Return of the Book Thread

[cmlancas]

Since we're talking about the outdoors, any of Hemingway's short stories are excellent. (Working on my thesis and Hem's on the brain.)


Start with "The Short and Happy Life of Francis Macomber."

[WayAbvPar]

I'm definitely no stranger to infuriating writing.

Not so much the writing as the subject matter. Some of the things done in the name of religion are just abhorrent.


Outdoor adventures? Robert Ruark has written some masterpieces, and Peter Hathaway Capstick's Africa stuff is fun reading. I re-read Death In The Long Grass at least once every 18 months or so. Stories are riveting, and he has a great sense of humor.

[cmlancas]

Have you read Kingsolver's The Poisonwood Bible? If infuriating in the name of God antics keep you glued to the pages, you'll like it. Plus, Kingsolver is a hell of a writer.

[HRose]

After all the recommendations here and on my thread on Q23 about the best/most epic fantasy cycle, I'm going to bite on Steven Erikson and RR Martin.

For the first time I'll also try to read them in english as I found them for 5$ each. With an italian version near in the case it reveals to be too hard.

With games I don't tolerate translations anymore, maybe it's time to do the jump even with books.

Steven Erikson seems the exact copy of what I always looked for. A cycle that focuses more on world building than the single character, with a very wide scope, and with a more modern/mature approach compared to fantasy targeted at teens. In particular without the Hero's Journey and with many strong characters instead of one or few protagonists.

There's a fascinating "review" on Salon that is evocative on its own. Even if I haven't read a single page yet I expect Erikson to become my favorite fantasy writer.

Since I wanted to archive it anyway, here's a collection of random comments that turned me into fanboy:

His first fantasy novel, Gardens of the Moon (1999), constitutes the first of ten projected volumes of the Malazan Book of the Fallen. His style of writing tends towards complex plots with multiple point-of-view characters.

It is an epic fantasy, wide in scope and encompassing the stories of a very large cast of characters. Each book tells a different chapter in the ongoing saga of the Malazan Empire and its wars. For the first five books, each volume is self-contained, in that the primary conflict of each novel is resolved within that novel.

However, many underlying characters and events are interwoven throughout the works of the series, binding it together.

HRose: Erikson's series should be under 'epic' in the dictionary. With timelines spanning 100000 years and more, and tons and tons of characters, many of which who are ancient themselves. It helps that it's brilliant writing too.

My personal favorite. I love the expansive and interesting world Erikson has built. That being one of your criteria I don't think you can go wrong.

I do like Erikson too, but the far-flung epic feel drags in parts. That could just be me in that I only have time to read sporadically. THe Malazan books are certainly not ones you skip merrily through. You have to pay attention and invest yourself in them. You are definitely paid off, though, because the detailed world he creates is nothing short of amazing.

This is the seventh novel in the Malazan Book of the Fallen series. It is everything you hoped for if you have been following this story from the beginning. The sheer scale and grandeur of this tale is breathtaking. Again you will question who are the "good guys" and who are the "bad guys"

Martin and Erikson are absolutely the giants of the genre at this point.

Erikson other folks have described. Huge time scale, lots of gods and other major powers futzing with things. Enormous, dramatic conflicts. I've found every book so far to be rough getting into (he sometimes spends 5/6ths of a book building tension and weaving threads before the big shit goes down.) but increasingly compelling to the point of obsession the deeper into them I get. There's nagging things that keep popping up and back down again before I can entirely identify them. But he's telling much too good a story for me to really care.

Another big hell yeah for Malazan. There is just nothing else quite like it out there. And another reason it deserves the "epic" title (which I didn't see anyone else mentioning in this thread but they may have and I missed it) - the depth of character and location interaction is so broad it's almost silly. You meet what look like minor throw-away characters in one book only to find they are the major player three books later.

And my last bit of fanboy praise - the characters are freaking GREAT. Ericson is not afraid to kill of major characters, and he creates new major characters in just about every book, and yet almost all of them are clearly drawn with distinct personalities and are quite memorable.

