Rift: Planes of Telara

[Segoris]

Cleric dps is fine.

While I wouldn't call it fine, its' actually not bad. The issue is that it is just not good when compared to sabos and champs, but that changes next patch as sabo and bm get neutered

[Draegan]

As I just said in the rift thread but will expand upon here, I do not believe trion has any intention of going outside standard class roles. Warriors tank, mages nuke, clerics heal and rogues dps. They may let you go a little outside your role but just enough to tease, now get your ass back to your proper spec. I think it's the fact they won' address the exposure debuff at all that bothers me. It's clear this one debuff is wildly unpopular and a huge cockblock to doing simple things like running or even grouping up mobs but they seem to be doggedly sticking with it. This speaks to me of having a firm 'vision' for what they want their game to be, fun be damned.

Rogue tanks are the best tank for Greenscale right now.  Warriors are the best dps.  Mages are the best healers.  Clerics.. well they need some help.

Bards suck by the way.  Not in their useless Healing output.  (Useless because it tops everyone off before Chloromancer's Living Veil ticks so you see really large overall numbers) Bards suck because all you do is recast the same 5 motifs over and over and press cadence.

During Greenscale I played the Bard bitch in the raid.  All I did was run around, avoiding ground effects, casting Verse of Joy every 2 minutes.  And refreshing 5 motifs every 30 seconds.

In between I cast cadence over and over.

There is no feedback in the class to show you you're doing good.

Yay i see a bunch of green heal numbers.  Not that they actually move people's health bars.  My healing is just faster to top off someone who takes 500 random damage.  It doesn't actually save anyone.  I don't have to organize or prioritize my healing.

At least mindless DPS classes have a rotation they have to adhere to and they get damage feedback.

It's a horribly designed soul.  Your dps is on par with a Warrior Tank.  Your gear doesn't mean shit.  Your spells can't miss.  Your abilities really don't scale at all.  It's not like you can get a brand new weapon and suddenly be badass.  You can play a Bard in level 30 greens and as long as you load up on endurance and have over 5k hps you're good to go.

Bards may bring stuff to groups, but they are boring as shit to play.  Then again maybe people like very simple gameplay and just watch the game.

[Threash]

They can still cover the most roles :).  Funny how the champion got severely nerfed with the actual soul hardly being touched at all.  Titan strike went from 5 to 3 seconds (which in reality means from 2.5 to 1.5) and the str talent went from 15% to 10% (it was already questionable whether str helped all that much anyways) but the changes to path of the wind not allowing a potw/rising waterfall rotation anymore  and the complete gutting of the bm soul will make a huge difference in their dps.  Really what people saw as champions (warriors with 2h) was a combination of the bm bleeds, which being dmg over time do more damage overall than regular abilities and the extremely good path of the wind/rising waterfall rotation from paragon being useable with a 2h.  Their massive burst in pvp was mostly a combination of all three souls no global cooldown abilities, i could bullrush someone and unleash bloodthirst, frenzied strike, flesh rip, backhanded blow, flinching strike and inescapable fury/turn the blade if you got unlucky all instantly with zero gcd, several of those even triggered rising waterfall, leading to a 3 point finisher before the bullrush stun wore off.  Now that shouldn't happen as much or as easily, i think.  Paragons got buffed out the ass though, just reading those changes it sounds op as all fuck.

[Draegan]

Screw Paragons.  More competition for my 1h'd weapons.  I got my 32.9 dps single handed axe already so I'm kinda happy.

[Nebu]

Draegan, I appreciate your views but wonder if you realize that some 90% of the people playing Rift will never experience the game in the way that you are.  I wonder if the developers realize this as well.  Most players will level to cap once, maybe twice, and struggle through the endgame dungeons with random people in the hope of improving their gear.  Organized elite dungeon runs and 20 person raids are pretty much the content meant for those with enough time and/or friends to ever experience them. 

[Draegan]

Draegan, I appreciate your views but wonder if you realize that some 90% of the people playing Rift will never experience the game in the way that you are.  I wonder if the developers realize this as well.  Most players will level to cap once, maybe twice, and struggle through the endgame dungeons with random people in the hope of improving their gear.  Organized elite dungeon runs and 20 person raids are pretty much the content meant for those with enough time and/or friends to ever experience them. 

Not sure what you're responding to.

[Sobelius]

[Not sure what you're responding to.

I think he's responding to all of your posts. I know I would love to see/play the game the way you do but just don't know how you manage to have the time unless playing RIFT is your full time job, or you are a home-spouse with a sugar-spouse. Color me envious.

[Venkman]

Nothing wrong with how anyone plays. The most successful of these games have the endgame players getting stuff only the masses could dream to get. But the dream is what keeps people trying.

Just as long as the game doesn't get designed around just one type of player. But usually none of them are, even if it feels otherwise sometimes :)

[Nebu]

Nothing wrong with how anyone plays. The most successful of these games have the endgame players getting stuff only the masses could dream to get. But the dream is what keeps people trying.

Just as long as the game doesn't get designed around just one type of player. But usually none of them are, even if it feels otherwise sometimes :)

   After all these years, you still get me. 

[Draegan]

I appreciate all types of players.  This is the first game in several years that I've actually raided on the edge with.  I've played casually from 5-6 hours a week to poopsock mode.

The beauty of this game is that outside Greenscale, you can PUG and play every single piece of content.  Can you do it on demand?  No, because it involves other players and there isn't a random dungeon finder yet.  That's essentially what the casual player is missing.

[Threash]

Saw a greenscale pug forming up on /50 chat earlier today.  Sure as hell wasn't gonna join in, but people are trying.

