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Title: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on January 04, 2009, 02:45:07 PM Looks like the Scout will be the next class receiving an update, amongst other things.
http://www.teamfortress.com/ Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: TripleDES on January 04, 2009, 03:00:39 PM Christ, the engineer needs some fixing already. Not the damn scout.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on January 04, 2009, 03:12:20 PM The engy got that mini-update where teleporters and dispensers are now upgradeable.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: TripleDES on January 04, 2009, 03:53:01 PM Doesn't make the sentry less shitty. :why_so_serious:
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on January 05, 2009, 07:56:07 AM Hmm, I'm going to have to check TF2 out again as I was unaware of the Spy buff. There are maps where ammo recharging cloak could let you run around staying almost permanently invisible. This will be GREAT for hit and run operations deep in enemy territory.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on January 05, 2009, 07:56:29 AM I am reinstalling TF2 the moment the Scout teaser page comes up.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Yoru on January 05, 2009, 09:46:46 AM YEAAAAH! BOINK!
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on January 05, 2009, 09:53:13 AM Hmm, I'm going to have to check TF2 out again as I was unaware of the Spy buff. There are maps where ammo recharging cloak could let you run around staying almost permanently invisible. This will be GREAT for hit and run operations deep in enemy territory. The best is if you can sneak behind enemy lines and get to their dispenser. You can sit there cloaked all day long waiting for a chance to strike. It makes spying on Dustbowl fricking awesome. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on January 05, 2009, 04:38:09 PM Hmm, I'm going to have to check TF2 out again as I was unaware of the Spy buff. There are maps where ammo recharging cloak could let you run around staying almost permanently invisible. This will be GREAT for hit and run operations deep in enemy territory. The best is if you can sneak behind enemy lines and get to their dispenser. You can sit there cloaked all day long waiting for a chance to strike. It makes spying on Dustbowl fricking awesome. There is no visible line of healing from you to the dispenser? Wow. That does open up many strategic possibilities. How much of a recharge do you get from fallen weapons? I.e., does backstabbing, grabbing fallen weapon, and recloaking get you back to full? I haven't been able to reinstall yet (work is hectic), sorry for the obvious question. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on January 05, 2009, 05:03:45 PM You can hide the line pretty easily by standing on top. Plus in the thick of battle most people aren't paying attention. A fallen weapon does fill you back up if I recall correctly.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on January 06, 2009, 08:14:27 PM You can hide the line pretty easily by standing on top. Plus in the thick of battle most people aren't paying attention. A fallen weapon does fill you back up if I recall correctly. Now that I've played: This makes things so easy on pubs its almost criminal. My first time back in months on defense in goldrush 1: 70 points. Next closest was 26 :awesome_for_real: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: KallDrexx on January 09, 2009, 04:13:25 AM The engy got that mini-update where teleporters and dispensers are now upgradeable. I've been away from tf2 for a while, what do the upgradable teleporters and dispensers do? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on January 09, 2009, 05:38:51 AM Teleporters recharge quicker as they get upgraded. Dispensers dispense more health and metal per tick as they get upgraded.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: TripleDES on January 10, 2009, 09:28:55 AM Doesn't make the engy role suck less. Actually turns you even more in a sitting duck that can be spystabbed.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on January 10, 2009, 09:56:34 AM I have to inform you that if you keep this up I'm going to have to start accusing you of sucking at being an engy. Which will then be followed by you positing scenarios in which an engy is clearly powerless to win. Followed by tiresome rebuttals from other people saying that no, you just suck at being an engy. Ad nauseam. And really, we don't need that, do we? :why_so_serious:
Let's talk about scouts. Start placing your bets on what the new melee weapon's going to be. Louisville Slugger? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on January 10, 2009, 10:28:59 AM Either a wooden bat or a high crit rate nailbat.
Edit: I'd give up the world for a Jose Canseco bat. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Lantyssa on January 10, 2009, 11:33:46 AM Clue-by-Four - Killed by the Scout, in the Spawn Room, with the Lead Pipe.
Actually any kills in the spawn room, but gives the referenced lead pipe. I'd love to see that one. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on January 10, 2009, 11:55:43 AM I wouldn't want a lead pipe to be the alternate weapon, it's dumb. >_>
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Lantyssa on January 10, 2009, 01:45:38 PM But it'd be an awesome achievement. :sad:
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on January 12, 2009, 11:34:34 AM Did you pay money for that?
Destroy a turret with the bat. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on January 12, 2009, 04:05:46 PM From one of the Steam forum threads: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=783901
My personal fav: "You following me, camera guy?" Taunt for a freeze-cam shot. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on February 07, 2009, 12:18:54 PM bump, more blog updates. They've changed crit mechanics and the scout package is imminent.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 07, 2009, 09:38:05 PM the scout package is imminent. hehehehehehehehehehehehe :grin: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 17, 2009, 03:11:50 PM Bonk! (http://www.teamfortress.com/scoutupdate/sandman.htm)
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 17, 2009, 03:14:00 PM Oh wow.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 17, 2009, 03:29:59 PM Oh my god are snipers going to hate me.
