f13.net

So I'm live posting from the mellencamp, and dylan concert my wife wanted me to bring her to. Mellencamp was awesome! But Dylan?  What the fuck is this idiot mumbling about? He sounds like a homeless guy mumbling to himself after a pack of cigarettes, and a bottle of Thunderbird. I mean not only does he mumble everything but his actual singing voice is nonexistant its rough talking to music.

What the fuck did anyone ever see in this guy?

Oh and it shows how engineered his voice is in the cadillac commercial where he is at least in key. That was mumbling but at least it was melodic mumbling. I can shoot video for those wwho doubt how really bad this is right now.

Dylan is loved for his song writing.  Not his voice.  See also Neil Young. 

Yea, I still can't figure that out either.

As for the concert, I can't imagine the cost of seeing either of those artists, let alone together. No way that can be worth the ticket price.

Cheaper than 50% of assets.


I kind of like Dylan, but I do not think anyone can understand what he is singing outside of the studio.

$69 per seat. Me, her and 3 in-laws. At least I enjoyed Mellencamp.

Oh and he is appreciated for his lyrics? Awesome then have him write and sell songs but what dumbass gave him a mic and said, "sing!"

Trying to get them to let us leave early. Asked them if we came to the concert on talk like a pirate day?

....

You do know what music came out of the 60s right? That decade was filled with great songwriters that couldn't sing and great singers singing shitty songs.

And lots of weed, shrooms, and acid.

You don't want to do Dylan live. But he is the high poet of my generation. You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows. Or something.

Without Dylan, pop music would be sort of juvenile, and mostly love songs. Not to say he was the first or only person writing lyrics that held political and "serious" literary value... He came from a folk and blues scene that was already doing that. But his influence on rock lyrics is huge.

So huge that people who are giants in their own right were influenced by Dylan. John Lennon didn't depart from simple love songs until he heard Dylan, for instance - and in turn, Lennon influenced a megaton of people. Jimi Hendrix was a huge fan, but just a guitar player in r&b bands - until he became a songwriter himself.. and he credited Dylan a lot for that. And covered him a lot too. I mean, come the fuck on.. "All Along the Watchtower" anyone? That might be Jimi's most popular song, and yet, it's a Dylan song.

Anyways, even if you don't like him, instead of asking what anyone saw in him, just acknowledge that they did see something. And there's bound to be musicians that you favor that saw it. So in the end, you yourself are poorer without Bob Dylan.  :awesome_for_real:

After the 60's, Dylan was pretty instrumental in country and rock convergence. And even people who were around before him were influenced by him, like Johnny Cash. After the mid 70's, he had different periods, some good, some bad, but even so, just that 60-70 period is huge.

This is petty. I do not like being petty.

John Lennon never did silly love songs. Paul Mcarthy did and still does and owns up to it. John Lennon sings and wrights poetry. Why am I replying to Lennon and Dylan threads on the same night? You can not see my generation as it happened? Please listen to "a working class hero" 15 times then come back and we will talk. Just us girls.

Saying things like this makes me want to punch you.


That paragraph is practically gibberish.

Sorry, it's 10:30. I think you've already filled your "I want to punch you" quota for the day.

[edit] Working Class Hero came years after the Beatles, well into a period where Lennon was very influenced Dylan. I'm not sure why you mention it.

I'm talking about the period of the Beatles from the first album to Beatles for Sale - these were love songs. In between this period, Lennon fight got turned on to Dylan and got to meet him. All of the sudden the next album was "Help!" Heh.. The title track itself was different from what they'd been doing... But even the love songs took on a different tone, like "You've Got to Hide Your Love Away".

Way to sidestep that fact that what you said was flabbergastingly silly.

What am I supposedly sidestepping? You just disagreed and said you wanted to punch me. I'm not sure what the discussion is. I read it. I laughed. Not sure what else to do.

Quite possibly the most pathetic (as in pathos, not pitiful) thing I ever saw was Dylan on 60 Minutes, explaining how his talent as a songwriter was inextricably mixed with his drug use, and the drugs nearly killed him.  "How could anyone ever sit down to write something like that, sober?"  You could see his regret at having become a pale shadow of his former self, and his resolve to follow through with it.