[Draegan]

You can probably do it if you over gear the instance.  But in order to do that EVERYONE needs to be hit capped and you need at least a core group of people on vent coordinating efforts. 

[Lakov_Sanite]

Does it explain anywhere hat hit cap is in rift?

[Modern Angel]

What is it, 50 hit to be capped for expert five mans, 100 to be hit capped for raids?

It's an increasing number, seemingly to allow them to fine tune their gear vis a vis new content. Presumably the cap would be 150 for a new tier of raids and you'd get to 150 naturally with drops.

[Threash]

I had 117 before setting foot in a 5 man so those numbers feel low.  I was told 200 for raids.

[Nija]

Hit cap? Really?

You guys sure as shit aren't in Azaroth anymore! 

[Modern Angel]

Hence why I thought that commercial was so fucking dumb.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Not gonna get back into ripping on rift, honest question here. Where in the game does it say what hit cap you need to hit raid bosses, or is it mmo voodoo to figure out?

[Nebu]

Not gonna get back into ripping on rift, honest question here. Where in the game does it say what hit cap you need to hit raid bosses, or is it mmo voodoo to figure out?

I think you have two options: wait for an answer from Draegan or brave the cesspool that is the Rift forum. 

[Draegan]

Well, you could read fansites.  You could search for posts from devs.

Or you notice your character missing a lot.  Wear more hit gear, miss less, then you get to the point where you stop missing.  It's a natural process of gearing up in any case as much of the Tier 2 (if not all of it) has some form of +hit on it.  So if you gear up properly through the games progression, you'll be hitcapped for Greenscale.

Of course if you try to go in early, like many people have done, you'll have to gear specifically for it targeting specific gear and enchants.

It's a standard DIKU stat, it's nothing new to the genre.  Hitroll has been in these games for decades.  If it surprises you, you're either very green and most likely not doing Greenscale right now or kinda ignorant. 

As for the numbers, you need 100 hit for T1, 150 hit for T2 and 200 hit for Raids (It's actually closer to 220 for bosses).

[kaid]

I appreciate all types of players.  This is the first game in several years that I've actually raided on the edge with.  I've played casually from 5-6 hours a week to poopsock mode.

The beauty of this game is that outside Greenscale, you can PUG and play every single piece of content.  Can you do it on demand?  No, because it involves other players and there isn't a random dungeon finder yet.  That's essentially what the casual player is missing.

Heck I don't even need a random dungeon finder I just want a solid looking for group tool. Hell even give me something like the eq1 old looking for group tool and putting dungeon runs/raids would be a snap. Right now many do not seem to even realize there is an LFG channel so they just shout in their level range public channel which is cumbersome and not really well situatated especially for dungeons that are sort of between level ranges.

[Draegan]

I hear you.  I'm fortunate to be in a guild where I don't have to really PUG.  The game is severely lacking a LFG tool.  I've brought it up many times.  I even asked Hartsman over a beer when I was out at San Fran.

Essentially the answer was, until we can do it perfectly (i.e. automated group created like WOW), they don't want to spend the dev hours on something that will eventually go by the wayside because they are planning on a dungeon finder.

It makes sense from a developer and manager point of view.  But from a player point of you it's pretty shitty.

[Venkman]

It's so funny how often a new MMO launches without players even realizing there's an LFG channel. With all the MMO players that bounce between games, you'd think it'd be standard. This is one of the most common complaints I've seen.

It's almost time that LFG tool becomes as standard as minimap, action bars, and go-here-for-foozle overlay/guidance.

[Modern Angel]

So they are planning a dungeon finder?

[Lakov_Sanite]

MMO Voodoo

Thanks.

[Threash]

Not gonna get back into ripping on rift, honest question here. Where in the game does it say what hit cap you need to hit raid bosses, or is it mmo voodoo to figure out?

The real answer is you wait for the top players to figure it out then you go read up on it.

[Draegan]

So they are planning a dungeon finder?

Yes.  First it will be server only.  If it doesn't work out well, they will possibly go multi-server.

MMO Voodoo

Thanks.

I'm beginning to think you've never played a single video game before.  That or you're retarded.

[Venkman]

Not gonna get back into ripping on rift, honest question here. Where in the game does it say what hit cap you need to hit raid bosses, or is it mmo voodoo to figure out?

The real answer is you wait for the top players to figure it out then you go read up on it.

This.

Which of course has been the case since the 80s.

Not sure why this comes up now.

[Sky]

Because it's dumb. "Let's hide the numbers so a small minority of hardcore players can figure everything out and then force everyone else to go read a fan site, rather than just document the shit ourselves."

You know why I love mmo threads? They remind me how awful mmo is.

[Rasix]

If you're too casual to find it out about the a hit cap, you probably don't need to worry about it.

It should be in the GUI. It probably will be at some point. MMOs often err on the side of not telling you nearly enough.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Hovering over your hit stat in wow now and it'll show a little pop up of what hit rating means. Te fact that we still have things like undocumented stats in mmo's is ridiculous, it's not like its very hard to program a tooltip.

[Sky]

If you're too casual to find it out about the a hit cap, you probably won't ever get to the cool parts of the game

[veredus]

Hovering over your hit stat in wow now and it'll show a little pop up of what hit rating means. Te fact that we still have things like undocumented stats in mmo's is ridiculous, it's not like its very hard to program a tooltip.

Hovering over your stats in Rift tells you what they do, including Hit. Speaking of Hit, handy tip, if you're a melee cleric Focus gives you Hit same as spell power does for attack power.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Does it tell you the hit cap or just "hit helps you hit monsters!"

[Draegan]

Does it tell you the hit cap or just "hit helps you hit monsters!"

You're the reason why there is an instruction sheet on the side of a box of pop tarts.