f13.net

It's that time of year again, and we've decided it's time to update the house.

First project - the computer room.  30 year old wallpaper and ugly carpet gets the boot, after we finish here it's on to the rest of the house! (hooray  :uhrr:)

I forgot to get a before picture of the computer room, but heres a closeup of the lovely wallpaper:

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000796.jpg)

And the living room (next project) with all the shit from the computer room in it - don't mind the attack chihuahua at the bottom:
(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000795.jpg)

After about 2 hours - wallpaper is fully removed, taking off baseboard, getting ready to texture walls and paint before we lay down the laminate.

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000794.jpg)

More pictures to come as the project goes on, we should be done with painting and have the laminate laid by monday.

God you're hairy. Don't get paint in it.

Ha, thats not me, but I'll let the Yeti know.

Yah, I figured it was his dad.  Looks too old to be Nerf, who I thought was mid/ late 20s.

I just finished putting mohagony hardwood in a hallway and two rooms.  You have my sympathy with the remodel.   

We're doing a stained veneer under the chair rail for the living room as part of the next project, so the computer room paint/floor is just easing into it.

Also, updates!

Computer room is primed and back wall is textured.  We'd be done with the whole thing if there hadn't been a layer of paper that we had to mud over, wait to see what starts peeling off, peel it off, then prime over, wait to see what starts coming off, and peel it.  Royal fucking pain in the ass, the next trip to home depot is to see if we just can go right over the top of the paper wallpaper to texture/paint instead of taking it off.

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000797.jpg)

Side view of the texture:

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000798.jpg)

Closeup-ish:

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000799.jpg)

It's going to be painted sort of a two-tone, wall will be beige and then inside the grooves will be a shade or two darker.
For those concerned, no, I didn't pick out the colors.  Fuck you.

Should be finished painting tomorrow, pics as we go.

I don't like it. Start over you human wookie.

I'm staying at my parents' house for a few weeks while looking for jobs that don't suck ass and they're having an addition put on.  I've never understood how people can build things by just hitting shit for 8 hours a day.  Today they showed up at 6:30 and woke me up an hour earlier than I was expecting to be woken up early.  I'm not a happy man right now.

You're staying at your parents house.  Right now you're not a man at all.  Get your mom to make all your favourite foods and enjoy it while it lasts!

Can I come stay with you and Righ?

I was just going to make a Home Improvement thread, so I'll just piggyback on yours. I don't have Jerry Garcia working on my rooms, though. I've done work all over the house, but here's a couple rooms. First the living room. I was going to put together better before/during/after shots, but the before/during shots are mostly on my home pc and I'm at work.

I forget if I related this story, so forgive me if I have: I had the living room prepped and ready to paint after tearing out the walls and insulating and drywalling it. Then I decided to remove a couple more pieces of trim so I could clean them up...and forgot to score the paint along the edge. And tore a huge sheet of paint off. There was so many layers of cheap paint it was like a sheet of vinyl.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3088/2645602913_abd06e239f_o.jpg)

Oops. Wish I had better before pictures, the thermostat is new, replacing ye olde circular mercury jobby from the 50s. Also wired in a new circuit and ran the cable through the roof. You can make out the old white cable line that just kinda came out of the basement and laid across the floor  :uhrr: So now it's in a nice new down-pointing fixture that was big enough for a splitter, all that shit is now hidden. I sanded the shit out of the wall, but there are still some defects visible (to me). Talking to the paint store guy, there is a product I could've used to fix those. Ah, well. Still need to get the trim cleaned and replaced and get a grill for the vent in the upper right.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/2645602919_9af0b25698_o.jpg)

The living room is pretty easy, the real work happened in the bathroom. I'll just let these images speak for themselves. (Apologies for not rotating the first one)

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3040/2646419052_ee5a370932_o.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3111/2646419054_a159ce935e_o.jpg)

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3041/2646419062_a733c29e0d_o.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3075/2646419058_cddd52dcb7_o.jpg)

Lookin' good.

We just got a new deck, does that count?

Nice transformation on that bathroom.  Very clean lines. 

That is one hell of a copper pipe.

That puppy is probably worth quite a nice chunk of change.

No dobut.. sell that fucking pipe, Sky, and pay for the next few months mortgage!

So what's the brown in the first picture? I thought your walls were plaster but that looks like drywall. Please tell me you didn't rip the face of the drywall paper off.  :ye_gods:

Yes. Unintentionally. I fucking bummed. I was ready to paint.

There is a product to cover the middle paper layers, but I didn't know. Sun rakes across that wall. The room came out so great, everyone loves it...all I can see are defects in that wall.

The copper is my retirement fund.

So wait, how much are we talking here?  Copperwise?

Yeah, that was my next question, "did you put an oil primer on first?"  The paper hasn't bubbled on you yet?  If so you got lucky and should just be glad at that, and any 'defects' are probably 100% better than most folks would have managed with just brown paper to sand down.  Just don't let the wall get wet.   No squirtgun fights!


Current price is listed about $3.84 per pound.  That looked to be about a 3 1/2" diameter pipe, and a pipe diameter is about 5.12 pounds per foot.  It's probably at least 15 feet long to get through the roof, possibly better than 20.  Sooo.. $294.91 to $393.21 for the pipe.   Yeah, it's not really a house payment.. but it's a damn impressive pipe.

http://www.metalprices.com/FreeSite/metals/cu/cu.asp - Metal Price
http://www.copper.org/publications/pub_list/pdf/copper_tube_handbook.pdf - Characteristics of copper pipe.

