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Wii software outsells 360 software in December - NPD
Xbox 360 software dominance comes to an end in the US.

IGN has revealed the software tie-ratios for all current-gen consoles in the US for December 2007 as tracked by US numbers company NPD, and in a surprising revelation the Wii leads the pack. In December in the US, 8.11 Wii games were sold for every new console, 7.76 Xbox 360 games were sold for every Xbox 360 console sold, and 5.04 games were sold for every PlayStation 3 hardware sale.

Tie-ratios are a relatively useless figure without context, as they are just that, a ratio, and depend on absolute numbers to mean anything. But since we know the hardware sales for December (as also reported by NPD), absolute software sales can be calculated easily.

This means that total software sales for December in the US were 10,948,500 Wii games, 9,777,600 Xbox 360 games and 4,019,904 PS3 games. The Wii number does not include the bundled Wii Sports, but does include Wii Play sales. Many people don't consider Wii Play a full game purchase, so removing its December sales from the total leaves the Wii still ahead at 9,868,500 games sold. Considering the Wii is still almost two million consoles behind the Xbox 360 in install base in the US, this is quite an achievement.

IGN also revealed the lifetime tie-ratios of the three consoles, 7.0 for Xbox 360, 4.64 for Wii, and 4.26 for the PlayStation 3. As expected the Xbox 360 still leads on that count, as tie-ratos increase over a console's lifespan since more owners have had the console for longer and thus have had more chance to buy games. This means that as of December 31st 2007 63,873,600 Xbox 360 games had been sold, 34,194,016 Wii games had been sold or 30,074,016 if not counting Wii Play (neither figure counts Wii Sports), and 13,844,148 PS3 games had been sold. At the same point in the Xbox 360's life as the PS3 and Wii are at now (31 December 2006) it had a 5.1 tie-ratio and had sold 4.5 million consoles, and therefore had sold 22,950,000 games.

A surprising result. Unfortunately it would be almost impossible to attain worldwide software sales outside of shipments.

http://www.palgn.com.au/article.php?id=10165&sid=9f546114a1c33869787e6593b501b07e&title=Wii+software+outsells+360+software+in+December+-+NPD
http://au.wii.ign.com/articles/847/847472p1.html

I can't actually say I'm surprised. Microsoft blew their wad in November. The PS3 still costs too much for poor people. Mom is still buying Wiis because she's a retarded ass clown and it's the new Monopoly.

Also, since you didn't link exact numbers, I just have to look at this:

Nintendo, Nintendo Controller, Nintendo, annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd Guitar Hero.

Color me absolutely not surprised.

I read the post incorrectly since normally Velorath and I track down hard numbers so it doesn't require "real" reading. As such, I had to put filler. Wii Play with no punctuation was all I could come up with.

Here we are:


Still looks right for a top 10 these days.

Isn't the 40 gig PS3 dropping to $299 this week?

Rumor.

Somewhat believable though as they're going to phase out the 80GB for a new high-end sku (at the same price as the current 80gb).

That was just a rumor as far as I know.

As for Wii software sales... the Wii has a lot of budget titles, plus a lot of places are still selling Wii's in bundles where you're forced to get 4 or 5 shitty games with the thing.

The Wii also doesn't have a good strong set of third-party software, which is why most of those top-selling titles are Nintendo titles. I keep waiting for some of these developers to get the stick out of their ass and face the reality that the market for those games is going to be as big as the 360 market if not larger, but meh. Developers are hard-headed fucktards sometimes.

The market for gamer's games on the Wii is smaller than the PS3s.

Every third party developer knows it. And Suda 51 proved it. Hence the reason he moved to the more expensive next-gen development for his next title.

Suda51 is hardly proof. Even if No More Heroes was No More Jedi's, Suda's game design style is in no way a mainstream type of design. Killer 7 proved that.

Actually, Suda51 is pretty good proof. Hardcore gamers are so starved on the Wii, they're buying non-games.

Basically, if you're not Capcom or Nintendo, that system may as well be dead already.

Maybe Square-Enix will change things. Too bad Crystal Chronicles sucks as a series.

This I have seen in action.  My mom randomly bought my nephews games, most based on how cheap they were.  She did seem a little crestfallen when I mentioned one of the games she bought was the lowest ranked game ever on Gamespot.  For what it's worth, my nephews got at least 5 games for Christmas alone.  Spoiled little brats.


I don't see that from the sales figures.  Sales figures there seem to be showing Wii owners buying the top rated game for the system (and franchise darling), an extra remote, and some cutesy, kiddie franchise game.   