Unfortunately I won't be able to double-jump over to laugh at them up close. :( Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 17, 2009, 03:42:06 PM Yeah, losing the double jump is a pretty brutal trade off. I can't wait for scout rush stun wars on 2fort though.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 17, 2009, 05:27:57 PM I'm actually really uninspired by this. So far, the melee weapon upgrades have been quite good, but giving up the double jump is way too harsh a penalty for me.
Hopefully the others are better. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 17, 2009, 05:44:27 PM How powerful this is dependent on the length of the stun.
If its 1-3/4ish seconds, totally not worth it to lose the jump. If long range hits get you something like 10, totally worth it. We'll see. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 17, 2009, 05:52:29 PM If it works on turrets, OH MAN.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 17, 2009, 05:59:32 PM Also, is chain-stunning possible? If so, that makes it much more useful.
Or is TF2 about to introduce CC immunity? :awesome_for_real: EDIT: Oh god, if this is possible, it took me five seconds (4.999 seconds longer than it will take any griefer) to discover the fun here. Lock down an enemy for ten minutes on an isolated part of the map, ahoy! Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Kail on February 17, 2009, 06:09:09 PM Seems to me like most of the utility would be from mucking up ubers, though I'd need more detail on how it works. What happens when you smack an ubering medic with it? Does he just become unable to move, does it remove the uber from his target, does it remove the uber from him and his target, or what?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 17, 2009, 09:33:46 PM I'm actually really uninspired by this. So far, the melee weapon upgrades have been quite good, but giving up the double jump is way too harsh a penalty for me. Hopefully the others are better. I'd gladly give up the double jump on Badwater. It'll also be handy for defense on Dustbowl 2.* and 3.*. I can see myself using it, but it is definitely a sidegrade. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: TripleDES on February 17, 2009, 09:37:36 PM All their reasoning about ditching the spy grenade just went out of the window...
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 17, 2009, 09:55:40 PM Yeah, the crowd control floodgates are probably opening. Slowing body-shots for the sniper! Gas grenades for the spy! CC immunities and anti-CC trinkets! And cooldowns...cooldowns...cooldowns!! Its all coming now :oh_i_see:
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: caladein on February 18, 2009, 02:13:05 AM Yeah, the crowd control floodgates are probably opening. Slowing body-shots for the sniper! Gas grenades for the spy! CC immunities and anti-CC trinkets! And cooldowns...cooldowns...cooldowns!! Its all coming now :oh_i_see: http://www.steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/natascha.htm (http://www.steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/natascha.htm) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 18, 2009, 06:55:20 AM Yeah, the crowd control floodgates are probably opening. Slowing body-shots for the sniper! Gas grenades for the spy! CC immunities and anti-CC trinkets! And cooldowns...cooldowns...cooldowns!! Its all coming now :oh_i_see: http://www.steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/natascha.htm (http://www.steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/natascha.htm) At least if you get slowed you are still playing the game and in control of your player. If you get stunned, you might as well /afk sammich :ye_gods: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on February 18, 2009, 02:29:57 PM http://www.teamfortress.com/scoutupdate/watchtower_and_junction.htm
Two new community maps arena_watchtower created by Joshua ‘JoshuaC’ Shiflet An Arena map that plays unlike any of Valve’s Arena maps, with a heavy focus on vertical space and long, open sight lines. Control of the central building is a key decision that teams must wrestle over. More Sniper friendly than most Arena maps, it’s a perfect complement to the Scout update. Batter up! cp_junction created by Sean ‘Heyo’ Cutino A Gravel-Pit style map that the community has been heckling us to include for months. Junction is a sharp contrast to Watchtower. It’s full of tight spaces and short sight lines, which create combat opportunities dominated by ambushes and explosive weaponry. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 18, 2009, 03:16:59 PM Does this mean the update is hitting next week?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 18, 2009, 03:35:16 PM Does this mean the update is hitting next week? Next Tuesday. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 18, 2009, 04:35:20 PM Nobody plays Arena, and Junction sucks (I hate Steel-type maps, this is one in spades). Next plz.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 18, 2009, 04:39:29 PM If Junction is the pretty-but-fucking-claustrophobic map I'm thinking of, I pretty much have to agree.
Funny how roughly a decade later nobody's come up with anything that can beat 2fort and dustbowl. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 18, 2009, 07:01:15 PM Shut yo mouth. Arena is tons of fun. Killing the last two people as a medic to win the round is all sorts of :drill:. It does need tweaks though; I prefer it with crits off and a one medic limit.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 18, 2009, 08:37:36 PM Nobody plays Arena, and Junction sucks (I hate Steel-type maps, this is one in spades). Next plz. How is junction like Steel? This is a gravel-pit style map. It is WAY too small for pub server play, and arguably too small even for smaller league play. And yeah, Arena sucks. Uninspired by the maps released here. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 19, 2009, 02:15:59 PM http://www.teamfortress.com/scoutupdate/energydrink.htm
Apparently the scout likes Nuka Cola. Also, double payload? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 19, 2009, 09:28:08 PM I was arena'ing earlier, and I got the new Watchtower map. It's a circular area, with the checkpoint at the top of the tower.