I ignorantly figured I'd just prime the shit out of it with the latex primer I already had. Most of the paper strips came off in sanding, the few left bubbles every time I put on a coat of primer. After that it was fine (for painting), it's just "textured". Actually a net gain because the old paint was so shitty and I was able to smooth over the drywall joints that had recessed because there was only a single coat on them (the original drywalling, not my installation!).

My walls came out pretty kick-ass. Hopefully I'll get some before/after of the living room like I did the bathroom.

Pipe wasn't vented through the roof. Ended in the attic crawlspace by the gable vent. So I ran out the last few feet in pvc to bring it up to code (in NYS at least one vent stack has to penetrate the roof). Still, it runs down into the basement, probably 13-15ft total.

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000811.jpg)

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000812.jpg)

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000810.jpg)

Paint is mostly done, just a few trim areas around the window to go.  Next we pull up the carpet and lay the laminate floor.

Bye-bye nasty carpet!

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000813.jpg)

Going to Pergo the floor?

I agree, love the minimalist look and the stainless.

Yeah, we picked up some of this:
(http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/8473/edenmapleviselocao5.jpg)

We havn't decided if we're done for the day or not yet, its not quite 5 and we could get a fair amount of it laid, but we're tired.

Ookii: No hotlinky

Like forever?   Do you shed?

Geez.  You guys are very energetic.  When I get the urge to look for houses, I always look at ones that are all done.  I don't think I could go through Sky's level of major renovations.  It would kill me in hours.

My dad and I laid Pergo in a room about that size in about 4 hours, with neither of us having ever done it before.  It was fun times.  Sure beats the 12"x12" stickum tiles that were on the floor to begin with.

Last summer we laid 1,000 sqft of laminate in the rental house before we sold it, did 500sqft of carpet and both bathrooms in vinyl, too.
I'm really glad we're doing it 1 room at a time this time around.

Signe, I can't afford houses that are 'done' :) Renovating is fairly easy and lots of fun, it's like a puzzle game. It just takes some time and money, but it's cheaper than buying someone else's work and you get to choose the materials and ensure the quality (or not, heh) of the work done. Just by doing those two rooms and replumbing the kitchen sink, and going by comps on the market in my neighborhood, I could sell the house and cover my entire mortgage, cost of all renovation (including tools I keep), cover all costs related to buying and selling, and still walk away with at least several grand, if not five figures.

I can definitely see how people got into flipping in the bubble, it's fun and lucrative and nice to see the potential in a shoddy property come out. Of course, I didn't have much in the way of structural issues, either, I bought it for it's good bones.

Mr BW, not sure what you mean by minimalist, but that's brushed nickel, not stainless steel.

Cool thread.

Time for a major update to the house, so we're looking at:
Kitchen:  Paint, new cabinets and countertops
Front bathroom:  Paint, put in new vanity, sink, toilet, mirror, and shower/tub
Back bathroom:  Paint, new vanity, sink, mirror
Living Room:  Paint
Dining Room:  Paint
Master bath: Paint, new double vanity, sinks, mirrors, etc

In the last 2 years, we have replaced the heatpump (inside and out), gone with tankless water heaters, new flattop stove, overhead microwave, roof, had 18 trees cut down, laid sod (including all the prep work for that) and put up a 6' foot privacy fence in the backyard. 

If anyone is thinking about going tankless, it is soooo worth it.  I'd recommend it to anyone, regardless if your hot water heater is going out or not.  Dropped our power bill by 25 percent, and the instant heat is awesome.

I just look.  I never actually buy any.  But when we do, I'm not sure I could tolerate all that work.   We're thinking about buying but we don't know where, yet.  Not anywhere around here, that's for sure.  If we buy a house, it still doesn't mean Righ won't be having to travel and all that crap, and usually I go with.  Still, now that we have cats, I suppose I should settle down.  It's been nice these last two years that Righ has worked from the house and I've decided settling down will be nice.  But where?  He would probably want to buy and live in Scotland and I kind of don't.  Scotland is wonderful, I just wouldn't want to live there. 

I'm babbling again.  Sorry.  What all this means is that the stuff you guys are doing looks wonderful and I couldn't do it myself.  Righ probably could if he ever had time, but I would have to live somewhere else while it's being done.  I'm not handy or even handy-tolerant.

Arg, I hate when people cut trees! I'm trying to find some trees to plant, need to borrow my buddy's come-along to get some from a cliff near my mother's place. Couple nice birch for the front yard. Then I want to drop in some blue spruce along the fence line for privacy.

Also going to need new appliances, the stove and fridge that came with the house are cheap shit. The stove (electric) has only a single large burner, three small ones. Who the fuck makes a stove like that? I hate cheap shit. I'd love to put in a gas stove, but I'm wary of getting any more convoluted with the natural gas lines in the house, the kitchen is on a slab.