Dylan didn't just change "juvenile music", he changed music, period.  I'm not particularly into music, and even I can see we live in a better world thanks to him.

--Dave

Of course he did, but implying that pop music would've continued being juvenile had he not existed is just insane. Someone else would've filled it in and the Stones, Aerosmith (this was a terrible example), David Bowie and Elton John would've still existed. Not to mention Springsteen, The Grateful Dead, and countless others. Sure, some of their stuff was inspired by him post 65, but nonetheless, they were already around.

Of course someone else would have done it. I was going to write something like that.. I should have. Basically, it just happened to be Dylan.


Dylan is... a very inconsistent guy though.. Which also makes him interesting to me when he says stuff like that. I think he's just moving forward and talks shit about his past a lot maybe. He goes through different periods. He became folk music's hero in the beginning, and then he went electric and pissed them off - both with the direction of music and his disdain in interviews for them in crowning him their messiah... and then after that, he was dismissive of a lot of rock.... and then even after that, he became a born again Christian in the late 70's and dismissed his previous music even further. Lennon (since we're speaking about him) parodied him in some home recordings here... he seemed pissed. Then all of the sudden, Dylan pissed off the Christian community by hanging around Rabbis and getting in touch with his Jewish roots.. and so on and so forth.

To appreciate Dylan and his contemporaries better, you have to have a good understanding of how the music industry operated before them.   Writing and singing songs with moral overtones and political themes was a bold thing to do in the early to mid 60's.  Dylan was a pioneer (among many).  

Very true. The banana, chocolate and peanut butter pie (for the birthday cake) at home made it all worth while in the end.
We have to be thankful for pie.

Awesome. He could be the living messiah of everything that is good in music. That does not change the fact he sucks ass now. Major giant hemorrhoid covered ass. He sounds worse than the guy with no voicebox signing the in the Truth television commercials about the dangers of cigarettes.
Even my 60 year old father-in-law who was a hippie in the 60's said, "Wow he butchered that."

When did pop music stop being mostly juvenile love songs?

Umm, to answer seriously (sorry!).. 1965 had some angry and/or introspective hits. Satisfaction, My Generation, California Dreamin, Eve of Destruction, Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood, I Fought the Law, Turn Turn Turn, It's Been a Long Time Comin, and Like a Rolling Stone. To name a few.

Putting it all in perspective, Dylan is only a small part of that. I'm sure Kennedy and Civil Rights.. and just generational differences.. pissed everyone off. Yet, oddly enough, the top hit of 1966 was the Ballad of the Green Berets.

Unfortunately bob dylan always sounded like a mumbling homeless guy I love his music especially if somebody else is singing it.  He is a great songwriter but his singing ability leaves a LOT to be desired.

Dylan is amazingly over-rated. He wrote a few good tunes, and other people played them much better. If he had stuck to songwriting, I'd have more respect for the guy.

I like Mellencamp alot, but he's boring in concert for me. We saw the Allmans "open" for Tom Petty a couple years ago, Tom is the same kind of artist. I like a marriage of songs and music, Tom and Jphn are "songs" guys. You'll hear the hits, and a few interesting deep catalog choices, but nothing you can't get from a cd player. You go see someone like Widespread Panic (opening for the Allmans this year), and you get music but not much in the way of songs, turns into boring jams (though elevated while Jimmy sits in with them). A band like the Allmans, you get great songs and incredible musicianship with everything being malleable, the live versions often being far superior to the recorded versions. I like any band that puts musicianship to the fore while still playing good songs to showcase it.

However, the Petty show was iconic in the form of the people who sat in front of us. Through the Allmans set she read a newspaper, then Petty gets on and she only gets rocking to the big hits, and goes nuts on cue when Petty raises his hand (opposed to the ABB fans who cheer when someone plays a particularly tasty solo). I bet she only watches comedies with a laugh track.
I'd use Pete Seeger as a much better and far less douchey example.

$69 to a double headline bill isn't too bad.

