SW - Episode 7: Mary Sue wakes up but there's no coffee. RAGE.

[Soulflame]

To be fair, the Thin Man movies are boring.  Although it's fascinating to see all of those barely functioning alcoholics stumble through the cigarette haze of their lives.

I didn't particularly care for Abrams reimagining of Star Trek, and I'm not sure either movie was really that good, even taking them as "as inspired by" rather than something that should be viewed as actually Star Trek.

I also loved the original Star Wars movies as a kid.  We, as a family, saw A New Hope twice in the theaters, something that never happened before or after that.  The new Star Wars movies, I didn't like as much, but they weren't for me, and I can live with that.  What that means, unfortunately, is that I'll be an even further remove from the next set of movies, unless Abrams dumps the concept of the movies being for kids, and tries to make them appeal to the audience that grew up on the sequels.

I'll probably see the first one, unless I hear it's not a good movie.  Whether I see any of the others will depend on how I like the first.

[HaemishM]

And before anyone starts on the "kids have no taste" train, we weren't any better. Let's face it old men like us only watched Leave it to Beaver, Lassie, etc because it was the only option, not because we enjoyed them.  GI Joe was as terrible as the Prequels, in a lot of ways worse, and we ate that shit up as prepubescents.

I'll have you know I watched Dobie Gillis religiously as a kid - that was some good shit. Just because it's old doesn't mean kids automatically hate it. Same goes for the Wizard of Oz - that movie was ancient when I was a kid, and it was "must watch TV" when it came on in my household.

[Shannow]

I still don't buy the BS that the prequels were for kids. That sounds like a 'oh it's still in beta' excuse to me. George Lucas just makes crap films now (holy mother of god try watching 'Red Tails' some time). It happens. If SW VII has a good story, humour and a good John Williams score it will fucking rock for kids and adults.

Star Wars Rebels wasn't half bad, and when the force theme played I did get goosebumps. I'm such a sucker.

[Sir T]

Lucas didn't make the films for Kids as such, he made them to sell as much merch as he possibly could. That's where he thought he would make the money. He knew damn well that the real audience for the prequels was the old star wars fans so making them "for kids" would have been bloody stupid. They only became "for kids" after the fact then he was explaining how his films were commonly regarded as having sucked and made more money for him than the Merch did. All the merch flopped for the most part as no-one cared about whoever that alien was in the messy prequels. And he had to explain with all that how "the Clone wars" was actually a quite successful cartoon series. Nothing in the pre-hype said that they were made for kids but they became that after the fact because the successful and reasonably well regarded part was a cartoon.

I'd be willing to bet money that Lucas had been beaten away from the clone wars with a baseball bat at that point and had little to do with it.

[Nevermore]

Star Wars Rebels wasn't half bad, and when the force theme played I did get goosebumps. I'm such a sucker.

Styling it like A New Hope with the wipes was a nice touch, but I didn't like it as much as The Clone Wars.  It's obviously aimed at an even younger audience.  Energy slingshot? Really?    It's still better than the prequels, though!

[Soulflame]

I think a character like Jar Jar is meant as a direct appeal to children, and having one of the heroes (even if by accident) be a child was also a direct appeal to children.

If Lucas meant to tailor the sequel trilogy to adults who loved the original trilogy, I think he missed his mark, at least in my case.

[jgsugden]

... I'd be willing to bet money that Lucas had been beaten away from the clone wars with a baseball bat at that point and had little to do with it.

From the interviews I've read, you'd lose the money.  He had a heavy hand in Clone Wars until the point that Disney took the controls and changed course.

[Maven]

Which begs the question... was Anakin & Padme's romance still a better love story than Twilight?

When I think genre titles for adults, I think Star Trek: TNG or other more intellectual explorations. Whiz bang action, while enjoyable, has a certain immaturity to it. Reality is hand-waved over excitement and drama. Yes, true for any entertainment product, but to a larger degree in fantasy genres (A Wizard Did It).

I'm sure there's a Kids to Adult genre scale for fantasy that starts at Adventure Time and goes to Game of Thrones. Star Wars would be closer to the former.

