f13.net

After being laid off for 9 months from work, I decided to try my luck on part time customer service industry. It was quite a short assignment, the job briefing and training took me around 1 week. I suffered no ill effects. Until the real work begins. I don't know how to describe it, but the work environment is very, very crowded. With around hundreds of people crowding the service center, demanding to be lead to the right counter or service on their products. At times, I was forced to escort some customers to another place, around 5-10 minutes walk away because the queue's getting worse. The soles of my feet ached like hell after work ends from all the standing up and walking. I was fine mentally at work, coping with the stress and stuff. But when it comes to sleep, I suffer a hell lot of grief.

I would see my workplace all over, again and again in my sleep. I would wake up sweating from the mental stress. At times I know I could wake up any time I want, but kept my eyes close trying to get much needed sleep. But every time I close my eyes, it just kept replaying the stress at work, fucking me up. After the peak period ended, it went away. I could sleep without worry, but eventually the employer said my part time work ended since the PC Show is over. Then I went to look for another job. Perhaps full time.

This time, it's a tuition center for kids. The first interview zipped by, and I was briefed with what I needed to do and I know deep inside I'm probably fucked if I ever take this job. 5-8 kids at once for 9 hours daily, demanding attention, education, and improvement on their schoolwork. I only went for this interview cause a friend recommended me. Finally,the guy said 'You're an OK guy, we'll call you back once we review some more'. I take that as 'You won't hear from us again' and went to look for another job. But they called again this morning and said I should come back on another day to 'observe' how a teaching is done. For 6 hours. 4 Classes. 4 Different subjects. On Saturday. Unpaid.

FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU------ my mind cried. I started sweating like hell. I couldn't say no at that moment. Fuck. It's past midnight, I don't think I can get much sleep tonight.

So, what's actually wrong with me? Am I having trouble handling stress? Am I crazy?

Your dreams are a way to deal with the stress. I think it'd probably be much worse if you WEREN'T dreaming of work. I've had those kinds of dreams hit me twice in my life, where I would literally be at work in my dreams. The first was my first "real" job working behind the seafood counter at a grocery store while in college. I was working until midnight at night and going to school in the morning, and it was pretty grueling physical work for someone my scrawny size. I would literally wake up putting shrimp in a bag - as in I was actually physically going through the motions of putting shrimp in a bag. The second was when I worked at the local paper putting up their website. That one was because the job was horribly stressful and the hours right up until we got the site live was 16 hours a day, 7 days a week and longer.

Sounds like you should take the job for the money, but have a constant eye on another job.

Damn man, that sucks. Sounds like stress or something, but I'm far from qualified to comment on this sort of thing. Can you go to a doctor?

Kids aren't so bad!  :grin:

Honestly, unless you really love that sort of thing, go away. I know people who thought they did (and not to be sexist, but they were nice girls and had that sort of instinctual caretaker thing more than the average dude does.... and yey they flipped out into crazy versions of that landlady from Kung Fu Hustle). Get a job sitting in a refrigerated room handling rack servers or something. Or something equivalently... private? .. for awhile maybe.

Sounds like there's two issues here:

First and foremost, getting enough sleep/rest to stay mentally healthy.

And secondly, wether you'd enjoy teaching kids.

The first you may want to see someone about if its a daily issue and you're not getting your 6+ hours every night.

The second, you should just go and see what its like on Saturday. Doesn't sound like you'll be asked to commit right then, and if after a few hours you know for a certainty that you'd murder the little shits, you can just thank them for the oportunity and high tail it back to bed.

I recommend some exercise, nothing like cardio to help you sleep better.  Also make sure your diet doesn't suck balls.  Finally you can try drugs, I find a glass of scotch makes me sleep like a baby, there are also pills you can take though its very easy to get dependent if you go that route.

I had a dream last night that someone (with some kind of authority, dunno if it was a cop or not) was tasing my best friend over and over and I was standing there but felt paralyzed and he kept grabbing like a better more painful taser and doing it again and finally I woke up.  Dreams are fucked.

