Title: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Lakov_Sanite on December 24, 2008, 08:40:29 AM Quote IRVINE, Calif. - December 23, 2008 - Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. today announced that World of Warcraft®, its award-winning subscription-based massively multiplayer online role-playing game, is now played by more than 11.5 million subscribers worldwide. This new high was reached following the November 13 release of the game’s second expansion, Wrath of the Lich King™. Within its first 24 hours of availability, Wrath of the Lich King sold more than 2.8 million copies, making it the fastest-selling PC game of all time. In addition to winning a number of editor’s choice awards from major gaming publications, the expansion has now gone on to sell more than 4 million copies in its first month, setting a new record for monthly PC-game sales. Both sales records were previously held by World of Warcraft's first expansion, The Burning Crusade. “We’re pleased to welcome the new and returning players who have helped World of Warcraft reach these new milestones, and we appreciate the enthusiasm and support that the game’s global community has continued to show,” said Mike Morhaime, CEO and cofounder of Blizzard Entertainment. “We look forward to providing all of them with an excellent entertainment experience for a long time to come.” “Not only is Wrath of the Lich King still doing well, the base World of Warcraft game and the World of Warcraft Battle Chest® are performing better than last year,” said Bob McKenzie, senior vice president of merchandising at GameStop. “That type of traction is very impressive for a game that is going into its fifth holiday season and speaks to the enthusiastic player base Blizzard Entertainment products have.” So it's no surprise that the expansion was a hit but if i remember their last subs updates was 10.5 million so it gave them another one million boost?! This is getting a tad crazy now, any thoughts on when the supposed decline actually starts? Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: HaemishM on December 24, 2008, 09:06:58 AM When Blizzard releases its next MMO?
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: rattran on December 24, 2008, 09:10:33 AM WoW is still better than the alternatives if you want a fantasy mmog. Until that changes I don't see a decline, and as Haemish says, the eventual WoWkiller mmo will likely come from Blizzard.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Trippy on December 24, 2008, 09:15:02 AM No last number was on 10/23/2008 where they said "over 11 million" so WotLK actually gave a rather small boost.
(http://pandadesigns.com/f13/wow_chart_20081223.jpg) Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Lakov_Sanite on December 24, 2008, 09:36:08 AM No last number was on 10/23/2008 where they said "over 11 million" so WotLK actually gave a rather small boost. (http://pandadesigns.com/f13/wow_chart_20081223.jpg) Ah good point though it's kind of sad when a 'small boost' is more than most current mmo's have in subs total. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Venkman on December 24, 2008, 09:47:33 AM Actually, I'd even question WotLK's "small boost". More likely, the boost came in throughout the year against a slightly smaller amount of people leaving through normal attraction/attrition ratios. The "boost" WotLK gave was probably more to re-upping lapsed users.
Which I think is even more important than an expansion boosting a game. It shows that WoW continues to grow even four years later. What game since EQ1 has been able to claim that? Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Trippy on December 24, 2008, 11:08:36 AM Which I think is even more important than an expansion boosting a game. It shows that WoW continues to grow even four years later. What game since EQ1 has been able to claim that? EVE?Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Jobu on December 24, 2008, 11:50:26 AM Countries with less population than WoW include:
Greece, Portugal, Sweden, Czech Republic, Cuba, Austria, Serbia, and Senegal. The list goes on and on. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Viin on December 24, 2008, 12:56:55 PM Which I think is even more important than an expansion boosting a game. It shows that WoW continues to grow even four years later. What game since EQ1 has been able to claim that? EVE?I do believe EVE is growing in subscriber numbers, but it is inflated by the fact that having a 2nd account is very useful (though by no means required). While subscriber numbers continue to grow steadily, I would guess 30-50% of new subscriptions are in fact a 2nd account for an already existing player. That said, when it comes to money, # of subscriptions is all that matters. Matter of fact, if I made an MMO, the first thing I'd do is find a way to make secondary accounts useful but not required. Secondary accounts have the highest ROI by a long shot. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Cheddar on December 24, 2008, 01:22:21 PM I do believe EVE is growing in subscriber numbers, but it is inflated by the fact that having a 2nd account is very useful (though by no means required). While subscriber numbers continue to grow steadily, I would guess 30-50% of new subscriptions are in fact a 2nd account for an already existing player. That said, when it comes to money, # of subscriptions is all that matters. Matter of fact, if I made an MMO, the first thing I'd do is find a way to make secondary accounts useful but not required. Secondary accounts have the highest ROI by a long shot. Do secondary accounts cost less? Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Merusk on December 24, 2008, 01:42:28 PM Sometimes, I think is the answer. They run specials every now and then as 2nd acct incentives.
