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Topic: SWTOR (Read 2120545 times)
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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Mass Effect 2 live demo on right now. Was that a new character in your party or did Ashley get some implants? That's someone new, with a very VERY tight shirt.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Fordel
Terracotta Army
Posts: 8306
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Oh boy, ACTION ORIENTED combat.
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and the gate is like I TOO AM CAPABLE OF SPEECH
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Montague
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1297
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No gameplay. Zzzzzz
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When Fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross - Sinclair Lewis.
I can tell more than 1 fucktard at a time to stfu, have no fears. - WayAbvPar
We all have the God-given right to go to hell our own way. Don't fuck with God's plan. - MahrinSkel
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Lucas
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3298
Further proof that Italians have suspect taste in games.
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" He's so impatient, it's like watching a teenager fuck a glorious older woman." - Ironwood on J.J. Abrams
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Falwell
Terracotta Army
Posts: 619
Ghetto Gear Solid: Raiden
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Those hoping to see gameplay footage in that "stage demo" will have to be content with eating shit.
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Lucas
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3298
Further proof that Italians have suspect taste in games.
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Taste like chicken.
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" He's so impatient, it's like watching a teenager fuck a glorious older woman." - Ironwood on J.J. Abrams
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eldaec
Terracotta Army
Posts: 11843
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Does this even have a fake release date yet? Who the hell was expecting real gameplay footage?
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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SnakeCharmer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3807
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Those hoping to see gameplay footage in that "stage demo" will have to be content with eating shit.
Forums are a flame with nerd rage about the lack of the demo they supposedly promised without delivering. So much so that you can't create a new topic in any forum, and only reply to existing threads. Wow. That Sean guy is WAY WAY out of his league.
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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Those hoping to see gameplay footage in that "stage demo" will have to be content with eating shit.
Forums are a flame with nerd rage about the lack of the demo they supposedly promised without delivering. So much so that you can't create a new topic in any forum, and only reply to existing threads. Wow. That Sean guy is WAY WAY out of his league. There's already been a demo. wtf are they whining for?
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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SnakeCharmer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3807
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I wrote that wrong, sorry.
The were apparently expecting to see 30 minutes of game footage. Not sure where that specifically started from, but that's been the buzz of the forums the last couple of days. "Journalists" got to play it (or see the demo), fans didn't. Now forum/fans are pissed.
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UnSub
Contributor
Posts: 8064
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I completely approve of the experimental MMO design that Bioware is trying out - a choose-your-own-adventure title that you can play with others and all pick which page to turn to.
The issue here is that they are doing it with the Star Wars IP, which is loaded with so much fan baggage that it would choke a sarlaac. The group decision process sounds okay up until players metagame it for powergaming advantage, grief each other about it and basically don't team. In fact, I see it (as described) as guaranteeing limited / small PUGs or solo play. Plus the content has to be replayable - has to - or else 1) Bioware will have to create more content for SWOR's launch than any other MMO to date - 40 hour storylines in MMOs tend to get eaten up within two weeks - and 2) players won't want to miss out on better content because their group picked the 'wrong' path.
At this point, it sounds like SWOR will be a MMO PvE with a giant lobby players can gather in before going into individual storylines.
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Triforcer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4663
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I honestly believe that Bioware believes it can churn out static content at a rate that each person's personal "story" will last until the next expansion. We are probably close in time to their "oh shit" moment when they realize that would take another five years, and EA won't allow that.
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All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu. This is the truth! This is my belief! At least for now...
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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I honestly believe that Bioware believes it can churn out static content at a rate that each person's personal "story" will last until the next expansion. We are probably close in time to their "oh shit" moment when they realize that would take another five years, and EA won't allow that.
