DAOC State of the Game

[TheWall]

I've been picking through all of the DAOC game threads I can find here and I wanted to ask a few questions of those of you still playing.

I am trying to come back brand new. I haven't played since right after the release of New Frontiers. I still have two accounts with 50s on them but I dont' want to come back to that. I was thinking of buying the new box set with everything in it so I can come back new and play like a new player. I'm hoping to imerse myself in the world the way I did when I first played the game. I want it to be exciting to wander out of Vasudheim (sp?) and kill wolves and skeletons. I want to catch the fun from when the game was new and finding my way down to the Tomte lair was an exciting adventure. Is this still possible? Or will I be leveling in a vitual ghost town where people just walk by the wolves and skeletons to get to the instances and such.

Also, if I were to pick a server cluster, which one could I get the most xp from PvP in the battlegrounds? I'm looking for a server that is busy enough that it has BG action from level 1 to level 44. I'd prefer it to be a classic server since I don't want the TOA learning curve. But I'm not limiting myself.

[shiznitz]

I have never played DAoC but I am betting on the ghost town scenario. Does any game released pre-2004 have any new players these days?

[HaemishM]

I'm betting on ghost town. That's the way it was for me when I resubbed AFTER New Frontiers. I soloed for all but about 3 hours of my first 32 levels before I quit.

[TheWall]

Do you think the ghost town syndrome will be reduced on the Classic servers? Or has that ship already sailed?

[Morfiend]

Well, they do have that "Sidekick" function. Im not sure what its called in DAOC, but it basically work the same. So, you would have less trouble finding a group, but even at low levels, you would be doing higher level content.

[HaemishM]

Nebu would know better than I, but I did hear Classic Servers initially had good reprsentation at all the battlegrounds, even the under 20 ones.

[Lt.Dan]

Best bet is classic servers but don't hold your breath for groups outside of instances.  Shortest route to the cheese and all that.  

I resubbed for classic servers, joined a guild and generally had a blast.  However, sometime in high level 30s groups in dungeons just didn't happen.  The player mentality was: "instances were the fastest way to advance so lets do that".  Instances were the most uninspired gameplay in any game ever (think progress quest) and I couldn't face the grind anymore so I quit.  I prefer some challenge in my gameplay.

I heard they nerfed instance XP so it may be different now, but past experience tells me you'll just spend time asking for groups at xp camp du jour instead of having fun.  And if you're a stealth class you'll probably be asking a lot.

Sidekicking worked fine up until the grind set in.  Then people were more interested in maximizing xp.

[Nebu]

Nebu would know better than I, but I did hear Classic Servers initially had good reprsentation at all the battlegrounds, even the under 20 ones.

Thanks for the kind words Haemish... here goes my diatribe.

The classic servers are dying down as well, but Gareth still retains about 2500 people during primetime.  I think this server would be as close as you can find to your original experience.  As someone that has been playing off and on since beta, here are a few things to note as you consider playing the game again:

1) The PvE experience is still pretty bad.   There are MUCH better games available if PvE is your thing (i.e. WoW and CoV).  

2) If you enjoy PvP or RvR, you will find a very active environment for it on the Gareth server.  I will caution you that now that the server has matured, fewer of the BG's will be populated (Thidranki, Molvik, Leirvik) but still offer a fun experience.

3) Catacombs reduced the PvE grind to 50 making entry into the endgame less painful.  Add to this the classic server ruleset and you can be equipped and ready for "big-boy" rvr much faster than ever before.  

4) Darkness Rising added a few nice touches without adding a lengthy new grind.

5) The newbie experience is still lacking.  Most players on this server are veterans of the game and have come to this server with old friends.  Finding groups for adventuring isn't as easy as it used to be.  Many people prefer to solo, group with friends, or group with a bot.  I wish this weren't the case, but it's more the norm rather than the exception. Be prepared to be on your own often.

6) The RvR experience is best enjoyed with an organized group that plays together regularly.  You may find pickup situations very frustrating and without a group will be at the will of roaming bands of players (affectionately called: zergs).  If you happen to play with 7 other solid players, DAoC offers one of the better PvP experiences in an MMOG.  Without it, you can face some bouts of sheer frustration.

