley realizing that Ricardo Clark is fucking terrible 30 minutes later than everyone else on the planet cost them the game. If they don't go down early they would have gotten some more counterattacking chances instead of having to chase Ghana all over the field. Bradley also missed the boat on Findley. Pace alone does not make a striker. The guy couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat. Should have been Buddle, with Gomez coming on as a super sub after Jozy tires from trying to beat 3 defenders with ball all the live long day.

Those 2 decisions were crucial. Bradley lost that game for them.

Looking forward- good christ I hope we have some young defenders that can play coming up- our back line is fucking clownshoes. Never pace-y, and now old to boot. Just a total shit show. Maybe this kid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Gonzalez)? They better get him a cap before Mexico convinces him to come play for them instead.

Uruguay is going to crush Ghana. 3-1.

The US really needs to go back to dribbling and passing school.

That first half was full of bungles in midfield.

Overall was a fun game to watch though.

Glad the U.S. made it as far as they did, but they need to get a few more players with better ball handling skills. And they REALLY need someone who can distribute the ball in the midfield.

Ghana/Uraguay should be a pretty good game.  Looking forward to tomorrow's killer doubleheader.  I'm thinking Messi is going to break out in this one.

Very tense and exciting match to watch despite US failings and it was a fair result with the better team winning. It's hard to complain.

But yes, US can't settle the ball and falls into stopping to pass. They're sorely lacking speed as well.

Well, poop.  Can't in any way say Ghana didn't deserve that victory, though.  We were stone cold outplayed.

Ah well, time to stop paying any attention to soccer for another 4 years.  Goodbye thread!

I think this is one of the few matches where a lot of people would've been happy with either team winning. Well played to both teams.

Rico clark is probably done for the nats. I can hope anyway.

I see the clipping now, but he still jumped as if electrocuted. I hate that shit.

1st goal was three players fault:

1. Clark, clearly.

2. DeMerrit, gave up too much ground, let the defender turn him and wasn't cutting off enough angle.

3. Howard, the striker should have had to beat him far post or with a wonder shot or deflection, 9 times out of 10 under less pressure Howard makes that save its too bad and I'm sure he wishes he could get it back.

As for Findley, he did miss their only clear chance in the first half but Buddle showed us nothing for the brief time he was on. I'm very saddened by all this, despite what all of you are saying they hardly got run off the pitch so much as the US really looked spooked under the pressure of the moment and the pressure of Ghana playing so far up which is really not how I wanted to see them go out.  There was far too much throwing away of the ball during essentially the entire game except for the 20 minutes leading up to the pk and it was done by the entire team as a unit.

Back to the drawing board but I see no reason that our strikeforce and midfield will not be better in Brasil then it was in Africa so now its just as others have said I prayer that somewhere there is an American playing left back who doesn't suck complete monkey ass though those four guys really did pull through and give us a fighting chance, with a little more luck, a little more finishing or a Howard having a spectacular game instead of his usual great games (he could have possibly made either one of those saves the first one he should have had, the second would have been a highlight reel amazing reflex save though maybe I'm asking too much of him since I didn't stick around to watch replays) and really by the 3rd and 4th game our defense was no longer the absolute worst defense in the tournament hands down without question which is a massive improvement.

*edit typo*

Ghana is going to have a tough game against Uruguay, since a few of their players will be out due to yellow cards.

Actually, they have a midfield. Bradley just can't figure out how to play them. They don't have any fucking WINGERS it seems. But if he'd started Feilhaber instead of Findley and Edu instead of Clark, they might have come out and gotten better possession to start the game. I can't figure out for the life of me why Findley was in the side to start 3 of the 4 games they played. He had no chemistry with Jozy - all he could do was run at the defender solo and miss shots. Clark was a similar head-scratcher. He did fuckall against England. Not having Onyewu really fucked our backline and it showed. At least he can defend. Bocanegra is just not a central defender. But for fuck's sake, how they continued to bang their heads against the central of that Ghana defense was irritating. I don't think Landon or Dempsey went wide once during that whole game. They just kept crowding the middle and getting shut down.

The whole team spent the first 30 minutes asleep. Their passing was slow and tentative, and they got caught in possession WAY too many times. Feilhaber changed all that, but he couldn't be everywhere. And Jozy, man he really needed some help to get those fuckers off of him.

Does this mean Univision puts a stream online of even the afternoon games on weekends when espn3 doesn't carry them? Or are you not using espn3 for a reason and nobody puts those online but the pirates?

He has a doucheface. His face, for whatever reason, begs to be punched. David Villa has the same kind of look.

Bradley looks like a decent all rounder, looks like hes at least trying to do intelligent things with the ball and his movement off it is good.

Where was the defense on that goal?  The goalie kicks it the length of the field and it just goes in 1v1?

This is just embarrassing to watch.

As an Australian, its making me feel a little bit less embarassed.

Of course, what the hell happened against Serbia?  Are there two German teams?

The comeback is on !!!!

I can't remember the last time I felt sorry for England. Tough, tough.

Holy hell Eng was robbed  :heartbreak:

They sure were. Awesome first half so far.

Now we are never again allowed to complain about Wembley in '66

Yeah, clearly having a video ref would break the flow of the game. what a load of shit. this is supposed to be the world cup.

