Return of the Book Thread

[dd0029]

Scalzi has a new one coming early next month, Lock In. Tor is putting up the first 5 chapters, one a day starting today. Of interest is that they have also included the full prequel novella, Unlocked: An Oral History of Haden’s Syndrome. This was much better than I expected after the letdown that was Redshirts.

[dd0029]

The Martian by Andy Weir. For a book about an astronaut left alone on Mars after his mission is scrubbed, this was surprisingly funny. This is the geek version of a breezy beach read. Highly recommended.

[Morat20]

Finally read "John Dies at the End" and "Dodger". Started the first book of The Rho Agenda (Second Ship is the title, maybe?). Have Ancillary Justice queued up after that one.

[Ingmar]

The Martian by Andy Weir. For a book about an astronaut left alone on Mars after his mission is scrubbed, this was surprisingly funny. This is the geek version of a breezy beach read. Highly recommended.

I've played Magic with him - never got around to reading the book yet, but I guess he got a movie rights deal for it so you might see a movie version eventually.

[Johny Cee]

Malazans: I loved the series so much, but felt like I forgot so much, that halfway through the tenth book, I went back and reread it. I got stuck in the middle of the ninth book and haven't been back yet. I personally like how the characters progressed over that, what, 10 year period? made sense, at least insofar that when a character does something you don't expect, there's some shout out to why they did it in some throwaway fashion. This is whether it's Quick Ben doing something you don't realize he can do or Sinn becoming pure evil. You can kinda see the progression to that point, but only if there's that throwaway line that then makes you rethink the progression, and then if you happen to read the series again you see the signs ahead of time

Shit though does he Tolkien up some of the and-then-they-wandered-here/here's-every-fucking-step-they-took stuff though, particularly in I think book four when they're in that wierd dimension with all the tile floors, and in the eighth or ninth (or probably both) when they're still in that goddamned desert.

Bugg and Tehol, their dialog was awesome. I always looked forward to the next time they'd show up. But as a whole, I'd say they were not only the most colorful characters, they were about the only colorful ones aside from Quick Ben. Though eventuall Karsa become interesting.

Actually, the timeline of Malazan is just thoroughly fucked and makes no sense.  Basically, years pass in some places/character threads but only months pass in others.  For instance, Crokus/Cutter seems to only have maybe months pass in his character arc, but events in Darujistan have had 6ish years (based on the age of Stony's kid) pass.  Karsa's teen kids track him down from his pillage early in his arc in House of Chains, but there is no possible way that many years have passed. Etc.

Pretty much up until book 5 Erickson was working with a pretty detailed outline/background notes, but his annual release schedule after that meant he had to pump out a book every year (or 18 months if he was late) and the later books have far less depth, more filler, and don't make cohesive sense to the grander story arc when compared to the first few books that all fit together like a puzzle.

Also, he relies too heavily on one type of character: undergrad philosophy major.  Especially in later books, far too many characters sound like freshmen in a dorm debating philosophy.

I really liked the books up until Book 6, where it jumped the shark for me.  Books 7-9 were a slog, and I just can't force myself to read book 10.  I say this as someone that reread the first few books multiple times before each new release until book 7-9 started battering my patience with his style.  Also, second Ingmar's complaint of "rape as character development".


If you liked Malazan, pick up Glen Cook's "Dread Empire" trilogy.  That was Erickson's major inspiration for Malazan, right down to stealing the character Mocker and renaming him Kruppe (complete with weird speech mannerisms) though Mocker is more an actual con man than secretly a genius mastermind cum demigod.  It's pretty well known by this point that most of the Malazan soldiers were stolen directly from the Black Company, until the later books where talky-talky soldier philosophers took over.

If you want books with unreliable narrators/narratives where one line all of a sudden turns everything before on its head, you should really try some Gene Wolfe.  The Wizard Knight is probably the most approachable (it's a duology), while The Book of the New Sun is his most famous series.

[Phildo]

Listen to Johnny Cee, this man knows what he's talking about.  I'm currently on book 8 of the Malazan series and really want to go back to Glen Cook now.

Speaking of Glen Cook, looks like a new Instrumentalities of the Night book was just released.  It's not his best series, but I'll take what I can get right now since he's done with Black Company and Dread Empire books.

[shiznitz]

I highly recommend The Lies of Locke Lamora if you like fantasy thief stories (and who here doesn't?) Great characters, complex story, well written.

I might have learned about it here for all I know.

[Ironwood]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

[murdoc]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

This sums it up nicely, Sir.

New Dresden today!

[MrHat]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

This sums it up nicely, Sir.

New Dresden today!

Weeeeeee!

[shiznitz]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

Ok then. Oops.

[dd0029]

New Dresden today!

Got my library copy today and am just a bit in, but this is the first time I'm really noticing the sexism. It's way beyond awkward and into creepy. We're getting sexual comments in the middle of firefights and triage. 

[rattran]

Listen to Johnny Cee, this man knows what he's talking about.  I'm currently on book 8 of the Malazan series and really want to go back to Glen Cook now.

