Job thread

[Rendakor]

The lead tech at my job is leaving in a few weeks, which opened up an opportunity for me to get a few more certs. Already got one done for a small raise, and he's training me in one more before he leaves on the 18th.

[Salamok]

Sigh, finally get a passable systems administrator and now after 9 months he is gone.  Any network admins want a state job in Austin?

[Lantyssa]

Too far a commute, unfortunately.

[Signe]

I'll take it!  What does a network admin do?

[Lantyssa]

You help administrative types network amongst themselves.

[Yegolev]

Do programming majors take any math classes?

[Rasix]

Computer science majors? Yes, you take discrete math and linear algebra.  

Interviewers love them some Big O notation.

[Yegolev]

Does not explain some of them getting overly excited about 300-year-old mathematical discoveries.  Or I'm surprisingly overeducated.

[Selby]

I took 3 semesters of calculus, statistics, differential equations, & linear algebra. But I was also an engineering major too. I'd say a good portion of them are just dumb... based on my experience naturally!

[Yegolev]

I was also educated as an engineer and completed real analysis, and I agree with your observations.    Alternate answer: I'm just old.

[Rasix]

The maths is part of what scared me out of engineering. I really didn't care for Vector Calc or Diff Eq and was horrible at them.  I did fine when I took them in high school, but college was a different experience.  Also, thermo.. fuck that shit.

They put my new workstation request on hold.  My day is officially ruined.

[Goumindong]

Does not explain some of them getting overly excited about 300-year-old mathematical discoveries.  Or I'm surprisingly overeducated.

What specifically are we talking about here?

Anyway, everyone tends to study different stuff for different reasons. Engineers study dumbed down physics that only needs to be accurate enough for the building to not fall down. Programmers tend to study logic more than math and the math they do focus on tends to be either algorithmic or specific to computer error. I am not an engineer or a programmer, though I did have a chance to study the various types of math that they all did (Linear, Vector Calc, Differential Equations, Difference Equations, Difference Equations Again, Linear Again, Graph, Statistics, Statistics Again, Mathematical Statistics, Mathematical Statistics Again, Theoretical Statistics, Theoretical Statistics Again, and Again) but i don't see much they would be doing that involves Markov chains or computational error tolerance. Eigenvalues/Vectors sure, since I expect a lot of linearized dynamic systems. But its still a very different focus even if its the same underlying math. More so than any other profession, programmers have to know how to do the math(at least the ones writing packages that others can use) and engineers have to know how to use the math and never the twain shall meet.

In the end everyone thinks everyone else is dumb even if its all very similar in the end.

[Yegolev]

I agree with each of your points, generally.  I personally am lacking the library of algorithms that one would expect an educated programmer to have, and so I'll end up reinventing several wheels if I'm not careful and I expect I'll look ridiculous to them with my dumb questions and such.  Then again, I'm digging through some Perl where someone basically rewrote the find command, so apparently (some) programmers give few, if any, fucks.

I have an engineering quote:
"Anyone can build a bridge that holds itself up, but it takes an engineer to build a bridge that barely holds itself up."

About the thing I thought was funny: people trying to explain how Git works.  Someone asked me if I knew about graph theory, to which I naturally replied "No" because I don't remember that at all (lots of math over lots of years, but don't ask me to solve anything from trig upward).  It sounded like a big deal, though.  Turns out it's just Euler's networking junk from the seven-bridges problem.  While that is, in my mind, just one of the many mathematical inventions I learned about in the days of yore (such as when we spent a day or two learning the math behind a RDBMS), other people seem to get all excited about it like the guys who post "life hack" articles which are really just meta-blogs about a millennial learning how to do something simple like put hot water on a pickle jar.  Thus, I might just be old.

About Git itself, after being told that it's a one-directional network of state hashes (mostly my words there), now I just have to work with the commands until I understand how they manipulate the pointers.  It's still not super-clear, but I'll work it out.  If these Mac-using ding-dongs can do it, I'll do it as well.  Too bad I never bothered to learn simple programming things like how diff and patch work, because now it would be a benefit.