Over Sepp Blatter's dead body.

At least this will get the discussion going again.

Wow.  Worst referee judgment of the cup so far.  That ball was a yard into the goal. 

Instant replay now.

Now I actually feel bad for England. I don't want my team to win like that.

Seriously, how much longer are we going to have to put up with this nonsense of disallowed goals? Even baseball accepted replays for home run calls, and I see nothing different about doing it for goals.

At least there is no excuse for this.  There is no, "it was a judgment call and I thought there was a foul" type reasoning that can come from the ref.  The only thing that can be said is that it was a huge mistake. 

Yeah, it wasn't subjective at all. England was totally jobbed and there is no reason for it.

Oh wow, good counter with a horrible goalkeeping decision.

EDIT: And 4-1 now, the wheels have come off England, and the Germans look like counterattacking masters.

Wow, England have just been over the place.

Horribly slow defense.

 :heartbreak:

No Doubts Germany have been the better team - England have been poor.

But , What would have happened if it had been made 2-2 and momentum completely changed what could have happened.

At least we can say this: if the score stands like this, England cannot say that they lost solely to a bad call.

All goes back to Green's error.  If England had the easiest quadrant, they could have (likely) handled Ghana and Uruguay.  With that kind of momentum and confidence, this game might've gone differently.

That was awesome hope Manchester United buy Ozil pronto he's seriously good. Gerrard was the main reason for all of Englands woes he was terrible in every game and he's supposed to be the captain. Lampard would have been a better choice.

Holy Shit! A watchable England football match in my world cup!

I do think a competent linesman would have made more than a 1 goal difference, but in the end England weren't going anywhere in the tournament (let alone beating Germany, Argentina, Spain, Brazil in sequence), so better for it to end in a bang.

But if going out isn't depressing, this is...

James
Terry
Ferdinand
Upson
King
Carragher
Cole
Warnock
Barry
Gerrard
Lampard *
Beckham
Crouch
Heskey
and probably Wright-Phillips, Defoe, Carrick, Hargreaves

Every fucker on that list is probably too old for the trip to Brazil. Rooney is the only decent player England have under 29.


* OK, this is a plus.

not that it matters but this was funny, Photographic proof the disallowed goal was correct.

It doesn't matter cause England were shit, but I think they really need to bring in a system similar to the Challenges they have introduced into Tennis.

Hey, I think all of us Americans and English are wrong for blaming the teams for the losses.

It is obvious that the real cause for the losses was Mick Jagger rooting for the teams from the luxury box!

They don't even need video replay, they just need a goal line official on each side. The problem is that linesmen are not in position to see those kinds of calls because of their responsibility for offsides. There is a reason American football has 7 officials on the field as so much of the game comes down to crossing various lines. Soccer at this level has no excuse for not parking 1 guy on each goal line.

True and in fact they tried that out recently, not sure why it's not being implemented.

I think it is because FIFA is still convinced that everything that needs to be seen on the entire field can be seen by one man at ground level.

I think it's mainly that fuckwit Sepp Blatter, Platini was trying to push for the video replay afaik.

Fuck you, no. They got more than enough good players. But then I don't expect Ozil to stay at Bremen very long.


No. HELL NO. While he certainly didn't have a great Cup, he was much better than Lampard who showed how useless he was in pretty much every game. I think part of the problem was that Gerrard was either in the midfield with Lampard (and they are too similar to be in a midfield together unless there's only 1 striker up top) or out on the wing where he's just not as good because he's constantly cutting into the middle instead of providing natural width. England's biggest problem was a shitty shit shit shit backline that also got no help from the midfield. Neither Barry, Gerrard or Lampard are worth much on the defense, and the backline was constantly exposed as being slow. Ferdinand and King wouldn't have helped because of their injuries, and Carragher is also way too slow to help that. Terry got caught out of position on at least two of the goals and Upson got beat on another. Neither Heskey or Defoe helped much and Rooney was constantly left without any service worth a shit. No one got wide and sent crosses into the box. The team was a mess tactically. The players were tense, and it showed, and I think part of it is that Cappello doesn't let the players play in the positions that maximize their potential. He's like Rafa Benitez in that - good when a team doesn't take advantage of their flaws, but horribly easy for good teams to expose.

My god the video quality on Univision's stream is so much better than I was getting on ESPN360 this morning.

I agree Gerrard should have been played in the hole from the start of the WC if they really needed him on the pitch, it's his best position. But Gerrard for me was the most out of form player in the squad his short passing was terrible and he linked up with absolutely noone, FIFA stats puts his short pass completion at something like 62% which is terrible for a midfielder at this level of play. Johnson was fairly dirt aswell. Defoe is great if you need to punish weak teams or as an impact player or when you need goals but not against a solid defense, even an out of form Rooney will give you more benefits over the course of the match. I agree with the lack of defense from Midfield which leads to the Scott Parker decision, he looked like the most in form defensive midfield option England had and they brought Carrick instead? That was probably the one thing that fucked everything up he might have been shit but he couldn't have been worse defensively than Barry and at least it would have given Cappello an option to switch things around.

Another bad call, but I actually think that ball was going in anyways.

And another example of where a video review of the goal would have not necessarily been a bad thing.

Tevez was way offside there.

Doh!

