Cracks starting to show?

[Rasix]

I have to confess that if Blizzard opened an old people's server (like 30+), I'd probably resub.  I'd even pay $5 more a month. 

Yah, I'd pay extra for that.  Then the assholes would just be mostly political trolls, and you'd skip a lot of the plain gross immaturity.

Hey, when you joined my guild we had an entire group and all us were over 30.   It was nice when we could field 4 out of 5 people in a group and just ignore the random idiot DPSer.

[Sjofn]

Slap in the Face always felt "old," even though I was only 26? I think? when WoW came out (  ). We actually do have some younger people in the guild now (college age-ish) but our relentless old person crabbiness seems to rub off on them for the most part.

[SurfD]

<Get off my Lawn> Now recruiting.  PST with your location when Kennedy was shot for possible invite.

[Furiously]

Could we settle with when the challenger blew up?

[Sjofn]

You know, I was totally thinking to myself that the Challenger is probably a better metric at this point. zomg twinz

[Khaldun]

What I find fascinating is that even the kiddies hate being around the kiddies. In the DCUO chat the other day, some guy started doing Barrens chat classics of various kinds like "Hey, it's MLK Day, that means I'm supposed to like n***ers" and so on. And then twenty minutes later, he suddenly says, "I wish they'd make a server for mature people, I'm so tired of all this kiddie crap on chat channels".     I see that all the time on WoW trade chat too: the worst offenders themselves want to be in an environment where it's not cool to be an asshole on trade chat, and think that the way to get there is to find a server where there's lots of grown-ups.

[Lantyssa]

Could we settle with when the challenger blew up?

In class, watching it on TV... yeah.

[Oban]

Haha!

We had the day off due to snow.

[Soulflame]

I was in class... freshman at college.

[Xanthippe]

I wish Blizzard would try something like this - League of Legends is introducing The Tribunal where players evaluate cases of bad behavior.

While I understand the potential for griefing, I really don't see how it would be worse than the current situation, given the proper constraints.

(In the Sierras, a cross-country skiing vacation; in first grade - I suspect basing a guild on the Kennedy assassination timeline would result in perhaps 20 members across all servers. I'd sure love being in a bg with just other old folks though.)

[Soulflame]

Yes, I'm sure a tribunal hosted by the trade chat trolls wouldn't be abused.  At all.

[Ingmar]

Yeah that sounds quite significantly worse than the way things are now, to me.

[Threash]

Yeah i don't know why anyone would ever think that is a good idea.

[Sjofn]

I was home from school (2nd grade, I believe) but I have no recollection why. I think I was sick, but not 100% sure on that. I also don't know why my mother didn't call me in to watch it lift off, because we usually watched launches together when we could. I'm sort of glad she didn't, though. She came running in to tell me about it right after, and we watched replays over and over and over.

As for trade, I wish it would just get nuked from orbit. I have to settle for just turning it off immediately on every character I make.

[kildorn]

Man, I have the personality to handle being a Trade Chat Judge! It will be a reign of peace and prosperity. Right after the summary executions.

[Paelos]

Could we settle with when the challenger blew up?

I was four and a half, and my parents were packing up our stuff to move to Dallas.

[ghost]

When the challenger blew I up think I was in sixth grade.  I was at home watching it because my mom (who was a teacher) had stayed home sick so I stayed home too.  Creepy stuff. 

[Xanthippe]

Yes, I'm sure a tribunal hosted by the trade chat trolls wouldn't be abused.  At all.

Sure, if there were no restrictions upon who the judges were.

I assume that not everybody would be given the opportunity to be a tribunal judge.  I also assume that there would be more than one judge - perhaps a score or more - per case, so that the cases would be decided in aggregate by the judges, which would be reviewed by GMs.  I also assume that there would be a reputation system in place for such a thing to even be considered.

Under those conditions, I fail to see how it would be worse than the current situation.  I could be wrong about this, but I think you're being too reflexive.

[ghost]

That system could work if it wasn't a free-for-all, which means not getting Barrens Chat trolls involved.  If Blizzard could choose unbiased folks to run it the process could work.  Of course finding unbiased people could be troublesome...

[Furiously]

Could we settle with when the challenger blew up?