Erikson also does some really unique stuff with structure and narrative that I haven't seen a lot in the genre. It's not straightforward in any way. For example, the first book takes place on a certain continent with certain characters then Book 2 moves to a completely different continent with mainly new characters. Book 3 then acts as a sequel to Book 1, and Book 4 to Book 2.

Then there is an all new continent and characters in Book 5 and now Erikson is drawing all of those threads together in the latter half of the series.

The result is that the whole enterprise is basically a puzzle where the reader is making the connections between these seeming disparate storylines.

Especially since Erikson abhors any type of exposition describing the world and it's history. It's left to the reader to put together so readers of the first book often feel like they are missing something and starting a series in the middle. Another cool technique Erikson uses is that he hides some secrets and twists in plain sight which can makes re-reads quite enjoyable when you see how much he had laid out in advance.

Martin isn't really high fantasy- it's all very realistic with minimal magic. Erikson, on the other hand, really excels when it comes to epic, magic heavy battles.

Erikson's world can probably be compared to the mythology of Ancient Greece but set in a medieval period- Gods and Ascendants (basically demi-gods) are main characters and frequently interact with mortals.

Erikson is a master of lost and forgotten epochs, a weaver of ancient epics on a scale that would approach absurdity if it wasn't so much fun.

War is a constant -- from continent to continent, century upon century. Erikson's universe is a violent one, Gothic in intensity, without clear demarcation between good and evil. It's perhaps more like the real world, then, than most fantasy, which so clearly differentiates between light and dark. Not the kind of story I would read to my son before bed -- death and pain abound, along with magic and wonder.

Gods are always messing with mortals in Erikson's work, but the mortals also, by their patterns of belief, create their own gods, their own greater powers.

Maybe he can put the quotes on the cover of his next book ;)

[Murgos]

G.R.R. Martin does a lot of tricks with words in his stories that I am not sure can translate too easily to another language or at any rate that aren't easy to pick up if you are not paying attention.  There are MANY examples where he says something and it has two meanings, one that is applicable to the current situation and just seems like simple story telling and another that is heavy foreshadowing of following activities.  For example, the Red Wedding's outcome is hinted at for almost a full book before it actually happens.

Personally, I would like to read Dumas' Three Musketeers books or Count of Monte Cristo in French just to catch a little more of the nuance between conversations.  Or, maybe, Trainspotting in English.

[Morat20]

G.R.R. Martin does a lot of tricks with words in his stories that I am not sure can translate too easily to another language or at any rate that aren't easy to pick up if you are not paying attention.  There are MANY examples where he says something and it has two meanings, one that is applicable to the current situation and just seems like simple story telling and another that is heavy foreshadowing of following activities.  For example, the Red Wedding's outcome is hinted at for almost a full book before it actually happens.

Oh yes indeed. The mystery of Jon Snow, and what Ned Stark actually saw when he went to rescue his sister didn't click until the second reading of the book.

[Johny Cee]

G.R.R. Martin does a lot of tricks with words in his stories that I am not sure can translate too easily to another language or at any rate that aren't easy to pick up if you are not paying attention.  There are MANY examples where he says something and it has two meanings, one that is applicable to the current situation and just seems like simple story telling and another that is heavy foreshadowing of following activities.  For example, the Red Wedding's outcome is hinted at for almost a full book before it actually happens.

Oh yes indeed. The mystery of Jon Snow, and what Ned Stark actually saw when he went to rescue his sister didn't click until the second reading of the book.

You guys seriously need to read Gene Wolfe.  His books in the first person narrative carry on in a light and matter of fact style....  until the main character does something outrageous and you have to reinterpret exactly what was going on the last 100 pages.

[Falwell]

Just finished Atlas Shrugged a few days ago. Hell of a good read.

Now splitting time between American Gods and rereading Asmiov's Foundation series for the umpteenth time.

[pants]

Oh yes indeed. The mystery of Jon Snow, and what Ned Stark actually saw when he went to rescue his sister didn't click until the second reading of the book.