We only had 5v5 teams, so it was hard to get a feel for it, but it seems like it might be fun. Snipers are definitely going to be key to the map, but it doesn't look like it's going to be the fish-in-a-barrel that I was dreading. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 19, 2009, 09:38:52 PM Scouts get stun and invincibility? How long a cooldown will Cloak of Shadows...er, the cola...have?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 19, 2009, 10:56:01 PM Yeah, if the soda can is a self-uber that slows the scout down after it runs out, which is what it sounds like, I'm not a fan. I'd be all in favor of something that sped him up while making him more fragile, but something that lets him ignore damage seems all wrong.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 19, 2009, 11:09:13 PM I doubt he'll become invincible, but will just have an incredibly high chance to dodge bullets. Could be a cool mechanic to counter level 1 sentries.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 19, 2009, 11:15:00 PM I doubt he'll become invincible, but will just have an incredibly high chance to dodge bullets. Could be a cool mechanic to counter level 1 sentries. Depends on whether it allows him to dodge flames and explosives (and spy knife and melee damage, I guess, although thats less important) too. If it does, that could be pretty overpowered depending on the duration of the cola. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 19, 2009, 11:20:06 PM I doubt he'll become invincible, but will just have an incredibly high chance to dodge bullets. Could be a cool mechanic to counter level 1 sentries. Since sentries can only rotate so fast, a good counter for level 1 sentries is running past them really fast. An item that provided that ability rather than give a blanket "you take no damage" ability would have been much cooler and fit with the scout's playstyle. The "dodging bullets" thing is only cool if you get to see the scout do the matrix thing when it happens. And it would be better if it tied into the gameplay for the scout rather than being an automatic invisible shield. As it is I'm guessing it's going to be more like "you have the scout squarely in your crosshairs, he's standing perfectly still, and you fire. MISS! Try again when the cola buff wears off." Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 19, 2009, 11:51:31 PM You can strafe sentries now (I think; I'm still too noob w/ scout to pull it off), but you can't outrun bullets; the hit is determined when the shot is fired, and sentries don't miss.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 20, 2009, 12:00:03 AM They never fire at all if they can't draw a bead on you, though. Your angular velocity relative to the sentry just needs to be greater than its turning rate, and it'll never get you.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 20, 2009, 12:15:08 AM If your radius to the sentry is short, sure. But the feel of it (since I've no numbers) is that they couldn't boost your speed fast enough to actually outrun the LOS arc of a sentry shot at anything more than a few feet away. If I don't take cover the instant a turret gets LOS on me, I'm getting hit.
I mean, maybe they could, but I have trouble keeping my bearings straight now. Giving the scout much more speed seems like it would be too difficult to control to be worth using. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 20, 2009, 12:20:39 AM I wouldn't even be averse to having a sentry-specific effect where it tracks slower in the presence of this particular buff, to give the effect of the scout moving in "bullet time" without actually moving that fast. Assuming that what they're going for here is even a sentry counter. It's having an actual human player draw a bead on you and make a perfect shot and then be told that it missed because he didn't roll high enough that just doesn't sit right.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 20, 2009, 12:47:12 AM Well, I don't think bypassing sentries is the main purpose, but who knows. I'm thinking the intention is to improve scout elusiveness on maps like 2fort, which is sniper/sentry hell. I don't see it being very useful on Goldrush. Maybe situational in arenas if the scout is desperate.
It's entirely possible that the chance to dodge will be based on the distance from the shooter. Since the cola takes the pistol slot, you have to get up-close for your scattergun to be effective, and that would give your opponents a better chance to land against you. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 20, 2009, 03:06:44 AM I don't read that description as a "chance to dodge." Sounds more like full-out bullet invincibility to me.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: eldaec on February 20, 2009, 03:16:52 AM Why is it every one of these 'upgrades' is designed to make the game more shitty?
Seriously, so far I hate them all. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 20, 2009, 10:05:34 AM I can't see the cola having a huge impact on the game. Giving up the pistol for an occasional speed boost/dodginess is not an easy decision. I suspect most of my kill shots as a scout are with the pistol; the scattergun is brilliant up close but fairly weak at mid-range. Not to mention the reload time on the scattergun is brutal, and the pistol frequently picks up the slack when you don't have time to reload. The Studio Rumble server has a few really amazing scouts, and they seem to favor their pistol heavily.