You have your health and your youth. It helps to keep things in perspective, you didn't grow up in North Korea or the Slums of Mumbai, you could also be missing a limb or have a terminal disease. There's not point in freaking out about anything, because in the long run most of it doesn't really matter.  What matters is staying sane, just go with the flow and don't let things get to you.

GTFO.

I say this as someone uniquely capable of working in the industry without getting really stressed but still willing to take an axe to 90% of the customers. I probably could have kept going if GoDaddy weren't the most horrible place on Earth. Hell, I lasted 3 years longer with Best Buy.

Your current work situation is probably affecting your stress levels - if your finances are tight, you might feel pressured to take (and stay in) a job you hate. As Haemish says, take the job, and look for something else while you're doing it. Remember, unless they're making you sign a contract in blood, you don't have to stay. You've had a bad experience with one, and it may be that is causing extra anxiety with the school position - just remember, you can walk away. Personally it helps me if I pick out aspects of a situation I am worried about to think about positively and concentrate on - whether it be meeting new people, or developing myself. Anxiety grows if you focus too much on it.

Changing jobs is stressful at the best of times - doesn't sound crazy to me.

And on that note, leaving GoDaddy and being broke for nearly a year was the best thing I ever did for my mind.

Yeah,I'll think it over (but most probably skip that 6 hr observation shit, I'll just politely tell them I'm not capable enough), I might sign up on a security (guardslol) course next week or something. Long hours yes, but at least I have my sanity intact, instead of going to the bookstore and catch up on grade school maths while marking horrible stories written by 6th graders.

No one wants to be a middle school teacher in any fashion.  Elementary kids and High School kids are relatively fine, but middle school is like Lord of the Flies.  If you aren't a placid person (and I mean like Ghandi after a doobie) you want to stay the fuck away from middle schoolers.  Unless you like the idea of going to jail for mass murder.  It may seem all right at first, but they're just luring you in for the kill.  That "we'll call you back after we review" thing was only because they'd probably scare you away if they jumped on your ass too fast. 

Be afraid.

For a year after working the bartender/server industry I would wake up with nightmares of having 20 tables and no one to help.

You're mental, but not because of this.

I used to have dreams of unloading boxes when I was doing it for a living. For the first three months or so. I used to pick my girlfriend up and throw her out of the bed.

Harsh. Stress like that is a nasty, nasty thing. I went through a nasty bout of it myself as the last job I had was ending.

Although, I don't think you're crazy or anything. You just don't like dealing with people like that and I'm pretty sure that's common, too. Customer service can be a pretty stressful place, and so can dealing with children - more so around that age. Tack on the stress from being laid off, and you have a recipe for exactly what you are going through right now.

When it comes down to it, if you need the job, then go to the interview. However, I think it is safe to say that you are not going to enjoy it, just based on what you said with this post. It'll be too reinforced within your mind that you'll basically hate it - and I know how that goes. That said, if you need the work, you probably shouldn't just say no, even if it is something that you won't enjoy. I hate giving advice like that, but... pragmatism demands it. Just plan for the future and try to accept the present. That might even help, when you see a goal to work toward, it might help to motivate you and make your current situation feel not so bad.

Are you a social cripple?  I think this stress will be good for you.  You should keep subjecting yourself to it.  You need to feel comfortable around people.  If you want to strengthen your hands, you don't wear gloves, you get callouses.  And if you want to avoid disease, you don't bathe in Purell. 


Perhaps you could go to the Doc and get some anti-anxiety meds, but you need to be able to handle dealing with people without having a mental meltdown.  I'm not saying dealing with 8 stupid kids is a walk in the park, but it's not normal to suffer this much anxiety about something like that.

