Return of the Book Thread

[Ironwood]

Getting a literature degree ruined most books, TV shows and movies for me.  True story.

As some of you are aware, I'm not allowed to talk while the wife is enjoying a show because endings and arcs are always painfully obvious to me.

I guess that's why Moffat offends me so.

[Phildo]

That's true with most things.  The more you know about the, the less magical they become.  I get the same way with lots of music, although I'm better at turning it off now than I used to be.

[HaemishM]

My wife sometimes gives me the stinkeye when we watch shows for that very reason. I often like examining where a show is going to go from a narrative science standpoint, and she's just like "SHUT UP, I LIKE THIS MOVIE!" as if examining something critically means I don't like something as well. For instance, she loves "This is 40" and I thought it was a terribad story that was strung together with chewing gum - but I thought there were some funny bits in it, enough that I didn't hate it. It just wasn't a good movie, story or set of characters by any stretch of the imagination.

[lamaros]

as if examining something critically means I don't like something as well

Story of my life.

[Morat20]

You've never met any authors have you?

English teachers err in they they often just repeat the rote 'meaning' in books that their education system provides them, which is truly awful when students are fully engaged and wanting/thinking more, but they don't err is saying that many authors spend a lot of time and effort to put stuff in there more than the surface-fucking-obvious.

More so than that, authors often have their own issues. (We all do, you know). And frankly any work of writing that the author did that he put any effort into whatsoever is going to have some of the author's issues, fascinations, etc embedded into it.

Authors write about the shit that interests them, the ideas that interest them, and their characters and plots often involve issues they wrestle with on one level or another.

That doesn't mean all literary criticism is valid, but a good work of writing generally has a lot of intentional subtext and not a little projection. Hell, I can't remember the trope (Author Anvil maybe) -- but bad writers are often REALLY obvious with their personal demons and hobby-horses on the page. (Goodkind's objectivism, for instance. Piers Anthony's burgeoning pedophilia, for instance). The good writers make it subtext, hard to spot.

But in the end: The shit you wrestle with as a person? Whether as a hobby or interest, or a personal demon -- it's gonna be all over what you write.

But it's only one part of assessing a work. I mean, shit -- knowing a given author was paid by the word is about as important. I mean, sure, Victor Hugo might have REALLY been interested in Waterloo, but he really spent like 40 pages on it in Les Mis because he was paid by the word not because he gave any fucks about Waterloo.

[Cyrrex]

That's an extremely good, and I think accurate, point.  The problem is that it probably takes a psychology degree to fairly decipher any of that sort of thing fairly, and even then sometimes the curtains are just blue for no reason at all.  I am pretty sure none of my English teachers were qualified. 

[Ingmar]

Your English teachers didn't need to be qualified to analyze that stuff, just to teach other people's analysis, which is likely what they were doing.

[Chimpy]

The sequel to Sanderson's Way of Kings is out now, hopefully I'll be reading that in the next week or so.

Uhm, Amazon is saying March 4th release date.

But, my library did let me put a hold on the book which is listed as "On Order"

Interestingly enough, the library sent me an email on Wednesday saying my hold was available for this. I picked it up yesterday afternoon and just finished it (all 1080 pages).

I think it was better than the first book, though it did have some low points. Of course, the first book had to spend a lot more time describing what the world was like.

I would rate it as one of Sanderson's better works.

[Ironwood]

Anyone reading Sand ?

[Shannow]

Anyone reading Sand ?

I wondered if you were talking about Howey writing a new book in the Wool series. Bizarrely this book is by Howey but not set in the Wool world. (mindblown)

[Ironwood]

Yes, that's the book I was referring to.  Wondering if it's any cop.

[Cyrrex]

I am currently reading Adrian's Undead Diary.  I stumbled across it when looking for some good post-apocalyptic reading (I have a thing for this lately).  The author seems to have a cult following of some kind, which has probably severely inflated the ratings he gets on places like Amazon and the like.  The writing itself is available for free on his own website, or you can opt to purchase them for a somewhat improved e-book experience (no idea if they are available in paper form, but probably).

Anyway, I can't put that shit down.  It reads in an actual diary form (first person), and only breaks away from that occasionally and reluctantly in order to fill in some back story that the guy Adrian obviously wouldn't be able to fill in himself.  The basic gist is that this guy survives day zero, and the diary follows his exploits.  There is a shitload of just simple logistics and supply gathering content...I imagine it could bore the shit out of some people, because he gets into a crazy amount of detail sometimes, but I find it riveting for some reason.  Probably because it just feels real, somehow.  You get the feeling that the author has spent endless hours thinking about how such and event might play out.