[Bunk]

I think a character like Jar Jar is meant as a direct appeal to children, and having one of the heroes (even if by accident) be a child was also a direct appeal to children.

If Lucas meant to tailor the sequel trilogy to adults who loved the original trilogy, I think he missed his mark, at least in my case.

A New Hope appealed to kids without pandering to them. It was full of stuff that was cool to kids. Episode 1 was pure pandering (and crappy pandering at that).

Episode 1 vs. Episode 4:
 - main hero is a six year old versus a guy in his late teens
 - key plot around saving an entire race of comic relief aliens from "evilish" comic relief aliens, who are oppressing them with comic relief robots vs. two comic relief support characters in C3PO/R2D2 (who did the same in both movies)
 - Lucas directing everyone to over enunciate like they are doing a radio drama (or talking in a way little kids can follow) vs. not doing that
 - a comic sidekick that was so revoltingly stupid that even kids hated him vs. a cool sidekick who happened to use bits of comedy to make himself cooler

Look, nothing here is new to anyone. The prequels sucked and 99% of that was on Lucas, because he wanted to attract new kid viewers and knew the old viewers would show up no matter how shitty it was. I still saw everyone one of them in the theater, twice in the case of episode one. But I stopped and thought about how many times I've seen each, and it's something like this in order: 3, 2, 2, 20+, 7, 2 (by Jedi he decided he wanted to go after new kids, thus Ewoks)

[Sir T]

How many times have you watched



And its gripping sequel



And yes they were real movies by the real George Lucas.

[Trippy]

Edit: thanks

http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=23804.0

[jgsugden]

In *gulp* defense of Lucas, he has said that the intent was to present a series of movies that were a cohesive whole - and that he wanted to start them innocent and make them grow darker.  It explains why he took the approach he did, even if it was a complete failure.

[Sir T]

So he started off with "kid acts like annoying angry spoilt uncaring Jackass" and ended with "young man acts like annoying angry spoilt uncaring jackass". Frankly, Anikins journey to the Dark Side was about 2 feet, including detours. Lucas's idea of foreshadowing is "Start with character already at the dark side and film him flicking off all the lights and digging darker tunnel"

[Evildrider]

I blame at least half of shitty Annakin on Hayden Christiansen.

[jgsugden]

Lucas was certainly the black hole that drew in everything wrong with the prequel... he was responsible for the casting, the story, the dialogue, the duche, ... Christiansen is his fault.

[Malakili]

So he started off with "kid acts like annoying angry spoilt uncaring Jackass" and ended with "young man acts like annoying angry spoilt uncaring jackass". Frankly, Anikins journey to the Dark Side was about 2 feet, including detours. Lucas's idea of foreshadowing is "Start with character already at the dark side and film him flicking off all the lights and digging darker tunnel"

Yeah, this one of the real problems too.  It's sort of a character driven trilogy with essentially no character arc.  And instead of an interesting, perhaps subtle insidious turn to the Dark Side where you can sort of empathize with him, instead you get a brat who turns into someone who murders kids.

[Ghost_of_Najena]

How many times have you watched



And its gripping sequel



And yes they were real movies by the real George Lucas.

Heh is it bad that I went back and watched both of those the last 2 nights...

[Lantyssa]

Only if you enjoyed them.

[Sir T]

In all honesty I've never seen them. Are they as bad as the whole concept would scream at you?

Oh god I'm actually contemplating looking for them to watch them now help me help me! 

[Rishathra]

I enjoyed them immensely when they first came out.  I was ten at the time so I think that warrants forgiveness.

[Merusk]

Enjoyed the stories, hated the cutesy girl.  Was also 10.

I also remember wondering why the hell the giant guy didn't bother the Empire when they were about.

[Nevermore]

That second one looks like Gandalf vs Angelina Jolie and the Creature from the Black Lagoon.  What's not to like?  

[Ingmar]

That's clearly Dumbledore.

[Maven]

I don't remember much of the movies other than I saw them, pretty sure I only saw the second one, and that's the only time I've seen that haircut on a child.

[Pezzle]

If I had any photoshop talent those would both be Shadow of Endor posters.  Ewok extinction level event!