360 sales numbers are nice.  :grin:

 

I was speaking mostly about the Japanese.

Those are US numbers in the original post.

No More Heroes came out last week. It's...

You know what. Nevermind.

You totally missed my point.

A cricket game would be the Wii's killer app. Is anybody making one?

There was a campaign for a while, but it has died (website gone). Fans even made an ad (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZ4OZ8xget0) to sell the concept. Surely you can all see (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRXmPe8I7QQ) why the wiimote and this game belong together.

Which point? That the Japanese markets don't matter, especially when the original post was all about the US numbers alone and not the Japanese? That No More Heroes proved in one week (for which we don't have sales figures) that somehow the Wii isn't a suitable place for "gamer's games?" That hardcore gamers are buying non-games (Wii Fit? Not sure what you mean by non-games)? I really did miss your point.

I know.

Schild's point is best summarized by a small child lying on it's back waving it's arms and legs.

If gamers on the Wii are desperate for "gamer's games" then logically they should be snatching up No More Heroes in droves.

Yeah but the Japanese "hardcore gamer demographic" is full of very creepy and scary people.

Japan doesn't count anymore.

Bring over the 200-1000 creative and cool people from there and the rest of the little island nation can go back to being creepy, wierd, and living like a bunch of sardines.

Suda made a game few people actually liked.  Is it any wonder his follow up might not explode off the fucking shelves?

If even GOOD developers like Lord British, DW Bradley, and Red Lynx can have off days should folks line up out of the gate for an iffy proposition?

Hell, I can easily be considered hardcore gamer (western kind, not the creepy Japan or Weeaboo kind) and I doubt I will get No More Heroes till it hits the budget racks.
(Of course one of my decisions to improve my life involves buying most of my games at budget price points so I don't count.  Financial responsibility is BAD or something.)

Most of my Wii games are Nintendo too.  Its not my fault most third party developers are technofappers who helped kill PC gaming with ever increasing system requirements in the face of all evidence that top of the line is fucking RARE and can't be bothered to work on such a lesser machine even though Resident Evil 0, Remake, 4, Soul Calibur 2, and the Rogue Squadron games prove you can make some gorgeous games on it.

Instead they all want to make games for the overpriced SKU fuckery of the PS3 (which isn't really selling), or the 360 which would be good provided it wasn't put together with dried snot and chewed up bubblegum.
(Oh wait, I could swear Schild blamed the breaking 360s on idiot consumers who just don't know how to take care of a piece of electronics..  Something else ya have been COMPLETELY  :uhrr: about.)

Developers made some coin on the NES and SNES.  They should stop being dipshits and leave the shitty games to EA.

I don't see No More Heroes selling well on any system.

Gamasutra has a good interview with David Jaffe up. In it he says that American audiences increasingly want realism. I've noticed this for years, in Japan the top games are often crazy and imaginitive but in the US the top games are sports games and WW2 shooters.

The "hardcore" and "casual" distinction has got to go. No More Heroes is not "hardcore", it's a game for afficianados. The kind of game the old DieHard GameFan would have splooged over.

They spooged over the pack in game to the Atari Jaguar though.  They were a bit.. ahh.. umm..  yeah.

Unsigned code can now be run on the Wii through a memory card exploit.

Dreamcast 2.0? Maybe.

I don't think the distinction needs to go, it's just being misused here.  No More Heroes isn't a hardcore game.  It's a niche game, and would only appeal to a small audience regardless of what system it was released on.

I don't think "hardcore" has any real meaning, especially since the definition of "casual" has changed dramatically. 5 years ago "casual" might have meant a guy who played Mario Kart with his frat bros while drunk, now it means a 50 year old mom playing a flash game.

If that's casual, I don't think that's necessarily what the Wii is drawing either. It's kids and their families, as well as party/boardgame types. Casual to be sure, but they've been kind of a forgotten factor for the past several years.

The 50 year old mom playing a flash game tends to get lumped into a catagory these days many people refer to as non-gamers (a bit of a misnomer obviously, but I guess people seem to like the term better than something like Ultra-casual).

I think I can safely call myself a gamer at this point in my life. I have no intention of ever buying No More Heroes on any platform.

Wait, does this mean there is going to be a NEW backwards compatable high end sku for PS3, or should i go out and grab an 80gb model right now due to potential fear that i will never see another backwards compatable model again?

I am also a gamer and don't see myself picking up NMH any time soon, regardless of what Epic Fail Schild or anyone else says.