What Bob Dylan is good at:

Writing songs >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Playing the guitar>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Singing>Playing the harmonica.

Man, I forgot about the harmonica. Folk singer need to be banned from harmonica use.

Little Walter wept.

This.

I happen to like Dylan.  A lot.  I also know, having seen him live a few times, that he's a very inconsistent live act.  I also like Neil Young.  A lot. 

Then again, I hate coffee and prefer vanilla ice cream.  Different strokes and all that. 

You're so bland.

I still like Bowie better.

That's like saying you like lobster better than asparagus.  They are completely different types of music. 

Bowie is the lobster of the music world.

Well, of course. Is Dylan really doing anything interesting these days? I saw Young (who I enjoy) on that thing with Emmylou (mmm) and he had a nice new tune that almost made me weep, about the death of the hippy dream. I like some early Bowie, but there's another squandered talent imo.

Whereas you can go see the Allman Brothers and see a show that'll be better than it was in 1970, and it was pretty damned good then. Same with Buddy Guy, he fucking tears it up and his latest album is one of his best...at 73. Dickie Betts is also inconsistent, but he's been great the three times we've seen him. Again, diff'rent strokes, I prefer great musicianship combines with great songs, lacking either gets boring for me.

What did Bowie do so badly that makes him seem like he squandered his talent? ??? His recent albums, as well as stuff from the 90's isn't repugnant or anything. Some of it is pretty good. Some of the 80's were bad, but that's the case for a lot of people. Besides, nobody can maintain a level of excellence like Bowie had in the 70's.. everyone has dry periods, but that isn't the same as squandering.

Dylan's harmonica.. well, I don't think it's bad either.. He wasn't trying to be a kickass harp player, just accompanying himself. And by necessity, he couldn't muffle or bend notes, since his hands were tied up. So the only different about him is that he just has a plain blowing sound.

um...actually you don't use your hands to bend notes...its a mouth thing.  And yeah, as a harmonica player Dylan can't play...it hurts.  hell, if you listen to him in recordings its a rare feat if he can even replicate a riff.  some would say that's artistic, but I say he's just a bad inconsistent player.

Yeah, this. Even his bad '80's stuff was some catchy pop music. He's still producing good music.

Saw Buddy Guy two months or so back with BB King. He was awesome.

Yes, pretty much.

Since it seems like an open field for random opinions on this thread :why_so_serious:


Townes Van Zandt>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dylan

Lyrically, and singing.  Townes drank himself into the grave, but even towards the end he still sounded good.  I saw Dylan in the late 80's (89ish?) and he was god awful, I hate to think of what he might sound like now. 

I like Jake E. Lee more than any other Ozzy guitarist.

/amidoinitright?

Yea, and Lobster is better than Asparagus. Not really rocket science.

Bowie makes Dylan look like an amateur hack that happened to trip over some clever wordsmithing every once in a while.

Edit: As for Bowie being squandered talent, lol. That said, I just like to go with the feeling that Peter Murphy (the closest solo career I can find to Bowie, at least in that brand of music) finally caught up with and surpassed Bowie with Deep and only got better with Holy Smoke and Cascade where Bowie started to just tread water.

Music fits moods... just like food.  I love Bowie, but only when I'm in the mood for Bowie.  Dylan just fits a certain "mood". 

Maybe it's an era thing.  Hell, I can't even explain why I like Dylan any more than I can explain why I hate anime. 

I wish it were that simple. He's one of those folks who has fans that hit you over the head with how amazing he is and when you finally get around to listening to it, it's like wtf. I'm perfectly willing to assume that if you weren't alive at his peak there's absolutely no way to really relate to his shit - and I'll concede that. But the potheads and people trying to pretend they were born in a different generation make him out to be a shiny golden god when really he just sounds like a burnt out hippy with a mouth full of marbles. In a decade I'm sure some of the kids youngsters today will think Cobain was some kind of fucking Virtuoso and I can't wait to tell them that they would've been wrong in 1995 too.

Edit: You edited to make the point I was making! /snarl

To be fair there's a big difference between what he sounds like *now* and what his early recordings sound like. He's actually pretty understandable in a lot of the studio stuff, even some of the later things.