This is why they have to use voiceovers and hopefully do-so w/o quest text. I'd say the grind would probably 3+ times as much time to maxlevel if people have to listen to all the voiceovers. Also, since much of the content is decision-based, you cant just skip through... because you could be seriously borking yourself. I think it's evil, and ingenius if they indeed release the game that way. I hope they do... gonna take balls though They can also take a lesson from MxO, which really didnt effectively get its players to take part in the active storyline, even with dynamic content. Reason being, there was nothing forcing the players to aspire to do-so and the stories were just too few and far between. Bioware is hiring an Army of writers, and they'll likely stay pretty employed if they can get the playerbase to sign onto this. Instead of trying to make the content dynamic after-the-fact, they make it "dynamic" via CYOA before release... and update at their leisure. Very smart if you asked me. It'll be like an audiobook you can play. The only other question I've got is how much scripting will there be? If the writing is good enough, there wont need to be any. Bland, and they better have some interaction beyond just CYOA.
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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Venkman
Terracotta Army
Posts: 11536
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I completely approve of the experimental MMO design that Bioware is trying out - a choose-your-own-adventure title that you can play with others and all pick which page to turn to.
The only thing I find anywhere near innovative is the mention of multiplayer quest dialog. Everything else is just a crapload of money chasing a proven formula. The game play is derivative. The only thing really "experimental" is the scope of the promise I actually would like to see them make an AC1 with a story that mattered and kept players entertained, rather than giving them some specific new set of grinds every month. We've got WoW for that noise.
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Triforcer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4663
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I'd say its highly unlikely that there will be no accompanying text, and/or be on option to skip cutscenes (although the latter gets complicated in a group setting). There will be hearing-impaired players and/or those who want/need to play without sound. There will be a much larger group of players who go into an unstoppable rage if they have to watch a cutscene every time. Bioware, at some level, has to realize that.
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All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu. This is the truth! This is my belief! At least for now...
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SnakeCharmer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3807
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Bioware, at some level, has to realize that.
I think it might me...Yeah...It is... It's time for my schild impersonation... BioWare AUSTIN
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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I'd say its highly unlikely that there will be no accompanying text, and/or be on option to skip cutscenes (although the latter gets complicated in a group setting). There will be hearing-impaired players and/or those who want/need to play without sound. There will be a much larger group of players who go into an unstoppable rage if they have to watch a cutscene every time. Bioware, at some level, has to realize that.
So then have the text, but dont allow one to skip through until the cutscene has finished. Either that or make the text scrolling w/o the ability to speed it up.
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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Triforcer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4663
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I'd say its highly unlikely that there will be no accompanying text, and/or be on option to skip cutscenes (although the latter gets complicated in a group setting). There will be hearing-impaired players and/or those who want/need to play without sound. There will be a much larger group of players who go into an unstoppable rage if they have to watch a cutscene every time. Bioware, at some level, has to realize that.
So then have the text, but dont allow one to skip through until the cutscene has finished. Either that or make the text scrolling w/o the ability to speed it up. That is the kind of shit we mock mercilessly when talking about old school EQ or some other exercise in virtual S&M. What's the point in not giving people the option to skip it? Because they "should" read it? Why is "players should" still in the MMO dev's vocabulary?
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All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu. This is the truth! This is my belief! At least for now...
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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Umm.. the devs mentioned "the end of the story arc" for your particular class character. Exactly what happens at the end?? Do we have to reroll? (if there's no endgame I would hope there is no subscription fee)
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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Triforcer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4663
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A couple of the E3 interviews that have been mentioned have said that the devs said this will be a "full trimmings" MMO- with full pvp (I don't think, from context, they meant FFA PvP), crafting, raids, etc). Maybe that was in response to the "this is a single-player game" rumors floating around.
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All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu. This is the truth! This is my belief! At least for now...
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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Why should they risk the huge amount of money this game is costing on something experimental in the controls?
If half of what they're saying about the storyline stuff and PVE design is true, then the game will be plenty innovative already. Advancement in the genre doesn't have to be purely mechanical or visual.
I think this game is Not For Me. Quests were cool when we were coming off of games like EQ and DAOC, but now after years of 'em in WoW, I'm sick to death of quests and theme park storylines. All that voice acting and story driven quests sounds boring and the kind of thing I'd skip frantically so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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Triforcer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4663
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so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
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All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu. This is the truth! This is my belief! At least for now...
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
I know. It doesn't even have to be earth shaking revolution. Just mob bashing that's got a new twist or two to play with.