I see this as a very situational "weapon", much more so than the most of the other unlocks we've seen thus far. If this effect was in addition to all his other skills it would be crazy, but I think sacrificing the pistol a purely defensive upgrade is a big deal. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 20, 2009, 01:35:03 PM The achievement descriptions are up on the Bonk! page. Looks like some fun stuff in there. Looks like scouts can bat opposing scout stun balls, and that arena is being tweaked to give the first person to kill for the round a buff.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on February 20, 2009, 01:47:10 PM Scattergun replacement seems to be called Force-A-Nature and has a knockback effect.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 20, 2009, 02:10:28 PM Scattergun replacement seems to be called Force-A-Nature and has a knockback effect. Linky? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: LK on February 20, 2009, 02:13:29 PM Scattergun replacement seems to be called Force-A-Nature and has a knockback effect. Linky? It's in the achievement descriptions. Lots of references to unrecognizable item names. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 20, 2009, 02:45:35 PM Also, the scout can rocket jump with it.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Evil Elvis on February 20, 2009, 02:47:33 PM The picture from the Thurs. update shows the scout holding the new gun. It doesn't have the round chamber above the stock, so you'll probably have to reload both barrels after each shot.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on February 20, 2009, 05:10:24 PM I haven't played well in ages, so I cannot remember how it works.
How is this possible though? Quote Quick Hook: Kill a player in Well before the round starts. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 20, 2009, 05:21:45 PM Rocket jump with new gun then double jump over.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 20, 2009, 05:24:56 PM Beanball: Stun a scout with their own ball.
Oh shit! Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 20, 2009, 05:50:48 PM I haven't played well in ages, so I cannot remember how it works. How is this possible though? Quote Quick Hook: Kill a player in Well before the round starts. With a bit of creative double jumping you can get over the train cars. Alternatively, I suppose you could try to shoot through the gaps, but jumping over seems more viable. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: eldaec on February 22, 2009, 11:33:28 PM As far as I can tell, all the scout upgrades are all strictly better than the originals. What kind of retard designer can possibly think this is a good idea?
The bat becomes the bat only you can long range mezz people (wtf) The pistol was pointless and is replaced by a fucking magic bullet shield (wtf) The shotgun becomes the shotgun, only with knockback (wtf) What they should have done: Bat : More damage much slower swing time - requiring you to time a single swing as you run past someone. Pistol : Replace with cola, but just make it a speed buff at the cost of taking more damage if you are hit, you use the speed to, you know, RUN FAST AND DODGE BULLETS YOURSELF BECAUSE THIS IS A FRICKING FPS NOT A DIKUCLONE. Scattergun : +50% damage, -50% range, I have no issue with adding rocket jumping as it fits the scout concept, but knockback? Fuck that noise. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: eldaec on February 22, 2009, 11:36:40 PM I suspect most of my kill shots as a scout are with the pistol; the scattergun is brilliant up close but fairly weak at mid-range. I'm sure you have far more hours on a Scout and on TF2 than I do, but if this is the case shouldn't you be playing a different class? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 23, 2009, 04:52:48 AM The whole problem the scout has is that once you get in close on your average server (Well, Gravel Pit, 2fort) you're done. Splash damage typically kills you. Allowing the scout throw people around a bit so they can dash off gives the class a bit more flexibility.
I think they're releasing 2 bats. Sandman and Force-A-Nature. Sandman stuns and Force-A-Nature lets you physically hit someone away, which is no where close to how bad you say it is. Do you realize how close you have to get to do that? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: eldaec on February 23, 2009, 05:44:39 AM tbh, the long range mez, invisible bullet shield buffs, and the lack of any significant disadvantage to the unlockables that bothers me more than knockback.
Knocking people out of the way at least makes some sort of sense for the scout concept (unlike mezzing) and doesn't clash with the fps/twitch nature of the game (unlike invisble bullet shields) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 23, 2009, 05:50:27 AM The mezzing is to give the scout some kind of support ability. The only good use for one is pissing people off and intel runs. Keep in mind they haven't posted the downsides to the unlockables yet, though they hint that the energy drink could kill you if you use it too much, so either it's on a timer and drains health or you can chug it back at the cost of possibly getting yourself killed.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on February 23, 2009, 05:56:18 AM You're overreacting. The sandman removes the ability to double-jump, so the stun ability either becomes a means for scouts to take a more direct route and get past defenders, or it opens up new roles in teams for dealing with ubers. Not being able to double-jump will force scouts to take the same routes that all the other classes take, classes which generally have more up-front survivability.
As for the enrgy drink, it removes the scouts' long-range viability and it's a 3-4s boost followed by a snare. It's hardly some form of lol-invincibility buff that will allow scouts to be gods. At best it's a situational tool that helps mobility in a tight corner at the cost of offense. Also, there's more damage in games than just bullets, and I doub't the drink will allow you to dodge explosions, rockets or flames. I'm waiting before I doomcry myself. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 23, 2009, 08:39:44 AM I suspect most of my kill shots as a scout are with the pistol; the scattergun is brilliant up close but fairly weak at mid-range. I'm sure you have far more hours on a Scout and on TF2 than I do, but if this is the case shouldn't you be playing a different class? Nope. The scattergun puts your fragile little self right next to the big baddie, which means all of your maneuverability is with worth pretty much dick. You can circle strafe a heavy, but pretty much other class, including a good medic can put a hurt on you up close. I tend to soften up people with my pistol at long to medium range, switch to scattergun for a couple big hits, and then run away peppering them with the pistol again. Soldiers are the most funt; stay at range plinking at them while they shoot at you with rockets, then when they get annoyed and switch to the shotgun come bounding in to hit them with the scatter gun. Rinse repeat as necessary. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 23, 2009, 08:57:24 AM Yeah, it sounds like you're been the person at the hurting end of a good scout, Eldaec. They're honestly few and far between and these changes are needed to get people to play them as more than cannon fodder.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: K9 on February 23, 2009, 09:28:54 AM I think that was something Valve mentioned on their blog, that the scout is probably the most extreme in the "Easy to learn, hard to master" category.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 23, 2009, 09:47:38 AM I am stoked and have reinstalled TF2 in anticipation.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 23, 2009, 06:32:42 PM Force-A-Nature out.