Just for the record, I have a Mac Pro under my desk which I intend to give a trial run to if I can get a monitor attached.

[Goumindong]

Well its kind of like saying that Google's page rank is "just" a Markov Chain. Or a Markov Chain is "just" a set of Euler Networks. And so on and so forth.

The manipulation of matrices is still a relatively novel thing.

The engineer quote is great though

[Trippy]

Overview of Git internals by Randal Schwartz (of Perl fame) at a Google Tech Talk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dhZ9BXQgc4


And for fun Linus's Git presentation also at a Google Tech Talk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XpnKHJAok8

[Tannhauser]

First week of my new job done and it's been really great.  Bit boring as we are going over stuff I learned ten years ago, but my boss is a super nice guy and he wants things done a certain way so I can accomodate him.  Really going better than I expected, everyone is very friendly and supportive of the new guy.  Their processes seem half as complicated as I'm used to so I'm optimistic I'll be able to make solid contributions.

I'm sure the honeymoon will wear off but, after 2.5 months of unemployment and uncertainty, it's nice to get back to work and a routine. 

[Yegolev]

Awesome.

[Merusk]

I'm beginning to think my boss is trying to find a new job. Lots of texting and conversations in hushed tones for 45+ mins at his desk. Has been burning accrued vacation beyond what he was going to lose this year. Left to talk to the head of HR for over 2 hours this afternoon and hasn't been very communicative with the rest of the team. I'd cite that all his cycling stuff suddenly disappeared, too, but that was wife-driven since she was upset at the lack of home pictures when she visited.

This would be a good thing for him and a terrible thing for me. He's underpaid and we're undervalued as a part of the firm. I'm the guy who'd have to pick-up the pieces and reforge the team while waiting on a new sup.

I could take-over but I really don't want to given: 1) how undervalued we are 2) I know he'd be leaving because after being promised a promotion for 2 years he's not getting it (director to vp) 3) I'd be inheriting a lot of bullshit high-maintenance C-levels who I'd be expected to be the personal tech support for.  All for less than $80k. No thanks.

I really hope this is just paranoia on the part of the team and there's something else going on.

[Tannhauser]

HR is not a good sign, but cheer up, he could be getting divorced!

[Rasix]

I just applied from my promotion.  Apparently, if you can't straight up promote someone, you can have them apply for their own job at the band level it should technically be at. 

Someone else applied for it as well.  Good luck, fella.

[Cheddar]

I'm beginning to think my boss is trying to find a new job. Lots of texting and conversations in hushed tones for 45+ mins at his desk. Has been burning accrued vacation beyond what he was going to lose this year. Left to talk to the head of HR for over 2 hours this afternoon and hasn't been very communicative with the rest of the team. I'd cite that all his cycling stuff suddenly disappeared, too, but that was wife-driven since she was upset at the lack of home pictures when she visited.

This would be a good thing for him and a terrible thing for me. He's underpaid and we're undervalued as a part of the firm. I'm the guy who'd have to pick-up the pieces and reforge the team while waiting on a new sup.

I could take-over but I really don't want to given: 1) how undervalued we are 2) I know he'd be leaving because after being promised a promotion for 2 years he's not getting it (director to vp) 3) I'd be inheriting a lot of bullshit high-maintenance C-levels who I'd be expected to be the personal tech support for.  All for less than $80k. No thanks.

I really hope this is just paranoia on the part of the team and there's something else going on.

That or EEO.  Or both.

[Viin]

Computer science majors? Yes, you take discrete math and linear algebra.  

Interviewers love them some Big O notation.

After working many years in tech, usually software but lately more hardware, I can say there's a big different between a programmer and a computer software engineer. One can hack together something that sorta works and only crashes when it encounters punctuation, the other can over-engineer the shit out of a simple database lookup function.

[Quinton]

Solid grounding in theory can be helpful, but it's no substitute for hands-on experience working on real shipping code (that has to handle unexpected input, be shut down randomly, running out of memory, etc.)   It's easy enough to find people who can happily prove the validity of an algorithm but have no frickin' clue what to do if a program crashes.