Its been about a year since I read Fire & Ice, but I'm a bit lost by these comments.  What do you mean by Jon Snow's mystery?  Who his mum is?  And the bit about what Ned Stark saw?  Maybe I'm being thick, but I can't work out the meaning behind these?  Care to elaborate - I guess with spoilerific protection as well for those who haven't read it.

[Morat20]

Oh yes indeed. The mystery of Jon Snow, and what Ned Stark actually saw when he went to rescue his sister didn't click until the second reading of the book.

Its been about a year since I read Fire & Ice, but I'm a bit lost by these comments.  What do you mean by Jon Snow's mystery?  Who his mum is?  And the bit about what Ned Stark saw?  Maybe I'm being thick, but I can't work out the meaning behind these?  Care to elaborate - I guess with spoilerific protection as well for those who haven't read it.

Ned Stark went to rescue his sister, who had been kidnapped by one of the last Dragon-king guys (not the King, just one of his royal brothers). When he found her, she was alone in a tower guarded by three of the Kingsguard. Kingsguard ONLY guarded the king and royal family. She was there, dying, in a bed with the smell of roses and blood. Why would Kingsguard be there, why was she dying? Childbirth -- the child of one of the dragon-king guys and Lyanna Stark. Ned Stark's only said "he is of my blood" -- his nephew would be too.

That would give Jon Snow a heritage of fire (dragon guys) and ice (Starks). The prince that was promised -- whose song was a song of fire and ice.

[pants]

spoilerish stuff

Wow - I did miss that even on my 2nd reading.  Very interesting...

[lamaros]

Oh yes indeed. The mystery of Jon Snow, and what Ned Stark actually saw when he went to rescue his sister didn't click until the second reading of the book.

Its been about a year since I read Fire & Ice, but I'm a bit lost by these comments.  What do you mean by Jon Snow's mystery?  Who his mum is?  And the bit about what Ned Stark saw?  Maybe I'm being thick, but I can't work out the meaning behind these?  Care to elaborate - I guess with spoilerific protection as well for those who haven't read it.

Just think of it in terms of fantasy. For all GRRM's 'shades of grey' in characterisation his world is still one of high fantasy; birthrights, destiny etc etc.

(And, not necessarily a condemnation, but insofar as subtlty goes Martin.. well I'm not sure he's aiming for it. The hints of future events are deliberate and range from obvious to mildly disguised; but they are all there to be read.)

I must admit, I don't enjoy the series as much as I used to. The first book is still the best as the fantasy is given less of a free reign. The later books tend to give in to the tendency for fantasy drama which doesn't really work for me as well. The stated aim of having things more like Tolkien - with magic and fantasy present but 'ofscreen' or in the past (I don't really like Lord of the Rings - but I do like that aspect of it) - no longer seems true, and the books are the worse for it.

Lord Snow? Lady Dragon? Conan as a young girl raised by magical assassins? Etc. All the characters are becoming too involved with these fanciful storylines and the book has lost that grounding and focus that it originally had. It's moved from 10 views of the same isolated view of their own 'world' to 20 views of the world generally...

Oh well. I'll still read it when the other books come out.

Magician is still one of my favourite Fantasy novels. It's just a simple and fun story. Taken as itself, not as a series (which doesn't stand up nearly as well).

[Ironwood]

Richard Morgan's "Black Man" is very good.  Americans should read it.  Some food for thought on the collapse of your country.

[Murgos]

Some food for thought on the collapse of your country.

You're jumping the gun a bit there.

[Morat20]

Lord Snow? Lady Dragon? Conan as a young girl raised by magical assassins? Etc. All the characters are becoming too involved with these fanciful storylines and the book has lost that grounding and focus that it originally had. It's moved from 10 views of the same isolated view of their own 'world' to 20 views of the world generally...

Lord Snow goes nowhere, though -- his place is the wall, and will be until he dies. He had Aemon's example to guide him. The Dragon chick, on the other hand --- I have no specific idea where he's going with that one, other than highly complicating the situation of an already fucked realm. I mean, Winter is coming -- and their last harvest got burned. No one's prepared, half the men are dead, and oh hey the religious nutcases are taking control everywhere.

