SWTOR

[Malakili]

While I agree that the animations look pretty mediocre, its far from the most important issue to me.  The gameplay just doesn't look all that great from what we've seen.  Give me great gameplay and I'll overlook animations, textures, graphics in general.  I only get hung up on the graphics when its one of the only potential points of interest in the first place...at which point we have problems.

[Sjofn]

They should just even get the animations to be sufficient. As it is, they look remarkably amateurish, as though what we're seeing now is just a basic stand-in. Very little else done to improve the game's aura matters until they get the animations up to par.

I'm holding out hope that the current animations are largely stand-in. If it's purposeful design or 'thematic,' or they've convinced themselves that what their current animation teams have produced are good enough to go into the final product, I really hope that focus group testing and beta disabuse them of the notion early enough that they can overhaul the animations professionally. It really should be a priority.

Yeah, I don't need the animations to be great, but if they're not at least adequate, I wind up having a hard time getting into it.

[birdsguts]

Hey look at that! The circle is complete... 

[Margalis]

I think this game looks pretty bad and totally uninspired but to be fair pretty much all MMO combat looks boring in videos. Even the gold standard (lol) WoW combat boils down to stand there while you autoattack for the win and maybe press '1' sometimes if you feel like it.

[Shrike]

I think this game looks pretty bad and totally uninspired but to be fair pretty much all MMO combat looks boring in videos. Even the gold standard (lol) WoW combat boils down to stand there while you autoattack for the win and maybe press '1' sometimes if you feel like it.

Not really. WoW isn't PSO/U when it comes to fighting, but most dps classes are GCD choked as it is. Both my blood DK and--especially--my enhance shaman are button mashing fests of epic proportions. Supposedly, this crap is being slowed down some for Cataclysm, but it sure ain't auto-attacking with occasional inputs (in other words, it isn't EQ). One of my friends always comments that my enhance shaman sounds like a speed typing excerise in the background when listensing on Skype.

[Vinadil]

What do "PSO/U" and "GCD" mean?  It seems from the context that they refer to UI elements needed in game play? Are these new game defining terms that I missed somewhere?

[sam, an eggplant]

What do "PSO/U" and "GCD" mean?  It seems from the context that they refer to UI elements needed in game play? Are these new game defining terms that I missed somewhere?

I would guess that PSO/U probably means Phantasy Star Online Universe.

GCD is an acronym for global cooldown. After you swing your sword you can't immediately cast a fireball, there's a short cooldown period where you can't do anything else. Without it you would be able to consume all of your resources as quickly as you could hit the buttons (or a macro) and gameplay would be adversely affected. Imagine a wizard casting 100 fireballs in under one second.

[sam, an eggplant]

So I somehow managed to doublepost when editing my own post. I blame a crazy turk.

[Fordel]

GCD = Global Cool Down


The little pause between actions that prevents you from just holding down 'instant attack A' and blowing through that 50 times a second.

[Ratman_tf]

Hey look at that! The circle is complete... 

[Vinadil]

Ahh thanks, GCD I should have gotten... never would have come up with the phantasy star reference.

[Trippy]

Anonymous Mythic employee blog post discussion moved here:

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=19940.0

[tmp]

lead system designer interview

We're really proud of the crafting system. We can't wait to talk to you about it, and it is going to be really soon.

oh shi-

[Koyasha]

Ugh, my sentiments exactly.  I hate crafting, if it's more complex than the KOTOR2 system it'll probably be an annoyance to me.

But the worst part is WoW style crafting where different crafts have benefits that only the crafter can take advantage of, thus requiring everyone to either take up crafting or be sub-par.  Worse yet is combining it with a limitation on how many crafts you can learn or max out.  If everything that can be crafted can be sold, it won't be too bad, but if it's like WoW where some things are restricted to those with X skill, it'll be a major annoyance at best.

[Reg]

So if the crafting is like it is in WoW then SWTOR is doomed.  But if it's not like it is in WoW then it won't be quite as bad but SWTOR is still doomed.  Is that about it?

I can hardly wait for the predictions of doom once they've given out actual information.

[Koyasha]

Heh.  I tend to stay away from predictions of doom.  I just predict general annoyance in anything to do with crafting.  ...so far I have yet to be wrong on this.  I prefer to avoid anything to do with crafting if I possibly can in order to minimize the annoyance.  In WoW, that's not really possible anymore unless you want to be at a clear disadvantage.  At best, I am hoping that in SWTOR everything is tradeable and there's nothing that only the crafter can use.

Crafting where you've got stuff only the crafter can use means everyone must craft, which forces everyone to deal with the annoyance of crafting or be sub par.  Combine that with not being able to master all crafts, and you also wind up with optimal crafts for your class/spec.  It's almost inevitable, unless the benefits are identical from all crafts.

[tmp]

if it's more complex than the KOTOR2 system it'll probably be an annoyance to me.