I'm digging my new throne, a class five Kohler Cimarron two-piece, pretty affordable imo. I was /very/ wary of the flush, because it's set to 1.24 gpf (canister valve). But I was looking at the diameter of different model's flush valves and most stuff was in the 2" range, the Cimarron has a 3-1/4", which gives a nice powerful flush. And because the canister only dumps about half the water from the tank per flush, you can hold down the lever to get a 'double flush' that dumps the whole tank. After years of cheap apartment thrones, it's so amazing to have a decent one, finally. Same goes for my new sink faucet, I've had to do dishes for so many years on cheap shit faucets, it's nice having something decent.

3/4 of the trees we had cut down were 150' pines that were dead or dying, and were very much a hazard if the wind gets up a bit.  We routinely had big ass branches falling in the back yard - not exactly the kind of thing you want when you and your (almost) 2 year old are out playing.  They needed to be cut down - it's either that or have them fall on us or the house. 

That toilet sounds strong enough to suck your nuts down with it if you flush whilst sitting down.

What about getting a dishwasher instead of doing it by hand?  Lack of room?

Over the last few years I've pulled about 16 maples out of my back yard.  None of them were mature, though; they were just volunteers that grew up through (and threatened to kill off) the lilacs lining the yard.

I didn't do them all at once because it would have destroyed the shade; the lilacs are only now recovering to the point I think I could remove the last four or five maple trees.

Ok, ok. I was just reacting to all the people I've lived near that have clear cut old trees and turned neighborhoods into bare shells of themselves. The maple comment gets me because I've got a massive maple in front of my house that I'd love to chop down but won't because it's an awesome shade tree. But the fucking seeds....I took out about a hundred seedlings and a few maples about three to five years old where the last owner never kept up the yard. They breed like crazy and the seeds clogged the shit out of my gutters.

I hope to get the two birches on either side of the maple and then chop it down in ten years or so, when they start to provide some shade.

Dishwasher: I'll have to replumb a little bit, but it shouldn't be bad, need to figure out the supply line, they make a y piece for drain I know. It's mostly the space needed, that corner of the kitchen is tight.

Nah, I agree with you on the clear cutting.  I hate the newer neighborhoods that are just barren wastelands of roofs.

I love my trees, just not dead ones :P  Planted a few new ones to replace what was cut down, plus it was part of an overall scheme for redoing the back yard. 

I use 2,4-D on the billions of seedlings.

But it's not just the damn seeds, the flippin' trees never stop dropping shit.  Pollen, seeds, leaves, whatever--as soon as one is done, they start a new batch of something else.  Got two in front and one out back that are just too big and lush and shady to get rid of, though. 

Two old Norway spruce out front as well, great trees but one's not healthy.  The top ~20' of that one wound up in my front yard after a thunderstorm a couple of years ago.   It's probably best to take that one out altogether, but I've been delaying since the city is going to widen the street in front of my house and wipe out both of those trees in the process whether I want it or not :P

The trick... Is to get your own real estate license or just do a FSBO and don't let the agents pocket the 5%. That's some huge money, plus you can start doing it for your friends and be "nice" and only take like 1%.

When I was house hunting, years ago when I started, I was thinking about getting an agent license. It's easy and cheap, and I was doing all the hunting anyway. My agent was fucking worthless and pocketed more than both lawyers combined, with only his half of the commission split. That's fucking stupid. I really should've gotten licensed. If there is a next time, I definitely will.

You seem to need a live-in cat nanny so you can travel without worrying about the little darlings.  Since I'm in the market to be a bum, can you beat Yeg's offer? ;D

I don't have a wife!   :grin:

I think she was proposing...

Heh.  I wouldn't do that to Righ.

No job can be perfect though.  With enough other benefits I can cope.  You can provide plenty of pussy for example.  Yeg made no mention of pets and I do miss having cats about.

Think of the advantages!  Another mouth to feed.  Someone to get underfoot.  Your very own layabout.  It'd be like having your own delinquent brat whom you don't have to love because they're not your child.  With enough coercion and gnashing of teeth, I might even be convinced to help with remodelling projects.  I can hammer a nail or two until I compain about the heavy workload.

Don't do it!  Remember--the reason women live longer than men is because they don't have wives :)

You had me at plenty of pussy.

Progress!
(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000815.jpg)

Looks good.  Is that the interlocking laminate stuff?

Yeah, True Natural Platinum Edition - Eden Maple.

It has beveled edges where each slat locks with the others to make it look like real wood, and I don't like it.  The stuff we used when we did the floors in the rental house in San Antonio was smooth when finished, -much- easier to put together, and like 1/4th the price retail.

We got this stuff for $2.50/sqft IIRC, MSRP is 4.25 or so. The stuff we used on the rental was like $1.15/sqft from home depot, though alot thinner.  This new stuff is 12mm.

We've got 3 more strips to run in the hallway between living room/computer room and we're done, then we just have to paint baseboard, nail it back up, and move the furnite in.

Finished floor pics sometime tonight.

Finally done! Well, mostly, but it's just little niggly shit left.

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000824.jpg)
(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000823.jpg)

Closeup of wall texture:
(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g72//P1000821.jpg)

Very nice!

Couple more before and afters, living room edition. Not done yet, but move-innable.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3059/2689458825_a8185beb58_o.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3150/2689458837_49ba424874_o.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3057/2689458849_8d4c0c4e21_o.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3131/2689458855_b1a79fb988_o.jpg)

Who puts fake brick like that in their house?  I'm really impressed that you could see past that for the potential.  Scary stuff.

Good job getting rid of MURDERER RED BRICKS.