Ok.

That goal was sweet.

The expression on the two British nationalist fans with the bomber caps was priceless QQ. God Bless Univision.

That was really strange the linesman saw his mistake on the big screen and couldn't take it back. I wonder is Sepp Blatter watching this one aswell?

WOW!

That 3rd goal was serious business.

That was a damn amazing shot.

And latin american announcers on scores rock.

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!

Univision streams every single game. Which is pretty nice. Otherwise I watch whatever ESPN360 shows. Because I gots no TV.  :drillf:



Yeah, more officials would help, there's no good reason to still stick with just the three (plus the loser time keeper ref). Replay would still suck shit though.

Hooray, Mexico isn't going to be shut out!

\o,---<| BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

And Mexico puts a beut on the board.

Some good strikes in this game.

Oh, almost some Messi magic.

It would have been a nice bit of icing on the cake.

Was probably the most engaging game than I have seen so far.

That match was great. So far the knockout rounds are putting the rest of defensive-ugly-boring shit in the group rounds to bed early.

Headliine of The Korea Times English edition "Korea should have won"

Under that: "Korea exits World Cup gracefully"

Oh, Korea.

England stood a much, much better chance playing from a tie.  They don't have the speed to match the counterattacks of Germany so in order to go on the offensive they left themselves vulnerable.  It was a terrible call and was a tipping point for the match.

Ok, I knew I said I was done with the thread, but I felt I had to post this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8JGhoVybkM&feature=player_embedded#!

Netherlands is looking strong, but I still think it's going to come down to Germany, Spain, Argentina or Brazil.

Your opinion is bad and you should feel bad.

Bitterly disappointed with England. Not that we lost, but the way we lost.

I doubt we'll ever get the true story but we looked like a squad divided by dissension. We need less people looking to "take the game by the scruff of the neck", more people who can keep the discipline of playing the shape the manager wants.

I believe a lot of the turmoil came from Terry's belief that Cole was essential. You can argue the merits of Cole v Lennon v Wright-Phillips v Millner, they all have different qualities. But what's important is not fucking up the squad because you're too obstinate to accept you're not in charge.

I thought Capello did well trying to turn the "player revolt" around but you can see that against Germany the Chelsea players in particular had let it get to them. Terry had put them in an impossible position - they had to pick between club captain and national manager and it got to them. They decided not to back Terry but felt terrible about it and it showed in the game. Ashley Cole was shit, Joe Cole was shit, Lampard played at walking pace.

What I would like to see is the FA to continue with Capello, for the England squad to be gutted, for all the undroppable millionaire celebs who would rather second guess the manager than do what they are fucking told to do to be sent to the BBC studios to watch the next World Cup with Lineker. Just drop everyone over 25 years old and start over, building the team around Wayne Rooney.

I feel good actually, Gerrard sucked donkey balls the whole tournament, his decisions were terrible, his demeanour was terrible and his leadership was non existent. Also if my national teams spokesman was a dumb scouser who beats up DJ's for not playing their favourite record I would feel worse.

They'll all be gone next year.  They'll be too old, except Rooney.  Maybe he'll even be gone if he can't find his feet.  They can ditch Capello, too.  I wouldn't mind.

Yes please. Maybe the kids will be able to be taught how to hold the ball more than three passes before losing it too.

Here's a infuriating quote from Frank Lampard after the game, "It is the story of the game: nobody can stand here and tell me Germany were a lot better than us. They were not 4-1 better than us.".


In my bracket poll at work, I tipped Netherlands to make it to the final over Brazil. We'll see how Brazil play today, but I think the Dutch are going to sneak in under everyone's radar and make it through.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/id/5335440/ce/us/fifa-censor-stadium-replays

Fuck replay, we'll just censor the shit so no one will know...

 :uhrr:

It must be hard to see anything with FIFA having it's head this far in the sand.

FIFA hold the argument that the rules of football should be the same the world over and applicable in the local park game in the EXACT same way as in the World Cup.

No one would expect a kickabout game in a local league to have TV replacy facilities and therefore the world cup shouldnt  have one.

Using this argument of course floodlights shouldnt be used , Linesman arent nescessary and referees shouldnt be paid. 

That's not sand.  :awesome_for_real:

The Netherlands game was pretty static with some flashes of brilliance, and the same goes for Brazil. I love this Chilean side. They play football the right way, and I look forward to seeing them in the future. They just ran up against a much better team, but they never gave up attacking.

As for replay, FIFA is a bunch of fucking tools. There is nothing but obstinate idiocy stopping them from using replay. Hell, Rugby uses replay for tries at the ref's discretion, why can't FIFA restrict the use to JUST goals? Removing replay from the stadiums is the height of stupid. Instead, let there be a television match official for games in the leagues that can afford it, and let him review any goals that are made/disallowed. There would have been at least 3 goals awarded this tournament that may have made a difference. At the very least, adding that extra goal line ref like UEFA did for the Champion's League would help some of this. But the fact that the refs who see the replay in the stands CAN'T USE THAT EVIDENCE to change their call is ludicrous.

I still think it's going to be Spain in the final, and quite likely a Spain/Germany Euro '08 rematch.

Chile beats most of the teams remaining in this cup, but got matched with Brazil.

Brazil is a freaking monster again.