The KOTOR2 thing was pretty ok for me. Mostly due to being able to customize the lightsaber look, and the scavenger hunt for the components was fairly light on tedium. I wonder though what sort of system they're going to invent that's going to fit all their classes in this one; given the recent trends, expecting some variation of the "bring your shit to npc to have it turned into useless crap X times" theme

[Paelos]

Bring back the Galaxies crafting system! I want to run my mining empire again, dammit! 

[Malakili]

Bring back the Galaxies crafting system! I want to run my mining empire again, dammit! 

I wondered how long it would take to get back to Galaxies after crafting was mentioned.

[Shatter]

Bring back the Galaxies crafting system! I want to run my mining empire again, dammit! 

I loved crafting in SWG.  You could make the most overpowered shit with the best resources and charge out the butt for it.  I had 2 accounts just for farming of the materials since there were so many and you could only put down so many factories, etc per character.  Waiting for every few days when the resources changed and you go find that close to 100% spot...good times.  As time consuming as this was I loved it but if SWTOR does anything close to this I am going to tear someones head off and rape their esophagus

[Draegan]

I hate crafting only because farming materials is never a fun thing to do.

[Cyrrex]

I hate crafting, but want to play in a world where crafting is important and complex.

[Shrike]

I hate crafting, but want to play in a world where crafting is important and complex.

I hear Square/Enix has a little something for you...

Personally, I hate it. De-frelling-test it. With a bullet. Admittedly, I indulge in WoW, but it's mostly because I'm a cheap bastard and hate farming gold even more. Having your own 'smiths, LW, and a JC do make life easier--once they're all capped. The trip up is hell. Pure, screaming hell. Other than making arrows in EQ, I avoided it like the plague it was. I don't see that being any better in ToR, and potentially a lot worse. Another strike against this game.

[Reg]

Wait. Any kind of crafting is "strike against the game?"

Do you know irrational you sound?

[Shrike]

Wait. Any kind of crafting is "strike against the game?"

Do you know irrational you sound?

Not really. I don't like crafting. What more needs to be said?

If it's something you can ignore without any real consequence, then fine. When you have to do it or suffer some sort of degradation in gameplay, then I get stabby. WoW teeters on that brink as it is. We've got a guy in our guild that switches professions constantly for the slightest advantage they might give. This in itself isn't a big deal, but when he gives me (my shaman) shit about it because she's not an engineer...well, you see the issue.

And, yeah, I"m keeping score on this game (ToR). I want to like it. The VA works is actually quite impressive. The gameplay videos, however, are anything but. Funky looking characters--strike one. I realize there's a reason for this, but I don't like it. Shitty animations--strike two. Now we have crafting--which may or may not be a cockstab. It's not looking good.

[tmp]

On the other hand, imagine crafting has components like "Ewok tears". And you get to squeeze them out personally...

[Malakili]

Bring back the Galaxies crafting system! I want to run my mining empire again, dammit! 

I loved crafting in SWG.  You could make the most overpowered shit with the best resources and charge out the butt for it.  I had 2 accounts just for farming of the materials since there were so many and you could only put down so many factories, etc per character.  Waiting for every few days when the resources changed and you go find that close to 100% spot...good times.  As time consuming as this was I loved it but if SWTOR does anything close to this I am going to tear someones head off and rape their esophagus

They won't, so don't worry.  Its really obvious they are trying to do everything as deliberately different from Galaxies as possible.

[Shrike]

On the other hand, imagine crafting has components like "Ewok tears". And you get to squeeze them out personally...

Ahh, you had to go and do that. The sheer potential...staggering.

[Samprimary]

I also want achievements.

Christmas Special
Murder every single Wookie on Life Day.

[Lantyssa]

Wookiee, godsdamnit.

[eldaec]

I hate crafting, but want to play in a world where crafting is important and complex.

Eve online says hi, as she often does when people are describing how they want their mmogs to be.

[Rasix]

I'm trying to come up with some witty wordplay to be as dismissive as I possibly can, but I'm coming up empty.

Eve is fucking boring.  Stop saying "hi".

edit: Seriously, shoooo.  Back to your forum.

[Lantyssa]

You could try "She did?  Sorry, I fell asleep when she started describing how gameplay should be."

Alternatively:  Get back in the station and cook me a capacitor.

[Sjofn]

Eve is the kind of girl who doesn't understand you're just not into her.

[Kageru]

Eve is terrible. But it is also true that the only game in which crafting is fundamental is one in which there is massive destruction of crafted assets. Eve probably hits that target an order of magnitude harder than any other MMO. I mean that's largely why WoW introduced raid consumables and personal bonuses because most of the crafting products are useless as soon as people are in the first raid dungeon.

Given SWTOR has to go for a mainstream audience (to make the sub numbers they need) the chance of there being a deep crafting system and mass consumption of crafted materials is pretty unlikely.