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Topic: Game of Thrones [SPOILERS] (Read 1116847 times)
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Lakov_Sanite
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I don't know if they explain it in the books but it doesn't seem like anybody ever flies dragons, they ride them. You can kinda give them general commands like "let's go this way" "burn those guys they suck" and "let's head home" but anything even as complicated as "burn that line lengthwise" or even "turn in this direction now" is just out of the question.
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~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
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eldaec
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Nobody has flown a Dragon in the books - unless you count Drogon flying Dany away from Mereen.
Inability to control dragons is still a plot point.
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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Teleku
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https://i.imgur.com/mcj5kz7.png
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One they haven't addressed in the books yet, so actually a big one. TV show just decided "she suddenly can."
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"My great-grandfather did not travel across four thousand miles of the Atlantic Ocean to see this nation overrun by immigrants. He did it because he killed a man back in Ireland. That's the rumor." -Stephen Colbert
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HaemishM
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Posts: 42631
the Confederate flag underneath the stone in my class ring
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How hard could it be?
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Khaldun
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I remember a bit in the old Harold Shea fantasy series by DeCamp and Pratt where Harold just has a foil and he's supposed to have a sword fight with an armored knight and a broadsword and he thinks it through pretty carefully. Reminded me of that scene with Arya and Brienne.
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Merusk
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If we're gonna get all nitpicking on things..
Ed: Shit missed Cyrrax's post saying the same thing here. Also: Dothraki never dismount. Certainly not to chase down one man.
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« Last Edit: August 09, 2017, 09:50:10 AM by Merusk »
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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Lakov_Sanite
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One they haven't addressed in the books yet, so actually a big one. TV show just decided "she suddenly can." Well that's what I'm saying, she can't really. Lot of people saying she should have done this or the dragon should have flown that way and all I can think is it's a miracle the dragon not burning her own men.
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~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
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Phildo
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It's a miracle it didn't stop for a snack in the middle of the battle with all that tasty bbq horse lying around.
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lamaros
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Jon has taught Dany the secret ways of amgic animal control, duh. Ain't no special secret in the books.
Maybe Bran will come in for an episode and conduct a symphony of dragons and other animals fighting. Maybe he'll puppet a thousand men to build the largest human pyramid of all time.
It's all stupid at this point.
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HaemishM
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the Confederate flag underneath the stone in my class ring
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RhyssaFireheart
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I don't even watch the show (no HBO), but am I the only one bothered by Dany's dragons actually being wyverns?
Or least Drogon (whatever one she's flying on) is.
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pxib
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Posts: 4701
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I don't even watch the show (no HBO), but am I the only one bothered by Dany's dragons actually being wyverns?
Most "realistic" "dragons" are nowadays. See also: The Harry Potter films. How to Train Your Dragon did six limbs, but I don't think I've seen a live-action one since Dragonheart.
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if at last you do succeed, never try again
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Merusk
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You're asking too much nerd for even Hollywood art departments these days. As nerdom got trendy the pendantics got pushed off the bus.
But yes, it bothers me a lot too. Even Smaug in The Hobbit was a Wyvern, not a Dragon, and Jackson is a big enough nerd to know better. I blame Reign of Fire, which was the first modern movie I remember with shitty dragons.
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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Sir T
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Trivia - Reign of Fire was shot in the Wiclow mountains in Ireland. It was shot in the winter/early spring, and in the middle of filming they too a 2week break. When they got back, instead of the lovely hell landscape they left, everything was green. so the most expensive special effect in the movie was to make the new green grass match the earlier dead grass. So the Dragons probably got shortchanged because of that. The fantastic Dragon which fought the WW2 bomber in "Sucker Punch" was a Wyvern too. God I wish that was a better movie because some of the scenes in that were so bad ass... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP6Go0ooEWw
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« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 12:31:57 PM by Sir T »
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Hic sunt dracones.
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pxib
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I blame Reign of Fire, which was the first modern movie I remember with shitty dragons.
I blame the Academy Award nominated effects work in this. It lost to Raiders of the Lost Ark. Dragonslayer is mediocre movie with an awesome creature. It pretty much set the standard for special effects dragons. All the directors who had dragons in their works went MAKE IT LIKE THIS ONE. "But technically that's a wyvern..." Sadly, nobody cares. I'm pretty sure How to Train Your Dragon would have had wyverns if the books hadn't been illustrated.
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« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 01:39:17 PM by pxib »
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if at last you do succeed, never try again
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Abagadro
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Probably just easier to animate 2 legs and 2 wings instead of 4 legs and 2 wings.
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-H.L. Mencken
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Lakov_Sanite
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Wyvern noun, Heraldry. 1. a two-legged winged dragon having the hinder part of a serpent with a barbed tail.
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~a horrific, dark simulacrum that glares balefully at us, with evil intent.
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Typhon
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Possibly also something to do with the whole "JUST JAM THE WINGS ONTO THE BACK, IT DOESN'T HAVE TO MAKE ANATOMICAL SENSE" plays in there as well. With the Wyvern you can at least point at a bat or pterodactyl and say, "see? it sort of makes sense".
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Morat20
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Nobody has flown a Dragon in the books - unless you count Drogon flying Dany away from Mereen.
Inability to control dragons is still a plot point.