Illegal use of apostrophe.

Why does this sales information spark controversy?

I bought No More Heroes because PURPLE COINS MAKE HULK ANGRY!  HULK SMASH!!!

Sony is hiring backwards compatibility engineers in Japan right now. Eventually, I expect a firmware update. Far as I know, the 40GB ones still have the memory card utilities on them which would lead me to believe they would eventually become BC.

hmm.. BC making a return? Maybe I'll hold off on buying that cheap PS3 and instead wait that year for the return of BC and price drops... When's word on this due? (or likely?)

The 40gb units don't have the flash card readers.

Who knows. I was just putting that out there.

I don't think that they will add hardware for compatability. My guess it that they will do software emulation just like the x-box did.

They just said that it was a big achievement to reduce production costs of the PS3 as much as they did. This was only possible by removing hardware compatability and some other stuff.

I'm starting to come around to Schild's line of thinking on this.  I haven't picked up my DS in months, and would only buy a Wii for Mario.  With all that money can't they just buy or hire a couple first party teams to make some sweet games that I want to play? 

Metroid? No?

neg.  played one on GC and wasn't exactly impressed.  Bought the one for DS and played it for maybe an hour before turning it off in boredom.

Nope.  Instead it sound like they're just shifting around their internal development teams a bit to put more people on Wii development rather than DS.

If they had more than one game for Wii I wanted I'd buy a Wii, that's part of my point.  It's not like I can't afford a Wii, I just don't know if I want to buy one so I can play Mario.  I'm not aware of any other game on the Wii that's remotely interesting to me.

Why?

Hates freedom.  I suggest Advance Wars.

Didn't like Advance Wars.  My Mom could write better dialogue.

lol playing advance wars for the dialogue

(http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/2769/653img4165yj4.jpg)

I agree there is too much dialog in Advance Wars.

He can't be serious.

If it wasn't duse I'd probably agree, but I'm going with the safe bet here.

There is a shitload of dialogue in ADvance Wars, all of it tedious and insane (not in a good way).  The gameplay is derivative, and doesn't come close to making up fir it.  It's not as good as Fire Emblem, it's not as good as most TBS games.  It's an extremely mediocre game in most respects, which is the best thing that can be said of it.

...Have you actually played Advance Wars on the DS. It's fucking splenda; superior to Fire Emblem certainly.

The new Advance Wars is nothing compared to Disgaea PSP.

Or Jeanne D'Arc.

Or FFT PSP.

Or Advance Wars GBA/1.

It's sad.

Shit, I don't care if it's derivative (personally, they remind me of the old Panzer General type of games..). It's not like there's a big pool of tbs games out anymore. I'll take what I can get.

I loved the first title on the DS. I haven't touched the new one yet, as I traded in my DS for my PSP.

Games like FFT are fairly different that Advance Wars. The first is an SRPG, the second is a straight tactical simulation. The world has plenty of room for both.

At this point Schild's reaction to everything Nintendo is that it's worse than ET for the 2600. Yeah, we get it. Disgea, with it's penguins and super-gay shit and terrible writing and story and overly complex systems that add nothing to the gameplay is teh best evar, because it's Sony. Blah blah blah...

I didn't know he had the hate on for the DS. I can understand the Wii though. Not just for being relatively unpowerful, but for not even targetting my gaming "sensibilities" much in any way. The DS has a little bit of everything though, and some good options for genres/gamestyles we don't see much of anymore. Like TBS or Adventure.

Schild calls bullshit.

Stray, you're killing me. Look around harder. Go buy Culpa Innata on Steam for zee adventure.

Wait, wait.. I didn't say it was some haven for adventure. Just that there are good options on there. Or at very least, games with adventure/exploratory elements.

That game on steam looks interesting though. I'll check it out soon.

Its better than all of them actually. 
If you had said Dual Strike was a lesser game I could easily understand.  (Except for the last one.)

Disgaea is a grindfest.
FFTactics is ok, then becomes a grindfest later on (unless you just use Agrias and Orlandu then its pathetically easy)
Jeanne D Arc is merely ok.  (Its easy if you grind and abuse SAILOR FRENCH TRANSFORMATION POWER, otherwise its unfairly hard.)
Original Advance Wars has retarded AI.  (Apparently transport units ate the AI's baby like a bunch of Dingoes or something.)