I could go on, but that's a good place to start.  I've played a number of characters on Gareth for the past few months and had some fun when the server was young.  Sadly, I find myself considering cancelling my subscription after 4+ years with the game.  Mythic has been doing quite a bit to keep this title on life support, but the longer I play, the more problems I see on the horizon.  

Feel free to ask more questions.  I played both Alb and Mid on Gareth and feel I have a good understanding of the game and the server.

[TheWall]

Thanks for the info Nebu. Its unfortunate news though. I must say I'm a bit disheartened that I will not be able to find the fun I once had. Soloing isn't terrible though. Maybe I will make a Hunter. From what I read Mid is the least populated on Gareth and a hunter can solo well in RvR. (Well they could when I left.) I'm a very casual player so the race to 50 is not really possible for me. I figure I'll get there when I get there, but I want to PvP as much as I can on my way.

I'm planning to play with no buffbot at all but I heard that people just stick them to their backs and run around fully buffed anyway. Is this pretty much how things are?

[Mesozoic]

I was thinking of buying the new box set with everything in it so I can come back new and play like a new player. I'm hoping to imerse myself in the world the way I did when I first played the game.

This doesn't work. Sites like this exist because people like us are trying and failing to re-create that first-time feeling.  The newb-hymen does not regrow.  And no, the bloodstains don't come out.

[TheWall]

This doesn't work. Sites like this exist because people like us are trying and failing to re-create that first-time feeling.  The newb-hymen does not regrow.  And no, the bloodstains don't come out.

Hah hah hah hah! Awesome. I guess you are right. If it were possible to get back that feeling then we would all still be playing UO.

[Nebu]

Thanks for the info Nebu. Its unfortunate news though. I must say I'm a bit disheartened that I will not be able to find the fun I once had. Soloing isn't terrible though. Maybe I will make a Hunter. From what I read Mid is the least populated on Gareth and a hunter can solo well in RvR. (Well they could when I left.) I'm a very casual player so the race to 50 is not really possible for me. I figure I'll get there when I get there, but I want to PvP as much as I can on my way.

I'm planning to play with no buffbot at all but I heard that people just stick them to their backs and run around fully buffed anyway. Is this pretty much how things are?

Sounds like you have some idea of what to expect.  I actually play a hunter on Gareth and soloed it to 50.  It's a tough class to solo with, but it is doable.  Having self buffs helped a lot.  

As for solo RvR, you should have some fun in the BG's but I would be prepared for level 50 RvR.  Very few stealthers solo in this game anymore.  Stealth zergs and stealth/visible groups make running as a stealther quite a challenge.  Hunters do work well during large scale warfare in NF but I've found that Mid as a realm is poorly organized and has a low percentage of active RvR participants.  I tend to run solo most of the time and very rarely find solo targets to fight.  Often I'll attack a lone enemy archer only to get shot in the back by 3-4 more I didn't see.  About the only stealthers I do find solo were higher RR rangers and assassins which could make fast work of me.  

I'm not trying to be discouraging.  I just want you to know what you're getting into.  The game still has some very fun aspects to it, particularly if you enjoy the PvP side.  The game just has a number of balance issues and quite a few well-used exploits that I'm not sure will ever be addressed.  If I didn't see the fun in it, I never would have stayed as long as I did.  

A friend of mine compared DAoC to golf.  "Like that one good shot, it's that one good fight that keeps you coming back."  Mythic got a lot of things right in this game but still have a long way to go.  If I do leave, I'm sure I'll be watching the patch notes for a reason to return.  

[TheWall]

Well perhaps I will see you on. Gareth seems to be the server of choice for my play style. Send me a PM with your character names if you want to group some time.

[Signe]

That all in one box for $40 is a pretty good deal, too, if you're looking to fiddle around while you wait until... umm... something or other launches.

[Nebu]

Well perhaps I will see you on. Gareth seems to be the server of choice for my play style. Send me a PM with your character names if you want to group some time.