Snow's heritage is more complex than Martin has implied, but I [DON'T -- I left out the stupid word DON'T] think the ending will be something trite like "Marry Snow to Dragon Chick and unify the Kingdom, and her dragons can flame the others". The King in the North is either Bran or Rickon, the actual heir to the farkin' Iron Throne is either Dragon Lady or that bastard son of Robert's -- the blacksmith kid. Or possibly Stannis. The Brienne/Jamie storyline remains interesting -- even more so if she's really dead.

I just want me more of the Imp. At this point, he's the only one I'm truly fond of, especially after he dealt with his dad.

Edited: I meant "don't think" and used "think", thus confusing poor Murgos who read what I wrote instead of reading my mind.

[Merusk]

More Imp more Arya.

Now on to spolier-ish discussion!

You're dead-on about the "Marry Snow to Dragon Chick."  Daenerys has told us about the Targaryen nobility's traditions in regards to marriage and with the "omg how the fuck did I not work THAT through." bit that you dropped earlier that seems all the more likely.   However, I dobut very much that will be the ending. 

Daen is going to show up in the south sometime after the problems in the north are dealt with, I think.  John will start to see the fire witch and Stannis as a problem  since y'know, buring heretics will start to get out of control.  At that point he'll ally with Daen and Arya will show up again as a faceless and it'll all be very weird.

The Iron Throne is definitely Targaryen's, though.  There's still a westlands contingent that sees house Targaryen as the true king, despite them being crazy-as-fuck.  House Stannis will wind-up wiped out except for that bastard whom nobody will remember (because most who knew about him are dead now)  and there will be no "King in the North"   Bran is going to wind-up dead or otherwise removed from the game as his powers turn him into something else and Rickon will be the sole remaining Stark, left to reestablish the line in the North. 

I'm going with "Brienne is dead" and Jaime does little about it except - perhaps - feeling a bit of regret and some humanity.   He's got "going to die a redemption" written all over him, though, so I can't get too thrilled with his recent de-bastardization.  I expect Tywin will wind-up as head house Lannister in the end, though, if he too doesn't wind-up killed off and ending House Lannister as well.

[Rasix]

Yikes, you sure are liberally peppering in the spoilage.  If anyone has not read A Song of Fire and Ice and wants to, uhh, ignore this thread.

As for who abducted Lyanna Stark, it was Prince Rhaegar, Daenerys' brother.  The whole thing sets up nicely for a marriage of plot convenience (Dragons v. Others)  and family precedent (Targaryens are known for intermarrying).   I wouldn't count necessarily on Martin sticking Snow up on the wall for the rest of the series.  Although Snow's taken the duty to heart, Martin seems to find away around such things.

Of course, Martin will find out some way to throw in a curve ball. 



I love the series, but I just wish he'd hurry up a bit.

[Morat20]

I had to edit it above -- I meant "Snow won't marry Dragon Chick" -- left out a critical word there when I wrote it. :)

The Targaryen's were fucking insane, and while Daeny isn't personally insane it's really only a matter of time if they keep inbreeding. I suspect that'll make Snow a really attractive target to her IF she ever works that out, but he won't do it. He was raised in the North, and between Ned and Aemon, his places is on the Wall.

He's not leaving the Wall. He didn't do it to save his family, he won't do it for the throne.

I'm not sure what's up with Jamie, although seeing his sister in the hands of the religious nutcakes is amusing to me, since I've loathed the bitch since the beginning -- even though she's clearly crazy too.

Daeny + Robert's Bastard could unify the kingdom and stop the incest problems, and probably manage to crush both the incipent crazy religious movements. It'd be Daeny's work, but Robert's bastard would settle some minds (and it'd be a nice twist on the usual habit of marrying off the female heir for that reason).

I'm also waiting for the Frey's to get theirs over the Red Wedding. Caetlyn isn't hanging around because she enjoys life.