Huh...unless those barrels do a lot more damage then the regular shotgun, I don't see this as an upgrade. What good does knockback actually DO the scout? If anything, the first shot sends them farther away and makes it harder to hit with the second shot. Given these unlocks, as a pubbie, I think I'd run only with the cola. Maybe an alt setup is to run with the new shotgun and Sandman, but not the cola (so you still have that midrange offense, and losing double jump is somewhat ameliorated by the shotgun jump). Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 23, 2009, 07:48:19 PM The damage-less rocket jump effect sounds like a pretty sweet upgrade.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 23, 2009, 08:00:00 PM I think a lot of people tend to forget that the alternative weapons aren't supposed to be vertical movements in the upgrade department. Almost every weapon is a lateral move in terms of +/- changes.
Tri - A good scout uses his pistol. It has increased accuracy versus other pistols, so you shotty/bat and then pick them off while they have reduced accuracy from being pushed away. Scout isn't a tank, this just increased survivability. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 23, 2009, 08:09:02 PM The Force-A-Nature seems freaking amazing. Someone buy me that shirt.
See, what they needed though, was a way to knock back turrets, or knock them over. "Help me. Is anybody there? I love you." Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 23, 2009, 10:25:29 PM Knockback will be fricking awesome on 2fort. I frequently have people try to block me in with their meatsacks when I'm escaping with their intel. It'll also be nice for clearing folks off of the spires in badlands. I'm curious to see just how bad the reload is.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on February 23, 2009, 11:41:16 PM The first person to master blasting themselves in the air only to switch to the bat and dizzy people while they're mid-air will rape face.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 24, 2009, 07:05:12 AM The first person to master blasting themselves in the air only to switch to the bat and dizzy people while they're mid-air will rape face. My goal for my study break.Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Der Helm on February 24, 2009, 08:44:55 AM Should this not be starting today ?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on February 24, 2009, 11:52:38 AM Probably. I think the heavy update went live on the night when the last item was revealed.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 24, 2009, 11:57:24 AM It should be starting today, but never expect Valve to be timely.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 24, 2009, 04:41:33 PM (http://i44.tinypic.com/2qbg8ja.jpg)
(http://i42.tinypic.com/20gno05.jpg) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 24, 2009, 04:45:16 PM I no longer allow myself to truly believe in a Valve update until I see it sitting on my hard drive. For whatever reason, they're incapable of keeping to the schedules they post. Expecting otherwise only leads to heartbreak.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 24, 2009, 04:46:05 PM It's true!
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 24, 2009, 06:14:55 PM Damn you all for making me think about it. I would have happily forgotten about the update until it'd been out for a few days, but now I'm here refreshing the stupid update page looking for the "Coming Tuesday" that will inevitably not appear until sometime tomorrow.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 24, 2009, 07:10:11 PM Update just started downloading.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on February 24, 2009, 07:49:55 PM Final update is pretty disappointing. All it is is the results of the poll. No new "Meet the..." video. No new game mode. No new Valve map (especially since the background of the Bonk picture looked like a double payload map). The entire scout update is 3 unlockables, some achievements, an update to an old map, and 2 maps that someone else made for them for free.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 24, 2009, 10:19:02 PM Man that just sucks. I'm just going to have to spend 30 hours playing with the new scout toys on new maps. Shucks. Maybe I should just kill myself.
I am bummed about not getting the double payload map or whatever the hell that is. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Triforcer on February 24, 2009, 10:35:50 PM Actual details of the weapons are already on the steam forums-
(1) Bonk puts you in third person for 3-4 seconds- no shooting, but immunity from ALL damage (yes, all). (2) FAN apparently doesn't do any more damage per bullet, but reload isn't actually ungodly slow. (3) You get one ball. You can either retrieve it from where you shot it, or it comes back in roughly 20 seconds. Also, spy backstab is now instantaneous (!). However, sidestab has been removed (please to be telling me how to get snipers now?) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 24, 2009, 11:04:46 PM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX__swbUwag&fmt=18
amazing. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 24, 2009, 11:24:59 PM All the terrible scouts are fucking awesome fun.
:awesome_for_real: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on February 25, 2009, 09:17:26 AM They make great firewood though.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: LK on February 25, 2009, 09:43:22 AM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX__swbUwag&fmt=18 amazing. WOW. Holy shit. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Xurtan on February 25, 2009, 10:14:23 AM Yeah, nice moves mumbles!
