The Elder Scrolls Online

[Paelos]

Just ask rk47 what mods he uses.

Then put those on your list of mods you never want to install.

[Tannhauser]

There's a good one I like that makes the lore books glow blue and the skill up books glow orange until read.  Recommended.

[koro]

I really should try Skyrim with some mods.  I've never tried any.

You should. Steam facilitates this nicely if you can get past the fact that 60% of them are for pervos.

If you're referring to the Workshop on Steam, it's pretty much garbage and shouldn't be used.

[satael]

I would recommend nexus for any skyrim mods. If you install their mod manager it's almost as effortless as steam and you can install BOSS load order there which will autosort most of the mods saving you from lots and lots of frustration.

[Merusk]

I really should try Skyrim with some mods.  I've never tried any.

You should. Steam facilitates this nicely if you can get past the fact that 60% of them are for pervos.

If you're referring to the Workshop on Steam, it's pretty much garbage and shouldn't be used.

Workshop is good for some games, like torchlight, but terrible for any big customizations.  The limit to mod size means all of the cooler Skyrim mods can't be hosted there. 

[Venkman]

I found Workshop worked for me just fine in Skyrim. I suppose one "graduates" from that to something more advanced. And I'm sure that it's "easy" to folks who've been using it for awhile. But if you're just starting out in Skyrim at all, wouldn't jumping to advanced modding be akin to studying endgame tier 3 raid templates the first day you ever played an MMO?

[Paelos]

If you're referring to the Workshop on Steam, it's pretty much garbage and shouldn't be used.

I meant more that it's easy to mod things on Steam. It doesn't get in the way. The Workshop isn't something I've used a bunch, but I mod M&B like crazy with no issues.

[apocrypha]

I would recommend nexus for any skyrim mods. If you install their mod manager it's almost as effortless as steam and you can install BOSS load order there which will autosort most of the mods saving you from lots and lots of frustration.

I'll vouch for this approach too.

Install Nexus Mod Manager & BOSS, browse the Nexus and click the "Install with NMM" button on any mods you like the look of, run BOSS before launching the game.

I started off thinking I'd just make a few tweaks and bugfixes etc, and am now running about 60 mods...

[koro]

I really should try Skyrim with some mods.  I've never tried any.

You should. Steam facilitates this nicely if you can get past the fact that 60% of them are for pervos.

If you're referring to the Workshop on Steam, it's pretty much garbage and shouldn't be used.

Workshop is good for some games, like torchlight, but terrible for any big customizations.  The limit to mod size means all of the cooler Skyrim mods can't be hosted there.

Oh totally. I meant for just Skyrim.

[Triforcer]

A couple of actual gameplay-related questions:

(1)  I keep hearing people mention (in passing) that everyone can sneak.  Is that the same as saying every class has stealth?  If ranged glass cannons, et al. can (full invis) stealth that seems- unbalanced in pvp.

(2)  Is there any way for attackers to get in a keep without breaching the gate/walls?  I realize that would break sieges if everyone could do it, but I was hoping for a nightblade "scale wall" skill.

[satael]

A couple of actual gameplay-related questions:

(1)  I keep hearing people mention (in passing) that everyone can sneak.  Is that the same as saying every class has stealth?  If ranged glass cannons, et al. can (full invis) stealth that seems- unbalanced in pvp.

(2)  Is there any way for attackers to get in a keep without breaching the gate/walls?  I realize that would break sieges if everyone could do it, but I was hoping for a nightblade "scale wall" skill.

As far as I know...

1) the stealth is just like in Skyrim with modifiers affecting how effective it is. There is some invisibility stuff apart from the stealth thing

2) nothing like that. It there was everyone would go nb for pvp (if they cared about it).

[Threash]

A couple of actual gameplay-related questions:

(1)  I keep hearing people mention (in passing) that everyone can sneak.  Is that the same as saying every class has stealth?  If ranged glass cannons, et al. can (full invis) stealth that seems- unbalanced in pvp.

(2)  Is there any way for attackers to get in a keep without breaching the gate/walls?  I realize that would break sieges if everyone could do it, but I was hoping for a nightblade "scale wall" skill.