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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Tannhauser
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4436
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Yeah, the game you're looking for is called Spellborn. It takes about 1 minute of real time to kill a single bear. You're welcome.
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jayfyve
Terracotta Army
Posts: 46
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I'd actually personally be thrilled if I went in with a PUG and some douche killed the puppy anyway, and it meant that the karma police were going to come after all of us as a result. Because that's how shit really works. You don't get to re-roll, and you don't get to load the last save point. Seriously, I'd love that (not because I'd do it, I'm a pretty straight arrow). I suppose I'm damn near alone in that thinking.
I think this can be a good mechanic as well. To take a scenario from WoW, what if the Alliance and Horde could group together if they wanted to, but there were disadvantages to doing so, and eventually your allegiances switched. Another way to say this might be, I roll a republic light side Jedi. Two months later, friends finally quit the other MMO's they are playing, but they all want to roll Sith. Now I can easily play with them, but my avatar's reputation slowly switches sides as well.
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SnakeCharmer
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3807
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so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
I know. It doesn't even have to be earth shaking revolution. Just mob bashing that's got a new twist or two to play with. Like maybe a story that revolves around said mob bashing?
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DLRiley
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1982
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Yeah, the game you're looking for is called Spellborn. It takes about 1 minute of real time to kill a single bear. You're welcome.
45 seconds if you stand still. so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
I know. It doesn't even have to be earth shaking revolution. Just mob bashing that's got a new twist or two to play with. Like maybe a story that revolves around said mob bashing? I think a combination of repayable story driven content + the option to kill mobs all day action game style is guaranteed to keep both camps happy along as it doesn't play like an mmo. Something that spellborn pretty much missed by 10,000 miles.
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Ratman_tf
Terracotta Army
Posts: 3818
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so I can get back to bashing mobs. I wanna see something new on the gameplay side dammit!
I know. It doesn't even have to be earth shaking revolution. Just mob bashing that's got a new twist or two to play with. Like maybe a story that revolves around said mob bashing? Maybe, if they can tell a story without going to the conventions of "Read some text, Take a quest, Solve a quest, Show a cutscene."
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« Last Edit: June 04, 2009, 08:13:18 AM by Ratman_tf »
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"What I'm saying is you should make friends with a few catasses, they smell funny but they're very helpful." -Calantus makes the best of a smelly situation.
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tmp
Terracotta Army
Posts: 4257
POW! Right in the Kisser!
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Maybe, if they can tell a story without going to the conventions of "Read some text, Take a quest, Solve a quest, Show a cutscene."
How do you suggest a story could be told when text is a no, audio is a no, and visuals are also a no? Short of straight upload into brain matrix-style i'm kinda drawing a blank here...
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DLRiley
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1982
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I think its really a matter of tying in the whole story process to the progression of the game. Again when something plays like an mmo even good things like a story becomes retarded. Story =! excuse to grind.
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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I think its really a matter of tying in the whole story process to the progression of the game. Again when something plays like an mmo even good things like a story becomes retarded. Story =! excuse to grind.
This is one reason why I'd prefer they didnt use quest text, or at the least not traditional quest text. It'd have to be stylized and ideally scrolling along with the audio. Also, they have to vary the way the story is presented. It cant just come from NPCs standing around. They should be using holographic comms, messages, droids, go-betweens, The Force, radios, etc. Boils down again to how much scripting leeway the writers have. Hopefully, they've got a set of tools that easily allows them to inject different modes of storytelling.
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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schild
Administrator
Posts: 60345
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Am I the only person that wants a bounty hunter mission (preferably within the first 5 levels - hell, the tutorial) to lead you to a warehouse full of Nemoidian Bird Cages and you have to kill an architect and leave the place completely unrecognizable (maybe... a pile of ash)?
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Montague
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1297
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I think its really a matter of tying in the whole story process to the progression of the game. Again when something plays like an mmo even good things like a story becomes retarded. Story =! excuse to grind.