In class, watching it on TV... yeah.

Me too - our entire 8th grade science class and another class joined in watching it. I still remember looking at the teacher and seeing her expression go from, "What just happened.." to "OMG, I just showed a snuff film to my kids."

[Ashamanchill]

I was two! Well, actually, two and a half.

And I approve of this tribunal system, both in LoL, and WoW. Both games are VERY socially reliant, to the point where one dick (or even not a dick, but a 'newb') can wreck the game experience for the rest of the group members. I'm not sure it's a smart business idea, for either game, but it's something I personally would like to see implemented. Too often (again, bot in LoL, and WoW) someone has been a total asshole, and I have thought 'Man I can't wait until that person gets their just desserts......Oh wait, that doesn't happen.' The frustration and bitterness that results from that has bascially led me to resume playing one player games for the first time in about 3 years.

[Setanta]

Could we settle with when the challenger blew up?

In class, watching it on TV... yeah.

Me too - our entire 8th grade science class and another class joined in watching it. I still remember looking at the teacher and seeing her expression go from, "What just happened.." to "OMG, I just showed a snuff film to my kids."

I was in Year 11 - about all I can remember now is being horrified and that it only took 4 hours for the NASA=Need Another Seven Astronauts joke to do the rounds (This is pre-internet Australia).

[Oban]

I am certain that hearing the joke about Christa McAuliffe's dandruff is what turned me to a life of dark humour.

How did NASA know that Christa McAuliffe had dandruff?

As for Tribunals, Blizzard could call the volunteers Counselors.  What could go wrong?

[Azazel]

I was in Year 11 - about all I can remember now is being horrified and that it only took 4 hours for the NASA=Need Another Seven Astronauts joke to do the rounds (This is pre-internet Australia).

I was in High school as well. And I also remember hearing that joke on the day.

[Xanthippe]

(Aside: I recall that the Challenger disaster spawned jokes almost immediately - I heard the first one at work back at work on Monday or Tuesday.  I don't think I've ever heard a joke about 9/11.)

It's becoming more difficult to attempt pug heroics.  Are tanks and healers no longer queuing? 

The people who love that heroics are hard cannot be the same population of those typically using the LFD tool.

It seems to me that a lot of people are playing alts.  I had a 15 minute queue on my little worgen rogue (25ish) for dungeons yesterday, while regular 85 dungeons were ~30, and heroics were ~45.

BG queues are almost instant, no matter the level (as long as one picks random bg).

Oh, and another crack.  The Isle bg boss is practically unkillable now for level 80-84 bg.  When he jumps, everyone dies.  The only way to win that bg is by attrition.  Taking the workshop and using demos to kill players is very effective.  Trying to explain this to alliance is like whistling in the wind, as usual.

[El Gallo]

It would be better if they had more 85 non-heroic dungeons and more non-heroic gear progression.  People who want to play via the random dungeon feature, or people who just don't freaking feel like not standing in fire in 5-mans, should be fine with regular dungeons.  Problem is that half of the Cata dungeons are wasted on pre-85 levelling.  With the quest rewards, you end up maxing out on non-heroic progression after a very few regular dungeon runs.

If all the dungeons were 85, all had loot better than quest rewards, and perhaps all had some more reasonable way to get justice points, then I think there'd be less pressure to do heroice.

[Paelos]

(Aside: I recall that the Challenger disaster spawned jokes almost immediately - I heard the first one at work back at work on Monday or Tuesday.  I don't think I've ever heard a joke about 9/11.)

It's becoming more difficult to attempt pug heroics.  Are tanks and healers no longer queuing?  

The people who love that heroics are hard cannot be the same population of those typically using the LFD tool.

Yes, tanks are healers have stopped queuing. There is nothing they need now from JP because they got it all through having instant queues, so they only do them for the VP random, and only then with groups they hand pick. I think I pugged one person when I did a regular this weekend for a friend, and that was to pull in a healer. As far as the people saying they love harder heroics, they are always going to be the people who blow through them the fastest and never see them again. That's why you don't listen to them when you designing your non-raid content.

[amiable]

(Aside: I recall that the Challenger disaster spawned jokes almost immediately - I heard the first one at work back at work on Monday or Tuesday.  I don't think I've ever heard a joke about 9/11.)