Speaking of Glen Cook, looks like a new Instrumentalities of the Night book was just released.  It's not his best series, but I'll take what I can get right now since he's done with Black Company and Dread Empire books.

It was more of the same from the first few, but seemed more filler-ish, like some of the final Black Company books. I'll still buy the next one when it comes out.

[Engels]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

Ok then. Oops.

We also mentioned something back in 2006 that I hope you are already apologetic about bringing up AGAIN.

[satael]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

Ok then. Oops.

We also mentioned something back in 2006 that I hope you are already apologetic about bringing up AGAIN.

Scott Lynch is actually a guest at my local con this year and I'm looking forward to any panel/speech with him in it. 

[Evildrider]

Parkour!

[Ironwood]

You will have.  We all raved about it.  And then slightly less about the second one.  And then scratched our heads a little at the third one.

But good books.

Ok then. Oops.

We also mentioned something back in 2006 that I hope you are already apologetic about bringing up AGAIN.

Hey, don't look at me, I wasn't looking for an apology.

In related news, I'm re-reading The Chronicles of Black Company.  Still overrated.

 

[Xilren's Twin]

New Dresden today!

Got my library copy today and am just a bit in, but this is the first time I'm really noticing the sexism. It's way beyond awkward and into creepy. We're getting sexual comments in the middle of firefights and triage.  

If by sexism you mean "is constantly noticing the attractive females around him even in circumstances that you think he should be focused on something important" it's the combo of the winter mantle and the fact this character hasn't been laid in years, literally.  They made that rather blatant last book too...

Oh, and having finished this new one, the generally feeling i had coming out of it was ...

[dd0029]

Got my library copy today and am just a bit in, but this is the first time I'm really noticing the sexism. It's way beyond awkward and into creepy. We're getting sexual comments in the middle of firefights and triage. 

If by sexism you mean "is constantly noticing the attractive females around him even in circumstances that you think he should be focused on something important" it's the combo of the winter mantle and the fact this character hasn't been laid in years, literally.  They made that rather blatant last book too...

I've finished it now and, yeah....no....

Compare the first third and the second half. The second half is what you're talking about. The first third, it's just creepy as fuck.

[Fraeg]

He'll hath no fury.....

Enjoying the new Dresden

[Morat20]

Just finished Raising Steam and starting Skin Game.

Raising Steam had a very odd tone for a Discworld novel. I've seen a few reviews (in comments or reviews on like Amazon or whatnot, I haven't seen an actual PROFESSIONAL make the conclusion. I also read him saying, like two years ago, that he's doing better than he and his therapist thought and so far it's been physical, not mental problems) that it was because of his illness, but I read Raising Steam right after Dodger, and Dodger was great.

So Raising Steam had a weird feel, like a connective book.

I'm not sure if he's just running out of steam on Discworld (sorry for the pun), I mean he's 40 books in, or if he just felt this one needed out and didn't want to wrapper it in a specific character. It's technically a Moist book, but in the plot he's.....well, actually he's pretty much to the book what he in the plot. He's kinda in the middle of things, and doing the work, but the whole thing really isn't about him at all. He's more observer and facilitator than plot driver.

Making Money and Going Postal had him pushing the story, it being solely focused on him -- but this one scattered between people and places and Moist was more of a place to hang the story on than anything.

It's defintely unusual for a Discworld novel, and didn't grab me like Dodger did.

I can't decide if it's just a swing-and-a-miss, or something he wrote more as filler, or him experimenting with structure and it just not working to what I'm used to from him.

I mean, worth the money -- but it's ain't Night Watch or Hatful of Sky.

[murdoc]

The biggest problem I have with the Dresden books is that Butcher seems to be always a few years behind in the pop culture he references. It has always screamed to me of trying to be cool (the description of Thomas is the biggest culprit for me) but not actually knowing what cool is.

Parkour!

[Evildrider]

Dresden is always behind on pop culture references.  I don't think it's necessarily the author.

[Tmon]

Given his effect on electronics, I imagine that keeping up with his twitter and instagram feeds is a bitch.

[Johny Cee]

Got my library copy today and am just a bit in, but this is the first time I'm really noticing the sexism. It's way beyond awkward and into creepy. We're getting sexual comments in the middle of firefights and triage. 

If by sexism you mean "is constantly noticing the attractive females around him even in circumstances that you think he should be focused on something important" it's the combo of the winter mantle and the fact this character hasn't been laid in years, literally.  They made that rather blatant last book too...

I've finished it now and, yeah....no....

Compare the first third and the second half. The second half is what you're talking about. The first third, it's just creepy as fuck.

Dresden has been pretty creepy for a while.  Every new attractive female character still throws herself at Dresden, too.  I think Ingmar pointed out the troublesome depiction of female characters and Dresden's oggling of them in discussion around the time the last book was released.  I've decided its less "Jim Butcher has some weird views of women" and more that he is trying to write classice hard-boiled detective fiction femme fatale back and forth and is just not very good at.

The sex scene was kind of ehhhhh, and I had flashbacks to when the Anita Blake series went from kind of fun actiony UF to supernatural porn.