I like Dylan.. a lot. Is he an incredible singer?  Hes a damn fine songwriter. Tell ya a story,  a true one, but a story all the same. My dad was dieing of cancer my kids (daughters) were like 13 and 9. I chose to take the 13 year old as she would not need much support and might actually help as I went to visit him for the last time. Nashville to Cape Coral FLA. We get close to Chattanooga and I look over and she is sitting stiff (daddy is the stern one mommy is the lenient one. That's just how we roll) so I tell her I need some help with the lyrics of a song. I have never figured them all out. Subterranean Homesick Blues we sang it over and over for the next 12 hours. If you don't have it get it. If you do have it play it. It is right up there with country joe and the fish with hell no we won't go. It is what 1967 felt like at least in my experience. Ya, I like Dylan a lot. Favorite album? Blood on the tracks. Is he a great singer? Hell of a song writer and made great sense at the time.

Saying it twice doesn't make him more listenable. Once again though, you were alive back then.

Also:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2af69xt0VKE

This is analogous to how I feel about Dylan:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Waits

You have to really be into music on level that is deeper than the consumer to appreciate either of them. Any hits they have had to their own name are accidents and not manufactured. They aren't in it to be big stars. Both have amazingly deep reserves of talent and when others reinterpert their work... it comes out far better to the average person's ears.

Oddly, I put Billy Corgan in the same category. He writes far better music than he plays.

Oh, I think Billy is an amazing guitar player (and producer), right there in the albums. It's the singing that I know isn't always accessible to people (maybe that's what you're referring to as well).

I'm with you about Waits..

I like some of Dylan's work.  Most of it I find to be a bit rambly and boring, but different strokes and all that.  I wasn't even close to being alive when he was in his prime, yet I can still see why some people love him.  Many artists are hit and miss live though.  If there is one thing I hate, it's sitting through a CD performance after having paid $$ to see the band live.  Moby was bad about that, his performance was just downright awful.

I love me some Tom Waits, and thanks to Stray for turning me onto him. We then had a librarian that unfortunately moved back to Long Island that gave me a couple of his albums. Definitely an acquired taste, fiancee doesn't get it.

On harp playing. Junior Wells, Little Walter, Sonny Boy Williamson, Jerry Portnoy, James Cotton.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nisxh5PPFBA (Junior is also one of my favorite singers and played with Otis and Buddy, two of my favorite guitarists)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx606E2OzPE (love the sound Cotton's getting in 66, shades of blues rock to come)

I'd like to think Waits is an acquired taste but good, so that I can continue bagging on Dylan.

I kinda wish Corgan would stick to writing.  I don't remember Zwan being any good.

Waits is most definitely an acquired taste, but I actually think he should go down as a better songwriter than Dylan - and this is coming from someone who likes Dylan for what he is. I don't own any Dylan albums and think the best songs of his were recorded better by someone else (All Along the Watchtower by Hendrix smokes any other version). Waits' songwriting just has so much more range, intelligence and innovation. The motherfucker created his own instruments to play some of that shit. Dylan is a good wordsmith - Waits is a fantastic wordsmith and a crafter of music.

Oh that shit already happens with Nirvana and Cobain. People think he was some fucking rock god.  :oh_i_see:


And Billy Corgan is another whiny sounding fuck who should stick to writing and never be let near a microphone ever again.

The correct way a Dylan song should be heard... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpI9A9fxRH4)

Course, I am a little biased on that mark.

http://www.pastemagazine.com/blogs/lists/2009/04/50-best-bob-dylan-covers-of-all-time.html

I like Tom Waits but frankly I think he makes the single best drunken morose sorrow drowning soundtrack ever.

Metallica.  Black album.  Every time somebody says that Enter Sandman is their best song God pinches off a kitten's head with his sphincter.