My new task is to erect a frame to put a bench swing in.  I found some 4x6 pretreated timbers that will get the job done, but they would not fit in my car so I just got some hole diggers.  The 4x4 ones somehow just didn't look big enough, but I'm prone to overengineering.  Current plan is to just drop them into holes and backfill with quikrete, forming a pi-shape (I don't know the construction-goober term so I'm using the math-nerd term).  I'll take some pictures if (when?) the project enters Comedy Land.

I'm also going to be burning a lot of shit with the wife's blessing.  I have a bag of marshmallows and a 150' garden hose ready.

The red is painted over girly pink. And the wall I posted earlier (that I tore the paint off) was also girly pink before being painted a semigloss white. In the living room.

Between that and the atrocity of a bathroom, I was glad for the experience I've had looking for a place for about five years, on and off. This little house is all about potential...which means I'm broke and have little free time :)

Garden hose...how I wish I had a hose. Have to replumb about twenty feet, break open the concrete and put in a new valve, put in new concrete. Then I'll have a hose. I will, dammit.

I'm tired.

You're really bringing out the best in that place, Sky.  The yard looks like it has some real potential as well.  I love mature trees.

I agree with you about the experience part.  When I moved this summer, I looked at over 50 houses.  It was so easy to see the bones of a house and which homes were going to be larger projects than I wanted to tackle.  It's hard to find a well-built house with charm... at least one that doesn't need $50k in renovations.

It's all about the yard. Mature trees on two sides, the back is forested for about a hundred yards. Some douche pulled strings with the city and used a paper alley as a driveway into the landlocked forested part, but he's not behind my house. Right now I'm trying to get this construction done so I have enough money to hunt down the other half of the forest patch so he doesn't clear cut that part. But it's a double lot and extra deep, the biggest on the street. Second cheapest house on the street, and a small place without a garage just went for $13k more after two weeks on the market.

Also, it's on a dead-end street, second from the end. Only traffic is the neighbors coming home.

So it's all good. Sometimes hard to remember when I'm in remodel fatigue and totally fucking broke. Putting gutters on in a week or two and have to try and get the basement dried up. Then it's all about recovering the savings :) Toughest part of remodeling!

Someone put up girly pink bricks?  I love pink but that's just daft sounding.

Looking good, Sky.  I totally lack the imagination required to see past what is and what it could be.

By the way, at the risk of sounding more daft than usual, what's a 'paper alley'?

Sky should become one of those house flippers.  He might not make any money but being a house filpper is sort of "in" right now.  it could be the first time in a bazillion years he's been in style!  HURRY UP BEFORE IT BECOMES PASSÉ!

Are you putting back the old moulding/trim in the living room, Sky?

A paper alley is a deeded alley owned by the city that was never turned into a real alley. Two owners ago (the old guy that I would've liked, not the douche I bought it from) bought up the 20x100 deed behind my double lot and appended it to my deed, so I've got the only 100x170 lot. The guy who used another part of the paper alley for his driveway pulled strings to get the right-of-way through what had been another guy's side yard. Thus I'm happy it's in my name and not the city's. A bunch of people just think it's free land...until the city decides to use it.

NiX, I'll be putting the crown trim back on after I clean it up (after I move my stuff in). I'll be replacing the baseboard, corner, and door stuff. The baseboard was tucked in behind the carpet and I broke some, but it was beat to shit. The door and corner was shitty 90º crap. Not sure what I'll do for corner and door, but it'll be nicer than that.

Also have to make some new shims for the heat shield on the wood stove and get some new ceiling tiles to cover the spot the big black box was in.

Sig, house flipping is dead, it just doesn't know it yet. The market is too cool for casual flipping. For a good contractor, there's always money in taking derelict buildings and rehabbing them, but the whole soccer mom flipping thing is so bubble. That said, I would walk away with more money than I make at my day job if I sold it right now...

Looks awesome, both of you guys.   That texture would drive me up a wall, Nerf, but nice job on it.

Sky, what's that dot on the wall above your stove?  Just some dust on the lens?  Ceiling fans always look so sad surface mounted. Poor things, they want to fly free, too bad you don't have the room for it.

Yeah, it's dust. The ceiling fan is slated for replacement at some point. Some fan/light combo. Because there are three wall switches for it. Makes sense for a light, not for a fan.

I didn't want to say anything about how horrid that fan looks in case you liked it, but yeah, get that shit replaced. Have you thought about sanding down those doors and repainting/staining them? That brown/brown colour scheme is scary.

Heh, I didn't fully list the work left. Like I said, it's not done, it's move-innable. That odd brown/grey door is to the garage, slated to get new hardware and a paint job. The front door (not pictured) got new hardware and is also slated for a paint job. Metal doors, so I'll just paint over them and replace them with wooden doors* when I can afford it. The back double doors are fucking win, one of my favorite parts of the house. I'm using them as a base for my stain color, even though they're so old they don't even match themselves anymore...

And this is just round one, to get it move-innable without the crazy wall and box. Next round replaces the ceiling, front wall and carpet (hardwood flooring ftw). That should be in 2030 or so  :oh_i_see:

*Something like this for the front door:
(http://www.gingersweetan.com/xSites/Agents/gingersweetan/Content/UploadedFiles/Door%20Mission%20style.gif)

The door kind of looks like it's trying to appear rustic rather than is rustic.  I like rustic distressed looking doors.  More like this, though:

(http://www.doorsbydecora.com/DbyD393.jpg)

Not really the style, but the rustic look of the wood.  Which I'm sure you can beat up yourself.