I haven't played any of the other Advance Wars games, just some Days of Ruin, and there is nothing at all wrong with this game other than the copious dialog that interferes with me rolling over an opposing army; this is why God gave us an A button.  It's not like FFT or its comparatives, not very much anyway.  I haven't tried the free battle mode but I imagine it skips over the anime-retread schtick.

It's like those old SSI games, like I mentioned. Panzer General, Allied General, etc.. A lot more cutesy, but almost exactly like them. Down to the little cutscene/battle animation stuff. They predate FFT and the like by a bit, I believe.

I've only played the original Advance Wars, but I can safely say it's a worthy TBS wargame, in the vein of Perfect General and such, only on the teeny-weeny portable scale.

Just ignore the part where emo 16 year-old girls are military commanders in charge of combined arms operations.

Lin is a 20 something I think.  And she is bad ass.

I actually enjoy the story overall.  But you can skip it.  Just hit the Start button a lot.

The Advance Wars series technically predates the Perfect General games.

It was called Famicom Wars back in the 80s.  Its interesting that the ranks and bike units seem to be lifted from the Turbografx game Military Madness though...
(Which is an oldie but a goodie.  If you have a Wii, get it on Virtual Console.)

Wow, actually predates them.. Hmm.


I like the characters in AW, but I can see if some don't. Either way, the gameplay is great for a little handheld entertainment. Not sure why someone couldn't find some fun out of it.

Yeah, there was Famicom Wars, Military Madness (Nectaris), games like Earthlight for the SFC - it's an old genre. Not many of those games were translated so it seems newer than it is. Fire Emblem is the same, it began as an NES series. (Also by Intelligent Systems)

People who like Military Madness/Nextaris should try Earthlight:

http://nectaris.tg-16.com/earth_light_intro.html

Not sure if there is a translation available but it's playable in Japanese. It's basically Nectaris 2. (Avoid the second EarthLight game, it sucks)

There is also the Dai Senryaku games, of which 2 are available in the US.  One on the Saturn called Iron Storm or something, and Dai Senryaku 7 which is available on the Xbox (BC on the 360 surprisingly enough!), and an enhanced version of the same game on the PS2.

The PSP has Field Commander which is a soulless scifi Advance Wars clone with some annoying stealth units and Robotech voice actors.

The N Gage has High Seize which is Advance Wars with voiceovers and a PIRATE theme. 

Booo!

They just seem like more souless anime generica. But really, the characters and twee dialogue are highly skippable, and it's a great handheld game.

I'm thinking of sending Killer Bee the money for PG. I loved that game, and it's cheap enough. Apparently you can't re-download it (only reason I haven't bought it yet), so make sure to create lots 'o backups.

Why boo?

It was a pretty fun game for being a complete ripoff of Advance Wars. 

Just catching up:

Wii is not a gamer's platform. But there's more non-gamers than gamers. By lots. And the titles are cheaper in general (even if so far people are largely buying the A-list brands and Nintendo).

PS3- People are buying less of the console and less content for it. For a gamer's gaming rig, you'd think it'd be higher. The more telling comparison here is the continued thrashing the X360 is giving them. But it's also provides insight into the idea that non-gamers are going to spend less money on games in general. I understand this belief but it is wrong, for one simple reason:

Everyone's a gamer. You make games for them and they'll buy them. The only difference between this decade and the prior is that realization that "them" is a hell of a lot bigger than once thought. The teens of the 80s took their gaming habits with them into careers, marriage, kids, and, well, you've heard this all before. It's just becoming less deniable.

PS3 is still lacking widely appealing titles. In America (Not Europe or Japan), 360 Owners will buy anything. There's no accounting for taste. Even games like Bullet Witch made profit.

In Japan, the PS3 is doing just fine, though it's obviously slow to pick up (cost). But it's always been a matter of "When do Devil May Cry, Monster Hunter Next-Gen, Gran Turismo HD Final, and Final Fantasy hit" over there.

The Wii could be the new PS2. Easily. If the PS2 weren't around. That's why Atlus, etc are releasing the Wii and PS2 versions at the same time for a lot of their games. Apparently converting a game from PS2 to the Wii is a nominal cost (not surprising).

PS2 games are still incredibly, incredibly profitable as well. When costs go down on the PS3, things will switch over. Also, when Sony makes PS2 games downloadable when they finish the software emulator, that will help immensely.

No. No they're not. Not here in Australia at least. There might be a half-dozen shovelware POS titles for it. Maybe even a dozen, but there are tons of older 360 titles that are considerably cheaper (and for the most part, better).


