Marvel Universe (Thar be spoilers ahead.)

[eldaec]

Wouldn't it be fun if we didn't know Spiderman's secret ID?  That could tie into the Civil War where they want him to unmask and we in the audience want to know which version it is, Parker, Morales, etc. but Spidey refuses

For info, it is going to be Peter Parker.

Aside from that, yes, that certainly could be fun.

[sickrubik]

According to this Variety report, they haven't decided yet. But the current casting rumors certainly lean towards Parker.

[CmdrSlack]

I'm not interesting in a Sinister Six movie, but a Superior Foes? That'd be awesome.

Yes, this. Guardians proves that they can do funny with action.

[Evildrider]

[Maven]

Amazing.

[Merusk]

Spectacular.

[sickrubik]

Friendly Neighborhood.

Shit.

[taleril]

Clearly "Superior".  Get with the times. 

[Evildrider]

[HaemishM]

FUCK YOU, NO. 

[jgsugden]

I think an unknown actor really helps sell the Story of Peter Parker. I hope the guy they go with is an unknown.

[eldaec]

FUCK YOU, NO. 

Possibly worth it for all the right wing talk show host rage it would generate.

[Margalis]

Not revealing his identity is an interesting concept. How could it work though?

His life outside of being Spider-Man is a big part of the character. Would the movie just not have those parts? Or would it be some cheesy thing where his back is always turned? Or would it follow a bunch of people, any of who could be the lead? But then in that case would one of them be named Miles or Peter?

Here's a radical idea: make the main character of the story Mary Jane, or Gwen Stacy, or the Black Cat, or someone like that. Maybe not the "main" character exactly but the viewpoint character. Then at the end of the movie, or in a later movie, who Spider-Man is is revealed to them and to us.

Someone get Marvel on the phone!

[Evildrider]

[eldaec]

Not revealing his identity is an interesting concept. How could it work though?

His life outside of being Spider-Man is a big part of the character. Would the movie just not have those parts? Or would it be some cheesy thing where his back is always turned? Or would it follow a bunch of people, any of who could be the lead? But then in that case would one of them be named Miles or Peter?

Here's a radical idea: make the main character of the story Mary Jane, or Gwen Stacy, or the Black Cat, or someone like that. Maybe not the "main" character exactly but the viewpoint character. Then at the end of the movie, or in a later movie, who Spider-Man is is revealed to them and to us.

Someone get Marvel on the phone!

It would only work if they made Spiderman a significant character in CA3 and hid his identity in that - I don't see the slightest chance they'd do it in the actual Spiderman film. Making a film following another character is an interesting idea but far too much of a risk given how template driven the Disney side of this is, and awful the Sony team have been.

[Tannhauser]

Since he's just doing a cameo in CA3, I'd say the chances are good we won't see his face there.  Since they are doing a 'soft reboot' at Sony afterwards why not wait until then to reveal Morales, etc?  With a cameo, as Spider-Man, will they have time to introduce the character under the mask in CA3?

[Setanta]

I would absolutely love it if they brought Spidey into the fold... only to kill him off if the most such a way that he could never be ret-conned into a movie again.

I'd pay to see that. Twice :)

[Teleku]

The picture is funny, but I'm not getting the pun/joke (if there is one).

[Lantyssa]

They invited Spidey into the Avengers then made him the maid.  They're in line for him to wash all their iconic gear.  (That the Hulk's iconic gear is his purple pants is a humorous bonus.)

[jgsugden]

Since he's just doing a cameo in CA3, I'd say the chances are good we won't see his face there.  Since they are doing a 'soft reboot' at Sony afterwards why not wait until then to reveal Morales, etc?  With a cameo, as Spider-Man, will they have time to introduce the character under the mask in CA3?

How he'll be used is unknown.  It could be a cameo or it could be a larger role, but one that is mostly separate from the main action.  It does not begin filming until April.  There is time to rework Spidey into a substantial part of the film (hopefully more organically than Hawkeye was into Thor I).

[jgsugden]

Another interesting note I missed from last month: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=58384 Amongst other locations, Cap III will be filmed in:

[DraconianOne]

There is time to rework Spidey into a substantial part of the film (hopefully more organically than Hawkeye was into Thor I).

 

[Velorath]

Since he's just doing a cameo in CA3, I'd say the chances are good we won't see his face there.  Since they are doing a 'soft reboot' at Sony afterwards why not wait until then to reveal Morales, etc?  With a cameo, as Spider-Man, will they have time to introduce the character under the mask in CA3?

How he'll be used is unknown.  It could be a cameo or it could be a larger role, but one that is mostly separate from the main action.  It does not begin filming until April.  There is time to rework Spidey into a substantial part of the film (hopefully more organically than Hawkeye was into Thor I).

I don't really see how that would work at this point. Even if we assume that they had an alternate script ready and that the key actors have had access to it for a substantial amount of time, logistically there's just too much they'd have to change up. Pre-production exists for a reason, especially for big blockbusters like this. Everything gets story-boarded, the filming schedule gets set, props and costumes are made, stunts and special effects are being planned out and practiced... I just don't know how you could put a character like Spider-man in for any substantial amount of screen time without throwing out a ton of work and pushing back filming. They probably don't even have a costume design for Spidey yet and I assume that's something they have to work out with Sony and isn't the kind of thing they want to rush. A post-credit sequence or a small cameo they can film when they're doing reshoots and post-production.