Rasix: I spoilered the bit that was speculation, but the last book has been out over a year. So other than being a little roundabout....

[Rasix]

He's not leaving the Wall. He didn't do it to save his family, he won't do it for the throne.

He'd do it for something greater than that.  Which is why I think Martin finds something for getting him off the wall.  Brings Daenerys to the wall.  Something.  He brings them together. 

The family (Targaryen) really doesn't have a concept of incest. He's not going to attempt to appeal to modern standards of "icky".

[Morat20]

He's not leaving the Wall. He didn't do it to save his family, he won't do it for the throne.

He'd do it for something greater than that.  Which is why I think Martin finds something for getting him off the wall.  Brings Daenerys to the wall.  Something.  He brings them together. 

The family (Targaryen) really doesn't have a concept of incest. He's not going to attempt to appeal to modern standards of "icky".

Yeah, but the whole problem with the Targaryen's was they came as conquerer's and never wed the land. Unlike the Starks -- who were tied to the north -- they more or less kept to themselves, applied their own rules, and ruled first through dragons and later through sheer inertia.

Wedding Jon Snow, if his heritage is indeed that of Ice and Fire, would be a way out -- and it might happen only because Martin's played that angle damn cagey. It wasn't until I kept wondering what the hell Lyanna had made Ned promise, or why he kept thinking of her at the oddest times, did I really sit down and work out what I think was really going on. He could unify the conquerers with the land -- or at least the one House that had the deepest roots (the Weirwoods and the Old Gods).

But frankly, any Stark would do -- Brandon or Rickon. Or even a Bartheonon, or any of the old houses, and start a new line of Kings out of the old.

With the introduction of the fantastic -- the Others, dragons, resurection, and the Gods (Fire, Death, whatnot), I think the resolution will have to be deeply symbolic. It's no coicidence that dragons reappeared when the Others threatened, or that sorcery came back with them -- I don't buy the "Magic happens because there are dragons" link. I think the dragons could come back for the same reason that magic started working again (although I might buy the explanation for better wildfire). Part of the resolution will have to be to tie the Targaryens to the land they now occupy, to make them part of it the way they were once part of Valaryia -- and Daeny isn't even close to that level of acceptance. They always looked down on their new country, they weren't part of it.

For other random thoughts -- is there any doubt Coldhands is Ben Stark?

[Ironwood]

Some food for thought on the collapse of your country.

You're jumping the gun a bit there.

Me ?  I'm not jumping anything.  Have you read the book ?

[Murgos]

The country has yet to collapse.  Unless you are using 'the collapse of your country.' in some strange form of future tense I am unaware of.

If you actually believe the country has collapsed then you have spent far to long in the politics forum and should probably get out for some fresh air.

[Ironwood]

John Wyndham and HG Wells both wrote mightily on the collapse of my country.  It's Sci-Fi.  Get a grip.

Read the book and if you honestly don't think that underneath the Usual Violence and Noir we expect from Mr Morgan there's a lot of social message, well, I guess we'll just raise our beers, hold no grudges and you'll be free to suck my dick.


Further, for those interested, it actually is another book from Morgans Datastack timeline.  It's interesting to see how he saw the world evolving towards Kovacs World.  Like all good sci-fi, it's a really thought provoking read.

[Murgos]

You didn't say it's a fictional look at the possible collapse of your country.  You said it's a book on the collapse of your country.  Big difference there, cocksucker.

[Rishathra]

If my country collapses like it does in Snow Crash, I think that might be a lot of fun.  For no other reason than I get to use the word burbclave.

[lamaros]

He's not leaving the Wall. He didn't do it to save his family, he won't do it for the throne.

He'd do it for something greater than that.  Which is why I think Martin finds something for getting him off the wall.  Brings Daenerys to the wall.  Something.  He brings them together. 

The family (Targaryen) really doesn't have a concept of incest. He's not going to attempt to appeal to modern standards of "icky".