Impossible. The brackets are organized with them on the same half of it. At best, they'd face each other in the semis.

It's so silly that rather than fix the problem or just live with it they're going to pretend it doesn't happen.

This is like George Bush thinking, apologizing for getting caught instead of getting it wrong. According to FIFA the problem isn't that they blew a call but that spectators were shown that they blew a call.

I don't have a problem with using replay or not, I'm generally opposed to it in most cases. But if you aren't going to use it you have to live with the fact that some calls will be wrong and people will find out - trying to cover that up is inane.

That I agree with. I think replay would be terrible in soccer, but I definitely don't think trying to HIDE blown calls is the way to go. Own that shit, bitches! "Blown calls happen, it's part of the game!" Own it!

Bugger, you're right. Shame. Spain/Brazil then.

The "Television Official" route that Rugby uses in international and major professional matches I think is the way to go. In Rugby it adds very little downtime to the match (probably less than it takes for the team to clear the bench and pile up on each other as they do after every goal in soccer it seems) and in soccer they have a lot less of the slow-mo zoom in at multiple angles thing you need to confirm/deny a try in Rugby.

This seems apropos (http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/video-technology-confirms-england-are-very-bad-at-football-201006282855/)


 :heart: Dailymash

Blatter bends the knee (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/id/5338733/ce/us/sepp-blatter-says-fifa-reopen-file-replay?cc=5901&ver=us)

The time being wasted argument is bullshit, how much of the game is wasted by the ref being surrounded by angry players after a bad decision? As much as it would take to check the video replay I'd assume.

Although the refs have been mostly terrible, color commentary from John Harkes turns out to be even worse. I was writing an e-mail while he was speaking in the background and it turned into a suicide note.

Why is the early game always the boring one? The late games are always seemingly the better ones, or the ones I want to watch. But at 4:30am...  :uhrr:

Quite impressed by Suzuki Honda, looks very reliable with a great engine :rimshot:

Ooooooh, shoot out time!

Oh man, it would so suck to be the guy who blows the PK.

Yeah, I feel for Komano. Surprisingly, he didn't commit seppuku afterwards.

Too bad for Japan. I didn't watch any of the game until the end, but what little I say of that team impressed me.

Been there.  Bury your head in your hands and weep loud enough so you don't hear your teammates talking shit about you.

This is a highly entertaining half going on right now, not the least reason for which is the ref not buying Ronaldo's flops.

I don't know where to put this, and it's old, but kind of funny although horribly sexist.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3icksHJDjA8

Kick the ball at the goalie enough times and good things will happen  :awesome_for_real:

Kudos to Japan for getting as far as they did.  Now, all the countries I am interested in are out (US and Japan).  I have close to 100% German ancestry, but strangely I've never been able to muster any feeling of kinship with them. 

Pretty indifferent at this point as to who wins.

It will be nice to just see some quality football at this point.  Too many crap goals or crap non-goals have happened so far.  I probably am going to pull for Germany now.  They have a fast, youthful and enthusiastic squad, and I like that. 

Spain took care of business. I've got a new term for the type of football Portugal and Italy play... bitchball. Dive, whine, complain and do everything you can to keep the other team from scoring until the refs give you a penalty. Portugal obviously have talent besides Ronaldo, but I haven't seem them try much to use it. They played totally negative against Brazil and not much more positive against Spain. Torres is obviously rusty - the way he's playing is usually how he plays right after returning from an injury. Llorente was pretty damn good for such a neophyte. That Spain team is so stocked with talent it's not even funny. When you can leave young guys like Silva, Fabregas and Mata on the bench and still have enough talent on the field to stock a Barcelona team, you know there's something special out there.

Still not sure if they can beat the Germans or Brazil, but they are my pick.

With the US out I am pulling for Germany or Brazil. They have been (to me) the most fun to watch so far, so I'm hoping they meet in the final.

You have to play that way against Spain, its how the Swiss beat them and its the only hope anyone has of doing it. Spain has an experienced back line that throw questionably legal blocks in front of every attacker every time, hell that is basically the only thing Puyol has left that old fucker. There were way more blatant fouls on Ronaldo that weren't called then there were straight dives. He was very stupid however to not adjust to the fact the ref wasn't going to give him a call for being screened from the ball and he needed to fight through the defender instead of going down so easily.

Japan and South Korea really showed the world something in Africa. They took the best free kicks we have seen so far and played fun to watch and smart football throughout both teams will be missed.

re: FIFA
Did you guys not read the post that explained their stance? They want the rules of the game to be simple enough that everyone can follow them. Replay is not. I'm a big proponent of adding more refs to world cup games as it doesn't change the rules just acknowledges that at higher levels the game is harder to ref (it is) the same way that rec games are ref'd without linesmen because the skill level and speed makes the job easier. We need a linesman next to the goal on the other side of it from the linesman on that half to call things like Lampard's goal, Henry's handball, Fabiano's handballs etc.

As for showing replays on the big screen, do I need to remind people just how violent soccer fans can be? Seriously? You don't want a bunch of ultras to know that the call was just blown unless you think the ref deserves to die for missing a call.

Neither is the offsides rule as it's called (or not called, or called badly as is usually the case).