The real question is, how have their sub numbers done since they nerfed the "no training while unsubbed "bug." Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: ajax34i on December 24, 2008, 02:55:33 PM Judging by what I remember the server peaks to be on Sundays, and the current numbers shown by EVE-Offline (http://www.eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility), their sub numbers have increased since the "no training while unsubbed". By quite a bit, actually. Their all-time high used to be 42k, half a year ago, and before the start of all these recent wars (Goons vs. Stain/RA, whatever's going on in the North), I wasn't seeing the server go above 39k, week after week, but now it's 43k.
I guess, with EVE, the population numbers will go up or down based on whether or not the major alliances are "having fun" or are bored out of their minds and not maintaining their subscriptions. Whether an expansion is released (or not) seems to have less impact than drama or a new war. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Malakili on December 24, 2008, 04:14:41 PM I guess, with EVE, the population numbers will go up or down based on whether or not the major alliances are "having fun" or are bored out of their minds and not maintaining their subscriptions. Whether an expansion is released (or not) seems to have less impact than drama or a new war. Thats actually a really interesting observation. If true, it means that they have really succeeded in creating a player driven game, but it also raises the question of what can the creator of such a game do to retain as many subs as possible without giving up the player-driven aspect of the game. Still, evens consistently growing numbers, regardless of where the subs are coming from, does seem to indicate that CCP is doing SOMETHING right. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: TripleDES on December 24, 2008, 04:38:26 PM I do believe EVE is growing in subscriber numbers, but it is inflated by the fact that having a 2nd account is very useful (though by no means required). Multiaccounting is common in WOW, too.My ex-brother-in-law, who never really played computer games or never was good with computers, had two WOW accounts. Friends of him were supposedly also multiaccounting. PS: Ex-brother-in-law thanks to WOW. :why_so_serious: Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Triforcer on December 24, 2008, 05:08:30 PM Careful. If you imply that WoW has ended marriages, you may become an international media sensation.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: TripleDES on December 24, 2008, 05:22:14 PM Situation was more hilarious than the standard cut'n'dry WOW relationship killer.
While he was busy all day, when he was not at work, playing his damn game, their relationship stagnated. My sister ended up hanging all day on her computer surfing the web, chatting and god knows what. At some point, he started losing interest in WOW, noticed that my sister was bothering more about her surf experience than him (i.e. a similar situation the other way around), he got upset and things escalated in a decent manner. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Lantyssa on December 25, 2008, 08:00:47 AM Careful. If you imply that WoW has ended marriages, you may become an international media sensation. Every now and then we should agree on a random obvious but silly topic for a thread, then have Raph post it to his blog. We can make a fun game of seeing how many are turned into international stories. It'll be a riot.Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: K9 on December 28, 2008, 04:10:52 PM When will the plateau come?
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: NiX on December 28, 2008, 04:28:01 PM Every now and then we should agree on a random obvious but silly topic for a thread, then have Raph post it to his blog. We can make a fun game of seeing how many are turned into international stories. It'll be a riot. The problem with this is, like with one site who intentionally made false news, their "reputation" was tarnished in the eyes of Kotaku.Seriously, write up some ground rules and let's get Raph on board. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Slyfeind on December 28, 2008, 05:42:24 PM I know one I know one! Let's say I met someone in an online game and we got married, but they were cheating on me by cybering with someone else online, and oh forget it.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Murgos on December 28, 2008, 06:01:33 PM Countries with less population than WoW include: Greece, Portugal, Sweden, Czech Republic, Cuba, Austria, Serbia, and Senegal. The list goes on and on. This combined with the 'not hiring WoW players' thread leads me to think I have found the source of the economic crisis... Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Goreschach on December 28, 2008, 07:36:27 PM I know one I know one! Let's say I met someone in an online game and we got married, but they were cheating on me by cybering with someone else online, and oh forget it. If you're going to rehash yesterday's news, you need to spice it up. How about if the guy she was cheating with turned out to be one of the army's WoW bots? Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Slayerik on December 28, 2008, 08:09:25 PM Careful. If you imply that WoW has ended marriages, you may become an international media sensation. Tri, usually I see your posts and sometimes cringe....but this one was fun of win. And that almost rhymed. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Ratman_tf on December 28, 2008, 08:18:51 PM I know one I know one! Let's say I met someone in an online game and we got married, but they were cheating on me by cybering with someone else online, and oh forget it. If you're going to rehash yesterday's news, you need to spice it up. How about if the guy she was cheating with turned out to be one of the army's WoW bots? I'd make it so the chick was really a transvestite and he found out on their wedding night. Surprise! Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Daztur on December 28, 2008, 09:51:52 PM Meh.