Those doors are nice, but what are we talking here... like $2k for a door? 

Solid wood doors cost a mint.  Also, at least in my case, they require some serious protection from the elements.  My mistake was not having an overhang to protect my front door from sun and rain, which made it actually be rustic rather than look rustic in just 2 or 3 years.  Now it's painted and kinda warped, but I don't have the luxury of replacing it.

Wood is a tricky beast to play with. If you want a nice wood that stains well, it'll cost you over and over again. If it lasts, you'll make your money back, but more often than not you'll be losing money on whatever venture it is you're building.

You don't need a door where you live, just a pool, and a poolhouse for me to retire into when I'm 30.

Yeah, I'm going to build a pool house pretty soon.  Meaning me and Killjoy.  Whee!

Until then, you can stay in the big house.

Is Killjoy going to get off the couch to help?

This is not the way I approach home remodeling. I want stuff I like.

Although I am also concerned about the weather endurance of the door, since it's going to be southerly exposed in an upstate ny climate (meaning ranging from humid high 90s to subzero blizzards). Most metal or vinyl doors I've seen look like shit, though. I'm open to suggestions.

Signe, that's a nice door, too. You can come rework the masonry into an arch.  :awesome_for_real: I like the stain on the door I linked better.

It's not so much the colour or the style of the door, I just like rustic beat up looking wood doors with knotholes and imperfections.  My sister beat the hell out of her door and stained it and it looks awesome.  I like the stain on your door, too. 

My advice: Don't spend the money on a solid wood door.  You can get engineered wood veneer doors that cost less, have the same styling, and will weather better. 

He's actually more excited about it than I am.  He has already gutted and rebuilt his own house, so his expertise will be invaluable.  Seriously.  The current holdup is just me getting some trusses (I'm not dumb enough to think we can build those ourselves) and after that it's up to my wife to draw the plans using whatever the standard size is for those.  I already have the scotch, so we will just need lumber, roofing and windows to get it dried-in.

As for doors, I'll agree with Nebu.  Solid wood doors are a vanity item, and these days I'm rather partial to metal doors if you want something solid.  But hey, your house.  That's what's so awesome about having a house: you can tell everyone else to go fuck themselves.

I grew up in a "rustic" house. We called it old and beat to shit. I don't understand why people would intentionally fuck up their house or furniture like that. I hear rustic or distressed and vomit. So there's that. Like Yeg said :)

Anyways, the only door treatment I'll be worrying about for a few years is a can of spray paint on the crappy metal doors I already have.

This.

Check out Anderson & Milliken to start with.  Don't go to Home Depot or Lowe's, check out with local builders who they use as their supplier and go to the showroom. You'll find more doors than you'll know what to do about.

Unless you've got a gestapo HOA like I do.

I like old worldy looking stuff when it comes to wood.  Maybe it's the Euro influence.  I like solid wood doors, too.  Nothing wrong with vanity.

What does Righ think about solid wood doors?

I don't know.  I'll ask him when he's not so busy.  Actually, he probably won't care much about doors.  I have only a very mild interest.  My main concern about doors is that they keep bad things out and good things in.  I'm not overly fussed about stuff.  When we look for a place to live, we look for space, a view and all mod cons.  Mostly all mod cons.  I prefer living near water, too.  If I have that stuff I don't bother with style.  I also prefer disinterested or mostly absent neighbours, for the most part, although when we lived in Portsmouth I loved my neighbours.  We had a very cool older couple on one side (weekly bbqs, fast RIBs for frequent wine trips to France and only there half the year) and an ex Red Arrow wing commander on the other side (amazing looking, interesting stories, only there on some weekdays).  I don't think our preferences are the norm. 

PS  Was that a trick question?  I'm not always sure if something is innuendo. 

Do you have gas? I'd look at a gas insert instead of the fireplace. Give you back some room.
Also look on Craigslist religiously for doors. I got a sweet deal on two sets of fiberglass french doors to replace my old sliders.

I meant you'll get your money back in that it'll maintain its appearance. There's nothing worse than buying something you really like only to see it become something you don't like in a year or two.

The current technological level of gas fireplaces is good.  I have a ventless LP fireplace that does a great job of heating up the joint.  Far preferable to the wood-burning sort.

I do have a gas line running close to that location, and we've discussed a gas fireplace. But on one hand, a new fireplace would cost money I don't have. On the other, gas is going to get real expensive soon, which kinda kills the whole money-saving aspect of a wood stove ($$ vs free). I don't mind the room it takes up, I love woodstoves. Plus, it has a dragon on it.

Craigslist in my area is for gay hookups. I was going to sell GH3 on there, and I've looked for musicians and musical gear. And by my area I mean the city a half hour away. Goddamned city folk.

This is what we have.  In fact, it works so well that I can only use it if it's very cold because even at the lowest setting, it makes the whole house very warm, very quickly. 

I moved out of a Gestapo HOA into a no-HOA area.  Now we're considering moving back.  God help us.

HOAs sound like a good idea until you actually live in one.

