Sneaky Ninja Skills: Probing & Covops Training Op 23rd February 2000ET Sankassen

[Darkin Ranova]

I'll be sure to make it.  Aside from cloaking requirements for the covert cloak I should be up to par with the gold stand. by then. I was gona hold off on the covert-ops training but looks like a good reason not to.

[Hoax]

I'll try to be there to help out and learn some stuff...

[Endie]

Participants:

ajax34i
bhodi
dbltnk
Ravandor
Zetleft
Darkin Ranova
Hoax
lac
Quinton
Der Helm

This is a fine number, since everyone will be able to ask questions/get me to go over stuff I didn't explain well enough etc. Do try to be there on time (or at least to be in vent on time) though.

[Phildo]

I'm not planning on going cov-ops, but if I'm able to I'd be happy to play target.

[lac]

I should be able to make it too, I'll bring my cheetah.

Where do we start?

[Endie]

I should be able to make it too, I'll bring my cheetah.

Where do we start?

Let's start at the corp HQ in Sankassen, unless we're at war in which case I'll post an alternative on Thursday.

[Quinton]

I'm in if you've got room.

[Der Helm]

I'm in if you've got room.

Me too.

(Did I post that already ?)

[Merusk]

I've got a probe and a few drones & launcher I picked-up for this, but I'm still not sure of my Saturday schedule. I may or may not show up.

[Mook]

I'll be joining in the sneakiness in a gallente frigate. (Stupid Amarr and their lack of E-frigs *grumble* *grumble* *grumble*)

[Llyse]

I'll be participating as well in a Heron

Amarr suxxxxxxxxx
Reroll Caldari for E-war!

[ajax34i]

There's a chance I might not be able to make it, despite wanting to.  It all depends on whether the fridge we ordered that the store has on back order arrives there on Saturday, and we have to go pick it up.  Hopefully it won't.

Edit:  Llyse, heh, don't reroll!  Just train Caldari Frigates, which is very fast, and then Caldari Cruisers for the Blackbird, and you should be set.

[Endie]

Indeed.  Unless you have managed to create some truely horribly high-charisma character with a 3 base perception then it is never worth re-rolling in Eve.

[Slayerik]

Also, new guys, if you are digging this game and can afford it...get another account rolling sooner rather than later. You will thank me for this advice. :)

[Endie]

Also, new guys, if you are digging this game and can afford it...get another account rolling sooner rather than later. You will thank me for this advice. :)

This is an especially good investment when you move to 0.0: having a cloaking covops character one jump ahead of your cargo full of 200 million ISK worth of ratting loot makes for a more relaxing journey by far.

[Mook]

Can you run 2 Eve clients on the same computer and alt-tab between them? Or do you need to 2 box?

[Endie]

The only time you have to dual box is if one of the two is a trial account.

Otherwise, you are fine (though dial the graphics down a bit).

[Zetleft]

Well crap my schedule changed and I'm gonna be working tomorrow so I can't make it.  That really blows, guess I'll have to pickup the sneakiness as I go.

[dbltnk]

Update: Can't make it to the operation. A game that I can't name has recently opened a open pvp server and I'm too busy ganking whole groups of carebears. =D

[lac]

ah crap, didn't they also say the were going to do another round of beta invites before the open pvp server? Guess I missed this round too then

[bhodi]

Thanks again Endie for providing us another skill for our toolbox. Greatly educational, and hey, after we finished, I probed out some abandoned t2 drones and blam! 700k richer.

[ajax34i]

That was informative and fun, thank you.

[Morat20]

Thanks again Endie for providing us another skill for our toolbox. Greatly educational, and hey, after we finished, I probed out some abandoned t2 drones and blam! 700k richer.

I've got to put together a Helios and practice scanning. Working on Covert Ops 3 right now.

[Llyse]

Sounds like it went perfectly.

I regret on missing out so much now

Especially after this happened to http://f13.7mph.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=167 me at a dodgy safespot

Questions.

What qualifies as a decent safespot? The further from celestial bodies the better? 4.5au from everything?

[5150]

What qualifies as a decent safespot? The further from celestial bodies the better? 4.5au from everything?

One that you dont stay at very long

Seriously unless you are deadspace distance only increases the time it will take for someone to find you (the same could be said of deadspace but by a larger margin)

You can also fit a cloak and cloak as soon as you hit your SS (and if you use it alot I'd fly in a random direction once cloaked in case its already busted

[ajax34i]

There is no decent safe-spot, really.  The farther you are from everything, the longer it takes, but it's still a matter of minutes.

You must either cloak at the safe-spot, or have multiples and move between them constantly.

[amiable]

Can't you alternatively turn your MWD on a fast moving interceptor and be reasonably safe?  somethign like 4-5km pres econd at least?

[Endie]

Can't you alternatively turn your MWD on a fast moving interceptor and be reasonably safe?  somethign like 4-5km pres econd at least?

Almost completely.  This is a frustrating thing for a covops pilot: your target is moving at high speed, so by the time you get there they are a long way away. 

If you are really good you can find something they are burning towards - a Celestial body usually so they can instawarp out to it at 100 or something if busted) - warp to that, find them on scan again at their new position (assuming you're getting tiny deviation - while getting your gang to go to that location too.  Then you warp to your target at 100 - to try and get there before them, then get your gang to warp to you at 100, so they get there ahead of the target.  You probably want to leave a handful at the standard warpins at the celestial body if it is the only one nearby.