This is one reason why I'd prefer they didnt use quest text, or at the least not traditional quest text. It'd have to be stylized and ideally scrolling along with the audio. Also, they have to vary the way the story is presented. It cant just come from NPCs standing around. They should be using holographic comms, messages, droids, go-betweens, The Force, radios, etc. Boils down again to how much scripting leeway the writers have. Hopefully, they've got a set of tools that easily allows them to inject different modes of storytelling. No, I think he's more saying that you have to tie story progression in with the ding-grats. The method of delivery will be irrelevant if the mechanical progression of the characters is the straight Diku-model - the MMOGtards will ignore it in the frenzy to get to end-game. Tying skills and abilities into quest progression in a LOTRO-esque fashion might be the answer.
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When Fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross - Sinclair Lewis.
I can tell more than 1 fucktard at a time to stfu, have no fears. - WayAbvPar
We all have the God-given right to go to hell our own way. Don't fuck with God's plan. - MahrinSkel
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DLRiley
Terracotta Army
Posts: 1982
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I think its really a matter of tying in the whole story process to the progression of the game. Again when something plays like an mmo even good things like a story becomes retarded. Story =! excuse to grind.
This is one reason why I'd prefer they didnt use quest text, or at the least not traditional quest text. It'd have to be stylized and ideally scrolling along with the audio. Also, they have to vary the way the story is presented. It cant just come from NPCs standing around. They should be using holographic comms, messages, droids, go-betweens, The Force, radios, etc. Boils down again to how much scripting leeway the writers have. Hopefully, they've got a set of tools that easily allows them to inject different modes of storytelling. No, I think he's more saying that you have to tie story progression in with the ding-grats. The method of delivery will be irrelevant if the mechanical progression of the characters is the straight Diku-model - the MMOGtards will ignore it in the frenzy to get to end-game. Tying skills and abilities into quest progression in a LOTRO-esque fashion might be the answer. No its the opposite, story shouldn't simply be a way to get your character from point A. to point B. otherwise you quickly run out of content and you have a serious problem with everything following the same formula when your attempting to tell a story. Your better of thinking people actually want to play the game and will go through the multiple story arcs in order to have more fun, then naturally assuming that progression is king. Because if you do assume progression is king than ultimately the game devolves into skipping the story anyway to quickly get to level up part only to rage 10 seconds later because you didn't unlocking the skill you want.
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Ghambit
Terracotta Army
Posts: 5576
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I think its really a matter of tying in the whole story process to the progression of the game. Again when something plays like an mmo even good things like a story becomes retarded. Story =! excuse to grind.
This is one reason why I'd prefer they didnt use quest text, or at the least not traditional quest text. It'd have to be stylized and ideally scrolling along with the audio. Also, they have to vary the way the story is presented. It cant just come from NPCs standing around. They should be using holographic comms, messages, droids, go-betweens, The Force, radios, etc. Boils down again to how much scripting leeway the writers have. Hopefully, they've got a set of tools that easily allows them to inject different modes of storytelling. No, I think he's more saying that you have to tie story progression in with the ding-grats. The method of delivery will be irrelevant if the mechanical progression of the characters is the straight Diku-model - the MMOGtards will ignore it in the frenzy to get to end-game. Tying skills and abilities into quest progression in a LOTRO-esque fashion might be the answer. No its the opposite, story shouldn't simply be a way to get your character from point A. to point B. otherwise you quickly run out of content and you have a serious problem with everything following the same formula when your attempting to tell a story. Your better of thinking people actually want to play the game and will go through the multiple story arcs in order to have more fun, then naturally assuming that progression is king. Because if you do assume progression is king than ultimately the game devolves into skipping the story anyway to quickly get to level up part only to rage 10 seconds later because you didn't unlocking the skill you want. Just what I was about to type. If the Story is good enough, endgame wont matter as much. And it better be good, because so far we see no indication of any kind of robust endgame aside from PvP. If you check out the new "Heavy Rain" game for PS3 you'll see a masterful job of interactive storytelling. Just watching the demo engrossed me. In that type of game you cant click through dialogue, because the dialogue is actually part of the game... that's what Bioware should try to achieve. (obviously, it'd be more deliberate though)
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"See, the beauty of webgames is that I can play them on my phone while I'm plowing your mom." -Samwise
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