Look at this, just caved in your skull, my bat's still dry. No clumps of hair, nothing. I think the heavy and pyro ones are my favorite. :heart: Instant spy stabs now? Woot and stuff. No more missing because I suck at flickstabbing. Although trying to stab snipers might be interesting. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on February 25, 2009, 11:37:38 AM I haven't had a chance to play this yet, what's the word on how the sandman changes gameplay? Are people really stopping ubers with it?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: schild on February 25, 2009, 11:38:10 AM I haven't had a chance to play this yet, what's the word on how the sandman changes gameplay? Are people really stopping ubers with it? Didn't see that last night. Maybe though. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Xurtan on February 25, 2009, 12:15:28 PM The long range stun length on the Sandman seems pretty ridiculous. I can see a Scout that has gotten good with the ball being a bane to all Snipers. (It does make me wonder how hard the ball is to see being shot at you, however. Will a Sniper see it coming and be able to move in time?)
Do regular ammo packs increase the ball regen, like the Spy cloak, or is it one ammo one ball, no matter the size ammo pack? :ye_gods: As long as you have the ammo you could theoretically chain stun someone. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Yoru on February 25, 2009, 02:36:52 PM Does the bat have increased damage? If not, fuck this update. I want my beta bat back.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Xurtan on February 25, 2009, 02:52:37 PM It's actually -50% damage vs non-stunned players. :awesome_for_real:
...And it's slower. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Yoru on February 25, 2009, 04:32:52 PM Fuck this update.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 25, 2009, 06:00:16 PM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX__swbUwag&fmt=18 Fucking awesome.amazing. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Kail on February 25, 2009, 06:10:53 PM It's actually -50% damage vs non-stunned players. Removed this in today's hotfix, looks like. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: NiX on February 25, 2009, 07:42:51 PM Fuck this update. Quote Gameplay changes - Removed the damage reduction against non-stunned enemies on the new bat Unfuck this update? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Xurtan on February 25, 2009, 08:08:15 PM Meh, still not sure it's worth using. Losing double jump is a huge issue. So far, the ball seems to be really easy to dodge. (How much that will change once people start learning to aim is up for debate.) Still, at max range it seems to be a five sec stun or so. So far I've only seen it hit on huge targets from large range (Read: Heavy on 2fort battlements), in a large melee where it has to hit -something-, or as someone comes around a corner/chasing someone. Haven't seen it used on ubers yet.
It's too bad the knockback on the fan is so horrible; would have been nice to have been able to use it to pseudo-rocket jump. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 25, 2009, 11:38:49 PM The announcer has been disappointed again (http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2293)
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on February 26, 2009, 06:00:18 AM It's too bad the knockback on the fan is so horrible; would have been nice to have been able to use it to pseudo-rocket jump. You can actually get a quite large amount of horizontal distance with it,but not a lot of height, so it does have some use for mobility, but it isn't quite a rocket jump. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 26, 2009, 08:32:41 AM The announcer has been disappointed again (http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2293) (http://www.jlh-design.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/simpsons_nelson_haha3.jpg) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Yoru on February 26, 2009, 10:18:38 AM Fuck this update. Quote Gameplay changes - Removed the damage reduction against non-stunned enemies on the new bat Unfuck this update? No, that's just the removal of retardation. It doesn't return the bat to the awesome beatstick it was before they nerfed it. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on February 26, 2009, 11:44:45 PM Does the FAN do increased damage from behind? I just one-shotted two snipers in a row by hitting them point-blank in the back with the thing. I'm pretty sure you can't one-shot a sniper with a scattergun at any range.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on February 27, 2009, 10:09:05 AM Each individual bullet does less damage, but there is more of them. I believe as long as everything hits it is a good chunk more damage.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 02, 2009, 04:58:31 PM Two weapons unlocked so far.
I really like the FAN, and futzing around with the Pop Fly achievement (kills while double-jumping) in conjunction with the FAN's kickback has opened up some interesting possibilities re: being really hard to hit and getting to interesting places. The kickback is nothing like a normal rocketjump and takes a lot of getting used to before you can use it to actually get anywhere; what it does right off the bat, though, is keep you in the air twice as long when you're just bouncing around like a maniac. This is sometimes a good thing and sometimes a bad thing. Not sure about the Sandman. Whacking the ball around is fun, but it rarely turns the tide of a battle, and I'm really loathe to give up my double-jump. I'll keep it for as long as it takes me to get the bulk of the achievements that rely on it and see if my opinion changes during that time. Side note: what goddamn genius decided to make the ball the primary fire of the Sandman instead of the secondary? What if something's right in front of me and I just need to club it? Additional edit: It's really funny how after playing L4D for a while I keep right-clicking in an attempt to bash people with my pistol. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 06, 2009, 08:48:21 AM Getting better with the Sandman. Trick to using it effectively seems to be stun, rush in, double-shot with the FAN. The stun will always last long enough for you to get up to point-blank range, so if your victim is alone, there is absolutely nothing stopping you from hitting them with every single pellet. This is death for most classes.