I don't understand why some of you care about whatever other people like. If other people think Dylan or Cobain are "rock gods", then so be it. It's like you think there are facts behind it all or some shit, and that you know them, and others must too. When it's all bullshit actually, like or dislike. There are no facts, and one's own tastes should be enough to worry about (imho). Don't mean to be preachy, but goddamn. Personally, I reserve pure hate for the most automated dance type of tracks. It's only a step up from pressing demo on a Casio keyboard. But I still don't give a fuck if someone likes them. Sounds like a waste of time and stress.  :-P

You can't account for bad taste, but you sure as shit can make fun of it.

Ah, carry on then. As long as it makes you feel good.  :awesome_for_real:

Hey speaking of Metallica, am I alone in thinking Death Magnetic is pretty damn good?!  :grin:

Cynanide is groovy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUMqqVOlJBs)

You are not, sir.  I mentioned it in the other music thread, but I think everyone else here has given up on them.

Yes, folks do that with both bands.  Which sucks as Enter Sandman was, IMO, the WORST track on the Black album.Nirvana's over-hyped existence has been covered here before.

I don't like James' voice.  That alone turns me off to most of it.  Other than that, it's all right.  Had it come out a few years ago, it would have been a different story but I'm so far removed from the world of Metallica that I just don't really care for them too much anymore (even the older stuff).

This.

In the late 80's I would lose house working through their songs and learning the bass lines. Now? I wish I'd chosen Megadeth.

"Hello Me, this is the Real Me"?  :grin:


But yeah Dave Ellefson(sp) was definitely the more skilled bass player for sure... Vs Newstead, I mean.

Older. I'd rather know the fingering for "Peace Sells..." and now am too graceless to accomplish it. :)

And Justice For All was the last great Metallica Album.  Ride the Lightning being my personal favorite.  

I was never a big Nirvana fan personally.  I thought Pearl Jam and Soundgarden were definitely superior.

I thought they were trying too hard on that album.  I prefer Master of Puppets for my Metallica fix. 

Kill em all!

...which some of these newer songs sound closer to in a way. Stripped down, tight, but groovy metal riffage. Not so reverb heavy and spacious as Master and Lightning either. Metallica.. Iron Maiden.. bands like that.. I enjoy them when they're in your face more. :P Not to mention there's a nice blues tinge to many tracks on Kill Em All (and why I like that song above too.. that's a Metallica I haven't heard in a long time)..


And Justice for All is cool, but I don't like the deafening bass noise when you crank it up.

What, there's bass on that album?  ;-)

Ah you think like me.  I am impressed by a band that accurately replays music represented on record (usually with ~27 backing musicians), but not necessarily entertained.  As you commented, I could have enjoyed the CD (or even a "live CD"!) from the comfort of my own home, for much cheaper, for basically the same experience (unless you want to get slammed on the front rail to get up close and personal).

On the other hand, you've got the shitty jam bands that go on and ON and ON and ON... ... ... ... CHRIST WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU TRYING TO ENTERTAIN???  You mentioned Widespread Panic, but one of my roommate's buddies insists on playing one of his bootlegs of String Cheese Incident EVERY FUCKING TIME he comes over.  Same shit. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I like something that Greg Allman said.  He said that they were not a "jam band", but were a "band that jams", and they tend to pretty well balance the jamming and the song playing.  I'd throw Deep Purple in the same category. 

I'm not a huge country fan, but I like some of the older stuff and I think Willie Nelson's band does a real nice blend of playing hits and allowing band members to shine in solos.

Got about half way through this and decided to jump to the end...

Bob Dylan was just expanding on what people like Pete Seeger and Woody Guthrie were already doing/had already done.  It was probably more about timing and luck than anything else that he was the one who became the "voice of the generation", etc.  So if there was no Dylan, there still would've been a large folk music scene to draw lyrical influences from.

Also, there was a period of time where Dylan did prove that he could carry a tune if he wanted to.  I can't remember specifically when it was, I think it was one of his full-in country albums in the 70s.

Edit: Ah, I see this thread moved on without me.

He changed his voice drastically for Lay, Lady Lay.. Is that the song you're thinking of?

He kind of sounds like Dwight Yoakam on it.

Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfF0uHekcc8)


And always an alternative cover for each of his songs.... I always liked Ministry's (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xyx85_ministry-lay-lady-lay_music) version.