Yes it is. It is just literally a split second matter of inches that requires you to be aware of exactly when the ball is played and be in position to see down the line and make the judgment. The calls like on Tevez v Mexico that get blown are because so much shit has happened in the box in such a short time the linesman gets out of position or loses track of when the ball was played. If there was an additional linesman who's job was to track the bang bang shit in the box the sideline guy could focus on just getting offsides right in those situations.

See, when you post things like this in a sports context, I really have to just assume you're trolling. We can debate replay on how it affects the speed of the game, the historical purity, or even where it should be applied.

However, there isn't a single addition of replay in sport that hasn't made the game fairer and less complicated. You default to the field call if it's 50/50. Done.

The THEORY of the offsides rule is simple. The way it's actually called though? Total shit, completely inconsistent and not at all simple. Hell, it's not even called like the laws of the game says (i.e. the attacker gets the benefit of the doubt).

Lack of replay isn't the problem. Lack of refs is. It irritates the hell out of me to hear guys in the booth on ESPN to be lobbying for replay because they know better. The sport's biggest advantage is simplicity in play and rules which is something that replay would hinder. Getting convoluted is not the way to go.

The issue has less to do with fairness and more to do with concerns at the lowest levels of the sport, where money isn't directly involved. Until junkyard games start getting replay, it's not going to happen.

More refs please.

American football has 7 referees, and they still constantly miss things. FIFA needs to add at least 3 more- 1 on each byline on the side of the goal opposite the linesman (ideally they would be in raised seat behind the goal ala a tennis judge or hockey goal judge, but that would never happen), and a second on field ref that roams the park in the opposite diagonal from the head ref.

Unless you're Argentina.

The NHL only had one ref for a long time, and it was a stupid system. They added two refs, and things got better, but they still had replay on goals.

When goals are even rarer in soccer, it makes zero sense not to have a replay official. People can argue until they are blue in the face about human error as part of the game, but only baseball and FIFA are fighting the tide and they are losing.

I mean can you imagine taking replay out of NFL football right now? It has shown that the amount of calls missed by even 7 well-placed officials is simply staggering.

Here's a great article talking about the problem's with England's system:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0629/1224273557820.html

FIFA believes that part of the reason it is the world's game is the simplicity of the rules and of play. Replay runs contrary to all of this. The point that the world cup is a big enough deal to have replay is valid but I think its a simpler and better idea to add more refs. I'm not trolling I have played the game throughout my life in a variety of places and skill levels and I have at least been a linesman and center ref for some games though nothing at anywhere near even class 1 tournament level you weekend warrior types who don't give a fuck about football and only are interested once every four years telling the world the game is run wrong and should be more like hockey? Ehl oh fucking ehl.

FIFA calls the rules of football "simple", but there are very few areas where the rules of football aren't quite gray.

Ball going over the line (out of bounds or goal) and hand balls are the only non-judgment calls made by the referees.  So it's not quite as simple as FIFA would like it to be.

My point is that trying to pretend a game with the kind of money and media attention that the World Cup or any of the top tier leagues is played the same as it is at the park level is ludicrous. It's NOT the same, no matter how you try to make the rules the same and pretending it is otherwise is only cheapening the game that is meant as an ambassador to the world (i.e. the World Cup). FIFA would rather pretend their refs can't make mistakes or be subject to criticism than look at possible ways to use technology to improve the game at the highest level. A good compromise is the UEFA addition of the extra refs, but I think in an event as big as the World Cup, treating it the same way you do sandlot games is an insult to the fans and the players.

Compared to what exactly? Lets put it this way, to learn the actual rules of the game takes you about 10 minutes of reading time. To learn how to properly enforce them and not be fooled by players takes a lifetime but so what?

The game has been through severely abject changes throughout it's 150 year history, introducing technology wouldn't even compare to the paradigm shifts football has gone through.  It wasn't until the offside rule was changed to the one we know now did football start hitting the mainstream and it also make a huge impact on tactics and how the game was essentially played. Pre the rule (1924) teams used to play formations like 1-2-7 and 2-2-6 and the game was basically like Rugby with a round ball and using your feet to run with ball, amazing thing was after the introduction the goal per game ratio went up despite teams playing slightly more orthodox formations like 3-2-5 and 3-3-4.

Anyway FIFAs complete unwillingness to implement technology stems from them thinking that controversy should rule the sport more than the enjoyment of the game itself. It has little or nothing with them try to keep the purity of the game intact, they reckon controversy sells papers and keeps Football the number one sport.

It's a bit telling that most of the major, moneymaking sports in the US are going to video review.  And very, very good refs make bad calls.

Yeah, it's just know-nothings, rite? There's no international call from the players for replay that FIFA is ignoring.  :oh_i_see:

What's just as or even more telling is that Tennis which is steeped in history and tradition has easily shifted into the modern era. In fact it has enhanced the tactical element of the sport as each player gets 3 video challenges per set. If they use up the challenges too early the onus is then shifted on to the player even if the officials make a mistake, or you could say the player is to blame for wasting their challenges and the official is somewhat reconciled.

Hah.  Yeah, and video replay won't interrupt play any more than some of these idiots writhing around in pain from perceived slights.   :drill:

Or what I've taken to calling "The Chelsea Huddle." You know, when all 11 players on the team surround the ref like he's a piece of meat after he's just shown a yellow to a player committing a foul so obvious it could be spotted from orbit.