PS3. I'm a gamer, but I've only become interested in getting a PS3 to use as a BR player. (that can play a couple of games).
I was looking at getting the HD-DVD a few weks ago, then the studios' announcement hit the week before I was going to go out and purchase.

It's kind of a pain in the ass right now, but it'll have more options eventually for games. I mean, hell, it isn't even that bad now. I may just be overly picky. I still think Sony is the cream of the crop as far as first parties go though. And in the end, all of these systems will be fine 2-3 years from now. Games galore. I really doubt any, PS3 included, are going the way of the Jag or DC or whatever.

There I agree. I think it's possible the concept of directly comparing these consoles could itself be changing. I really doubt the Wii stole cannibalized the PS3 much, for example. Maybe the X360 got a bunch of PS2ers who didn't want to wait another year, but I suspect that group will migrate to the PS3 if (big emphasis) all the stuff being talked about a) actually comes out; and, b) is any good.

Could be different markets emerge. So it's Wii by itself and then PS3 and X360 duking it out to a degree, until one of them tries to splinter into a third market. Kinda depends (to me) on how far Microsoft is willing to push their media anywhere connected household thing. The PS3 may be the better media device, but the X360 is better integrated to more houses... assuming the people in those houses want the device for more than just RRODs, achievements and more PopCap games.

Sony has much better support of their own systems post release - and even moreso after nextgen is out. Which is to say, they still heavily support the PS2. And are still making advances on the platform. I bet the PSP2 WILL be based on if not THE PS2 architecture.

But I bet there's another revision of the PSP after the new PS2 hits america and EU.

As for Microsoft and Nintendo. They leave their old consoles in the dust. Except for the Gamecube (who gives a shit, rite) with the Wii, since it IS a gamecube.

Basically, when Sony (post release, not pre-release 3HDMI port silliness, OH KEN "You Krack Me Up" KUTARAGI) says they're going to do something, they do it. And they do it better than the competition.

Also, as Stray said, better first and second parties than anyone else right now.

Yeah, I'm real shocked that Sony continues to support the console that sold over 100 million (and what is still likely their biggest source of profit in their game division), while MS and Nintendo discontinued their last gen consoles.

Sony is already turning a profit on the PS3, just to put that out there.

360 is still a loss leader (well, was until Halo, but it will be again, repairs are costing them).

Awful pun, and I like awful puns.

I replied to this earlier but the internet ate my post. The gist being I agree with you in general, but in the now it's not all that exciting if you already have a 360, (And Live makes 360 the format of choice for cross-platform games, just as the controller and the 1st and 2nd parties made the PS2 my console of choice over Xbox). 1st and 2nd Party studios this round is really a personal pref thing, and at the moment I don't really have an opinion for the moment on this gen..

Sony is turning a profit in their games division again.  Part of the reason for that is a reduction of the cost in manufacturing PS3's, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're making a profit on them.  It could just mean that they are losing little enough money on them for the PS2 and PSP sales to be able to cover the losses and still bring in an overall profit for the game division.

Surely it isn't a coincidence that the Sony games division is making a profit about the time that PSP sales are increasing significantly, PS2 sales hardware (and thus software) sales are remaining as strong as they've been for the last few years. I'm pretty sure the PS3's lackluster sales numbers aren't contributing much if anything to the profit.

I sort of have a hard time believing any of the Playstation Triplets are carrying the division alone.  Maybe the PS2 is, I could believe that.  It's hard to follow something so fractured.

It's very likely that the PS2 is carrying the division.  The last price drop the thing had was a $20 one almost 2 years ago (before that, it had been $149.99 since May of '04), so I have to believe they're making a decent profit on the hardware at this point, and it's still selling well, along with the software.

OK, the more I think about it the more I believe you.  Last time I went into Gamestop, they had a huge number of PS2 titles.  I have no idea who is buying all of these PS2s, but it must be the same crowd that was buying all the GBA SP during the 2006 holiday season.

Sort of going back to the original topic, I was mildly surprised to see a discount rack of Wii games at Best Buy last week.  I mean that I was surprised for about five seconds to find it, and another five seconds due to not recognizing any titles and realizing they were all new.  These are real dollar-store-type SKUs, like those DVDs you see with a bunch of black-and-white cartoons you have never heard of near the Rite Aid checkout.

Between December and March, Destineer alone has 5 Wii budget titles.

I bought one back in September just to play FIFA 08 because the Wii version sucked such massive donkey cock. Of course, I bought one used and didn't actually spend any money, using trade-in credit I'd gotten by trading in an extra Wii that I won. But still. I did buy a PS2.