[eldaec]

Depends on what we mean by 'substantial', and they are going to have work out the costume anyway.

Possibly something like Falcon or Agent 13 in CA2 but with fewer scenes in the first 40 minutes of character intros. Final 40 minutes of CGI action are heavily post production, especially for spider-man, and that just leaves the middle 40 minutes of "plot" as the challenge to figure out. I imagine there must be a bunch of supers, so maybe they just add him to the group in the second act, then has his own scenes only during the action sequence at the end.

I'm still not convinced this is a good idea mind you.

Also, the blurb suggests that the followup film will see Spiderman back at high school. This cameo is of Spiderboy. Which sounds especially awful.

[jgsugden]

Quick quiz:

How many months was it between the hiring of the Russos for Cap II (July 2012) and the release of the film (March 2014)?

How many months between Spidey being locked down (somewhere between November 2014 and January 2015) and release of Civil War (May 2016)? 

Yes, they were writing Winter Soldier a year before the Russos signed on the dotted line.  There has been a lot of negotiation, but Spidey's inclusion in the MCU had to be a clear target for Marvel right after ASM II underperformed relative to Sony's huge expectations - 10 months ago.   That is supported by the leak documentation.  The writing of Winter Soldier began as First Avenger hit the screen.  It is likely that the writing of Civl War began as Winter Soldier hit the screen.  When Winter Soldier hit the screen, they knew ASM was underperforming.  It is likely they had Spidey as a target for inclusion around the time they started writing- and there is nothing in the leak to suggest that it was ever abandoned, despite Sony's claims they were advancing on Sinister Six, ASM III and May Parker - Spy.

[sickrubik]

Hell, Marvel has probably always had a "contingency" plan on the chance that they had an opportunity to use Spidey, even before Winter Soldier/ASM.

[Velorath]

Hell, Marvel has probably always had a "contingency" plan on the chance that they had an opportunity to use Spidey, even before Winter Soldier/ASM.

Probably, but I feel like the contingency plan is likely to lean more towards "here's a few scenes we can shoot and insert into the movie that don't really change the story" rather than "here's an alternate version of the movie that we came up with where Spider-man plays an integral part". I also think that even if they were planning far in advance to work out a deal with Sony (which is likely), they couldn't have really known the exact terms of the deal until it was pretty close to finalized.

Beyond that, if they haven't even cast Spider-man or finished a script for his solo movie yet, that really limits when they can do with him in this story. He's not going to reveal his identity as part of the registration act. There's no dramatic tension about how revealing his identity might put people he cares about at risk because we won't be seeing any of his supporting cast. Aside from the fact that they're going to have Spidey in high school, and the assumption that they'll go with Peter Parker, he was bitten by a radioactive spider, he'll have an Aunt May, and Uncle Ben will be dead, the character will be a blank slate. There will be someone in a Spider-man suit in the movie, but to what extent will he even be a character, and for the purposes of actually telling a story does it add anything to have such an ill-defined character play any sort of important role in the movie?

[eldaec]

I really don't imagine MCU is going to get into a considered examination of civil rights and individualism vs regulation in this movie.

There will be threat, you'll be able to see the threat because Captain America will oppose it. There will be some guys introduced, then they will decide to follow Captain America or be wrong. Finally there will be an extended action sequence.

For a little under 120 minutes we will care about the people on the good side because they chose to agree with Captain America and are therefore good, this the same reason you care about Blonde Agent and about Falcon in CA2.

I imagine the proxy that Captain America will actually spend screentime convincing is Bucky. Who we apparently already care about because of a scene and a half in CA1, and who is presumably scheduled to become Captain America if the Human Torch gets shot or whatever.

[jgsugden]

I think that is an unfair simplification of how the recent Marvel films have been made. That is like saying that all Star Wars movies are just people wandering around space for two hours before a space battle and sword fight.

Marvel does have big battles at the end of every film. All action movies do. However, they've crafted each movie to build to that battle in different ways. They're much more character driven than you make them out to be.

[Ironwood]

That is like saying that all Star Wars movies are just people wandering around space for two hours before a space battle and sword fight.

Er....

[Pennilenko]

That is like saying that all Star Wars movies are just people wandering around space for two hours before a space battle and sword fight.

Er....

[sickrubik]

to be fair, it's LAZER swords. 

[eldaec]

For the record, I am totally alright with MCU output being lightweight by-the-numbers genre movies, with a dubious serial plot that enables threads like this to exist.

At least, I'm alright with it so long as they remain well written and well produced lightweight by-the-numbers genre movies.  

[Merusk]

They *will* start to take themselves seriously at some point.  Probably not until the guy in charge now moves on or dies, but once that happens there will be worlds of fail.

That's what my problem with Spider-Man and Superman was.  They were trying too hard to be mature instead of embracing the ridiculous notion that is "a superhero".

[jgsugden]

Does Winter Soldier not 'take itself seriously' in the non-action moments?  First Avenger?  Iron Man?  The first Thor?  All of the action in every one of these films is pretty much played for awesome/cool/funny bits, but the non-action in most of the Marvel films is really intended to be mature storytelling.

This, obviously, is not true of all moments - and is in no way true of GotG once you get past the credits.