How many of these are people who pay monthly and not hourly (Chinese)? In any case, I'm sure a bit chunk of those numbers are Chinese people who haven't played in months but don't bother cancelling their account since they have no reason to since they just pay hourly. I'm sure that WoW has a lot more revenue than any other MMORPG, but these numbers really aren't a good metric of WoW's success. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Trippy on December 28, 2008, 09:55:19 PM Meh. About half.How many of these are people who pay monthly and not hourly (Chinese)? Quote In any case, I'm sure a bit chunk of those numbers are Chinese people who haven't played in months but don't bother cancelling their account since they have no reason to since they just pay hourly. They don't count those. Basically those "subscription" numbers are the number of monthly subscriptions (Western-style) plus the time card accounts that have logged on in the last month (Asian-style).Edit: clarified Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Xerapis on December 28, 2008, 10:04:22 PM HAI GUYZ!
Let's have the "over-inflated Asian numbers fuck up total subscription numbers" argument all over again! Thing to remember: Let's say Blizzard "adjusts" their numbers inaccurately. Let's say they tell us DOUBLE the actual subscriber numbers. Pretty big lie. How do they compare exactly to the nearest competition? The numbers don't have to be a good metric. EVERYONE in the proper demographic knowing about the game? That's a pretty damn good metric. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Trippy on December 28, 2008, 10:26:39 PM Blizzard's always been upfront about how they count. It's in every press release that announces subscriber numbers.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Xerapis on December 28, 2008, 10:51:48 PM Oh, sure. You know it, I know it, and Schild could probably write a fucking dissertation on how subscriber numbers are recorded and reported. He might even be able to do it without referencing HE WHO MUST NOT BE NAMED :why_so_serious:
But for others..... (http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t51/Xerapis/readingishard.jpg) Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: UnSub on December 29, 2008, 05:02:52 AM I'm sure that WoW has a lot more revenue than any other MMORPG, but these numbers really aren't a good metric of WoW's success. You're right. How about we use the "WoW makes Blizzard over $US 1 billion dollars a year in revenue" (http://au.gamespot.com/news/6185347.html) as a metric? Profitability of 40% at that level too Alternatively, discount 50% of WoW's players as "foreign" and you still have the biggest MMO in the English-speaking world. WoW: the biggest, no matter how you cut it. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: kildorn on December 29, 2008, 05:17:54 AM I love the "those are all canceled, based on the evidence that this one guy I know totally canceled his account and thus THE END IS NEAR.
WoW's going to keep growing for a while. They've established market dominance and managed to make the entire game about people trying to compete with them on their own turf, while missing the backing cash and the development time that goes into a few expansions. They're in the same spot EQ used to be in. Everyone else needs to make something you'd like So Much that you'd leave established social and character relationships to jump ship to. Even if your game is slightly better than WoW, it's not better than WoW + your friends. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Venkman on December 29, 2008, 05:44:26 AM I think the days of relying on the aggregate attention of individual gamers are over. The more recent strategies include going after as many guilds as possible (not just the ubers) and trying to get more people who've never played an MMO before (of which there are plenty, as long as you're not trying to sell a fantasy-based diku).
The thing about marketing though is you need to have, like, a good game to back it up :awesome_for_real: Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Jeff Kelly on January 07, 2009, 03:48:54 AM The most important thing is that WoW now has critical mass. I see a lot of people playing it or coming fresh to it that never vere playxed any computer games at all. Why? Because their friends/family/colleagues at work play it.