That is what they should be using video replay for. Hand out cards after the game for simulation if replay clearly shows you weren't touched or that your greatly embellished minimal contact. It is a deliberate attempt to deceive the referee and gain an advantage, which is obviously cheating. Also it is the cuntiest of behavior and the quicker it is drummed out of the sport the better. Especially if you want NASCAR fans to tune in more than once every 4 years.

Do they even want Americans to tune in? I was pretty sure FIFA had a fuck-you attitude to us and our money.

If you want NASCAR fans to tune in just introduce fighting like hockey.  That would actually take care of a good deal of the flopping, now that I think of it......

How is having a way to review goal related calls at the highest level of the sport somehow making it so the "world cannot play the game"?

Last time I checked, no pee-wee football league in the US has 7 officials or instant replay. No high school tennis team plays on a court with a cyclops machine monitoring boundary lines.

The higher the stakes, the more tools the officials need to make the correct decision. The linesman and referee in the Mexico/Argentina match were both obviously upset after the Tevez goal was replayed on the big screen. But they had no option within the existing officiating regime but to uphold the call as it was on the field if they had wanted to change it.

Soccer's ruleset is simple enough, and the area of focus that replay would need to cover in goal award/disallowal is so small, that it makes almost no sense why they would not have implemented some form of quick review process by now at the professional and international level.

I remember the hue and cry when they first used the cyclops at Wimbeldon and how it was "taking away from the game" yadda yadda. But that faded pretty fast and as others have noted, they have increasingly been adding technology to assist the officials at the highest levels of the game.

(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/85685/horn.jpg)

 :drill:

 :Love_Letters: to the air-zela inventor.

After professionally dealing with the FIFA types for nearly a decade now I can say that they are dead opposed to any rule changes or technical systems. They have shot down any proposed system. Tracking of the ball (invented by a german company), goal line technology to detect if the ball is over the line, goal cameras, another official, anything. A lot of people have sunk a lot of money into making the game less suceptible to bad calls and the FIFA has always shot them down.

They always get back to to points of which only one is valid.

1. They don't want to interrupt the flow of the game. Any interruption stalls the game and might the teams cause to lose momentum. That's actually a valid complaint because it's one of the attributes of football. Football with interruptions and time outs wouldn't be football anymore something a lot of you don't seem to understand.

Interrupting the game to review calls could seriously fuck up the play on the pitch and might be used by the teams to disrupt the opposing teams territorial play and strategy on and off the ball. Something the teams already try to do now by tactical fouls, dives, back passing to the goal keeper and so on. Rules regarding passing the ball back to the goal keeper and offsides have been especially created to stop that shit as has the rule that injured players have to be treated off the pitch while the game resumes.

But there are measures that wouldn't do that to the game the FIFA is also opposed to because of reason 2:

They want a single set of rules that are valid for all leagues, from the third rate minor league in some godforsaken town to the premier leagues. Only premier teams would be able to afford the additional measures so they argue that you'd have a different game if you play there than you would have in the second or minor leagues. I think it's bullshit but it has been the stance of FIFA for nearly two decades now. All officials that don't subscribe to that line are politically isolated (see Platini).

I suppose that the real reason is that they want a certain amount of uncertainty and potential for abuse. If you look closely who has the most influence on FIFA decisions than you don't wonder why that might be.

You obviously have never heard of the "Chelsea Huddle".

Every Goal is followed by a minute of players celebrating, they can't fit a review in that window?  :why_so_serious:

Yes, I can understand flow-of-the-game arguments if they also tacked on delay-of-game penalties every time a player flops, or argues with a ref, or celebrates excessively.  Except they don't.

For some reason, it's perfectly okay to interrupt the flow-of-the-game if you're being a doucebag, but not to make sure the "right" call was made.  That I do not understand in the slightest.

This.

Well I said that in the next sentence after the one you quoted.

Well what are refs supposed to do, red card the entire team? That would really open up the flow of the game. Create a record for highest score in a world cup match too (unless it was Beckham shooting at the goal  :drill:)

The don't penalise it but that's what aditional time is for.

Adding on time doesn't remotely correct all the time-wasting late in games with goalies walking to kicks, trading off throwins, taking forever to milk the clock. Sorry, but I'm not buying the argument that football has to be free-flowing to be football. All it has to have is a ball, two goals, and some dudes. The current rules or lack thereof, reward the worst behaviors while espousing the fact that it's the beautiful game.

I'm not sure why a review of a goal situation should interrupt time at all, in most instances.  If they call it a goal and the player was offsides, why does play need to stop to remove the goal from the scoreboard? 

Which they can certainly add on to the end of the game for any stoppages in time due to replays. That's why I suggested a TMO like Rugby has. Put someone in a booth with a shitton of cameras, someone who is not subject to the on-field pressure of the Chelsea Huddle, who can review the goal footage in a 2-minute period and relay goal/no goal to the ref. If he can't figure it out in 2 minutes, fuck it, move on. For something like the England goal, there wasn't much doubt. You could sink that shit with one good look at the replay. By the time the players have finished cunt flapping at the ref, the decision is made correctly.