Yeah, but the whole problem with the Targaryen's was they came as conquerer's and never wed the land. Unlike the Starks -- who were tied to the north -- they more or less kept to themselves, applied their own rules, and ruled first through dragons and later through sheer inertia.

Wedding Jon Snow, if his heritage is indeed that of Ice and Fire, would be a way out -- and it might happen only because Martin's played that angle damn cagey. It wasn't until I kept wondering what the hell Lyanna had made Ned promise, or why he kept thinking of her at the oddest times, did I really sit down and work out what I think was really going on. He could unify the conquerers with the land -- or at least the one House that had the deepest roots (the Weirwoods and the Old Gods).

But frankly, any Stark would do -- Brandon or Rickon. Or even a Bartheonon, or any of the old houses, and start a new line of Kings out of the old.

With the introduction of the fantastic -- the Others, dragons, resurection, and the Gods (Fire, Death, whatnot), I think the resolution will have to be deeply symbolic. It's no coicidence that dragons reappeared when the Others threatened, or that sorcery came back with them -- I don't buy the "Magic happens because there are dragons" link. I think the dragons could come back for the same reason that magic started working again (although I might buy the explanation for better wildfire). Part of the resolution will have to be to tie the Targaryens to the land they now occupy, to make them part of it the way they were once part of Valaryia -- and Daeny isn't even close to that level of acceptance. They always looked down on their new country, they weren't part of it.

For other random thoughts -- is there any doubt Coldhands is Ben Stark?

I don't think Martin will in any way do predictable.
I don't think Tyrion will come good. I don't think Dany and Jon will get Married. I don't think Jamie will be fully redemed. I don't think There will be a happy end with neat solutions like that.

Or maybe I just hope.

I mean, I think the whole Jon becomes Lord Snow thing is just a bit retarded, and the Arya with her coin bit too. So Bran going off and becoming some silly magician and all this other rubbish happening might take place, but it'll be blindingly predictable at this point and I think Martin has retained some ability to not be predictable at least.

Consider that Sansa is still in the story and you have Theon/Theon's story most likely having influence and you'd have to get somewhere other that just symbolism in the end.

Though, he's getting close to the end of the series and there is nowhere near enough room for detailed and non-symbolic events to play themselves out everywhere.. so my faith is a little shaky.

We'll see though. It can't be any worse than the end to The Night's Dawn Trilogy (though I have to say I have a soft spot for that in a way - A big ole 'fuck this lets go with a really bold complete resolution'.)

I'm sure if you were bothered you can go back and read the predictions of Rheagar (spelling) while Dany is in the house of dust and work out the story resolution from that.

Oh and I don't think he abducted Lyanna, I think the indication was meant to be that were in love and eloped - despite she being sworn to Robert and him being married. Enough is said on that issue to be reasonably certain.

[Murgos]

Oh and I don't think he abducted Lyanna, I think the indication was meant to be that were in love and eloped - despite she being sworn to Robert and him being married. Enough is said on that issue to be reasonably certain.

Yeah, that's pretty much how I read it.  But adultery and oathbreaking are pretty serious crimes, especially when breaking oaths and committing adultery at that level of politics so Lyanna and Rheagar aren't really innocent parties here.

[Xilren's Twin]

Just read through and ejoyable book by a new (to me at least) author in the fantasy genre: The Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss.  It a clever look at the truth of the life of larger than life hero as told by himself to a chronicler over the course of 3 days (which means it's a trilogy of course).  Interesting behind the scenes look at how myths can grow from truth and one mans search for truth inside the myth, plus I like his take on magic(s).  650+ pages but it flows very quickly.  Now, the wait for book 2 in 2008 :(

[Johny Cee]

Just read through and ejoyable book by a new (to me at least) author in the fantasy genre: The Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss.  It a clever look at the truth of the life of larger than life hero as told by himself to a chronicler over the course of 3 days (which means it's a trilogy of course).  Interesting behind the scenes look at how myths can grow from truth and one mans search for truth inside the myth, plus I like his take on magic(s).  650+ pages but it flows very quickly.  Now, the wait for book 2 in 2008 :(

Name of the Wind is on alot of (fantasy/scifi) folks "best debut" novels,  and is seeing a large amount of casual readers picking it up.  I think I mentioned it a few pages back.  It's a big book,  but it flows very well. 