For some it's basically the new ICQ/AIM/Skype, a way to keep in touch with people, for others it's a replacement for network TV or other entertainment but everybody knows someone who plays so they are more likely to play themselves and it can be played on anything that is at least 5 years old wich is also a bonus. So WoW will keep on growing for some time I presume. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Sunbury on January 07, 2009, 05:10:27 AM I think the days of relying on the aggregate attention of individual gamers are over. The more recent strategies include going after as many guilds as possible (not just the ubers) and trying to get more people who've never played an MMO before (of which there are plenty, as long as you're not trying to sell a fantasy-based diku). The thing about marketing though is you need to have, like, a good game to back it up :awesome_for_real: Humm, I just had an idea.... I've always read on these boards how important being in a guild / online friends in game are important for keeping players, or adding new ones. Instead of a MMO company supporting guilds, what if they 'secretly' started forming guilds and recruiting? Not by hiring people, but buy 'paying off' existing players / guilds leaders in some way to actively recruit, help new players, keep players interested. Pay via free accounts, special in-game items, prestige, etc. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: DraconianOne on January 07, 2009, 06:06:16 AM Secrets don't remain secrets for long.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: FatuousTwat on January 07, 2009, 06:40:24 AM I think the days of relying on the aggregate attention of individual gamers are over. The more recent strategies include going after as many guilds as possible (not just the ubers) and trying to get more people who've never played an MMO before (of which there are plenty, as long as you're not trying to sell a fantasy-based diku). The thing about marketing though is you need to have, like, a good game to back it up :awesome_for_real: Humm, I just had an idea.... I've always read on these boards how important being in a guild / online friends in game are important for keeping players, or adding new ones. Instead of a MMO company supporting guilds, what if they 'secretly' started forming guilds and recruiting? Not by hiring people, but buy 'paying off' existing players / guilds leaders in some way to actively recruit, help new players, keep players interested. Pay via free accounts, special in-game items, prestige, etc. They already tried that in EVE. HEYOOOOOO! Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Ragnoros on January 07, 2009, 05:07:45 PM Well played Sir.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Dren on January 09, 2009, 06:54:12 AM I don't know much about a "small boost," but I'm seeing evidence from most servers (including my own,) that their queues are back with a vengeance during prime. My server (strawman) hasn't seen this since about 3 months after the BC release. Even then it was on the weekend during prime time, not during the week. Now it is every damn night.
Has Lich King been released in Asian yet? Either way, that "small boost" had to have been nearly all in the NA servers because we are packed full now. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Dewdrop on January 09, 2009, 08:20:39 AM On my server (Mal'Ganis) I think the que has actually gotten worse since the traditional holiday break has ended. I was hoping that it would lighten up once the HS kids went back to school and whatnot but ive had 600+ que's and and hour or more of waiting time.. And I log in relatively early, mid week. Forget Sunday afternoon, if I'm going to be playing I jump in the que and go grocery shopping or catch up on laundry.. Its insane. Anectdotally it seems alot worse now than it was when LK first came out 2mo ago..
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Venkman on January 09, 2009, 08:35:51 AM The queues were horrific. Four years and a hojillion dollars later and the best they can do is open up more servers. Makes sense since their server architecture was probably decided like eight years ago or something, but still, quite annoying. The queue has gotten shorter since the holidays, but the players are standing in line for longer. As such, no net gain since right around Christmas. Much gnashing of teeth.
This is not a problem I think that can be solved technically at this point. What they should therefore do is something they should have been doing forever: recognize guild alliances and offer to move them en masse. That's about the only way you're going to get many of the established large guilds to budge. Right now most of them are like us: waiting to see who else ditches. Quote from: Sunbury wrote Instead of a MMO company supporting guilds, what if they 'secretly' started forming guilds and recruiting? Not by hiring people, but buy 'paying off' existing players / guilds leaders in some way to actively recruit, help new players, keep players interested. Pay via free accounts, special in-game items, prestige, etc. Too much integration between developers and players leads to UO volunteer crap, the EQ2 guild server move/buff thing and the Eve nonsense. Your idea is good, but I'd rather see it internalized. Hiring GMs and assistants to create guilds can get pricey though, so really, I think one of the better solutions is the NPC starter guilds from Eve. Just doing that gives a sense of camaraderie that being dumped nekkid and alone in a new world does not. What will naturally happen is a few players will become the defacto leaders of the guild anyway, feeling like they "own" it alongside the NPCs. But this is players doing what they want, not something the company sanctions. As such, they are protected from the legal bullshit of pissed off players who think they're more important than they really are. Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Nebu on January 09, 2009, 08:45:10 AM How about offering incentives for the creation and support of seed guilds? Giving players free subs for the maintenence of successful newbie guilds would seem to be a nice marketing tool.
Title: Re: When will this madness end? (wow) Post by: Fordel on January 09, 2009, 01:42:32 PM WoW sorta already did this, no? Maybe I'm high, but I thought Blizzard went out of their way to invite some of the largest and most notorious EQ guilds of the time into their Beta process?
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