I also have a real fireplace and it is not only cheap (to operate, not install!) but you can dispose of many things in it.  Worst case, put on another sweater.

Or nosy neighbour.

Doors are for pussies. Seriously. If you don't have any, your cats will go exploring and get lost and other peoples' cats will come exploring and piss on your carpets.

So are we putting a sweater on the fire, or wearing a neighbour? You've got me all confused.

If your neighbor is a sweater, putting them on would be kind of icky.  You don't want your fire to get cold, so a sweater is okay for it, though it prefers natural fibers.  Synthetics will cause it to give off all kinds of horrible smells after a bit.

Sky,

What was that big black box hanging from your ceiling originally for???

YAR! WRONG THREAD!

It had a hinged bottom panel that would swing down. When you were using the stove, you could open it up, turn on a fan in the attic and run hot air through a duct that spanned the attic crawlspace out to the kitchen, where it would come out over the sink.

Since the kitchen is the NEXT ROOM, I tore the entire thing out, though I still have to pull the ducting out of the crawlspace. If I need more heat in the kitchen, I'll install a fan in the "hallway" (which is about 5x5).

The kid I bought the house from lived there for three years with that thing in his living room and never bothered to find out what it was. Then again, he didn't ever look for the screens, either. Possibly the most clueless person I've ever met, and I've met some real doozies.

My in-laws are remodelling an old house to hopefully turn it into a B&B. What can you tell me about these tankless systems? One per bathroom? One for the whole house? How does it work?

One for the whole house unless it's huge and you need one for each floor.

Upside is that you get hot water for hours at a time. Downside is that it takes longer to get hot (30 seconds or more depending on the temp of the water coming in).


Edit:

I believe there are two verisons: 1) where you heat the hot water at/near the exit (ie: in the bathroom), in which case you'd need one for every room that has hot water and won't usually work in older houses. 2) the one I'm referring to above, where you replace your existing heater with the on-the-wall unit and provide hot water to the whole house.

Most folks only do one, but if you have kids or a big enough house then two might be worth while.. but requires lots more plumbing changes. And they aren't cheap.

Prolly wouldn't work for a BB because they really are only good for one major item using hot water at a time - so two guests showering may be too much for it and cause lots of temperature changes/pressure changes.

There's only the one type.  The # of flames required to create the BTUs needed to heat the water take up a decent bit of space.  Installing them AT the fixture is prohibitive.  There are instant-hots which are mini-water heaters for taps and similar things for showers if you want immediate at-the-fixture hot water.

You can set-up a recirculation pump at the tankless heater as well.  It cycles the water through your hot water pipes back to the tankless so there's always hot water at the fixture,  but that's always seemed stupid to me. You're essentially turning your hot water pipes into a hot water tank but with none of the insulation. If anything I'd think that sort of a setup would RAISE your bill, not lower it.

One should suffice for any home (note I'm not a plumber.) since it attaches into the plumbing like your hot water tank.  All the other hot water pipes branch off from it, so as long as the unit is rated to heat water at the max flow you'd have hot water everywhere. 

Pressure isn't a problem these days.  Modern plumbing systems and fixtures have pressure and temperature regulators to avoid the old "flush the toilet and water goes away/ gets scalding" problem.  If your parents are rehabbing, I'd hope they're replacing the plumbing as well.  Lots of folks want to in order to have more cash for finishes.  However, plumbing and framing is the infrastructure of your building.  Cheap out on those and it doesn't matter what the finish is like, because you'll be ripping it up/ replacing it soon enough when that infrastructure fails.

I agree that the circulating-water-with-a-tankless defeats the purpose, which is to avoid heating water 24x7.  The other side of that is if your heater is like mine and faaaaar away from your shower then you will wait a long damn time for hot water.  Our solution at the time was to have a convection loop so that I get warm water pretty quickly, but it's both wasteful and inconsistent.  I really want one so that I can stay in the shower for two hours without a temperature drop.  I'm going to put in a tankless once my wife stops spending all of my money, but I will put it under my bathroom.  Everyone else will have to deal with the other 40-gallon tank unit until I put in another for the rest of the house.

The important metric for looking at a tankless heater is the degree rise at a specific GPM.  I figure that the most GPM I have going at once in my bathroom would be from the tub faucet and that's probably 2.5GPM per the Delta catalog.  From there I can figure out how hot I can get the water from a particular heater and size it appropriately.

I thought I was going to have recovered the budget to the point where I could start on the winterizing stuff (lots of work involved there!). Then the fiancee gives me an ad with the bedroom set we had just looked at (to buy in a year or two) that is marked down from $1800 to $1000 (and the $1800 was an amazing deal). Fizuck. Looks like I'll be broke again.

At least I'll have a decent bed.

Replace the nouns in that anecdote and you'll be set for wife-stories until you die.

Arise!

I am just wondering if anyone has any experience or expertise with garage flooring. We are fitting out a four car garage at home, complete with a maintenance pit, and I am wondering what is the best material to lay down over a concrete base?

Google seems to suggest rubber mats as the popular solution, but I have also seen many garages with some sort of durable paint-esque floor material that is smoother and harder than rubber. If anyone has any advise regarding what is better/cheaper/easier/more durable, that would be welcome. Cheers!