It's often hard to turn Computer Scientists into competent Software Engineers.

[Yegolev]

I like to pull out that engineering quote in these situations.  I'll study Git internals, for example, up to the point where it's reached its usefulness to my goals.  Engineering professors will sometimes tell you that no one does math daily in the real world since most of the calculations were solved years ago and some genius put it all into a table.  I think Viin's comment applies here as well.  There is certainly a middle ground where academics meets practicality, and that seems hard to find people for.

[Cheddar]

So think I started my new job, sorta.  Very fricking cool, wish I could share more, but it is moving fast and details are ambiguous.

Basically, toss out political BS and make things better for the business.  Forget the Six Sigma, forget Agile, just do it.

I am in heaven.

[Strazos]

So think I started my new job, sorta.  Very fricking cool, wish I could share more, but it is moving fast and details are ambiguous.

Basically, toss out political BS and make things better for the business.  Forget the Six Sigma, forget Agile, just do it.

I am in heaven.

Sounds cool; I've always been leery of Six Sigma and the like (including our own internal version of this stuff).

[Viin]

So think I started my new job, sorta.  Very fricking cool, wish I could share more, but it is moving fast and details are ambiguous.

Basically, toss out political BS and make things better for the business.  Forget the Six Sigma, forget Agile, just do it.

I am in heaven.

Need any help? 

[Yegolev]

Heh, yeah, do you?

Although, seriously, my current job is great.

[Signe]

Congrats, Cheddar, and you guys who got jobs you enjoy.  That doesn't happen very often.

[Yegolev]

And suddenly, I'm explaining git to other people.

[Fabricated]

Beginning of the semester sucks and everything is broken.

[Fabricated]

Also I literally just remember that I have a ticket I've had since late January to set up some clusterfuck of a database/license server/worthless client to deliver an ebook that no one cares about. I got the database set up after 3-4 months of wrangling and there was something up with it so I had to email the vendor. The vendor said, "We'll check with our programmers in India" and despite me emailing them every other week since then I haven't heard back. So uh yeah, oy.

[Tannhauser]

Working with a Brit on five new projects for his company.  We are missing critical certs from Company 'X'.  The Brit tells me he has the leverage with Company 'X' to get the certs. What he doesn't know (and I can't tell him because of confidentiality), is that Company 'X' just bought us out and their rep is literally across the hall hiding in a closed office while the Brit is here.  He was mildly amazed I was able to get the cert so quickly.   

[Soulflame]

My boss, the previous QA manager for about 8 years, finally retired earlier this year.  I had turned down the job multiple times, because holy shit no one would want that job/can do that job.

They hire in a guy from outside who wants to change everything.  I, in fact, after the interview, tell everyone else that he will want to change everything, will get frustrated if not allowed to change everything, and will subsequently leave.

He's in training a month, takes over.  A month in, he sees some shit that he cannot believe is going on.  Bails on the company, with two days notice.  I am told that I am now the proud owner of a "I told you so" card, redeemable at any time.

They come to me, ask that I shepherd the QA team until such time that they hire in a new manager.  This includes finishing testing on a major release, concurrent with a patch for a previous version.

I perform that role for about a month, then tell them to stop looking (I am not convinced they ever started...) I'll just do the damn job.

So.  Yay?

It's mostly good, I had gotten bored with manual testing anyway.  I was supposed to become the automation dev.  There is a lot of commitment to having automation built, but very little to actually having someone to build the automation, then maintain it for the long term.

So now I am having an interesting time trying to keep the whole thing rolling, while uneasily thinking I really need to start thinking longer term.  (I would describe how... uih.. "good" things are, but I am not sure anyone would believe me.  I have, in my more lucid moments, thought I have enough material to write a very solid "What not to do" book on software development.  Or possibly "What Agile really absolutely positively does NOT mean.")

[Rasix]

QA test manager.. you are a braver man than I.  We go through them at a staggering rate.