Stealth works the way stealth should, it is only effective when approaching someone from behind.  From the front people can see you quite a distance away.

[sam, an eggplant]

Stealth also drains your stamina, depending on how quickly you move. So you can't stay in stealth for extended periods of time either.

[satael]

It seems that Zenimax is starting to agree that the "starting islands" are doing a disservice to the game. 

[blackwulf]

Where did Blackwulf go??? 

Oh, I still pop in from time to time to read a couple threads here, but really life's too short to try to convince a bunch of old neckbeards to like a game I like!  I have to note that you ask that question rather smugly as though you think I've been wrong all along, and probably changed my mind.  I have to ask, do you guys only read these forums?  You all seem very out of touch.  General opinions about TESO have done a 180 after the last couple of weekend betas - they had 2.5 million people in the last weekend, and received largely positive feedback (aside from the 'stress' part of the beta!)

The devs ARE listening to our feedback:  The next beta will feature collision detection via the Havok engine in an attempt to alleviate the complaints about combat feeling "floaty" and they've changed the way the game starts:

In order to give new characters more freedom of choice, we’ve made a change to the way that characters move between the early zones. With this change, after you complete the tutorial and escape from Coldharbour, you will now arrive in the starting city for your alliance. You will have the option to visit the original starting areas, or just go forth and start adventuring immediately. Content in and around each of these cities has been adjusted to be more easily performed by characters of levels 3-6.

Overall, the game is incredibly deep and if you only gave it a couple of hours before deciding it's boring, then you've done yourself a disservice.  Have you guys even tried the pvp?  If not, there are hundreds of player made videos out now.  Here's a particularly fun (and not very long) one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s29KvfHwYqk&feature=youtu.be

My motivation for "shilling" a game has always been to try to get people to see what I like about a game, and join me in playing it.  I'm not altruistic - the reason I do this, I'm sure, is because I want the game to do well enough that it stays open for me and my guild to continue enjoying it.  I'm no longer worried about that, because it is selling extremely well, and the various fan communities are swelling like crazy.  I'm confident that 90% of you will end up buying this game, and I think most of you will enjoy it more and more as you play it.  So, see you in game!

PS - latest patch notes if anyone is interested:

[Nebu]

I have to ask, do you guys only read these forums?  You all seem very out of touch.  General opinions about TESO have done a 180 after the last couple of weekend betas - they had 2.5 million people in the last weekend, and received largely positive feedback (aside from the 'stress' part of the beta!)

I'm sure I can speak for others when I say that yes, we do read other forums/sites.  Problem is, that the kind of blind optimism that we see elsewhere is exactly the pablum we've seen in other MMO's for... well... as long as there have been MMO's.  It doesn't interest me what the masses say about ESO.  The masses get excited about Bieber and the latest Hip Hop fads.  I'm interested in what this forum has to say because they are generally more in-tune to what I prefer in a game.

Having tested ESO myself over 4 separate weekends, I can state that the folks here are pretty spot on in their assessment.  ESO is an opportunity wasted that will only serve to disappoint the hardcore Elder Scrolls fans. 

[Falconeer]

In order to make the world feel more substantial, you will now collide with NPCs, including collision with NPCs in combat.

Awesome!

Please note that this will not affect PvP combat with other players; collision is only on NPCs.

Pathetic.

These people just don't get it.

[Threash]

That is so ass backwards and a horrendous waste of bandwidth.

[Miasma]

So they're just making all of those lackluster newbie zones optional?  Wow that's a dramatic move but I guess the only one they could do considering they have just a month before launch.

Do you think mmo developers make the same mistakes each time out of spite or is it really that hard to fix?  If you're in closed testing for too long where only employees, friends and the most hardcore fans you've invited can play you won't get enough criticism.  These starter islands must have been the first ones played and the most tested so how on earth didn't they realize they kinda suck?  Not until it had a wider release for the stress tests and people started complaining did it dawn on them.

[Paelos]

Collision was one of the things I posted on the beta forums that I wanted, along with a better starting experience. So, it's good they finally addressed that. It's silly they didn't address it with players for PvP purposes. The idea that a player can just run right through you is moronic.

