Battlestar Galactica (spoilers/speculation)

[Merusk]

Given the references to a singular God, the nomadic nature of the fleet and the persecution from people trying to keep them out of their homeland, BSG always aligned closest to Judaism to me.  12 tribes with a lost 13th, and all.

-ed:  Now I'm forgetting how many tribes Israelis had and if the 13th was a fictional reference or what. Wikipedia is telling me only 10 tribes, so wtf man, I forget where I'd heard 13 before.

[Furiously]

How many people do you see at the table? And where is the chalice?

[MournelitheCalix]

Given the references to a singular God, the nomadic nature of the fleet and the persecution from people trying to keep them out of their homeland, BSG always aligned closest to Judaism to me.  12 tribes with a lost 13th, and all.

-ed:  Now I'm forgetting how many tribes Israelis had and if the 13th was a fictional reference or what. Wikipedia is telling me only 10 tribes, so wtf man, I forget where I'd heard 13 before.

disciples of Christ would be my guess

[Riggswolfe]

Given the references to a singular God, the nomadic nature of the fleet and the persecution from people trying to keep them out of their homeland, BSG always aligned closest to Judaism to me.  12 tribes with a lost 13th, and all.

-ed:  Now I'm forgetting how many tribes Israelis had and if the 13th was a fictional reference or what. Wikipedia is telling me only 10 tribes, so wtf man, I forget where I'd heard 13 before.

My understanding is it actually has more in common with the mormons. http://www.michaellorenzen.com/galactica.html

[Abagadro]

Ya, I was posting that Glen Larsen stole it all from the Mormons but I got the "RED WARNING OF LIKELY POST IRRELEVANCE"

[Furiously]

There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. They may have been the architects of the great pyramids, or the lost civilizations of Lemuria or Atlantis. Some believe that there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive somewhere beyond the heavens...

[HaemishM]

What is interesting about the missing models is that the existing Cylons seem to know next to nothing about them.  They also made reference to "the one who programmed us", who I'd assume they equate to the Cylon God, although they didn't make that clear.  It makes me wonder though, what sort of relationship they have with their creator?  Enough of one to know there are 12 models (to coincide with the 12 colonies somehow, I'm sure), but not enough to have met them.  More confusing is the age involved here.  The 'human' Cylons are only a few years old. 

I think the fact that there are 12 colonies and the 13th is the mysterious missing one and 12 Cylon models has everything to do with each other. There's a lot of significant numbers thrown about in the show, and I think they all mean something.

I'm going to guess that the original 12 Cylon models were all caretakers on deep freeze colony ships from the original 13th. Or that the lost 5 were Cylon android caretakers, while the other 7 were humans who have been reincarnated (like Kara).

[Jayce]

I'll echo the sentiment that the final five won't be people we know.  Or at least I hope they won't.  We've seen that twist enough times.

All I know is that the outcome, the big secret, of this series will either be really cool and deep, or ridiculous.  With all this buildup, it pretty much has to be.

On another note, there were rumors going around a few weeks ago that the network was not sure whether they were going to renew the series after this season. Has anyone heard anything else about that?  Looking around the net, it looks like it was really just some exec being unclear, but I hadn't heard for sure that they renewed it.

[Lantyssa]

I think Cally is one.  :-D

I have suspicions about one more but am less sure.  The other three I think are unknown or more minor characters.

[Tannhauser]

We know at least one of the 5.  Xena/#3 recognized and apologized to her.

Thanks Lum for that extra insight, that reinforces my theory on the whole thing.

You have two 'whisperers' Head Baltar and Head Six both steering humanity and cylons to Earth.  Who convinced the cylons not to wipe out the humans on New Caprica?  Caprica Six.  She and Boomer changed the Cylons from genocide to 'getting to Earth first'.  Why the change?  Because Head Baltar convinced her!

Of course we have Head Six telling Baltar to get to Earth also.  So god is indeed guiding the cylons to being more humane and  Count Iblis(?) is guiding those pagan humans to go spoil paradise with their fighting and confusion and conflict. 

So when both get to Earth, about the same time, THAT will be the convergence and both races will merge and live in peace.

Eventually they will form 12 tribes and go back into the universe.

'This has all happened before.'

Or maybe I'm just drunk...

[Ironwood]

You're drunk.


And Cally is not a cylon.

[Lantyssa]

Wanna cookie bet?

[Furiously]

Is it a Kitten Love Cookie?

[Ironwood]

Wanna cookie bet?

Sure.  Because, you know, she had a kid.  And that totally, totally, totally fucks the uniqueness and importance of Hera.

Cally is not a cylon.

[Lantyssa]

Or it reinforces the integration of species and the need for love to have a child.  Tyrol is one of the few people who could look at toaster and love them anyways.  By not focusing on that aspect right now Hera remains a plot point of importance.

[Furiously]

She did shot Sharon however. Which set her free again....

[Lantyssa]

She was mad Tyrol was fraternizing with a different model.

[Furiously]

You know who would be great to be a cylon...Starbuck's husband. The irony would be DELICIOUS.

[Lantyssa]

Sam "the Percolator" Anders.

[Jayce]

update:  officially renewed!

http://community.tvguide.com/thread.jspa?threadID=800008633

[Roac]

Only for 13 shows?  That's not good.

[Riggswolfe]

Only for 13 shows?  That's not good.