Shit, games lose more time and momentum to Italian Play-Acting than could be lost to replay. I understand about momentum, but again, there's plenty of things that skirt the edge of the rulebook to disrupt momentum.

I agree in principle with both reasons, but they're hard to swallow when you look at things in reality. Most of the leagues I've played in (waaaaaay down beyond anything resembling professional levels) are lucky enough to even have a linesman. Sometimes we'll just make do with two refs (one in each half), or no linesman at all and just the one guy running around trying to judge what happened. It's not like our fields are always the proper dimensions either, I've played on nearly square fields crammed into the outfield of a baseball diamond. There's so much flexibility to the letter of the laws for the rest of the us that this idea of purity and equivalence of rules is just silly and obstinate.

That said, I think technology should be used *only* for goal verification. Offsides calls are regularly blown, and introducing reviews of those would be the thin end of the wedge to screwing the whole game up with delays, challenges, and expansion into reviewing everything else on the pitch.

Still a slippery slope. What about goals by someone offsides?

Let's tag all the players so we can check their global positioning at all times on the pitch!  :tinfoil:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100701

Makes points on both sides of the current ref debate we have going on. Also if you don't read Simmons you should and I hate basketball but its still worth it. The end made me tear up a little.

"No gimmicky team names like the 'Heat' or the 'Thunder.' (You know what the announcers call Germany? The Germans. I love this.)"

That's a gem.

Yeah, that's a pretty solid Simmons article right there. The comments about him being the Soccer Manchurian candidate were really funny.

I am so glad the NBA season is over so I can start reading his stuff again.

Dan Loney over at bigsoccer with the soccer/nerd combo  :drill: (http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/blog.php?b=9414)

Oh man that killed me, bravo.

There is a Spanish person in your way.  :awesome_for_real:

Awesome.

Write The Future Reedited (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fgRvpbYkc8&feature=player_embedded)

Both the video and the writeup were fucking hysterical.

Here we go again. After a dominant first 50 minutes and a goal Brazil's keeper has generously gifted the Dutch a goal. Julius Caesar was less than imperious when he tried to punch a Schneider cross.

Brazil 1 - Holland 1. Shaping up to be a great last half hour.

2-1 dutch??

 :ye_gods:

Didn't see that coming.

I always fancied the Dutch myself, lots of experience and Sneijder / Robben combo is pretty deadly. Shame though I enjoyed Brazil up to this point.

Holland deserves that goal. Bastos is playing like a fucking douchebag and should have been sent or taken off by now.

bah. my post got blocked by the "a new reply has been posted"

Great second half. Well deserved to Holland. I never thought I'd say that.

Brazil deserve to get out. One own goal and their nerves are shot.

Since I did what you did and who knows maybe more, am I allowed to say the game is run wrong?


About technology and lower leagues, it's all bullshit. First of all, you don't have official linesmen in Italy until semi-pro, around 17 years of age. Second, don't pro football refs and linesmen have a headset and a microphone to facilitate communication between them, apparently to make better calls? Sticking against replays is just ridiculous at this point.

I think most people in this thread know a fair amount about football. Besides the beautiful game should look great to everyone, not just anoraks.

Anyway well done Holland. At this stage in the tournament I'm reduced to supporting Liverpool players and English referees. I thought Dirk Kuyt had a blinder. And hopefully Howard Webb will get the Final.

That was a sweet bender. One of the few in the entire tourney.

Uruguay look a bit susceptible without their two main defenders.

Holy hell!

Holy shit. Wow.

 :popcorn:

Heartbreaker for Ghana. Really should have taken it.

Ghana :((((((((((

I feel bad for Ghana, but those guys looked like they'd never taken a PK in their life.

So sorry for Ghana and Gyan and the other players who missed.

It was a marvellous match.

Kinda sucks that an intentional handball to prevent a goal can end up saving them through to the next round.

At least the ref saw it and not having Suarez is a major handicap in the next game.

So sorry for Gyan too.

Why are you guys feeling sorry for Ghana? Those fuckers beat the US.

Edit: you US guys that is

It doesn't really matter whether Uruguay have Saurez or not, because if they play the way they played against Ghana, they will lose to the Oranje.

Yeah Trippy, that's the attitude -  you want the people who can beat your team to lose to other teams. That'll make the US look better. ;)

I have faithfully set my TiVo for every single World Cup match, avoided coverage until I got home, and then enjoyed the games unspoiled. Until today. Fucking forgot to set it, and missed getting to watch two incredibly dramatic games unspoiled. FUCK.

Good news is I am about to walk out the door and begin my 3 day weekend. Yay.

I thought the miss by Mensah was the worst of the three missed kicks by Ghana, dude took one step and basically passed it to the keeper.

He's a Stanfurd fan, you can't expect his rooting decisions to be logical.  :wink:

Don't personally care much about Ghana vs. Uruguay but I'd like the Ghanians to have won.

Love the fact the fact the Dutch won though - best team in the world that has never won a WC. Not saying they will either, Argentina/Germany will be fearsome and Spain is still ranked #1. But damn that was a tense last half and had me cheering for Orange.

EDIT: Oh and thanks for the Simmons link. Am in Belize with very unstable WiFi so am being choosy on what I bother to click as any click may be the last for the night. Great quotes in that though - "And again … what's wrong with MORE sports? Like you'd be furious if there was another USA-Canada gold-medal hockey game in 30 months?"



heheh.