Epoxy garage floor coating (http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/how-to/intro/0,,20174654,00.html)

That's what I did to the garage at my last house and it worked out pretty well.  I wouldn't recommend it for high traffic and industrial use though.  It provides a nice clean look to the garage floor that's easy to maintain.  That's why I did it. 

Rubber mats are nice because the installation is so easy, you can make the kids/wife do it. Simply snap them to each other, trim around support posts or walls, and you're done.
However the draw back is if you have a fluid leak from an automobile or weather incident flooding the garage, the stuff will get under the mats and they will need to be removed in order to clean and dry underneath.

Self leveling epoxy floor covering is nearly as simple in installation. Really all you need are a bunch of five gallon buckets, a drill and mixer attachment, and a couple of large squeeges.
About the only other thing I would recommend is a laser level, to check the slope of the garage floor. Because this stuff is self leveling, if your garage is sloped forward so water and such will run out, so will the epoxy when you put it down.
Bonus is nothing can get underneath it, makes an old concrete floor look shiny and new (we use it in some of our businesses), and stands up to LOTS of abuse. Draw backs can be the stuff can be extremely slick when wet, if you dont add chips or sand or some other traction additive.

Fucking A! Thanks chaps.

That epoxy stuff was what I was trying to remember. As it stands the garage will not be getting much traffic, and flooding is pretty unlikely, the epoxy seems like a less fancy but better option to the rubber mats.

So, I've given up on the search feature for our home improvement thread and I'll just tack on to here.

Background: last September, second invasion of the ants into my kitchen, I rip out the paneling and seal the wall, insulate and drywall.

This summer I painted it and I've been slowly working on replacing the trim and jambs. The jambs are where things have been a bitch, you might remember me talking about getting a Bosch table saw a few months ago. I decided against it, because I just don't have the dough. I do, however, have a bunch of planes. So I decided to work it with hand tools. But I don't have much in the way of a workbench, let along a woodworking bench to plane on.

So the first version of the stool I rabbeted clamped to a couple sawhorses. Unstable, lots of racking. Between that and the knotty stick of pine, I had a couple splits (minor) and a knot pop/break (major). So I bought a stick of clear lumber (actually a planed/jointed old 12' long stair cut down to 8'). I figure I'll slap together a little woodworking bench and go about learning about such things, bury my head in a couple books and poked around the shop that I buy lumber from. Turns out the corner I have available in the garage won't work - though I did briefly consider opening the window when I wanted to extend the tail vice, it would've been against a wall on the right end. (And sadly, that corner of the garage has sunk about 3/4", so the window won't even open...)

I have a couple old benches that came with the house, angle iron with some cheap tops. I figure I'll see if those will at least serve temporarily. I go down and try to rack them (planing pressure) and one racks pretty good, the other moves a little. Turns out the years before I move in (when the house was neglected), the minor flooding in the basement was enough to rust out the feet on both. Well, the one that doesn't rack much, maybe it will work for this ONE DAMN PROJECT, so I figure out a clamping system and head back down there. Turns out it's top is hardboard on plywood on particle board, all cut to different sizes, so I can't clamp against it (right now looking at joining the edge of a board with a plane, so a vertical clamping setup). I go back to the drawing board and figure a way to clamp some scrap to the legs that would be high and proud enough to clamp the work piece to...except the rounded bolts knock the scraps out of true...

So thinking maybe use shims, maybe carve a couple notches for the bolt head.

This kind of bullshit has been going on all summer. All for the lack of a good goddamned workbench! And even if I get a good one, the basement still floods enough I am wary of putting it down there. Too bad I have such a cool little house on such an amazing lot, it's so tempting to trade up with rates where they are right now :)

At least the actual trim has gone easily. Putting in crown and 6" historical baseboard and wrapping the corners. Windows waiting on the above so I can get the jambs installed to put the trim on.

Does anyone have good advice on interviewing and hiring a remodeler/subcontractor? I watch that HGTV show Holmes on Homes, where he goes in and fixes other contractors or inspectors fuck ups, and it scares the shit out of me.
But I have a baby coming and need to remodel the upstairs bathroom before it happens. Yes I could do a lot of it myself to save money but I don't have the time. Also need to do a few touch ups in dining room.

So any good advice, tips, or tricks?

I'm pretty sure this is the de-facto home improvement thread

Sand, I don't have a lot of experience, but most of our hires have come through word of mouth recommendations, either from people we trust who have had work done, or from other people we have hired who have done good work. I don't know about the US< but certainly here in the UK there are a range of accreditation schemes that are generally good starting points for people with specific roles (e.g. Boiler Engineers).

Word of mouth or Angie's List.
http://www.angieslist.com

You could try calling around to a few Residential Architects (check with the local AIA chapter) or the biggest local home builders, but chances are the guys they recommend won't do your job because it's too small.   Or if they do agree to take it you'll be shoved off the schedule more than you care for because you're a one-off and the other guys are steady work.


ed: Sky, just build yourself a damn table already.  A few sheets of plywood, a joiner and a few weekends and you'll be happier than trying to puzzle this all out!

Pray. Don't be a perfectionist, understand there are going to be some areas where it's just not going to be perfect unless you really unload top dollar.

I've got a guy for bigger projects/speed/pita stuff. He's very reasonable, but it drives me nuts because his company is too small, his help sucks and he doesn't have great attention to detail. But he puts up with me being over his shoulder, he takes time to discuss and explain things, and he's cheap and quick. And cheap.