No, the song I'm thinking of is much more "western" than that.  Wish I could remember it better.

It's got to be the same album at least? Lay Lady Lay is from Nashville Skyline.. he does that same little croon on all the tracks. That's his de facto country album. Even does a duet with Johnny Cash on it.

lol, i hope you agree... i don't want a reenactment of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3-LxmrFm40)  ;D

Eh, I'm gonna pretend I never brought it up.  It's definitely not Lay Lady Lay, but beyond that I really can't remember.

umm im just making a joke there..saw that skit the other day. funny shit

i believe you on lay lady lay ;) i didn't mean to suggest that the second time. i mean there's other songs on that album (nashville skyline) that were more country sounding, and where he sings different. it might have been one of those.

God yes. When I was a kid, I loathed Seek And Destroy. I mean, it's a decent enough song, but it's repetetive and can get boring when EVERY BAND IN THE CITY is playing it. Every band. They fucking love it. I was the only person who refused to learn it, since the band has an amazing catalog of great songs. Hell, by that time Master was out and we could play all of that, most of Lightning and a selection off Kill 'Em All. So really, fuck Seek and Destroy, let's play Orion. Or even Master, which we overplayed to fuck (also played it almost double-time). But no, dum dum dum dum DERN IT DERN IT dum dum dum dum DERN NER NER NER. Made me wish for a thousand deaths.

Then Enter Sandman came along and replaced Seek and Destroy as the song every douchebag wanted to play when you mention Metallica. With the bonus of Metallica's newfound fame, so you could hear every hack in the city mangling it at the guitar shop. I tend to go to the guitar shop on off hours, so I get puzzled when the guys are so happy to see me and tell me I can crank anything as loud as I want, play whatever. Because I forget until I go in during prime hours and hear the utter shit they have to put up with on a daily basis. But hope blooms eternal, we were all once those newbs mangling the fuck out of whatever we were attempting to do, in the hopes of finding that magic sound that would make us sound like our heroes.

But fuck Enter Sandman.
Eh, it's ok. I don't really listen to too much metal these days. I don't think Mars Volta counts. The next metal album I'll get is probably Mastadon's Crack the Skye, it's fucking  :drill:. Metallica has gotten poretty bland and samey, I like St Anger but don't think I'll be buying much more Metallica. I'm kinda disappointed they didn't make a more seminal album with Rubin and Trujillo. It really was all about Cliff.
Shut your dirty hole. Pick up your bass and play, gramps. It's never too late, most of my skill has come back and I've gained much more in other areas. Mostly the sheer speed is gone, but then, I don't practice that. But I'm so glad I picked up the guitar again, it makes me a whole person.
:why_so_serious:

Not sure which my favorite would be. Lots of memories and emotions from that time. I guess it fits this thread, because Metallica was kind of our Dylan. We didn't do much in the way of covers, but we could play so much Metallica. They were the big underground band, selling by gigging. We all felt so betrayed, first by the One video...but it was a great tune, so ok. But then the Black album went further down the commercial path (though in hindsight a decent disc) and the MASSIVE overplaying on tv. Then Load just finished them off imo. Anyway, Lightning holds a special place for me, we played Fade to Black in memory of our first bassist, we grew up with that album, mid teens. And then Master came out just as we were getting good as a band, we learned it and had so many fun jams with people sitting in playing those songs. Our (almost) double time Master was just sick, and to this day our drummer would swear he can't play Sanitarium. I'd launch into it, he'd bitch saying he doesn't know it....and we'd proceed to play the whole thing. Can't pick between them.

Death Magnetic is the best thing they've produced since the Black Album. The Black Album was mediocre compared to their other work, as is Death Magnetic, but it beats the fuck out of (Pants)Load and St. Anger (at how badly this album was produced, written and recorded).

EDIT: I don't get the love for Mastodon. They are great musicians, but goddamnit, I cannot fucking abide that shitty gravelly-voiced Pantera-clone vocals. Nothing kills my interest in a band more than getting really interested in the intro to a song and hearing someone mangle it with the goth douche version of Oscar the Grouch singing with marbles in his mouth.