Contrary to what I'd thought, it does not seem possible to hit the ball with the bat. You get the "bean ball" achievement for picking up a fallen ball from another scout and beaning him with it, not batting it straight back at him. (I got this last night by sheer accident.) The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Valmorian on March 06, 2009, 08:54:03 AM The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it. Hm, can you drink it while you have the briefcase? Does it make sentry guns miss? (that would be nice for zipping through 2forts chokepoints where there's usually sentries set up..) Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 06, 2009, 09:32:05 AM It does make sentries miss, but I don't think you can use it while carrying intel (it would be inconsistent with their usual rule of get-out-of-jail-free cards not working in combination with capturing objectives).
The best use for it seems to be acting as a distraction for your teammates, i.e. getting all the defenders to abandon their posts chasing the invincible guy so your heavy hitters can surprise them from behind. Really coordinated teams will use it to take out sentries by having the scout sit there soaking up bullets while the rest of the team rushes in to blow them up (they just have to do it before the scout's juice wears off). One thing I do want to try is blowing up an engy with his own gun by running behind him in sight of it. :drill: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on March 07, 2009, 11:22:06 AM The soda is kinda fun for messing with people (HEY HEY HEY LOOK AT ME), but I have yet to do anything really useful with it. Hm, can you drink it while you have the briefcase? Does it make sentry guns miss? (that would be nice for zipping through 2forts chokepoints where there's usually sentries set up..) The best use for it is to Act as a cheap "uber" and stand directly in front of a sentry gun to block the bullets while a demo man comes in behind and destroys it. It isn't realy good solo, cause all it does is buy you a few seconds of invulnerability, and when it is over you get dramatically slowed for 3-5 seconds, meaning whoever you just saved yourself from is going to come and beat the crap out of you now that they can catch you easily. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Kail on March 08, 2009, 09:48:03 PM It does make sentries miss, but I don't think you can use it while carrying intel (it would be inconsistent with their usual rule of get-out-of-jail-free cards not working in combination with capturing objectives). Pretty sure it does, or at least, you can drink it right before you get the intel. Saw a couple scouts do that today, unless I'm mistaken. Personally, I'm not liking this update. The new bat is stupidly annoying in the hands of a decent player. The other two aren't bad, but the FAN seems to be like a slightly cheesier version of the normal gun, and the Cola is pretty useless. Ugh. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 08, 2009, 11:28:08 PM I do think the scout might be a little overpowered now. I was initially skeptical of the Sandman, but I'm so consistently raping face with it now that I'm starting to feel bad about it. The FAN isn't quite as unbalancing, but the fact that I can't imagine ever switching back to the original scattergun at this point is a pretty good indicator that it could stand a little toning down.
Ironically, the one item I thought was going to be gamebreaking (the invuln soda) is the one that has turned out to be completely useless. So that'll teach me to prognosticate. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on March 09, 2009, 10:53:50 AM I still haven't picked up any of the unlocks, but having been on the receiving end quite a bit it feels like the Sandman is overpowered in 1 vs 1 matchups, but doesn't help much in larger conflicts. It does help some in breaking up overly defensive teams on ctf maps, but outside of that it is a minor annoyance. 1 vs 1 it is brutal, especially since the point blank range stun is plenty long enough for the scout to unload the FAN into my poor helpless medic body.
The FAN seems pretty awesome, but I'm not sure if it is overpowered. I think in the hands of a skilled scout it is a vicious weapon, but a lot of the scouts I've played against are pretty horrible with it. I've also found that in scout on scout battles the scatter gun is pretty damn good against FAN scouts. The soda seems useful in very limited situations. It is sweet to have an uber in a can for distracting turrets for teammates, but that's about it. I'm curious to try it on goldrush. I think it could be handy for breaking behind enemy lines to molest snipers. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on March 09, 2009, 09:50:20 PM I'm actually of the opinion that the Sandman isn't unbalanced (which is to say, I don't think it has a huge impact on the outcome of most matches, at least public matches, I left the competitive scene a while back and don't even know their general stance on unlockables anymore). It is however, really farking stupid. There is simply nothing more annoying than being stopped dead and just waiting to die. Awful mechanic, has me playing the game less than before the update.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: ClydeJr on March 11, 2009, 07:34:19 AM Incredibly lucky Sandman shot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pz90sWPPbbE)
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on March 20, 2009, 10:33:07 PM Jesus the FAN is fun. Being able to jump onto the roof of the bridge from ground level in 2fort is :drill: :drill: :drill:. Not to mention the awesome fucking jumps you can pull off on cp_well. I can'wait to try cp_egypt with this thing.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on March 21, 2009, 01:36:22 PM Jesus the FAN is fun. Being able to jump onto the roof of the bridge from ground level in 2fort is :drill: :drill: :drill:. Not to mention the awesome fucking jumps you can pull off on cp_well. I can'wait to try cp_egypt with this thing. Not using the sandman are we? Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Hoax on March 21, 2009, 03:41:00 PM I hate the new scout, anyone without perfect ping playing as a scout is so fucking annoying and like 20 times more people use them then before the update.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on March 21, 2009, 06:44:32 PM Not yet, I have a stack of achievements to get first. I haven't even picked up Bonk! yet. I'm addicted to mobility, so I suspect I'll avoid the Sandman. We'll see; stuns do look like a lot of fun.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 30, 2009, 11:21:59 PM WOOOOO
This screenshot taken in front of the BLU base. The sniper drew his last breath on the RED battlements. :drill: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on March 31, 2009, 07:26:58 AM I don't know how to feel about your non-achievement box antics.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 31, 2009, 09:45:21 AM Are you saying you achievement-boxed Zombie Genocide?