That depends. If season four is going to be split into two parts like season 2 was they may be speaking only of 4.0.

[Triforcer]

You know who would be great to be a cylon...Starbuck's husband. The irony would be DELICIOUS.

Carl Agathon would be even more ironic.  HERA ISN'T SPECIAL AFTER ALL!

[Yegolev]

I bet Boxey is a Cylon.

[tazelbain]

He's the Cylon God.

[Tannhauser]

Good news on the renewal.  Reminds me of praying for another season of B5.  :-D

[Rasix]

This latest episode was pretty crappy.  Only decent part was the Six/Invsi-Baltar freakout session.

Now, this wasn't as bad as last year's noir EP.  But I'm just hoping we haven't hit the "gimmicky sci-fi shit" section of the season.  This one was "racism is bad!"; perhaps the next one will be "proper dental hygiene or humanity is doomed!". 

Gyah. As they say in the Monty Python's Holy Grail dvd: GET ON WITH IT.

[Yegolev]

We have spotted a pattern where "good" or "main plot" episodes are broken up by "soap opera" episodes and the occasional sci-fi social commentary.  Objectively speaking, these are usually not bad episodes when considering All TV Ever Aired, but they get in the way of me seeing some very fine and main-plot-related episodes, and their status as filler is noted.

Every time some sort of relationship episode comes around, particularly Lee-Dee-Kara-Sam shit, I sit there and wonder "What's this got to do with the Cylon threat?" but of course I keep watching because you never know when one of those fuckers will show up with an explosive or a basestar will jump in.  OK, most of the time I know it will be in a "real" episode but I watch anyway, hoping.

[Stormwaltz]

Reminds me of praying for another season of B5.  :-D

http://www.babylon5scripts.com/TLT-JMS-Photos.html

Given the quality of the previous movies, however, I have little hope.

[Jayce]

We have spotted a pattern where "good" or "main plot" episodes are broken up by "soap opera" episodes and the occasional sci-fi social commentary.  Objectively speaking, these are usually not bad episodes when considering All TV Ever Aired, but they get in the way of me seeing some very fine and main-plot-related episodes, and their status as filler is noted.

I guess this is a matter of opinion, because I in fact like the soap-opera episodes.  It grates on me when the heroes save the world (metaphorically) every episode, because it leaves no time for character development.

I liked the last episode, but I didn't see "racism is TEH BAD" as the main point of the show.  I thought it was more about Helo and how his convictions are the most important thing to him, even when it seems, simply from luck of the draw, to always land him on the "wrong" or less popular side.  And him questioning whether it is just luck of the draw or whether he intentionally sets himself up for it.

I do wish they'd do something more interesting with Kara/Lee/et al.  That storyline seems to have found itself with nowhere interesting left to go.

[tazelbain]

I do wish they'd do something more interesting with Kara/Lee/et al.  That storyline seems to have found itself with nowhere interesting left to go.

Throwing them out the air-lock is the only interesting thing they can do with them.

[Johny Cee]

We have spotted a pattern where "good" or "main plot" episodes are broken up by "soap opera" episodes and the occasional sci-fi social commentary.  Objectively speaking, these are usually not bad episodes when considering All TV Ever Aired, but they get in the way of me seeing some very fine and main-plot-related episodes, and their status as filler is noted.

I guess this is a matter of opinion, because I in fact like the soap-opera episodes.  It grates on me when the heroes save the world (metaphorically) every episode, because it leaves no time for character development.

I liked the last episode, but I didn't see "racism is TEH BAD" as the main point of the show.  I thought it was more about Helo and how his convictions are the most important thing to him, even when it seems, simply from luck of the draw, to always land him on the "wrong" or less popular side.  And him questioning whether it is just luck of the draw or whether he intentionally sets himself up for it.

I liked the episode as well.  Really served to flesh out Helo's character and motivation.  He's in big danger of slipping off into token Sharon's husband/Hera's father territory.


Dresden before it really isn't too bad, either.  The first episode was meh,  but the last two have been stronger.  It interferes with Rome,  but Rome is repeated at least a dozen times during the week since it is HBO.

[Yegolev]

I do wish they'd do something more interesting with Kara/Lee/et al.  That storyline seems to have found itself with nowhere interesting left to go.

Throwing them out the air-lock is the only interesting thing they can do with them.

I agree, that shit needs to be broken up.  Just don't put Jaime Bamber in a fat suit again.

[Roac]

I liked the Helo ep. just ok.  I did like how they were fleshing out the character, and the position he was in.  It was also nice to see some more dynamics between the colonial groups, since the present government is still young and there is a lot of background strife between the colonies they haven't jumped much into. 

However, the pacing felt too slow.  Shooting up some Cylons may be cheap and unintelligent, but it does help to move the show along.  Or show more stuff with Caprica Six and Head-Baltar.  We've only seen that pair face off a couple times now, and I'd like to see how that's going.  I'd really like to see real Baltar and Caprica Six talk about their head pals to each other.  Just anything really - that show could have used at least one other plot line running through it, because the evil racist doctor bit was good but not enough to carry a whole show.

[tazelbain]

Evil Doctor bit was too spontaneous. If they had built up the key element in earlier episode it would felt better. As it is, it felt like the entire situation pulled out of the air.  Why are there refuges anyway? The entire damn fleet is refugees.