When I worked as a chef (sous-chef, really, but it was a small place where you had to do a lot of different jobs: I'd bake 150+lbs. of bread in the early morning, prep for lunch, keep us going through lunch, sell gourmet meats and cheeses in the mid-afternoon and then do some prep for the next day before closing; every couple of weeks, I had to supervise putting together a big catering order), I'd sometimes get that feeling of anxiety about the next day that might seep into my dreams. I kind of liked the work, and my boss was a nice guy. I think some of the anxiety was a feeling that I never knew what the next day would bring, beyond some rough expectations (e.g., Saturday was always crazy, Tuesday was usually quiet). Maybe it would be a crazy bad day, maybe it would be calm. Maybe a new dish I was making wouldn't work quite right and there we'd be, fucked with an hour to lunch. Maybe everyone would like something I was trying to add to our repertoire. (We didn't have a fixed menu, we'd do four different things every day and put it up on the blackboard).

So I think any job where you're dealing with a lot of customers or people and have no control over your schedule, your experiences, your passage of time, produces a kind of anxiety that's hard for some people to take. I know that once I got into a career where I had a lot of control over the kind of work I did at any given time, and a lot of built-in autonomy, I stopped having that kind of anxiety. (Other kinds, maybe, but that's a different issue.) If that's what's eating you, it's a signal to try to find something, anything, that has a different kind of flow of time involved.

I would probably ignore 'lol you need to toughen up' type comments. Stress can have pretty serious long-term health effects. If you do take one of these jobs, see if they have any kind of coverage for mental health stuff and check into it.

You can ignore the "toughen up" comments, sure.

But toughening up helps. It's obviously more important to find a job you actually like.

Toughening up is one thing when you're 25 and another when you're 45, really. I think when you're in your 20s, you can often endure a long period of total shit if you have some other part of your life that is compensatory and fun or you have some reasonable hope that you're enduring the shit in order to get to the good stuff. When you hit mid-life, somebody telling you to just tough it out is more like being told that not to worry, you'll be dead soon anyway. Which is the point at which a lot of mid-life men blow their brains out, buy a sports car and wreck it, or otherwise self-destruct. It's all relative to circumstance. "Tough it out" in something that's dead-end, without some compensatory life, without some vision, is probably bad no matter when, but at least in your 20s, you can still reasonably think that something different will come along.

You crazy people and your jobs!  Look what they do to you!

I wasn't being a dick.  This guy isn't slogging it out in a high stress occupation.  He's tutoring small groups of teens and escorting customers around a sales floor.  It sounds like he has an anxiety disorder over dealing with people.  So, he can be a hermit, sure.  Or, he can suck it up and fucking fly right by getting some meds and trying to overcome this disability.  It's really the only option unless you're a misanthrope with zero ambition.  I'm always amazed when I give the most common sense advice on this fucking forum and people dispute it like there's a reasonable alternative.  I mean sure, the guy could work the graveyard shift somewhere so he'll never have to deal with anyone ever.  But that's lame in every respect.


Anxiety is fear.  You don't face your fears by hiding from the world.  You confront that shit, and if you need prescription strength help to do so, then so be it.  Life is too short for this.

There are plenty of interesting, compelling people in recent world history who've done alright by themselves by avoiding or minimizing things that make them anxious rather than getting medicated and confronting it head-on. I mean, there's nothing abnormal or crazy about introversion, for example. It is what it is. Here's a nice essay by Jonathan Rauch (successful writer, speaker, think-tank wonk) on introversion, which is not shyness, it's just about where you get your energy from and how you deal with that. http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200303/rauch

Being introverted and having crippling anxiety from dealing with people are not quite the same thing.  But I understand what you're saying I think.

That happened to me when I had the surprisingly stressful job of being a ride operator in the kiddy park section of the local theme park. In my dreams I would have to wrangle kids and check their seat belts over and over and over and over and over and then I'd start the ride and some kid would manage to get out of his seat belt and all the parents would scream at me and it was awful. At least it sounds like you recovered from it once the stress went away, I've been a terrible sleeper ever since.  :awesome_for_real:

It does sound like you might have some sort of anxiety problem. There's no harm in talking to a doctor about it, and you probably should.