I still don't think the combat is fixable at this stage, nor will the first person view work.

[Maledict]

The only place I know of where feedback has been generally positive is Penny Arcade, and I'm fairly sure that's because the moderation on their site prevents people from complaining in a thread about a game.

Everywhere else, without exception, I see nothing but misery and condemnation for this dull, shit stain of a game. Even the old EQ boards I still frequent think it's a sad joke.

[satael]

Collision was one of the things I posted on the beta forums that I wanted, along with a better starting experience. So, it's good they finally addressed that. It's silly they didn't address it with players for PvP purposes. The idea that a player can just run right through you is moronic.

I still don't think the combat is fixable at this stage, nor will the first person view work.

While pvp collision detection would be great it would open up a whole bag of (grief) worms and make any lag issues really terrible (nevermind how many bugs the system would have given the late stage they are adding it into the game)

[Draegan]

Collision was one of the things I posted on the beta forums that I wanted, along with a better starting experience. So, it's good they finally addressed that. It's silly they didn't address it with players for PvP purposes. The idea that a player can just run right through you is moronic.

I still don't think the combat is fixable at this stage, nor will the first person view work.

First person will never work in games like this. As far as collision in PVP, it's got to be a performance thing.

[Falconeer]

It has to be a performance thing, because collision detection has been a thing in many, many PvP games before this one. In fact, it is usually the opposite: it's off in PvE but on in PvP. Anyway, this is shit.

[Nebu]

Also makes you wonder how much of the positional data is client side.  That's going to make a mess of PvP as well as soon as people learn how to manipulate it.

[Ingmar]

PVP collision would be a griefing nightmare, I'm not really surprised it doesn't have it.

[Paelos]

PVP collision would be a griefing nightmare, I'm not really surprised it doesn't have it.

Would it be impossible to just have enemy pvp collision?

[Falconeer]

PvP collision is in many PvP games and MMOs specifically and it's not a griefing nightmare, except for stuff like this. which was greatly appreciated anyway. Seriously, body blocking is part of those games and it's usually a meaningful, valuable combat mechanic. I am sure they are just terrified at the servers trying to detect player collisions during 100v100v100 siege battles.

EDIT: I found this statement from Brian Wheeler, the PvP lead of TESO.

Collision Detection

"Having worked on games with player collision in PVP before, we found that it was far more valuable to offer players larger battles with better server and client performance than smaller battles with player collision due to the hit servers and clients take when implementing such a feature."

[Soulflame]

I think you meant 150v100v50.

Having played DAoC, the sides are never 100v100v100.

[Nevermore]

If the PvP area is in its own instance, then the sides can be regulated to a degree.  In DAoC, there was no regulation at all on the number each side could bring.

[Ingmar]

I guess if the collision detection is enemy-only (and only if you're both flagged ideally - I can't remember if this game has world pvp as well as the frontier stuff) that would help a lot.  Seems like the sort of thing where exploits might exist, but yeah.

[Stormwaltz]

NPC collision can be checked client-side, because if you decide to cheat it, who gives a shit?

PvP collision must be done on the server.

[Tannhauser]

Collision was one of the things I posted on the beta forums that I wanted, along with a better starting experience. So, it's good they finally addressed that. It's silly they didn't address it with players for PvP purposes. The idea that a player can just run right through you is moronic.

I still don't think the combat is fixable at this stage, nor will the first person view work.

First person will never work in games like this. As far as collision in PVP, it's got to be a performance thing.

In pve I played the beta in 1st person.  Not since EQ have I done that.  Gives me the Elder Scrolls feel.  Now pvp or some instance?  Yeah I'll go to over the shoulder but you're way off base saying it will never work.  I imagine there are many folks like me who will pve in 1st person.

[HaemishM]

Were I to play this game, it would be in 1st person. It's the only 1st person MMOG that's worked for me since EQ1.

[Sir T]

To be honest, from a simple lag and performance angle, I am sympathetic to them saying that it would adversely effect performance if they had player collision detection and I'd rather have a smoother game than a lag fest. I can also see how it makes combat a bit crappy.