I did this for a Sylph gang recently, got a perfect warpin on a Stain ishtar, gave them the word, and discovered that the impatient fucks had left the system a couple of minutes before... 

Another way to use this when safespotting (as the potential target) is in a gang, when you have one very fast ship: they burn ahead at uncatchable speeds, and everyone else warps to them at zero when they reach 150km.  The average velocity of the gang then becomes that of the inty.

[5150]

Can't you alternatively turn your MWD on a fast moving interceptor and be reasonably safe?  somethign like 4-5km pres econd at least?

If you do this (and go AFK) you need make sure you are very fast (or dont go AFK), I know of one case where the cov ops pilot called in a faster ship which (eventually) caught the MWD'ing ship up and then killed it

[Endie]

Can't you alternatively turn your MWD on a fast moving interceptor and be reasonably safe?  somethign like 4-5km pres econd at least?

If you do this (and go AFK) you need make sure you are very fast (or dont go AFK), I know of one case where the cov ops pilot called in a faster ship which (eventually) caught the MWD'ing ship up and then killed it

I also read a thread from someone saying "how did I die?!?" after doing this.  I think you'd only be safe if you were fast enough to get off the grid before a good covops could get and provide a warpin plus the time needed for the inty to warp in and start chasing.  Since that would probably be at least 15 m/s on most normal-sized grids I reckon that such a pilot wouldn't risk his Gistii MWD and snakes by going afk like that anyway...

[Morat20]

Anyone have any proposed fittings for a Helios? I was wanting to fit one out to hunt and scan down prey. My general support skills are good, and I'll have something akin to the "gold standard" for scanning listed in the first post. I've been playing with EFT, but I must be making some wrong assumptions about the differences between cloaking devices. You can add rigs if you want to be extra-nice. :)

I was hoping to outfit a Helios in the next few weeks and practice scanning in my missioning area, then fly it out to Sank and store it until it's needed.

Edited to add: My primary problem seeps to be CPU-based. Pushing Cov-ops to Level 4 helps a lot there. Between the Cov-ops cloak and the scan probe launcher, I have virtually no CPU left at Cov-Ops 3/5. (I am right in assuming you probe something out, cloak yourself with the Cov-ops cloak, warp there, and then invite the gang in if it's worth killing?).

You can't probe while cloaked, right?

[5150]

Anyone have any proposed fittings for a Helios? I was wanting to fit one out to hunt and scan down prey. My general support skills are good, and I'll have something akin to the "gold standard" for scanning listed in the first post. I've been playing with EFT, but I must be making some wrong assumptions about the differences between cloaking devices. You can add rigs if you want to be extra-nice. :)

I was hoping to outfit a Helios in the next few weeks and practice scanning in my missioning area, then fly it out to Sank and store it until it's needed.

Edited to add: My primary problem seeps to be CPU-based. Pushing Cov-ops to Level 4 helps a lot there. Between the Cov-ops cloak and the scan probe launcher, I have virtually no CPU left at Cov-Ops 3/5. (I am right in assuming you probe something out, cloak yourself with the Cov-ops cloak, warp there, and then invite the gang in if it's worth killing?).

You can't probe while cloaked, right?

I have fitting problems on my Buzzard and I have Cov Ops 4 - I don't think you can get any half decent setups on once you fit the probe launcher (are the sisters faction probe launchers easier to fit?)

You cant launch probes while cloaked but you can perform scans on existing probes while cloaked

[Endie]

I have plenty of empty slots on my buzzard: I care deeply about having three modules: the covops cloak, the recon probe launcher and the MWD for getting out of gatecamps.  I also fit an MAPC for grid and a cap module in the mids for recharge rate, since buzzard + MWD equals tiny cap.  And a warp core stabiliser, also for gatecamps.  Some people fit an offline weapon in a high slot, or a cyno generator, or a salvage mod etc.  I don't need those.

[Morat20]

I have fitting problems on my Buzzard and I have Cov Ops 4 - I don't think you can get any half decent setups on once you fit the probe launcher (are the sisters faction probe launchers easier to fit?)

You cant launch probes while cloaked but you can perform scans on existing probes while cloaked

Well, I can get the launcher, the covops cloak, and still mount a few other things (MWD, ship scanners, etc) but I have to fit a coproccessor. Mostly I'm wondering what else I'd need as a Helios pilot besides the cov-ops cloak and the probe launcher.

I'm working under the assumption that if I'm being shot at, I'm fucked anyways.

[bhodi]

that's easy, fit overdrive injectors :)

I wish someone had told me about the cheetah, it seems to be clearly better than the buzzard and I wish I had trained for it, instead.

Extra capacitor recharge plus faster base speed plus 3 low slots for overdrive injectors = the win. The only downside is you really need covops 4 instead of covops 3.

My buzzard setup, this works with covops 3, engineering 4, energy upgrades 3 hull upgrades 2
1 covops cloak
1 recon probe launcher
1mn digital booster rockets (MWD)
1 cap recharger II
2 overdrive injector system II

I'll probably start with a stab and a micro aux power core, like endie, until I get a feel for how easy/hard it is to run camps. In general I like the one above.