Just watched the replay of the second game. Man, Ghana got fucking robbed.

A hero to his nation, but a cheater to the rest of the world. I can't blame him for it, celebrate Humanity imo. This world cup's special.

I'm now forced to root strongly for the Dutch.  :ye_gods:

Kinda off topic but found this cool montage of players who scored the winning goals on world cups throughout the years.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/gallery/2010/may/29/worldcup2010-worldcup2006?picture=363061636

That's pretty cool.


No wonder they've never won.

Germany versus Netherlands final? 

Go germania

Germany really exposing Maradona's "we don't need defenders" strategy.


EDIT: Now it's just ugly.

Scwheinsteiger  :heart:

Germany has one of the best counterattacking offenses I've ever seen.  They have a stout D and a ton of speed, which makes them really fun to watch.  I am going to pull for them to win it just because I really like this style of play.  

I have this vision of Maradona right now, which comes right out of the movie Airplane:  "I picked a bad day to stop snorting coke off of transvestite hookers' asses........"

YEAH!  :awesome_for_real: amazing! Best German Team of the Decade SURELY!

(http://www.abload.de/img/1278171883012cxxw.jpg)

Har har har! My works pool just got effed right up. If Spain goes out it's over, someone will win based on second round results.

Hey guys, lets make our manager a total egomaniac that pissed his talent away on coke and hookers. What could go wrong?  :why_so_serious:

I was with a friend and we passed a TV screen and I've never seen someone turn white so fast when she saw the score.  :grin:

Germany vs Spain will either be an incredible game to watch or too stupid to watch. I look forward to it.

I dunno, 20 minutes in, Spain's playing sleepy and Paraguay's defending nicely.

Crazyness!

The BBC commentator just claimed 22.6 billion people watched the final 4 years ago. It's almost as if they make these numbers up!

Looks like a gritty job well done for Spain. As for Germany - wow, just wow. Looks like England only losing 4-1 (4-2 really) might have been a better result than we felt at the time.

Agreed this German team has really been underestimated by most people including myself. I always felt Lahm left a lot of space behind him, but now his runs look a lot more intelligent, which is not what I would say about his opposite number for Spain, Ramos. Spain look a bit shaky at the back, what was Pique thinking there?? They looked a whole different prospect when Fabregas was introduced for Torres and Villa pushed forward. Will be interesting to see who performs on the night between Xavi and Schweinsteiger, footballing genius on display.

Will be great to see Torres not starting after all these attempts to get him fit.

Yeah, that was a terrible set of PK's. I felt really bad for Ghana, as they looked to be punching well above their weight the whole tourney. But even without Essien, they showed they have a helluva lot to look forward to.

About those PK misses? The Spain game tonight shows that even the top level players can shit the bed on PK's. Of course, why Alonso's second take at the PK didn't lead to another penalty for taking out Fabregas, I don't know. That ref sucked monkey balls. I'm not sure Paraguay deserved their penalty, but they sure deserved it more than Villa for the penalty he won. And seriously, if the Villa one was an actual penalty, shouldn't the player who pulled him down have gotten a red card for being the last defender on a goal-scoring opportunity? Paraguay still played their asses off and should be quite proud of that game - other than the PK miss.

Germany... holy fuck, what do you say? An absolute masterpiece of domination over Argentina. Messi never got in the game, they didn't take the chances they got, and when Germany got ahead, it was over. That team is top to bottom even better than I thought they were, and I thought they were a lock for 2nd place. With the form Spain is showing, I'm not entirely sure they can beat Germany, but goddamn, it'll be a better game than the final.

Brazil fell the fuck apart after that first goal. I'm glad the scorekeepers changed their mind this morning and gave it to Sneidjer. Cesar should have cleared his own man out to get to that ball, but it was going in whether it got a touch or not. The second goal was well deserved, and the red card was one of those what the fuck are you thinking moments.Brazil's first goal and the shot Kaka made that got saved were the last bits of class that team showed. After that, the Dutch just grabbed hold of the game and deserved the win.

EDIT: Torres definitely shouldn't be starting for Spain. He's not anywhere near 100% fit, which you could tell from the first game he got on. It's not like Villa can't hold that single striker position himself, he did it all the time for Valencia. They've still got Fabregas, Silva, Pedro, Navas, Llorente or even Mata that could start if they needed another body. There are very few club or international teams in the world where any one of those players wouldn't start.

I hate to be a team flopper - but Germany has shown up with the only team I can say I believe is a champion team after spending many hours watching these matches. Fucking amazing play by the germans.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXjv3F5XipE

If you forget about the official rule (Law 12 ugh) there's a good argument for referee discretion, if the foul is accidental then a penalty and a yellow card should be compensation enough. The odds of the player scoring from that position under pressure is about the equivalent of scoring a penalty ,although this WC has proved different, been some really bad penalties. Law 12 should be amended to include the word deliberate as it's t0o open to interpretation and you can't have players sent off for a mere clip of the heels or something innocuous that leads to a penalty.

I agree the retake for encroachment was silly though.

Holland seem in control so far.

{edit} And just as I hit enter Holland makes it 1-0 against Uruguay  :grin: