The Elder Scrolls Online

[Goreschach]

Well maybe if you had been wearing some big fluffy Depends instead of the big boy pants, then you wouldn't be acting so butthurt right now.

[Draegan]

Well maybe if you had been wearing some big fluffy Depends instead of the big boy pants, then you wouldn't be acting so butthurt right now.

You're cute.  I like you.

[amiable]

If anything the inventory system in this game is too lenient.  With the ability to port anywhere at any time practically why do i need 60 bank spaces?  15 is more than sufficent.  It is also unrealistic that I have 60 bag spaces.  I could make do with 10.  Also they should limit how much gold you can carry.  Realistically could someone even lift 1000 coins?

They have a vision people.   A. Vision.

[Modern Angel]

Draegan, when exactly did you become such a dickhead? Because I don't remember you being quite this bad.

Also, grown men circa 30-40 saying "put on big boy pants" is fucking embarrassing.

[Nebu]

Draegan, when exactly did you become such a dickhead? Because I don't remember you being quite this bad.

Also, grown men circa 30-40 saying "put on big boy pants" is fucking embarrassing.

1. I don't think he's being all that bad. 

2. Since we're adults arguing about computer games, that takes embarrassment out of the equation. 

I remember when coins had weight in EQ.  This couldn't possibly be that bad.   

[Modern Angel]

It's more taken in totality of his generally being pissy over the course of the past year or whatever.

I dunno, dudes. I'm not going to go all smarm or anything but getting so het up about vidya games that we're calling each other retards and shit lost its luster awhile ago. It's boring. But I don't post that much anymore because of that so what do I know?

[Ingmar]

What do you expect them to do in these types of games? Give you infinite bank and inventory space? Just be happy they didn't implement a shitty weight system.

Copy GW2, done. It's a solved problem.

[Nebu]

Copy GW2, done. It's a solved problem.

The crafting bank system for GW2 was pretty awesome as was the shared bank spaces.  One of the bright spots of that game for me.

[KallDrexx]

I guess I just see it from a different point of view. I see a game that gives you a shit load of stuff and leaves it up to you how to deal with it. It's somewhat refreshing from different game design theories that drastically limits what you can do and thus limits the choices you are force to make.

For example, in WOW you are limited to the choices of professions and gathering so you are never forced to deal with all this extra stuff. It's designed to be streamlined and easier to deal with. If you are a miner and a blacksmith, your world never really comes in contact with any other profession except maybe cloth that you loot from NPCs.

ESO just says "here is everything, go play". Most people have been trained to collect and store everything they find "just in case" so they snag everything they find and try to put it somewhere for a rainy day when they decide to hunker down and do some crafting. I was doing this for some time to some degree and found out that I really didn't need any of this stuff and got rid of it. If I want to eventually craft, I'll just go back and do it another time. The only thing I've kept were uncommon or rarer materials. Everything that was common I gave away or sold to a vendor.

You say the game promotes hoarding. This is only true if you're a player that wants to do everything at once. And if this is the case, I agree, the game is frustrating in that aspect. But from the way I look at it, it's not designed for you to do everything at once and a bi-product of that is forcing you to make choices of what to loot, how often to loot crates and backpacks or even take sidetrips to a bank or a crafting station.

You just proved that everyone you were arguing against was right.  Sure, you determined that all the stuff was useless to you and are perfectly fine throwing it away even though you admit that you may need to collect it later to explore that part of the game.  Most people are not going to be that forgiving that the game essentially forced them to get rid of something that they may actually have a use for in the future, and when they do have a use for it in the future it's wasting their time by having to re-collect it all.  

The game doesn't promote hoarding because people want to do everything at once, it promotes hoarding because it gives people ideas of what they can do in the future and people don't want to waste that futuristic opportunity cost.  The game is clearly going "here's a bunch of mats that are totally usable to you if you ever decide you want to try this other feature out" and most players are going to subconciously pick up on that and save it in case they do want to try their hand at that later.  Then the user gets constrained by inventory space and wants to keep his options open for later without wasting time but the game is also fighting against that.  

If the game makes people think that something they pick up might be useful to them in the future, they will keep it.  If the game makes people think that hoarding something now will save them time in the future, people will hoard it, and thus you have to design your systems and loot around that.  It's human nature and it's a pretty good example of how a lot of game designers are totally divorced from the (most of the time subcioncious) truths of player behavior.

[Ingmar]

Copy GW2, done. It's a solved problem.

The crafting bank system for GW2 was pretty awesome as was the shared bank spaces.  One of the bright spots of that game for me.

Right-click->send all mats to bank + dedicated material slots are the things from GW 1/2 I wish every single game would steal. It's just infinitely better than the way any of the other ones do it.

[Paelos]

Draegen's right about one thing, if you go against the grain here in a thread you get the full monty of ridiculousness, and high-fiving amongst the people ganging up on you. And usually making very few good counterpoints.

[Rendakor]

It depends on how you present your unpopular opinions. I've disagreed with the masses quite often and never had anyone jump down my throat. Maybe I've got thicker skin, or I don't come off as much of a dick as some people. Dropping insults while dissenting doesn't do much to help your case, though.

[Nebu]

It depends on how you present your unpopular opinions. I've disagreed with the masses quite often and never had anyone jump down my throat. Maybe I've got thicker skin, or I don't come off as much of a dick as some people. Dropping insults while dissenting doesn't do much to help your case, though.

As many times as Draegan and I have disagreed in the past, he's always been civil and provided thoughtful counterpoints.   I can't say that for many others. 

What's the point of insulting each other here anyway?  Aren't we enough of a community to be past that petty shit?

[Miasma]

Draegen's right about one thing, if you go against the grain here in a thread you get the full monty of ridiculousness, and high-fiving amongst the people ganging up on you. And usually making very few good counterpoints.

This thread doesn't have a grain, it was overwhelmingly negative for the first 80 pages and even the people who are now playing and enjoying it are being honest about the game's problems.

Oh you're talking about f13 in general, I think.  Yes that happens, not just here but everywhere.  You just have to accept the one in ten times you get ganged up on since you're probably the one doing the ganging up elsewhere the other nine times.

The latest season of Archer sucks compares to all the past awesome seasons.  The cocaine plot is weak and provides nothing but bad plotlines.  They can't use their best most developed villains because there is no overlap.  It had really great female characters and this season has turned them all to crap.  Mother archer has no real role anymore.  Cheryl's subplot is unfunny and going nowhere.  Pam is now a one trick 'look at me eat cocaine' pony.  Worst of all who in their right mind takes an awesome action oriented character like Lana and makes her pregnant so that she just sits around doing nothing?  You're in the one medium where you don't have to worry about writing up contrived plots to account for an actor's pregnancy and then you decide to just do it anyways and tie your hands behind your back?

[Paelos]

This thread doesn't have a grain, it was overwhelmingly negative for the first 80 pages and even the people who are now playing and enjoying it are being honest about the game's problems.

The grain here is mostly negative early, followed by the expected release honeymoon, and I expect things to turn after a month or two when Zenimax does something overwhelmingly, but predictably stupid. That's pretty much the bad MMO standard timeline.

It may not, they might have fixed a lot of the problems with the game, but I'm betting otherwise.

[Yegolev]

[shiznitz]

What do you expect them to do in these types of games? Give you infinite bank and inventory space? Just be happy they didn't implement a shitty weight system.

Copy GW2, done. It's a solved problem.

I believe you but that isn't going to happen any time soon.  So the solution now is to just stop gathering so enthusiastically.

[Draegan]

Draegan, when exactly did you become such a dickhead? Because I don't remember you being quite this bad.

Also, grown men circa 30-40 saying "put on big boy pants" is fucking embarrassing.

I have a one year old daughter. I operate on 4 hours of sleep. I had a reprieve about about a month ago, but now she's teething. I'm allowed to be a cranky old man on the internet, I certainly can't be with my wife. I would be dead.

[Draegan]

This thread doesn't have a grain, it was overwhelmingly negative for the first 80 pages and even the people who are now playing and enjoying it are being honest about the game's problems.

The grain here is mostly negative early, followed by the expected release honeymoon, and I expect things to turn after a month or two when Zenimax does something overwhelmingly, but predictably stupid. That's pretty much the bad MMO standard timeline.

It may not, they might have fixed a lot of the problems with the game, but I'm betting otherwise.

I think everyone was caught by surprise that there was an actual honeymoon launch for this game. I personally wrote this game off as shit as much as 2 months ago. I was pretty surprised to find an enjoyable game.

[Nevermore]

What do you expect them to do in these types of games? Give you infinite bank and inventory space? Just be happy they didn't implement a shitty weight system.

Copy GW2, done. It's a solved problem.

I believe you but that isn't going to happen any time soon.  So the solution now is to just stop gathering so enthusiastically.

I suppose it's a good thing there aren't any problems with movement or combat then, since similar solutions to those hypothetical problems would be to not go anywhere or fight anything.

[Signe]

I don't really find any one thing to be game breaking so far.  I can even deal with the god awful radial menu.  Just.  One of the things I liked about the single player games like this were stashes.  I would stick stuff in odd barrels or chests and go back later for it.  I don't know if they will ever have housing, though, which would be awesome, and solve some of the inventory/bank issues people have.  The only official thing I ever saw about it was the statement, "Elder Scrolls Online will not launch with player housing", which is ambiguous, at best.

[Falconeer]

Also not launching with a thieves guild. 

[Bzalthek]

Draegan, when exactly did you become such a dickhead? Because I don't remember you being quite this bad.

Also, grown men circa 30-40 saying "put on big boy pants" is fucking embarrassing.

I have a one year old daughter. I operate on 4 hours of sleep. I had a reprieve about about a month ago, but now she's teething. I'm allowed to be a cranky old man on the internet, I certainly can't be with my wife. I would be dead.

See, now all your recent posts make more sense.