In contrast to Quicksilver,  which I'm finishing now and find it difficult to get into.  Once I get past 5 or 10 pages,  it's good.  But kind of have to psych myself up to start again after I put it down.  I find the POV jumps to be kind of jarring,  since the 3 main viewpoints have such a different style and plot progression.  It's enjoyable,  but I'm not devouring it.

I have a huge pile of books that I've started but haven't finished: 

Acacia -- Also on folks "best debut" lists.  Seems decent.

A Wanderers Tale -- Wasn't impressed by 70 or 80 pages,  then read a bunch of peoples negative reactions. 

Ink -- Sequal to Vellum...  heavy wierd post-modern stuff.  Different worlds/realities, where the same characters can be radically different people in each.  The author seems to have ditched splicing in ancient Sumerian myth stories that roughly parallel the plot.  Really have to work myself up to sit down and get into it,  though the first was pretty enjoyable once I did.

The Blade Itself -- Pseudo-GRR Martin.  Almost done,  but not really crazy about it.  Despite the loads of good reviews I read.

Bunch of fun trashy stuff.  Lots of Warhammer 40k books now collected in Omnibus, stuff like that. 

Read a shitload of short story (fantasy, scifi, some horror),  including a sort of "what if you combined Sherlock Holmes' Victorian England with Lovecraft's Cthulthu Mythos" which was wildly uneven. 

[Johny Cee]

John Wyndham and HG Wells both wrote mightily on the collapse of my country.  It's Sci-Fi.  Get a grip.

Read the book and if you honestly don't think that underneath the Usual Violence and Noir we expect from Mr Morgan there's a lot of social message, well, I guess we'll just raise our beers, hold no grudges and you'll be free to suck my dick.


Further, for those interested, it actually is another book from Morgans Datastack timeline.  It's interesting to see how he saw the world evolving towards Kovacs World.  Like all good sci-fi, it's a really thought provoking read.

Black Man was retitled as Thirteen in the US.

I like the Kovacs novels,  but overall didn't care for this one.  Morgan is (again) setting up his world to give proof for his political and sociological prejudices.  That'd be fine,  except the story and the main character feel as if some hack writer banged out a ripoff of Altered Carbon.

The main character is a Kovacs ripoff.  The plot roughly follows Altered Carbon.  Even the love interest is a pretty close parallel to the cop in Altered Carbon.

[Abagadro]

Just finishing up A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East. If you want to know a) how the Middle East got this way and b) how we are making the exact same mistakes that have been happening for the last 90 years, it is an invaluable book.

[Ironwood]

Finished An Instance of the Fingerpost.

Avoid.

[Engels]

Finished An Instance of the Fingerpost.

Avoid.

No way! That is like, a favorte book of mine! It took stamina to get through it, but was totally worth it!

[WayAbvPar]

Just finishing up A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East. If you want to know a) how the Middle East got this way and b) how we are making the exact same mistakes that have been happening for the last 90 years, it is an invaluable book.

That sounds really interesting. Gonna have to pick that up after I finish the Baroque Cycle (was interrupted by about 5 gambling books to prep for Vegas).

[Morat20]

In contrast to Quicksilver,  which I'm finishing now and find it difficult to get into.  Once I get past 5 or 10 pages,  it's good.  But kind of have to psych myself up to start again after I put it down.  I find the POV jumps to be kind of jarring,  since the 3 main viewpoints have such a different style and plot progression.  It's enjoyable,  but I'm not devouring it.

I had the same problem. I didn't have that problem with The Confusion or The System of the World. Then again, I struggled to get into Cryptonomicon -- although once I did, it was worth it. (Except the ending. Man can't write an ending for shit).

The Sherlock Holmes/Lovecraft thing is a Neil Gaiman short story. Good, but not his best. :)