Yeah, but you'd think there'd be books. Dragons USED to be a pretty common instrument of warfare. There'd be stories about how dragons are used in combat in conquering Westeros, and you'd think a Targeryeon who had a decade or so sitting around in a damn house before getting married off might have read them. And if she didn't, Tryion "I've read everything about Dragons because they're awesome. Also I've read everything, and also my last big battle I spent reading books on famous sieges to prepare" Lannister damn well would have. Things like "Don't fly directly at the funny looking giant crossbow". Maybe she's got shit eyesight. I was okay with her flaming the line perpendicular to it -- the idea was to make a big ass hole that ran all the way through the line, so..success. Seems the best use of a dragon, if you want to avoid friendly fire, is breaking up hard points (shattering a line like that) and then doing stuff like burning baggage, fucking with the reserves, flaming any knots of organized resistance, and in general setting shit on fire and breaking up the opposing force so your troops can crush each portion separately.
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eldaec
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Posts: 11843
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The books imply quite strongly that the reason you can't pick up a Dummies manual on the subject of Dragon operation is that an anti-magic faction, probably run out of the citadel, has been working to restrict knowledge of magic, dragons, zombies, and 300 mile long walls of ice. While they obviously couldn't remove Baleron's Skull from the Red Keep, or the keep the 300 mile long of wall of ice a secret, they have been pretty successful at making sure nobody understands any of it.
Maybe because use of magic caused the long night, and/or the doom.
Maybe because they are evil fun-hating bastards.
TBD
On the subject of dragon tactics, Sarah Connor hasn't fought anything that can touch her before, so I have no idea why anyone would expect her to be on the lookout for modified Dragon-piercing Ballistae.
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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HaemishM
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Posts: 42631
the Confederate flag underneath the stone in my class ring
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I imagine the reason the Maesters in the Citadel have locked all the books on dragons and fucking ice zombies away is for the same reason they did the "cure" to the stoneskin sickness. Sure, the knowledge might help people but chances are pretty good that some unscrupulous bastard like Qyburn will use them to fuck up a whole bunch of shit instead.
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eldaec
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Posts: 11843
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And maybe Varys really is in it for the little guy.
It is explicitly claimed that the citadel killed the Dragons last time, and that they seek to control everyone because plans within plans. Somehow.
If you want to get into deep tinfoil territory the books even have a steward in the night's watch, who is notably from oldtown, ends up involved in Jon's murder, and goes around wearing perfume for no obvious reason other than to trigger 'perfumed seneschal' prophecy speculation.
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"People will not assume that what they read on the internet is trustworthy or that it carries any particular assurance or accuracy" - Lord Leveson "Hyperbole is a cancer" - Lakov Sanite
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MahrinSkel
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When she crossed over, she was just a ship. But when she came back... she was bullshit!
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On the subject of dragon tactics, Sarah Connor hasn't fought anything that can touch her before, so I have no idea why anyone would expect her to be on the lookout for modified Dragon-piercing Ballistae.
This is funny to me because Sarah Conner is the one that had the dragon-piercing ballista built.
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Samwise
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sentient yeast infection
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I don't know why I didn't put together until just now that the last two people to play Sarah Connor are both in GoT. Someone get Linda Hamilton on this show as the Night Queen or something.
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Shannow
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Meh.
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Khaldun
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That was about as convoluted a plan as I've ever seen in fantasy literature.
"So let's go north of the Wall, kidnap a zombie, bring it back undead to King's Landing, convince Cersei that there really are zombies, then Cersei will sign an armistice and Danerys can safely move her troops north to help with the zombies."
WTF, guys. Seriously?
I get the appeal of a Dirty Dozen/Magnificent Seven adventure in the North, but there has got to be a better way to get to it than that fucking dumb shit.
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Brolan
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It does sound like a hare-brained scheme from the pen of a bad writer. Do you think it was GRRM or the TV people?
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Bzalthek
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Wasn't impressed, though I really liked seeing Gendry again.
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Polysorbate80
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I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)
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Phildo
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Is #dreamteam trending on social media yet? They're just missing Bronn and Brienne at this point.
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jgsugden
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It does sound like a hare-brained scheme from the pen of a bad writer. Do you think it was GRRM or the TV people?
It is the tv way to get back towards the GRRM storyline they screwed over with earlier changes.
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Abagadro
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I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)
I told you all Gilly was the key to the whole shebang.
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"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”
-H.L. Mencken
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Merusk
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The rowing joke, while funny, was too meta for me. Lots more TV writer stuff here than GRR.
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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Brolan
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I liked the way they snuck in Jon's legitimacy (and Sam's development of a spine in general)
I told you all Gilly was the key to the whole shebang. Isn't Sam now head of house Tarly? No one mentioned that in the show.
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Merusk
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He would be if taking the black didn't require renouncing of all claim to titles. Remember, Sam is the older brother and was thrown into the Night's Watch so Dickon could become the heir. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_TarlySam would have to go through the Snow Loophole or otherwise be absolved of his vow to the Night's Watch. Considering that the vow was so strong it let a Targaryen remain alive there's probably no way around it. The fact that the northern lords allow Jon to lead despite taking the black while also not knowing he died and returned is a rather large plot hole.
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The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
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