Stress is a funny thing.  When you’re super busy enjoying yourself, and doing lots of OT at a project you adore, and it’s all consuming, you’re not “stressed”.  But the minute something goes wrong and you stop having fun, all that energy and pace suddenly become stressful.  We all have experienced this, particularly in games.

Hey RK47, I’m sympathetic – you should try and look for someone to talk to.  And start by taking your lack of sleep (probably a symptom, like you suggest) seriously.  It will just feed whatever nervousness you already have, because very likely you are caffeinating your self to compensate for your lack of sleep.  Focus on sleeping more and better first maybe.  Then see how things go.  And lay off MMO's too if you are doing any :)

I can't really play any MMO at this stage man. I used to remember beating on siege keep doors after some bouts of WAR and that distracted me from looking for work lol.  :awesome_for_real: I'd ding my RR in my dream and log in to find that it didn't actually happen.  :why_so_serious:

But this 'workplace dream' is something else. Actually, I felt I learned a hell lot from that customer service job. I think I can talk to people better now. Social problems - not really, I could talk to my customers, I met really good ones and a few terrible ones who insisted his mother 'cannot walk' but didn't bring a wheelchair. I never had a mental breakdown at work, but when I wanted to sleep, I just couldn't. I felt like it's something I can't control and it translates into gradual decline of my waking hours hence I'm really worried about this. I rather take a lower paying job than going through hell when I'm supposed to be relaxing. Games, don't really help. I spent an hour blowing away aliens in Mothership Zeta and all it did was gave me motion sickness. That DLC sucked hard btw.

Yes, I talk to friends. Half said I should 'Hey, toughen up and manage stress better the other half said 'I think your mental state is more important'. I'm 26, and I think I'm not in any shape to risk going mental just to be 'tough'. But maybe I should see a doctor about this.

You're not going mental. You just hate the work.

On one hand you shouldn't be such a pussy.
On the other hand, you should really find work you like.

I was 26 when I quit godaddy, moved without a job, and was broke for nearly a year and got a job I now love.

Shit happens. Get a helmet.

I've found a lot of people go through a little mini- mid-life crisis in their mid-20s.  I'd say it's pretty normal.

From personal experience, not all of us handle stress well at all.  Part of it is figuring out what is going to be best for you (and when you're not in a position to be picky that's tough), but it's okay to go get some help.  If you feel things are a little overwhelming, find a doctor/psychiatrist/therapist and see how things go.  If you're not comfortable with them, find a different one.

It's also a good thing to work on any social anxiety you have, but don't torture yourself in the process.  Dealing with people can be very draining, being drained can make it tougher to deal with people, and it just kind of spirals down.  Even if you're okay in a business environment which deals with customers, it might still wear on you.  In which case finding ways to get some alone time is good.

Simple. Sounds like social anxiety disorder or more likely avoidant personality disorder.
 :grin:
That will be $576.42
See my receptionist to set up next week's appointment on your way out.

The awesome part about the "toughen up" crowd is that they don't seem to realise that saying, "Fuck, I think I might be crazy" is pretty goddamn tough. Especially when people like them keep telling you shit like "Get a helmet." There's still a lot of stigma attached to ANY sort of mental issue, even the ridiculously common ones like depression. I particularly enjoy the people who act like I'm a weak, terrible person because I have to take medication to control my depression. My brain chemistry is broken, but that's apparently a personality flaw.

Your issues MAY just be a "lern2stress" issue but they MAY be something more serious. It's definitely worth it to at least find out, and fuck the people who think you'd be weak to do so.

This may be an understanding board, but it's still the internet. Medical and/or Mental questions are best pointed to a trusted professional. Just like Tax questions.

Long and short, your problems are common and can be easily diagnosed by people that know wtf they are talking about.

I think being stressed is pretty common too, even among people our age (I'm not 26, I'm 32.. but basically same ballpark). I recall reading plenty of articles that confirmed it (about the age range, I mean), so you shouldn't feel odd about it. The only comfort may be that it's even worse in other countries. 30,000 people kill themselves every year in a small country like Japan, for example, and much of that is stress related. Anyhow, I see a lot of my friends stressed and starting to look worn down from it too. Couple that with all of the fatass little kids running around, I wonder just what the avg life expectancy is going to be for my generation and the ones following it.