I've decided to cancel my account with some of the most recent game changes.  Best of luck to you!

[TheWall]

That all in one box for $40 is a pretty good deal, too, if you're looking to fiddle around while you wait until... umm... something or other launches.

It's only $30 at Walmart here.  Minus the free month I'm really only wasting $15.  :-D

I've decided to cancel my account with some of the most recent game changes.  Best of luck to you!

Oh well, thanks for the info anyway. What changes are causing you to quit, if you don't mind sharing?

[Nebu]

Oh well, thanks for the info anyway. What changes are causing you to quit, if you don't mind sharing?

There are some very fundamental flaws in the game's PvP mechanics that can make it a very frustrating experience.  Some of the recent "fixes" actually introduce a number of new problems rather than address larger core issues.  I see many of the recent changes as shortsighted.  It's almost as if the changes were implemented by someone that doesn't really see the game from the player's perspective.  I'd label most of the recent changes as a) this group is whining, so toss them a bone to keep subscription numbers up or b) enhance class x so that people will roll a toon of that class and maintain a subscription longer.

As a business, I can understand why Mythic has chosen this direction.  I've just decided that I don't wish to support the current trend and the only way I can vote is with my wallet. 

[TheWall]

Well you might have saved me some money then. I think I'm going to hold off on playing again until I can find some friends to play with me.

I have a few friends getting tired of WoW who have never played DAOC. I figure playing with new players will bring back some of the fun from when it was new. If I can convince them to switch from WoW.

[Johny Cee]

Just did my first reasonably active week of big boy RvR in about 2 years.

Wow......  just....  wow.

New frontiers adds a bunch of that battlegrounds feel.  Port into a keep,  run to hot spots, pick off stragglers or those enemies too busy with the full groups to worry about you.  The gank groups will run you down flat,  and occasionally the high RR stealther type or zerg runs you over,  but overall it was alot of fun.

Sitting at about 94,000 rps gained for the week.  Well over half of that was in a group of less than 4, probably 15k solo.

I can see why 8 vs 8ers aren't big on New Frontiers.  It takes away alot of their advantages.

Old Frontiers was set up such that,  it was useless to go out to Emain (major rvr zone) unless you had a full group.  A full, well balanced group.  A full, well balanced group with at least 4 competant people in specific positions.  That meant that most of your time was spent sitting in the portal keep or outside the border keep spamming broadcast for the required classes, unless you were in a gank guild or had a reputation for playing a key support class.

A pick-up group will still be run down by a gank group 10 times out of 10,  but now there's less chance of getting run over without support.  Small groups and soloers add,  and it's always likely if you're near the active portion of the map that some other group will blunder in.  Had quite a few fights where it gets going,  only to have the third realm jump in as the spoiler.

Buff and item differences are still an issue.  Both are much reduced.  The prevalence of bots (I was left a buddies account when he quit,  so have a bot) is at the point such that it's pretty likely you're getting buffed from someone.  I buff my groupmates, for example.

The item issue is ameliorated by Champion gear,  and the rounds of nerfs to ToA.  Champ gear is pretty good,  and ludicrously easy to acquire.  This sets you up with a top of the line weapon and some decent jewelry (just the Circle of Five quest gear is pretty good).  The ToA nerfs mean you need credit,  some scrolls, and you're pretty much in business.

And if that fails,  between the rvr missions and new rewards for healing, taking/defending structures, and repairing (guildie described repair rps as "pretty good",  and he's a sour German who complains about everything  ) you can pull in some decent RPs even if you or your group isn't dominating.

Beats the hell out of my last big RvR period.  That was pre-Left Axe nerf and crowd control was more dominant.  There were nights where I'd be lucky to make it from the border keep to Emain (5 minute plus run) without getting radared and run down.  And then sit at DL spamming "looking for bard for rvr" for 20 minutes.

Nebu is dead on when he described the rvr experience:  You play for long periods of time just to have those short, near euphoric, minutes when a really good fight is going. 

Just some impressions.  Would love to hear some other opinions.