[Daeven]

I find it interesting that you can feed your horse to increase 'capacity', though that currently appears to be meaningless.

Where are my satchel bags and wagon!!?!

P.S. maybe it is the honeymoon period, but I find myself enjoying this thing. Probably because it twigs my story/explorer aspects. This SinglePlayerGameWithOthersRunningAbout is actually enjoyable. Especially once you add a damned SPAM filter.

I hereby withdraw my initial pessimism.

[Miasma]

Each time you feed your horse for capacity you get one extra inventory slot.

You can skip the opening movies by going to the Documents\Elder Scrolls Online\live\UserSettings.txt file and changing SkipPregameVideos to 1.

[Simond]

I have a one year old daughter. I operate on 4 hours of sleep. I had a reprieve about about a month ago, but now she's teething. I'm allowed to be a cranky old man on the internet, I certainly can't be with my wife. I would be dead.

You should try garlic for toothache. 

I find it interesting that you can feed your horse to increase 'capacity', though that currently appears to be meaningless.

Where are my satchel bags and wagon!!?!

Coming right after the horse armour DLC.  

[Pennilenko]

You should try garlic for toothache. 

That's even more funny if you are familiar with rerolled less refined areas.

[Simond]

It's almost like I did it on purpose. 

(RIP in peace Wizardhawk)

[amiable]

I'm actually having fun on this game but I will probably quit as soonas my wife lets me because the inventory management is so atrocious and the lack of a global AH is equally annoying.

What i would give for this game to steal GW2's AH and inventory system.

[Miasma]

I tried to level provisioning but ran out of mats around level 16, despite having a provisoining mule with 50 some odd ingredients.  In any other game I could have bought some off the auction house for whatever price gouging amount the people who saved all their tangerines demanded but instead I had to try and root around old dungeons and zones.  Found lots of garbage but very few of the actual mats I needed.

Since killing gray mobs gives no loot I'm also worried I won't be able to do something like farm bears for meat.  I know they at least sometimes still drop leather but I don't know about meat.

The first dungeon I went to had a huge amount of stuff to loot in barrels, crates etc but then in the next dungeon all that stuff was already empty.  I really hope it was just bad luck and not some sort of anti loot code that spawns more empty crates if you've looted too many recently.

At any rate, the quests and zones and exploring are all still awesome.  But yeah, add a couple gw2 inventory/ah systems and this game would be amazing.

Fake edit: Oh and I fooled around on the guild auction house, that is one of the most worthless interfaces I have ever seen.

[Stormwaltz]

I understand the good intentions behind the AH thing, but it's like saying "smartphones have killed public conversation, so we're going to outlaw everything but landlines." Rather than address the problem directly, they're just making everyone's lives aggravatingly inconvenient.

http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/04/10/elder-scrolls-online-recommends-third-party-auction-forum-for-tr/

[Signe]

Yeah, that "instead of an auction house" solution is not for me.  I'll just ignore everything except myself, I guess.  :)  One really, REALLY fun thing I did today was go to the Fungal Grove with my level 14 Dragonknight and use stealth then use ardent chains to pull one or two mobs to me and get all the way to the final boss and his two compadres.  I couldn't kill them, but I did away with nearly everything else.  Loads of good loot, too.  There's quite a few chests in there.  It took a while but it was a good laugh.  The only quests I have left in my journal for the Stonefall area is that one and a buggy one.  There's probably more but I've almost out-leveled that area.  I think.

[Stormwaltz]

I'm curious - the one quest where I thought I'd finally achieved a design structure I was happy with was in Stonefalls. It was granted by an item purchased from a wilderness vendor. Could anyone tell me if it was left in?

EDIT: Never mind, I found a reference to it in a wiki. I can't tell if it still works the same, but it's there. (It's "The Fetish.")

[Modern Angel]

I understand the good intentions behind the AH thing,

There are no good intentions behind it. Revisiting something I said pages ago, every day in this game I become more and more convinced the whole "we want to make trading social and awesome again" spiel is asscovering for technical ineptitude. Think about it: the search functions don't work in my 500 person trade guild now. You can't organize the searches by name. I swear that doing the same search brings up different results. And now they're saying, "Yeah, we said we wanted trading to be intimate and small but you can go ahead to this website if you want".

Then think about their insistence on a global server and what GW2 (run by a demonstrably more technically proficient team) went through with their single global AH.

They just couldn't code the fucker is what happened.

[Ginaz]

Is there an F13 guild going in ESO?  I joined a trading guild just to have the ability to buy and sell something without having to spam chat (this game needs an AH, I don't care what anyone says) but I'd like to join a real guild that does stuff like dungeons and pvp.  I'm in the Ebonheart Pact.  Also, installing a few of mods mentioned earlier (action bar, inventory etc) has things MUCH more playable.  I highly recommend using them.

Edit: I know someone (Signe?) posted a link earlier of all the Skyshard locations but this might be a better site to use. http://teso.mmorpg-life.com/database/skyshard-locations-map/