Shit, I'm all over the place here. Sorry. I'm on the opposite end of the spectrum (no crow's feet here! :P and I sleep good as well), but many would find my ability to shun work issues to be appalling. So my personal solution isn't for everyone. A healthy dose of not giving shit might be helpful though.  :why_so_serious: And if you do go to a doctor, for crissakes, don't get prescribed Xanax or something.

Look, you (and others) can keep harping on maybe getting some help - and he should, I know I should. I definitely know I should. But Life IS TOUGH and he SHOULD get a helmet. It's just too short to be a pussy, you have to learn, even if it's a mental defect - to struggle through the bullshit. It's just part of life. It sucks, but that's how it goes. You struggle through with medicine, great, maybe he will too - and that would be fine. But the existence of one thing does not mean the other magically disappears. Even if he gets prescribed something, he should still get a helmet, because life will still be tough.

Where is this "toughen up" crowd you speak of?  People have been pretty fucking sympathetic.  Stop projecting.

This from someone who ranted about people not walking fast enough for him.

My advice: join a geriatric zimmer-frame relay team. It will help you toughen up by constantly subjecting you to something that obviously stresses you.  :grin:

Nice selective quotes.  Why don't you relax and take some more meds.

I got to agree with Duse on that one. People walk slow as shit. Usually while waddling their obese asses down a sidewalk, dripping cheese from their supersize burgers and pulling their snot covered obese kids along with them. Get the fuck out of my way!!!!! GAH! :drill:

Again, talk to someone with some specialization in the area. You can see what kind of responses you get here.

There's nothing wrong with you, it's the world that's fucked. Work shouldn't be this shit.

Dude, there's only two results no matter who he talks to:

1. Helmet
2. Pills

And, maybe:

3. Helmet & Pills

Yes, getting help is worth it. It helps you UNDERSTAND, but you can't carry a shrink around in your pocket. Stress, assholes, and assholes that cause stress are everywhere. You have to learn to cope, either through yourself or with someone else to help make sense of it. But it doesn't change the end result. The responses have all, from both sides, been helpful.

You must have missed my post.


I took a class on this in college. I actually had to read the book and everything.

Or, given that you have no idea what the hell you are talking about in the mental health arena, you could just let him ask somebody else.

Unless you are currently medicated, have been medicated, or have a degree in it. If you do please enlighten us with examples.

Hard not to agree with the thesis that people should stop shambling around in a permanent mindless daze like zombies.  But of course the cream of the crop that is F13 found a way.

/thread

It has already been said, you have to find the happy inside. Professional help offers nothing beyond self awareness and drugs, 90% drugs. You seem fairly self aware, so the issue is how to deal with it internally. Ive never had my dreams get negative and crazy so you have my sympathy. Work in a warehouse before customer service, 10 times the stress for the same wage.

Hey, thanks for the advice, you all. I guess I'll just try to enjoy my weekend for now and browse through the bookstores first before heading to a clinic.

Find an outlet, take up exercise and re-evaluate your health as a whole, which includes food and what not.

Not to be weird, but what do you have in your room aside from your bed? What do you do in your room aside from sleep (or trying to)?

Hey.

1) Stress is crappy, it will kill you and you need to find a way to deal with it before it puts you in the ground.
2) You will need to figure out how to do this.  Many suggestions in this thread are worth trying.
3) You can try combinations of things since it's unlikely one thing will be the Magic Cure.
4) If you go the pills+therapy route, I suggest looking at it as a short-term process rather than a lifestyle.
5) If you hate your job, get another one and fuck the money.  Can't spend money when you are dead.

Also, I like Epictetus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epictetus).  A bonus effect to practicing Stoic teachings is that it infuriates certain people.