[Triforcer]

I think a character like Jar Jar is meant as a direct appeal to children, and having one of the heroes (even if by accident) be a child was also a direct appeal to children.

If Lucas meant to tailor the sequel trilogy to adults who loved the original trilogy, I think he missed his mark, at least in my case.

A New Hope appealed to kids without pandering to them. It was full of stuff that was cool to kids. Episode 1 was pure pandering (and crappy pandering at that).

Episode 1 vs. Episode 4:
 - main hero is a six year old versus a guy in his late teens
 - key plot around saving an entire race of comic relief aliens from "evilish" comic relief aliens, who are oppressing them with comic relief robots vs. two comic relief support characters in C3PO/R2D2 (who did the same in both movies)
 - Lucas directing everyone to over enunciate like they are doing a radio drama (or talking in a way little kids can follow) vs. not doing that
 - a comic sidekick that was so revoltingly stupid that even kids hated him vs. a cool sidekick who happened to use bits of comedy to make himself cooler

Look, nothing here is new to anyone. The prequels sucked and 99% of that was on Lucas, because he wanted to attract new kid viewers and knew the old viewers would show up no matter how shitty it was. I still saw everyone one of them in the theater, twice in the case of episode one. But I stopped and thought about how many times I've seen each, and it's something like this in order: 3, 2, 2, 20+, 7, 2 (by Jedi he decided he wanted to go after new kids, thus Ewoks)

I'm 5, 1, 1, 15+, 5, 2.  I don't know why I keep watching Phantom Menace- it seems like it is always on television, and it actually is better than II and III. 

[jgsugden]

But how many times have you seen the Christmas Special?

[Sir T]

YOU MONSTER!!! *cries*

[Soulflame]

I've never seen the Christmas Special.

Episode 1 isn't unwatchable.  I like the first 15 minutes, the last 15 minutes, and the rest is buffer I can more or less ignore while awaiting the climatic duel between the Jedi and Darth Maul.

[Rendakor]

1 is definitely the least shit of the prequels; it lacks Hayden Christiansen which makes it more tolerable. I'm something like 4, 2, 2, 10+, 10+, 10+ for views; don't have an exact count but The Trilogy is always watched to completion.

[Sir T]

Ep 1 had Liam Nealson, who actually tries his damndest to make his character a little bit interesting, priest-like and have a depth greater than 0.02mm.  He was the best thing about the hole thing, which means he probably had Lucas screaming in his ear after every take about what a shit joke of a job he was doing and to ACT LIKE YOU HAVE A PLANK UP YOUR ASS LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DAMMIT!!!

The fight at the end had be giggling a bit in the Theater. I was actually expecting them to start dancing the can can it was so obviously choreographed. And seriously, when Darth Silent walked through the door in front of a bunch of guys with guns I REALLY wanted them to fucking open fire on his ass rather than leave him to the Jedi and find another way around. I mean, I'm sorry, Lightsaber vs 15 guys in close range with blasters = you open fire. It would at least have been cool to see him leaping 10 feet out of the way or something. Oops, sorry, that's too much like Empire Strikes Back and therefore is shit, signed Lucas.

I've never seen the Christmas Special.

Well if you want to sample the Je ne sai que of the Christmas special without actually watching the thing, you can read this minute by minute review of it. It should help you appreciate how much you missed.

http://badfiction.typepad.com/badfiction/2012/12/bad-movie-review-the-star-wars-holiday-special.html

[Rishathra]

The fight at the end had be giggling a bit in the Theater. I was actually expecting them to start dancing the can can it was so obviously choreographed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0qH2IaSjEU&index=5&list=PLINl9l0igYjzIipxsD4Y59_Jjxe4N3pZo

The full videos are, like the Plinkett reviews, better than the actual movies.

[Pezzle]

Movie title revealed.  The Force Awakens

http://insidemovies.ew.com/2014/11/06/star-wars-episode-vii-breaking/

[Sir T]

So the force was asleep the last 3 movies??

(Sorry, your math is off. THERE WERE ONLY 3 MOVIES!!)

[HaemishM]

So the force was asleep the last 3 movies??

Well, the director was certainly asleep the last 3 released prequel movies, so why not?