It's becoming more difficult to attempt pug heroics.  Are tanks and healers no longer queuing?  

The people who love that heroics are hard cannot be the same population of those typically using the LFD tool.

Yes, tanks are healers have stopped queuing. There is nothing they need now from JP because they got it all through having instant queues, so they only do them for the VP random, and only then with groups they hand pick. I think I pugged one person when I did a regular this weekend for a friend, and that was to pull in a healer. As far as the people saying they love harder heroics, they are always going to be the people who blow through them the fastest and never see them again. That's why you don't listen to them when you designing your non-raid content.

As a healer (85 pally) let me give you my take.  I re-upped because my wife wanted to and I heard they "fixed" the pvp aspect of the game and that my favorite archetype (the healer) was terrific.

To say I feel mislead is a bit of an understatement.  PvP is non-stop crowd control fest where I enjoy most arena's and Bg's from the form of a sheep, frozen block, or running around screaming in fear.  Solo PvP as a healer is worse than solo PvP as a tank,  because my damage output is so anemic that practically every dps class can outheal it using the myriad of "self-heal" abilities that Blizzard saw fit to put in the game.  Alternatively I am stunned, silenced, cc'd to the point where I can only take instant actions.  Effectively Arena matches turn into pillar humping fests where I have to desperately avoid cc while I throw an occasional heal to my partner.  Fun times.

PvE is worse.  I only queue with my wife (who plays a mage and is having an awesome time in PvE and PvP), and folks have tried to kick my from more than half a dozen groups.  In all of these cases I feel confident in saying that the fault for the poor performance was entirely the fault of crappy DPS who couldn't be bothered to learn rudimentary mechanics like "do not stand in the fire."   I know that probably sounded a bit arrogant, but being that i have played a helare in MMo's for almost a decade now, I think I am pretty familiar with the mechanics.   Unless I am incredibly lucky every dungeon run turns knots in my stomach as I try (often in vain) to keep the party up while simultaneously trying to manage my mana bar (and as a pally I have the easiest time doing this of any of the healing classes).

I pretty much just gave up random queing, I am waiting for a few rl friends to level up so we can run the 85 instances together.  Occasionally I have  a moment of madness where I queue random heroics with my wife (who butters me up because she wants the 5 minute queue with me instead of the 50 minute queue without).

Meanwhile I am leveling a dps class and having a grand time in PvP and PvE.  I think I am going to stick with this and let someone else deal with the headache.  I imagine I am not alone in this reasoning.  

[Merusk]

Rather than bitch about it anymore I just unsubbed.  It's so unfun I don't even want to bother finding a raid group that works on EST instead of PST where I'm going to bed at 1am.

[Hawkbit]

Rather than bitch about it anymore I just unsubbed.  It's so unfun I don't even want to bother finding a raid group that works on EST instead of PST where I'm going to bed at 1am.

Same.  I had considered writing a lengthy post with all the reasons this is unfun, but I just realized that I don't really care to spend my time throwing words at a brick wall.  Maybe I was one of the 'bads', but at least in wrath I was having fun.  It is a shame, after six years of playing for it to end this way.  I have a weird feeling like I won't be back.  After that amount of time I've lost the hook.

[Minvaren]

I canceled my subscription yesterday.

My main hit max level last week - and I was enjoying grinding rep more than I was seeing the new content. I'm not going to RDF again, no desire to raid, and I can't bear the thought of leveling another alt.

...as a side note, did anyone notice the detailed questionnaire you fill out when unsubscribing now?  o_O

[Oban]

Yes, where it basically tells you to learn to play.

[Merusk]

Yes, where it basically tells you to learn to play.

Yeah I had a laugh at the choices for "It's not fun anymore."  Talk about not getting it.

[Nebu]

Yes, where it basically tells you to learn to play.

Yeah I had a laugh at the choices for "It's not fun anymore."  Talk about not getting it.

Did Tigole write the exit survey? 

[Paelos]

Yes, where it basically tells you to learn to play.

Yeah I had a laugh at the choices for "It's not fun anymore."  Talk about not getting it.

Is there a link? Can you give us an idea of what the survey was like?