I'd go more for the general contractors than the guys the home builders use, since they tend to know the program they install all day long rather than being generalists specializing in remodels.

Angie's is good if you're in a bigger city, it's useless around here. BBB is also pretty sketchy these days. Word of mouth, but beware that most people don't know what constitutes a good (or bad) contractor. Sometimes people just think a nice lipstick job is amazing, sometimes a solid job with minor problems gets slammed as awful. It's a giant, barely regulated morass of ignorance. If you find an honest and competent contractor, treat him well!

Anyway, specific to what you're saying: bathrooms are a great place to evaluate a contractor and their subs. You'll see their work every day and there's not a lot of fudge room. For the dining room, you might want to tackle it yourself. I can recommend a few books I like if you want to expand on the scope of that project. And since you watch Mike Holmes (who is a goddamned Saint imo), you know some basic stuff about protecting yourself from scammy/incompetent contractors:

http://makeitright.ca/Mike_Holmes_Online/view_resource.php?cat=13&article_id=118
http://makeitright.ca/Mike_Holmes_Online/view_resource.php?cat=13&article_id=120

edit Merusk  :why_so_serious: iknorite I can be a perfectionist to the point of retardation, literally.

FUCK Angie in her tiny little twisted ass.
We signed up for that service a couple years ago. It took multiple attempts, threats of lawsuits, and multiple reversed charges with our bank to get them to cancel our subscription and stop charging us.

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=20416.0

cut a hole in the basement floor, put in a sump pump.

I'm what might be considered an over-engineerer. Like Sand, I blame Mike Holmes (actually he just cemented the tendency). So I want a full-on solution, though short of excavating the exterior, because I can't afford it. I want the full-wall dimpled membrane over the channel leading to the pump hole.

I called the local company that does the most work in the area when I first got the house and they nagged me to be sure all other options were explored before they'd even look at it. I've done almost all the changes to minimize the water...but I still can't afford the basement guys. It'll be at least three years before I can call them.

I could probably put in a rudimentary system myself, with a little research into the proper materials...maybe I'll make that next summer's project...

Re:Angie's: I was signed up before it was a paid service and they still nag me to "renew" my membership. I don't currently use them (also useless for my area).

For people living west of Atlanta, I found an old man who is an incredible builder.  He has put second stories on houses, and his work is of great quality.

Well.... you just need to remind yourself water is the only enemy of a house.  I'm not seeing the membrane working that well in an older house... are there no cracks in the basement floor? Does the water perk through the concrete floor itself from hydrostatic pressure?

I have repaired my sunroom that was heavily damaged by the tornado.  The drywall is now up and today I got a guy coming by to fix my hot tub.  This weekend I'm staining my deck around my pool, that will be a big project.  Got to get this stuff done before winter!

Still not sure what color to paint my sunroom wall or what color of carpet to lay down. 

Contractor quoted me 12k on building a garage, the cinderblock walls are already up though, so I'm not sure if that's a good deal for around here (east TN).  Any thoughts?

There's not really a lot of problems left. Two gutters are getting bypassed in heavy rains, so I've put in diverters (and now that I'm thinking about it I need to install one more... There's one low spot that I need to excavate and re-blacktop, that's where the majority of intrusion is right now.

The seepage I'm seeing is from the walls, though there is one bolthole that was filled with hydraulic cement I'm keeping my eye on. I'd wager it's just the overflow when the gutters can't handle heavy rains and the years of faulty/no gutters have created channels against the walls. Excavation would obviously be the best thing, but I don't have that kind of money. Since we're talking at worst something like a few gallons here and there, I think membrane/channel/pump would be able to handle it.

But yeah...that's why I want to start getting expert opinions and bids.

My wife works in commercial construction (N GA), and I might wager that you could get a better price if you can find someone more desperate.  Then again, you get what you pay for.

Neighbor just gave me a 9" craftsman table saw.

I vow to not bitch about their planting on the property line until at least next spring :)

Grats! Don't saw your fingers off.

This thread makes me glad that I rent.

In terms of cost, I agree... but now that I am back renting, I miss the home projects. Thankfully my mother is ~3hours away and has a house I can do all sorts of stuff with... esp since it shall be mine someday.  :evil:

Watch the kickback too; I tore up a couple of fingertips once when I got a piece of wood bound up on the blade.  They can throw 'em pretty hard.

My contractor's got his minions out now unloading the trusses for my shop/barn in the rain; I feel sorry for them but I just didn't have the money to get it done any sooner.  I'd invite them in to hang out at my basement bar but they haven't built that yet either  :oh_i_see:

Good luck Poly.  Personally I am recuperating from two days of deck staining; two coats rolled, one brushed.  I'm gettin' too old for this shit.

Deck looks great though!

The beauty of renting is obtaining the fun stuff before you buy. I just killed off my HD DVR and went full streaming on my main TV. I use the Xbox for all of my streaming with PlayOn on the networked PC. This allows me to use Hulu Plus without the stupid "PC only" garbage. Also, extensions for PlayOn make it pretty awesome.

As far as home projects go, I can build shelving, etc. for the spaces that need it. I also like decorating for the space that I have, which is much more challenging than with a full-on house.

We also have access to an indoor lap pool, and outdoor pool, racquetball courts , and a workout room. If shit breaks, someone comes to fix it.