As for jobs, I don't know.  I'm thinking of doing all kinds of crazy shit for money if I get laid off.  Just yesterday I laid out a plan to do some lumberjacking; I can use a chainsaw and the trees are all ten-year-old pine.  It might not be ideal but it will pay and I won't have to deal with jackasses, just wildlife.  Mostly, though, I get stressed out about the situation for no good reason... not that there is ever a good reason to be stressed except when you are surprised by a bear or hippo.  I'm worried because I currently have very little confidence that Plan B (start an AIX consulting company) will produce money.  I'd really save a lot of time and effort if I can use my existing expertise in AIX somehow.

I find that since nothing can be done at the moment, the best approach is to distract myself from it with games, home improvement and F13 jibba-jabba.

Haha wow, I was gonna pull out the Stoic card, but was afraid it'd be a bit much. ;) I second the suggestion. Personally, Taoist and Buddhist writers help me, but Epictitus and Aurelius aren't too shabby either.

There's always room for Stoicism.  Zeno, Marcus Aurelius, it's all good.

The toughen up crowd mentioned by rk47? Quoted by me and then quoted by you? Plus schild's initial suggestions of "don't be such a pussy" and "get a helmet" were not exactly helpful, and definitely smacked of "toughen up." Since he actually elaborated, I can see what he's trying to say and it's not so bad, but a blanket "you're being a pussy" is bullshit.

I agree.  The problem is that even if "stop being a pussy" is the actual solution, the presentation is all wrong.  It's not usually the actual solution, though, since that's the first thing every random asshole says in these situations and the person with the problem has likely already considered this.  Interestingly, a therapist (often) knows how to tell someone to stop being a pussy while framing it in a manner in which the person with the issue can understand.

Speaking of understanding, chances are most people don't actually have a good understanding of themselves and I submit, based on personal experience, that learning what makes you tick will do absolute wonders for your ability to handle Shit.

Seconded.

A good therapist will teach you how to be more self-aware.  People are really bad at it.

Nightmares suck.

One of my friends lost her niece in a car accident, now she has the hardest time taking care of kids.  It is the guilt of not being able to help, the sorrow that she knows we did all we could, the anger that she was a wonderful child who died...yet the drug addict with kids from different fathers lives when she should have died (or other person she treats and seems ungrateful and mean).  Stages of grief and dying can really fuck with you, and it makes me and my coworkers crazy, yet we deal with it in ways that make us enjoy what we do for a living.  She has worked threw her depression and anger, mostly because she asked for help and we all pitched in for her.

/em listens to Jimbo, since of all of us, he probably knows a thing or two about job related stress.

Go with therapy. Make it a good one too. If I could afford to, I would be seeing one right now.

I think he has a Brain Cloud.

Just go mental; you'll fit in better with rest of America.

I was given antidepressants when i was younger, but they did nothing (at least good) for me. But a family member of mine is prescribed them, and they definitely help... In his case, depression is an overwhelming thing (I think at the time, I was only merely sad.. because I've been off meds for over a decade and depression has never been "overwhelming". I just don't need them). But umm, my point is, I wouldn't knock it. I've seen how it can get, and it's not as simple as toughening up sometimes. And if not depression, and anxiety is the main problem, ust stay the hell away from stuff like Xanax, like I said. Hell, you'd be better off smoking a bowl than that. Xanax is not much different than feeling stoned, except it's highly addictive, a major bitch to get off from, and probably more damaging to your body than weed in the long term. So smoke weed, if anxiety is your problem. ;D

But besides weed, like me and Yeg said, go buy a copy of Aurelius' Meditations and the Tao Te Ching while you're at it.  :grin: Good reading. I recommend them to anyone. The bottom line of those philosophies is to just be in the moment.

Weed doesn't work for everyone.  Doesn't do a damn thing for me, for example.

About the therapists, unfortunately you will want to try more than one.  Find one that seems to understand you and that you like.  My first one was an arrogant dick and we obviously had very different core philosophies.  Second one was much better.