The main dude, Adrian, is very much an Alpha Male type with a special forces background.  As such, there is a bunch of gun fetishism going on here, and the writing style is very...testosterone heavy.  It makes total sense in the context of the story, but if you can't stomach such things for very long, this won't be your thing.  Not surprisingly, he's also a bit of a misogynist in some ways, or at least I imagine some people would think so.  It isn't a blatant thing, as there are several rather strong female characters around him, but it will manifest itself in some of the things he says.

You can take a look at adriansundeaddiary.com for a taste.

[dd0029]

Just finished up Red Rising by Pierce Brown. While technically YA, it's definitely on the upper edge of that. This is a Spartacus infused cross between Hunger Games and a technological version of Percy Jackson with lots of comically enhanced violence. The back ground stands up slightly more than the Hunger Games world but still doesn't fare well if you look too far behind the curtain. It's a quick fun read. It opens strong, but does there's a section just a bit less than half the way through that descends to Harry Potter wandering in the woods terribleness. Fortunately that part comes to an end and the crazy ensues.

[Ironwood]

This Book Is Full of Spiders was vaguely amusing and fun.  Not exactly high art and if, like me, you didn't read the first one, it loses a certain something I would think.

But not bad.

[Rendakor]

Read the first one, it's much better.

[K9]

I recently finished Robert Gates' 'Duty'. I don't read many biographies but I thought this one was pretty good. The prose was excellent and it was a compelling and engaging read; Gates seems like a pretty interesting guy, although I guess anyone can polish up an autobiography in theory (Tony Blair's attempt being an example of how you can cock it up and produce an unreadable mess...). He seems quite ready to lay criticism on himself, and if nothing else it's an inside look at the Whitehouse from someone who could have a valid claim to being able to compare the capabilities and styles of Bush and Obama from first hand experience.

Now I'm reading Neuromancer, it's not as good as the hype suggests. I'm about 60% done, and while it's a fun read, and I can see ow it inspired 'The Matrix' it's not the greatest sci-fi read ever.

I'm also reading 'The Atoms of Language' by Mark Baker, although unless you have a perverse interest in Chomskyan language theory this probably isn't a book for you.

[shiznitz]

I read it many years ago but I just gave American Shaolin to my 11 year old son to see if he would like it.  It is well written, interesting if you have ever like watching kung fu movies and you learn cool stuff about traditional China as well.

[Morat20]

Now I'm reading Neuromancer, it's not as good as the hype suggests. I'm about 60% done, and while it's a fun read, and I can see ow it inspired 'The Matrix' it's not the greatest sci-fi read ever.

Lot of stuff of a 'certain age' tends to have problems. Once they get old enough, they're classics and so far from the mainstream that they can become fascinating again. (War of the Worlds, Frankenstein, etc). But there's a certain lengthy period where a defining genre work just feels...off. Because when it came out, it was the first (or close to it) and reshaped a genre. But then the stuff that came after it built on that, which means 20 years later you've got a ton of work in that genre that's had two decades of extra experience in that genre. So the original work can feel like a shallow derivative rather than a genre-maker.

Neuromancer is one of those,  in my mind. Too young to really be a 'classic' and the ideas it started have been explored unto death in a million related works, and pushed further and in different areas. (Mind uploading versus 'jacking in' and biotech that makes the cyberware look clunky, outmoded, and kind of dumb).

[K9]

I think you're absolutely right about that; although I'm happy enough to give it a pass in that regard. I think the thing I'm struggling with slightly is how little context there is for so much he talks about; I'm well read enough that I don't usually stress about unexplained details, trusting that I'll pick it up or puzzle it out as part of the story, or if all else fails I'll just make up an explanation for it. The net result is that the prose has a very vague and hazy feel; perhaps that's intentional, I can't be sure. It's not bad, it's just pushing my tolerance for this sort of thing.

I think the people smoking cigarettes on their space ships is the most dating thing in this book :p

[HaemishM]

Well, yes it's definitely dated. As for that vague and hazy feeling, that's as much Gibson's writing style as anything purposeful. Even in his latest stuff set in modern day, he's got that.

[dd0029]

Just read The Girl, the Gold Watch and Everything by John C. McDonald. I imagine that, had I read this when I was about 15, I would have been all over it. Now, however this is some creepy geek's fantasy. A book from the '60s about a geeky guy who inherits a watch that can stop time goes just about everywhere you'd expect it to. About the only thing missing is a skeezy Penthouse Forum opening.

[Cyrrex]

I believe there was a short run television show or miniseries based on that book many years back.  I remember seeing it and and thinking to my pre-pubescent self "I would totally just go around and touch girls' boobies all day!"

[Numtini]

There were two tv movies I think. Syndicated. I don't remember anything creepy though. It was like a young adult adventure/romance.