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on March 31, 2009, 09:57:57 AM Are you saying you achievement-boxed Zombie Genocide? Of course not, just like I didn't achievement-box getting a million pyro damage or healing for a million points. But I did achievement-box "Out of the Park". :awesome_for_real: Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on March 31, 2009, 09:59:53 AM I won't lie. I considered it. But the adrenaline rush of finally pulling it off on a live target was worth it. The guy actually stepped out of the way while I was winding up, and then stepped back right as the swing came. :drill:
This is after swatting maybe ten snipers into a wall because the angle was wrong, and having maybe three times where I had the shot lined up perfectly and one of their teammates shot me in the back before I could finish the swing. All the stars had to be aligned perfectly. (edit) oh ya, I got Foul Territory the day before that, which was also one that had stumped me for a while. Stunned a medic on ctf_well as he was crossed the tracks with our intel, and SPLAT. I was too excited to take a screenshot. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Valmorian on March 31, 2009, 10:59:10 AM Personally I'm surprised that Steam games don't automatically screen shot every time you get an achievement. It's not like they're THAT frequent after all.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Prospero on March 31, 2009, 11:28:59 AM I'm not sure a screen shot would be terribly exciting, but a video would be cool in some cases. I'd love a video of when I got Moonshot and Bean ball from the ball's perspective.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on April 01, 2009, 01:55:36 PM A video of Out of the Park from the corpse's perspective would be :why_so_serious:.
Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Ookii on April 03, 2009, 06:57:55 AM Quote It's been a couple of weeks since we posted, so we thought it'd be good to do some housekeeping. The next class pack will focus on the Sniper. It's actually shaping up to be the largest TF2 update yet, with multiple new maps and a bunch of gameplay tweaks. In addition, we've got another update in the works that should be done before the Sniper, and that one will include some new content for all classes. The XBox 360 update is still being worked on. If you're wondering what's taking so long, since the content is "done" on the PC already, it's mostly been around fitting it all onto the XBox. The original version of TF2 in the Orange Box was very close to the XBox's memory limit, and all the additional TF2 content we've produced has pushed well beyond it. We've found a couple of nifty ways to get back a bunch of that memory, but it's turned out to be a lot of work, and that's what most of our time is being spent on. In the meantime, we're going to get a code update out to address the server cheating that's going on. Like many other folks online, the TF2 team has been loving the Top 10 TF2 Plays of the Week videos that Push Gaming has been doing. If you haven't seen them yet, you can catch week 1, and week 2. We're hoping for a third one soon, but we can't really complain. If we were doing them ourselves, you'd probably see the third one sometime next year. While waiting though, you can check out the exploits of some of the Sniper's countrymen in the second frag video of Aussie clan Mad Dogz. http://teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2394 (http://teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2394) SNIPER NEXT! Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Malakili on April 03, 2009, 11:25:41 AM SNIPER NEXT! I'm a little baffled by this choice to be honest. I play sniper quite a bit, and I really don't think it needs to have a high priority for changes. I mean, I know they don't make the add ons just as "buffs" but they do try to make the classes more appealing when they are underplayed, or viable when the are not useful it certain situations. As it stands, snipers fill their role nicely, are useful on pretty much every valve-made map, can be used on offense or defense. I'd much rather see Engineer or Spy next, to be honest, as I think they need the most work. Sure, they did recently receive a little patch that made them slightly more viable, but Engineers and Spies have suffered the most from the evolution of the game, as the community has become increasingly good at countering them as they've become more experienced. Title: Re: [TF2] Scout Update Post by: Samwise on April 03, 2009, 11:32:28 AM As it stands, snipers fill their role nicely, are useful on pretty much every valve-made map, can be used on offense or defense. I'd much rather see Engineer or Spy next, to be honest, as I think they need the most work. Sure, they did recently receive a little patch that made them slightly more viable, but Engineers and Spies have suffered the most from the evolution of the game, as the community has become increasingly good at countering them as they've become more experienced. If I were them I'd be holding off on further Spy/Engy tweaks until everyone's gotten used to their most recent buffs. Spy is very different with the cloaking change, and Engy has gotten much more viable on offense with the upgradeable teleports. We should start a new thread for speculating on the sniper changes. |