Just finished River of Stars, by Guy Gavriel Kay.  It's a loose sequel to Under Heaven with the same setting but a couple hundred years later.  Really, really good.  Alternate world ancient China, with a couple of supernatural/magical realism flourishes.  Kay is just an amazing author, and really people should check his stuff out.  He got his start helping to edit The Silmarillion.

[Xilren's Twin]

Just finished River of Stars, by Guy Gavriel Kay.  It's a loose sequel to Under Heaven with the same setting but a couple hundred years later.  Really, really good.  Alternate world ancient China, with a couple of supernatural/magical realism flourishes.  Kay is just an amazing author, and really people should check his stuff out.  He got his start helping to edit The Silmarillion.

Yes that was an enjoyable book, though it did remind me too much of that thinly veiled propaganda piece that was the movie Hero.  I know the story was inspired by actual evens in China, but i think i would have preferred a different ending...

[NowhereMan]

So Raising Steam had a weird feel, like a connective book.

I wasn't fully gone on Raising Steam either but I feel this is pretty much what's going on with it. Pratchett's made Discworld a pretty vibrant literary world and like you said it's been going a long time. I think he's trying to actually shake up the status quo and change what Discworld is about, he's bringing in the Industrial Revolution and possibly creating the opportunity to tell different kinds of stories. It's definitely understandable considering how long he's been writing in the same world and it's definitely brave if that's what he's doing but I think this really was aimed at some developmental world building and the story suffered. Some of the jokes were kind of underwhelming too, although after reading a health dose of Brandon Sanderson I can't complain about Pratchett's joking too much.

[Ironwood]

He's been doing that for a while.  The Discworld has been slowly going steampunk since Hex and now it's just ramped up the pace of it.

I'm still not sure I like it much, but I do find the characters to be more compelling.

[Morat20]

He's been doing that for a while.  The Discworld has been slowly going steampunk since Hex and now it's just ramped up the pace of it.

I'm still not sure I like it much, but I do find the characters to be more compelling.

I  find the right-under-the-surface "If I didn't like it, it must be his disease" annoying. I'm sure he finds it MORE annoying. Dodger was pretty fantastic, though. Although the real problem there is having used Victorian London (and Robert Peel, for that matter) as templates for some of the Discworld, there's a bit of a "I know that guy" at times.

[Ironwood]

I  find the right-under-the-surface "If I didn't like it, it must be his disease" annoying.

What ?

[NowhereMan]

I guess he means the constant suspicion that when one of his jokes falls flat or a character seems very two-dimensional, you're wondering if it's just writing that's not clicking for you or if Alzheimer's is taking it's toll. The fact that it seems to have coincided with a change in direction and tone of the Discworld novels is also a big corellation/causation thing. As in it's probably just correlation but we're hardwired to put two seemingly connected facts as causally related even if we know they're probably not.

Edit: More on topic - Black Library has apparently released the Night Lords Omnibus for an actual reasonable price as an ebook (rather than costing slightly more than all 3 physical books separately). This sign of the apocalypse is pretty welcome as it's one of the few examples of well written 40K, apparently enjoyable even to people who barely know what the hell any of it's about. Basic story line - We follow our 'heroes' members of the Night Lords, a chapter of Chaos Space Marines whose defining attribute is being recruited from the criminal scum of their old home world, trained and organised by their Primarch who was basically psychotic Batman, and spend all their time bickering, infighting and betraying each other the moment it gives them any sort of advantage or material reward. It also features characters with actually distinct personalities and half believable dialogue.

It features such great moments as

[Maven]

The Shallows: How The Internet Is Changing Our Brain by Nicolas Carr. The fact it was a finalist for the Pulitzer Prize helped make the purchase, and it's a pretty fantastic look at neuroscience and how just completely fucked we are as a species thanks to the Internet.

I may have added that last part.

[Morat20]

I  find the right-under-the-surface "If I didn't like it, it must be his disease" annoying.

What ?

NowhereMan got basically what I meant.

Nobody here is doing it, but scanning reviews around it almost always comes up in comments.

[Ironwood]

Well, people saying that need to die in a car fire.

I'm reading The Long War because the wife got it for me (wasn't that impressed with The Long Earth).  It's ... the same.

[NowhereMan]

Just started reading Embassytown by China Mielville. It's still very early into it and I'm definitely not enjoying it as much as his Bas-Lag books but that might just be that he hasn't had enough time to really get the world building done so far.

Also read Sanderson's Alloy of Law, the Steampunk/western type fantasy novel. His dialogue has definitely improved from the earlier novels, I don't know if he's improved or his editors have finally got him to tone down the cringe inducing puns. And I say this as someone who pretty much loves making those exact same kind of puns and even enjoy hearing them in real life. What can be funny/clever in real life spontaneity does not translate well to planned and written out dialogue which he seems to be learning. The pacing of the ending was somewhat better handled as well, as awesome as it can be to have plot twist after plot twist with everything being tied up in the last hundred pages or so this felt a bit more balanced in terms of a conclusion so the middle didn't drag so much.