[Cyrrex]

Trust me, all the creepy was contained in the minds of the male populace who watched it.

[Ironwood]

Read the first one, it's much better.

This turned out not to be the case.

[Ironwood]

Just read The Girl, the Gold Watch and Everything by John C. McDonald. I imagine that, had I read this when I was about 15, I would have been all over it. Now, however this is some creepy geek's fantasy. A book from the '60s about a geeky guy who inherits a watch that can stop time goes just about everywhere you'd expect it to. About the only thing missing is a skeezy Penthouse Forum opening.

Isn't that just Clockstoppers ?  God, that movie was so funny.

[Rendakor]

Read the first one, it's much better.

This turned out not to be the case.

Really? I liked JDATE a lot, while Spiders was only decent.

[Khaldun]

Enjoying James Cambias' A Darkling Sea. About to start Weir's The Martian.

[shiznitz]

I am 35% through The Red Knight by Miles Cameron.  It will appeal to those that like stories about hard mercenaries.  The setting is a feudal world with a kind of nature magic.  It is written much like GRRM in that the book is organized by character perspective.  The humans are Christians and the "enemy" are Fae - but not cheezy Fae.  There are no elves or dwarves.  It also has bits of Arthurian mythology mixed in with some Black Company.

[Furiously]

I'm currently reading "Pacific Alamo" it's the story of the US forces and civilians suck on Wake Island on the days leading up to and after Dec. 7th.  It's totally depressing. Followed by amazing heroics. Followed by totally depressing.

I'm also reading my son "The Big E" it follows the carrier Enterprise. My seven-year-old is loving every moment of it. It's much less depressing.

[NowhereMan]

Currently just discovered Brandon Sanderson, not having read WoT I've only just discovered him and am starting with the Stormlight Archives. I enjoyed the first one (Way of Kings) so much I've bought the second and the first two of the Mistborn series as well. The man is apparently a writing machine, which will make a nice change from some of the other authors I've followed (I'm looking at you GRRM and Scott Lynch). If you like well written Epic Fantasy the Stormlight Archives seem to be set up pretty well, it's slated for a 10 book series but I've found the first one and first 1/3 of the second to be easily worth reading even if the pay off turns out to be lacking (though by all accounts the pay off is where he really shines).

On the other hand I've been re-reading Bakker's Second Apocalypse series. They're dragging a bit especially with some of the heavier philosophising parts (not because it's badly written but because it's exposition centred around first/second year philosophy and I've got my MA in that, it feels a lot like it's being pointed out with big neon lights in case the reader misses it). I love some of the ideas in his series though and am getting annoyed at the lengthy waits between books.

Finally got round to reading Abercrombie's Red Country too. A little less bleak than some of the other books, especially compared to Best Served Cold. Interesting further hints to the history of the world and coming very close to actually seeing the Old Empire do something other than be reverently mentioned.

[Reg]

I just finished Words of Radiance. It was awesome. It's not often that I finish an eleven hundred page book and it feels too short.

[Rasix]

The man is apparently a writing machine, which will make a nice change from some of the other authors I've followed (I'm looking at you GRRM and Scott Lynch). If you like well written Epic Fantasy the Stormlight Archives seem to be set up pretty well, it's slated for a 10 book series but I've found the first one and first 1/3 of the second to be easily worth reading even if the pay off turns out to be lacking (though by all accounts the pay off is where he really shines).

Stormlight is still going to take him eons to finish.  He is a writing machine, but the problem is he has like 20 projects going on at the same time.  I "liked" him on Facebook and in one post he detailed everything he's working on at the moment.  It's staggering.

I liked Way of Kings (Stormlight 1) better than Mistborn.  The only problem I really have with him is that he'll lose me for stretches in his books.  I'll have to put them down for a while and pick them up at a later date.  I'm not sure if it's just boring or stretches in his books that lose focus. This happened with all 3 of his Mistborn novels and with Stormlight as well.  Didn't happen with his WoT work, probably since the structure was already there for him. 

[dd0029]

I like Sanderson, but he can't end his series to save his life. I thought Mistborn had a crummy ending. His wrap up to the Wheel of Time was mostly an interminable slog, especially when compared to his first two outings in the series.

[Malakili]

I like Sanderson, but he can't end his series to save his life. I thought Mistborn had a crummy ending. His wrap up to the Wheel of Time was mostly an interminable slog, especially when compared to his first two outings in the series.

The last book of WoT was going to be somewhat of a mess no matter who wrote it.  The serious was long and winding and bringing it all together was undoubtedly a hell of a task.

But then, this is one of the reasons I've shied away from "epic" fantasy and sci fi lately.  There is a part of me that still loves it, but I'm a lot happier with nice, well written one-off stories.