I dunno, one guy gets a bit growly, but another is a ringer for Ozzy. I don't go for the evil grover type guys, but Mastadon is barely scraping into that with tons of great music and two more melodic singers. The band makes me want to play metal again, that's saying something.

This guy has the tracks from the new album on teh tube, just listened to the whole thing again this morning:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Vf5syTfmE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GENvZhd-XjY

Seriously... you know what I'm talking about, right? Woom Woom Woom Woom. It's not bass so much as it's just produced with a lot of low end. The songs are great.. I just never liked how the album sounded.

Master of Orion is about the coolest thing ever done by Metallica. It captures everything that was heavy about them, but also shows off their actual chops at that time. I really enjoy playing that one, even now. Well, parts of it when I get to touch the guitars. :)

Grimwell is old.  He's confused his game titles with his song titles.   :drill: :geezer:

/tease

oops.
pwned!

When I was a kid, I loathed Seek And Destroy.[/quote]
I'm not a kid anymore and I still despise that song.  Like you said, plenty of other good songs in the catalog from that era, why focus on the one that EVERY band on earth seems to want to play?  Probably because most of it is slow and easy...

But then the Black album went further down the commercial path (though in hindsight a decent disc) and the MASSIVE overplaying on tv. Then Load just finished them off imo.
[/quote]

The Black Album would have been #1 on the charts and would have sold huge numbers without radio-friendly singles and MTV videos.  Do you remember the advertisement for it in the guitar magazines?  It was just a black page that said "August 12th", or something like that, and EVERYONE knew what it meant.  Every metal head loved Metallica and that album would have sold huge without crossing over.  I just was expecting some mind blowing speed metal epics and was kind of disappointed.

I'm too young and in too remote an area to have memories of S&D being everywhere, instead I remember being in the high school cafeteria listening to someone mangle it for a bit, then pass it to a friend who cranked out the first minute or so with the guitar held upside-down to account for the fact that he is left-handed.

It was pretty fucking awesome.

We had one guy who wanted to join our band for a while, he could only play straight muted riffs. They were good, but it was all straight beats, fast or slow. Chug chug chug chug chug. Drove me nuts because I have always been about syncopation and breaking up heavy riffs to make them more interesting. S&D is a chug riff that's much better played double time triplets :)

Heck, I was just playing (what I could remember of) Master of Puppets and the first climbing riff (after the initial four hit intro) I keep playing triplets for the E to F low part, it's normally just a straight downpicked EF (B) EF (C) EF (C#) EF (C) EF (BB). So more of an EEF in the same space. Should probably have put that in the guitar thread :P

Seek and Destroy is the shit. And as far as I know, I'm one of the only people who plays it around here... Plays it right at least.  :grin:

Not my favorite track from Kill Em All though.. It's probably No Remorse. [edit] Yeah, as far as I'm concerned, that song is the king of Metallica songs.  Instant head bang.  :rock:

I prefer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKYALsp-sIg when it comes to songs that can be abbreviated as S&D.

Re: earlier in the thread, I quite like Blood on the Tracks and I'm not really old... even if you dislike Dylan you surely have to agree that he has some good songs on some of his albums... right? (I also like Waits and have most of his albums)

James Osterberg Jr. A Fine choice.


Yeah, Blood on the Tracks is good! That was the first intro for me.. I picked up a cassette at a used bookstore on a whim, and I instantly became a fan. Afterwards, it was Highway 61, which is now my favorite (probably a conventional choice). I like every album thoroughly from the first until Blood on the Tracks. Except Blonde on Blonde (which I guess is a fan favorite, but hey). That one is hit and miss. Then after the 70's, it was lots of hits and misses.

Hmm...my favorite is probably... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm6KMVEUDt0  :why_so_serious:

I dunno, I liked The Four Horseman and Hit the Lights quite a bit. It's really a different album, kind of like listening to early Maiden.

Jack-booted fascist police detain living legend for the heinous crime of walking while raining.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=8331830&page=1 (http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=8331830&page=1)

Senile old man, living in a vehicle? Sounds like a vagrant to me.